The Syndicate

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Nov 29, 2018 2:26 pm So was the pursuit of Hufflepuff suspects a legitimate thing, or was that just sly devils creating a false narrative?

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Sun Nov 25, 2018 12:49 am

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Sat Nov 24, 2018 4:13 pm I went back to re-read D3 because I don't remember this Glorf Truth thing being so heated but it turns out the two people I cased and called bad that day were Jack and Long Con.

Am I....am I *too* good?

I think ‘good’ is absolute, my friend and you are as good as they come

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 5:11 pm

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 3:18 am Mega Man, Outpost and now Hogwarts mafia. Ya boi out here GRINDING. This is the DH Era

All credit on those last two but we had what? 18 inactive townies in MM? And LC and Speedchuck defected to the mafia.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 12:31 pm Funny thing is, if I had just believed Quin...

I had seen DH committing a piercing kill on mafia. With a blast ended screwt going through Quin's protec. Mafia wouldn't kill their own. I had undeniable proof of a serial killer, and knew who it was.

And I withheld that name.

juliets wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:05 am DDL have I said congrats on a great game yet? If not, this was awesome. Like dunya, this and U-Pick have been my favorites. This one was just so intricate, so many moving parts, and honestly I never thought about a secret role which just made it more exciting. You did a fabulous job.

And congrats DH, you did a great job. Certainly my pick for Best Indie.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:03 am

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:32 pm I would agree with you that I wouldn't attribute my win to luck, or to a majority of luck. I got lucky when I needed it, but I was hustling my ass off every other second of the game. I don't win the game if my Long Con case falls through. I don't win the game if I don't connect the dots with Jack, which later led to everyone connecting the dots on you. I don't win the game if I don't use the Niffler/House Cup/Hallows mechanics the way I did.
I got some good lucky breaks this game for sure but I'm not going to lie, it wasn't an easy win.

Oh I don't mean to say you only won this because you are lucky. You really played an awesome game, no contest. I just wanted to talk about your insane luck because it was amazing to behold. But yeah, not getting lynched for 8 days straght was your merit. That's the only thing I really want from an indie, because they can't do much to avoid night actions.

You even had the most posts in the game. @JaggedJimmyJay maybe that's another exception to that "blow up thread" theory of yours?

dunya wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 8:20 am DH to win best 3p for his performance here. lucky or not, killing 3/5 scum members as 3p and winning a game as lms is pretty epic even though the ego could lose a few notches

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 8:13 am

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:11 pm

poutanko wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:10 pm

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:03 pm I really needed to find Jack's partner when we did, otherwise I'dve lost probably.

Only if Petrificus Totalus work on you.

It wouldn'tve but I was moreso worried you guys would tunnel-kill me every night until it stuck.

It would. Petriricus Totalus prevents you from drinking potions.

You were in for a stone cold surprise (kek) if you tried to kill poutanko one night later.

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 3:03 am Aww, I just realized I could have used the 3p make a lot of posts tell...derp...missed opportunity.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 2:29 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 2:10 am At this point, I don't know what triggered it. It could be you and inh, or it could have been something else. I guess somewhere I felt belittled or that my reads didn't matter or no one was listening or who knows what.

I guess it just seemed a bit rougher than what I'm used to or something.

Something I have experienced a number of times when playing my first or second game on another site is the feeling that nobody is listening to a word I say. Indeed, it might on some level reflect reality -- not that nobody is listening, but that the regulars on the site don't think my reads are as informed as they need to be based upon whoever's metas to be trusted as valid (and on multiple occasions it has been to their detriment: I was right and they were wrong). I think you might have been in a very similar position in this case. Nearly everyone else has played with DharmaHelper many times over, and in that time there has developed nuanced ideas about how he plays and who he is as a player. And sometimes that can be blinding instead of informative, as it may have been here. Perhaps the regulars were blinded to a detail that you were able to pick up because you haven't already built years of biases.

With repetition these frustrations tend to subside though, because people become more accustomed to the approach of the newcomer. Indeed, when I was new to The Syndicate nobody listened to a damned thing I had to say. I remember feeling like I was talking to brick walls in Economics Mafia.

Please know though that it there is never an intent to disrespect or belittle you. I have seen first hand the kind of great Mafia play you are capable of, and I don't think it would surprise anyone here to see you do more great things. I hope you can find the energy to give us another try, because we're a better community for having you a part of it. Every new idea and perspective enriches a game, and every new friend enriches a site.

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 2:17 am @DharmaHelper one thing to be aware of you were far too happy or not phased by multiple townies dying. Nutella had the correct townie response to multiple townies dying, but then you on the other hand "thought it to be good news". It's one thing to say it's good news about narrowing down suspicions, but when there's 1 to none mafia deaths and like 3 townies die, your mood is a dead give away.

