The Syndicate

I left feeling that boo was town and was absolutely certain that nanook was town. But I also had mac and jack as my primary suspects. I think I could have caught wilgy with more time (drago’s response to my vote for him on Day 1 was wacky) but no one was ever touching the G.

G-man was in complete control of this game. I was quivering.

boo is the heavier tinfoil suspect of those three. I read him as town, but there's enough of an argument to the contrary that he's on my shortlist.

i'd shoot between jack, mac, and boo. I still think now's a good time for a trustfall. I'm out.

"Nanook has bussed before, therefore he is bussing now" is not a compelling argument.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:54 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:43 pm Mac told me I should know better than to town read nutella on Day 1.

Jack is telling me I should know better than to town read Nanook on Day 3.
False dichotomy. You're feeling too much pressure to justify your opinions. You're confirmed town you have the freedom to explore all angles here properly. You don't need to spend any time at all justifying your opinions, just entertain when they are objected to and look at new angles until you find the right one because you haven't yet I assure you.

This isn't a dichotomy. I'm not saying this to link the two of you together. I'm just observing that I've been told twice that my reads shouldn't be what they are. I was right in the first instance. This post is pure salt, not an accusation.

What has nanook done that is super scummy?
bearing in mind that this is nanook we're talking about.

Spoiler: show

Do these posts exist if the mafia team is wilgy/boo/drago?

Mac told me I should know better than to town read nutella on Day 1.

Jack is telling me I should know better than to town read Nanook on Day 3.

this phase ends in 20 minutes and i'm expiring with it. i'm not going to re-read 48 hours worth of posts. I'm just trying to offer what I can before the clock expires. If others look at what you're pointing to and agree with you, good. I'm not going to be around for that part though.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:33 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:23 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:10 pm I am comfortable removing nanook and johann from the POE outright. funnygurl and hyena are also town reads, but I'm open to arguments against them.
does anyone disapprove of this line of thinking?
I do.

You haven’t even looked at Nanook by your own admission because he shot Drago even though you just won a game because Nanook hard bussed your slot.

You know better.

Your other three clears are fine imo.

i don't think i won that game. i did not actually participate.

i'd need more than wifom to convince me that nanook is a worthy suspect.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:26 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:22 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:19 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:13 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:12 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:10 pm It's currently 8 vs 2, but I'm essentially already dead so it's really 7 vs 2. I believe that gives town a total of 2 mis-shots. A 4-person POE should solve the game.

I am comfortable removing nanook and johann from the POE outright. funnygurl and hyena are also town reads, but I'm open to arguments against them.

If we're comfortable taking those four out of the pool, though, then we just need to clear one of the following: G-man, wilgy, boo, mac, jack.

When I placed a doofus vote on wilgy Day 1, Drago came down hard on me. I'm not sure that happens if Wilgy is his partner.
You shouldn’t have trouble clearing me or GMan considering you seem to have just read the entire game.
Tell me why Jackofhearts2005 deserves to be cleared.
Read Day 2.

I have antialignment with your entire POE unless it’s me and GMan.
explain
Boo and Wilgy both want me dead.

Mac and me had a shitton if back and forth today and if you read it all as wolf theater, you need glasses.

what about g-man?

i don't think you and mac are incapable of hard distancing.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:10 pm I am comfortable removing nanook and johann from the POE outright. funnygurl and hyena are also town reads, but I'm open to arguments against them.

does anyone disapprove of this line of thinking?

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:19 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:13 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:12 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:10 pm It's currently 8 vs 2, but I'm essentially already dead so it's really 7 vs 2. I believe that gives town a total of 2 mis-shots. A 4-person POE should solve the game.

I am comfortable removing nanook and johann from the POE outright. funnygurl and hyena are also town reads, but I'm open to arguments against them.

If we're comfortable taking those four out of the pool, though, then we just need to clear one of the following: G-man, wilgy, boo, mac, jack.

When I placed a doofus vote on wilgy Day 1, Drago came down hard on me. I'm not sure that happens if Wilgy is his partner.
You shouldn’t have trouble clearing me or GMan considering you seem to have just read the entire game.
Tell me why Jackofhearts2005 deserves to be cleared.
Read Day 2.

I have antialignment with your entire POE unless it’s me and GMan.

explain

i'd say right now but i'm tired. do it after i'm gone, y'all.

I recommend doing a trustfall at some point.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:12 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:10 pm It's currently 8 vs 2, but I'm essentially already dead so it's really 7 vs 2. I believe that gives town a total of 2 mis-shots. A 4-person POE should solve the game.

I am comfortable removing nanook and johann from the POE outright. funnygurl and hyena are also town reads, but I'm open to arguments against them.

If we're comfortable taking those four out of the pool, though, then we just need to clear one of the following: G-man, wilgy, boo, mac, jack.

When I placed a doofus vote on wilgy Day 1, Drago came down hard on me. I'm not sure that happens if Wilgy is his partner.
You shouldn’t have trouble clearing me or GMan considering you seem to have just read the entire game.

Tell me why Jackofhearts2005 deserves to be cleared.

It's currently 8 vs 2, but I'm essentially already dead so it's really 7 vs 2. I believe that gives town a total of 2 mis-shots. A 4-person POE should solve the game.

I am comfortable removing nanook and johann from the POE outright. funnygurl and hyena are also town reads, but I'm open to arguments against them.

If we're comfortable taking those four out of the pool, though, then we just need to clear one of the following: G-man, wilgy, boo, mac, jack.

When I placed a doofus vote on wilgy Day 1, Drago came down hard on me. I'm not sure that happens if Wilgy is his partner.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 9:01 pm Jack whenever he’s suspected by lots of people: Pff. I can’t be scum because I obviously have no partners.

Consistent response: Oh, we’re hunting for a single wolf even though there are two.

who's bad?

it is true that i'm perfect, i won't argue their.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 8:52 pm Sounds like you just want to look at boo.

Fringe is a good show.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 8:49 pm Those were my explanations for not trusting her myself. They were not my arguments for why she shouldn't have the gun. You even quoted where I said that she wasn't getting the gun because nobody else trusts her. On day 1 I flip flopped on my Nutella read. I do that. In every game. That we play in. Ffs.

This is not my issue. My issue is that you argued against trusting nutella because it was too early to determine whether or not she was town, but it was evidently not too early to shoot her on suspicion of being mafia. The former implies we require more time to sort her out. The latter is a booming statement that we don't.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 8:48 pm I am suspected literally for the below reasons:

1. Jack talked me out of shooting him at the last minute with ATE.

Literally no.
2. Nutella provoked me a lot and I was tinfoiling the shit out of her and half the game wanted her shot so I changed my Jack shot to her instead without thinking on it much.[/quote]You shot nutella after saying it was too early to town read.

3. Dragomir (and probably the scum team more generally) didn't want Duskfall to have the gun and gave it to me instead and now I look guilty through Dragomir interactions.

Yeah.

I have no argument against the logic of the case frankly. I look bad. If I get shot so be it. But ONCE I DO if someone ANYONE doesn't re-read my posts through the lens of them being sincere I will be very upset.

I will endorse this. If Mac gets shot and flips town, please look at boo.
If mac gets shot and flips mafia, also look at boo. I wouldn't put it past him to bus his teammate hard if he think he's going down.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 8:43 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 8:40 pm I looked at Mac's recent posts to see where the smoking gun that points to boo is. I didn't find it. boo just kind of abruptly became the top suspect today.

I also still don't feel like mac has even come close to addressing my early concern about him:
Spoiler: show
Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu May 14, 2020 11:49 pm I also have genuine concerns about Mac's progression on nutella:
Spoiler: show
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:46 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:45 pm It is quite silly that anyone can look at nutella and not see an obvious civilian.
Nutella is too good of a player for this read and you know it.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:13 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:11 pm Nutella should still be the one we give the gun to, fwiw.
Nutella is incapable of projecting town strong enough day one for me to clear her. Shes too capable of her town range when wolf.

In time that changes. She makes herself obvious with results. Like you.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:34 pm Sloonei nutella isn't getting the gun because we're in a game with a lot of non regs and most of them don't trust and are triggered by her usual behaviours, just shouting about it isn't going to help. You had a chance to give me the gun because I had FG, Hyena, Dragomir etc. but frankly you blew it. Not me, you. You did this. And should be sad and ashamed of yourself.

He made all three of these posts to justify not letting her have the gun. She's too good of a player to have a read on this early, he insists. We can't trust her with the gun when it's entirely possible that he scum game is just a perfect reflection of her town game at this stage!

And that he decides to shoot that very same player on Night 1.

He repeatedly downplayed my calls for nutella to get the gun because she's too good of a player for anyone to have a clear sense of her alignment at that stage of the game. But then he goes ahead and shoots her anyway.

The nutella suspicion (in general) never made sense to me, and I'm beginning to think it was amplified by an opportunistic scum team.
Yeah and what were the names of the players that were pushing me to shoot Nutella?

I didn't say Nutella wasn't getting the gun because she's too good of a player you lightweight. I said she wasn't getting the gun because the players in this game that aren't used to her were triggered by her usual behaviour and she wasn't trusted enough so going that way was a waste of time trying to go that way. Notwithstanding that several people seemed to want her dead.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:46 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:45 pm It is quite silly that anyone can look at nutella and not see an obvious civilian.
Nutella is too good of a player for this read and you know it.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:13 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:11 pm Nutella should still be the one we give the gun to, fwiw.
Nutella is incapable of projecting town strong enough day one for me to clear her. Shes too capable of her town range when wolf.

