The Syndicate

bea wrote: ↑Mon Nov 21, 2022 4:46 pm I was so excited that coders were gonna work on the cod for "vanillia civ"

The biggest sign I was bad was that when I solved this I didn’t immediately tell the whole thread this joke. But I did tell Daisy lol.

bea wrote: ↑Mon Nov 21, 2022 8:23 am Today is Turnip Head's birthday and that was just a gut punch to see.

They should have played with us. I miss them.

I had the same gut punch

bea wrote: ↑Mon Nov 21, 2022 6:53 am That said - off the thread and one on one - I am very curious about some of the personal info you spoke of in the game. I didn't know you were neurodivergant - I would love to get to know that part of my old friend as well.

Yes, because I think this has the possibility to explain some of how I was 'off' = or maybe your gut was 100% just seeing baddie me! Really happy to have that convo bea! It has changed how I interact with the world.

I had actually correctly solved vivax before Sloonei did (I finally got one right!) but I thought I could sneak his lynch in based on some in thread stuff he had said.

I wasn’t so worried about solving sig… I had a goal of lynching vivax and nking sig or elo at f5 at that point. A sig/Sloonei/me final three might have been where I headed.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Sun Nov 20, 2022 4:47 pm Good stuff Mafia. Well played.

@Golden did I die because you caught me solving Sig?

Those last few kills felt like me trying to thread the tiniest needle. Every one of them was about improving my win equity as much as I could.

I thought you’d be solved as town, that you could well flip on me at lylo, and that you wouldn’t be Kate breaked on that night… which was pretty much my rationale every kill I made, and I think as a team we had essentially that rationale on the ones before that too. We had a very strong town to defuse.

Having very little solving on the DF day was quite helpful though.

Roxy wrote: ↑Sat Nov 19, 2022 12:19 pm So fun reading and keeping up. Great game play Golden I do understand why you were killing the old school players. Congrats to all baddies you all played together as a team and that is what is needed when you are mafia Wanted to find the spec chat but never quite found the time Cannot wait to play with you all someday Linky w/Gman - wow great game play I also would have been sorry not sorry

I hated it though! On day one when we killed splints I was sooo sad. I had to toughen up.

Vivax wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 11:02 pm Big thanks to the hosts obviously. Very dedicated and nice writing, but they may have underestimated the social burnout from this summer in regards to special events. My conscience went downhill when I didn‘t submit a song, but not as much as it would have, had I rolled mafia.

I‘m probably weird cause I appreciate a reasonable amount of creative rudeness when it‘s not angleshooty or crosses red lines.

Best civs were Kate, Scotty, SVS/DH imo
Golden best scum easily
And me best third party without a shred of doubt

You were in that civ group for me. All four of you made me uncomfortable (well Kate didn’t yet but she would have soon enough).

Hey @Kate how DID Map work exactly?

Kate wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 10:13 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 10:05 pm I vote to have more Classic Syndicate games hosted here in the future.

I would SO be here for that! I really forgot how much I loved this game.

Me too. And I was genuinely annoyed we weren't civ/civ and we need a game where we actually are.

Here is my post in night chat before choosing my kill last night:

If eloh is Kate break:

If she picks me, she blocks the kill
If she picks the same one of Sloonei and vivax that I do, she blocks the kill.
If she picks the one I don’t pick, she townclears them and knows it’s me

So I have to kill elo.

But if I kill elo, it should be clear to vivax that Sloonei is rev mafia, and it should be clear to Sloonei that vivax is lostpedia.

So I need to kill one of them, hope I don’t pick the same one as elo, and convince the other that sussing me is Elos scum move
Sorry team, I think chances of us getting out of this one rely on elo actually being adverb tell and not llama
I’m just going to run what I think is the safest line I can… elo suspecting Sloonei most will try to block him, i kill vivax, and I have to convince Sloonei it’s elo… and chances are I’ll fail.

Vivax wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:39 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:23 pm @Vivax I really enjoyed playing with you. You were a sharp player and I'm certain if I was civ I would have had you in my town core and really pushed forward. You were very perceptive.

And @Michelle you were a great teammate who was so gracious when I had to bus you and I'm glad we got to meet this way.

Nice to meet and get to paly with both of you.

Thanks a lot. Impressive ramp up in productivity on your part towards the end.
I guess in hindsight you were hard to spot because your tone was similary aloof to the other players.

Post game is where I could learn the most from this, given the motivation.
First time I tried old school after so many years of mafia and it was great compared to setups with roleclaims and obvitowning. Wouldn‘t mind another go at some point.

