The Syndicate

Shalom

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:59 am
Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:46 am
Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:53 am
Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:45 am When the fiddler gets to the roof, does the game end? Who is the fiddler?
the fiddler is a metaphor for survival in uncertain times times

the play is not even about violinists, or roof construction. that was a disappointment for me in highschool since those were two major interests for me
Those uncertain times times are harder than good times times. How does that metaphor work - is it because being a fiddler isn't stable employment?
don't blame me, blame the website I copied and paraphrased it from

I always figured it was cus like.... you see a fiddler on the roof? he's having the time of his life, maybe he's playing wonderwall or something, maybe everyone's watching and clapping? but like any minute it could start raining or maybe a bird poops on the fiddler and suddenly the fiddler just slips off the roof and just fucking dies I guess?

like being on a roof is already dangerous but adding on fiddle playing which requires a good amount of arm wiggling adds a new layer of danger. anything could happen

In the movie, Tevye says that "Without traditions, our life would be as shaky as a fiddler on the roof" or some such. Basically, in the harsh climate with the Russians hanging about, the Jews are sticking to their traditions doggedly. They try to enjoy their lives and traditions as if they aren't in a precarious position. As life happens, and Tevye keeps having to reject traditions for those he loves, he sees the fiddler more and more.

Something like that. It's a good film. My second favorite non-Disney musical. I assume the play is good too.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:18 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 10:31 am Kyle is with the Russian Police. Discuss.
strongly disagree

He's strong-arming us!

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:59 am fucking

*votes Kylemii*

If I may make an observation, regarding the setup:

Tevye can get BTSC with his daughters. In doing so, he can confirm them town to himself. So that's neat.

However, if he doesn't search for them, the town gains a cop in the match-maker. Match-maker can search for BTSC, which would (if Tevye doesn't submit actions) only be held by the mafia.

We trade off a BTSC-finder and a town searcher/btsc/lover thing for a cop. Does anyone think this is a good idea?

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:39 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:24 pm If I may make an observation, regarding the setup:

Tevye can get BTSC with his daughters. In doing so, he can confirm them town to himself. So that's neat.

However, if he doesn't search for them, the town gains a cop in the match-maker. Match-maker can search for BTSC, which would (if Tevye doesn't submit actions) only be held by the mafia.

We trade off a BTSC-finder and a town searcher/btsc/lover thing for a cop. Does anyone think this is a good idea?
I... don't agree. Civvie btsc can be an incredibly powerful tool when both players are active, and to enact your plan would mean purposefully not using a doctor, which comes with it's own problems. the matchmakers results should already be helpful so long as that player takes their results with a grain of salt and considers contextual information. it's not worth losing two powerful resources to increase the power of one.

Oh wow I completely missed the doctor thing. Yeah, no. Not even a question anymore.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:01 pm Do people actually read all the roles before games even start?

I don't, apparently. Or, at least, not accurately, or I would have seen the doctor.

I don't think I read the roles in Mountain Mafia until we had the 4th phase with no deaths. But then again, I didn't care. I was 3P.

Three scumreads on Kylemii, all for different reasons. If Jay is being serious. That's crazy.

And nobody in the thread is trying to defend him. Also crazy.

I put scum Kylemii at like... idk, 60% odds?

LC/Kyle not w/w.
FZ./Kyle not w/w.

FZ. wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 6:29 pm Speedchuck, can you explain what w/w is?

wolf/wolf
mafia/mafia

You two are probably not on a team together, is what I'm saying

linki: as for your second post, I could see FZ and LC's points on Kylemii. For a guy who probably knew that JJJ's suspicion was just pressure, he sure acted very seriously about it. But, at the same time, no teammates have influenced the thread either.

Those reasons.

[mention]Kylemii[/mention] Be a man. Throw the brick back

I still have a scumread on Kylemii. Stronger than before Jay dropped the suspicion.

If I still have it come Day 1 Start I'll tell you why.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:19 am Jay and Kyle are highly unlikely scum partners, but I could see one or the other being scum.

... don't know if I agree with this.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:29 am
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:28 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:19 am Jay and Kyle are highly unlikely scum partners, but I could see one or the other being scum.
... don't know if I agree with this.
which part?

First part. :P

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:47 am Non-fiction dialogue:

Anyone who really believes I would prefer to whip this thread into a frenzy for appearances than just let it snail along with nothing but theme-inspired chatter has no clue about my mafia-aligned play. No clue.