In time that changes. She makes herself obvious with results. Like you.

Also I destroyed Boo to a degree few have ever been destroyed. You're being a tunneling lightweight. Get out of the tunnel lightweight.

[citation needed]

nanook, johann, funnygurl, and hyena are my top town reads. G-man and wilgy are not priority suspects either. I lean town on boo but don't want to tell others not to suspect him. If neither of Jack or Mac are bad then I will be surprised.

I looked at Mac's recent posts to see where the smoking gun that points to boo is. I didn't find it. boo just kind of abruptly became the top suspect today.

I also still don't feel like mac has even come close to addressing my early concern about him:

Spoiler: show

He repeatedly downplayed my calls for nutella to get the gun because she's too good of a player for anyone to have a clear sense of her alignment at that stage of the game. But then he goes ahead and shoots her anyway.

The nutella suspicion (in general) never made sense to me, and I'm beginning to think it was amplified by an opportunistic scum team.

Spoiler: show

Johann wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 8:25 pm
Johann wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 11:56 am
boo wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 11:53 am
Johann wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 11:42 am
boo wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 11:39 am
Johann wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 11:33 am
boo wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 11:32 am

TBD. Nanook had a list somewhere, someone in it. I'd like to think Mac and Jack are teammates, but it seems a bit too easy. I think it's probably only actually one of them, and the other is playing the other.
I can see Mac as scum more than Jack
Sell me that pitch by your words and not nanooks
I'm not really invested in you voting with me. Whichever one of them hatched this scheme doesn't expect you to be on my side of this, and even then, I still see being able to get the numbers to burn them on what they did here. So if you're more open-minded then they thought, it's still easier for me to show you that it's worth risking trusting me through my interactions with other people, not directly with you. You don't trust me. Fair enough. I've given you reason not to. So you're to tunneled on me to not be able to find a way to doubt anything I can tell you. If you have more specific questions I can try and help you get there that way, but I'm not going to be able to sell you on trusting me in the way you're asking here.
Listen here.

Those 2 have no influence on me what so ever, no one in this game does. I don't know any of you besides Dragomir. You maybe are my prime shot but i am not an idiot that will close them self in the shell and donkey it.

I am asking you a simple question. As someone who sees part of dougal that's scummy - why do YOU wanna kill him
The same reason anyone wants to kill anyone in mafia (well. usually, at least), I believe it's part of my win condition. I can see what Mac is trying to do here, but I think he misplayed, is mafia, and does not have the numbers to make his plan work. It could be close, but it's increasingly looking like it won't be. He's even lost you. Maybe not fully, but enough.
Ok
Listen here

Can you stop playing the victim for a second and answer in a simple manner - WHY DO YOU THINK DOUGALL IS SCUM.
I don't wanna hear stuff like " i can see what mac is trying to do here"
Like you have to have a reason , a reason you can put in words why is he scum. If you do put it in words or by god i will put a bullet in you

There is nothing in here that strikes me as "playing the victim." I think boo is explaining why he suspects Mac, in his own way (i've noted that boo's reads aren't always clearly stated, but I don't necessarily suspect him for that). When he says he "can see what Mac is doing", he means that as in he believes that he can see Mac manipulating the thread toward a certain end: that is why boo suspects mac. "Playing the victim" would imply that boo's attitude projects an air of persecution here, as though he feels you are unfairly questioning him, but I don't get that sense at all. I see him answering your questions in the way he's comfortable doing. This aligns with his general attitude throughout the game. His approach is unorthodox, but it's clearly stated.

Hyena wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 8:24 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 8:10 pm
Spoiler: show
boo wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 4:32 pm
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 4:24 pm So you think nutella specifically doesn’t want the gun D1 as scum.

Why?
She would want it as town, and make a pretty noticeable effort to form a base that townreads her and will vote for her. That lack of any effort at forming a base (and her explanation for it: Hyena and I suspecting her) is suspicious to me. Anyone town should be on a strong offensive, and that's what her offensive in this format is what I think we'd see. It isn't what I'm seeing from her, I'm seeing some posturing offense and way to much of a defensive mindset. It doesn't fit.
He eventually explains why he suspects nutella so firmly, but this doesn't really satisfy me. That doesn't necessarily mean I don't believe him, and I think I slapped a town read on him shortly after this post(?). My impression of this suspicion at the time was that boo was projecting a certain idea onto nutella, trying to make the piece fit into the hole. It didn't, but he was determined. I felt like there was sincerity in the effort.
So, this is the post and the reason why I both 1. townread him early, then 2. suspected him later on.

I made this entire argument by mself earlier that day. He -stole- it from me, and didn't even acknowledge or townread me for it. In fact, he later scumread me in spite of using my argument against Nutella.

Here are the posts where I made that same argument:

Hyena wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 11:32 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 10:57 pm I'm flattered

[VOTE: nanook] aubergine for now
Hey, wtf. I want to give YOU the gun. Are you afraid of getting the gun? Are you afraid of getting blood on your hands and looking scummy?

Hyena wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 10:39 am There's also the fact that Nutella didn't accept my vote on her? :P So yeah, she could be scum.

Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 5:38 pm I feel like Boo is expressing the same thing (the stuff about scum potentially being worried about getting the gun) I was trying to express earlier, except better.

Hypocrisy is a staple of the civilian playbook.

Johann wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 8:22 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 8:20 pm
Johann wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 8:16 pm @slooney

I asked boo to explain to me in simple terms why is dougall scum to him but he couldnt drop the victim mentality for one sec and kept saying some big words like.some politician
I do not see him playing the victim. Could you show me the post(s) you're talking about?
I am on mobile and i dont know how to ISO on it.

Yeah there's no direct ISO link on mobile for some reason. But leetic provided all the ISO links in the first post. here you go.

Johann wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 8:16 pm @slooney

I asked boo to explain to me in simple terms why is dougall scum to him but he couldnt drop the victim mentality for one sec and kept saying some big words like.some politician

I do not see him playing the victim. Could you show me the post(s) you're talking about?

I scanned G-man's posts and it does not look like his treatment of Drago was much different from his treatment of everyone else. My mild concern has turned even milder.

I'll try to remain focused on current events until the deadline now. Let's talk about the cases against boo.

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 8:00 pm also idfk what's wrong with flip flopping. at least i'm out here acknowledging that i've been wrong. consistent reads are for twg gods or ppl who are too bullheaded and end up wrong, or wolves

"Flip-flopping is bad" is a take that the entire mafia community needs to get rid of.

boo ISO

Spoiler: show

I've talked quite a lot about nutella in this game, and the way Day 1 unfolded. I was more vocally supportive of her than I ordinarily would be of anyone on Day 1 because A) I didn't have many reads at the time, but "nutella is town" was the strongest of the bunch and B) the widespread suspicion I saw against her seemed entirely misguided. People were hurling accusations at her for doing all of the things that make Civilian Nutella a great player. It was goofy.
As we've already seen Drago was a prominent member of the anti-nutella campaign, I've become even more wary of it in hindsight. But I also need to check that a little: It is unlikely that the mafia team alone would have launched a full assault on nutella like that. They would need to lean on some civilian support. boo was also a card-carrying member of the anti-nutella committee. I'm not sure how that reflects back on him just yet. But it originates with this post, which... has no substance whatsoever.

Spoiler: show

Places a vote on nutella and then quickly removes it. I don't know what's going on here. The premise of the initial vote is that boo wants mac shot. He backs off because nutella doesn't have any other votes? This is super early in the day. I don't understand what's going on in boo's head. This is the player who also criticized me for casting an "inconsequential" vote for wilgy for five minutes with an hour to go before the deadline. boo is an old school syndicat, and vote changes can be something of a devil for that crowd. I have as much first hand experience with that line of skepticism as anyone.

Spoiler: show

boo's next series of posts continue to stay focused on nutella. Now he wants to give hyena the gun so nutella can get shot. Okay. I remain thoroughly unclear on why nutella is even a suspect at this stage.

Spoiler: show

"I don't believe in townreading" is the most bizarro sentence I could read in a mafia game, but it is again something that makes sense coming from an old school syndicat (once upon a time we required players to survive to the end of the game to qualify for a win. civilians played the game more like independents than civilians, and publicly identifying other civilians was seen as giving the mafia team a roadmap to effective kills, and that old attitude still lingers for some). I think that philosophy could also go a long way to explain some of boo's more eyebrow-raising behavior. I am not looking to make excuses for boo or let him off too easily, but it is certainly not impossible to read an honest mindset in his posts.
Civilians win the game by cooperating.

Spoiler: show

boo wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:54 am
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 2:44 am
nutella wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 2:42 am
boo wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 8:00 am I got my PM and do not care when phases start/end.

Self-killing makes zero sense Johann.

We should give the gun to someone with a subset of players they're allowed to choose from to shoot.

If they go outside that, they got shot next.

I think it's better then deciding on a specific player because that keeps mafia from being able to control the conversation easily.

And at 13 players, 10/3 split... Assuming the gun always gets used (no ties, but in most cases that should be easy enough to avoid since we can hammer)... We can only afford like 4 gun uses on a civ? One or two more if we get 1 or 2 of the mafia mixed in with that? Right? It's too early for me to be mathing. But it's a general point.