Luckily for you, that didn't matter this game. But if I was alive and hadn't subbed out, that would have been maybe something I might have seen or looked at.

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 2:01 am

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:47 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:44 am Or it could be forum bias? Well, whatever it is, congrats on nearly fooling everyone.

Thanks, and I look forward to finding out the reason you suspect me the next game we play together

I don't know if I'm playing here again. Yeah, I could have talked to dunya about it, but I was thinking of quitting a few times before the family emergency. I guess I'm of the opinion that I shouldn't need to talk to someone to get through a game.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 2:03 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:41 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:39 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:37 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:01 am I think you do clear all of those things if you are in the game tbh. At least until it's too late. We never realised we were at DH LYLO on the day we lynched Jack for instance. I don't think anyone in their right mind could have known that.

You were my top suspect pre-poutanko lynch. I didn't give a shit about the potion.

Yeah well maybe I shouldn't have been given, you know, I was a civ...

That you were. Had I been alive you'd have found the late game even more frustrating than you already did.

At what point did you realise I was a civ for sure?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:48 am I think that catching an independent player purely on behavioral data is a very muddy endeavor since the primary motivator of behavioral change between games is the presence or lack of extra information (known teammates or unknown). The capacity to genuinely hunt for mafia is one of the most important benefits anti-civilian roles can enjoy -- it's as pronounced in games with multiple mafia teams (and in many cases renders those games outright unbalanced, which I would not say this game was).

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:44 am Or it could be forum bias? Well, whatever it is, congrats on nearly fooling everyone.

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:25 am So remember when I said DH is playing different from last game and you guys didn't believe me?

I only subbed out because my grandfather was awfully sick, and then went on to pass away a few hours after I subbed out.

I guess 1 game meta can be a thing for me or at least I know have an exhibit A.

I guess part of me wants to take some credit for shaping how DH played.

But yeah, he was a bit more aggro or less caring in some ways as compared to the previous game.

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:15 am Grats on the win Dharma, must feel good

juliets wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:47 pm Hey DH did you kill Epi? If so why? If not, can someone from the mafia tell us why?

(sorry I still haven't looked at the spoiler night actions)

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:36 pm

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:40 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:39 pm

juliets wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:38 pm I want to know what the deal was with the Quin-speed actions. I assume speed was telling the truth, was Quin? Maybe I missed the answer to that somewhere.

DDL posted all the night actions in a big spoilered post. I totally forgot to look at those when I skimmed it but I assume something messed them up lol

LC tried to save himself by using a Dodo on someone.

But the person he picked (Quin) happened to be the guy DH was trying to kill for a hallow.

( )

I forgot Speed had DH ages ago.

Quin wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:33 pm

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:46 pm

Quin wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:43 pm

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:38 pm

Quin wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:38 pm to be honest though i'm not sure why DH became so strongly town read after the jack lynch.

..civilians couldn't have known that he had a horcrux.

I didn't know that he had a Horcrux either.

yeah, but the way you went about his lynch felt to me like you had information that you shouldn't have. and i was right, given the polyjuice potion thing.

I knew him getting no result when he checked me meant he was bad, yeah.

I also knew he knew polyjuice existed in the game which no civ would.

i mean i was confident it was, but i didn't have any actual knowledge of it i guess

timmer wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:28 pm If I had lasted one more night I was going to nk DH but I guess that would have failed? I realized Colin was civ too late, as I was dead.

poutanko wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:25 pm

timmer wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:21 pm Poutanko I think this was the first time I've seen you play and just fyi those emojis you use are super cute.

Thanks, I'm new here just my habit using them
You're dangerous when you're serious. Went back and forth between killing you or using you as extra kill

Lunalee wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:13 pm

Quin wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:49 pm ima make a sweeping declaration for future meta evaluations and also because that was annoying as heck

I don't lie about my night actions. I don't need to.

I'm GenuQuin

Seconded. Night action claiming got me lynched too just because some people thought what I claimed was stupid, and their logical conclusion was that I must be bad.

poutanko wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:10 pm

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:03 pm I really needed to find Jack's partner when we did, otherwise I'dve lost probably.

Only if Petrificus Totalus work on you.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:08 pm

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:56 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:55 pm

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:18 pm I was telling the truth when I said I figured out Jack was bad because he pretended not to know what polyjuice was.

And I was telling the truth when I said you were the serial killer.

Well played. That was a fantastic SKer role and you did a damn good job of playing it.

Hilarious to me that because you got outed as a mafia nobody gave two shits about you putting me on blast.


Worthy foe.

Hardly on blast. I was pretty kid gloves about it.

