The Syndicate

rundontwalk wrote: ↑Mon Mar 26, 2018 9:22 pm I'll play again soon that was fun

You like history, and I got history.

Right here

Unlikely to start for the next week at least.

The exercise's insight may have been specific to dunya. Epignosis and I were also oft-named, but entering the game that wasn't likely to surprise anyone. dunya though, despite having performed very well in her earliest games on this site, hasn't had enough time to generate much play-based reputation -- and she was still named more than either of us (or anyone else). I probably should have cared more, but yanno. Everything seems clear when the answers are revealed.

It was awesome having y'all around, RYM old timers. I hope you'll stick around a bit and play again, either immediately or soon. You elevate the game!

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:21 pm Jay, I believe in your thesis tbh. But we should stop giving people easy civ reads whenever they blow a thread. If it happens once a year, that's one game a year that civs are handing to baddies on a plate. It's too much.

I am sure I will be more vigilant moving forward, even if I am not truly sure I should be. It's a double-edged sword, because greater vigilance can often lead to greater paranoia, and then real civilians are wasting their time fielding stupid suspicions (or worse yet being lynched over them). Indeed that happens much more often than this happens, and I think it causes more civilian losses.

Nonetheless, I doubt I will maintain a perfectly Vulcan mindset. Getting one's ass kicked has an effect for better or for worse.

dunya was replaced because of an accidental blurt by me in a private conversation about my general Mafia experience in the present. I said something careless which in a vacuum could have affected her read on me in this game (even though she already knew I was a civilian mechanically), and I informed Jack of my oopsie. They decided on a replacement. I'm not sure that needed to happen, but it's my fault anyway.

Good game indeed to the whole Mafia squad. Y'all endured a lot of pressure, both in the words and in the votes, throughout the game. You squeaked by time and again, and that's the name of the mafia-aligned game. Nobody cares who suspected who. Just get to another day.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:15 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Mar 22, 2018 6:48 pm

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:54 pm @JaggedJimmyJay

Your thesis has been disproven.

It still hardly ever happens. I am unlikely to overhaul my perspective of the game of Mafia as a result of an outlier. I am already annoyed in advance at the tinfoil mislynches which will follow from this performance in future games. They're coming.

They should come. dunya belongs in the Epignosis pantheon of the "NEVER READ AS CIV" people.

I don't just mean mislynches of dunya.

I mean mislynches of numerous people who are playing their asses off. Nobody will care anymore.

It's coming.

BTW: I apologize to nobody. I was dead wrong about dunya, and I will accept the egg on my face for that.

Otherwise, I was mislynched for suspecting the rest of the mafia team.

In hindsight, I'd say the warning sign I should have given more attention was that it took dunya too long to acknowledge me as a civilian read. It's similar to the Sloonei dynamic wherein it tends to be a two-way when it's real.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:54 pm @JaggedJimmyJay

Your thesis has been disproven.

Nah. Nobody ever knows what my thesis is seemingly.

dunya and speedchuck both played wonderfully and they deserve a great deal of praise. dunya especially blew up this thread in a way I have never seen before, and it was probably the single best cycle of mafioso play I have observed as a player to this point. Awesome work, and from a player who has loneliness-and-cheesed in the past. Perhaps my theory in some capacity inspired the effort.

My thesis was never that this is impossible though. It was that it hardly ever happens.

It still hardly ever happens. I am unlikely to overhaul my perspective of the game of Mafia as a result of an outlier. I am already annoyed in advance at the tinfoil mislynches which will follow from this performance in future games. They're coming.

dunya is a very rare exception to a very reliable rule. And for that, she kicked my ass in this Mafia game. I tip the cap.

The replacement was never necessary though.

*fades into bolivian*

Yes. Today is a good day to die.

*dives on top in a speedo*

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:34 am Jay knows he's living, that's why he's still posting. He'll be like "oh yay you guys, sucks Iron Dwarf is a civ" and then nobody will vote for him tomorrow because reasons.

Mac, sometimes you say the silliest things. Never change.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:52 am God damn it I need closure.

Here’s a sneak peek:

I’m a civilian.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:30 pm It's good to see @ColinIsCool is still around watching the game. Sign up to another game Col.

He's ready to roll in the upcoming heist. Y'all should join him.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:15 pm yes? the way it was supposed to be would have resulted in no death if you were civ and 1 death if you were mafia. the current setup results in a death in all cases except the case where iron dwarf is mafia. my understanding and approval of the plan was dependant on you being the one in second place with the monk vote.

Okay, then if nobody dies the chance of Dwarf being a mafioso skyrockets.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:16 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:11 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:09 pm JJJ has until about Easter to give his legacy reads.

I already gave a pile of them. If you want specific reads substantiated more, say the names.

That was a joke on how long it takes to tabulate votes and stuff.

I know. I'm just inviting requests. Might as well.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:15 pm yes? the way it was supposed to be would have resulted in no death if you were civ and 1 death if you were mafia.

I don't follow.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:14 pm Good night.

