The Syndicate

DharmaHelper wrote:Yoooooo if the civvies win I will be so pumped.

Same. It'll also mean that the civilians will have won every single GoC thus far.

Golden wrote:I can't believe there is still an outside chance of the civilians winning.

+1

DharmaHelper wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:My team was fucked from jump street. That we held on as long as we did is a miracle.

Yeah, a member getting NKed on N1 and then another member getting lynched shortly thereafter is a real rough start. I've been there, so I can relate; it feels like constantly putting forth every bit of effort in an impossible uphill battle.

Not to mention the lynch shenanigans we went through in the last two lynches.

Like, ok guys I get it I'm not supposed to win GoC's. Gosh.

That'll make the 2016 win that much sweeter, am I right?

DharmaHelper wrote:My team was fucked from jump street. That we held on as long as we did is a miracle.

Yeah, a member getting NKed on N1 and then another member getting lynched shortly thereafter is a real rough start. I've been there, so I can relate; it feels like constantly putting forth every bit of effort in an impossible uphill battle.

a2thezebra wrote:The civilians, I mean.

I'm with you there; despite not playing a stellar game collectively by any means, I'd love to see them pull away with the win in the end.

Consider my mind blown if the civilians actually pull this off.

Just like I do for calling zebra and DH as bad. :P

But I also thought Epi (not too off there?), Long Con, and Dom were bad for sure, so... ehhh.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I told people the Kubrick reveal was bait bullshit and got eyerolls. Oh well, punk ass baddies tryna get JJJ lynched. Pfft.

Well, now you have bragging rights for being right.

MovingPictures07 wrote:I wonder which mafia faction will win.

Well, I guess that answers that.

Good attempt though, Epic Noses.

Turnip Head wrote:The civvies are not playing well right now, but they're getting enough help from other sources that they're still in this. It's still anyone's game.

Could you imagine if they ended up winning?

I wonder which mafia faction will win.

Epignosis wrote:Anybody feel like betting on how many times bea posts tonight? Bonus if you can guess her biggest streak.

I'm going to say 9.

Golden wrote:

Black Rock wrote:I don't understand the baddies kills this game. Both JJJ and Dom were thread distractions and could have taken a lynch. Why NK them?

Me either. Very odd.

Perhaps we are at the stage when the baddie teams are getting worried about each other and are trying to actively take out the other team and failing. If that's what it is, I will find that hilarious.

That actually would make sense.

Epignosis wrote:"The Big Wheel" and "Ghost of a Chance" have been stuck in my head since Sunday.

Two of my favorite Rush songs, for sure.

I was wondering what you meant there.

Black Rock wrote:I don't understand the baddies kills this game. Both JJJ and Dom were thread distractions and could have taken a lynch. Why NK them?

I don't get those two kills either.

As for the spoiler poll, I put "yes, privately", but I'm personally not averse to the first option -- though I already see G-Man would be, and Golden and Typh might be too, so that's why I added my vote there.

Turnip Head wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Yeah, shame you died for sure, especially with that role. Nice inclusion of Light, btw, hosts.

We wanted to give the role checker some sort of drawback, so someone from Death Note with the Shinigami Eye Deal made the most sense. Misa would have made more sense thematically, but Light felt like the more iconic role.

Would have been fun as a serial killer role too though.

Yeah, I actually figured Soichiro Yagami would probably get included if you guys went for a civilian role check, but since you're not restricting yourselves to civilian/mafia alignment from the original game (good move, btw, since that was unnecessarily restricting back in GoC '13), Misa or Light make at least as much sense, if not more.

Light as SK would have been awesome.

Yeah, shame you died for sure, especially with that role. Nice inclusion of Light, btw, hosts.

Dom wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Damn, I was wrong about Dom AND Long Con.

Killing me was unexpected. I guess I'll have to read up.

I really thought you were bad. Goes to show that I should always go with the opposite of what I'm thinking when I read you.

Damn, I was wrong about Dom AND Long Con.

Typhoony wrote:The fact that there should be players around who know he's civ makes it even worse

Yeah... that's not a role that should be getting lynched at this stage of the game.

Wow, I did NOT expect that. That sucks.

Well, something super interesting happened, I spammed this spectator chat, so... sorry about that, and I'll be back later to see what the hell is actually going on. :P

Lol, "peek" came from the "seer" terminology, I believe, so it makes thematic sense in that regard, as if the seer is peeking into a crystal ball or however you'd like to think of it.

I'm not sure why it would be thematically used with "cop" though.

S~V~S wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Another possibility is that Boomslang has a tracker-like role card (doesn't have to be a straight up cop), thinks he saw LC killing last night (?), and is going after him as a result. And his GTH exercise is completely honest, having nothing to do with outside-the-thread information.

