The Syndicate

I'd like to know how the mafia team responded (if at all) behind the scenes to Epignosis and I ripping into each other all day, my furious insistence that he be destroyed, and then both of us completely dropping it out of nowhere and never revisiting it. That was fun.

By the way. Sloonei and I were teammates. You should have lynched us.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Jan 30, 2018 2:14 am nice work everyone. good work daisy. you had me doubting myself.

this game was cool cus i didn't have to do basically anything at all

Just be wary. Everyone knows your tell now.

Bummer on the conclusion, NVN. You played a strong indy game and surely came close considering how much I wanted to murder Marmot. It was a good first game playing with you.

*civilians carry FZ. on shoulders over the horizon chanting heroic poems*

Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Tue Jan 30, 2018 1:59 am A couple things I would like to say. First of all, I wrote my big posts and case against Jay before I knew my role. I was 100% certain that Jay was bad as I was catching up on the thread. I knew I was replacing, but I didn't know what my role or alignment was until when I was announced back in. I decided my best course of action was to play it just like I planned before I knew I was to be bad. So all my thoughts were my authentic civ thoughts at that point. Additionally, I had no idea my team had used my predecessor's role to force Dizzy to make a case until you saw me switch off Jay in the thread. I wasn't told and what I said about Epi mentioned a curse and so forth, also 100% truth. I say this because, dude I would never have gone after Jay if I had known so please don't judge my awful Day 2 play based on that. I swear I'm a better baddie than that.

Also, let me be perfectly clear. I consider it poor form to use your real life circumstances as a weapon to guilt or manipulate anyone. I was not ever doing that and the reaction you saw was authentic.

Anyway, well played civs, PoE does it again.

Hell, I thought your initial suspicion of me looked very authentic (and it was), and your turn back the other way when you discovered Dizzy's forced vote also looked authentic. Even if accidental, it wasn't a bad play! You were in a very difficult position as a replacement and you managed well under the circumstances.

Thanks for the game, DFaraday.

It was a fun one and my nerves were continually poked. I definitely didn't see Dizzy's death coming.

Good game, Daisy!

You played very well. Even if the last two day phases were dead quiet, I was never comfortable. I couldn't shake the feeling that we were choking this one away.

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Mon Jan 29, 2018 10:00 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Jan 29, 2018 9:55 pm I just scoured the posts of night killed players to find clues in case it's not Daisy. The best I've got would still be NVN with a roll of tinfoil in Kyle's lap.
Why is Marmot clear ?

I think FZ. had information in his favor (or information against Daisy or both). She couldn't say it outright, but there's no better reason she could have been so insistent in his defense. It'd also fit the [speculative] theory that she was Lazar Wolf and was killed when the ghost found her. That role can track on even nights and block on odd nights. It'd suggest either tracked Daisy into a kill or Marmot not into a kill when there's only one mafioso alive. It's possible she also blocked the Night 5 mafia kill (and she'd have targeted Daisy with that). That all depends upon her being Lazar Wolf though, which is an educated guess.

I just scoured the posts of night killed players to find clues in case it's not Daisy. The best I've got would still be NVN with a roll of tinfoil in Kyle's lap.

I've voted.

We should prepare for contingencies though just in case. The best alternative I have is still NVN. I'm going to trust FZ's strong endorsement of Marmot.

Reduce the POE pool to two and we should be okay (barring more skipped day phase or wrong lynch type b/s).

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon Jan 29, 2018 1:14 am Can we fast forward to post lynching Daisy then?

Whaddya think you'll do then?

I think the universe has accepted the outcome.

This is all highly speculative. There doesn't have to be a switch or extra votes. My working theory: if Dizzy had a punishment objective and failed to meet it (likely the day they voted for me), then the consequence was being lynched instead of whoever. That could be wrong too. Who knows.

Dizzy definitely had no votes this time anyway. I don't think any of this makes it more or less likely that Daisy is mafia-aligned. I still don't have a better name to offer given that Marmot appears to have been cleared.

