The Syndicate

gg

Thunal33 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 9:49 pm I'm leaning voting Rico now, but I'm not going to hammer yet. Now that Rico is in the PoE if he were town he'd need to find the wolf not a PoE of 2 and I feel like there's a lack of interest in that. Like "Scotty is the manipulative" feels like he's putting a lot of effort to discredit Scotty without outright calling him a wolf, and there's not the sort of impressions I would expect from a townie. Like I'd expect a townie to have real-time thoughts and impressions of how people are treating him and that's almost absent.

This is becoming bothersome.
Having a PoE of 2 is (still) the range I find sufficient to smoke out the wolf. It's true for anyone else, whether they "stick to this plan" or mislynch me and embrace a different game tomorrow.
The quote line came at the end of a proper analysis. And it is answer to what not only you, but Scotty as well, asked. Now it's being seen as discrediting. Ok.

Thunal33 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 10:00 pm Normally a townie believes that they are generally playing the game in a townie way. Rico's defense being that he voted Epi over me is fine in a vacuum, but it pings me that that's consistently the only thing he cites as towny for him.

One, it is not in a vacuum, it is in a specific context, and you are now the third player ignoring that context.
I didn't play shit until I made that shot.
I don't believe and never stated "I am townie", i.e. asked for cred, for anything.

Thunal33 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 10:42 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 10:30 pm

Thunal33 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 10:00 pm Normally a townie believes that they are generally playing the game in a townie way. Rico's defense being that he voted Epi over me is fine in a vacuum, but it pings me that that's consistently the only thing he cites as towny for him.

To be fair, that is probably the main thing that brings him into the towny discussion. He didn’t do much until then.

That's true, and it is possible t!Rico just thinks it's the only thing clearing for him.

It is. You are now the third player ignoring that context etc.

Take me out, Thunal, nutella. A pool of three players now not looking at facts and context regarding that D2 vote is already too big, it basically means I've lost town support for the 3-PoE solve and for myself.
Take me out and good luck with the f3, whether you'll be there to manage it or you entrust it will be in others' better hands.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 6:26 pm

Ricochet wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 6:04 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 6:00 pm

Ricochet wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 5:57 pm

Thunal33 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 5:45 pm I still think Rico bussing Epi wouldn’t be good strategy, but it might not matter as much as I thought it did. What matters more is if Rico would think it was good strategy and I don’t have much of an idea whether he would. One thing that is imo a slightly good point for Rico around Epi is that he didn’t do more to bury Epi and maximize cred. He just said Epi looked worse and left it at that.

I'll be the first to say that is within range for a bus.

My virtue call of not being wolf is not that I killed Epig in the tiebkreak.

My virtue call of not being wolf is that I did not sink you, given that the timing and tally I arrived had that on a plate. Press the button, cook up a sentence, or just vote etc.

This is TMI





IMO

I offered this rewind before and your answer was "just vote me then bro what you waiting". Are you that unable to repeatedly explain the reasoning for a wolf verdict on that instead of just framing it as such?

It seems to me you're saying you should be TR by virtue of the fact you did not vote off Thunal...which implies that you know her alignment.






Cuz while it's true, you may TR her slot, you don't KNOW she's town. Especially since, if you had been TR her slot the whole time, it's not even a big decision on who to vote for, Thun or Epi

If I KNEW she's town out of TMI, why. did. I. not. push. her. over. the. cliff. as. she. was. standing. at. the. very. edge

Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 6:04 pm

Ricochet wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 5:51 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 5:04 pm
POEs as a concept in a game that is basically mountainous is not binary. Process of elimination should culminate into best guesses, but literally no one can be eliminated from the suspicion list without mech

You are seeming to operate under the assumption that bing bang boom the solve is set in stone, but have a hard time coming to the possibility that you yourself could be in the POE of town. Because as you know, at least one of falcon/myself is town

Which of us is being manipulative and which is being manipulated?

You are, in principle, correct, and I wish I would approach this more "fairly", if that's your issue. But my angle is 3 phases, 3 shots, wolf smoked out. It's good enough. It's mathematical enough.

Failure of this angle is likely, but then it will be cuz of a wolf-wolf wagon (which I would interpret as less likely) or of straight up reverse psych (which is extreme to contemplate, and extremely difficult to solve).

