The Syndicate

I shall also throw in my vote for Liz. I see no reason not to at this point.

LizKeen wrote:The host has no problem with it so I'm going to try it. The only way I can think of to get you guys to believe me is to hand you my vote at this point. So here's the deal: Tomorrow's Easter and I won't be around until late, however, if before I go to bed, (and I'm an insomniac so that will be a while), if enough people can come to an agreement on where I should place my vote tomorrow I will put my vote on that person. First, second, third vote, whatever I really don't care. (Obviously not going to vote myself of course.) I won't go off just 3 people because that could be mafia, I think to be fair I need at least 7 people in agreement.

What could this possibly have proven? How does getting other people to tell you where to vote help in any way (other than removing your accountability)?

Metalmarsh89 wrote: I still think S V S could be bad based on multiple circumstances.

1) Defending the millionaire when blindfaeth did his thing Day 1, then going after Zomba after her name was revealed.
2) The last point in the list I brought forth on LizKeen, in which LizKeen suspects Epignosis based on reasoning brought forth by SVS.
3) Defending Epignosis yesterday

These are actually pretty reasonable points against her. I still think SVS isn't a baddie though, there are a few slight things I've picked up on that make me think she's on our side. I say slight, they're actually pretty clear. I feel like some people are deliberately ignoring them though.

LizKeen wrote: 2 mafia have been lynched. If I was mafia and gave my vote away that would make me the worst teammate ever. Me just voting how I want to vote would prove nothing.

So your argument is basically WIFOM? You'll prove you're a civ by letting others dictate your vote because there's no way a baddie would ever do that?

LizKeen wrote:I wasn't even thinking about who had the safe when I posted this. I was merely speculating on what could happen. I don't think Epi was even on my radar at that point. If I was his teammate and had such knowledge why in the world would I have even said this?

Could've been an accidental slip like people think the JC thing may have been. Again, your defense here is purely WIFOM. I hate invoking it, but sometimes it's just the truth.

LizKeen wrote: I guess I don't know what else I was supposed to say to that. This post kind of contradicts itself. You're saying one teammate wouldn't have voted another but then you say two teammates would throw each other under the bus for distancing? Maybe Vompatti and Zombarella were teammates and since Vompatti wasn't really participating they threw him under the bus. I don't know.

I don't see why they'd do that though. If a baddie looks like they're in danger but it could be recovered, usually their team tries to push for someone else's lynch. Why would they do that with another of their team. Why would Epi ensure that the vote was a tie between his two teammates? If your answer is "for civ cred" then I will tell you you're wrong because he'd have got more civ cred from voting Zomb and sealing her lynch.

LizKeen wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:I do still have the key, but I've put it up for sale in this auction thing since it's completely useless t me.

What if it becomes useful? Why would you chance selling it to the mafia?

The key is very unlikely to ever become useful to me because I don't have the power to steal items, and therefore cannot be blocked by a locked door. As I understand it, that's where the key comes into play. So I'm putting it on sale, I was hoping a Celestial might be inclined to buy it in exchange for anything fun but not Oriental that they've come across in their travels.

S~V~S wrote:
I think TH <3 civs and I think baddies fear him

I have spent most of the game thinking Liz is bad, tbh. But right now, seeing everyone else (and I trust none of you tbh, lol) closing in on her, my misplaced nurturing feelings are kicking in. But she has struck me as bad pretty much most of the game. My main interest today is saying what I have to say since who knows if i will be silenced or dead tomorrow.

If you think she's bad, why not vote her? I feel most strongly about the case on her right now.

S~V~S wrote:I miss Splints I did think it was interesting that she brought up Faraday again before she was killed. What do you think of Faraday? And Rabbit, you buying what i am selling yet? I will give you a reduced price

She did that? Must have missed it. Faraday did catch my attention earlier and I do mean to have a proper look at him.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:I don't blame you, I need to do some studying as well.

LizKeen: what are your thoughts right now on her?

Thought you'd just been reading my posts? :P Yeah, I still think Liz is bad. I just can't add up a bunch of things she's said with the idea she's civ. I think your latest point is quite interesting too. As far as the Vomp thing is concerned, it's not a battle I care too much about and I'm not going to waste much effort since he's not interested in defending himself, but I still think that when you look at all the factors from day 3, he probably isn't bad. How do you feel about that? Is there anyone else you're looking at?