Yeah I don't trust your calls to meta. It bothers me more that you said this than the rest of your play this game.

Only 24 hours boys. Please mention everyone who hasn't appeared. I'm too lazy

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 1:01 am
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:55 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:29 am
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:28 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:19 am Jay and Kyle are highly unlikely scum partners, but I could see one or the other being scum.
... don't know if I agree with this.
which part?
First part. :P
My scum read on Kyle is contingent on him being made genuinely uncomfortable bu Jay's fake scumtell on him. I can only see them as compatible partners if that was an elaborate distancing measure to kick off the game.

I don't have a meta read on Kylemii mafia. But I'm personally always more emotional and reactive as mafia. Check out Pirates. I don't see that as a factor.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:59 am
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:55 am Yeah I don't trust your calls to meta. It bothers me more that you said this than the rest of your play this game.
I don't care what bothers you. I won Phenon: Origins because the civilians were generally disengaged and did not try. I won Transistor because the civilians were generally disengaged and did not try. Rule #1 is to let a lazy thread remain lazy. There have been instances where I've provided some half-assed fake "motivation", like "let's go, the thread is moving too slow". Those things never matter and don't hasten the thread pace.

Pushing Kyle's buttons and blowing it up? That works. I know what works. Feel free to discard this shit after this game now that it's plainly stated, but it's true right now.

The votes appear to be changeable.

Fair.

But I have a policy of ignoring emotional pleas and taking any appeal to "I would totally play this way" with a truckload of salt.

(Which I just realized is hypocritical but I don't dictate how you guys read me)

Epignosis wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 9:35 am Yo (I'm pretty sure that's Yiddish for "What's up with this?"):

speedchuck isn't on the poll.

Awesome!

Kylemii wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:14 am
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:41 amBelieve me or don't, this entire dialogue is just WIFOM to people who aren't me.
the other stuff you've said basically amounts to sandbagging but this part is a valid point, I think

That's not a point. That's like... a disclaimer or something.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:20 am I’m frankly fine with being mislynched if Epignosis gets hanged immediately thereafter. Sometimes that’s what it takes for anyone to critically assess that dude.

So you're saying there's practically ~0% chance you are both town?

Cause if not, you've consigned us to two mislynches there. Which is more of a frustrated action than one that is seeking the best for town.

NAI, necessarily.

Doesn't look like I'm going to be able to lynch Kylemii today.

JJJ: "I am good because I'm doing what I normally do D1, and what I would only do as town. It would make no sense if I did this as scum."
Also JJJ: "I don't care what Epi usually does when he's town. It's scummy. I hate it, and that defines my read. Don't care if it makes no sense for him to do this as scum."

I voted JJJ just now, BTW. Bracing myself for fallout.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:47 am Anyone who really believes I would prefer to whip this thread into a frenzy for appearances than just let it snail along with nothing but theme-inspired chatter has no clue about my mafia-aligned play. No clue.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:48 pm Anyway, to answer your question LC, I don't care what is perceived to be "normal" for Epignosis. This kind of "that's Epi being Epi" shit is what he has thrived on as a bad guy since I joined this website and probably long before. He can do or say basically anything and people refuse to actually dig into it with any thoroughness -- it's infuriating. If I see something that I hate at face value, then that is going to define my read. You might understand where I stand better than most here because you have gotten into plenty of Day 1 combat with Epignosis. In the scenarios where you both ended up being town, can you describe in general terms the behavior you have felt is so suspicious that you ended up wrong about? Don't spend a lot of time on this since it's external meta; I'm just asking for a tip.

I guess I can't paraphrase, then.

Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 1:15 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:48 pm I swear that "omgus" is one of the silliest notions in Mafia, and we'd all be better off if it just disappeared. I mean seriously, whenever I am revealed to be town, please take that to heart folks.

No u is stupid.

Omgus is stupid.

No more.

That might be my campaign for 2018 alongside Sloonei's fight against ketchup.