Then once we have a baddie killed, players who had them in their subset but chose not to shoot them can be looked at more in depth. Plus that's a way to try and force the mafia into bussing if they do get the gun.
this is boo's first post and it's basically stating the obvious about how the game works. imo it's fluff

boo wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 8:55 pm
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 8:52 pm COMPROMISE is what makes this country GREAT, except when it’s MY IDEALS, in which case we must be UNCOMPROMISING in the face of ADVERSITY
something something towncore, something something if I get the gun I'll shoot you, something something casual mention of someone who hasn't even posted but I am saying is either 100% town or mafia. Actually, no. Strike that. They're the secret independent role that isn't stated in the roles. Probably? But I don't know, because reading host posts is apparently for nerds, so I haven't done that.
this is... what the actual fuck is this. this is a scum post 99% of the time it exists.
Wait, is this all you got against him?
Yes, because she's mafia and I'm an easy mis-shot, and she knows it and is going balls to the wall trying to make it happen because if she doesn't I'll be gunning for her until she gets shot and she knows it.

Again, this is not an unbelievable post for a civilian boo to make. I am unsure how much I want to read into Drago's stepping in on this matter; it reads more like an effort to discredit nutella than a defense of boo. boo is a consequential bystander. But my gut right now tells me this whole exchange is too over-the-top to be double-you/double-you. I've looked at this three times now and the needle is pointing toward a civilian boo.

Spoiler: show

... however, I continue to not know why any of boo's reads exist. The nutella suspicion seems to be the catalyst for everything else(?). He opposed giving duskfall the gun specifically because he calls nutella town. I assume that I am also on boo's shortlist because I was on nutella's side as well. But it's unclear where the nutella suspicion originated. If that read is the bedrock of boo's game, then it's shaky and elusive.

Spoiler: show

He eventually explains why he suspects nutella so firmly, but this doesn't really satisfy me. That doesn't necessarily mean I don't believe him, and I think I slapped a town read on him shortly after this post(?). My impression of this suspicion at the time was that boo was projecting a certain idea onto nutella, trying to make the piece fit into the hole. It didn't, but he was determined. I felt like there was sincerity in the effort.

Spoiler: show

I like posts like this. boo is careful not to have his suspicions misconstrued or conflated into anything they're not. I think it reflects a level of focus that is more likely to be prevalent in a civilian: "This is how I feel, and I want to make sure there are no mistakes about it."

Spoiler: show

I mentioned this post in the interactive ISO. It's probably my least favorite moment in the game for boo. To reiterate, he's said nothing about drago all game. When he's directly asked to provide a read, he stammers for a bit and ultimately says nothing.

Spoiler: show

But then posts like this keep me from scum-reading boo too hard. He is philosophically apart from everyone else in this game, but he is able to articulate his thoughts so clearly that I can't help but believe they are coming from an honest place. Everyone's questioning him all the time, but I never find myself raising my eyebrows once he's addressed the initial concerns.

Spoiler: show

Here's a lot of words that don't explain why Hyena is a suspect. This is another slight issue I have when I try to clear boo for myself: I understand him when he explain his philosophy, but I don't see the same clarity when he expresses his reads.

Nothing else really stands out to me from Day 3. Johann suggests that there is something bad in his exchange with boo during this phase, but I'm not sure I see it. [mention]Johann[/mention] care to talk some more about that? I would lean toward a town read on boo, but that's not set in stone.

Hyena wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 7:45 pm I'm okay with taking Wilgy out of the PoE now, I think.

X plane

I have seen nothing in here that would be out of bounds for the Macdougall that was my teammate in the GoC two months ago.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 7:34 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 7:32 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 7:28 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 6:55 pm Mac & Drago
Spoiler: show
MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 4:51 am I have gamesolve anyway.

boo - scum
Dragomir - town
DrWilgy - doesn't matter cuz my towncore is big enough
Duskfall - town
Funnygurl555 - scum
G-Man - doesn't matter cuz my towncore is big enough
Hyena - town
Jackofhearts2005 - doesn't matter cuz my towncore is big enough
Johann - doesn't matter cuz my towncore is big enough
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME - town
nutella - town
Sloonei - town

Shooting order:

FG > Boo > G-Man > Wilgy > Jack > Johann

Game winning POE already.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:10 am
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:06 am
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:21 am
I think they’re very smart and good people!
So GTH they're all town?
Do you think Nanook is a wolf?

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:20 am
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:10 am @MacDougall your Hyena scum read goes against my town read on her. Talk to me about your read.
Hyena seems aright it's just that FG/Hyena feel like teammates. The "oh revenge shoot lol" thing seems like bs. They went on about it too much. If FG flips town I'll probably drop the read entirely.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 6:49 am Dragomir just do your own work for now I don't care enough to explain myself.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:42 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:40 pm @MacDougall do you think Nutella is good or bad?
I think it would be foolhardy to give her a town read here but as of right now she is not someone I will shoot.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:52 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:51 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:49 pm

Move your vote to Dusk, and I will unvote myself and move to Dusk, too.
Nah. I like my Mac vote.
Hyena and Duskfall fear me having the gun. Funny.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:34 pm Sloonei nutella isn't getting the gun because we're in a game with a lot of non regs and most of them don't trust and are triggered by her usual behaviours, just shouting about it isn't going to help. You had a chance to give me the gun because I had FG, Hyena, Dragomir etc. but frankly you blew it. Not me, you. You did this. And should be sad and ashamed of yourself.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:06 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:06 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:05 pm It's false logic so it triggers me.
WTF did Boo and Dragomir do to you in scum chat?? Where is Mac?
What a strange and reachy horrible scummy post this is lol.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:13 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:11 pm
Duskfall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:10 pm Btw reversing my drago read good chance he's scum
Yeah I'm cool with this. Shoot Drago, Mac?
Dragomir was a big supporter of arming me. It'd take some convincing.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:18 pm
Duskfall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:18 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:16 pm

What was your read on him prior to EOD and did he know it?
I listed him in my top town 2 or 3 minutes before he cfded
Yeah ok Drago def on the shortlist.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:19 pm Btw nutella you stinking butt head. I AM reading the thread.

So far here's the score:

FG - Sus
Hyena - Sus
Nanook - Cleared
Johann - Cleared
Nutella - Sus

Still going.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:34 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 12:37 am
Hyena wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 4:22 pm I'm bored with the convo about Johann self-shooting. I'm so bored with it, I refuse to reread it and make reads from it.
Hyena is town. Lock it and throw the key away.
Say stuff about this

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 7:16 pm So basically here are my narrowed down options.

G-man - Not spicy but I think he's scum
Wilgy - Not spicy and I think he's town
Johann - Lil bit spicy and I think he's scum
Hyena - Spicy and I suspect
Dragomir - Spicy and I suspect
Jack - Flaming spice and I think he's scum

I have the shot submitted on Jack unless I have a change of heart.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:29 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:23 pm Johann, Nutella, and FG would be all shots I'd be fine with. I'd only shoot Jack after those three and G-Man.

I don't think I'd shoot Mac or Dusk ever. Nanook would be a SUPER spicy shot, especially considering that he's starting to trend into that tone territory where I get iffy about him, like I did in Corona Virus.
Talk to me more about Johann, as well as your Nanook read.

Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:23 pm I think I'd keep Sloonei around another day.
Why did you frame it like this, versus just town reading him? What is your reservation?

Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:25 pm Boo and Drago are no-gos for me right now. I'd never shoot them right now, but if I had to pick one to die over the other right now, it would always be Drago to shoot over Boo since I'm less sure about Drago. Boo just feels pure right now to me.
Why did you feel the need to pair these two off? Particularly why did you feel the need to go from no go-s to choosing between them? I don't understand your thought process here.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:46 pm boo - no
Dragomir - no
DrWilgy - no
Duskfall - ...
Funnygurl555 - no
G-Man - ...
Hyena - ...
Jackofhearts2005 - ...
Johann - ...
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME - ...
nutella - no
Sloonei - no

Duskfall... nah
G-man... nah
Wilgy... nah
Hyena ... nah
Johann maybe
Jack maybe
Nanook maybe... nah.

Kind of in two minds about Johann and Jack here.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sat May 16, 2020 11:43 pm I think I look worst here but that's because Dragomir did work to pocket me. I think there's a good chance the Johann case was just distancing. Dragomir didn't respond to it like a scum responds to a townie casing them.

Bit sus on his interactions with Boo and FG too. I'd focus on those three.

This is uninspiring. Mac suggests some suspicion of Drago while he's holding the gun, but I don't see much evidence that he's actively considering a shot in that direction. At one point he acknowldges a case against Drago and places him "on the shortlist", but then Mac's very next post is a general summary of players he has decisive thoughts on, and Drago is omitted. There's no sustained pressure on Drago from Mac on Day 2, or really any pressure at all. He made a quick point to downplay the associative reads between them, which is yuck. I still maintain a firm suspicion on Mac based on the entirety of his handling of nutella Day/Night 1. His interactions with Drago are not encouraging either. If I could get the gun, I'd probably shoot mac.
Fuck this nightmare. You were meant to join me not turn on me.
Join you in what? When did I turn on you? I've been consistently naming you as a suspect for a while. But I'm not getting the gun, so you don't need to worry too much about old sloon. Tell us who deserves to be shot instead of you and hope for the best.
Like come in and catch up and realise I'm the sane person and all my arguments against Boo were legit and back me up and shit gdi.

Sloobot malfunctioning. I can't play wolf like this Sloonei. I haven't managed a wolf game anything close to this in years. I've been nothing but honest and sincere. God's honest truth that is.