No. I am having far too much fun reading about data analysis and statistics.


On second thought, what would you like to chat about?

I never said it doesn't do anything. It opens locked objects. I want to sell it though because I've yet to find a use for it and don't expect that I ever will, so maybe someone else will appreciate it more than I do.

I do still have the key, but I've put it up for sale in this auction thing since it's completely useless t me.

S~V~S wrote: So Bullz & Faraday, who do you think is bad then? Other than Liz. Cause there are three baddies, not just one. So you do not think that the TH=Vomps evil teammate has any merit then?

Shouldn't it be obvious that I don't think TH is Vomp's teammate? I mean, if I don't think Vomp is bad, then I shouldn't think he has teammates should I? Seems kinda obvious to me, but then I seem to be one of the few people who can pick up on the obvious in this thread. I don't think TH is bad either, for the record. To be honest, I'm sort of wondering about DF now. I feel like his last post was just an echo of everything I've been saying, I need to reread him but I do kinda feel like he's just jumping in, echoing a few sentiments, and jumping back out. Something just seems off there.

I'm still sort of getting back into the game after being so sporadic earlier on, there are a few people I'm thinking things about but I'd need to have a proper look before deciding anything. There are a handful of people I think are definitely/quite likely to be civs. But I'll turn your question on it's head. Who do you think is bad, other than Vompatti?

LizKeen wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:

LizKeen wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:Being useful and being a civvie are two entirely different things though.

Ok, what is it about Vompatti's post that you're finding civvie?

His posts are the usual Vompatti stuff.

Well that would drive me batty.


I wish I knew how to convince you people I'm not bad. Does it even make sense I would be on a team with Epignosis? I've thought he was bad since about Day 2. And he was trying to steer people towards me Day 3.

Do you not have anything to say about the rest of my post? I wish someone could explain to me where the other three baddies voted if both Zomb and Vomp are bad and got so many votes each. In my opinion, it makes more sense that some of the people responsible for the Vomp case would be baddies trying to save Zomb. Epi even voted Vomp to tie it up! Why would he have deliberately created a tie between two of his teammates? Surely it would have been better for him to put the final nail in Zomb's coffin?

As for you, it's not unheard of for teammates to go after each other. That's the whole concept of distancing. Some players spend all game looking for a nice big bus to throw their own team under when they're bad. For all I know you could be like that. The two of you could've agreed in btsc to go after each other so one would have civ cred when the other was lynched. A lot of your posts just don't add up with the idea of you being good IMO.

LizKeen wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:Being useful and being a civvie are two entirely different things though.

Ok, what is it about Vompatti's post that you're finding civvie?

His posts are the usual Vompatti stuff. They say little about his alignment IMO. As I've said at least two or three times, I just think based on the way the Zomb lynch went down that it's unlikely they're both bad. I'm not saying he's some bastion of goodness who we should all aspire to be more like, I just doubt that the guy's a baddie

Being useful and being a civvie are two entirely different things though.

S~V~S wrote:I have a funny feeling that I may be the only scapegoat today. Not sure why I think that ...

Since there is a theory that Vomp is voting TH becasue TH is the Millionaire (not a theory I subscribe to, tbh, like at all, I think it's a horrible theory) I suggest we lynch Vompatti. And see how that works out for us. Or maybe we could lynch me. Then you could see that what I have been selling is true, and then maybe you could look for real baddies.

But really, I would like to start with Vomp.

I would certainly not like to lynch you. However... Vomp, I still don't think is bad. Just because of the Zomb lynch. 14 votes for either one, and people think both might be bad? I dunno. I could still see a Liz lynch, if you're up for that?

Glad everyone was right about Epig! I still think Liz could be bad and will probably continue to look at her tomorrow. Voting Wabash!

I will vote now too actually. I had planned to let Liz respond to me first, but some of my friends are threatening to make me go out and get drunk with them so I may not get the chance later. *Voting Liz*

juliets wrote:I haven't felt good about Liz since I hounded her about answering Epi and TH's cases about her and she still didn't. I finally gave up. But that does bring up a point - if Epi brought a case against Liz doesn't that rule them out of being on the same team? Or do you think Epi would try to distance himself by bringing a case and potentially telling Liz to just ignore it.

