The Syndicate

NewTraditionalist wrote: ↑Sun Sep 24, 2017 5:28 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:27 pm @NewTraditionalist made a meaningful impact on this game -- he was first in the late game to move against nutella when the other civilians were handing her all sorts of credit. That was the initial moment when MP began to shift on that nutella read. It was a big moment and NT triggered it.

Thanks to everyone for the welcome. I'm sorry that I ghosted at the end and didn't participate as much as I would have liked before that. Had a few busy days offline and have yet to be accustomed to adding this place to my "oh yeah...i should check this" list for being a computer (hate browsing forums on phone...sorry...old here).

I look forward to another game. I like the heist size quite a lot and can't imagine trying to sort out a bigger game but we'll see.

Special thanks to MP and SD for the intro to the site and JJJ for hosting the game and being patient.

Glad you tried it out, looking forward to playing more games with you as well!

Thanks folks!

But you're right, I don't care who hosts it as long as it happens.

HE MUST HOST IT, seriously he is an auto-endgamer if he plays.

I imagine Epi would host it as a Heist since that was how the last one was hosted, so it'd go into that queue and probably would be a few months, right? Unless we set it up as a special game for a specific purpose, which I'm open to hearing.

dunya wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:47 pm

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:21 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:16 pm

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:15 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:13 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:00 pm Though Epignosis in Vocaroo could kind of make it 11 for mafia and 2 for indy (solo).

That game played out so strangely. We blindly fell into an absentee scum lynch on Day 1 and then had to try to catch a lone baddie with no real clues anywhere. Plus epi charmed the pants off us.
My point is when is Vocaroo II happening?

This.

I think I'm supposed to be hosting that.

DO IT

please don't do it till middle of October!

That could be easily arranged.

Ricochet wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:17 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:13 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:00 pm Though Epignosis in Vocaroo could kind of make it 11 for mafia and 2 for indy (solo).

That game played out so strangely. We blindly fell into an absentee scum lynch on Day 1 and then had to try to catch a lone baddie with no real clues anywhere. Plus epi charmed the pants off us.
My point is when is Vocaroo II happening?

I've sent all my prayers banking on "never ever".

"Hit that dislike if you dislike."

Epignosis wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:16 pm

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:15 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:13 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:00 pm Though Epignosis in Vocaroo could kind of make it 11 for mafia and 2 for indy (solo).

That game played out so strangely. We blindly fell into an absentee scum lynch on Day 1 and then had to try to catch a lone baddie with no real clues anywhere. Plus epi charmed the pants off us.
My point is when is Vocaroo II happening?

This.

I think I'm supposed to be hosting that.

DO IT

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:13 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:00 pm Though Epignosis in Vocaroo could kind of make it 11 for mafia and 2 for indy (solo).

That game played out so strangely. We blindly fell into an absentee scum lynch on Day 1 and then had to try to catch a lone baddie with no real clues anywhere. Plus epi charmed the pants off us.
My point is when is Vocaroo II happening?

This.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 11:59 am

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 11:54 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 11:52 am This is the 2nd civilian win in the last 11 heists.

God damn. I knew it was bad, but man. Let's make some more dents in that, townies.

Overall it hasn't been so bad. Heist wins by faction:

Civilians - 8
Mafia - 12
Indy (shared) - 2
Indy (solo) - 1

It's been a very bad run following what had been a very good run for the townies.

Interesting.

Also have to make a shoutout to our new player, [mention]NewTraditionalist[/mention].

Although it seems he struggled with getting acclimated to the very different format as well as the timing of phases, this man said these things before dunya or I had our eye on nutella:

NewTraditionalist wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2017 12:06 am I'm going to downgrade my nutella read to slight mafia for a similar reason. 2nd round DDL vote at a time where DDL was not going to be lynched. easy camo play (or the ravings of a very bad new player).

NewTraditionalist wrote: ↑Mon Sep 18, 2017 12:19 am I gotta say, nutella, I'm leaning more towards you. MP's day 2 vote for sanmateo seems like an impossible mafia play to me but your vote for DDL feels like easy camo...seems like it was a foregone conclusion so that a different vote would be even more suspicious.

I'm currently

certain town: me
probable town: MP
neutral: everyone not mentioned
slight mafia: dom (still working out reasons for this one)
slightly more mafia: nutella

Mad props. Hope you try another game.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 11:52 am This is the 2nd civilian win in the last 11 heists.

God damn. I knew it was bad, but man. Let's make some more dents in that, townies.

That is a good question. I also really thought the speedchuck kill implicated Sloonei but perhaps that was the WIFOM or they were just going after an active/obviously townread speedchuck. I think the NKs were generally made on players who had little to no suspicion, so they made sense in that regard, but I did wonder about some of them nonetheless.

Lastly, a shameless plug, but if any of you are now itching for another Heist since this one is over, I have Seinfeld Mafia ready to go and need anywhere from 6-11 more folks before it'll start. Should be a blast. I only hope it'll be as tense and awesome as this game was. Just PM me if you want to sign up since it's going to be sockpuppet/anonymous.

