The Syndicate

I doubted Epignosis every step of the way.

I'm lost.

Well, that was awful.

Well done Baddies, you had us played. Considering how Day 1 went down, this was a pretty amazing victory for you guys.

Only if I get another Hillary point.

Thanks for the game G-Man!

Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:What's your ideal endgame scenario?
I don't know. All I'm saying is that if I lose because Wilgy or MM honestly think I killed Eloh Night 1, that will be a new level of boneheadedness on their part.
You're pushing that point so hard, it's starting to have the opposite effect on me. I'm going to place a vote on you for now.

Vote Epignosis
This post came at 4:01 PM EST.

The lynch ended at 4:32pm EST...the next day.

I think Long Con believed the lynch was ending in half an hour and he sailed in with a third vote on me. When he realized his error, he made up some convoluted nonsense about fishing for reactions.

Damn. I can't believe I didn't realize that until now.

I'd be happy to lynch him too!

Oh wait...

I'm no JaggedJimmyJay, but I don't appreciate your manner of response to my cases.

Epignosis wrote:
Marmot wrote:Well, you have looked elsewhere, but you've maintained since I started suspecting you that I'm bad because of it.

I've seen civilian Epignosis be more fair and less condescending about such things, something you have not done here.
What things have I been condescending or unfair about?

You've called me a foolish and boneheaded (Wilgy too).

One of your reasons for voting for me is so you're not "stuck" in an endgame scenario with me.

Yes I'm a little irked by those things. I don't think they're necessary or accurate. You're asking me to understand a mindset that I just can't empathize with. I'm telling you I can't, so I've ignored that in my read of you.

Well, you have looked elsewhere, but you've maintained since I started suspecting you that I'm bad because of it.

I've seen civilian Epignosis be more fair and less condescending about such things, something you have not done here.

I did, I left you alone. Something happened that changed my mind, but I considered the idea that I was wrong and looked elsewhere.

You did not.

Long Con wrote:Sorry Marmot, I broke it.

Good! I can't vote myself, so I'm glad you did.

Peace out civilians.

Long Con wrote:
Marmot wrote:His accusations against me are weak, and often off-the-cuff and unfounded. Why? He doesn't need to make a strong case against me; I'm an easy lynch.

Get off your damn "Epignosis is a civilian, because he's always civilian" mentality and get your shit together civilians.
That's not what I'm doing. I just think he made some really good points about why he's a Civ. I think he'd rather have a golden gem in his pocket about never killing Eloh, than give it up for a Heist.

Note that it was SVS who first accused him, not something he brought to the table himself.

His accusations against me are weak, and often off-the-cuff and unfounded. Why? He doesn't need to make a strong case against me; I'm an easy lynch.

Get off your damn "Epignosis is a civilian, because he's always civilian" mentality and get your shit together civilians.

I don't really have anything else to say, except lynch Epignosis please.

Epignosis wrote:
thellama73 wrote:I have heard "DFaraday is bad" for a long time now, but am confused about why. Can someone refresh me on the case?
I have no idea why. Something something blendy something something tone reads bad.

MM

Why?

But you know, why don't you just vote the player you actually think is scum instead of plotting vote maneuverability?

thellama73 wrote:
Long Con wrote:
thellama73 wrote:
Long Con wrote:Marmot cannot vote DFaraday, because that would force DFaraday to switch to Marmot, resulting in Marmot's lynch. Marmot is forced to vote notsawyer.
True, but if Metalmarsh votes DFaraday and DFaraday votes Metalmarsh, that still leaves me with a spare vote. Oh the power.
What would you do with your power?
That all depends, but I certainly don't want a tie. No lynch only benefits the mafia at this point.

Actually, a tie could put us at an odd number of players, so not the worst thing in the world.

I see people are actually considering lynching me. Le sigh...

Long Con wrote:
Marmot wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Marmot wrote:That's two posts that suggests that Long Con is a power role. Why is he still alive? Why haven't the mafia killed him?
Two different power roles. And that's not counting the lie detector stuff. As Mafia, I've been trying to draw out that last, crucial Civ power role all game, and they're just so darn stubborn that they won't counter my so-called suggestions... and so timid that they won't try to make a case against me. Even though they know I'm the last baddie.

Oh, sorry, is that what you are doing, Marmot? If so, carry on.
How many mafia are there? Was that an intentionally placed slip?
No, just an assumption based on the numbers.

Check out last year's RED vs. BLUE.

Epignosis puts the brewsky in brusque.

Long Con wrote:
Marmot wrote:That's two posts that suggests that Long Con is a power role. Why is he still alive? Why haven't the mafia killed him?
Two different power roles. And that's not counting the lie detector stuff. As Mafia, I've been trying to draw out that last, crucial Civ power role all game, and they're just so darn stubborn that they won't counter my so-called suggestions... and so timid that they won't try to make a case against me. Even though they know I'm the last baddie.

Oh, sorry, is that what you are doing, Marmot? If so, carry on.

How many mafia are there? Was that an intentionally placed slip?