I don't know actually. I've only been bad with Epi once that I can remember and he distanced from us by killing off three of our team in one night. Granted, those circumstances were vastly different. I'm not sure of his attitude to distancing but anything is possible really.

juliets wrote:Bullz the slip discussion is from a recent post. I think you did a good job laying out a case. Are you thinking of voting Liz instead of Epi today?

I know What I mean is it gained exposure as I was going through Liz's posts so I didn't see fit to repeat it again. I am indeed thinking of a Liz vote. I could see an Epi vote too, in all honesty, I think his comments to LC about info could be quite telling but I'm more convinced about Liz right now and I'm one of those who aren't keen on voting for the cursed. Speaking of which, 3 curses in 5 days? Wow.

So, forgetting the potential slip discussion which seems to have sprung up during the course of reading her older posts, there are a few things that concern me about Liz. She sometimes seems to reach odd conclusions about things and I feel like she tries to cause confusion with some of her posts:

LizKeen wrote:I feel like the Celestials and the mafia are voting the same people. I can see why the mafia would do it but is there some reasoning the Celestials would do it? Either that or there's some recruited folk.

For instance, this whole post just feels like fear-mongering to me. One the one hand "The neutrals are working with the baddies!" and on the other "The baddies have recruited people!". No supporting evidence to either claim, but one or the other is happening.

LizKeen wrote: Is there usually this much requoting in Syndicate games? I'm really wondering if it's a mafia tactic just to be a massive distraction. If so then you're doing well.

I questioned the intent behind this ages ago, as did others, and I don't think anyone got a response.

LizKeen wrote:I think the simple solution is we're going to have to come up for new words for theory and Possibility, for clarification purposes.

Speaking of which, has anyone theorized the possibility the millionaire could gain more power to recruit?

Baseless speculation, but again reads like fear-mongering as well. Trying to make people afraid of recruits so that nobody is really safe to trust any more? Maybe I'm the only one who sees it this way, or maybe I'm not explaining it right, but it feels odd to me. Some of her explanations for her votes also don't ring true with me.

LizKeen wrote:

S~V~S wrote:Why?

Because I couldn't get past that he had the elephant charm and I didn't understand why anyone would want to steal that item.

Really? Not even a Celestial? We can't know for sure that he was one but I think it's a safe bet. She's not the only DP voter in the pack, but I do think there was a really good explanation for why DP might've had the charm. So good in fact, that it's probably why he's dead now.

LizKeen wrote: Like you pointed out, I voted early because it was either that or chance missing another vote and at that point I had no way of knowing how the lynch was going to go. The suspicion at that point seemed to be me or Zomberella so a vote on Vompatti wouldn't have made sense. If you look at the posts you 'll see I wasn't back that day before the vote. Given how many votes he got that day and that post he made yesterday I think it may be a very good thing he didn't get any more votes. It seems he actually wants them. And actually my suspect list hasn't changed much, if at all. My only problem is there's about 7 people on it and there's supposedly only 4 mafia left.

Vomp quite regularly plays the way he is playing here, and is often lynched for it. 9 times out of 10 he's not even bad. It would be a huge coincidence then, if he was the millionaire. Even so, you believe he is bad but have an arsenal of excuses for why you don't vote for him. You say you've got 7 suspects but I feel like you've only ever mentioned 3 who are still alive: SVS, Vomp, Epi. Please correct me if I'm wrong, or feel free to name the other 4.

LizKeen wrote:

S~V~S wrote:There is something bothering me after reading your posts, I have to read again and try to put the posts in context, and make them fit with your voting record.

Make them fit? Just to make me look bad?

This feels like a NO U to a post that wasn't even that accusatory.

LizKeen wrote: Vompatti as I've said twice now seems to want to be voted for. Which could explain his useless odd posts. No, I won't vote for him at least not right now because either he's the millionaire or for some reason wants us to think that. If he is is the millionaire then by my count he has 8 votes already (that could explain the day 1 self-vote) and who knows how much power and if one of those powers is the ability to avoid a lynch I don't want to waste a vote AND give him more power.

If you're so suspicious of Vomp, when will you vote him? He's probably not getting NKed any time soon if he's not bad, and if he is bad then you obviously know we need him lynched at some point. So when? Ever?

LizKeen wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

S~V~S wrote:What is your opinion on Liz?

My opinion on Liz is that I think you're right, and she's as bad as they come. I'm surprised she hasn't been lynched yet.