I haven't gotten to any of that yet. I am looking squarely at Days 1 & 2 and Dragomir interactions.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 7:28 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 6:55 pm Mac & Drago
Spoiler: show
MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 4:51 am I have gamesolve anyway.

boo - scum
Dragomir - town
DrWilgy - doesn't matter cuz my towncore is big enough
Duskfall - town
Funnygurl555 - scum
G-Man - doesn't matter cuz my towncore is big enough
Hyena - town
Jackofhearts2005 - doesn't matter cuz my towncore is big enough
Johann - doesn't matter cuz my towncore is big enough
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME - town
nutella - town
Sloonei - town

Shooting order:

FG > Boo > G-Man > Wilgy > Jack > Johann

Game winning POE already.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:10 am
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:06 am
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:21 am
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:09 am
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 12:49 am There are 162 posts and I have 37 of them ~22%), while that’s a terrible baseball record it is a pretty solid yards per carry

What a time to be alive
Hey, you have the most votes on the poll right now. What do you think about those voting for you?
I think they’re very smart and good people!
So GTH they're all town?
Do you think Nanook is a wolf?

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:20 am
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:10 am @MacDougall your Hyena scum read goes against my town read on her. Talk to me about your read.
Hyena seems aright it's just that FG/Hyena feel like teammates. The "oh revenge shoot lol" thing seems like bs. They went on about it too much. If FG flips town I'll probably drop the read entirely.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 6:49 am Dragomir just do your own work for now I don't care enough to explain myself.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:42 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:40 pm @MacDougall do you think Nutella is good or bad?
I think it would be foolhardy to give her a town read here but as of right now she is not someone I will shoot.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:52 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:51 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:49 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:48 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:46 pm Also, I don't like how the votes are tied again. That seems to keep happening in spite of me calling for people to avoid doing it.
Why don't you unvote yourself to make it not tied?
Move your vote to Dusk, and I will unvote myself and move to Dusk, too.
Nah. I like my Mac vote.
Hyena and Duskfall fear me having the gun. Funny.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:34 pm Sloonei nutella isn't getting the gun because we're in a game with a lot of non regs and most of them don't trust and are triggered by her usual behaviours, just shouting about it isn't going to help. You had a chance to give me the gun because I had FG, Hyena, Dragomir etc. but frankly you blew it. Not me, you. You did this. And should be sad and ashamed of yourself.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:06 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:06 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:05 pm It's false logic so it triggers me.
WTF did Boo and Dragomir do to you in scum chat?? Where is Mac?
What a strange and reachy horrible scummy post this is lol.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:13 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:11 pm
Duskfall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:10 pm Btw reversing my drago read good chance he's scum
Yeah I'm cool with this. Shoot Drago, Mac?
Dragomir was a big supporter of arming me. It'd take some convincing.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:18 pm
Duskfall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:18 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:16 pm
Duskfall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:15 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:13 pm

Dragomir was a big supporter of arming me. It'd take some convincing.
He risked tying the vote and giving town no gun to make sure I didn't get the gun, I'm his top townread. Regardless of you Vs me wanting the gun aside, why the hell would a town player risk the tie here last minute to take the gun out of your top towns hand? Even if he thinks you are slightly better with the gun I should be a nearly perfect to get the gun he should never CFD off me last minute
What was your read on him prior to EOD and did he know it?
I listed him in my top town 2 or 3 minutes before he cfded
Yeah ok Drago def on the shortlist.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:19 pm Btw nutella you stinking butt head. I AM reading the thread.

So far here's the score:

FG - Sus
Hyena - Sus
Nanook - Cleared
Johann - Cleared
Nutella - Sus

Still going.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:34 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 12:37 am
Hyena wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 4:22 pm I'm bored with the convo about Johann self-shooting. I'm so bored with it, I refuse to reread it and make reads from it.
Hyena is town. Lock it and throw the key away.
Say stuff about this

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 7:16 pm So basically here are my narrowed down options.

G-man - Not spicy but I think he's scum
Wilgy - Not spicy and I think he's town
Johann - Lil bit spicy and I think he's scum
Hyena - Spicy and I suspect
Dragomir - Spicy and I suspect
Jack - Flaming spice and I think he's scum

I have the shot submitted on Jack unless I have a change of heart.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:29 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:23 pm Johann, Nutella, and FG would be all shots I'd be fine with. I'd only shoot Jack after those three and G-Man.

I don't think I'd shoot Mac or Dusk ever. Nanook would be a SUPER spicy shot, especially considering that he's starting to trend into that tone territory where I get iffy about him, like I did in Corona Virus.
Talk to me more about Johann, as well as your Nanook read.

Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:23 pm I think I'd keep Sloonei around another day.
Why did you frame it like this, versus just town reading him? What is your reservation?

Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:25 pm Boo and Drago are no-gos for me right now. I'd never shoot them right now, but if I had to pick one to die over the other right now, it would always be Drago to shoot over Boo since I'm less sure about Drago. Boo just feels pure right now to me.
Why did you feel the need to pair these two off? Particularly why did you feel the need to go from no go-s to choosing between them? I don't understand your thought process here.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:46 pm boo - no
Dragomir - no
DrWilgy - no
Duskfall - ...
Funnygurl555 - no
G-Man - ...
Hyena - ...
Jackofhearts2005 - ...
Johann - ...
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME - ...
nutella - no
Sloonei - no

Duskfall... nah
G-man... nah
Wilgy... nah
Hyena ... nah
Johann maybe
Jack maybe
Nanook maybe... nah.

Kind of in two minds about Johann and Jack here.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sat May 16, 2020 11:43 pm I think I look worst here but that's because Dragomir did work to pocket me. I think there's a good chance the Johann case was just distancing. Dragomir didn't respond to it like a scum responds to a townie casing them.

Bit sus on his interactions with Boo and FG too. I'd focus on those three.

This is uninspiring. Mac suggests some suspicion of Drago while he's holding the gun, but I don't see much evidence that he's actively considering a shot in that direction. At one point he acknowldges a case against Drago and places him "on the shortlist", but then Mac's very next post is a general summary of players he has decisive thoughts on, and Drago is omitted. There's no sustained pressure on Drago from Mac on Day 2, or really any pressure at all. He made a quick point to downplay the associative reads between them, which is yuck. I still maintain a firm suspicion on Mac based on the entirety of his handling of nutella Day/Night 1. His interactions with Drago are not encouraging either. If I could get the gun, I'd probably shoot mac.
Fuck this nightmare. You were meant to join me not turn on me.

Join you in what? When did I turn on you? I've been consistently naming you as a suspect for a while. But I'm not getting the gun, so you don't need to worry too much about old sloon. Tell us who deserves to be shot instead of you and hope for the best.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 7:02 pm Is that all of them?

Talk to me. What's our line? Jack is my proffered shot but I haven't fully read for the past cycle and a half.

I should note that I've also lost a bit of my feel for this game over the last few real time days. Too much else going on in my life right now. But based on the isolated view around drago, Jack and Mac are easily in the lead for shot candidacy.

But in saying that I want to note that I was the fourth person to vote for Johann in the current poll. Before me were johann himself, accompanied by... Jack and Mac. It's not outrageous to believe that one or two scum players would opt to vote for johann at this stage: given his drago interactions, he's the most obvious candidate on the poll. If you're drago's partner, you vote there and hope he can be convinced to vote for somebody else.

I'm going to ISO boo and G-man next to see what that turns up.

Mac, Jack, G-man, and boo are the players I'd be most inclined to suspect in that order right now.

wilgy is an enigma. linki: speak of the devil

I'm not interested in ISOing nanook because he's got more posts than anyone and he's the one who shot drago. I don't care about playing the wifom game with that at this stage. nanook killed a bad guy. nanook is good.

Mac & Drago

Spoiler: show

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 4:51 am I have gamesolve anyway.

boo - scum
Dragomir - town
DrWilgy - doesn't matter cuz my towncore is big enough
Duskfall - town
Funnygurl555 - scum
G-Man - doesn't matter cuz my towncore is big enough
Hyena - town
Jackofhearts2005 - doesn't matter cuz my towncore is big enough
Johann - doesn't matter cuz my towncore is big enough
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME - town
nutella - town
Sloonei - town

Shooting order:

FG > Boo > G-Man > Wilgy > Jack > Johann

Game winning POE already.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:10 am
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:06 am
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:21 am
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:09 am
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 12:49 am There are 162 posts and I have 37 of them ~22%), while that’s a terrible baseball record it is a pretty solid yards per carry

What a time to be alive
Hey, you have the most votes on the poll right now. What do you think about those voting for you?
I think they’re very smart and good people!
So GTH they're all town?
Do you think Nanook is a wolf?