1) You clearly didn’t care about who got lynched several times.
2) Nova was modblocked on N1 and Timmer was roleblocked. This means the only way a townie could have killed him is if there were two odd night vigilantes. There was clearly an even night vigilante. 3 town vigilantes on top of all the protection and investigation is op....unless there’s a sker.
3) Way too many kills with Timmer holstering and so much protection....unless there’s a sker
4) Outed a cop role and couldn’t give an actual reason why that role was bad. Plus lying about what we talked about in btsc.
5) Overstating credit for dead mafia members
6) Quin’s killer was clearly not the mafia kill but also clearly an evil character.

I couldn’t argue the third point without confirming Timmer (my mistake) and I choose not to hammer on the other points because at the end of the day, I was only about 75% sure and it wasn’t worth making Pout more lynchable to get rid of you in my (flawed) calculation. We knew you had the Elder wand and if we could get it, that meant that in addition to my transfiguration, I could give the mafia a 3 vote swing. If you had died and Pout had lived, we would almost surely have won.

But we didn’t and you did. You made the right bets and the right actions while we made the wrong ones. Hats off for a well deserved win.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:55 pm

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:18 pm I was telling the truth when I said I figured out Jack was bad because he pretended not to know what polyjuice was.

And I was telling the truth when I said you were the serial killer.

Well played. That was a fantastic SKer role and you did a damn good job of playing it.

poutanko wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:50 pm

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:32 pm This game is gonna fuck up my ego so bad.

I would agree with you that I wouldn't attribute my win to luck, or to a majority of luck. I got lucky when I needed it, but I was hustling my ass off every other second of the game. I don't win the game if my Long Con case falls through. I don't win the game if I don't connect the dots with Jack, which later led to everyone connecting the dots on you. I don't win the game if I don't use the Niffler/House Cup/Hallows mechanics the way I did.

I got some good lucky breaks this game for sure but I'm not going to lie, it wasn't an easy win.

Also I felt bad for the mafia this game even as I was running through you guys. Nova's kill was just on a lark I was like "Hey fuck inactivity!". At one point I considered teaming up with the mafia, using the Resurrection Stone to contact INH and feed him a line of bulshit about how I was a secret killer role looking to get recruited but I needed to know who I was looking for or some shit but @insertnamehere never showed up to the chat.

Said on maf chat "What if whoever gets 3 hallows become SK?"...somewhat true except that you're SK before getting all the Hallows

Which cycle did you contact INH?

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:45 pm The best I could rationalise against you was that you were a bus happy Mafia member because it wasn't until Jack started infodumping that I even entertained the idea there was a rogue but eventually that was just impossible because you were decimating them. You had this game pretty well wrapped up quite a while ago I feel.

Quin wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:43 pm

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:38 pm

Quin wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:38 pm to be honest though i'm not sure why DH became so strongly town read after the jack lynch.

..civilians couldn't have known that he had a horcrux.

I didn't know that he had a Horcrux either.

yeah, but the way you went about his lynch felt to me like you had information that you shouldn't have. and i was right, given the polyjuice potion thing.

Quin wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:38 pm to be honest though i'm not sure why DH became so strongly town read after the jack lynch.

..civilians couldn't have known that he had a horcrux.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:23 pm Ddl this game was friggin perfect. Screw anyone who's says otherwise. My favorite job on the site thus far.

I didn't realize Quins protective thing would count as a self target, so I was confused.

poutanko wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:28 pm

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:22 pm I will never be able to replicate a performance like this. I didn't think I'd be able to play this well period.

- Sniped Nova
- Nailed LC
- Nailed Jack (sort of. He said he got no result when he checked me, which tipped me off 4 days later when I thought back on it)
- Sorta got Poutanko although that one goes to the town I figure.

Very lucky breaaks with finding the Hallows/Polyjuicing myself but as far as the hallows goes I just used the mechanics to their fullest (last vote gets the hallow, Niffler, etc).

As an SK, I wanted to do two things: Get civ cred, and fuck up the mafia so I couldn't get Nightkilled. Once I set those goals and worked towards them the game was well within reach.

...you didn't kill Novase because you read him as scum. That one was luck

poutanko wrote: ↑Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:22 pm SK role is okay and DH did play well by making people think he's town. That one was not a result of "luck". He's lucky, true, but not fully on that that he won.

Having to wake up to find 1 of my team mate die every cycle was not something I expected. The mess on D3 was the worst. Woke up only to find huge mess on game thread and on maf chat. We're unlucky with Novase too, he's modblocked so we couldn't use his ability, he was never replaced (he's killed already), never received 1 night kill immunity like town subs and he's our doc/invigo maker/hippogriff/elder wand owner. Losing 3 maf limited our actions a lot. Felix and Avada became a must. Had to be 1 Hogwart/1 Dark Art per player. Had to avoid any player that might be protected/jailed or else our kill would fail.

...that Glorf thing I'd rather not...