Wow really? No reciprocal benefit of the doubt? Ok then.

Touched on this previously, but I'm going to mention it again. Seems like she was expecting trust or some kind of defense from MM for not going after him.

S~V~S wrote:Liz has said she has not played with this group, iirc when she first joined she said she stumbled on us in a search engine or something to that effect.

She referred to Juliet's as Juliets Coffee. She has not used that name here. The explanation LiZ gave did not ring true to me. So where did she hear that? In a chatroom? It was just an odd thing for her to say.

Has she perhaps been bad with Juliets before? Maybe she picked it up in a past btsc or something? It is definitely very weird, especially if she's suddenly claiming to have played around our community before when previously she said she was new...

S~V~S wrote:What I think my problem was, was that I had totally the wrong idea about who cursed me the other day. And when I flipped it in my head, reading things without that bias I started to get a better understanding of what people were saying. Things kinda clicked, so thanks MM for making me reread with a different mindset.

I could vote for Liz or Epi. I do think he is probably bad. Don't love voting for the cursed, but I could still vote for him.

I would prefer a Liz vote but the time I had hoped to spend pulling quotes went to arguing with Rabbit. An old and fun pastime that I have missed

Gotta say that Juliets Coffee thing was weird. Like someone said JC in chat and had to explain what it stood for. I know people suspect slips more than they actually happen, but that was very odd.

I could also see a Liz vote today. I keep feeling funny about her posts. Might look into her in a bit. Got a few things to do first though.

Long Con wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

Long Con wrote:I'm really surprised anyone wants to hear anything from me about Turnip Head tbh. I don't really know how to put my thoughts on him, S~V~S, and others out there in any sort of complex fashion because I'll likely get accused of infodropping and 99% ignored by the thread. Unless that's just special treatment that only Epig gets.

LC, you do not have info on me, because I'm not bad. Whatever you're working with, an error must have been made somehow. People have thought they've had info on me before and they were wrong. Is this about the bottle still?

Is there anyone here who speaks English that can translate my posts into Syndicatese so that people can understand them?

Are you in fact trying to say that you don't actually have info but people keep acting as if you do and this situation is making participation difficult?

Long Con wrote:I'm really surprised anyone wants to hear anything from me about Turnip Head tbh. I don't really know how to put my thoughts on him, S~V~S, and others out there in any sort of complex fashion because I'll likely get accused of infodropping and 99% ignored by the thread. Unless that's just special treatment that only Epig gets.

Try? It's only infodumping if you do it with the subtlety of a sledgehammer.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Dom wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:I think we should lynch Epignosis today, regardless of curses. I actually feel a bit better about Dom after DP was NK'd. This will require some rereading though.

We now have three confirmed civs who want(ed) Epignosis lynched: blindfaeth, MM 1.0, and the poet.

MM does someone being a confirmed civvie make them know what he baddies are?

I'm not sure where I stand on Epi, but I am not sure that argument holds.

Yes it does actually.

Can you clarify why someone having been a civ means we should follow their beliefs? BF thought TH and I were baddies who had decided to distance by having him call me by the wrong name. If I list off 10 people's names who I'm totally sure are 100% bad, and you lynch me, will you then lynch all 10 people even though more than half can't be bad?

LizKeen wrote: Like you pointed out, I voted early because it was either that or chance missing another vote and at that point I had no way of knowing how the lynch was going to go. The suspicion at that point seemed to be me or Zomberella so a vote on Vompatti wouldn't have made sense. If you look at the posts you 'll see I wasn't back that day before the vote. Given how many votes he got that day and that post he made yesterday I think it may be a very good thing he didn't get any more votes. It seems he actually wants them. And actually my suspect list hasn't changed much, if at all. My only problem is there's about 7 people on it and there's supposedly only 4 mafia left.

What do you mean, supposedly? There must be 4. One has been lynched, and they're the only ones doing any killing at night.

S~V~S wrote: And I am not playing dumb~ but helping the civvies =/=being the civvies. The baddies have to outnumber the civs & Celestials. lots more civs than Celestials, and the baddies know everyone not them. So I am not the one playing dumb.

I actually think Rabbit is right in this one. The baddies must surely be scared of that 5-person btsc group that they seemingly can't win with.

Dom wrote: So, you know who Luke is, then?

Who is Luke? Typo?

