The Syndicate

Bullzeye wrote:So, forgetting the potential slip discussion which seems to have sprung up during the course of reading her older posts, there are a few things that concern me about Liz. She sometimes seems to reach odd conclusions about things and I feel like she tries to cause confusion with some of her posts:

LizKeen wrote:I feel like the Celestials and the mafia are voting the same people. I can see why the mafia would do it but is there some reasoning the Celestials would do it? Either that or there's some recruited folk.

For instance, this whole post just feels like fear-mongering to me. One the one hand "The neutrals are working with the baddies!" and on the other "The baddies have recruited people!". No supporting evidence to either claim, but one or the other is happening.

LizKeen wrote: Is there usually this much requoting in Syndicate games? I'm really wondering if it's a mafia tactic just to be a massive distraction. If so then you're doing well.

I questioned the intent behind this ages ago, as did others, and I don't think anyone got a response.

LizKeen wrote:I think the simple solution is we're going to have to come up for new words for theory and Possibility, for clarification purposes.

Speaking of which, has anyone theorized the possibility the millionaire could gain more power to recruit?

Baseless speculation, but again reads like fear-mongering as well. Trying to make people afraid of recruits so that nobody is really safe to trust any more? Maybe I'm the only one who sees it this way, or maybe I'm not explaining it right, but it feels odd to me. Some of her explanations for her votes also don't ring true with me.

LizKeen wrote:

S~V~S wrote:Why?

Because I couldn't get past that he had the elephant charm and I didn't understand why anyone would want to steal that item.

Really? Not even a Celestial? We can't know for sure that he was one but I think it's a safe bet. She's not the only DP voter in the pack, but I do think there was a really good explanation for why DP might've had the charm. So good in fact, that it's probably why he's dead now.

LizKeen wrote: Like you pointed out, I voted early because it was either that or chance missing another vote and at that point I had no way of knowing how the lynch was going to go. The suspicion at that point seemed to be me or Zomberella so a vote on Vompatti wouldn't have made sense. If you look at the posts you 'll see I wasn't back that day before the vote. Given how many votes he got that day and that post he made yesterday I think it may be a very good thing he didn't get any more votes. It seems he actually wants them. And actually my suspect list hasn't changed much, if at all. My only problem is there's about 7 people on it and there's supposedly only 4 mafia left.

Vomp quite regularly plays the way he is playing here, and is often lynched for it. 9 times out of 10 he's not even bad. It would be a huge coincidence then, if he was the millionaire. Even so, you believe he is bad but have an arsenal of excuses for why you don't vote for him. You say you've got 7 suspects but I feel like you've only ever mentioned 3 who are still alive: SVS, Vomp, Epi. Please correct me if I'm wrong, or feel free to name the other 4.

LizKeen wrote:

S~V~S wrote:There is something bothering me after reading your posts, I have to read again and try to put the posts in context, and make them fit with your voting record.

Make them fit? Just to make me look bad?

This feels like a NO U to a post that wasn't even that accusatory.

LizKeen wrote: Vompatti as I've said twice now seems to want to be voted for. Which could explain his useless odd posts. No, I won't vote for him at least not right now because either he's the millionaire or for some reason wants us to think that. If he is is the millionaire then by my count he has 8 votes already (that could explain the day 1 self-vote) and who knows how much power and if one of those powers is the ability to avoid a lynch I don't want to waste a vote AND give him more power.

If you're so suspicious of Vomp, when will you vote him? He's probably not getting NKed any time soon if he's not bad, and if he is bad then you obviously know we need him lynched at some point. So when? Ever?

LizKeen wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

S~V~S wrote:What is your opinion on Liz?

My opinion on Liz is that I think you're right, and she's as bad as they come. I'm surprised she hasn't been lynched yet.

Wow really? No reciprocal benefit of the doubt? Ok then.

Touched on this previously, but I'm going to mention it again. Seems like she was expecting trust or some kind of defense from MM for not going after him.