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:20 am
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:10 am @MacDougall your Hyena scum read goes against my town read on her. Talk to me about your read.
Hyena seems aright it's just that FG/Hyena feel like teammates. The "oh revenge shoot lol" thing seems like bs. They went on about it too much. If FG flips town I'll probably drop the read entirely.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 6:49 am Dragomir just do your own work for now I don't care enough to explain myself.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:42 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:40 pm @MacDougall do you think Nutella is good or bad?
I think it would be foolhardy to give her a town read here but as of right now she is not someone I will shoot.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:52 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:51 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:49 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:48 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:46 pm Also, I don't like how the votes are tied again. That seems to keep happening in spite of me calling for people to avoid doing it.
Why don't you unvote yourself to make it not tied?
Move your vote to Dusk, and I will unvote myself and move to Dusk, too.
Nah. I like my Mac vote.
Hyena and Duskfall fear me having the gun. Funny.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:34 pm Sloonei nutella isn't getting the gun because we're in a game with a lot of non regs and most of them don't trust and are triggered by her usual behaviours, just shouting about it isn't going to help. You had a chance to give me the gun because I had FG, Hyena, Dragomir etc. but frankly you blew it. Not me, you. You did this. And should be sad and ashamed of yourself.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:06 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:06 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:05 pm It's false logic so it triggers me.
WTF did Boo and Dragomir do to you in scum chat?? Where is Mac?
What a strange and reachy horrible scummy post this is lol.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:13 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:11 pm
Duskfall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:10 pm Btw reversing my drago read good chance he's scum
Yeah I'm cool with this. Shoot Drago, Mac?
Dragomir was a big supporter of arming me. It'd take some convincing.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:18 pm
Duskfall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:18 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:16 pm
Duskfall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:15 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:13 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:11 pm
Duskfall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:10 pm Btw reversing my drago read good chance he's scum
Yeah I'm cool with this. Shoot Drago, Mac?
Dragomir was a big supporter of arming me. It'd take some convincing.
He risked tying the vote and giving town no gun to make sure I didn't get the gun, I'm his top townread. Regardless of you Vs me wanting the gun aside, why the hell would a town player risk the tie here last minute to take the gun out of your top towns hand? Even if he thinks you are slightly better with the gun I should be a nearly perfect to get the gun he should never CFD off me last minute
What was your read on him prior to EOD and did he know it?
I listed him in my top town 2 or 3 minutes before he cfded
Yeah ok Drago def on the shortlist.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:19 pm Btw nutella you stinking butt head. I AM reading the thread.

So far here's the score:

FG - Sus
Hyena - Sus
Nanook - Cleared
Johann - Cleared
Nutella - Sus

Still going.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:34 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 12:37 am
Hyena wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 4:22 pm I'm bored with the convo about Johann self-shooting. I'm so bored with it, I refuse to reread it and make reads from it.
Hyena is town. Lock it and throw the key away.
Say stuff about this

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 7:16 pm So basically here are my narrowed down options.

G-man - Not spicy but I think he's scum
Wilgy - Not spicy and I think he's town
Johann - Lil bit spicy and I think he's scum
Hyena - Spicy and I suspect
Dragomir - Spicy and I suspect
Jack - Flaming spice and I think he's scum

I have the shot submitted on Jack unless I have a change of heart.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:29 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:23 pm Johann, Nutella, and FG would be all shots I'd be fine with. I'd only shoot Jack after those three and G-Man.

I don't think I'd shoot Mac or Dusk ever. Nanook would be a SUPER spicy shot, especially considering that he's starting to trend into that tone territory where I get iffy about him, like I did in Corona Virus.
Talk to me more about Johann, as well as your Nanook read.

Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:23 pm I think I'd keep Sloonei around another day.
Why did you frame it like this, versus just town reading him? What is your reservation?

Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:25 pm Boo and Drago are no-gos for me right now. I'd never shoot them right now, but if I had to pick one to die over the other right now, it would always be Drago to shoot over Boo since I'm less sure about Drago. Boo just feels pure right now to me.
Why did you feel the need to pair these two off? Particularly why did you feel the need to go from no go-s to choosing between them? I don't understand your thought process here.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:46 pm boo - no
Dragomir - no
DrWilgy - no
Duskfall - ...
Funnygurl555 - no
G-Man - ...
Hyena - ...
Jackofhearts2005 - ...
Johann - ...
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME - ...
nutella - no
Sloonei - no

Duskfall... nah
G-man... nah
Wilgy... nah
Hyena ... nah
Johann maybe
Jack maybe
Nanook maybe... nah.

Kind of in two minds about Johann and Jack here.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sat May 16, 2020 11:43 pm I think I look worst here but that's because Dragomir did work to pocket me. I think there's a good chance the Johann case was just distancing. Dragomir didn't respond to it like a scum responds to a townie casing them.

Bit sus on his interactions with Boo and FG too. I'd focus on those three.

This is uninspiring. Mac suggests some suspicion of Drago while he's holding the gun, but I don't see much evidence that he's actively considering a shot in that direction. At one point he acknowldges a case against Drago and places him "on the shortlist", but then Mac's very next post is a general summary of players he has decisive thoughts on, and Drago is omitted. There's no sustained pressure on Drago from Mac on Day 2, or really any pressure at all. He made a quick point to downplay the associative reads between them, which is yuck. I still maintain a firm suspicion on Mac based on the entirety of his handling of nutella Day/Night 1. His interactions with Drago are not encouraging either. If I could get the gun, I'd probably shoot mac.

Johann and Drago

Spoiler: show

Johann wrote: ↑Thu May 14, 2020 5:06 pm Drago is scum
60:40 on hyena

Why poison dusk should be our question to answer.
Is it bcs he correctly guessed who is mafia or they wanna frame.

@Duskfall who is scum to you?

Johann wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 4:07 am Shoot Drago then me, but shoot Drago first

Gman is a fed up townie
Hyena is a tryhard
Nanook is powering but in a genuine way

Johann wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 4:43 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 4:18 am
Johann wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 4:07 am Shoot Drago then me, but shoot Drago first

Gman is a fed up townie
Hyena is a tryhard
Nanook is powering but in a genuine way
Why would you want to get shot?
Cause people say they wanna shoot me. Shoot Drago first then do w/e you want with me

Johann wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 4:58 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 4:49 am
Johann wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 4:43 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 4:18 am
Johann wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 4:07 am Shoot Drago then me, but shoot Drago first

Gman is a fed up townie
Hyena is a tryhard
Nanook is powering but in a genuine way
Why would you want to get shot?
Cause people say they wanna shoot me. Shoot Drago first then do w/e you want with me
Talk some more about Drago. I have no idea why you think he deserves to get shot as well.
Cause we play on the same forum and he is sheeping a lot. Drago town i know leads a lot. Tries to get opinions and stuff. Not just bluntly say shoot X Y Z

Johann wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 8:13 am
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 8:07 am You don’t have to know exactly which ones, just how many you think are there
2 for sure
Drago - Hyena

3rd is unknowm

Johann wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 9:04 am
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 8:20 am Ok-why?
Drago i already explained
Hyena seems as a try hard. Idk its a gut feeling. I am a good scum player and i can smell other scum. He smells scummy. I can iso some posts later.

He also put me in his scum read without even pushing for me or explaining

Johann wrote: ↑Sun May 17, 2020 8:41 am Dougall if you think Hyena is town bcs he shares same scum views as you ( and mind you so do i ) why is he town and i am not? In fact i think i am superior to hyena in every aspect

Hyena said drago is scum BUT NEVER PUSHED for Dragos death. I pushed for Drago death entire D2 but hyena never did so except saying ye i think drago is scum and he needs to die when asked by nanook

Hyena has been smoke with no fire so far and i just cant see him as town

If you will say i bussed Drago why not say same shit to Hyena then?

I just find it beyond funny how Hyena who never had anything of substance and didnt even push for Dragos death is somehow a more townie than me who pushed on Drago sincr d2 started and called for his death on every occasion.

If you will hold me as null then hold Hyena for the same shit if not less. It is not consistent at all

This is strong. Johann develops a suspicion on Drago and doesn't relinquish. Johann should never be shot. Johann should get to shoot.
[VOTE: Johann] aubergine

Jack & Drago

Spoiler: show

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:48 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 3:03 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:42 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:41 pm @Hyena if you get the gun, will you shoot Nutella?
Most likely, yeah.
Good shit. Everyone, give Hyena the gun.
This reads townie independent of Nutella's alignment. Moreso if Hyena is town.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 8:14 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 8:07 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:48 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 3:03 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:42 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:41 pm @Hyena if you get the gun, will you shoot Nutella?
Most likely, yeah.
Good shit. Everyone, give Hyena the gun.
This reads townie independent of Nutella's alignment. Moreso if Hyena is town.
Why? What about that post is good?
Seems to be the kinda thing a town player would say.

I’m kinda down with Nutella getting shot cause if she’s a wolf, I’ll take credit and if she’s town, I can say it isn’t my fault.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:40 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:32 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:17 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:00 pm @boo
@Dragomir
@DrWilgy
@Duskfall
@Funnygurl555
@G-Man
@Hyena
@Jackofhearts2005
@Johann
@MacDougall
@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
@nutella
@Sloonei

The gun has been given to MacDougall! During this night, he can privately submit the name of one person to kill. N1 begins now and lasts for 24 hours.
Lol who’s bright idea was that?
It was Mac's.
Figures.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 12:51 pm Skimming Dusk's iso, I think he was poisoned for being a consensus townread, not for having particularly scary reads since he was mostly after Hyena and Nutella and not even that harshly. Pushes my Hyena read south slightly all the same.

So here is our player list with players I have a reason to townread besides "Idk they feel pretty townie" (ie Hyena and Nanook) are crossed out

boo
Dragomir
DrWilgy
Duskfall
Funnygurl555
G-Man
Hyena
Jackofhearts2005
Johann
MacDougall
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
Sloonei

So let's look at...

boo
DrWilgy
Funnygurl555
Hyena
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
Sloonei

Those first three.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 5:44 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 5:34 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 10:32 pm Alright, so now that Nutella has flipped town, I think my shot list is going to be {G-Man, Dragomir, Jack}. Those were the three that supported giving me the gun after I announced the I would always shoot Nutella if I had gotten the gun. I think Sloonei rises to my townleans. Boo remains there. Mac is in my townreads now -- his emotional reaction at SoD kinda sealed it for me.
Here is my current reason for G-Man, Drago, and Jack.
Surely at least one of those reads has evolved past this point, right?