Good night Dragon D. Luffy. It has been lovely playing in this Internet Mafia game with you tonight.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:11 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:09 pm DrWilgy, what was dunya's nefarious agenda?

Dunya was very controlling during the class selection and I'm unsure why. Dunya had also been confrontational in my attempts to catch up. I did notice further confrontational tendencies, but I wouldn't be able to quote them.

Controlling in what way, and why does that strike you as a problem?

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:09 pm JJJ has until about Easter to give his legacy reads.

I already gave a pile of them. If you want specific reads substantiated more, say the names.

[mention]DrWilgy[/mention], what was dunya's nefarious agenda?

Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:03 pm

gwilikers6 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:54 pm

Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:52 pm is the poll right? doesn't gwil have to be voting for jay? am I misunderstanding

It is 100% perfect the way it is now.

the way it is, jay dies unless iron dwarf is mafia, I thought the purpose of this plan was to do it the other way around, where Jay only dies if he's mafia

Jay living or dying right now depends only on whether or not it on dwarf is bad, it has nothing to do with his own alignment

Does it matter to you which way the plan functions?

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:02 pm I thought you thought I_D was bad?

I'm saying the deadline passed, though DDL disagreed. Who can tell.

If Dwarf is bad, hopefully he dies. I have no reason to give him civilian credit.

If you want anymore legacy snacks, request them now while I'm in purgatory.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:59 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:56 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:55 pm Tell me:

Which of your teammates did I bag before you?

Yes, you did it once. Congratulations, bravo.

It will remain once this time. I can understand why you'd overestimate your ability to read me with Mountains in mind. You'll learn.

Lynch this man.

I think they already did. Calm down.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:51 pm CFDs are cancer.

HOT POTATOES

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:55 pm Tell me:

Which of your teammates did I bag before you?

Yes, you did it once. Congratulations, bravo.

It will remain once this time. I can understand why you'd overestimate your ability to read me with Mountains in mind. You'll learn.

I also don't care for the late-arriving nutella wagon. Two of the three voters are non-civilian reads, and lapluie is still new to the thread at this point.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:49 pm ~ I think read this guy as a civilian, but he has nonetheless done what I perceive to be a lot of damage to the game. This is not some petulant gripe, this is serious: he has contributed to the worsening climate for dunya, who was an obvious civilian (speedchuck carries on that credit). He has been rigidly confident in his read on me without having lynched a separate mafioso first, meaning he thinks he can snag me without interactive clues. He still hasn't done shit with his exercise. These don't have to make him bad, but if y'all fail to press him on these issues and any other you identify, then you are asking for it.

Forgot to say his name. Epignosis.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:41 pm At this point we don't know which of you goes but it's time for you to say your last words in case it's you.

Any civilians who contributed to my destruction: I forgive you. You did what you thought was best to progress our team just like I have done, and I cannot fault you for being wrong. We all are most of the time.

Some base points:

~ Never lynch the following players: speedchuck, MacDougall, Dragon D. Luffy

~ These are civilian reads, though I would encourage vigilant investigation anyway: nutella, lapluie, Kylemii, gwilikers6, Kenway, Kites

~ I think he looks like a civilian, though my tinfoil is twitching: rundontwalk

~ I think read this guy as a civilian, but he has nonetheless done what I perceive to be a lot of damage to the game. This is not some petulant gripe, this is serious: he has contributed to the worsening climate for dunya, who was an obvious civilian (speedchuck carries on that credit). He has been rigidly confident in his read on me without having lynched a separate mafioso first, meaning he thinks he can snag me without interactive clues. He still hasn't done shit with his exercise. These don't have to make him bad, but if y'all fail to press him on these issues and any other you identify, then you are asking for it.

~ I have no reason to give any of these people civilian credit or otherwise have active suspicion of them: colonialbob, DrWilgy, Iron_Dwarf, Long Con, Marmot, sprityo, Quin

~ My top suspect is DrWilgy. Beyond the fake dunya crap, I also think he's by nature a high-chance don selection. Everybody loves Wilgy and would be pleased to have his unpredictable nonsense on their team with them.

~ USE YOUR DAMNED P.O.E. Make your cases and pursue them with fervor, but do not overestimate your own capacity to see through people. So far it hasn't gone well. Finding the first one is always the hardest part. Rely more on your civilian reads and work together.

By the way, I still think Wilgy's suspicion of dunya was 100% grade A fake.

AUBERGINE

[6] JaggedJimmyJay - Dragon D. Luffy, MacDougall, Epignosis, sprityo, Marmot, DrWilgy
[5] Iron_Dwarf - colonialbob, speedchuck, nutella, gwilikers6, JaggedJimmyJay
[1] sig - Kenway
[1] DrWilgy - Long Con
[3] nutella - Iron_Dwarf, Quin, lapluie
[1] rundontwalk - Kites
[1] gwilikers6 - rundontwalk

No vote:, Kylemii, sig

Pretty sure I'm up by one vote.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:35 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:18 pm

lapluie wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:16 pm Jjj is NOT mafia, he's even willing to die, this is insane

Neither are you. You're one of my strongest civilian reads. If I die, don't lynch lapluie.