Turnip Head wrote:Rest in peace LC And welcome back DF, you got some 'splainin' to do!

Bullzeye, I have been leaning civ for Dom recently simply because he hasn't picked up on SVS's hints. I feel like that's something the baddies wouldn't be able to miss. But idk, maybe I'm reading the situation the wrong way Dom seems like he has tunnel vision which I usually associate with civvieness. I'm not really sure where to look atm though. Dom, if you're wrong about me and SVS, where else would you look then?

Linki. Oh snap rabbit comes out swinging against Bullz

Bullzeye wrote:

S~V~S wrote: Now, re this "us" thing of Doms. That is an astonishingly quibbly question, lol. I am not sure why bad Dom would pose it, especially to Juliets on Day One. I understood what she meant right off the bat, and when i first read that question it raised my brow a bit. Again, not sure why bad Dom would ask it. Then not sure why civ Dom would ask it, either.

Kinda reminded me of the Pokemon game where he decided I was his prime suspect because I'd asked a question (I think about the NK?) that I'd have already known the answer to if I was bad. We were both civs. Sometimes I think Dom has... interesting reasons to question/suspect people (I usually only think this when it's me, tbf) but he's not unique in that way. I'm still feeling pretty okay about him right now.

S~V~S wrote:I don't love self voting either, like LC says (if he did not say it in this game, he said it in another) it's an easy way to set yourself up for no accountability when you ARE a baddie. And I can understand that. When I first started playing, like many people, my civvie game was very distinct from my baddie game. Most people in that situation try to make their baddie game more like their civvie game. I did the opposite. I took a lot of lynches in civvie games, but it set me up for the old "but she acts like this bad or good" chestnut for quite a while until the aggression started creeping back into my civvie game, and more hosts started running one Mafia games. Hosts, y u do that?

I don't usually mind or care about self-voting, especially on day one, but we do have a baddie who gains power from votes (do we even know what that means?). It might be something worth bearing in mind. Not everyone who self-votes can be that baddie, but it's still a possibility for someone.

S~V~S wrote:This is a Llama game. Want to hear a helluva lot more from Mongoose. Quiet Mongoose is scary Mongoose. Other than the self vote, I want to hear more from MM~ is he posting content, or snappy comebacks & jokes? Who does Bullz suspect? I don't recall anything BWT has said, like at all.

Good question! Hopefully I'll let you know somewhere in the course of this post. Am catching up and quoting/responding to things as I go.

rabbit8 wrote: Because my other thought would be BF. Who does not consider all roles when they get info. Baddies with an agenda, or....................civvies who are too gung ho to actually think before they post. So this one is, meh.

Good point. It's why I don't currently think BF is bad. I just think he's a 'gung ho' misguided civ who has a different way of thinking to many of our community. Doesn't make him bad, but looking at the poll I'm one of only a few who think that way.

Zomberella12 wrote:

blindfaeth wrote:Oh well, if people are interested in lynching me I suppose I'll share what I know. At least if I die, SVS won't be able to lie to you about whose will it is. It is Zomberellas will. The reason I did not come after her in the thread as many of you suggested is because she was literally absent for so long. Which I think is oddly convenient, but whatever. Final thoughts, I think dom is bad, he's only analytical like this when he has a team. I think epi and bills are bad. Think SVS is misguided. Good luck

Well, I think BF ruined my role. Thanks, for that. Civvie or not, you blew it!

Does anyone else think if Zomb were actually the baddie BF is so sure she is, her team would've coached her a better response than this?

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Epig said it before, it was convenient for BF that the "name" on the will was someone who hadn't been around to discuss or defend herself. BF pointed it out as baddie behavior, but I feel like we already know why Zomba wasn't around, and it speaks nothing of alignment. And on that note, I didn't post at all until about the same time Zomba did, and nobody's pointing fingers at me for it.

I would find it more believable that the player's role name would be listed on the will rather than the player name.

Linki: Hi Bullzeye.