And a bonus will be that you don't have to deal with my insane levels of posting since I'm the host.

Well played again to all. Great game. Definitely a satisfying win and a worthy performance from the opposition. I look forward to playing with you all again.

I still can't get over how this game progressed. I mean, in all honesty, DDL, nutella, and sanmateo really could have easily won this game. They played this just very well. The rampant bussing was ballsy for sure, it almost paid off.

To elaborate, I think that's just something I've picked up on over the past year or so after witnessing it (both the absence of it and seeing it work successfully): Forcing assessments of content even when there isn't much there. I figure there is almost always something that can be picked out of nearly every post, or at least you have to die trying to find it. I learned that from you, Jay, as well as other town powerhouses like Epi, Golden, Sloonei, and Nacho.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2017 10:29 pm I think there was some visible growth in MP's civilian game here, particularly toward the end. He's always effortful, and he's always engaged. He has made good reads before too.

What I saw here that I haven't seen as much of in the past is assertiveness. When he made reads, he made fucking reads. I was thrilled to see the late-game PoE wherein he limited his suspects to Dom and nutella -- not because he had the right answer, but because he was eliminating low posters from the suspect pool with confidence. That's how you have to be. There's always a chance of being wrong, but that doesn't mean anything. Civilians cannot worry about that if they want to win games.

Thanks man.

Admittedly my biggest struggle with being town is being susceptible to analysis paralysis and indecision, especially early on in games and regarding players who don't provide as much content. I honestly was asserting more confidence than I probably really had in BWT, NT, and Serge, but I felt I had to take a damn stance on them and listen more to my gut for once; I figured I could always reevaluate if necessary. It definitely paid off.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2017 10:27 pm Catching sanmateo felt good. It really did.

Absolutely, that was a hell of a moment. Man, you and I were on the same wavelength or something this game. It was totally awesome to be synced like that.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2017 10:25 pm Also, I'm glad dunya got to drop in here for a bit and showcase those instincts of hers. Still the best radar I've ever seen in this damned game.

Seriously. Wow. I was already starting to come around to considering nutella more and more, but it was dunya's thoughts that got me seriously considering it. Without that I'm not sure if I would have done the digging that I did into her ISO and made the vote switch.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2017 10:21 pm GG guys. It's too bad I really didn't end up having any time to dedicate to participating above the bare minimum and thus was unable to defend myself, but I think our team had been doomed for a while, lol -- I was hoping my bus credit would keep me around for a bit, but it's not at all surprising that you guys saw past it by this point. Seriously though, I had no opportunity today to catch up much less defend myself as my job has been extremely busy lately (I was there for ten hours today and still have a few things that have to get done by the end of the night... I love my new job but it's crazy busy lol).

Anyway, great job civs, you nailed it. And fwiw there wasn't a ton of logic behind most of the kills beyond the general principle of going for people who were widely seen as town. If you pressed me I might figure out near-subconscious reasons I had regarding who was suspecting certain people and who I wanted to keep around for any possible framing/wifom/etc

You seriously played incredibly well, and despite your limited activity towards the end, I still was doubting it every step of the way.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2017 10:16 pm This game is basically a thesis on how bussing can go wrong.

You guys really had a good strategy going; if Epi and I didn't go after sanmateo suddenly like we did, you almost certainly would have won. That lynch definitely cracked open the game for us, so to speak, but nutella almost still won it for you all too. Well played for sure.

I know what you mean though; I've been bitten in the ass by bussing myself, but also the converse from defending teammates too visibly. It's a really difficult balance.

Seriously, I got to see dunya's legendary gut in action too. That was pretty amazing. Props to her for replacing in to this incredibly tough situation and helping me talk through everything. I'm indebted.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2017 10:06 pm This is the best civilian MP performance I have ever witnessed.

Thanks man, I appreciate the kind words.

The endgame was a real tough position to be in, and honestly I don't know that we would have pulled it off if you, Daisy, Sloonei, speedchuck, and dunya didn't bring awesomeness to the table while you all were alive too. Definitely a team effort.

I'm very curious what the logic was behind all the NKs, so if the scum team can talk regarding that, that'd be pretty cool.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2017 9:56 pm "So what was the point of the whole 'Quin Search' mechanic?"

For the vast majority of this game, there was no point. Y'all lynched the theme itself on Day 1.

Two of the three power roles (Long Con and sanmateo) were tied to the search mechanic. They were both gone by the end of Day 2. So it was really just for fun. I think I made my hints too easy though, because y'all were either on the correct answer or tied for it in every night but one.

A cool mechanic nonetheless, definitely different from your typical Heist power role mechanics.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2017 9:49 pm

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2017 9:11 pm I'm probably way too excited for this win but god damn it was driving me crazy knowing that I could cause town to lose it in the end. I'm so glad it worked out.