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat May 16, 2020 3:21 pm @NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME

I'm basically with you on Wilgy and Mac. I'm not in the same place with you on Sloon, GMan or Johann but I'm of the same opinion that none of them should be shot today.

Tell me what you got out of my interactions with Boo yesterday?

Talk to me about FG, Drago and Hyena. What is the most compelling reason to kill and not kill each of them?

This is weak. Jack plops a lazy town read on Drago immediately and never looks back. Jack can get shot.

Hyena & Drago

Spoiler: show

Hyena wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 1:59 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 1:55 pm Anyway, of the people in the towncore, I'd probably shoot Nutella first? And then of the people who pushed back against the towncore, I'd probably shoot Funny first.
And, just to make things complete, of the people who weren't involved at all {Boo, Dragomir, DrWilgy, G-Man, Mac, Sloonei}, I'd probably shoot Sloonei first with the caveat that I haven't really evaluated Dragomir yet.

Hyena wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:42 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:41 pm @Hyena if you get the gun, will you shoot Nutella?
Most likely, yeah.

Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 2:52 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 8:25 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 8:14 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 12:47 pm Nutella is scum, who's with me?
Explain this read, Mr. O'mir.
Let's trade. Give me your reasons on FG, and I'll give you mine on Nut.
Did you ever give yours on Nut? :P

Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:41 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:40 pm @MacDougall do you think Nutella is good or bad?
Drago, why did you move your vote to Mac?

Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:49 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:48 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:46 pm Also, I don't like how the votes are tied again. That seems to keep happening in spite of me calling for people to avoid doing it.
Why don't you unvote yourself to make it not tied?
Move your vote to Dusk, and I will unvote myself and move to Dusk, too.

Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:49 pm Drago, who would you be willing to move your vote to right now?

Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:51 pm @MacDougall @Dragomir

PUT YOUR VOTES ON ME!!! WE CAN DO THIS!!!

Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:52 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:51 pm Wait, no. I won't vote for you Hyena. Actually, I won't change my vote at all.
WTF

Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:43 pm For Boo and Drago, I am townreading one more than the other (Boo in this case), and that's just how I wanted to express that. Like, if I had to lose one of them, I'd be more willing to lose Drago then Boo, since I'm less sure about Drago.

Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:54 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:54 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:52 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:51 pm Wait, no. I won't vote for you Hyena. Actually, I won't change my vote at all.
WTF
We have 8 minutes left. Voting for you will tie the wagons meaning nobody will get the gun, which is made even worse since I town read both you and Dusk. So I'm just going to leave my vote on Mac. No point in changing.
Mac will give me the gun though. I need you to put me at five votes first, though.

Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:25 pm Boo and Drago are no-gos for me right now. I'd never shoot them right now, but if I had to pick one to die over the other right now, it would always be Drago to shoot over Boo since I'm less sure about Drago. Boo just feels pure right now to me.

Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 10:32 pm Alright, so now that Nutella has flipped town, I think my shot list is going to be {G-Man, Dragomir, Jack}. Those were the three that supported giving me the gun after I announced the I would always shoot Nutella if I had gotten the gun. I think Sloonei rises to my townleans. Boo remains there. Mac is in my townreads now -- his emotional reaction at SoD kinda sealed it for me.

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu May 14, 2020 11:41 am
DrWilgy wrote: ↑Thu May 14, 2020 8:46 am
Hyena wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 10:32 pm Alright, so now that Nutella has flipped town, I think my shot list is going to be {G-Man, Dragomir, Jack}. Those were the three that supported giving me the gun after I announced the I would always shoot Nutella if I had gotten the gun. I think Sloonei rises to my townleans. Boo remains there. Mac is in my townreads now -- his emotional reaction at SoD kinda sealed it for me.
Do you have reference to this event?

I agree with you on Mac.
Yeah. Drago's was the most explicit of the three:
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 3:03 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:42 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:41 pm @Hyena if you get the gun, will you shoot Nutella?
Most likely, yeah.
Good shit. Everyone, give Hyena the gun.
Jack's was less explicit, but I felt like he joined in on the support for similar reasons:
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 8:14 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 8:07 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 5:48 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 3:03 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:42 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon May 11, 2020 2:41 pm @Hyena if you get the gun, will you shoot Nutella?
Most likely, yeah.
Good shit. Everyone, give Hyena the gun.
This reads townie independent of Nutella's alignment. Moreso if Hyena is town.
Why? What about that post is good?
Seems to be the kinda thing a town player would say.

I’m kinda down with Nutella getting shot cause if she’s a wolf, I’ll take credit and if she’s town, I can say it isn’t my fault.
After rereading G-Man's ISO, I kinda believe him that he didn't join because I said I'd shoot Nutella. He made no mention of Nutella whenever he voted me, and he also mentioned that he'd prefer either of me or Mac getting the gun, not just me.

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu May 14, 2020 11:45 am
Dragomir wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 11:49 pm [VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

Dragomir wrote: ↑Thu May 14, 2020 12:38 am @NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME why should I trust you?
Why did you vote Nanook first here before asking him why you should trust him?

The reason I ask is that I recall Nanook specifically making this post concerning you --

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 9:42 pm I wouldn’t shoot FG fwiw, I don’t know what it is but I like her tone

I wouldn’t shoot drago maybe ever

I’d probably shoot hyena tho
-- and I get the feeling you placed your vote on him for that very reason.

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu May 14, 2020 9:57 pm Okay, so, I think this is where where I am as far as reads go at the moment:

Me
Dusk
Boo

Mac
Nanook

Funny
G-Man

Jack
Johann
Dragomir

Summary:
Funny has risen out of my scumpile and has settled into null territory, mostly because I'm now a little more suspicious of Jack and Dragomir -- especially Dragomir. G-Man has sunk to null territory, too, because I'm feeling better about Mac and Nanook now. Dusk is confirmed town, and Boo remains my strongest townread.

Hyena wrote: ↑Sat May 16, 2020 2:51 am
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sat May 16, 2020 2:47 am What I’d like to get from everyone is two people you would shoot and two people you would not. Doesn’t have to be ranked 1/2, I don’t care. Just give me two names on either end.
I would NOT shoot G-Man or Funny.
I WOULD shoot Dragomir or Boo.

The EoD1 kerfuffle where Drago and Hyena argued about vote placements does not look like the sort of thing two teammates would do. On top of that, I think Hyena's progression on Drago, from an early town read to a strong suspect based on nutella's flip, looks authentic. I'm comfortable calling Hyena a townread based on these interactions.
This calls into question boo's read that "one of Mac or Hyena" is scum based on Drago's flip. I'd have to ask what he sees in Hyena that indicates an alignment with Drago.

G-man & Drago

Spoiler: show

G-Man wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 12:39 am Qualified list of who I am willing to vote for as of this moment (caught up btw). All names are in alphabetical order because it's too early to try to rank anyone yet:

Would Vote to Give the Gun to Them:
-boo: He has a very logical way about him. I like it and I agree with much of what he has said as far as his opinions on mechanics, strategy, etc go.
-G-Man: He knows that gun control means using both hands.
-Hyena: New-to-me player, but I like what I see so far.
-Jack: Normally Jack's confidence/arrogance irks me a little. His 'Big-Brain' concept makes sense though. THis probably means I am misreading him and he needs to die though.
-MacDougall: He forgot that the sign-ups specified the number of baddies. That's a civ-look for him. I also want to see what the new-to-me folks think/do when Mac does whatever he wants with the gun.

Might Consider Voting For Them:
-Duskfall: The black text was irksome. Thank you for reversing course. He got sucked into side banter with new-to-me folk that did nothing to help me get to know him. I do approve of the TMNT avatar, however Raphael was better.
-Nanook: Also got dragged into choppy off-topic banter. (We have OT green for this) His saving grace right now is the point about not going into the night with just one target in mind.

Would Not Vote for Them:
Dragomir: For agreeing with Johann's idea about self-killing.
Funnygurl: For agreeing with Johann's idea about self-killing.
Johann: For proposing the self-killing idea.

Need More Input/Need to ISO:
-DrWilgy
-nutella
-Sloonei

G-Man wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:30 am
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 2:25 am I like G-man. I'ma put a good read on him.
Why?

G-Man wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 10:53 pm -Dragomir feels like a flat character that keeps popping up in a story full of three-dimensional characters. Is that normal for him? I see Johann says that Dragomir likes to lead, so is his play contradictory of that tendency in a bad way?

G-Man wrote: ↑Sat May 16, 2020 7:46 pm Quills in my hot wings! The horror.

More observations through EoD for Day 2. People are listed in the order I first found something worth jotting a note about.

-Dragomir says he doesn't lead anymore. Hmm. Staccato answers to Sloonei until pressed for more of a response. Called sheepy by Johann, but is there evidence of that?

G-Man wrote: ↑Sat May 16, 2020 8:39 pm
-Hyena: Lots of talking. Also a lot of responses and remarks to Nanook. I can see this as nervous chatter designed to portray himself as engaged and trying to help Nanook. Does anyone know if Hyena becomes a nervous talker either way when he's in the spotlight? He proposes shooting Dragomir and Boo. The former isn't on Nanook's list, and Boo was said to be the lowest of Nanook's priorities on his potential shoot list. It would look worse if Hyena had proposed Jack and Mac, as they are on even footing with him (or were when night started).