Fair warning to all: if you don't have information, please don't give the impression that you do. If you feel I am talking to you here and you want to protest -- please just don't. Leave it alone. Keep it in mind if you don't have information and ignore me if you do.

I trust FZ and endorse the above.

Works for me.

I assume Dizzy was victimized in relation to the punishment he received back when he was voting for me. It just took a while.

No matter who lives beyond this night, stick together civilians.

What the fuck ever.

Marmot wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 12:33 am Doesn't really matter, but I will love my vote to the Dais.

Who is it if it isn't Daisy?

A potential scenario which would make NVN look worse:

The reason I thought he looked better was his apparent lack of knowledge of why Epignosis was asking for votes on himself. I'd assumed that to be driven by a punishment from This Guy. If it's instead driven by the ghost, then a mafia NVN can still have no idea why that was happening.

Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 12:01 am EBWOP: I wasn't based on your forced, sorry trying to sim at the same time.

If it's not Marmot, who do you suspect next?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 11:50 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 11:41 pm
Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 11:40 pm I think NVN is it.
Why?
Nobody else really fits the description, except maybe Marmot. But why is he self voting. Why dud Daisy vote Nut instead of LC/Lorab for cred?

That depends on the timing of her vote. I can't remember.

What do you think about FZ's handling of Marmot today?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 11:40 pm I think NVN is it.

Why?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 11:39 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 8:47 pm NVN, why did you move your vote?
Did he move it from Daisy?

Yes.

Daisy, who do you think it might be in the event that it isn't Marmot?

NVN, why did you move your vote?

Back to Daisy.

FZ. wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 7:19 pm @linki: It's not him

Please estimate your confidence in that on a 1-10 scale.

I'm voting Marmot. If he's the damned role then Daisy still leads.

FZ. wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 7:13 pm JJJ, let's say it's neither Marmot nor Daisy. Who would be your next pick?

New question:

If it's not Daisy, then is it Marmot?

FZ. wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 7:13 pm JJJ, let's say it's neither Marmot nor Daisy. Who would be your next pick?

As of right this instant I'd find myself drifting back in the direction of NVN.

I mean, he didn't just say "follow me". He quoted Dizzy who had mentioned getting a flip on Marmot, recommended a follow, and included the grin emoji. It's flippant.

Actually he ended Day 4 without votes too. So -3 at least and likely -4.

FZ. wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 7:02 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 6:57 pm Spacedaisy,

What do you think of the assertion that Marmot is the role which can earn -1 to its votes?
Have you looked at the votes prior to him asking to be lynched? Do you know how many -1 votes he received?

I don't think we have a Day 1 tally, so I can't be certain there. I don't believe he had a vote at the end of the day.

He ended Days 2 and 3 without votes, so that'd be a minimum of -2 and possibly -3.

I think it would be very irresponsible for the person with that role to ask to be lynched. If everyone obliges, the minus votes are irrelevant and it happens anyway. If he leads the tally by a little bit, someone else gets lynched with no greater chance of being a mafioso than in any direct lynching effort.

FZ. wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 7:06 pm In what sense do you mean? The fact that he's voting for himself?

Yes, that.

Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 6:59 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 6:53 pm What is the point of complaining about how "BS" FZ's reasons are when you don't think she is aligned with the mafia team? If you believe that she is doing her best to find the right lynch, then wouldn't it be prudent to approach her without all these "you're bullshitting" accusations? How does that even make sense?
I didn't say she is bullshitting, I said her reasons are BS. As in I find it personally offensive that I had a shit night and her response is to basically say I am lying to guilt people.

I don't think she implied that you were lying about having a shit night. It was put in this mafia game thread though which means it's open for assessment. You can be telling the truth and still benefit from it.

I certainly hope today is better for you. We're just trying to get this right.