I’ll tag you when my job is up

Epignosis wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:22 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:11 pm @Sloonei did you work out what I was getting at with the night 1 thing?

I was hoping Eloh would have.

Yeah that would have been a very fun way to lose.

@Vivax I really enjoyed playing with you. You were a sharp player and I'm certain if I was civ I would have had you in my town core and really pushed forward. You were very perceptive.

And @Michelle you were a great teammate who was so gracious when I had to bus you and I'm glad we got to meet this way.

Nice to meet and get to paly with both of you.

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:18 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:15 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:12 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:11 pm @Sloonei did you work out what I was getting at with the night 1 thing?

No lol

I was role hinting at map.

Because the nons option was my avatar.

And I had pink checked Kate who was map, so I knew it was safe to claim.

I had you as map in my notes after that comment. Then the map never reappeared or seemed to do anything after N1, and….figured that role was definitely dead and you weren’t the map.

If I solved it correctly, Kate only made one poll and then could do things based on location each night, and there were some cool fun things in there.

Oh btw... I couldn't solve the FEB power, legit. It was phrased completely differently in our chat.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:12 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:11 pm @Sloonei did you work out what I was getting at with the night 1 thing?

No lol

I was role hinting at map.

Because the nons option was my avatar.

And I had pink checked Kate who was map, so I knew it was safe to claim.

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:05 pm Ahhhhhh I put too much work into this game.

It’s crushing games like these that makes me have to launch into breaks again. I can’t just not be involved when playing these things. And to come so close…

I’m just glad it wasn’t lost by some bullsuit. Golden clawed and scraped his way to that win. Sure, team win yadda yadda yadda…but at one point he was…what, 1v6? That’s impressive. Gotta give him props

I do actually feel a bit guilty for this.

I think, of all my mafia wins, this was the one with the most consistently strong civ play. You, SVS, Kate, Sloonei, Eloh, Vivax, sig, llama, wilgy... I had nowhere to hide

Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:07 pm Honestly I thought he had lost it when he voted Elo. I thought it would be easier to convince Elo that Sloonei was bad than the other way around. So that shows me how much I know.

I was 93% certain I could get sloonei to vote Elo. But I thought Elo might come for me no matter what.

@Sloonei did you work out what I was getting at with the night 1 thing?

Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:00 pm For the record, what Scotty wanted to do in thread was not out of bounds. I’m also surprised you remember our days of no claims so differently because it was something that used to happen all the time. It is fair game to discuss something that has happened that is public knowledge and speculate why or to try and slot à role.

Ah, but it would have made my life a lot harder.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:58 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:54 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:52 pm Did anyone not know what my role was after Day 1?

I mean me, obviously lol.

Glad I was such a good brick wall for Scotty.

I laughed when you said it was obvious I wasn’t Rev Mafia, but in hindsight thought maybe that was an act.

Oh no, I was in full civ golden mode.

Even before day one was swapped I believed it was being swapped by axe. I don’t know what his day one stuff was about but it was weird.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:52 pm Did anyone not know what my role was after Day 1?

I mean me, obviously lol.

Glad I was such a good brick wall for Scotty.

Vivax wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:51 pm Glad I got NKd. Don‘t think I‘d have picked the right one or survived the day.
gg Golden!

I would likely have nked Sloonei if I didn’t think eloh might be trying to block the kill.

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:49 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:47 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:46 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:44 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:40 pm I'm quite good at figuring out the bad guys with my gut, but am horrible at building cases. And I have a hard time following my gut when I have no real evidence. And yes, in some of my posts, I capitalized ALL the adverbs! @Golden did you catch onto this?

My finding people by roles was actually shit in this game lol. I thought llama was adverb tell.

Your handling of how I was going about figuring out how to clear Sloonei was pissing me off to no end. Like, you had me on two separate occasions have to leave the game to go fume IRL so I didn’t just start yelling at you in thread.

I should have known.

The whole ‘Sloonei is a mason thing’

Was based off your opening post.

That I forgot was you not Sloonei.

And then I had to lean in.

But like…the Mason thing aside.

Who the hell would have switched the D1 lynch besides Sloonei?

I thought it was axe.

Matahari wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:47 pm there’s a reason I left my vote on Golden for so long. Hmmm, I wonder why I did that?