As for the question:

a. same to what I said to thunal, I'd prefer to try an in-depth answer later toDay

b. I'd like to state that "manipulated" may be in fact murky to ascertain, since you both seem to have built this angle on your own; I don't recall or would need to revisit any instance of one of you sheeping the other's point

c. I'd like you to restate the case from this; falcon gave an answer, at least; you, why not?

Ricochet wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 12:36 pm Thunal up 3 to 2 vs Epignosis, with SVS, Epignosis and myself still to vote

Enter thread

Flake another 20mins (I was undecided and unread), instead of making it a decisive 4-2

“It’s the only explanation, guys, only Maf would play like this”

c. You know what? No. I don’t know how many more times I can rehash the same thing. If anything, I’ve overexplained my opinion on this spanning back to D3, and am in disbelief that you haven’t caught it in your read

Bro. You do know you picked the wrong guy to taunt at ISO'ing and showing you the receipts, right?

#1151, arguments

Rico should not be cleared - was gonna make the same point Falcon already did [my note: oh, I already stand correct, here's a slight sheep]
Rico is suddenly playing - how convenient.
Rico is wolf for suddenly playing.

#1192, arguments

Rico if bad had no option but to wake up and play
Epig was likely to go over [my note: although you pulled up AN INCOMPLETE tally in which it was 2-2, ignoring Syn's 3-2 move], so Rico should not be cleared for his vote.

#1236, arguments

What strategy other than bussing Epig could Rico possibly adopt to reach endgame [my note: argument devoid of vote progression context

#1269

Appears to be a partial argument, in agreement with falcon [sheep #2?], that Rico not being NK is tinfoil for wolf.

#1272

Rico is bad for coming back to life.
Rico is bad for tiebreaking Epig and taking a town claim for it. [my note: argument devoid of vote progression context]

#1326

Rico is bad for being committed to low-posting.
Rico is bad for wanting to solve his PoE.

#1338

Rico is bad for bussing Epig and taking a town claim for it. [my note: argument devoid of vote progression context]

#1384

Rico is bad for wanting to solve his PoE, but not fine-tuning it in the process.

====

So no. Not only did you not overexplained it, but did not explain ONCE the vote progression context and why wolf-me did not lynch Thunal button at the tip of the finger.

Congrats, Scotty.

You are the manipulative.

Good night

and, if you proceed to flip it, good luck.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 6:00 pm

Ricochet wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 5:57 pm

Thunal33 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 5:45 pm I still think Rico bussing Epi wouldn’t be good strategy, but it might not matter as much as I thought it did. What matters more is if Rico would think it was good strategy and I don’t have much of an idea whether he would. One thing that is imo a slightly good point for Rico around Epi is that he didn’t do more to bury Epi and maximize cred. He just said Epi looked worse and left it at that.

I'll be the first to say that is within range for a bus.

My virtue call of not being wolf is not that I killed Epig in the tiebkreak.

My virtue call of not being wolf is that I did not sink you, given that the timing and tally I arrived had that on a plate. Press the button, cook up a sentence, or just vote etc.

This is TMI





IMO

I offered this rewind before and your answer was "just vote me then bro what you waiting". Are you that unable to repeatedly explain the reasoning for a wolf verdict on that instead of just framing it as such?

Thunal33 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 5:45 pm I still think Rico bussing Epi wouldn’t be good strategy, but it might not matter as much as I thought it did. What matters more is if Rico would think it was good strategy and I don’t have much of an idea whether he would. One thing that is imo a slightly good point for Rico around Epi is that he didn’t do more to bury Epi and maximize cred. He just said Epi looked worse and left it at that.

I'll be the first to say that is within range for a bus.

My virtue call of not being wolf is not that I killed Epig in the tiebkreak.

My virtue call of not being wolf is that I did not sink you, given that the timing and tally I arrived had that on a plate. Press the button, cook up a sentence, or just vote etc.

Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 5:04 pm
POEs as a concept in a game that is basically mountainous is not binary. Process of elimination should culminate into best guesses, but literally no one can be eliminated from the suspicion list without mech

You are seeming to operate under the assumption that bing bang boom the solve is set in stone, but have a hard time coming to the possibility that you yourself could be in the POE of town. Because as you know, at least one of falcon/myself is town

Which of us is being manipulative and which is being manipulated?

You are, in principle, correct, and I wish I would approach this more "fairly", if that's your issue. But my angle is 3 phases, 3 shots, wolf smoked out. It's good enough. It's mathematical enough.

Failure of this angle is likely, but then it will be cuz of a wolf-wolf wagon (which I would interpret as less likely) or of straight up reverse psych (which is extreme to contemplate, and extremely difficult to solve).