Long Con wrote:
Marmot wrote:That's two posts that suggests that Long Con is a power role. Why is he still alive? Why haven't the mafia killed him?
Two different power roles. And that's not counting the lie detector stuff. As Mafia, I've been trying to draw out that last, crucial Civ power role all game, and they're just so darn stubborn that they won't counter my so-called suggestions... and so timid that they won't try to make a case against me. Even though they know I'm the last baddie.

Oh, sorry, is that what you are doing, Marmot? If so, carry on.

If you are a protector, and you had protected llama on Night 3, then yes, you probably would have cleared him going forward.

But there's also the fact that Floyd was nightkilled last night.

Would Long Con nightkill a player he said something incredibly rude to? That's double the rude.

Epignosis wrote:LC- I'm still waiting to hear your big thing on MM.

MM- I'm still waiting to hear your big thing on LC.

You don't have to wait for me to do work son.

Did you think I didn't have one?

Going back to what I had to say about Long Con earlier (I was phone-posting, the reason I couldn't state them then).

Long Con wrote:
Marmot wrote:Thanks for the protection whoever protected me.
I didn't protect you, I protected Epignosis!

There's this post, where Long Con jokingly suggested that he protected Epignosis.

Long Con wrote:1. Where you stand on notsawyer and why.
I'm kind of okay with notsawyer. Epignosis' suspicion of him has some influence on me, but overall I think this interaction is civ/civ. I think his accusations seem genuine enough, even if I don't agree with them.

2. Where you stand on Marmot and why.
Leaning scum on Marmot. His latest claim, that he was nightkilled but protected, feels like a) an attempt to look civ, and b) an attempt to draw out information from the baddies. That's why I countered him a little with my own jokey misinformation.

3. Where you stand on Floyd and why.
I stand on Floyd in the gutter, because that's where I assume he is lying, dead drunk or just plain dead. Does he get some sort of points for just signing up for Mafia games? I don't get this guy.

4. Where you stand on DFaraday and why.
I feel pretty good about DFaraday, but I don't know why right now. ISO 2

5. Where you stand on Quin and why.
Now both you and DF have said you forgot Quin was playing. I'm getting some alarm bells from Quin's direction. ISO 1.

6. Where you stand on thellama73 and why.
I'm cool with Llama now for reasons I won't really get into.

7. Where you stand on Long Con and why.
I don't think Long Con is trying to be out of the limelight. I think I've done some stand-out stuff. My Llama suspicions, my lie detector stuff... that's not blendy.

Then there's this post, where Long Con is cool with llama.

That's two posts that suggests that Long Con is a power role. Why is he still alive? Why haven't the mafia killed him?

Linki: Cool your jets dude.

notsawyer540 wrote:Marmot - One of the original people to suggest not lynching Jack, who then piggybacked on my attack on Epi. As far as the whole "Epi is still alive so Marmot is bad" thing goes, I can see some validity in that argument in that Marmot tried to get Epi lynched when I was going after him but then backed off when it was clear it wouldn't work. Marmot comes off as opportunistic imo

1) When did I suggest not lynching jack?

2) I did not piggyback on your Epignosis attack, I have my own reasons. And even if I did, you're going to have a difficult-ass time lynching people if you're going to suspect the people who have the same targets.

3) I backed off because I don't want to spend all my time focusing on one player. But, I keep coming back to him based on things that he says.

I find your reasons for voting me invalid. Try again.

I'd support a Long Con lynch for reasons I'll explain later.

thellama73 wrote:
Marmot wrote:What will a curfew entail?
Typical executive order. Sloppily drafted. Overly vague.

It's not dated properly either (unless it was written yesterday).

What will a curfew entail?

Epignosis wrote:
DFaraday wrote:I would be fine with either Notsawyer or MM, but it seems like it's going to be between Epi and MM, and I see the case on MM, whereas I'm reading Epi as civ.
It's far too early to say who it's going to be between.

I hope I am not stuck in an endgame scenario with MM and Wilgy. Civilians will lose.

Spoiler: show

thellama73 wrote:<snip>

I have a hard time believing that Epi, even at his ballsiest, would stick his neck out so far to defend an outed teammate. Then again, if anyone would, he would. Either way, it's bizarre behavior.

<snip>

My qualm with this behavior: Epignosis wanted to keep jack alive for the purpose of observing his behavior and hunting for baddies based on that. But the problem is, Epignosis did none of that, and even promoted the opposite when Quin promoted the idea of lynching him.

thellama73 wrote:I'll say one thing for Epi. He keeps his word.

Epignosis wrote:
Quin wrote:
S~V~S wrote:Quin missed my original point and misinterpreted my question. Hence we are talking in circles.

Placeholder vote on Quin. I don't think my original point was that obscure.
You had the chance to reiterate your point. Why didn't you take it, and instead choose to believe that I'm (assumedly purposefully) misinterpreting your question?
I'm not putting up with Quin getting into bullshit arguments with S~V~S. I will lynch both of you if this happens.

thellama73 wrote:The last thing about Metalmarsh; his suspicion of Epi.