Don’t you know you were clearly on the baddie team that day

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:46 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:44 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:40 pm I'm quite good at figuring out the bad guys with my gut, but am horrible at building cases. And I have a hard time following my gut when I have no real evidence. And yes, in some of my posts, I capitalized ALL the adverbs! @Golden did you catch onto this?

My finding people by roles was actually shit in this game lol. I thought llama was adverb tell.

Your handling of how I was going about figuring out how to clear Sloonei was pissing me off to no end. Like, you had me on two separate occasions have to leave the game to go fume IRL so I didn’t just start yelling at you in thread.

I should have known.

The whole ‘Sloonei is a mason thing’

Was based off your opening post.

That I forgot was you not Sloonei.

And then I had to lean in.

S~V~S wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:41 pm Well played Golden. It was what, 6 civs and you at one point and you still pulled it out of the bag.

I’m really sorry for murdering all my returning friends. The run of losing splints, llama, Kate and svs was brutal (Scotty wasn’t a brutal kill, that guy would never get off my ass).

Elohcin wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:40 pm I'm quite good at figuring out the bad guys with my gut, but am horrible at building cases. And I have a hard time following my gut when I have no real evidence. And yes, in some of my posts, I capitalized ALL the adverbs! @Golden did you catch onto this?

My finding people by roles was actually shit in this game lol. I thought llama was adverb tell.

S~V~S wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:39 pm I was screaming at Sloonei on my phone. “Golden, Sloonei, it’s Golden!!!”

Screaming lol. Things are so obvious when you’re dead.

Although I’m pretty proud I called out the last three in one post!

And then you mysteriously died

You’re way too good at this.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:35 pm There were moments in both Eloh's and Golden's ISOs that I thought looked like potential teammate interactions with members of the mafia team. Ultimately, I felt like Golden's going after Quin on Day 1 and then some time in the middle of the game felt too unprompted, and Quin's reactions too anxious, to have been faked. Well played, you two.

Honestly every member of this team mattered to this win. I do not think I could have pulled this off without them setting up a realistic deepwolf run.

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:34 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:33 pm

Kate wanting the rez when I role hint at her role lol.

Lmao

Scotty was calling for your head in spec. Ggs

Scotty. SVS. Kate… a few people I definitely wouldn’t have been winning with them alive.

I thought elo was Kate break so the last few nke were tense.

Sorry civs. I really wanted to be civ.

But I had a great team.

Kate wanting the rez when I role hint at her role lol.

Elohcin wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 7:38 pm Will, O prufasily troid.

Being cursed at lylo is a very rough position to be in for defending yourself.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 6:37 pm I just meant that I've been trying to be very careful to not even breathe a hint of info-dumping in the thread, so I was in no position to say "Hey, Golden, just fyi, the role you think I am is wrong." I had picked up on what you believed me to be.

Lol. Well I held it in some significance all game.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 6:23 pm I do have a question for @Golden. It is centered around this exchange:

Spoiler: show

Golden wrote: ↑Mon Oct 31, 2022 3:53 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Oct 31, 2022 3:47 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Mon Oct 31, 2022 3:44 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Oct 31, 2022 3:39 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Mon Oct 31, 2022 3:33 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Mon Oct 31, 2022 3:05 pm
@Golden does this answer make you feel
A) better about Sloonei
B) worse about Sloonei
C) both a and d
D) neither b or c

First reaction, shock.
Second reaction “is there a good reason for this post within ny current worldview?”
Third reaction - no I don’t think so.

What bothers me most about this is:

1) Sloonei disrupted significant heat on Quin with his read and
2? He never seemed bothered to contradict my rationale for trust.

Sometimes the simplest answer is also the correct one.

I town read Quin on Days 1 and 2 when no one else did. On Day 3, I still feel like he is town, but the state of the game demands that I reexamine that stance at some point.

Did you feel like you had a clear understanding on why I had a town read of you?

I did not think it was so reliant on certain aspects as to call the read into question if those aspects disappeared. I also was not in a position to argue with you about your read on me.

Ok, I don’t think this is unfair. Worldview partially restored.

Early in the game, you seemed certain that my town read on Quin was more secure or informed than it turned out to be. When I walked it back on Day 3, you expressed shock and dismay at your shattered worldview. But, after a brief exchange with me, you recovered and carried on reading me as town. Can you talk some more about how you processed all of these events? I understand that this topic is a bit dicey because it involves Stuff About Which We May Not Speak.

I think, given it is not infodumping, I am allowed to say that I believed you were a mason. But, I also had a partner in mind for you (Dr Wilgy), so I didn't immediately see your Quin read as anything but a read.