As for the question:

a. same to what I said to thunal, I'd prefer to try an in-depth answer later toDay

b. I'd like to state that "manipulated" may be in fact murky to ascertain, since you both seem to have built this angle on your own; I don't recall or would need to revisit any instance of one of you sheeping the other's point

c. I'd like you to restate the case from this; falcon gave an answer, at least; you, why not?

Ricochet wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 12:36 pm Thunal up 3 to 2 vs Epignosis, with SVS, Epignosis and myself still to vote

Enter thread

Flake another 20mins (I was undecided and unread), instead of making it a decisive 4-2

“It’s the only explanation, guys, only Maf would play like this”

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 4:48 pm

Ricochet wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 4:41 pm falcon, PoE candidate, will spin me wolf and vote me - check

Scotty, PoE candidate, will spin me wolf and vote me - check

We can't both be Maf, and in fact from your perspective (if town) we very well both might be town.





This take is not a town mindset

From my perspective, one of you is wolf.

Thunal33 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 4:48 pm I think Scotty has a good point. Yes, we need to find a winning PoE of 2, but it also doesn't make a lot of sense to treat both PoE candidates equally when you know only one of them can be the wolf.

The PoE started at 3 people, with 3 phases available to solve them. It may seem unbecoming to just trial and error, but that already took place (with Syn). Wavering is losing the solve out of sight, logistically.

Regarding what you previously asked, I can try to find an answer tomorrow, if the phase hasn’t been hammered. I don’t think I can commit at midnight now.

falcon, PoE candidate, will spin me wolf and vote me - check

Scotty, PoE candidate, will spin me wolf and vote me - check

I don’t fathom how the wolf would elim me N4 since I am “how is this guy still alive” fodder (in all likelihood something the wolf is also pushing himself).

I am the best mislynch the wolf can hope for, both remaining phases. Right now, he even has a towner pushing the same narrative. It’s quite a lifeline.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 1:34 pm

Ricochet wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2023 12:36 pm Thunal up 3 to 2 vs Epignosis, with SVS, Epignosis and myself still to vote

Enter thread

Flake another 20mins (I was undecided and unread), instead of making it a decisive 4-2

“It’s the only explanation, guys, only Maf would play like this”

Then vote me. You're just sitting there, hanging back

A. This is not really an answer, nor an attempt to argument this theory.

B. I’m willing and patient to coordinate with the other voters. No more than two wagons should happen, but there are still votes to go, for instance, on Scotty, if the others prefer that flip.

Thunal up 3 to 2 vs Epignosis, with SVS, Epignosis and myself still to vote

Enter thread

Flake another 20mins (I was undecided and unread), instead of making it a decisive 4-2

“It’s the only explanation, guys, only Maf would play like this”

lol, it got double posted despite giving me connection time-outs

so much for 16-post goal, too

hello

few preliminaries:

1. I've stated EoD3 that I am on holiday now, I'm not gonna cut on short beach time and drunk strip poker evenings to play mafia dot com sorry.

2. Why would my D3 hammer be controversial? We were to reach consensus and, of that PoE, Syn reached the votes. It was also the proper timing (10 or something p.m. my local) to make the vote, I was from travel, I was tired, I could have just as well fallen asleep, so at three votes for Syn, I found it reasonable to proceed.

3. The math solve is falcon/scotty, in f5/f3 respectively, I realise it's not pleasant for them to face such PoE logic, but that's the best thing to roll with, unless better alternatives can be argued.

4. Speaking of things argued, both falcon and Scotty show intent to push a lynch on me, and I don't think either has clarified (or proved willing to clarify) their wolf!me perspectives i.e. how I had Thunal's lynch at a push of a button and decided to hard kill my teammate instead. Word/tone-wise, falcon seems very unwilling to formulate proper arguments, whilst Scotty does so, but also mixes them up with "it's gotta be"es.

Anyway, one of them is town, so clearly misguided, the other could very well be wolf and resort to this as his lifeline. Tempted to believe the wolf would also come in thread and push the "why isn't Rico nightkilled that's so SuuuuS" narrative. In this f5, it's likely both of them could vote me, so it takes one more voter to change mind. In f3, I expect the same - keep me alive, bring it down to a vote swing to misselim me. Stay strong town.