Dom wrote:

S~V~S wrote:Just feels. Doms opinions, suspicions and thoughts have seemed less civ to me than Epis, anf the fact that Dom has *felt* like a low poster, but makes lots of posts I don't even remember (when I love reading Doms posts)... I dunno. Feels. And maybe I am trying to convince myself, especially re the buddying; sometimes I start a post with one position, but I end it with another. I talk myself in and out of things all the time. But I don't see myself talking myself into lynching someone who can't defend, snarky as i think that defense might wind up being.

Paraphrase: "I suspect Dom because he said things"

That's about as specific as that got.

Maybe, but I understand where she's coming from. I do the same thing with talking myself out of ideas halfway through a post. Don't necessarily agree with her here though.

Dom wrote:

rabbit8 wrote:

S~V~S wrote:I am not blowing him off. I am not sure I trust him, either. His weird little stab in THs direction before was, well, weird. I base my votes on my own thoughts, although if someone posts things I agree with I will follow their case. If they don't, well, then i won't.

You did basically dismiss it and blow it off. It was weird.
TH is a civvie?

I am starting to doubt it tbh.

Why? He has seemed reasonably good most of the game IMO.

LizKeen wrote: Vompatti as I've said twice now seems to want to be voted for. Which could explain his useless odd posts. No, I won't vote for him at least not right now because either he's the millionaire or for some reason wants us to think that. If he is is the millionaire then by my count he has 8 votes already (that could explain the day 1 self-vote) and who knows how much power and if one of those powers is the ability to avoid a lynch I don't want to waste a vote AND give him more power.

If you're so sure he's the millionaire, why wouldn't you go after him properly and do your best to make sure his lynch goes through? Personally I still don't believe both he and Zomb could be bad.

LizKeen wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

S~V~S wrote:What is your opinion on Liz?

My opinion on Liz is that I think you're right, and she's as bad as they come. I'm surprised she hasn't been lynched yet.

Wow really? No reciprocal benefit of the doubt? Ok then.

Why should there be any?

LizKeen wrote:I feel like the Celestials and the mafia are voting the same people. I can see why the mafia would do it but is there some reasoning the Celestials would do it? Either that or there's some recruited folk.

Why would either team all vote the same people? That would make it too obvious who they all are. I've never been on a team where all members consciously chose to vote together, in fact it's usually the exact opposite. That's not even getting into how dumb the Celestials would be to work with the baddies. I can see them putting their own team first, it's what I'd do, but they literally can't win with the baddies and are basically an extension of the civs.

Definitely voting Sophie. Some of her reactions to the discussion seem a little overblown for how close the vote actually is today. Doesn't feel civ to me.

fingersplints wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:Home now. Knackered! Gonna catch up here and have a chilled out night of pizza and WrestleMania 31. Uni work will keep til tomorrow - speaking of which, it's the Easter break so for the next three weeks I can hopefully be more active.

If you haven't already don't forget to change your time settings.
yay for being still light out

Haha it was just about still light when I started my catch-up! :P Thanks for the reminder!

I think you have raised some really good points regarding Sophie. I think I may put a vote there this evening, definitely wouldn't feel comfortable voting DP just because he allegedly has an item when there are many non-baddie ways he could've got it.

S~V~S wrote:Also, how is Zomba being bad mean that Vomps might not also be bad?

14 people voted for one or the other. I would be very surprised to find out that Vomp was also bad. I'm still not even sure how he got 7 votes.

Well. Save attempt, anyone?

So I said the other day I think at least one of the group that included MM/TH/LC/Epi was bad. Given TH's silence, I'm less inclined to vote him. So basically I guess I think one of LC or Epi is bad and with 10 minutes to vote I've not got the time to read them both properly. In the debate between the two, I feel like LC is coming off better. So I'm gonna put my completely inconsequential vote on Epig, and give both a proper read through tomorrow.

Bumped into an old mate and lost track of time!! I don't think Zomb or Vomp are bad. I don't know where that leaves me though.

juliets wrote:Who are you thinking about voting Bullz?

Haven't decided yet. I'm currently in the library trying to juggle three things at once. Might revisit the group I said probably holds at least one baddie in a bit.

S~V~S wrote: She said a lot of things I think more experienced players would have told her not to say. The No U start, and the low poster finish are things a bad team would have told her was a mistake. I think this is her first non-BTS game.