Hi! You make some good points here. A quite quiet person might be expected to not actually show up and defend themselves in the time it would take for them to be bandwagoned after being "outed". I also don't think being quiet is baddie behaviour anyway. In fact, when I'm bad I feel more compelled to post. As a solo civvie I'm only letting myself down if I don't post but when I have teammates of any alignment I feel like I'd be letting everyone down by not being around. Also agree re: the player's role name. I don't see Llama giving away the name of a baddie for free.

S~V~S wrote:What would be interesting is if she really was the Millionaire. Then by mentioning her name, BF would be getting her votes, but her lynch is far from a done deal. He did not mention her name until he had several votes. So if she is that role, BF would actually be helping her get some votes, which her role could use if she is not lynched. And if she was lynched, he would get tons of cred.

When life hands you lemons, make lemonade, right?

There is also the fact that if they were both working together, there are enough anti-infodump people to ensure that she'd probably be safe for a few days to gather just a small number of votes - not enough to kill her but enough to charge up a baddie's power. I dunno though. I don't think I actually believe that's what has happened at all, just throwing stuff out there.

Dom wrote: I mean we're entering a world with many glasses of wine that are just sitting there to be drunk.

Sounds like a fun world to live in!

Dom wrote:

blindfaeth wrote:Don't be sorry, please pile on the votes, I would rather die than talk to walls

Why is everyone who disagrees with you a wall?
Why won't you provide evidence for your "suspicion" of me?

If it's anything like his "evidence" against me, I wouldn't worry. I still don't think BF is bad. He's not helpful, but that doesn't make him bad.

Not sure who to actually vote for. I can see how MM or any self-voter could be bad but they can't all be and there's not much else to go on in that debate. I do think it's odd how Liz voted for Zomb without comment and seemingly without considering the range of alternative explanations but I don't feel strongly enough about that. I will spend some time considering where to put my vote, but I'm aware of how little time is actually left.

Linki - agree with TH, giving up doesn't help anyone at all.

Bullzeye wrote:So I said the other day I think at least one of the group that included MM/TH/LC/Epi was bad. Given TH's silence, I'm less inclined to vote him. So basically I guess I think one of LC or Epi is bad and with 10 minutes to vote I've not got the time to read them both properly. In the debate between the two, I feel like LC is coming off better. So I'm gonna put my completely inconsequential vote on Epig, and give both a proper read through tomorrow.

juliets wrote:We sure are a quiet bunch without Long Con and SVS. rabbit, I did read Elohcin but i just couldn't find anything to grab onto to show that she is bad OR good. I guess that says something in itself. But, it looks like she's silenced today so I need to find someone else.

Turnip Head wrote:Elo hasn't posted at all Day 7. Could she be silenced?

Long Con wrote:yyyyyaaa

oooo o o ooooo o o ooooooo o o o
o o o o o o o o o o
o o o o oooooo o o o o
oooo o o o o o o o o o
o o o o oo o o o o o
o o o o o o o o ooooo o
oooo oooo o ooooo

S~V~S wrote: What about them Mets?? Baseball season, my favorite time of year

Bass_the_Clever wrote:

Dom wrote:

Bass_the_Clever wrote:what do people think of bwt?

I have no thoughts. Do you?

Just what I said above.

Dom wrote:

rabbit8 wrote:I'm all for voting Canuck and SVS.

Or Dom and TH. .........

Hilarious, yes....but...

Why group me and TH?

Dom wrote:

Canucklehead wrote:I think there's a doctor on the baddie team that does vaguely worded baddie things.....which I would be very willing to interpret as poisoning and the like, given recent events.

Canuck where are your thoughts right now?

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

rabbit8 wrote:I agree with everything you're selling SVS. I have a large family, I will be less active, MM, but i think all your posts are on point.

Everyone is awesome, and I love rainbows and stuff....

You have a large family, your username is rabbit8, I see the correlation.