LATER EDIT: I started writing this before falcon's post. He has exhibited every predictable cue:
-- why is Rico alive rhetoric?
-- why wouldn't slank Maf kill his own teammate? (no further understanding of the actual EoD2 dynamic shown)
-- pushes wagon on me
(+ votes before all the arguing posts, which is extra nice)

5. Wrt participation, I suggest reaching out to the mod or discussing post-game any underlying principle. There is no participation requirement, the website has players and indeed winners of this style, I am at liberty to play so.

====

Now, my only thought of paranoia involves Thunal, the only played who can't be appreciated (and likely solved) through the EoD2 vote dynamics and flip. So, one more push of ISO, it is.

Epignosis - Thunal

#132 drops (and locks himself) into a vote on Thunal
#141 in reply to a very spirited critique by Scotty, claims or banters that "Thunal is his partner"
#967 by proxy, to an SVS reaction to a extensive Scotty case on Thunal, replies that Scotty ain't mafia
#975 direct, tho short and brush-offy, rebuttal to Thunal casing an Epig/Scotty team
#980 wth reaction to Thunal's rainbow (similarly having him and Scotty as bottom red)
#993 rebuttal to Thunal's vote on him (especially the accusation of him throwing out suspicions on the wall)
#1006 ends up with a bad label on Thunal in his D2 reads

Hmm. First, it's a dynamic opposite compared to that towards Scotty - neutral (so to speak) turned worse. It is not the least probable distancing dynamic (for D2) to witness - perhaps Epignosis was not pulling his weight, Thunal started distancing and Epig resorted to playing antagonical reactions.

A better vibe is that Epig might have been just as flippant and brush-offy to Thunal's case as he was towards nutella at times (though, sadly, we don't have a flip in that regard either, to judge it as wolf v. town for sure).

One ping towards Epignosis (which helped me also voted for him, EoD2) was that, past his vote-derp, he exhibited low incentive to, well, do anything significant, play a role in D1 even with his vote exhausted and such. Wrt Thunal, if his vote was a ping and not just a poke, I see no sign whatsoever of Epignosis having built a further case (or state otherwise that his Thunal vote does not gel with further reads on Thunal). At worst, if wolves, maybe Epig avoided bringing other votes onto the wagon he started on Thunal.

"Thunal is his partner" is, of course, the most in your face WIFOM possible - and in principle it is something Epig could try to pull, and something post-game might reveal to have been in-your-face spewing.

----

Thunal - Epignosis

#219 bemused by Epig's vote, questions its real intent and if Epig did in fact miss one rule, whilst pointing out others
#221 reads nuttela wolf and scotty town for their reactions to Epig's vote
#223 reads Epignosis' sequence of replies and reactions post-vote as very focused to "create a response"
#369 disagreement with Seanzie that Epig's vote-lock is likely town
#573 touches upon Epig's wolf reads (Dizzy)
#760 touches upon Epig's question re: my inactivity
#883 pinged by Scotty's vote on them as a sign of prepping an Epig save
#940 further focus (and re-read of previous posts) on Scotty likely wolf and partnered with Epig
#992 votes Epig (no vote-post?) and rebuttal to Epig on that matter
#995 further rebuttal to Epig's reaction
#1065 further read that Epig's sus read on her makes no sense
#1247 a more extensive read into Epig's interactions, with the main though that bussing/distancing is unlikely

I'm feeling several more fully-fleshed vibes at different parts of this.

219 & 223 & 369 benign / null - within Thunal's range of either alignment to make such critical judgements
883, 940 townlean work in case-making Scotty
992, however, not that sure why the resort to vote Epig instead of Scotty (don't remember the vote progression enough to judge this)
final posts - about as fair as I can expect of Thunal to judge Epig's behaviour

Distancing is, as always, a possibility and Thunal is among the players most able to create a balanced tone and progression with this. Bit of a hiccup in that Epig vote when the words were there to pursue Scotty, but this is in the same camp as nutella's switcheroo - why at all to create more trouble of Epig instead of pushing forward a mislynch on people they have worded enough upon.

Final thought: this is worth the tinfoil, and it'll be sadvibes if it turns out this way at endgame. But oh well. I think I'd still rule less in favor fo the distancing (and buss) theory and solve the falcon/Scotty PoE to its end.

======
======

Beach time. Good byes.

Don't have time to complete the ISO tableau with nutella. Things are already moving anyway in the direction I expected (wolf hopes for a mislynch lifeline on me), which means nutella probably won't be a wagon push toDay.

hello

few preliminaries:

1. I've stated EoD3 that I am on holiday now, I'm not gonna cut on short beach time and drunk strip poker evenings to play mafia dot com sorry.

