The Syndicate

I think if Jay doesn't come up with a valid "tell" that made him so sure as to call me out like he did then it's definitely a bad look for him.

As things are, based on past interactions with Jay he's likely to come out and say something like "there is no tell, I was just lying to build thread discussion" or "I'm not telling you what your tell is in case I need to use it again later"

I don't think either of those are acceptable answers for this.

Jay's usual civvie MO is to scatter bricks around on day 0 and 1 in order to start building discussion and put out reads. What Jay's done here is try to throw a single large brick at me, which causes no variation in discussion at all. The only discussion happening right now is surrounding me.

The only way that tactic comes from a responsible civvie mindset is if Jay really and truly believes in whatever he thinks my tell is

that would be the purpose behind checking into his shit

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 6:54 pm

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 6:34 pm Hey @JaggedJimmyJay I'm telling you right now, if you get me wrongly lynched and don't reveal what you thought the tell was then I'm not going to easily forgive you for it.

If you're really just making this up then it's not a cool tactic. If you legitimately think I have a tell then sure fine whatever, everyone's wrong sometimes, but if not then you have to take responsibility for it. Promise me.

Why leave out the third option?

the option where I survive has no bearing on my request. What I'm saying that if I do end up getting lynched for Jay's 'tell' then Jay has to be held accountable. He can't just say something like "oh well it didn't work this time but I'm going to keep what it was a secret in case it's a tell in the future. " and shrug it off.

If his tactic here causes me to die then I want his reasoning to be thoroughly checked into.

I take everything that involves me seriously.

Jay is a thread-leader. Stuff he says often ends up having impact. I'm not going to ignore it when he makes some vague claim about me, especially not if people are actually listening.

Hey [mention]JaggedJimmyJay[/mention] I'm telling you right now, if you get me wrongly lynched and don't reveal what you thought the tell was then I'm not going to easily forgive you for it.

If you're really just making this up then it's not a cool tactic. If you legitimately think I have a tell then sure fine whatever, everyone's wrong sometimes, but if not then you have to take responsibility for it. Promise me.

FZ. wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 6:17 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:34 pm

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:07 pm I really don't think we're going to be starved for information in this game anyways, out of the gate we have a btsc cop, a role cop, a role blocker, and a doctor who can gain btsc with 1 of 3 different civ roles, one of which is the previously mentioned role cop, we also have a soapbox user and a mayor.

the number of roles we have that can stimulate the information economy seems pretty good.

Did I hear someone say, "information?"

Sorry, can you explain what you meant by that? Coming back from a long break, I'm going to be a little slow...

Epignosis and I had a huge tussle in mountain mafia when I said that one low poster lynch would give us more information than another. He took issue with the fact that I used information by the dictionary definition of the word of "things you know" rather than the literal mafia meaning of "things the host has literally told you in big bolded letters".

We had a huge debate about it and started talking about philosophy and other bullshit and it was overall pretty bad, then we eventually made up and fell in love. I think he's making a joke by referring to that.

we've never played before, I don't think.

I like analyzing game mechanics. there's some good role synergies we can use to our advantage in this game to gain the upper hand

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 3:55 pm

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:01 pm...second of all you've never even seen me play as mafia before, the only player in recent history who has is dunya and even then it was just one game under unique circumstances, not enough to build correlation from

This section is sketchy, Kyle, it reads like it's written by someone with a mafia alignment. "you've never even seen me play as mafia before" implies you're mafia now, and the statement that there's "not enough to build correlation from" implies that there could be enough at some point, but if you're Civ, then the idea would be that "correlation is impossible because I'm not bad."

that's what the "first of all" part of the post that you cut out said.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:01 pm that's actually 100% false? first of all, I am a kind and hard-working citizen of Anetevka, so that part's wrong

it seemed important to me to not only tell Jay that his argument was wrong but also to explain how and why the basis of his argument was also flawed.

Aardvarks Bark wrote:Alright let's goooooo.

Everyone please do me a solid favor and describe yourselves in terms of playstyle in whatever level of detail you feel is necessary. It's important.

It's nice to meet you all.

was it "let's go"? I've been trying to make it a thing lately. as like a fun tradition of sorts I guess.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2017 4:04 pm mmmmmlets go

I opened with "let's go" in vocaroo as well, and a few other games I think.

Is that it? My next few posts in that thread were to make excuses for being late to the thread and to call people out for being shitty and rude to each other, and to ask people about their usual meta. I haven't done any of those things so it has to be the "let's go" right? :-?