G-Man wrote: ↑Sat May 16, 2020 9:56 pm
@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME This is probably too late to be helpful, but:

Would Not Shoot: Sloonei, Mac
Would Shoot: Dragomir, Hyena

G-Man wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 5:29 pm Quick post to vote. I looked through both Funnygurl’s and Johann’s ISOs again. I see Johann’s pursuit if Dragomir. That’s a good look. Still, I can’t get a good feel for the guy. Funnygurl is a little all over the place but I read her more innocently. Call it gender bias if you must.

[VOTE: Funnygurl] aubergine

Help us Sloonei-Wan Kenobi; you’re our only hope!

G-man was fairly critical of Drago, but it feels a bit underwhelming. If they're partners then G went for a hard one-sided distancing play. I've seen weirder things, but I don't see a smoking gun here so I should refrain from pursuing this too strongly. G-man hasn't been super active and a more straghtforward ISO might be more revealing to see how exactly this Drago pressure fits into his overall hunting efforts. I may do that if I have the time once the current exercise is done. G-man's someone who should remain in the POE, but I can't place him firmly in one pool or the other.

funnygurl & drago

Spoiler: show

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 3:20 am ok sloonei, you look good

there ain't enough for me to read nutella dragomir. tbh idk how to read her

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:05 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 12:35 pm
boo wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 12:22 pm I was not saying you would do the shooting. I was saying you were setting up getting me getting shot. You don't need the gun to direct where who gets it will aim it. And it's cleaner for mafia to not get it but have a hand in directing it.

And you know all of that, and it's the second time you've blatantly misrepresented what I have said; the first being when my talking about the mechanics was somehow trying to control what other people are doing.
I hope my last post clears this up a little but I am sorry if I've misrepresented you -- I was posting very late last night and was very much not eloquent and having trouble putting my thoughts into words so I think I mis-articulated some things, particularly the idea that you were trying to "impose" anything on anyone. I didn't mean it that way at all, just a looser idea that you were trying to apply your way of thinking to someone else's content in a way that didn't mesh with their original intentions. I'm not trying to say that your approach is wrong, just that it was misapplied to Mac's approach and I originally thought that you were nefariously trying to make him look bad out of nothing, but I can see that you may have legitimately had that interpretation. I don't know. I'm undecided on you now.

And sure, I was trying to push you as a candidate for shooting. But again nothing is set in stone at this point of the phase and now that I'm not screaming that you're "100% scum" I would appreciate the same courtesy. I was pushing my strong read at the time, which is what I believe townies should do. I was not trying to control the narrative in order to ensure a misfire, as you are insisting.
here you go drago

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:09 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:08 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:05 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 12:35 pm
boo wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 12:22 pm I was not saying you would do the shooting. I was saying you were setting up getting me getting shot. You don't need the gun to direct where who gets it will aim it. And it's cleaner for mafia to not get it but have a hand in directing it.

And you know all of that, and it's the second time you've blatantly misrepresented what I have said; the first being when my talking about the mechanics was somehow trying to control what other people are doing.
I hope my last post clears this up a little but I am sorry if I've misrepresented you -- I was posting very late last night and was very much not eloquent and having trouble putting my thoughts into words so I think I mis-articulated some things, particularly the idea that you were trying to "impose" anything on anyone. I didn't mean it that way at all, just a looser idea that you were trying to apply your way of thinking to someone else's content in a way that didn't mesh with their original intentions. I'm not trying to say that your approach is wrong, just that it was misapplied to Mac's approach and I originally thought that you were nefariously trying to make him look bad out of nothing, but I can see that you may have legitimately had that interpretation. I don't know. I'm undecided on you now.

And sure, I was trying to push you as a candidate for shooting. But again nothing is set in stone at this point of the phase and now that I'm not screaming that you're "100% scum" I would appreciate the same courtesy. I was pushing my strong read at the time, which is what I believe townies should do. I was not trying to control the narrative in order to ensure a misfire, as you are insisting.
here you go drago
Thanks. Hmm, I would not give Nutella a bad read for that post.
why's that? i can't metaread nutella yet but i'd generally scum read someone for a play like that
boo wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:07 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 7:59 pm
boo wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 12:22 pm I was not saying you would do the shooting. I was saying you were setting up getting me getting shot. You don't need the gun to direct where who gets it will aim it. And it's cleaner for mafia to not get it but have a hand in directing it.

And you know all of that, and it's the second time you've blatantly misrepresented what I have said; the first being when my talking about the mechanics was somehow trying to control what other people are doing.
boo = town

nutella = scum

this isn't distancing; it's not w/w

do you think nutella's town?

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:15 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:14 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:09 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:08 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:05 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 12:35 pm
boo wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 12:22 pm I was not saying you would do the shooting. I was saying you were setting up getting me getting shot. You don't need the gun to direct where who gets it will aim it. And it's cleaner for mafia to not get it but have a hand in directing it.

And you know all of that, and it's the second time you've blatantly misrepresented what I have said; the first being when my talking about the mechanics was somehow trying to control what other people are doing.
I hope my last post clears this up a little but I am sorry if I've misrepresented you -- I was posting very late last night and was very much not eloquent and having trouble putting my thoughts into words so I think I mis-articulated some things, particularly the idea that you were trying to "impose" anything on anyone. I didn't mean it that way at all, just a looser idea that you were trying to apply your way of thinking to someone else's content in a way that didn't mesh with their original intentions. I'm not trying to say that your approach is wrong, just that it was misapplied to Mac's approach and I originally thought that you were nefariously trying to make him look bad out of nothing, but I can see that you may have legitimately had that interpretation. I don't know. I'm undecided on you now.

And sure, I was trying to push you as a candidate for shooting. But again nothing is set in stone at this point of the phase and now that I'm not screaming that you're "100% scum" I would appreciate the same courtesy. I was pushing my strong read at the time, which is what I believe townies should do. I was not trying to control the narrative in order to ensure a misfire, as you are insisting.
here you go drago
Thanks. Hmm, I would not give Nutella a bad read for that post.
why's that? i can't metaread nutella yet but i'd generally scum read someone for a play like that
I would too due to the diplomacy that they got going on but this one I don't agree with. I think Nutella genuinely felt sorry there and she really thought she was wrong. She gave a deep explanation for it and while she ended up being on the fence on Boo, the thought process towards it makes sense to me. This is something I can easily see someone from both alignments doing but coming from a genuine place, you get me?
alright. i mean i can't use that to influence my own read of her but i appreciate the info and think it makes you look good

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:16 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:15 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:13 pm @sloonei why i sus hyena: he's one of the people who are conveniently wolf reading me without real reasons. he tried to kill mikey in the shots turbo we played together. consistency in scum play i guess
Huh? I don't get how shooting Mikey in a turbo game is relevant here.
hyena was scum. mikey's an easy mislynch

i'm an easy mislynch rn

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:20 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:18 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:16 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:15 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:13 pm @sloonei why i sus hyena: he's one of the people who are conveniently wolf reading me without real reasons. he tried to kill mikey in the shots turbo we played together. consistency in scum play i guess
Huh? I don't get how shooting Mikey in a turbo game is relevant here.
hyena was scum. mikey's an easy mislynch

i'm an easy mislynch rn
What makes you easy?
i mean look at me

i'm likely on most people's shortlists rn, and for what. no one here except mac has even seen me play as scum

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:52 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:50 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:48 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:40 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:06 pm sloonei you don't deserve the gun this phase maybe like d2 lol

and yeah that's fair i hope people get their butts in here too
What the hell does that mean?
ok u dont deserve it fmpov

our reads are very different but i mean who knows maybe you're right but i don't think so

i didn't mean this with offense sorry

the second line was directed at dragomir
How can you consider this when he's scum reading you?
not about me obv but he's scum reading mac which imo is a no and he's tr'ing nutella which is also a no imo

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:03 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:01 pm The vote is useless. Nobody's gonna wagon Wilgy, an inactive player with no more than one post, with roughly an hour left in the phase. Especially when the majority of the active players have formulated town cores.

Voting for Wilgy all of a sudden and even trying to get ppl on board is just worthy of an lol.

Now, I'm trying to decide as to what that means concerning Sloonei's alignment, if it has any meaning at all.
imo it's wifom

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:03 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:03 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:01 pm The vote is useless. Nobody's gonna wagon Wilgy, an inactive player with no more than one post, with roughly an hour left in the phase. Especially when the majority of the active players have formulated town cores.

Voting for Wilgy all of a sudden and even trying to get ppl on board is just worthy of an lol.

Now, I'm trying to decide as to what that means concerning Sloonei's alignment, if it has any meaning at all.
Dragomir mafia
this is spicy

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 8:24 am ayy johann is so town so town so town

the drago read is spicy

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 11:15 pm gman is town

boo is town

mac is town

we trust dusks nanook read

johann is BALLS TO THE WALL town

idk what to think of sloonei or wilgy, for different reasons.

hyena sus, drago sus, jack is eh.

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Sat May 16, 2020 3:00 am OH YEAH. DRAGOMIR

is an option

On the whole I think I like these interactions for funnygal. We see more of a sustained dialogue than we have in the previous ISOs. I think some of the back and forth looked spontaneous enough to not be the interactions of two teammates, and the way funnygurl perked up when johann apparently caught Drago yesterday looks authentic and good. Funnygurl looks the best of the people I've checked out so far. There's nothing here that totally absolves her, but I would not leap to push a case against her for any of this. Everything checks out.

Wilgy and Drago:

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Thu May 14, 2020 11:23 pm As it currently stands. If I had the gun I'd either kill Hyena or Johann.