2. Why would my D3 hammer be controversial? We were to reach consensus and, of that PoE, Syn reached the votes. It was also the proper timing (10 or something p.m. my local) to make the vote, I was from travel, I was tired, I could have just as well fallen asleep, so at three votes for Syn, I found it reasonable to proceed.

3. The math solve is falcon/scotty, in f5/f3 respectively, I realise it's not pleasant for them to face such PoE logic, but that's the best thing to roll with, unless better alternatives can be argued.

4. Speaking of things argued, both falcon and Scotty show intent to push a lynch on me, and I don't think either has clarified (or proved willing to clarify) their wolf!me perspectives i.e. how I had Thunal's lynch at a push of a button and decided to hard kill my teammate instead. Word/tone-wise, falcon seems very unwilling to formulate proper arguments, whilst Scotty does so, but also mixes them up with "it's gotta be"es.

Anyway, one of them is town, so clearly misguided, the other could very well be wolf and resort to this as his lifeline. Tempted to believe the wolf would also come in thread and push the "why isn't Rico nightkilled that's so SuuuuS" narrative. In this f5, it's likely both of them could vote me, so it takes one more voter to change mind. In f3, I expect the same - keep me alive, bring it down to a vote swing to misselim me. Stay strong town.

LATER EDIT: I started writing this before falcon's post. He has exhibited every predictable cue:
-- why is Rico alive rhetoric?
-- why wouldn't slank Maf kill his own teammate? (no further understanding of the actual EoD2 dynamic shown)
-- pushes wagon on me
(+ votes before all the arguing posts, which is extra nice)

5. Wrt participation, I suggest reaching out to the mod or discussing post-game any underlying principle. There is no participation requirement, the website has players and indeed winners of this style, I am at liberty to play so.

====

Now, my only thought of paranoia involves Thunal, the only played who can't be appreciated (and likely solved) through the EoD2 vote dynamics and flip. So, one more push of ISO, it is.

Epignosis - Thunal

#132 drops (and locks himself) into a vote on Thunal
#141 in reply to a very spirited critique by Scotty, claims or banters that "Thunal is his partner"
#967 by proxy, to an SVS reaction to a extensive Scotty case on Thunal, replies that Scotty ain't mafia
#975 direct, tho short and brush-offy, rebuttal to Thunal casing an Epig/Scotty team
#980 wth reaction to Thunal's rainbow (similarly having him and Scotty as bottom red)
#993 rebuttal to Thunal's vote on him (especially the accusation of him throwing out suspicions on the wall)
#1006 ends up with a bad label on Thunal in his D2 reads

Hmm. First, it's a dynamic opposite compared to that towards Scotty - neutral (so to speak) turned worse. It is not the least probable distancing dynamic (for D2) to witness - perhaps Epignosis was not pulling his weight, Thunal started distancing and Epig resorted to playing antagonical reactions.

A better vibe is that Epig might have been just as flippant and brush-offy to Thunal's case as he was towards nutella at times (though, sadly, we don't have a flip in that regard either, to judge it as wolf v. town for sure).

One ping towards Epignosis (which helped me also voted for him, EoD2) was that, past his vote-derp, he exhibited low incentive to, well, do anything significant, play a role in D1 even with his vote exhausted and such. Wrt Thunal, if his vote was a ping and not just a poke, I see no sign whatsoever of Epignosis having built a further case (or state otherwise that his Thunal vote does not gel with further reads on Thunal). At worst, if wolves, maybe Epig avoided bringing other votes onto the wagon he started on Thunal.

"Thunal is his partner" is, of course, the most in your face WIFOM possible - and in principle it is something Epig could try to pull, and something post-game might reveal to have been in-your-face spewing.

----

Thunal - Epignosis

#219 bemused by Epig's vote, questions its real intent and if Epig did in fact miss one rule, whilst pointing out others
#221 reads nuttela wolf and scotty town for their reactions to Epig's vote
#223 reads Epignosis' sequence of replies and reactions post-vote as very focused to "create a response"
#369 disagreement with Seanzie that Epig's vote-lock is likely town
#573 touches upon Epig's wolf reads (Dizzy)
#760 touches upon Epig's question re: my inactivity
#883 pinged by Scotty's vote on them as a sign of prepping an Epig save
#940 further focus (and re-read of previous posts) on Scotty likely wolf and partnered with Epig
#992 votes Epig (no vote-post?) and rebuttal to Epig on that matter
#995 further rebuttal to Epig's reaction
#1065 further read that Epig's sus read on her makes no sense
#1247 a more extensive read into Epig's interactions, with the main though that bussing/distancing is unlikely

I'm feeling several more fully-fleshed vibes at different parts of this.