Another possibility is that we have no clue what he is doing.

Um, and gotcha re peeks. With the colors and I have heard that in some games there is a civ peek before the game or something to that effect, I was not sure they were the same thing.

Then it's more likely that he's pulling some sort of gambit... so hopefully this doesn't blow up in his face like my "I'm the cop except I'm fake claiming as a vanilla townie" gambit did.

Correct, yeah, in a typical Thingyman-Mafia Championship type setup (which has largely been adopted for these early Heist games), the cop receives a randomly selected "green peek", essentially a free role check but ONLY on a townie to start the game. The reason it's restricted to green randomization only is for balance reasons (otherwise the cop would literally start the game with a confirmed mafia down, and could potentially end the game completely after N2). But every time he sends in a "role check" in subsequent Nights, you could also say he's sending in a "peek", same thing really.

The other possibility is that LC and Boomslang are both bad, and this is Boomslang's way to throw him under the bus, but... that seems silly, because by faking info like he is now, then he's setting forth the assumption that the mafia will have to kill him tonight. Then when they don't, it'll inevitably raise questions. That, and LC didn't have to be lynched today.

Well, I'm nonetheless intrigued as to what unfolds as a result. If this is some kind of crazy gambit by Boomslang, he has no information, but really thinks LC is mafia so he's faking info... then that's ballsy. I've tried that before and it 100% backfired in my face, because the person I was claiming was mafia was actually the cop.

S~V~S wrote:No that is not what I am telling you. Is a "peek" the same thing as a role check? I thought it was different, like the host gave them random info. We might have a role checker of sorts. But like TH said, I have no idea what Boomslang is doing, lol.

Take that as you will.

Yeah, my bad, I didn't mean to be unclear -- peek = role check

For example, in LP-based mafia communities for years, we'd say
"The role checker role checks"
whereas other communities might say
"The cop peeks" or "The seer peeks"

Typically, the cop and seer can receive a random n0 peek, which is like a free night action, so that's probably what you're thinking of, but the peek itself just = role check; they're synonymous wording as far as I'm aware.

Another possibility is that Boomslang has a tracker-like role card (doesn't have to be a straight up cop), thinks he saw LC killing last night (?), and is going after him as a result. And his GTH exercise is completely honest, having nothing to do with outside-the-thread information.

S~V~S wrote:Also why do you think we would have a role that has "peeks"?

He is bluffing.

So what you're telling me is that you included no role checker in this game.

S~V~S wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Typhoony wrote:Infodump. Lame.

And against the rules. Modkill!

Typically, infodumping and role claiming are totally OK in a closed setup like this, but yeah, it appears S~V~S and TH have specified otherwise.

We have? We said

This game is closed set up. This allows for limited role claiming. But be careful about that, and do NOT involve other people in your claim.

So people can say they are a cop, the Easter Bunny, whoever. They can say they are any role that existed this year. Whether or not that role is in the game is up to debate. Do you guys really think TH or I would give an info role to just anyone?

Silly Spectators.

Well, that's what I would have thought, but in the same rules post you also say:

*No role outing of others
*No info dumping~ which means no night results, no info gleaned via BTS, etc.

So it's a bit unclear what exactly constitutes as "info dumping".

And if I were the cop, I wouldn't want to throw out other GTH mafia information like that unless I had red peeks on them. Don't want players to misinterpret what I actually knew for sure from what I was guessing.

He named Dom, juliets, LC, Mac, and Blooper as GTH mafia. Frankly, I could easily see any of those players as mafia.

Regardless of the fact that it's allowed or completely forbidden, it happened... which is unfortunate. Nonetheless, the only question that now remains in my mind:

Assuming he is the cop, does he only have a red peek on LC, or did he red peek other players as well; what about those other 4 names he just threw out as mafia as well? There's almost no possible way he red checked all 5... unless those were literally the last 5 names he sent in every Night. If he somehow did managed that, then holy shit.

Typhoony wrote:It's definitely easier to defend against in a game like this... I hope LC (if he is actually bad) manages to wriggle his way out of it and win the game. Go LC!

That's precisely why, because no one even knows if a cop is even in the game, or whether there is and Boomslang is lying, etc. Situations like this would inevitably lead to a counterclaim and then the town lynching the player they don't believe is the cop.

Typhoony wrote:Infodump. Lame.

And against the rules. Modkill!

Typically, infodumping and role claiming are totally OK in a closed setup like this, but yeah, it appears S~V~S and TH have specified otherwise.

Boomslang the cop, it seems.