You'll get no reciprocal feelings from me either.

rabbit, do you think I am bad?

Vompatti wrote:

S~V~S wrote:

Vompatti wrote:

S~V~S wrote:

Vompatti wrote:If Turnip Head is not bad, why did he vote for me?

Maybe he thinks you're bad, Sugar. It happens.

He should be thankful for all the votes I gave him.

Oh Vomps, you're so awesome. I am gonna feel bad voting for you. I miss your Wombat, I hope you bring it back someday.

I identify more as a horse now.

birdwithteeth11 wrote:

Dom wrote:

birdwithteeth11 wrote:

Dom wrote:

Bass_the_Clever wrote:I really think SVS is civ friendly this game.

I think I buy her story too.

tbh I think I buy it. I'm a bit nervous because I think her focus on me, but then justifying not voting Epig was weird though. :/ IDK

Out of curiosity, what made you change your mind on SVS?

What do you mean?

Well when you said you buy her story, I thought you meant you're leaning civ on her. Are you now or does her not voting Epig still make you unsure of her or think she's bad?

Turnip Head wrote:I have the bottle.

Long Con wrote:Putting the blame all on Golden for your turnaround is so... convenient.

S~V~S wrote:Um, I aggressively pursued her until freaking Golden made me think I was wrong. It was like 5:30 AM, I came in the thread, and Zomba & Liz had lulled Golden into a sense of complacency. He said he did not think she was bad, I read her posts from that night and thought he might have a point. I did not trust my own gut, and I got burnt by her (and Golden). When you posted those two quotes from me that morning with Golden and Zomba and made the crack about my post, then my next post, you did NOT mention that they were 40 minutes or so apart. You also did not mention that it was like 5 or 6 AM and no one was here, lol.

But like I said, I have been very open. If you choose to ignore it, or not believe it because it would be more fun for you if i am bad, that's fine. But I am not bad, and I think you know that

Dom wrote:

rabbit8 wrote:

S~V~S wrote:I did vote Epig

Yeah, but your defense of him was very....defensive....

do u have any suspicious suspicions?

S~V~S wrote:I did vote Epig

fingersplints wrote:Because that is clearly the same meaning. Voting for someone isn't the same as saying I would bet that someone isn't bad. Smashpoints. Money. shoes perhaps since Liz will be needing some to eat

S~V~S wrote:Everyone who ever played with Sophie thought she was bad. Then there were the people who did not think she was bad but voted for her anyhow.

fingersplints wrote:

rabbit8 wrote:

fingersplints wrote:

birdwithteeth11 wrote:I don't know what SVS is anymore. I guess I'm currently sitting on the fence with her. Although I'm still leaning towards her being bad.

Can you explain your suspicion again to me? perhaps you will switch back to the other side of the fence.
I don't buy that a baddie SVS would defend teammates like that. None of this is her baddie game. I'd bet on it.

Like you bet on Sophies baddie game?

When did I bet on Sophie?
Sophie said herself this was not her civvie game.

S~V~S wrote:If Oliver Oliver remains with us, I am hoping he might pay me a call. We might have some profitable things to discuss.

Linki @Rabbit, no I am not acting like Zomba. You seem to be missing something staring you in the face. But OK

S~V~S wrote:I have. Have you?

S~V~S wrote:

rabbit8 wrote:SVS is bad. Denying this is absurd.

BIH Epi.

Absolutely not~ insisting on it it absurd, actually. Read the thread

fingersplints wrote:

birdwithteeth11 wrote:I don't know what SVS is anymore. I guess I'm currently sitting on the fence with her. Although I'm still leaning towards her being bad.

Can you explain your suspicion again to me? perhaps you will switch back to the other side of the fence.
I don't buy that a baddie SVS would defend teammates like that. None of this is her baddie game. I'd bet on it.

S~V~S wrote:I am not playing that game and that feels very hostile tbh.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:5 smashcoins says that SVS votes LizKeen today.