219 & 223 & 369 benign / null - within Thunal's range of either alignment to make such critical judgements
883, 940 townlean work in case-making Scotty
992, however, not that sure why the resort to vote Epig instead of Scotty (don't remember the vote progression enough to judge this)
final posts - about as fair as I can expect of Thunal to judge Epig's behaviour

Distancing is, as always, a possibility and Thunal is among the players most able to create a balanced tone and progression with this. Bit of a hiccup in that Epig vote when the words were there to pursue Scotty, but this is in the same camp as nutella's switcheroo - why at all to create more trouble of Epig instead of pushing forward a mislynch on people they have worded enough upon.

Final thought: this is worth the tinfoil, and it'll be sadvibes if it turns out this way at endgame. But oh well. I think I'd still rule less in favor fo the distancing (and buss) theory and solve the falcon/Scotty PoE to its end.

======
======

Beach time. Good byes.

Don't have time to complete the ISO tableau with nutella. Things are already moving anyway in the direction I expected (wolf hopes for a mislynch lifeline on me), which means nutella probably won't be a wagon push toDay.

and hammer [VOTE: Syn] aubergine

sorry for not posting since yesterday, I'm on holiday this week and this was travel day

nutella wrote: ↑Mon Aug 14, 2023 2:08 pm i still dont really love scotty being dropped out of contention for today but at the same time i've softened on him too. just want to reiterate that if we're wrong today he should absolutely still be on the table, i think yeeting the three of syn/falcon/scotty in some order always wins the game and we shouldn't stray from that set

word

4 posts left for tha win less gooo

i'm viewing the interactions under a fair assumpation that Epignosis would do the following (or prefer to do so, at least under a two-wolf setup)
1. not buss the teammate, if possible
2. not suss the teammate in excess or to a point of bringing the teammate in real danger
3. defend the teammate if needed, however subtle
4. variate tone, but within range of achieving points 1 to 3

Epignosis - Syn synergy (syn-ergy get it he he)

#147 banter talk (thanks Syn for approving of his thunal vote)
#446 pitches in to Syn talk with Marmot about teammate (D1) behaviour - honestly, not a point I fully grasp or can read into
#769 banter / slight berate on Syn's manner to question, instead of debating his nutella case
#774 follows up why asking Syn to hol on till he develops a full nutella case
#777 sighs when Syn dismisses his nutella case
#965 deflects when Syn states they'd be be fine with a wagon on him
#979 replies upon Syn's change of vibe on Epig wagon
#1006 rates / reads Epig "purple"

fairly underwhelming / below average level (or amount) of interactions on Epig's behalf. it would fit more of a "ignore teammate" angle, which they also semeed to ironically exchange thoughts on. #769 felts like a poke, it could be compatible with feigning some difference of wavelength. #1006 is stinky - can't really fathom why the need to make a joke read on Syn of all

------

Syn - Epignosis synergy (syn-ergy hehe get i- oh nvmd)

#133 points out to Epig in thread that votes are locked, then jokes further
#216 vibe checks Epig yellow (below null?)
#350 pokes Epig (and falcon) on having made "vanity votes" in sync with the ongoing topics at that time
#603 notices that Epig has avoided him "all day (1)", but also defends not having followed up
#768 asks (simply) Epig why nutella is his pick
#780-784 has a chain of reactions, from "grief" to "acceptance", when Marmot votes Epignosis
#1078 jacknicholson.gif reaction to nutella stating an epig/syn wolfery

----

wow, bit surprised interactions on this side are also thin. a lot of these looks (especially the wail on Epig being voted and the rather ill-timed banter towards nutella late EoD) fairly bad for a WolfSyn, but could also within reason amount to egg-on-face for a TownSyn. make me wanna rise to my feet and yell "your honor, this is proof of guilt!", yet also ponder for an extra sec "this is suboptimal wolfmate work, could it be that suboptimal coming from Syn"

the wolf-wolf main profile would be one in which Syn just about casts suss on Epig but not really, and Epig occasionally poked and bantered to create slight distance, but nowhere near a real growl. very in your face would be the banter, the "purple" vote and Syn's reactions to players who pushed Epig into serious wagon.