Um no, if you die and flip civ she becomes a red skittle.

That's about how much people have listened to me so far, I guess. What do I know, I've played this game like three times.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:33 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:56 pm Don't let mafia tell you to keep the tie. Bury the mafia.

But they are both bad.

Lord I hope Dwarf is at least, or this game is going to careen out of control.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:32 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:08 pm Also Mac, I am literally calling for nobody to change their votes again in this phase. If the tally doesn't move a millimeter, it'd be PERFECT. I don't want people chopping and changing votes; that's the opposite of what I have called for.

Why did you reply to my initial post as though you were disputing my point if you agree with it!?

I replied to the end of it where you told me not to let someone engage in shenanigans and get away with it. I said not to let them do that. Anyone has the power to make the post: "why did you do that?"

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:25 pm If you are a civilian, you would have acknowledged that other forces are likely at work, and that a civilian could be lynched, nobody is cleared, and even worse, people may make untrue assumptions. You would not have conceded so easily that a tie is in the civilians' best interest.

No. One thing civilian JJJ doesn't give two shits about is pointless conjecture. You are making two bad decisions at the same time:

1. Read JJJ with iron confidence given an incorrect perception of how he'd play under whatever conditions.

2. Refuse to acknowledge the validity of a strategy because of conditions which have no objective existence in this game. They are cans and coulds. It's also possible one of the mafia members is a fig newton. Who cares.

Defend your logic if you want. You'll know soon enough at least that I really believe what I am saying to you. Nobody can tell me I didn't try.

This isn't some damned appeal. My biggest fear in this game is that Dwarf and I are both civilians, and that both of us are headed for a lynch over the next two days in whatever order. Gwilly's role presents an opportunity to prevent that eventuality while also allowing a mafioso to be lynched if one of us is it. Shit, if y'all prefer then we can switch it around so that gwilly votes for ME. I don't give a shit. It makes sense.

But what if the mafia team has X role...

lapluie wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:16 pm Jjj is NOT mafia, he's even willing to die, this is insane

Neither are you. You're one of my strongest civilian reads. If I die, don't lynch lapluie.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:15 pm I recognize the role.

It isn't the only role.

And you are acting like it is.

If the mafia team has some extra vote and they want to waste it on Day 3, then they be my guest.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:13 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:10 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:09 pm But JJJ, you think there's not a single behind-the-scenes vote out there?

I don't know. There could be. I have no reason to assume that. I don't have time for maybemongering.

Fuck your tie madness. That's what I do when I'm bad.

What you do when you're bad is this:

WEEEE TIES ARE FUN.

I am trying to use gwilly's role to its fullest potential. If y'all can't even recognize that opportunity then please bloody lynch me. Get me out of this headache.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:09 pm But JJJ, you think there's not a single behind-the-scenes vote out there?

I don't know. There could be. I have no reason to assume that. I don't have time for maybemongering.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:09 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:42 pm

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:40 pm Who do I vote for? My burning passion for Dunya has burnt out.

Did it ever really exist?

It did. I really felt like she had another agenda and was opposed to progression of townie thought.

Tell me about that agenda. What do you think she was after?

Also Mac, I am literally calling for nobody to change their votes again in this phase. If the tally doesn't move a millimeter, it'd be PERFECT. I don't want people chopping and changing votes; that's the opposite of what I have called for.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:04 pm Jimmy, are you saying that you'd rather an EOD with a game full of people chopping and changing their votes on a whim? We've just used an entire day's play, there are wagons, cases, rationalisations have been made. There were 2 full days before it. There is no fucking reason why anyone would have to wait until they have an epiphany with an hour to spare to change their vote. That is so pro-mafia it's ridiculous. Let's make the Mafia stand out like dogs balls to do what they have to do. Let's not allow for a thread environment that could allow the Mafia to "accidentally" mislynch a civ and not have to answer for it.

If someone fucks up the tie and y'all don't make them answer for it, that is not my fault. Maybe this will help with the stragglers you're terrified of:

KEEP THE TIE

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:56 pm Don't let mafia tell you to keep the tie. Bury the mafia.

If you're a civilian you have wasted so much of your own time. Jesus.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:57 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:56 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:53 pm Guys please. Can you just fucking pick who you think is a werewolf and vote for them and then stop with the shenanigans. You should all be policy lynched for this garbage.

What’s the problem? You either lynch a mafioso, or you eliminate one suspect while clearing another.

That’s not a bad situation.

So the mafia have absolutely no secret ability to affect the lynch vote total, you're saying?

I have no idea, and I am not going to base everything I do on these fucking maybes.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:53 pm Guys please. Can you just fucking pick who you think is a werewolf and vote for them and then stop with the shenanigans. You should all be policy lynched for this garbage.

What’s the problem? You either lynch a mafioso, or you eliminate one suspect while clearing another.

That’s not a bad situation.