I've been thinking along these lines ever since the "BF ruined my role!" post. I think a baddie team would be better at helping a new-ish player react to a potential info reveal.

fingersplints wrote:I could be down with a vomps vote too. I don't think MM had any information that TH was bad, and I don't know why Vomps would say it seemed like he did. plus he is admitting to not bothering to read. I don't agree with zombas low posting = not reading (like say in the case of bwt) but this one is clear
Problem is with that vote we may get a baddie but chances are he is probably just a dangerous uninterested civvie

Didn't he just say that he thought MM made a good case? I didn't think he was saying MM had info. He said "hard evidence" but that could just mean evidence from the thread. I don't think TH is bad, so I don't agree with his vote, but Vomp doesn't seem any different to usual. I don't understand why there's suddenly a thing about him.

I'm back, gonna catch up. I'm going to Wales this weekend but after that it's the Easter break so I've got a month off and should be more active from then on!

I have a ridiculous amount of stuff going on right now and people are dragging me into drama I don't want to be involved in, so mafia and fun in general apparently has to take a backseat for a bit. Hopefully I'll be around later or tomorrow but oh my god some people. Sheesh.

Epignosis wrote:I'm afraid Golden scooped me on some things I wanted to say. Benefit of the waking hour, I suppose. If any of this is redundant, oh well.

LizKeen wrote:Is there usually this much requoting in Syndicate games? I'm really wondering if it's a mafia tactic just to be a massive distraction. If so then you're doing well.

The Legend of Zelda was an active game: With all the quoting and "requoting" present in it, I don't understand how LizKeen could consider this a Mafia tactic "in Syndicate games." This is a self-defeating thing to say: If there usually is this much requoting in Syndicate games (and a cursory glance at past games, including the one LizKeen was actually in, shows this to be the case), then how can anyone label it a mafia tactic? How many Mafia are there in this game? Surely there are more than five people making extensive use of the quote feature.

I brought up this post aaaages ago and got no response, so hopefully she replies to you. I'd still like to know why she asked that question...

I voted for Clark Street pretty much randomly.

Dom wrote:Bass-- do you have any idea why MP made contradictory statements and didn't answer my questions? Any explanation would be nice.

Why would he have an explanation?

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:At this point a vote for anyone other than MM is essentially pointless. I have already mentioned that he is in a category of people I think holds at least one baddie, so I shall *vote MM* and see what happens. How he flips may influence my opinion of quite a few players.

How does one hold a baddie?

However they want you to. Though I think SVS' post right after this answers the question appropriately. Hug them and maybe they will see the error of their ways.


It is the category that holds baddies. Or "includes", if you prefer.

At this point a vote for anyone other than MM is essentially pointless. I have already mentioned that he is in a category of people I think holds at least one baddie, so I shall *vote MM* and see what happens. How he flips may influence my opinion of quite a few players.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Anyway, Turnip Head.

I am convinced that he is on a team with Epignosis, and perhaps Dom as well.

Let's begin with the Day 1 reactions, especially those regarding blindfaeth. Everyone surely remembers when blindfaeth came forward early, saying that he has an item that could help him learn who the millionaire is.

He did? News to me! He must have kept pretty quiet about that one.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:
This question just seems out of the blue. Why does TH care about Dom's item, but not about anyone else's item? This smells of distancing, and a calculated form of distancing at that. blindfaeth had just accused TH about worrying about the safety of the millionaire, so TH immediately changes the subject. If he is a baddie, then what better way then to call upon a teammate. TH never followed up on the question

I think this is a bit of a stretch.

Metalmarsh89 wrote: Epignosis and TH immediately respond with a "Well that's interesting". But curiously, neither of them ever followed up on it, just left it at that. I believe that this was a set-up for themselves. If the lynch were to sway Zomba's direction, they are in perfect position to pile their votes on. But the lynch didn't sway that direction, so they were in a position to back right off of that suspicion. This is one of many examples of TH and Epignosis being on the same page, and I will address that in a bit.

Okay this is actually reasonable and worth remembering.

I was reading through your entire post (I'll take those smash coins now please) and there were a few things I would've commented on but they would all have been basically the same comment. I think some of your points are okay, but others come off like a bit of a stretch - as if you decided to suspect TH then went to look for reasons why.