======
======

Epignosis - falcon

#450 banter / berate(?) for falcon to change his debut post shtick
#463 banter react
#987 reads falcon "not mafia"
#1006 reiterates civread on falcon

falcon - Epignosis

#419 sympathetic or banter post to epig locking himself with the D1 vote
#460 somewhat rebuttal to an Epig react (of his debut post shtick), but could also constitute banter
#466 appears to conflate Epig's banter react into a statement that he is not in danger to except the post cap

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bleargh. this is peak ignore-lane from pretty much both sides. Epig went so far as to give a read on falcon, would be compatible with avoiding to cast any suss, don't recall any actual heat on falcon at that stage, also think this is a casual read from Epig - could serve purpose, could just be thrown out there, whilst focusing on wolfreading others. Two of falcon's three direct interactions are notable serios tone - not sure I get any real need from falcon (slank mode or not) to defend in such way.

vote-wise, WolfFalcon could have done his part to go off side (off-wagons vote), early on, and not need to take a stance on bussing Epignosis.

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Epignosis - Scotty

#141 banter deflect (implying wolfmateship with Thunal) to Scotty criticising / casting doubt on his vote-derp and immediate oops-reaction
#443 deflect to Scotty questioning Epig's reaction to his vote-derp
#470 flat out refuses upon Scotty's inquiry to expand nutella read (possible lateness of hour for Epig to take into account)
#752 reads Scotty "not mafia"
#754 open talk with Scotty on reading me wolf (or getting any info on my partner, if wolf)
#967 short rebuttal to a full SVS case on Scotty, reiterating "not mafia"
#975 deflect to Thunal putting in question an Epig/Scot team
#987 reiterates "not mafia" read on Scotty
#1001 yet another nope to reading Scotty mafia (in regards to nutella's push)

this is plentiful and interesting to ponder. first half is quite antagonistic in tone, but without any visible bite marks, no questioning of Scotty's reads and intents. then things seem to calm and even steer into town-reading him repeatedly. compatible in theory with wolfmate not creating further shade on a hounded teammate. but also compatible with choosing Scotty as one of his townreads, a prey with which not to play.

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#139 blasts full doubt on Epignosis's string of vote-derp and oops-reaction
#142 joke gif banter to Epig's claim that he is partnered with Thunal
#203 keeps questioning if Epignosis vote-derp is reasonable wolf move
#407 willing to give Epig a pass, but states possible of wolf move
#452 would join Epig on a nutella vote
#469 asks Epig to expand on nutella read
#751 still keeps in mind early take on Epignosis
#770 still questions Epig's nutella angle
#771 but then banters to Epig poking for a debate
#791 takes in Syn's choices for Epig & Thunal wagons, and votes thunal

somewhat a similar dinamic. even more antagonistic early on - in fact, the closest to a hounding I can interpret in questioning Epig's derp and posts afterwards. then settles for a "pass". then begins to sync with Epig (potential nutella wagon). still does most of the steps one would expect, in regards to questioning Epig's reads. this part is not something that can be fully set into townScot or wolfScot - it's within expectations, but it's also an easy chore, if something needed to be faked in-thread. rather null on this.
but then, one step further than Epig's established dynamic: #791 full stinky - fully interpretable as choosing the non-wolfmate route (complete with sheeping Syn, whilst at it)

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do I feel I can clear any of these players out of a POE? not really
i'm still ok with solving either of them.

if it's worth considering a traditional narrative (wolfmates bro'ing each other), then all points to Scotty
if it's a fractured or atypical narrative, then, even admitting an imperfect analysis, it's worth considering there was much banter, much ignore and whatnot with either Syn or Falcon
worst vote / possible save attempt award goes to Syn

@S~V~S, @nutella, @Thunal33 kindly pitch in

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Scotty wrote: ↑Sun Aug 13, 2023 10:55 am
[SNIP OF BIGGER POST}

The Rico vs Thunal clearing is specific in context to their games. I don’t see a path to the end for Rico if he is bad if he continues to slank along making weird disjointed votes and posts. He obviously woke up from his coma after Epi died. I think that’s notable. Thunal said he’s done something like this as town in a game she played with him, and I’d still like to see it.
Meanwhile, the vote was more inclined imo to go either thunal or Epi yesterday from what I read. I know Rico *could* have been a close call, but I think it was a longshot based on remaining voters.

