Interactions of Invictus and staypositivefriend
From Invictus
Invictius wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 1:52 am
that was somewhat of a joke, sorry lol. it was a more than obvious answer to the question.
why?
Invictius wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 2:25 am
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 1:54 am
Invictius wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 1:47 am
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 1:02 am
Alison wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 12:45 am
The point is that Gavial is infamous for having insane troll logic and I think this is because he simply views the game in a very twisty and strange way that is far removed from everyone else's when he is town. His play this game seems much more orthodox and I believe this is a symptom of him trying to mimic "normal" townies.
if the assumption in this post is correct (that gavial's read on me was totally serious), then wouldn't you say that it's pretty unconventional/strange for him to have a confident scumread based on the first couple of posts on page 1? how would you say that those reads are "orthodox" or "sane"?
something might be getting lost in translation w/your read on gavial, because the only frame of reference i have for him is fargo mafia, where he was fairly normal (iirc)
i like this tho. somewhat cause the question makes sense, also somewhat because they're defending the person that voted them(i know it's an early day 1 vote that means nothing, but as scum it wouldn't be too hard to piggyback on either the accusation against gavial or against anyone that's been pressured thus far but SPF chooses to dig deeper for a read which ME LIKES).
SPF can have a slight town read.
that being said, do you find alison suspicious for coming to such strong conclusions early or is it a towny thing? based on her read of gavial im assuming meta isn't disregarded on this site!
alison having strong conclusions early is pretty typical for her as either alignment. i got pinged by her read initially because it had a train of thought that didn't seem totally fluid to me (ie: describing gavial's reads as "conventional" when his play up until that point had been anything but conventional), but i think it's fine in the context of alison having highly specific meta about gavial's playstyle, and in the context of her trying to provide content to a game that was almost entirely dead
i see, fair enough. you make nothing of it tho, correct?
what do you think about him backtracking in regards to the suspicion he showed on marmot and I? when i say backtracking i dont mean in that read itself, but he seemed to switch from taking things seriously to saying everything was essentially non-serious after alison attacked him?
does anyone stand out as particularly scummy to you?
Invictius wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 1:24 pm
okay well all of those kinda look the same:
strong town reads: dizzy/splints/spf
weaker town reads: alison/nook
Invictius wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 1:22 pm
Alison
DkKoba
Dyslexicon
falcon45ca
Fingersplints
Gavial
Hollowkatt
Long Con
Marmot
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
Staypositivefriend
tonystarkprime
this is disappointingly less than i thought.
still a good start!
i dont include scum reads on my lists, but im more than happy to clarify who those are if anyone asks. particularly i dont like gavial, hollow, or koba right now and will vote among those 3.
if anyone thinks this is too many town reads, there's also a lot of town compared to scum! i like to solve via town reads and creating a poe to find scum. for the most part my town reads are pretty consistently good so it works well for me.
Invictius wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 10:32 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 10:21 pm
Invictius wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 10:01 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 7:01 pm
Marmot wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 5:10 pm
Current quick takes.
Alison is town for pushing for activity.
Dizzy is town for reasonable reads and OMGUSing. Good luck surviving til Day 2 Dizzy.
I am town because my rolecard says so.
oof, i don't like this post. do you think that alison would not push to make the game more active as a wolf? would dizzy not have "reasonable reads" as a wolf? this feels like a fairly surface level analysis
I disliked the post for other, maybe self centered reasons. Those being I was more active than Alison and had overlapping thoughts as dizzy yet Marmot didn't mention me at all
does that mean you wolfread marmot?
Leaning that way yes.
Ddk's frustration with nook reads Towny with me because the game I just played with nook had 3 separate townies all get frustrated in a similar fashion to nook(including me), altho that's not enough to really change my read on him. I'd still like to see one of their scum games for cross comparison.