S~V~S wrote:Liz has said she has not played with this group, iirc when she first joined she said she stumbled on us in a search engine or something to that effect.

She referred to Juliet's as Juliets Coffee. She has not used that name here. The explanation LiZ gave did not ring true to me. So where did she hear that? In a chatroom? It was just an odd thing for her to say.

LizKeen wrote:

juliets wrote:I did not play games at Lostpedia as Juliets Coffee. I played as ImaPisces. And how many games did you read at Rev?

I was trying to quote and paste and answer on my phone and posted the wrong site. I didn't play at Lostpedia that meant to say Hedville. And probably 2 or 3. I decided not to play there because people looked like they were being really nasty to each other. It's one of the reasons I quit all together. I played at The Piano once or twice too. Can't remember the name of the site before that.

S~V~S wrote:Lini, no, lol, not to make you look bad. Make your votes fit with your posts, which they don't. You say one thing, and vote another. I want to try to see where you are coming from with those votes.

Why no votes for Vomps? Not just that one day; any day.

Okay my votes: Day 1 I voted Zombarella because I didn't feel bf would have been so bold if he was a baddie. I voted Zombarella because there wasn't much to go on and I thought that comment she made might have been outing herself.


Day 2 I didn't think MM was bad most especially based on those posts the last day. But I missed the vote. I was less sure about Zombarella because from the ear phones I knew the mafia planned to put the doctors ability on whoever Zomba voted for. I took that to mean they were going to set Zomba up to look suspicious. Hence, why I told her to be careful where she put her vote. I wanted to vote you that day but that didn't seem to be where anyone else was looking and I didn't want to vote MM.

Day 3 I still wasn't sure about Zomb, especially with those posts she made right before I voted but as I've explained more than once I thought the lynch the next day might come down to her or me and I wasn't going to vote myself. Had I had a chance to be around closer to the vote I probably would have voted Zompatti because I already pointed out his posts were less than useful. I know its easy to say after the fact. I can say if I had been a baddie teammate with Zombarella I would not have voted her that early even to save myself. Again I have no way to prove this.

Day 4 I voted DP because I couldn't wrap my brain around him having that elephant charm unless he was the beast. Yes, it's been said the celestials might want it for something and yes it's also been pointed out all sorts of game mechanics could have accounted for it. I wasn't willing to chance a duck is a duck.

Vompatti as I've said twice now seems to want to be voted for. Which could explain his useless odd posts. No, I won't vote for him at least not right now because either he's the millionaire or for some reason wants us to think that. If he is is the millionaire then by my count he has 8 votes already (that could explain the day 1 self-vote) and who knows how much power and if one of those powers is the ability to avoid a lynch I don't want to waste a vote AND give him more power.

You've made no bones about the fact you won't vote Epi. Which says to me you know who he is, which means you're both either mafia, indy, or you're bad and you know he'll flip civvie and you want to give yourself some cred. What is your take on him tying up the vote on Day 3?

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

S~V~S wrote:What is your opinion on Liz?

My opinion on Liz is that I think you're right, and she's as bad as they come. I'm surprised she hasn't been lynched yet.

Wow really? No reciprocal benefit of the doubt? Ok then.

Epignosis wrote:
I see you
I see you though your eyes can tell lies I sympathize

Well that's creepy. What am I wearing?

S~V~S wrote:
And I was tryig to disguise myself in a sock puppet game. And gone for the day =/= insanified. At Rm & LP, generally lynching those unable to defend was not done. I still don;t like to do it, and I know there are others who feel as i do. Call us old ladies.

I don't like to do it either. But I refuse to grow old and as to whether I'm a lady it depends on who you ask. :P

However, Epi seems to do quite well posting in song.


Or maybe not. I have no idea what this means:

Epignosis wrote:
Sol, Dhoop
Sun
Ilios
Naytheet
Ah Kin
Saule
Tonatiuh
Qurax
Gunes, Grian
Surie
Ir
Samse

Metalmarsh89 wrote: I'm losing the motivation to make a case right now. I've already made two (on other players) this game to no avail. And my ideas here keep getting stomped on.

