The Syndicate

Dom wrote:

Scotty wrote:If I recall, wasn't the 3rd season written amidst the writers strike that happened that year? That's the same year Heroes wrote it's 2nd, and unfortunately, dooming season.

I'd like to think that the writers had overarching themes and answers to their questions, but realized that their web was too tangled by season 4 and backtracked mostly to shore up the big questions. So while we had all these intricate mysteries as a fan base to meticulously pour over, there was no way in hell they could answer everything in only 6 seasons. Another season would have maybe answered those, but then it would have felt like it was dragging.

Zebra, I do so say give it a shot and just try to figure out mysteries as they happen. It's so much more of a journey than the solution. I mean, that's what Lost is, summed up: the journey and relationships you make on that road.

Season four was writers strike.

Woah. No way! That was my favorite season aside from the 1st! I can't believe it.

If I recall, wasn't the 3rd season written amidst the writers strike that happened that year? That's the same year Heroes wrote it's 2nd, and unfortunately, dooming season.

I'd like to think that the writers had overarching themes and answers to their questions, but realized that their web was too tangled by season 4 and backtracked mostly to shore up the big questions. So while we had all these intricate mysteries as a fan base to meticulously pour over, there was no way in hell they could answer everything in only 6 seasons. Another season would have maybe answered those, but then it would have felt like it was dragging.

Zebra, I do so say give it a shot and just try to figure out mysteries as they happen. It's so much more of a journey than the solution. I mean, that's what Lost is, summed up: the journey and relationships you make on that road.

DrWilgy wrote:

Scotty wrote:Good game civs! And especially gg Typh and SVS for sniffing us out. And Sorsha for protecting Typh N1. That was a real bummer.

If Wilgy had died instead of me and we had killed off Typh early on like we were supposed to, I think this story would be very different.

And WHAT? Floyd didn't look at Matt N1? Who did he look at, Golden? He sure gave no indication otherwise.

I trusted you Scotty...

I just want to point out... There was not a single baddie on the Floyd wagon.

I know you did, my lovely pawn.

I figure at this point I'm not giving you a reason to trust me again, but also you should know that I did feel bad about it, and let go of your coattails after Day 2.

And yes, the civs singlehandedly killed their own cop.

Good game civs! And especially gg Typh and SVS for sniffing us out. And Sorsha for protecting Typh N1. That was a real bummer.

If Wilgy had died instead of me and we had killed off Typh early on like we were supposed to, I think this story would be very different.

And WHAT? Floyd didn't look at Matt N1? Who did he look at, Golden? He sure gave no indication otherwise.

Epignosis wrote:The Smoke Monster got Glenn Frey today.

my bad

Hey guys, I would very much like to not die today. thanks!

I'm out glacier hiking all day and will not have service before the deadline. But if I die, please actually look at Nutella next. Just let that be my dying wish.

Bullz, I don't like your vote for me and think it is quite lazy. I wouldn't think of you any less if you would be so kind as to move it.

Chau guys, and just remember: It's Not Penny's Bost.

Typhoony wrote:

Scotty wrote:

Typhoony wrote:

Scotty wrote: Ok. I mean you named me as your top suspect at top of the night yesterday with no reason, but yeah, take your time.

Annoyed, are we?
I don't think you're gonna get nutelLA lynched today, btw. I have no interest in voting her. You're better off putting your vote on Wilgy if you don't want to die.

Anyway, why I think you are bad:

1) You hinted at your role early on
While this is true that I did so, this is pure WIFOM and I'm hardly the only one to do so. Why am I the target of your ire for that and not "udders" or "city slicker"?
You are not the only one. Notice I also mentioned Epi down here. Who said "city slicker"?
As I explained earlier with Epi, I think baddies are more likely to do this than civvies. Baddies know that civvies do not know that baddies have a safe role to claim, so the incentive of claiming a role becomes bigger since you can use the defence "I hinted at my role from the beginning. Clearly that means I am actually that role". You cannot use that defence after everyone else has hinted or claimed. Waiting till the last minute to hint or claim opens you up to suspicion, so why not do it nice and early as a baddie... like in your first post?

2) You seem afraid to name people you think are civ, thereby leaving the door open for a future lynch.

I looked through your posts, but you never go out of your way to proclaim someone a civ.