I don't quite know what to make of this. The very first suspicion MM posted was of Epi for not playing hard enough. Then he flopped back and forth between civ and bad Epi for another couple of days before solidifying on Day 3. I asked him to explain his suspicion and he said it was "infoil" and refused to elaborate. After Quin's death, he's been more insistent still. As noted above, he also said " I woulda killed Epi night 1" which indicates a love of WIFOM as well as a desire to get Epi out of the game.

So basically, MM has wanted Epi gone with increasing intensity since Day 1.

Why?

Could be a genuine suspicion. And MM said all his suspicions are genuine, but the flopping back and forth seems odd in that case, as well as his brief attempt to partner with Epi to lynch me yesterday.

Could be a fear of being caught by Epi. As someone who has been caught by Epi many times, I can relate to that. But in that case why not just kill him at night? I have to mull.

Going to read Skeletor now.

I decided to back off of my Epignosis suspicion yesterday, because if I'm wrong, I know he's a good player to keep around as a civilian.

What I don't like is his accusation today. It's a valid point I'll admit, but it's undefendable.

Long Con wrote:
Marmot wrote:you'really
Fancy!

Cursed phone autocorrect.

Epignosis wrote:
Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:If notsawyer is bad, I bet MM is bad too.

I imagine them in BTSC, MM's teammates frustrated that he has pledged to not Night kill me (thanks MM!), but having to do something about me. So they go balls to the wall to get me lynched, unaware that they cleared me Night 1.

And even if notsawyer isn't bad, I bet MM is bad anyway.
You've made it past Day 1, so you've concluded that I'm mafia?

Is your code never to kill me Night 1 or never to kill me?

The former of the two.

That said, I don't kill you very often regardless, so it's trended to both.

thellama73 wrote:I need to reread MM today. Haven't given him a good hard look in a while, so it's on my to do list.

Read Skeletor while you'really at it.

Epignosis wrote:MM refuses to kill me.

I'm still alive.

MM tried to get me lynched.

What think you of MM?

I think folks ought to entertain the notion that you're mafia.

The fact that you're pushing this simple-minded approach encourages that idea.

What do folks think of that?

Epignosis wrote:If notsawyer is bad, I bet MM is bad too.

I imagine them in BTSC, MM's teammates frustrated that he has pledged to not Night kill me (thanks MM!), but having to do something about me. So they go balls to the wall to get me lynched, unaware that they cleared me Night 1.

And even if notsawyer isn't bad, I bet MM is bad anyway.

You've made it past Day 1, so you've concluded that I'm mafia?

MacDougall wrote:I got Llama as a civ read fwiw

Spoiler: show

Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:What is your actual opinion on llama? I think he stinks.
I voted for him the first two days, and I haven't really changed my opinion. What were his opinions on Quin during his lynch?
I'd have to look.

You do understand that I now suspect you as well. Yes, I'm sure you do.
It's fine. I probably have an inflated sense of my own lynch-survivability, which makes things easier for me.

You've got your mafia games all mixed up.

Long Con wrote:
Marmot wrote:
Long Con wrote:At the very least, Metalmarsh and Epi's Llama-based reactions should be analyzable, from the perspective that they thought Llama was Civ-cleared? I don't know, that's one perspective.
When did I say llama was civ-cleared?
You didn't say it. It was generally assumed based on my list and comments.

@Epi: I am actually preparing a nice ISO on MM that should be quite convincing that he is bad.

I'd love to see it.

Epignosis wrote:I did suspect him. The LC comment was always in the back of my mind. What do you make of his appraisal?

I think it was a lie.

Long Con wrote:At the very least, Metalmarsh and Epi's Llama-based reactions should be analyzable, from the perspective that they thought Llama was Civ-cleared? I don't know, that's one perspective.

When did I say llama was civ-cleared?

Epignosis wrote:
Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:And MM evidently suspects both LC and thellama73.
What's your point?
You suspect two people I now have a reason to believe are good, and you tried to get me to vote for thellama73 but you only offered "Fair enough" when I said I suspected him but wouldn't vote for him- you didn't make any kind of effort to make that lynch happen (or the lynch of LC for that matter). That makes me suspect you more.

1) I wasn't around after that point, so I was incapable of doing anything.

2) I'm not going to launch a campaign against every person I suspect, that's too much work, and likely wouldn't be fruitful anyway.

3) You suspect him but aren't pushing for his lynch either. Why do you suspect me for doing the same thing?

Epignosis wrote:And MM evidently suspects both LC and thellama73.

What's your point?

Who did I vote for? I don't remember.

Um, I meant to come back before the deadline, but I was distraced by things.

Fair enough.

thellama73 wrote:
notsawyer540 wrote:We would need llama, dfaraday, or floyd to change their vote.
If Epi and I both change our votes, you would still need at least one more.

I'm inferring from this post that llama's considering changing his vote in an attempt to save notsawyer.

Would you vote for him today?

Epignosis, what do you make of llama?

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