The Syndicate

I was Dhalsim, quietly waiting to get targeted.

So Diiny was E. Honda, and slapped Sloonei down himself?

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:21 am Yeah. Inactivity kills. With 8 players left, like 3 had no significant posts. Really hard to tell who is bad at that stage.

Doc Wilgy seemed to be soft claiming M Bison, saying he wanted townie Speedchuck dead, even after he flipped. Eloh was also obvious town. My death hurt her the most. It also hurt Mal, who I would have defended for another day (see my reactions to Fred early in Phenon) but I would have turned on him sooner than later.

Mal and Sloonei both should have been lynched awhile ago. Everybody was suspicious of Mall all game. Sloonei was clearly coasting.

We were never going to catch Simon and JJJ/Sprit/Serge. We were never going to clear Blooper/DF.

Never going to catch Simon? He was caught two days ago, and the inactivity was so pronounced that we were unable to complete the lynch.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:45 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Sep 05, 2017 10:36 pm You guys want to lynch Wilgy or Simon first?
Why does it have to be one or the other? rather limiting it seems.

Well, we tried both at once, and we saw how that turned out.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:48 pmLC, if Simon and I were already dead who would you vote?

ALSO... in the post quoted above, do you think the game will go on after Simon and I are lynched? Why or why not?

I'd vote DFaraday or Elohcin I think.

And yes the game will go on..., we have three more baddies to lynch at this point.

Such a mom.

Ok, then Simon can go first, and we shall see about Wilgy.

*vote Simon*

I don't think so, Wilgy just likes to be somebody.

And I thought you were referring to a relative of Chun Li.

You guys want to lynch Wilgy or Simon first?

Damn it Wilgy. Nice move.

My main lynch potentials are Wilgy and Simon, but given the recent revelations, Simon is my current choice.

vote Simon

Well, Simon seemed to reciprocate your goodwill for role-related reasons. That makes him look pretty bad. Or you are bad, and this is a cool scheme I want to copy someday.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Mon Sep 04, 2017 3:54 pm I made my decision between the two. It was easy, once I did the research. Props to anyone who can tell me why.

Last time I believed you despite my misgivings, MP, you were faking an emotional flipout to cover your Mafia-ness. I guess that's hard to get past trustwise.

RIP.

How is it that there were only four votes, and Long Con was one of them? I should be able to help more after tonight.

I know I haven't been here to do jack, it's just that it's summer and I have a food truck event every weekend and I have very little time for Mafia, I signed up for three different games that were lingering in sign up for too long, and now I'm in all three and unable to get time to properly play any of them.

I'm posting from an event right now in between Russia's, I swear to you that I am civilian, don't Lynch me, thanks

Diiny wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2017 2:48 pm alright, lemme iso you quick with that in mind.

also lmao I had to check if that last bit was real, incredible

Ideally, it will mean that MP is actually bad.

Diiny wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2017 11:46 am LC, what happened at EoD for you? I'm glad I convinced you re the sloon case but he was never going to win the vote. There were two obvious frontrunners for the lynch, and you placed your vote for someone else.

Did you not have a preference between booper and elo?

It's weak. I mean sloonei was my #1 suspect but pragmatism always comes first.

Like I said then, Sloonei was my favourite from the handful that I considered the forerunner possibilities, and I voted him before looking at the state of the lynch poll. While I like the idea that one of Eloh or Nijuu is bad, your thoughts on Sloonei made him a better option in my mind.

I actually meant to be checking in closer to the lynch to possibly revote for one of the vote leaders, but I didn't make it back.

Diiny wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2017 2:08 pm MP is scum. I can smell it like i smelled it on sloon. I'n coming for you.

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 8:01 pmYou are bad in this game, MP. I can smell it on you.

Not sure what to say about that.

Diiny convinced me to vote Sloon with his original Sloon ideas. That's pretty solid. I am glad to have a lens through which we can look at things - Sloonei's lynch was obviously an unexpected one.

Hey Wilgy, I lynched a baddie, all by myself!

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Aug 31, 2017 9:44 pm E. Honda you legend!

One might be tempted to think I'm E. Honda, but I am not. Whoever is E is a secret hero though!

Ohhh nice! How did that happen? NICE!!

I see a sea of players with 1 vote, and Eloh ahead with 3. I'll be around till the lynch, in and out. I'll try to start pulling my weight a little more during this night, and hit Day 4 with some new thoughts on someone.

Just over an hour left to vote. Right now I find myself mostly agreeing with the prevailing lynch train possibilities: Elohcin, mal, Sloonei. I like Diiny's thoughts on Sloonei, actually. I'll vote there now... don't currently know where the vote stands, exactly.