I hardly ever go out of my way to call someone civ unless I am confident in it. I actually think I came close with Matt, though that didn't turn out well. Typh, we haven't played that much together, but trust me in that statement now and in future/past games. I'm still not apologizing for that- in fact, I would admit it's better in general to be suspicious of everyone. Paranoid Scotty gonna be paranoid.
There's a difference between what you are doing and what the rest is doing. Most of the people left alive seem comfortable with following, or at the very least trusting, someone else in the game. You seem to keep every option open at all times. Being paranoid is fine, being too paranoid is not.

There's no shame in being caught as a baddie Scotty.

You're going to be very disappointed when you find what you think is my baddie play style is actually my civ play. You seem quite content with getting me lynched on reasons that are resonant with a play style you don't agree with. You are incredibly misguided here, but I promise you I am good.

Changing my vote to Wilgy then. Sorry man, but I also don't think your recent response has been genuine. And plus I need to save myself.

Bullzeye wrote:Not sure how much time I'll have over the coming days (hopefully none tbh because it'll mean I've finally got onto a phd) so I'll cast my vote while I know I have a few minutes. Of the two who look like big candidates I think *Scotty* is more likely to be bad. His weird pushing against SVS thing looks suspicious to me, like he's trying to make something of nothing. More thoughts shortly when I've finished catching up.

Welcome to the party. Take a ticket.
Why does butting heads with SVS look suspicious? "like he's trying to make something of nothing" Is there a parrot in here? Are you just repeating what SVS said?

nutella wrote:Scotty, idk what kind of case that was, you basically summarized some things I said without any analysis. Nice try. Like I said, my "flip" on Zebra was not sudden but gradual as I found myself trusting her opinions more (Typh's contributions helped bc I trusted him). As for Floyd, my reaction to his lynch was exactly how I said -- I was surprised that all those votes appeared on him and I was unclear on the motivation for it, and it had nothing to do with my earlier gut suspicion of him.

Looks like Wilgy is digging his hole deeper. I think either Scotty or Epi could be his teammate. Part of me wants to think Scotty is genuine, so I want to hear more from Epi for sure.

It was a perusal through your past, like a psychotherapist traversing your mental landscape. Your choices of suspicions seemed random; so yes, while your switch from Zebra, for example, was "gradual" as you say, I didn't see you talk about what actually switched it. Maybe you can't put your finger on it, but then, I feel like you haven't been able to put your finger on any of your votes this game.

I still don't know why you initially voted for Wilgy. Yes, his defense here does not look good, but why did you vote him before then?

Typhoony wrote:

Scotty wrote: Ok. I mean you named me as your top suspect at top of the night yesterday with no reason, but yeah, take your time.

Annoyed, are we?
I don't think you're gonna get nutelLA lynched today, btw. I have no interest in voting her. You're better off putting your vote on Wilgy if you don't want to die.

Anyway, why I think you are bad:

1) You hinted at your role early on
While this is true that I did so, this is pure WIFOM and I'm hardly the only one to do so. Why am I the target of your ire for that and not "udders" or "city slicker"?
As I explained earlier with Epi, I think baddies are more likely to do this than civvies. Baddies know that civvies do not know that baddies have a safe role to claim, so the incentive of claiming a role becomes bigger since you can use the defence "I hinted at my role from the beginning. Clearly that means I am actually that role". You cannot use that defence after everyone else has hinted or claimed. Waiting till the last minute to hint or claim opens you up to suspicion, so why not do it nice and early as a baddie... like in your first post?

2) You seem afraid to name people you think are civ, thereby leaving the door open for a future lynch.

I looked through your posts, but you never go out of your way to proclaim someone a civ.

I hardly ever go out of my way to call someone civ unless I am confident in it. I actually think I came close with Matt, though that didn't turn out well. Typh, we haven't played that much together, but trust me in that statement now and in future/past games. I'm still not apologizing for that- in fact, I would admit it's better in general to be suspicious of everyone. Paranoid Scotty gonna be paranoid.

a2thezebra wrote:

Scotty wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:There isn't anything between the lines Scotty, that's what you don't understand.