Your Epi quote shading Rico is a good one, although I’ll need to look at it in context because that could just be lamenting. His partner could have been able to swing votes away. At the point he posted that, (thanks to Syn), nutella then voted Thunal, and we had:

Syn wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 2:47 pm

S~V~S wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 2:41 pm Me neither. But I don’t want to vote Thunal or Syn, and don’t think the case on Epi is strong.

I thought you suspected Epi?

nutella's vote forces you into picking one of the three

even if you convince me, and epi, to stack on rico, rico can just tie his wagon with either epi or thunal

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Epi (2) - Marmot, Thunal
Syn (1) - Falcon
Thunal (2) - Scotty, Nutella

Hasn't voted: Epi, Rico, SVS, Syn

So if rico is bad, we had nut, svs and syn that could all vote for a non-wagon in rico. Rico was holding, Epi was holding. At BEST, rico was never going over. Epi was the far more likely candidate to go over.

Rico should not be cleared for this

Couple of things about this.

The quote vote state is still early, Syn voted Thunal, SVS voted Epig, I voted last, Epig never did. So I dealt with a 3-3 tie.

Hence, the only world you can paint with your angle is that I deliberately chose to not save my teammate (as in not even offer his a change to win the tiebreak toss). Furthermore, I had arrived in thread at 2-2 or 3-2 lead for Thunal, so wolf me would have had direct shot at killing Thunal. So in essence, I hard bussed only to bank on winning solo three more Day phases. Can you explain further this world's plausibility?

S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 7:10 pm

Ricochet wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 5:23 pm damn now that there's a shot I kinda wanna play

though I also want to win with just 16 posts lol

wyrd kill

from epignosis' stances alone, i'd rank syn most likely (banter, poking, nothing lethal), falcon possible (banter, null to lack of read), scotty possible

that's a reasonable poe to clear and solve

My main concern with Nutella, based on Epis posts and back and forth with her, is that the two of them were all in each others faces and saying, "Imma kill you!", but neither of them tried to actually kill the other. But that's tinfoil for me. But I might still want to POE her?

@Syn yeah, I kinda expected it to be me, too, lol. And my final post count for today will be 183, I'm writing it down to remember it. I had no idea what it was supposed to be yesterday, and i think i came close-ish.

nutella, and I'll add myself, are in "why would wolf them do this to epig" camp. Wolf me could/would have sunk thunal. Wolf nutella did all the work to have a very strong shot at sinking thunal, backtracked very last stretch. Wolf you, I imagine, would have found a way to not sink the wolfmate; would have not looked impeccable, but the wolfmate living another day is the better trade.

From this logic viewpoint, townclear strength is me, then nutella, then SVS.

If town can agree with this and appreciate at least one more town read, I think we have the f7-f5-f3 votes to virtually elim the wolfmate.

thunal too on the nose from epig's statements ("thunal is my partner"), but not clearable (didn't put much into ISO'ing her)

thunal was dead at 3-2 votes, so i'm townclear

svs 96% townclear for same + unless she pulled the biggest buss gambit or didn't play well enough to have a case on thunal vs epig (i imagine her rhetoric would be in the "i'm not that awful of a wolf" style)

nutella probably townclear, she was pushing thunal to die, there was no need to flake and reconsider

of course tinfoil version regarding them both is they played us 'n' town is screwed

would go with occam. so syn, falcon, scotty. gg

+ marmot kill is weird (in which case I'd imagine falcon doing it rather than syn) or meant to throw us off (in which case syn still the mastermind-like type, more likely)

k good night

damn now that there's a shot I kinda wanna play

though I also want to win with just 16 posts lol

wyrd kill

from epignosis' stances alone, i'd rank syn most likely (banter, poking, nothing lethal), falcon possible (banter, null to lack of read), scotty possible

that's a reasonable poe to clear and solve

Skimmed a bit epignosis feels worse

[VOTE: epignosis ] aubergine

Sorry for not posting I was at a concert

who should i vote

not mafia but it's ok to do what needs be done

Despite everything, it’s still me

I've been having a hard time keeping up that's why I don't post often

falcon all-around sketch would vote

D1 I thought marmot was mafia but I now feel that I'm wrong as of know I have no suspensions

sorry for not posting, but I think I know who I’m voting and that’s marmot. it seems marmot was trying to get there way then when everyone found that out marmot tried to say that they were just saying what they thought. That’s why I’m voting [VOTE: marmot. ] aubergine

I AM TOWN!





Good night.