Then there was a point where your Quin stuff became so insistent that I re-evaluated that read, and thought 'oh, Quin is the mason partner' and abandoned my Quin is bad read.

Now, the thing that shattered my world view was not merely that you were not a mason with Quin. It was that despite the fact that (I think) it would have been evident to you that I thought you were a mason with Quin, you didn't really take the opportunity to reject my worldview or bring my pause, and I thought you had been quite happy to float on my trust without challenging it.

That's why this response from you mattered. Particular this line:

"I also was not in a position to argue with you about your read on me."

Which, in the moment, I took to mean 'hey, who says I'm not a mason - you just read in to my quin reads' but also the way you framed it made me feel good about the fact that you weren't challenging it because I was on the right track. I'm not sure mafia sloonei frames that thing with that sentence.

My world view was challenged a second time when Scotty flipped mason and it was evident you weren't a mason, but not as substantially, because the line above has stuck with me and I could easily also read it to mean 'there is an in thread role hint as to what my role is', so saying you think you know my role from the thread is plausible'.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 6:19 pm I am in the middle of reading Golden's ISO right now.

Brave man.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 6:06 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 5:58 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 5:35 pm @Golden Can you talk a bit more about your decision to cast such an early vote for Eloh? What convinced you she is not town? She was OT Green'd and all that.

I spent two hours isoing Quin, Michelle, G-Man and Eloh last night and what I saw led me that way. I did post a lot of it in the thread.

Being OT greened is NAI for me, I'd be expecting that role to target teammates some of the time.

Besides that, it is not 'such an early vote'. For me there is no merit in waiting around 12 more hours just for the look of the thing.

Did it not give you pause that, if you were wrong, you'd effectively be ending the game then and there?

I did understand and consider that implication. It did not give me pause. The only thing that gave me pause is the fairness aspect.

Elohcin wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 6:01 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 5:37 pm @Elohcin If Golden had not voted for you and you were free to vote for either of us, who do you think you would have chosen? Why?

RIED ELUAD. Ot hilps.

O gat filt guldin wes bed ell gemi bat knuwligebly cuald nivir gu thiri tu baold e cesi. Hi wes qaoit ierly un end bicemi muri uf e furci eftir G wes doid. O fiil loki yuar gemipley hes biin muri cunsostint. Bat O hevi tu bi hunist. Of tudey wint doffirintly end guldin hed cumi on end telkid, bat weotid fur mi tu try tu rispund, end thin weotid antol clusir tu ind uf dey tu vuti yua, O wuald hevi es will. Thet osn't huw tudey wint, thuagh. Tudey, Guldin cemi on end pustid e BANCH whoch luukid loki "tryong" tu hilp tu sevi hos batt end thin vutid bifuri enyuni rispundid. O thonk hos ontintouns wiri tu cuntrul thi thried. O dodn't loki thet end ot sielid my gat fiilongs O'vi hed ell gemi. O jast hupi O'm roght.

LONKO - Guldin dod nut ivin weot fur as tu rispund!

To be honest Elo, and like I understand your disappointment in me not giving you a chance and it feels like the 'fair' thing to have time to respond and all of that.

But I would have just been pandering to you, and not being myself.

I've been saying since day one with bea that I am a different person to what I was when I last played, and that is because of me acknowledging my neurodiversity, and there are, I guess 'norms' that others like it when I observe but which it's not helpful for me to observe.

If I had not voted for you last night, the likely result would have been that I wouldn't have slept so well last night because my brain needs resolution on the end point of that work I did. It's just how I am and who I am. And I understand that there are ways in which that's not fair to you but the opposite would not have been being fair to myself.

This is really tricky stuff to touch on and talk about in the context of a mafia game where people are trying to read my intentions and I hate the idea that someone who is trying to work if I'm town or civ would read this and evaluate it through that lens because it just isn't about that.

Anyway, I don't think a slinging match between me and elo helps anything but I do really help you will read night 1, please don't skip that and think that it won't be as helpful as other things.

Elohcin wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 6:01 pmO gat filt guldin wes bed ell gemi

This isn't in your iso at all.

Of the three things that looked good on Eloh

The day one vote
The town slip
The OT green

Only the first two were things I felt like I really needed to satisfy myself could be otherwise explained.

Basically, the approach I took into my isoing last night was 'I think it must be elo, because I really do think sloonei is town. But these are the things that I need to find a satisfying explanation for, because if I can't then maybe it is sloonei after all'.