I guess I'll just never get a straight answer from you on the matter, and I look thicker because of it. I'm still working off that christmas ham, thank you very much.

a2thezebra wrote:Neither myself nor nutella is a baddie, lol. If the only thing you've got going against me Scotty is the hypocrisy you falsely claim I hold, then where is your suspicion of Wilgy to go with it? Even if I was being hypocritical in that instance, you claim you're not defending Wilgy against a case you admit to liking yet you don't figure him for either of the last two baddies. Instead, me and nutella.

Notice in an addendum post where I realized that it wouldn't be wise for both of you to be mafia and not bussing Matt.
I also love how confident you are about nutella not being bad. Why is that? Like, ok, you don't suspect her, but there you go again in absolutes. How could you know?

Where did I say that I know?

Speaking in definitives tend to imply that. Instead of "I don't think nutella is bad" you said "nutella is not a baddie".

a2thezebra wrote:Scotty your cases are gobbledy-gook.

how is that any different from usual?

DrWilgy wrote:I'm not breaking my word, so I won't vote Scotty.

Typh, lets make a 3 way tie.

lol what Wilgy? When did you give me your word? Because if I recall, we voted as a block on Day 1, and I returned the favor on Day 2. We haven't even really interacted since then, so this is actually surprising to me.

Typhoony wrote:He seems to be just throwing stuff out there in the hope that literally anything at all will stick.

Maybe Epi can call him the shitslinger from now on.

Actually, I think I have a solid suspicion on nutella. Not sure what shit you're talking about.

You know how this usually goes down for me in the past? People think my cases are crap, or choose not to listen to them, and some of them are wrong, but some of them aren't. And then I get lynched and everyone goes "So sorry Scotty, my bad." I'm hoping it doesn't go that route again before at least this one is resolved. Shoot me if I'm wrong here about nutella, but I feel pretty convinced in this. Even if you don't.

nutella wrote:And what exactly are your reasons for voting me? Sure I haven't looked perfect this game, but I'm a civ. I guess my behavior's been suspicious enough to make me an easy target for the baddies to deflect onto.

K.

nutella's game has been defined by that of which she admits to: "under the radar".

I already ripped on her from Day 2 when she hypocritically said that she thinks the people not getting into the discussion are baddies, when she herself only had 3 posts. She then defends this with:

I know that I'm sort of in the background, I just think that the baddies are also in the background.

That's like attempting to adopt a new company policy of required body-odor-canceling deodorant to be applied on everyone's armpits because your own pits smell like a dog's ass.

nutella wrote: I'll try to pay more attention and start to form some thoughts on day 2. Honestly even though my vote for Floyd was pretty pseudo-random I wouldn't mind pursuing him a bit since he also seems to have remained pretty under-the-radar.

So she says she hopes to get involved on Day 2, and pursue low-posters. Her vote on day 1 was for Floyd, because "idk" and her subsequent vote was also for Floyd for not contributing.

nutella wrote:

Scotty wrote:I wonder what nutella thinks about all this game stuff.

I too am interested in whether Zebra has info. I might decide to vote for Matt with that hope, but I'm kinda skeptical about him. I still have an odd hunch about Floyd, and tentatively also Long Con, but idk how to explain it. I guess I'm tired of overanalyzing and manufacturing suspicions and would rather listen to my gut unless something more convincing comes up.

Not even 10 posts in, and she's already tired of overanalyzing. Her hope that Zebra might have info is not enough to want to vote him, and she thinks about voting for Floyd on an unexplainable "hunch".

Day 2's vote ultimately falls on Zebra, who she ultimately doesn't trust for being shady on Day 2:

nutella wrote:I'm voting for Zebra. I believe Matt's claim and I'd very much prefer that he not die and besides I find myself not trusting a word from Zebra lately.

Her opinion of Matt on Day 1 and Day 2 is quite openly defending (yeah, I'm not one to talk, especially from Day 2). She believes the talkative people were good (Matt was all over that Day 1) and by Day 2, she runs with Matt's alibi as Sun. This is a logical reasoning, though we soon find out in Day 3 that all mafia have an alibi, so in essence, she could be working with the collective town knowledge (or lack thereof).

Anyway, Floyd is lynched, then she posts this candy:

nutella wrote: anyway, shit, RIP Floyd. Kinda weird how those votes suddenly happened, I'm not really clear on why. But I just want to lynch Zebra even more.