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 3:29 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:12 pm

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:11 pm okay so you think a 48 hour long game with teens who kept being terrible dicks to each other is going to be indicative of how I play in a real game as mafia?

one game isn't enough for real tell correlation, famous poker player sneezes the first time they roll a full house you don't just assume that they have a full house the second time they sneeze

So you recognize the parallel then?

boom rekt

I really don't recognise the parallel. I don't even know for sure if there is one without looking. In this game I've comfortably talked about musicals with people I already know, and in that game (I think?) I spent the first several of my posts trying to get to know the players on that site. I'm like 60% sure Jay is just making things up to prod for reactions but if not then he's wrong and his basis is flawed. If there really is a parallel Jay sees then it's 100% just a coincidence and not caused by alignment-bias.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:34 pm

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:07 pm I really don't think we're going to be starved for information in this game anyways, out of the gate we have a btsc cop, a role cop, a role blocker, and a doctor who can gain btsc with 1 of 3 different civ roles, one of which is the previously mentioned role cop, we also have a soapbox user and a mayor.

the number of roles we have that can stimulate the information economy seems pretty good.

Did I hear someone say, "information?"

This is the *literal* mafia context definition of information this time, Professor Gnosis. :-p

I really don't think we're going to be starved for information in this game anyways, out of the gate we have a btsc cop, a role cop, a role blocker, and a doctor who can gain btsc with 1 of 3 different civ roles, one of which is the previously mentioned role cop, we also have a soapbox user and a mayor.

the number of roles we have that can stimulate the information economy seems pretty good.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:24 pm If I may make an observation, regarding the setup:

Tevye can get BTSC with his daughters. In doing so, he can confirm them town to himself. So that's neat.

However, if he doesn't search for them, the town gains a cop in the match-maker. Match-maker can search for BTSC, which would (if Tevye doesn't submit actions) only be held by the mafia.

We trade off a BTSC-finder and a town searcher/btsc/lover thing for a cop. Does anyone think this is a good idea?

I... don't agree. Civvie btsc can be an incredibly powerful tool when both players are active, and to enact your plan would mean purposefully not using a doctor, which comes with it's own problems. the matchmakers results should already be helpful so long as that player takes their results with a grain of salt and considers contextual information. it's not worth losing two powerful resources to increase the power of one.

i actually kinda assumed you were lying for standard day zero jay-prod purposes?

i don't recognize any parallel

okay so you think a 48 hour long game with teens who kept being terrible dicks to each other is going to be indicative of how I play in a real game as mafia?

one game isn't enough for real tell correlation, famous poker player sneezes the first time they roll a full house you don't just assume that they have a full house the second time they sneeze

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:34 pm

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:18 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 10:31 am Kyle is with the Russian Police. Discuss.

strongly disagree

I'm afraid that is irrelevant. I know your tell and you have revealed yourself. I am sorry to wreck your game so quickly, but it's just how this works.

that's actually 100% false? first of all, I am a kind and hard-working citizen of Anetevka, so that part's wrong

second of all you've never even seen me play as mafia before, the only player in recent history who has is dunya and even then it was just one game under unique circumstances, not enough to build correlation from

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 10:31 am Kyle is with the Russian Police. Discuss.

strongly disagree

DFaraday wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 4:21 am The metaphor is explained in the narration:

"But in our little village of Anatevka, you might say every one of us is a fiddler on the roof, trying to scratch out a pleasant, simple tune without breaking his neck."

hell yeah. my sister was a drama kid. don't ever question my fiddler knowledge, I've seen this play 6 times B)

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:46 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:53 am

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:45 am When the fiddler gets to the roof, does the game end? Who is the fiddler?

the fiddler is a metaphor for survival in uncertain times times

the play is not even about violinists, or roof construction. that was a disappointment for me in highschool since those were two major interests for me

Those uncertain times times are harder than good times times. How does that metaphor work - is it because being a fiddler isn't stable employment?

don't blame me, blame the website I copied and paraphrased it from

I always figured it was cus like.... you see a fiddler on the roof? he's having the time of his life, maybe he's playing wonderwall or something, maybe everyone's watching and clapping? but like any minute it could start raining or maybe a bird poops on the fiddler and suddenly the fiddler just slips off the roof and just fucking dies I guess?

like being on a roof is already dangerous but adding on fiddle playing which requires a good amount of arm wiggling adds a new layer of danger. anything could happen

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:45 am When the fiddler gets to the roof, does the game end? Who is the fiddler?

the fiddler is a metaphor for survival in uncertain times times

the play is not even about violinists, or roof construction. that was a disappointment for me in highschool since those were two major interests for me

mmmmmmmmlets fiddler-go!