Well played to the scum team as well, all three of nutella, DDL, and sanmateo really played impressively well. It's a wonder we caught you all.

You should be. You were clutch. Straight fucking clutch.

I'm probably way too excited for this win but god damn it was driving me crazy knowing that I could cause town to lose it in the end. I'm so glad it worked out.

Well played to the scum team as well, all three of nutella, DDL, and sanmateo really played impressively well. It's a wonder we caught you all.

Dude! Seriously, I know how tough it is to try to participate in a game when you're seriously limited on time and feeling completely out of the loop. Thanks for giving it a try nonetheless. Your recent posts kept reading genuine to me, so clearly you assisted in this win.

Thanks so much for hosting this game, Jay, it might be one of the most fun games I've played in ages.

And thanks for playing, NT, hope you join us for some others. I hope I didn't scare you away.

DOM! HIGH FIVE BRO, NEITHER OF US MISLYNCHED EACH OTHER THIS TIME!

Serious props to Epignosis, Sloonei, speedchuck, Spacedaisy, and dunya for their incredible efforts. Couldn't have done it without you all. As well as the rest of town, really.

This is such a satisfying win.

YES OMG FUCK YES!!!!

Dom didn't show up in time to vote at all, whereas nutella parked a vote on Dom with apparently no intention of returning. I suppose that makes me feel alright about this.

Still nervous though.

F5 F5 F5

Well then.

...

*crickets*

Oops, I said "wouldn't don't". Okay. Back to work. Will check in probably too often.

Another random point against nutella (and Dom as well to some degree):

The final scum has every reason not to be picky as to who gets mislynched ever since they lost DDL who was a foregone conclusion for dying once sanmateo was lynched anyway. Especially the last couple lynches, this lynch, and a subsequent one if there is one, they wouldn't don't give a fuck as long as it isn't them.

The fact that NT, dunya, and Serge have all made distinct efforts since then to go out of their way to say to me and others "I think it's this person" or "NOT this person" reflects well for each one of them. NT for accusing me, then backing off and accusing nutella; dunya for not just rolling with Dom as the then-consensus lynch and expressing her thoughts ever since her entrance; and Serge for his accusation of Sloonei, who wasn't under any fire to speak of.

I can't really say nutella has done that at all. Dom hasn't either but at least made limited efforts today to dig up a couple of points against nutella, which is somewhat unconvincing but still something.

I suppose I'll also dig into BWT's ISO at some point before EoD too just to be safe but honestly if the guy was bad and dunya is now bad then we're fucked anyway and they've both played beyond amazingly.

I'll go back to working myself, but surely will be checking periodically to see if [mention]nutella[/mention], [mention]Serge[/mention], or [mention]NewTraditionalist[/mention] poke their heads in here within the next 75 minutes. Also curious what other thoughts Dom may have when he gets the chance as well.

dunya wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:43 pm I'll have to sleep now. I'm reading you MP. I like your thoughts. Good luck to us! See you tomorrow.

Thanks again!

Of course, I'm assuming heavily that there is only one other mafia. I very firmly believe that this is the case. Now that we have seen all 3 non-vanilla roles, I don't think Jay would have made the distribution for this game 10 v. 4, as that would be truly horrendous chances for town. I don't think we're looking for two scumsters at all.

I also don't think we've seen any evidence for 3P, and again, 3 power roles have been revealed, meaning this 3P would have to be completely vanilla as well. Highly dubious.

Updated rainbow:

dunya/birdwithteeth11 -- 1% chance of being last mafia

NewTraditionalist -- 3% chance of being last mafia

Serge -- 6% chance of being last mafia

Dom -- 15% chance of being last mafia

nutella -- 75% chance of being last mafia

Reexamining NT's other behavior I still stand by my earlier assessments in response to dunya here.

A random point though:

NT would have a ton of reason not to kill me if he is the final scum, because I've been a pretty firm vocal supporter of his for a while, and I could totally see him wanting to keep me alive just so he could fool me.

That's really the only point I can make in favor of him being bad right now, however.

NewTraditionalist wrote: ↑Wed Sep 13, 2017 1:13 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Sep 13, 2017 12:39 am @NewTraditionalist why did you vote for me?

I figured that being the one to focus on the new person would be good cover for a thug. Or a sign that you are an outgoing and well-adjusted person.

NewTraditionalist wrote: ↑Wed Sep 13, 2017 1:15 pm I have to say that doing this in a forum is really difficult for me compared to sitting around a table. I really have no idea what to look for.

These two posts read staggeringly honest to me. Maybe I'm crazy, but I just don't see a newbie scum player making an accusation like that and I also don't see that second post as faked in the slightest.

I'll look at NT again now just to make sure I'm not crazy or missing something.

My gut is usually shit but at least I'm going to listen to it again this time and put some simultaneous faith in dunya's as well.

Yeah, I really don't think it's Dom anymore.

This was the post Dom made close to EoD D4 and it made me feel he was being sincere. I still feel that way reexamining it.