She firmly leaves the Floyd camp, and "isn't clear why Floyd was lynched". Even though she voted for him Day 1, and even threw out his name as someone she was suspecting on "an odd hunch". But all of that is thrown to the wind, because now she declares Zebra is bad.

Epi pressures her on not pushing more against Matt, but she completely tosses that aside with:

nutella wrote: The one I'm really suspicious of is Zebra. And that's where my vote is going.

Not to say that she should have been going harder on Matt, even though she said she might vote for him Day 2, but it does make one wonder.

On Day 3, it is mentioned that Floyd probably checked Matt.

nutella wrote:Yeah, it does make sense to me now that Floyd probably checked Matt. And this may be really unkosher to say (idk punish me if it's breaking the rule) but part of why I think so is based on what Golden said.

But, my major hesitation is that I really believed Matt's claim, and given I know Jin is in this game I'd be surprised if Sun wasn't. If that's true and the baddies indeed have fake roles to claim, then kudos Golden for seriously messing with my brain. But based on how the role claiming fest went down, I still hella don't trust Zebra.

Conclusion: I'm not sure whether I want to change my vote or not. Probably Matt will be lynched anyway, but I'd feel bad if he's my dear wife. And seriously, what is going on with zebra, has everyone else picked up on something that I haven't? And wtf is wrong with that rainbow list? Is that a self-outing?

She admits to seeing the reasoning with the Floyd check, but can't come to terms with the alibi thing being probable, and *plus* since Matt's probably going to be lynched anyway, why vote for him, right? Matt still hadn't gone AWOL and admitted, so the jig wasn't technically over at that point I suppose. But nutella indirectly attempted to push the focus back on zebra.

Before Matt gets lynched:

nutella wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:Anyone care to talk about how if Matt flips civ, Zebra is Scum?

She with Wilgy on the condition of Matt flipping civ.

Matt flips the opposite of civ at the end of Day 3, but then her top suspects:

nutella wrote:So the fake role claim thing is confirmed. Well that's pretty fucked up. But great that we're one baddie down!

I bet the other two are Wilgy and Zebra. And if by some crazy chance that's not the case, I'd entertain that crazy theory about Sorsha and Typh.

So Zebra's still on there, plus Wilgy...whom she had never discussed as suspicious before this point. Plus Sorsha and Typh as possibly having a little mafia party.

nutella wrote:I've finally changed my mind on Zebra (it's been a gradual process over the last couple days tbh). I think Wilgy and Scotty are our uzzers.

Ope! Zebra's in the clear now! Something changed! Did she pet one at the zoo and have a change of heart? Tune in Thursday at 11!

nutella wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:It's Epi and Wilgy folks.

Or this actually.

Ope! Changed it again! Two people who she still hasn't talked about.

And today, she votes Wilgy. Why? I dunno. Because zebra suggested it?

That's a breakdown so far of why I don't think nutella is good. She has been on the periphery all game, her defense of Matt doesn't look great, and I'm still not sure of why she votes where she votes.

a2thezebra wrote:There isn't anything between the lines Scotty, that's what you don't understand.

I guess I'll just never get a straight answer from you on the matter, and I look thicker because of it. I'm still working off that christmas ham, thank you very much.

a2thezebra wrote:Neither myself nor nutella is a baddie, lol. If the only thing you've got going against me Scotty is the hypocrisy you falsely claim I hold, then where is your suspicion of Wilgy to go with it? Even if I was being hypocritical in that instance, you claim you're not defending Wilgy against a case you admit to liking yet you don't figure him for either of the last two baddies. Instead, me and nutella.

Notice in an addendum post where I realized that it wouldn't be wise for both of you to be mafia and not bussing Matt.
I also love how confident you are about nutella not being bad. Why is that? Like, ok, you don't suspect her, but there you go again in absolutes. How could you know?

My opinion of Wilgy is as such (and I must admit that I mostly skimmed your wall of text due to time ): I think he could very well be bad, and your points indicate in so many words that his play has been wishy washy and lazy. I would like to hear Wilgy's response to your post for sure, especially to your perception of his baddie game in Star Wars being parallel to this game. I didn't read through that game, so I'll just have to take your word for it. I must also say that your attention towards Wilgy reminds me of me when I'm tunneling hard on someone as if giving a cross examination. That could be a good thing, but could also be a bad thing. It's making it hard to believe you are on the same team, good or bad. If Wilgy is lynched and he turns out bad, I will not see you as bad. So there's that.