Elohcin wrote: ↑Wed Aug 30, 2017 9:27 pm I already stated that I believe at least one pwrson from the other site (new-to-the syndicate) is probably mafia. Seeing as a new-to-us member has now been killed so early, it only reinforces this theory. Syndicaters havw nwvee been very comfortable with killing of new people this quickly.

I know diiny is new. Is malak also from the other mafia site and playing here for the first time?

This meta line of thinking rings true to me.

If I don't post, then assume also that I am silenced.

Also, malakim's misinterpretation of context, intentional baddie move or innocent Civ mistake?

Really sorry I missed the vote. I'm in three Mafia games right now, and I failed to schedule my vote correctly.

Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:01 am
Dom wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:58 pmI don't buy that MP totally thinks you're civ for a second.
Why not? I'm in the elite green of his list, and he's stated more than once that he doesn't think I'm bad, if I recall correctly.

malakim2099 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:56 pmThis is the post that caught my eye, really. Been thinking about this. I highlighted LC's response because I really don't like that defense of "well, I'm cleared by MP!" ...

[snip]

Long Con (the defense highlighted above, it just seems like "MP gave me a clean bill of health!" without really proving a defense)

Just want to say that your analysis is unwarranted. I don't know if it was intentional or not, but you have ignored the context and made up your own interpretation that doesn't accurately understand what happened.

You are reacting like I was defending myself by invoking MP's trust of me, when it was a response to Dom's suggestion that... that MP doesn't think I'm Civ, I think? (To be honest, I didn't quite get what Dom meant by it, maybe that MP and I are teammates?) Anyway, you see what I mean? I agree that it would not be a worthwhile or convincing defense for me to use, you are right about that. But I wasn't using it as a defense.

I was offering evidence that MP does indeed think I'm Civ.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Tue Aug 29, 2017 11:18 pmLC's response to your pressure and the way he's doubting everything just feels town to me. Specifically LC brand flavor of town. Town that doesn't give a single crap who he targets for suspicion and doesn't care about looking scummy and won't let anyone get too comfortable.

I should try to bottle it and drink a bit when I'm bad.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Tue Aug 29, 2017 11:26 pm Eloh's responses... some look really good, some don't. I don't see how the nap thing points to a scumread. Why would scum say that rather than town? Asking you, mostly, Eloh.

I am not convinced that Elohcin's accusation of nijuu was genuine.

Not yet, but I'll be sure to let you know when I do.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Tue Aug 29, 2017 10:19 am JoH was killed by the mafia. Thus:

MP is most likely town. If he were on a scumteam that was planning to kill Jack, he wouldn't have wasted a scumread on the guy. Rather, MP would have townread Jack and agreed with any wrong assumptions jack made until he died. I'm not even assuming optimal play here. MP wouldn't waste the time looking for a scumread on a guy he's going to kill.

Just to put forth an alternate opinion, since you seem very sure of this one: when I'm on a bad team, especially night 1, deciding on who to kill is usually something that happens after the lynch is done. If MP07 is bad, then I doubt that he crafted his posts around who was going to be killed night 1. I don't agree with your clearing of him, based on that.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Aug 29, 2017 12:44 am
Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Aug 28, 2017 5:28 pm
Sorry, my friend, but I meant you. You like direct references, I've noticed, so I'll pull some instances up.

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:07 pm That said, I hesitate to scumread LC. I see your point, dunya, but I'm just not sure it means we're seeing scum!LC here.
Sometimes, when I'm trying to discern someone's motivations, I like to play a little game. I imagine the worst thing they could do, and then see if their actions support that conclusion. In this post, baddie MP applies nice mild buddying, while supporting the point that dunya made and was suspicious of. Further discussion of the topic also matches the profile of a baddie MP who, on one hand he kept the idea of my lynch in people's minds by discussing it a lot, and on the other hand he thought I was town and would say "RIP LC. I thought you were town."
Littlefinger's game is pure tunneling, and if you apply it to mafia you'll be the only townie in a sea of scum. If this is how you're looking at MP, it's no wonder you have a scum read on him.

I've only read up to this post so far, but i'm going to share one thought before I go any further: MP is town on volume alone. Nobody puts up this much fake content so quickly and effortlessly.

I would say it is MP's expertise.

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 28, 2017 10:59 pm RIP JOH. Clearly I was wrong about you, thanks for a good effort.

VOTES DOM

BBL.

I feel like I was pretty sudden in my accusation of you... but I think you are trumping me, with intent ferocity, in your Dom accusation and vote.

Aw, Ken! Too bad. I voted you until a rhyme butterfly distracted me.

[mention]Spacedaisy[/mention] works for me now

[mention]DrWilgy[/mention] hope you guys dry out soon!

[mention]Long Con[/mention]

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 28, 2017 5:59 pm
Elohcin wrote: ↑Mon Aug 28, 2017 5:50 pm JoH are you civ THIS game?
I'm not sure I'm allowed to answer this.