I feel your pain.

S~V~S wrote:What I think my problem was, was that I had totally the wrong idea about who cursed me the other day. And when I flipped it in my head, reading things without that bias I started to get a better understanding of what people were saying. Things kinda clicked, so thanks MM for making me reread with a different mindset.

I could vote for Liz or Epi. I do think he is probably bad. Don't love voting for the cursed, but I could still vote for him.

I would prefer a Liz vote but the time I had hoped to spend pulling quotes went to arguing with Rabbit. An old and fun pastime that I have missed

Gotta say that Juliets Coffee thing was weird. Like someone said JC in chat and had to explain what it stood for. I know people suspect slips more than they actually happen, but that was very odd.

Turnip Head wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

Long Con wrote:I'm really surprised anyone wants to hear anything from me about Turnip Head tbh. I don't really know how to put my thoughts on him, S~V~S, and others out there in any sort of complex fashion because I'll likely get accused of infodropping and 99% ignored by the thread. Unless that's just special treatment that only Epig gets.

LC, you do not have info on me, because I'm not bad. Whatever you're working with, an error must have been made somehow. People have thought they've had info on me before and they were wrong. Is this about the bottle still?

TH, LC said that he did not have info, and that he was trying to figure out how to convince people you're bad without hinting as such. I don't know why you think he could...

What do you mean? Why can't he convince people I'm bad without hinting he has info? What am I supposed to do when the guy who accuses me says he can't build a case on me without seeming like he has info? How am I supposed to react to that?

If LC wants to accuse me of something, I'll be here.

Turnip Head wrote:LC if you accuse me, I'm not going to accuse you of having info. That's a silly thing to worry about. I'm just going to tell you how you're wrong.

Long Con wrote:I'm really surprised anyone wants to hear anything from me about Turnip Head tbh. I don't really know how to put my thoughts on him, S~V~S, and others out there in any sort of complex fashion because I'll likely get accused of infodropping and 99% ignored by the thread. Unless that's just special treatment that only Epig gets.

I'm going to try and switch up my playstyle going forward, hopefully it will frustrate me less.

MM, no comment at all about the way Epig was gunning for you 1.0 even though he definitely knew that you killing BR night 1 was extremely unlikely at this point?

S~V~S wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

LizKeen wrote:You've made no bones about the fact you won't vote Epi. Which says to me you know who he is, which means you're both either mafia, indy, or you're bad and you know he'll flip civvie and you want to give yourself some cred. What is your take on him tying up the vote on Day 3?

I'm snipping this part because even if I am sober I bet it wouldn't make sense.

I am quoting this bit that Mm quoted because it is manageable. I have no idea who Epi is, I do know that I don't think both he and Dom are bad, and I am a bit more leery of Dom. I also know that he is incapacitated and it is unsporting to vote for him, IMO. No knowledge.

And like you, Liz, I suspect Vomps. Did then and I still do now. So I don't think he was trying to save Zomba since she made no effort to save herself and she could have.

Long Con wrote:And S~V~S, you referenced my theory from way back closer to the beginning of the game than now. Theories change. I've been watching TH for a while now, and though I want to see how the Epig lynch turns out first, I've got some more fine theories to share with you about your trusted Turnip Head. Your reactions this very day have been very interesting as well, to be honest.

I thought that theory had as lot off merit, as well as your occasional advice to the Celestials. About Zomba will, and asking them to steal your item. You had a lot of good thoughts re the Celestials. You may have changed your thought, but I think you were spot on about those items. If you changed your mind on that, maybe you could change it back

When it comes to Epi I am not sure he's bad. When it comes to TH, I am more sure that he isn't bad.

I will read the long posts after I get up, I am sure I have to respond to stuff in them since OMG I disagreed with LC and I don't want to vote for someone I am not sure is bad.