FZ. wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 6:56 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 6:53 pm What is the point of complaining about how "BS" FZ's reasons are when you don't think she is aligned with the mafia team? If you believe that she is doing her best to find the right lynch, then wouldn't it be prudent to approach her without all these "you're bullshitting" accusations? How does that even make sense?
Okay, you said it better than I did.

What does the current tally mean to you if anything as it pertains to Marmot?

[mention]Spacedaisy[/mention],

What do you think of the assertion that Marmot is the role which can earn -1 to its votes?

What is the point of complaining about how "BS" FZ's reasons are when you don't think she is aligned with the mafia team? If you believe that she is doing her best to find the right lynch, then wouldn't it be prudent to approach her without all these "you're bullshitting" accusations? How does that even make sense?

This is the exchange that I thought looked good for Kyle:

Kylemii wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:36 am
Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:10 am
Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 8:16 pmLC picks out the specific part of my response that supports his point despite the fact that the part he cropped out makes his point of agreement less meaningful.
Looking back, that is true. It was unintentional - I like to cut down quotes to the part I'm responding to for easier reading, and I lost that relevant part and reacted to just my slice. Kyle said that it's 100% false before the part I analyzed.
It's alright.

FZ. wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 5:14 pm Does anyone know when DF usually gets here?

He's usually come around just prior to the deadline.

FZ. wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 4:49 pm RIP Sloonei. Sad to see you go Now the game will definitely get quieter.
Speaking of Sloonei, he went after Kyle for a long time. I forget, is there a reason we let Kyle off the hook other than our feelings that he was being genuine?

The main reason I have been looking elsewhere apart from his looking genuine was the early exchange he had with Long Con where LC smeared his responses to my fake tell. LC omitted a piece of Kyle's post to make it look worse, and Kyle responded in a way that looked like genuine discontent and not some fudged exchange.

It's also a bit tougher to hang the Sloonei kill on Kyle given that the previous kill was Epignosis -- someone who was strongly in Kyle's camp.

I voted Daisy.

[mention]DFaraday[/mention], did you mean to include Epignosis in the poll?

Kyle, you've been Johnny-on-the-spot at the end of the last few night phases. Time to investigate your "rip"s.

All this said, I don't want paranoia to take over the game. For now there's room and cause to stay the course.

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:31 am
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:28 am Whatever it is, there's reason to believe it also happened to Dyslexicon and it could as easily happen to any living player again in the following day phase. It looks like adhering to the requirements of these whatevers is very difficult to do, and the consequences of failure are severe.
Do you think they're all similar ? Or does This Guy come up with ones for each of his target ?

No clue. DFaraday may give the player a list of options to choose from. If they have total freedom to make things up, that'd be rather overpowered.

Whatever it is, there's reason to believe it also happened to Dyslexicon and it could as easily happen to any living player again in the following day phase. It looks like adhering to the requirements of these whatevers is very difficult to do, and the consequences of failure are severe.

Also, given that DFaraday confirmed that the ghost does not have to die for the civilians to win the game, we can assume that it isn't purely an evil entity. If its ability triggers a skipped day phase, then it's ability is purely pro-mafia and anti-civilian. I think it makes more sense to just assign that shit to the mafioso.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:22 am or NVN still. Is his "cleared" status altered at all by Epi dying? If I'm not mistaken, the crux of his townie status is that he did not appear to have been responsible for cursing Epi, but now it appears that Epi was tinkered with by the ghost if anything. Or am I missing something?

I have no idea why the ghost has to have anything to do with what happened to Epignosis. I have been attributing it to This Guy.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:22 am why can't it be daisy?

It can be. I wouldn't watch that "lynch Daisy" deadline pass feeling terribly comfortable though.

Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:03 am I've had a long and aggravating day and I am not in the mood for mafia tonight. Lynch me, I don't care. But maybe then you will finally listen to what I had to say and lynch Marmot next. I'm out for the night.

This does not inspire confidence on Daisy's side either.

Why does everyone keep throwing their arms up and quitting? If these are civilians we're going to lose the game.

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