Black Rock wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Glad to know I was right about golden and JJJ!

I've been calling Dom and LC mafia for what seems like forever and I have no idea why they haven't been lynched. I also think DH is still probably mafia too.

I know why LC hasn't been lynched.

I don't think Draconus is bad.

The lynches this game have been so coordinated... Especially as the game has gone on. How can anyone actually suspect FZ.? Lol.

And here comes DH chiming in as well. He, Dom, and LC are so bad.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I've been calling Dom and LC mafia for what seems like forever and I have no idea why they haven't been lynched. I also think DH is still probably mafia too.

If you're right then my game-long frustration will have felt justified. I tried pushing all three of those cases and instead of sticking they just made people want to lynch me.

If I had been playing, I would have been right there with you and Golden most of the time (from what I did read of the thread, mind you, since I haven't been keeping up constantly). As usual, I don't understand the lynches this game, and found my opinions disagreeing with the vast majority of players.

Glad to know I was right about golden and JJJ!

I've been calling Dom and LC mafia for what seems like forever and I have no idea why they haven't been lynched. I also think DH is still probably mafia too.

So I've not been following almost at all these days, but I did see BR had Captain Olimar, and the role sounds super cool. Can't wait to find out more.

Now watch me be terribly wrong about everyone.

And then the only discrepancy between what we were thinking was solved by this post:

Golden wrote:Actually, my ping on dom is a lot higher than that now. I just reread his interaction with JJJ and it is bad. Really bad. The guilt trips like 'that seems like a shot at bea' and criticising JJJ for doing what he has to to explain the difference in his post count. Ugh. It feels like a trap he is putting JJJ into.

Beautiful, Golden. Now if you're mafia...

I agree with just about everything Golden said in this post.

Again, though, I'm not exactly 100% into the game; those are just my impressions based on what I've managed to get out of what I've read (probably between 60 - 70% of the thread now).

Dom, LC, and MM I just haven't managed to get any real reason to trust anything they're doing this game. I'm not sure what DH is doing either; I find myself consistently disagreeing with him, which I find strange.

To add to that, regarding why people are voting him, I don't get it. While I am not sold on his town-ness, I think the case brought against him is very weak, and I expect more out of an LC case. I realize it is still early in the game, but I just don't really buy any of it; it's all predicated on assumptions that I think either (1) seem to be a stretch (the zebra teammate connection), or (2) are criticisms of JJJ's behavior that, from what I've seen, don't indicate his alignment one way or the other.

That said though, I don't get practically any of the lynchees so far this game. Rico was obviously trying to get himself lynched, sig did what again?, and the thread has been very single-track, for the most part, especially for so many normally inquisitive players. Consider me confused at the major suspects continually.

If I were in the game and a lone civilian, I'd be going after those who both pelted sig with accusations and are now going after JJJ. From what I've read, no one other than FZ. has really been questioning any of the sig voters (other than JJJ, lol, which I'll admit was a bit of a strange vote for him, and makes me doubt my believing him), which I find odd, since that was super bandwagony.

Typhoony wrote:What do people think of JJJ? I've never played with him :P

He seems pretty on-meta to me, though in a lesser form for RL reasons he's been clear to stress (he's like me in that regard).

GTH I'd say he's a civilian, though I'm not sold on it. I've seen him as a civilian more often than mafia (unsurprisingly), and he can imitate his supatown meta really well as a mafia. I may be more inclined to see him as civilian because I'm smelling possible mafia in his three main attackers at the moment (Dom, Long Con, Metalmarsh), though it's difficult to say for sure.

With regards to my doubt, he hasn't been hunting mafia in the way I'd expect a supatown JJJ to do. Too much reliance on self-defense, whereas I'd expect a civilian JJJ to have undertaken more analysis by now and have more firm suspects by Day 3. He doesn't seem to be leading the thread as much as I'm accustomed to, but it could be partially because he's on TS and not RYM. And while his zebra interaction ISOs were inspired, I didn't get the impression that JJJ was really trying to find bad guys. That could be a reflection of mafia mindset (he doesn't care to, or has to fabricate his hunt), or of burnout regardless of alignment.

Hence I could entertain him as mafia, either zebra's team or not, but less likely to be zebra's team than the other team (if it were anyone's idea to target someone on their own team with a curse N1, I much more am apt to believe it's zebra's idea than JJJ's, since that doesn't seem his style).

In the end though, especially in his posts made today, I believe him -- and it's hard to express exactly why -- so call it a gut evaluation, especially since I haven't been keeping up with the whole game. Therefore, I question the motives of those trying to get him lynched. We'll see if I'm wrong though.