I don't really understand hollow's play at all and I think his accusations against me are kinda bad, but the sheer tunneling gives me town vibes. Not sure why they're so persistent on scum reading and voting me while being tied as the leading wagon, but not shifting their attention over to ddk or even really going at them reads well because they're not overly concerned, at least not yet, with self pres. Unless I guess they could both be scum, but I'd assume they'd at least distance in that case.
I continued to like SPF's posting, seem rather carefree and town to me.
Flint kinda vibed town in my read back too but nothing concrete there.
Not really sure I like long con thus far as it feels like they're just coasting by letting day play out. If both wagons are town it would be good to look back on as it would make sense for scum to just sit back and wait in that case.
Invictius wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:02 am
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:00 am
my vote is still up in the air, gavial. if you feel strongly about the current wagons being town and you have a good alternative, i will earnestly consider it
but you dont seem to be suggesting alternatives
Thoughts on long con?
Invictius wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:42 am
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:28 am
DkKoba wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:26 am
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:25 am
DkKoba wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:24 am
i mean they are purposefully trying to obfuscate it in an extremely anti town way that hurts solving - so if they're town they're playing like a jackass with no regard for anyone else trying to solve the game
nanook is? i dont really get that impression at all, he seems fine
is this how they normally play?
i barely paid attention to them in bread mafia bc they kept voting town lol
yeah he has a pretty chill playstyle but he tryhards when it counts in my experience
i dont mind him coasting as long as he picks it up when it's necessary, and i trust that he will
the issue is when he's scum he literally has to do very little to get near end game. And every phase counts otherwise why do any of us bother at all unless it's end game
Invictius wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:23 am
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:19 am
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:07 am
im about to go to bed, but will be somewhat around before the deadline tomorrow. if u have any burning questions for me, i would ask them now
what do your current reads look like, SPF?
Who do you think isn't being looked at that should be looked at
Invictius wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:23 am
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:19 am
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:07 am
im about to go to bed, but will be somewhat around before the deadline tomorrow. if u have any burning questions for me, i would ask them now
what do your current reads look like, SPF?
Who do you think isn't being looked at that should be looked at
Invictius wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:24 am
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:17 am
Invictius wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:16 am
AND THEIR NAME IS IN RED ON THE POST COUNT LIST, IF THAT ISN'T DAMNING WHAT IS?!?!?!
(i was looking at it to check to see if im sort of favouring active players for town reads and i kinda am, so ill keep that in mind)
there's a post count list!?!?!? today i learned
Let's you see all their posts too. Did you just never iso before lol
Invictius wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:48 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:39 pm
this is rough. i don't actively wolfread any of the highly active posters, but it's impossible to get an accurate read on the lower posters because they aren't .....posting. i feel partially like i am stumbling blindly in the dark based off of way too little information
i feel the same. i find it unlikely that all the scum are in the inactives, mostly as that isn't usually the way it goes, but hopefully we get some more light with some of the more inactive slots resolved.
Invictius wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 8:25 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 8:22 pm
well w/e, i don't care if this dude wants to fish my role out. i CC vig. i did not shoot last night
you can go into anti-spew now
Well I did good then.
Info is a shame as I figured I'd have gone far, but I got the remaining power roles outed so I can nap easy.
.
: I'm referring to the full exchange of quotes ending with the orange blob. This is a meaty pile of text that I think should provide some promise with regard to meaningful interpretation. Some of the language Invictus uses, e.g. "SPF can have a slight town read", the classic "fair enough", and what looks like a loaded question beginning with "what did you think about him backtracking..." -- it gives me an impression of someone talking about and to a player with whom he doesn't already have a relationship in the game. Rather it looks like he has chosen SPF as a sort of solving springboard to involve himself and look the part, which would be a decent bit to her credit. I am not super confident about that, but it's still my perspective.
The intermediary interactions here are uniformly pro-SPF by way of strong town reads, reiterated town reads, agreement, etc. I wouldn't say it all moves the needle much as it's an extension of the previous point.