Anyway, to answer your question LC, I don't care what is perceived to be "normal" for Epignosis. This kind of "that's Epi being Epi" shit is what he has thrived on as a bad guy since I joined this website and probably long before. He can do or say basically anything and people refuse to actually dig into it with any thoroughness -- it's infuriating. If I see something that I hate at face value, then that is going to define my read. You might understand where I stand better than most here because you have gotten into plenty of Day 1 combat with Epignosis. In the scenarios where you both ended up being town, can you describe in general terms the behavior you have felt is so suspicious that you ended up wrong about? Don't spend a lot of time on this since it's external meta; I'm just asking for a tip.
Epi says things that I really believe we both know to not be true, but he acts like it's the opposite. Recently, he used some backwards logic to try to convince everyone that I had slipped, and no amount of correct, linear breakdown of what was wrong with his backwards logic would get him to bat an eyelash about it. That's the Civ Epi I know, I can't remember what bad Epi is like in the early game. Does he plant instigation seeds? Can't recall.

I remember mafia Epi in Night Vale. He was very background, didn't do much. Definitely nothing like this.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 1:24 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 1:22 pm I remember mafia Epi in Night Vale. He was very background, didn't do much. Definitely nothing like this.
What was I like in Phenon and Mountain Mafia?

In mountain mafia, you replaced in and threw crap at your teammates till you died. I didn't see the case at the time. Flip surprised me.
In Phenon, I was dead, and knew who you were. The most I remember was you putting in a ton of effort at the end, getting emotional about the lynch, and appealing to your effort to keep the thread going (which you now say was a load of crap ).

You're usually a lot cooler and more consistent than you're being this game, so the best comparison I can throw to would be the games above. Especially Phenon. I can't know if you're throwing crap at teammates right now, unless Epig is scum with you. Then we'd also include the game where Sloonei said you bussed him D1 as a point of comparison.

There's probably more to your play than that, but I'm not rereading your games. That would take forever. I'm also not suspecting you for the same reasons as Epi.

Darn it, I was going to bold something and then missed a tag when I was deleting it.

Was the thread really that accelerated before Epi blew JJJ's restriction?

IDK. Starting to doubt myself. I might be in a tunnel.

Linki: I skimmed vocaroo, and found your passionate posts to be more passionate, less unreasonable? But that was just a skim. I ain't listeneing to all that

DFaraday wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:10 pm Speed not being on the poll was an oversight. Anyone who wants to cast a vote for him just bold his name in the thread.

Or don't. Just imply it.

I could move my vote back to Kylemii.

I'm sure Scum Epi would go after JJJ first. Because he's such an easy townie to lynch.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:01 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:57 pm I'm sure Scum Epi would go after JJJ first. Because he's such an easy townie to lynch.
Have you met Epignosis?

yeah man

Point taken, though, I guess. I'm not going to read that game to see how hard he stuck it.

Should we always lynch a low poster D1 then? 0.o

Agreed here. I think Nutella is being opportunistic.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:12 pm I don't love Speedchuck's post at the top of this page.

Will you like it if nutella is scum?

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:15 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:02 pm Agreed here. I think Nutella is being opportunistic.
What sold you on this one?

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:53 pm 1. OK, I've been on Jay's side pretty much throughout this Epi bullshit, 2. and the comparisons to RvB and WTNV, as well as Epi apparently being afraid to lynch Jay, seal it for me. 3. I'm voting for Epi. 4. There's a sea of wifom here but basically 5. I don't think he should be acting like this even if it's to provoke reactions such as mine.

1. Citation needed. Nutella hasn't commented anything committal to the subject until now, when it's winding down
2. citing arguments that aren't hers to pad her post, ignoring any counters. Also, WTNV was an argument for town epi. Nut doesn't care.
3. The vote.
4. Disclaimer for when she's wrong
5. Very weakly-stated opinion that is not phrased as being alignment related and puts the blame on Epi for her voting him.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:20 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:15 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:12 pm I don't love Speedchuck's post at the top of this page.
Will you like it if nutella is scum?
Yes.

I like these odds.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:18 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:02 pm Agreed here. I think Nutella is being opportunistic.
I could say that this post is...

opportunistic

I actually noticed that after I posted it. Hopefully my newer post helps.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:23 pm K. I've decided I'm going to buddy Speedychuckwagon this game.

Speed, your my buddy. Let's goooooooo!!!!