I can't recall ever seeing a game where you weren't allowed to say "I'm Civ/town" or "I'm not a baddie/Mafia/wolf".

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 28, 2017 5:39 pmI'm afraid I'm still not following you exactly, though I might be getting it now. Are you saying you find it suspicious that I'm equivocating my thoughts on you, or being wishy-washy, or that you specifically find the positive statements (aka buddying) suspicious? Can you explain why a bit more?

I can explain why in isolation, though I think it was made clear already.

Keeping me (a Civ) as a lynch candidate while doubting my badness is a fine place for a baddie to be for the first lynch.

I don't even think there was enough content to judge me Civ, but you repeatedly expressed doubt I was bad. A baddie would know that for certain, of course.

I find buddying suspicious because I am an experienced Mafia player, and those experiences have taught me this.

I'll be in and out all evening. Don't always expect instant response. Got lots to do.

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 28, 2017 5:06 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:49 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:41 pmHence part of my suspicion of MP and his accusations of LC falling flat.
As MP may or may not tell you, he actually defended me.

To avoid misinterpretation or whatever: I believe this is mild buddying.
Just to be clear: You believe what is mild buddying, what JOH is doing or what I am doing or something else?

Sorry, my friend, but I meant you. You like direct references, I've noticed, so I'll pull some instances up.

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:07 pm That said, I hesitate to scumread LC. I see your point, dunya, but I'm just not sure it means we're seeing scum!LC here.

Sometimes, when I'm trying to discern someone's motivations, I like to play a little game. I imagine the worst thing they could do, and then see if their actions support that conclusion. In this post, baddie MP applies nice mild buddying, while supporting the point that dunya made and was suspicious of. Further discussion of the topic also matches the profile of a baddie MP who, on one hand he kept the idea of my lynch in people's minds by discussing it a lot, and on the other hand he thought I was town and would say "RIP LC. I thought you were town."

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:18 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:15 pm To reiterate/clarify a point I made earlier: I don't think Jack was being serious about his desire to vote for me. His temptation to vote for me boiled down to a "That's racist, man!" joke. I read nothing into it. That it was then picked up, apparently, by speedchuck and Long Con is something worth pursuing in the absence of anything more substantial.

Linki x100: Stop posting so I can post!
I think I agree, but I simultaneously also hesitate to scum-read speedchuck or LC for doing something so brazen. Again this is anecdotal, but in my mind more often than not, most people who play scum roles try everything possible to get the spotlight off of them on Day 1, not put it on them. And what speedchuck and LC did was risky if they're scum.

Again: Agree, but also they're not maybe not scum. But it was brazen and risky.

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:23 pm MP POE Rainbow List #1 - Day 1
dunya
Jackofhearts2005
Simon
Sloonei

Bass_the_Clever
DFaraday
Diiny
Dom
DrWilgy
Elohcin
Long Con
JaggedJimmyJay
malakim2099
nijuukyugou
speedchuck

I won't vote for any of the four green players today.

I could theoretically vote for any of the grey, but I'm feeling hesitant about voting LC or speedchuck. I can't call them town reads but I'm not jumping to eliminate them either.

Again, that dual opinion. A lynch candidate, and a "but I'm hesitant". Do you see the theme here, MP? Do you think I would find more if I keep looking?

You seem to be a good judge of Eloh, historically.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:55 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:12 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:44 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:35 pm I thought Eloh was wushu washy in Nightvake in the exact same way she is here.
She went back and forth in night vale, but not usually in the same post. A sampling of her D1/N1 posts that game:

"I actually like this response to Epi. I think if someone grasps onto this "reason" for why Tony may be mafia, they should be looked at more closely as maybe being mafia themselves."

"So in other words, you're going to vote for someone based on your weaknesses? I think you may have my vote."

"If I could cqhnge my vote it would be to you. You're acting very scummy."

"I think I'm seeing a town golden."

"Who was it that said, "please don't vote jack" out of nowhere yesterday at end of day 1? I wanted to inquire about that."
Me, that was me. I did that. "Why did you say it?"

In night vale, Eloh flopped back and forth, sure. But she made statements. She called out things, questioned people, made calls on reads. Whereas in this game Eloh has been wishy-washy. I know it's backwards, but meta-wise: Is Eloh's current act just town unsureness?
Or is Eloh's more confident act something she does when scumhunting, since night vale had two scumteams? That would make her more scummy this game.

linki: Because of her non-committal statements, Sloon. I'm trying to figure out if Eloh's meta points one way or another right now.
How's about

http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 42#p365942

and

http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 30#p366030

Pretending not to understand a case and jump the gun voting for someone she doesn't actually suspect? That's what bad Eloh did in Nightvale and that looks like what she's doing here, too.
Hmm

It's a bit different with unchangeable votes, but otherwise, I do agree. There are similarities as well. Do you think the similarities outweigh the difference in tone that I demonstrated?