S~V~S wrote:I would imagine the Celestials are playing for the civs , though, Bullz. They can't win with the baddies unless one or more of them are dead. The civvies would be a better deal for them.

And that's cool, BR. Based on their posts and votes would you feel the same? Can you at least see why someone without your unique perspective might think one or both of them could be bad?

Tbh, I had read them as pretty much an extension of the civs and was prepared to take my usual pro-neutral stance against anyone who suggested going after them. Still, if I were one, I'd be looking for the Treasures as my first priority and not worrying about whether you or BF gave the more accurate description of the will.

Long Con wrote:I think it would be cool for Ichabod to steal the Will from S~V~S to see if she was telling the truth about the way it reads. If she is, then BF was making some strange assumptions about the wealth of Zombarella. If she's not, then she's Zomba's teammate, who made sure she got the Will by voting first, in order to assuage the public opinion on her teammate.

If Ichabod steals the Will, then a team of five people will be able to better judge S~V~S' position here.

I think he probably wouldn't - his team need to get specific items to win. Doubt they care about the rest of us and our debate over the will.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

DFaraday wrote:Epi is certainly taking an interesting approach to defending himself. I was thinking of voting MM, but Epi's behavior is giving me pause.

Linki MP: I didn't read into it. I thought Mongoose was joking and Liz seemed to think she meant it.

For the record, Epig's reactions are a result of the item I hold (a bottle), not necessarily true.

Interesting...

I see you explained this later on. Why Epig though? Was that the only curse you could grant? The fact you can admit it makes me wonder if you can explain the thinking behind it.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

juliets wrote:I didn't expect to find all these votes for Metalmarsh this morning. I was worried I would have to find someone else to vote for even though I was most suspicious of him, but I think enough people have voted for MM that it's safe for me to vote him. I think he's bad this game.

But here's the problem here, I am not bad.

Anyway, I've changed my mind. I've decided that I will still attempt to prove to the rest of you that TH is bad. I hope at least one person will read it.

I haven't voted yet and am capable of reading things people write. I must warn you that I may vote for you anyway though.

Canucklehead wrote:I don't think MM is bad. I don't think SVS is bad, either, but I am not great at reading her.

I'm uncertain about TH. I think the way he has glommed onto the LC/MM theory as if it were infalliable is not a good sign, but I'm unsure if he's just a civ who's fixated on an idea and the baddies are hopping onto his train, or if he's a baddie leading the train. :hmm:

I think I said already that I've found the debate between that group interesting. I think at least one person among the TH/LC/MM/Epi group is probably bad.


Hours of linki I've already read...

Metalmarsh89 wrote: Another note I should add, TH accused LC of voting for me on Day 1 instead of blindfaeth, even though blindfaeth was the "obvious" lynch choice at the time, and we should be wary of voting the millionaire. blindfaeth was leading the lynch 5-1 at the time. Yet TH voted for you, when you had zero votes, even though blindfaeth was the "obvious" lynch choice. blindfaeth was leading the lynch 7-3 at the time.

Being wary of voting the millionaire is all well and good, but if we're too wary of it we'll never lynch him.

Turnip Head wrote: LC said he was suspicious of BF. I was not suspicious of him. Why would I vote for someone I'm not suspicious of? And why wouldn't LC vote for someone he was suspicious of?

I didn't interpret Zomba's post as giving up. I interpreted it as "Great, now I'm screwed". And that's a reaction that I can see a player having with any role - civ, bad, whatever. Someone coming at you on Day 1 acting like they know something sucks no matter what your role is. And if we are to believe SVS's reading of the will, blindfaeth knew nothing about Zombarella's role.

Agree with your interpretation of Zomb. As I said earlier, if she was bad I think her team would've helped work out something for her to say that looked better than what she did. I think SVS is right in her reading, looking back over BF it makes sense. He himself said he became more convinced because of his opposition - suggesting that he knew it wasn't concrete to begin with.

LizKeen wrote:Mr. Fung, do you know if the ivory, jade and amber would be dangerous if they were in the hands of the wrong team?

What do you mean by the 'wrong' team? There's only one team that wants them and they seem fairly unthreatening.

LizKeen wrote:Is there usually this much requoting in Syndicate games? I'm really wondering if it's a mafia tactic just to be a massive distraction. If so then you're doing well.

Is this a serious comment? People quote each other for easy reference to things they've said...