YEEEEEEEAAAAA

:sparta:

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:29 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:22 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:20 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:15 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:12 pm I don't love Speedchuck's post at the top of this page.
Will you like it if nutella is scum?
Yes.
I like these odds.
Convince me

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:21 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:53 pm 1. OK, I've been on Jay's side pretty much throughout this Epi bullshit, 2. and the comparisons to RvB and WTNV, as well as Epi apparently being afraid to lynch Jay, seal it for me. 3. I'm voting for Epi. 4. There's a sea of wifom here but basically 5. I don't think he should be acting like this even if it's to provoke reactions such as mine.
1. Citation needed. Nutella hasn't commented anything committal to the subject until now, when it's winding down
2. citing arguments that aren't hers to pad her post, ignoring any counters. Also, WTNV was an argument for town epi. Nut doesn't care.
3. The vote.
4. Disclaimer for when she's wrong
5. Very weakly-stated opinion that is not phrased as being alignment related and puts the blame on Epi for her voting him.

Or you could just lynch her and find out

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:30 pm nutella voters, please tell me what you think of LoRab.

Slightly less bad than nutella.

Her suspish post on Epi didn't scream scum to me like Nutella's did, since it was more like a readlist of the three most involved players.
Could see her as scum independent of nutella, but not quite as likely. Could be teammates.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:31 pm
Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:41 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:24 pm If I may make an observation, regarding the setup:

Tevye can get BTSC with his daughters. In doing so, he can confirm them town to himself. So that's neat.

However, if he doesn't search for them, the town gains a cop in the match-maker. Match-maker can search for BTSC, which would (if Tevye doesn't submit actions) only be held by the mafia.

We trade off a BTSC-finder and a town searcher/btsc/lover thing for a cop. Does anyone think this is a good idea?
This is interesting. I need to think on this because traditionally I've always viewed civs with BTSC as one of the strongest things the civs can have...
This post accomplishes nothing.

Neither did this one.

I agree with you, went to go build a case, and there's nothing there. Daisy might just be busy?

Speed
Mac
Wilgy
Epi
JJJ
Marmot
Sloonei
Dyslexicon
LC
Kylemii
FZ
Novaselinenever
Dave
Daisy
Lorab
Nutella

I don't know why I'm doing this when I'm so back and forth this game.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:54 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:40 pm Speed
Mac
Wilgy
Epi
JJJ
Marmot
Sloonei
Dyslexicon
LC
Kylemii
FZ
Novaselinenever
Dave
Daisy
Lorab
Nutella

I don't know why I'm doing this when I'm so back and forth this game.
I don't mean to bite the gift horse in the mouth but why am I green?

Same reason as JJJ.

Crawled out of my tunnel, decided that your reaction wasn't as bad as could be, and attacked somewhere else.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:17 pm In a lot of recent games I've had the impression that most of the Day 1 noise was town-on-town aggression. I don't have that impression here. At least one major contributor is bad.

Define major contributers.

Then take a side.

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:19 pm 5. Basically what I meant by this was that if Epi meant the Jay/Sloonei w/w idea as another "poop" to get reactions, then he's taken it too far and it is not helpful anymore for him to play in the weird coy way that he has been.

unhelpful =/= scummy.
If Epi flips town, you're setting yourself up here to say "he took it too far" "It's his fault" "he should have played better"

linki: "did it first"
So the first person to fling bricks is allowed. The rest of us can't?

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:28 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:23 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:19 pm 5. Basically what I meant by this was that if Epi meant the Jay/Sloonei w/w idea as another "poop" to get reactions, then he's taken it too far and it is not helpful anymore for him to play in the weird coy way that he has been.
unhelpful =/= scummy.
If Epi flips town, you're setting yourself up here to say "he took it too far" "It's his fault" "he should have played better"
Okay. So if you lynch me you better be prepared to say "tsk tsk, she should have played better." Deal?

No, I'm pretty sure Sloonei's going to lynch me if you're town. He's got the tar and feathers all ready for me.

JJJ is back to Epi without announcing that he was once on nutella.

Who else was on nutella? There were 4 votes there once upon a time.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 6:04 pm Speedchuck in the interest of developing a read on you could you opine on the strangeways the Jay and Epi situation unfolded from the perspective of either being Mafia? It'll be fun.

I'm not around that much right now, so no. I could not.

Besides, I'm not on the poll, so you don't have to worry about me today.

linki: in Macdougall we trust
[mention]DrWilgy[/mention] if I followed Mac onto Kylemii would you follow me

linkilinkilinki I don't have time for this crap

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