@anybody: If you can follow this discussion, please, give your thoughts on it

I can see some similarities, but I'm not convinced that those similarities aren't because they're both Elohcin. Perhaps a Civ role she had for comparison? I mean, Night Vale she was bad, I assume. She was bad with me, I think.

@Spacedaisy I got no dropdown

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 8:57 pmI don't think LC is bad at this time. I'll tell you if I change my mind on that.

Ah... looks bad to me!

I had Eloh interactions?

That's a lot to take in. I like ST:TNG, games, AND I have played Mysterium. Plus D&D of course, a la Mr Gygax.

Did Gary Gygax realy say that?

speedchuck wrote: ↑Mon Aug 28, 2017 8:26 amTinfoil MP/LC scumteam, with all the buddying and false accusations between them. Just doesn't sit well with me.

Ugh.

Dom wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:58 pmI don't buy that MP totally thinks you're civ for a second.

Why not? I'm in the elite green of his list, and he's stated more than once that he doesn't think I'm bad, if I recall correctly.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:41 pmHence part of my suspicion of MP and his accusations of LC falling flat.

As MP may or may not tell you, he actually defended me.

To avoid misinterpretation or whatever: I believe this is mild buddying.

dunya know the difference?

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:16 pm
MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 7:42 pm
Diiny wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 7:31 pm
MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 7:15 pm I'm cautious because this is me. If I were to display any amount of confidence on Day 1 I'd be full on in MP hurricane mode based on very little and that typically doesn't end as well for town as I'd like it to, to put it lightly. I find that town benefits much better from me being cautious than careless.
I remember you being a tad more brazen than this in our games on OT. I like that you've stuck your neck out for some people, but tbh conversely that ties in with my fear of you treading very lightly.

If you had to choose right now, who's scum? Is your vote staying on squid? show me some fire without any actual consequences.
Probably. I'm sure I'll get brazen at some point here too like I almost always do, but my record at actually catching scum when I put my foot full on the brakes is almost certainly laughably bad. Especially early on in games the past couple of years, I try to be as measured as possible, but I'll still poke something if I feel there's something worth poking. As the game progresses I'll probably be more likely to pursue something doggedly. It depends inevitably on what happens though. If I really thought there was something super suspicious in the thread right now I'd be all over it, I think anyway. As it stands, unfortunately I think this game is a more typical Day 1 -- there's a bunch of weaksauce cases to be made that may or may not be totally legit, and I'm not in love with any of them -- specifically, the thoughts people have said re: any of the players with votes right now (Sloonei, JOH, LC, and speedchuck). With that said, however, I'm most potentially swayed by dunya's observation of LC. Just not ready to pull the trigger on it. Not convinced in the slightest by any of the others.

If I had to choose right now... ugh. I'm terrible at scum reads early in the game and these days much prefer to play POE for the first phase or two because I think it plays to my strengths. That said, I suppose I'd pick two or three of Bass, DFaraday, Dom, DrWilgy, Elohcin, and malakim to be bad (and which I choose would be basically luck at this point because none of them have literally anything substantial to judge), and then one of the players with votes right now that have some heat (JOH, Sloonei, LC, speedchuck -- GTH I'd pick LC), and then one of the more talkative bunch so far (you, Jay, dunya, Sloonei again, Blooper -- GTH I'd pick Jay). So LC, Jay, and two lurkers basically. I think.

As for what I'd do with my vote, it's very likely moving away from Blooper. I don't feel anything bad about her right now; it was basically RVS. I'd most likely vote for Bass. Not sure yet. It'd be nice if more folks popped in here soon so I can sort through how everyone else is feeling.
I hate this post. Whole lotta nothing. Like trying to guess the plot of a show. But there is no script, no writer playing up drama, just players playing and thus, no strength behind these ideas.

I dislike his interactions with LC a lot (in that LC comes out on top and MP comes across dishonest) and of course, his push on Bass, a townie.

At this point, MP is my top suspect.

I approve of this post.

Simon wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 9:41 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 8:32 pm
A distinct possibility. Only LC voting for EHonda really stood out as an odd choice.
I voted for Long Con. E. Honda is fat. I don't like him. Long Con likes fat fighters?

I emulated the rhyming scheme of the post before mine, actually. That was enough reason for me.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 8:58 pm @LC

Why is MP a suspect?

I'm reading this thread like I eat a burger, from both ends to meet/meat in the middle.

His treatment of the Dhalsim-alien situation is false. He's been talking about it, deciding out loud whether or not he thinks it's suspicious, defending me mildly about it, when he should have been saying "This isn't worth discussing because neither player was leveling anything close to a serious suspicion. It was talk about a character, that was all."

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