And what I found, for me, was a satisfying explanation for both of them and a baddie team that treated Elo basically the same way they all treated each other. There was some real 'aha' moments in there, particularly in reading G-Man's iso.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 5:35 pm @Golden Can you talk a bit more about your decision to cast such an early vote for Eloh? What convinced you she is not town? She was OT Green'd and all that.

I spent two hours isoing Quin, Michelle, G-Man and Eloh last night and what I saw led me that way. I did post a lot of it in the thread.

Being OT greened is NAI for me, I'd be expecting that role to target teammates some of the time.

Besides that, it is not 'such an early vote'. For me there is no merit in waiting around 12 more hours just for the look of the thing.

Elohcin wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 3:33 pm uh, O TRALY furgut. Thi fect thet yua OMPETOINTLY dod nut weot fur mi tu RIELLY telk tu yua mekis mi VIRY sed. Why wuald e cov HARRODLY vuti? [VOTE: golden] aubergine

Could I have waited? Sure.
Would it have changed my mind? You'd have had to pull out something special.

I understand why my impatience might be frustrating, but for me waiting on something when I've already made my mind up isn't me being honest or fair with you (or myself) either. I am impatient and impulsive and gut-based and I'm leaning into that more these days (not just in mafia, but in life) because the other thing isn't me being me, and also I don't have the time I used to

I've enjoyed playing with you again Elo. I hope I'm right, and if I'm not I hope the civs won't hold it against me.

It's all up to you now sloonei.

Moveable votes is dead.

Elohcin wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 12:00 pm My pull NIVIR wurks ENYMURI! O thuruaghly du nut andirstend ot. Guldin, yua niid tu muvi yuar vuti uff uf my roght nuw. Yua eri ixtrimily wrung on yuar thuaghts uf mi biong bed. @Sloonei , du yua uftin sii huw attirly wrung @Golden cen bi tudey? O sulimnly swier thet OO'm cov.

My vote is cast. If I'm wrong I'm sorry, and Sloonei has me snowed.

My read through tonight has made me feel quite confident in the right direction. In fact, I feel a little silly that I have relied on the townslip for so long and not done analysis that I think genuinely does point in that direction.

Sloonei - if you are bad, congratulations for pocketing me. One thing elo has infoslipped, townslip or not, is that she is not revolution mafia. Linki is almost certainly dead, and I know my own role. That provides a 50% chance that revolution mafia is alive. My thinking right now is not based only on this thread research, but also the fact that you have given me reason to believe, in our interactions, that you are rev mafia. Lol at me thinking you were a mason. But often the traditional way of solving these role madness games is by working out who the roles are, and I'm hopeful that this is how the civs will bring this one home too.

[VOTE: Elohcin] aubergine

Fingers crossed I have this right, sorry if I have it wrong. I'll try and spend some time in tomorrow too, if the game isn't over.

OK, I've skimmed Elo at this point... to be honest, I feel like I've found my baddie and so I was more ruling some stuff out.

Elo votes Michelle on Michelle's lynch day saying 'she's suspected her all game' but that isn't really substantiated, not even by her voting Michelle the day before when she could easily have been lynched instead of Quin.

The big thing is the 'townslip' in which Elo believes rev mafia is scum. She said this on day two, and really it has been what has driven by town read of her for the whole game since then without doing much questioning of it.

I have two theories on that, either one of which are plausible enough to allow me to go with the evidence of my eyes. Both of them are plausible to me because Elo was specifically calling out her real life stuff in the early game that prevented her from fully participating.

1) She mistakenly believed her team had saved her from the lynch (perhaps even a basic misunderstanding of something in mafia chat). In the world where she believes rev mafia is mafia, it makes sense that she'd want to paint sloonei as responsible for the lynch swap to immediately minimise questions about why she survived; or

2) She just hadn't got around to reading the roles thoroughly yet, including her own team's roles, and it was a simple error.

Lastly, G-Man did that think where he refused to vote for sloonei to save himself on day 3, which is wifom but definitely feels like he wanted eyes on sloonei on day 4.

G-Man wrote: ↑Sun Oct 30, 2022 3:35 pm Vamoosing for a bit to get some work done (because, like it or not, playing mafia doesn't pay the bills). Here's where my ISO's stand so far:

Towncore:
-Bea
-Eloh
-G-Man
-Kate

POE:
-DF
-DrWilgy


More to come tonight.

Of G-Man's four civ leans, only Eloh makes it into his town core.