Someone tell me why I'm correct or incorrect to do so.

@Duskfall, what's your feel on Hyena, Drago, Jack, Johann, and Mac? In that order? Also please relate your read of each one of these to a food dish.

This is it. Drago is a name in a list with no stated read. Wilgy has not had much to say at all, so it's not damning that there's nothing here. But I can't call them incompatible.

Boo & Drago

Spoiler: show

boo wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 9:54 am
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 2:44 am
nutella wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 2:42 am
boo wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 8:00 am I got my PM and do not care when phases start/end.

Self-killing makes zero sense @Johann.

We should give the gun to someone with a subset of players they're allowed to choose from to shoot.

If they go outside that, they got shot next.

I think it's better then deciding on a specific player because that keeps mafia from being able to control the conversation easily.

And at 13 players, 10/3 split... Assuming the gun always gets used (no ties, but in most cases that should be easy enough to avoid since we can hammer)... We can only afford like 4 gun uses on a civ? One or two more if we get 1 or 2 of the mafia mixed in with that? Right? It's too early for me to be mathing. But it's a general point.

Then once we have a baddie killed, players who had them in their subset but chose not to shoot them can be looked at more in depth. Plus that's a way to try and force the mafia into bussing if they do get the gun.
this is boo's first post and it's basically stating the obvious about how the game works. imo it's fluff

boo wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 8:55 pm
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 8:52 pm COMPROMISE is what makes this country GREAT, except when it’s MY IDEALS, in which case we must be UNCOMPROMISING in the face of ADVERSITY
something something towncore, something something if I get the gun I'll shoot you, something something casual mention of someone who hasn't even posted but I am saying is either 100% town or mafia. Actually, no. Strike that. They're the secret independent role that isn't stated in the roles. Probably? But I don't know, because reading host posts is apparently for nerds, so I haven't done that.
this is... what the actual fuck is this. this is a scum post 99% of the time it exists.
Wait, is this all you got against him?
Yes, because she's mafia and I'm an easy mis-shot, and she knows it and is going balls to the wall trying to make it happen because if she doesn't I'll be gunning for her until she gets shot and she knows it.

boo wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:06 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 7:48 pm
boo wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 3:51 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 3:43 pm
boo wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 3:34 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 3:32 pm I don't get why we are assuming that the mafia team does not want the gun.
Because being directly responsible for killing a civ is never a good look.
Assuming someone is scum for having a bad read is never a good look.
Not being a good look isn't the same as assuming they're mafia. But if the shooter gets 4 choices to shoot from the thread, and shoots a civ, and then later one (or two) of those 4 turns out to be mafia, that would make re-examining the shooter necessary.

Civ deaths are always an inevitably, but making no effort to mine from those deaths is just wasteful.
Do you mean to reevaluate the player to see why interactions they had with those 2 players that flipped Mafia? If so, what does the player not shooting those mafia have to do with it? Wouldn't you find and read those interactions anyway when you see that a mafia had died regardless of who shot them?

Shooting a civ is almost as NAI as being inactive.
If someone has a subset of players to choose from (presented by the thread at large), when they have the gun, and shoot a civ, and later other members of that same subset turn out to be mafia, I'm saying it's an indication that the player is more likely then other people to be mafia as a result. I'm not saying it's by any means a guarantee, but we have nutella in what you quoted acting like how a person uses the gun isn't going to be useful in game solving. That makes as much sense as acting like a standard lynch can't help in game solving.

boo wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:55 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:55 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:53 pm [VOTE: drwilgy] aubergine

The steady hand of a doctor is the only on we can trust with a shot like this.
This is the spiciest vote in the entire game. I don't know what to make of it.
That Sloonei is dedicated to his vote not being a relevant factor, apparently?

boo wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 11:34 am
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 8:24 am ayy johann is so town so town so town

the drago read is spicy
The Drago read is parroting the thread.

boo wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 2:30 pm
Duskfall wrote: ↑Fri May 15, 2020 2:22 pm Boo what is your dragomir read btw I can't remember?
I dunno if I've mentioned him, so that might be why.

He isn't someone who ever sticks out to me long enough to consider. I know I've played a game where he got lynched D1 or 2 as mafia, and even then I had no idea why it went down with so much support. That hasn't really been different here. I've seen him tossed about, and I've opened his ISO, but it's just a blank wall for me. There's just more interesting people to look at.

Today I'll be tunneling Jack. Being wrong about nutella made me lose a lot of interest in this game, but now that I have that it's what I want to deal with.

boo wrote: ↑Sat May 16, 2020 10:34 pm From Drago's ISO, I think there's 1 mafia between Mac & Hyena.

There's some affinity, but I would hesitate to call it teammate indicative. Drago and boo were more openly assertive of one another than I'd expect a pair of teammates to be, though that's not a hard and fast rule. There's no reason they can't be acting boldly.
The post where duskfall asks boo for a read on Drago (second from the bottom) isn't a great look and kind of dances around the subject without giving a clear answer. More recently, he has said that Mac and Hyena are suspects based on Drago's ISO, but he has not elaborated much on that position or its origins.

boo is not incompatible with Drago, but I also would not leap to accuse him just yet. I would like him to explain his reaction to Drago's flip in more detail.

Sloonbot mode activate. Massive post incoming. Beep boop.

Dragomir's interactions with others:

Spoiler: show

Pro-Johan, but only in the context of Johan shooting himself. I'd say this is a good look for the J-man.

Spoiler: show

Pro-Hyena, in any context. I've got my eye on the H-dog.

Spoiler: show

Drago is working too hard to get reads out of nanook. Good looky for nooky.

Spoiler: show

Too soon to tell what's going on in this Mac exchange.

Spoiler: show

Mafia Drago engaged in a smear campaign to get nutella shot Night 1. If only someone had been here telling people to never shoot nutella. Man, it would be a real shame if such an individual was completely ignored and we ended up shooting nutella Night 1.
My point is: at least one mafia member was actively campaigning to get nutella shot. The mafia team targeted nutella (maybe not individually, but she's clearly a target here for at least one member of the team), and Mac ended up shooting her. These are just facts.

Spoiler: show

This reads like Dragomir trying to score townie points with empty questions. Very slight good look for Jack by proxy.

Spoiler: show

Drago supports the funnygurl paranoia. Noted.

Spoiler: show

Got my eye on the G-man.

Spoiler: show

I think I am inclined to see this as a favorable look for funnygurl. On the one hand Drago appears to be defending her, but he immediately walks that back. Rather than looking like a player trying not to take a firm stance on a partner, this looks like Mafia Drago is trying to keep a misguided suspicion active without getting his hands dirty.

Spoiler: show

Drago's response to nutella's Day 1 boo suspicion is an indirect defense of boo.

Spoiler: show

This exchange exists, but I'm not sure it tells me anything about Hyena. At least not on the one-sided view. Drago's response is lifeless. If Hyena failed to follow up then it looks like a phony exchange.

Spoiler: show

What? This question is way too long-winded.

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I don't think this post needs to exist if boo and drago are partners. Tentative good look for Walter Bishop.

Drago insists on a town read on Duskfall around this point in multiple posts. So he's willing to puff up a civilian. Noted for mindset.

Spoiler: show

funnygurl and drago are not partners.

Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:20 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 8:16 pm I think I should have the gun tbh. I'm the better day 1 player and more likely to hit scum than anyone. Give to me.
I fuck with this.

[VOTE: Mac] aubergine

Mac is bad.

Spoiler: show

Hyena's alignment is ???

Spoiler: show

Drago, and to a lesser extent Mac and boo, came after me with bullshit after I placed a late-Day 1 vote against Wilgy. I remember it vividly, and I'll call it a good look for boo because it seemed like Drago fed off of his suspicion to justify his own. I think boo is a civilian, and when Drago saw that he had a problem with my vote, it gave Drago the confidence to push against it as well.
I'd also call it a tentative good look for wilgy. Scum drago probably doesn't berate me like this if I'm proposing we give the gun to his teammate, although it's easy to say this whole thing is just for show since no one was ever actually going to vote for wilgy Day 1 no matter what. If we read it that way then Drago's initial stance (calling my vote "the spiciest") might be a hint in that direction. He's testing the waters on the crackpot scheme that would result in his low-hanging partner suddenly becoming the most powerful player in the game for a night.
I'd probably lean toward wilgy being town tho

Spoiler: show

This might be a good look for Hyena? This doesn't look coordinated or orchestrated. If it is, it's kind of messy.

Spoiler: show

Never mind. Or... not never mind? I don't know. Drago ended up voting to give the gun to Mac, so maybe the hesitation here is "Wait no... I want my partner Mac to have the gun!" rather than "Oh whoops, that was way too obvious of an interaction with my partner Hyena, better dial it back."

Spoiler: show

Yeah at this moment I'd lean toward mac being bad and hyena being town.

Spoiler: show

This pressure looks authentic. Good look for Hyena. Ditto. Not only do Hyena's questions look legitimate, but Drago's responses have a certain annoyed tone that suggest he doesn't want to be talking about these things.

Spoiler: show

I doubt either of these two are bad.

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boo and hyena look good. I think funnygurl and wilgy do too, but that's not as solid. I glossed over nanook for the most part because he's the one who shot drago, but the couple of interactions I saw looked good anywhere. Nanook is solidly a town read. There were a couple Johan interactions bookending drago's ISO that I thought both looked good.

mac might be bad. G-man and Jack are the most absent named from this ISO, so they're going to be lumped into the suspect pool as well.

Saps my energy. I don’t know any Sals.

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