LizKeen wrote:I'm going back and re-reading (a task I dread) everyone bf was suspicious of so he won't have died in vain. The mafia would have most definitely wanted him so and I'd say there's at least one if not more of you in those 8 votes. Black Rock is off the hook obviously and I'm giving Zomb the benefit of the doubt now so that at least narrows it down to 6 for me.

Will be interested in what you see here.

Canucklehead wrote:Is anyone feeling leery about Dom? He's got that BUTTY/snappy quality to his posts this game that reminds me of Film Directors. He was a bad baddie then, and It pinged me in that game, too, but he assured me (and I gullibly beleived him) that it was b/c of real life busyness and mafia exhaustion.....
But now that I'm seeing it again, I'm feeling cautious about it. I seem to remember Dom being one of the funnier/jokier players of the old crew....so maybe I just don't know how to rea new Dom? I dunno, but is like to hear others' thoughts before I dig too hard into Dom as a suspect.

Hasn't seemed too unusual to me, I do agree he's a bit snappy but I think perhaps nerves were touched on day one with the info debate. Interesting if Golden really is silenced, as someone (Liz?) pointed out. Done to frame Dom? Or because of something else entirely?

I think the TH/LC/MM debate is interesting and worth keeping an eye on.

juliets wrote:Yeah, poor BR. RIPIYWG BR. i had no read on you yet.

There's no IYWG about it, is there? As far as I can see there's only the baddies that have a kill...

Zombarella wrote:

Zombarella wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:How many degrees are in a triangle?

180

Unless it's not Euclidian geometry. In spherical geometry a triangle can have more than 180 degrees - like 90, 90, 45. In taxicab geometry a triangle looks like a step pyramid and have hundreds and hundreds of degrees.

...And in Fairy Land a triangle can have all the degrees its heart desires, as long as it believes in the power of friendship!


Right?

Dom wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:

Golden wrote:

bea wrote:Golden - I know you are getting the drfunk bea you've missed so much -but isn't what I'm saying logical? Maybe? Just maybe? it wasn't the best move for BF to make. Maybe- just maybe - he should have kept his info to himself - instead of painting a target on someone (zombra ) who has a 50/50 chance of being a civ. As well as anyone who would inherit his will post his demise. If BF is a civ - he's painted a target on two other potential civs. On Day 1. How is that logical "civ" game play?

Your perspective absolutely is logical, bea. Which is why I hoped bf would survive, and some unknown civvie would steal the will from him. But I don't think two opposing points of view can't both be logical. I think bfs move was risky, but I also think it was logical.

Anyway, now that he is a proven civ, I guess that's easy for me to say! So, I'll just move on from my defence of bfs move and say... Once again I think some unknown civ should steal the will from svs tonight, so that there is no longer a target associated with the will (other than on zombra...)

It's pretty clear bf played it wrong in hindsight, but at the time I would have done the same, I think.

Does the will really matter any more at this point? Unless BF lied about what it said, we already know everything about it, right?

The will gives that person all of Zomba's items upon her death, no?

I suppose so. But don't baddies get your items when they kill you anyway? I feel like that point came up a few times in BF's posts.

Golden wrote:

bea wrote:Golden - I know you are getting the drfunk bea you've missed so much -but isn't what I'm saying logical? Maybe? Just maybe? it wasn't the best move for BF to make. Maybe- just maybe - he should have kept his info to himself - instead of painting a target on someone (zombra ) who has a 50/50 chance of being a civ. As well as anyone who would inherit his will post his demise. If BF is a civ - he's painted a target on two other potential civs. On Day 1. How is that logical "civ" game play?

Your perspective absolutely is logical, bea. Which is why I hoped bf would survive, and some unknown civvie would steal the will from him. But I don't think two opposing points of view can't both be logical. I think bfs move was risky, but I also think it was logical.

Anyway, now that he is a proven civ, I guess that's easy for me to say! So, I'll just move on from my defence of bfs move and say... Once again I think some unknown civ should steal the will from svs tonight, so that there is no longer a target associated with the will (other than on zombra...)

It's pretty clear bf played it wrong in hindsight, but at the time I would have done the same, I think.

Does the will really matter any more at this point? Unless BF lied about what it said, we already know everything about it, right?

Essentially, if I'm going to have to throw away my vote, I'd rather it not be for someone who is actually putting in a lot of effort.