Yellow: I could probably reduce the entire interaction to this moment if I wanted to. I have still done the review for the sake of due diligence, but I'll speak more about this from the SPF side.
~~~
From staypositivefriend
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 1:54 am
Invictius wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 1:52 am
that was somewhat of a joke, sorry lol. it was a more than obvious answer to the question.
why?
you seem comfortable and expressive in a way that most wolves in the early game are not. that's good enough for now
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 7:08 pm
mm im pretty much caught up now. i got townvibes from fingersplints, invicitius, and dyslexicon. i would gth lean on long con being town as well for some of the posts he made around the page 4 mark. TSP's opening posts were villagery but he has to do more to earn a townread. i'm either neutral or lukewarm about anyone that i didnt mention
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 10:21 pm
Invictius wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 10:01 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 7:01 pm
Marmot wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 5:10 pm
Current quick takes.
Alison is town for pushing for activity.
Dizzy is town for reasonable reads and OMGUSing. Good luck surviving til Day 2 Dizzy.
I am town because my rolecard says so.
oof, i don't like this post. do you think that alison would not push to make the game more active as a wolf? would dizzy not have "reasonable reads" as a wolf? this feels like a fairly surface level analysis
I disliked the post for other, maybe self centered reasons. Those being I was more active than Alison and had overlapping thoughts as dizzy yet Marmot didn't mention me at all
does that mean you wolfread marmot?
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:20 am
Invictius wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:02 am
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 1:00 am
my vote is still up in the air, gavial. if you feel strongly about the current wagons being town and you have a good alternative, i will earnestly consider it
but you dont seem to be suggesting alternatives
Thoughts on long con?
i thought that
https://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewt ... 18#p785218 was a mildly villagery post, in the sense that it had this hyper paranoid tinfoil/conspiratorial energy that wolves usually do not have. i am lukewarm about the rest of his posts, but i dont really wanna chop him today
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 2:38 am
Invictius wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 2:37 am
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 2:04 am
I want to leave my vote on dk cause it's clearly annoying him and his whole thing is mildly annoying to me
But he's probably town so
I'll move it eventually
why eventually. if you got nowhere else to be, LONG CON IS THE VOTE TO BE
why do you fos long con?
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:06 am
Invictius wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:04 am
Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 3:57 am
DkKoba wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 2:42 am
i guess this is where i reveal why i townread longcon, and the simple reason is, they intiated a vote on me, and thats usually town indicative to me. i guess its not really a good reason but also i think their intentions were towny. they were a very easy mislim in my last game with them.
This reasoning doesn't hold up for me at all. And I am considering voting LC.
He's not a town read in a sea of town or mild town reads.
yes this is it.
essentially town points are a thing. if youre in the thread and you do stuff that makes you towny then TOWN POINTS. obviously scum can do towny things too, but generally speaking if a bunch of people are looking towny and some people have been around and just haven't then i think it's best to remove from there as it helps with POE because eventually those towny points lead to people just being lock town and making the game easy to solve.
there is no real big case or anything, it's just the best move for POE and the read itself comes from POE.
what does your POE look like right now?
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:27 am
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:19 am
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 4:07 am
im about to go to bed, but will be somewhat around before the deadline tomorrow. if u have any burning questions for me, i would ask them now
what do your current reads look like, SPF?
thanks for asking! i feel fairly strongly about fingersplints being a villager but it's more of a soulread than anything else - there is a level of sincerity/comfort in her posting that i find it difficult to believe that she would have as a wofl. my understanding is that dizzy has a very good wolf game, but i townread him as well - he has mindmelded with me at multiple points throughout the game with regards to our perspective and the stuff that we're interested in pursuing, and i like that he has an equally strong soulread on fingersplints
i still townlean invictius, even though i feel that his playstyle is one that i might be inclined to townread regardless of his alignment. i would GTH lean on nanook and koba being town - at least to the extent that i am not interested in chopping either of them today. i think that long con had exactly one (1) villagery post, so i'm not inspired by his wagon, but i'm not at a level where i feel comfortable defending or shielding him
i was lightly pinged by a couple of falcon's posts. i have been pinged by HK's posts too, but i'm holding my breath on that read because i think that HK has the capacity to make himself very obviously town if he actually is a villager. i have very little to say about alison, gavial, marmot, or tonystarkprime (i thought tsp's opening posts were villagery, but i need more for that to develop into a real townread.)
i wanted to explain these reads more, but i can barely keep my eyes open
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 8:17 pm
Invictius wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 1:22 pm
Alison
DkKoba
Dyslexicon
falcon45ca
Fingersplints
Gavial
Hollowkatt
Long Con
Marmot
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
Staypositivefriend
tonystarkprime
this is disappointingly less than i thought.
still a good start!
i dont include scum reads on my lists, but im more than happy to clarify who those are if anyone asks. particularly i dont like gavial, hollow, or koba right now and will vote among those 3.
if anyone thinks this is too many town reads, there's also a lot of town compared to scum! i like to solve via town reads and creating a poe to find scum. for the most part my town reads are pretty consistently good so it works well for me.
this is invicitus's early readslist, and if we live in a world where he actually is a wolf, then i think that this list contains one wolf at most. i dont get the impression that invict is the type of person to try to towncore both of his partners in the early game - he seemed more focused on being conciliatory and getting people to townread him (which evidently worked, since i townread him throughout the majority of d1)
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 8:17 pm
Invictius wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 8:16 pm
Gavial wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 8:03 pm
Invictius wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 6:35 pm
that's a
weird kill and a shitty loss of a pt.
apologies for missing eod, my shot was at 3:00 pm instead of 3:30 so i had to rush there, but i would have probably gone after rusty too.
Wanna come back and tell us why you and your team decided on it then?
Because I shot there too. I'm the vig.
youre claiming to have shot fingersplints?
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 8:22 pm
well w/e, i don't care if this dude wants to fish my role out. i CC vig. i did not shoot last night
you can go into anti-spew now
The general trend here is two-fold: SPF tends to town read Invictus while also continually examining Invictus. At face value I appreciate the latter, and it's what I'd expect of SPF (someone I consider to be one of the more conscientious solvers around) -- even with a read established, she isn't finished
establishing it. That makes it easier to forgive her read having been the wrong one.
Orange: This is a more charitable approach to Invictus than I'd like. This is a good thing for SPF to expand on if not already done -- what about the Invictus playstyle do you suppose would create this bias?
Yellow: I return to this, and the interaction of these two really boils down to the claim and counter-claim. Foremost: I have seen this before. SPF did something very similar to poor Mellow Ezlo in S7G6 when he fake claimed. From that perspective, I appreciate this moment -- particularly given that I was not in the game yet so it couldn't have been done to schmooze anyone from Game 6 who might remember that. Moreover, if we follow the progression of SPF's read and consider her as a teammate of Invictus, I struggle to make sense of why this would exist. She had given him town credit, so she has an out to at least
entertain the vigilante claim for a moment before just CCing him to oblivion. She didn't do that, to her credit. So if we want to call her his teammate, we're forced to dwell in a realm of pure wifom -- the two of them specifically planned this claim and counter for theater. That's not
impossible, but nor is it something that strikes me as the most likely scenario. I am not sure there's a good reason to say
that's what happened beyond pure conjecture.
~~~
Conclusion
What I like most here is that, while I am tempted to reduce the interaction to just the claim and counter alone, given this review I don't necessarily need to do so. The rest of it trends in a direction that I like anyway, so I don't find myself contending with some significant conflict that brings the wifom theory out to the forefront. I would be surprised if SPF is an Invictus teammate. Given that this read is inherently more wifom-driven than others, I always welcome discussion.
You seem to know. Do you know too much? You seem to know I'm town and that gavial's town. 