My comments about you stem from the fact that I just haven't trusted you for longer, for a playstyle that seems very secretive and yet altogether jumpy. There's just something I can't fill in or put my finger on. But that's where my initial gloss over your suspicion came from.

Bah, voting nutella right now.

Ok, that's all the time I have. Gotta get ready to do a show. I'd ideally like to vote nutella, actually, this phase, but am keenly aware that I have votes today and might need to save myself.

I think at least 1 of the remaining mafia bussed matt last phase, and I think our answer will be in there. Could be Wilgy, could be Bullz, could be Epi. I'm kind of at odds right now between them, but will be looking at each voter when I have a sec tomorrow morning. I hope.

While zebra does bring up an interesting take on Wilgy, I must pull this quote:

a2thezebra wrote: These are the only posts where Wilgy has mentioned Matt (while attacking my alignment with each post) since the post above where he defends him (while also attacking my alignment). I can not stress this enough...WILGY'S READ ARC REGARDING MATT COULD NOT BE ANY MORE DISINGENUOUS. He goes from defending him, to voting for him while implying we're teammates, to implying he will flip civilian and therefore I will be bad, to implying again that we are teammates based on his response to an inquiry, and all of these "developments" have NO BRIDGE BETWEEN THEM TO MAKE THEM APPEAR MORE NATURAL. The ONLY thing connecting them is a suspicion of me which has yet to be supported.

I've brought this up before, but now you're accusing Wilgy of doing something very similar.

a2thezebra wrote:Matt on the other hand is 100% civ Matt.

Followed directly by:

a2thezebra wrote:Prepare to die Matt.

This led to Matt's eventual capitulation and lynching, but you couldn't have done more of a 180 if you were an semicircle.

a2thezebra wrote:Scotty what's the point of the coughing after what I've said? You're damn right I'll have a lot to answer to if Matt flips good.

Guess why I'm not worried about it. Go on, guess.

There never was an explanation to this. Your certainty of there not being a civ-civ train on D1 was spot on. Why is that? Maybe I'm just too boorish to understand between the lines.

I appreciate you saying I'm not bad, but that doesn't ingratiate you with me. And note that I'm not defending Wilgy more than I'm thinking it a bit hypocritical that you are latching onto Wilgy for doing, (what I currently deem) as a disingenuous accusatory arc. You have at least been consistently accusing Wilgy since D1, so there's that.


Also as a side note, I said before that my main suspects are zebra and nutella, but I'm not buying that both would be avoiding Matt on that last lynch. That would be...too revealing, wouldn't it? Hmm.

@Epi you too, slick. What is going on under that dirty mop on that head of yours?

I would also like to hear from Bullz, who, like SVS, has really only locked onto Matt this game. Who do you suspect, Bullz?

S~V~S wrote:Also gonna vote Scotty for now for trying to make a something out of a nothing, repeatedly. And trying to imply things are something they are not.

You know, the things I'm "repeatedly" bringing up are potential angles you could have if you were bad. The two things that I have brought up against you are 1) your WIFOM claim that you would never target Typhoony N1 because of your solemn promise or whatever and 2) your lack of original suspicions on anyone not named Matt. All accounts and reasons seem to be revolving around the category of "the way I've always played and ways I always act." It's very meta reasoning. Ceding to typhoony's judgment because you yourself are not sensible. Come now, I think you're plenty sensible, and this could most definitely be misconstrued as wallflowering.

S~V~S wrote:Wilgy & Nutella seemed most faux with their recent sentiments, and you are scaring the crap out of me. I can't forget that vote you & Sorsha dropped on me, but that is just paranoia speaking.

Besides putting your trust in Typh, this is your most original read on others, but if you were to make a cake with the filling of that suspicion, the cake would be more like a pancake.

The main reason I'm not hounding (and I'm not, even though you seem to think i'm "repeatedly" doing so) you for your lynch is because, as far as any of us know, Typh was protected by Sorsha N1, which makes your WIFOM about not killing him N1 look objectively more sound.
What scares me is that other option that you and Typh are both mafia and are bamboozling everyone, but I choose not to believe that, because that would be far too elaborate and unlikely. The only thing not clearing Typh as being civ is that there is still a PR that could have done something to prevent a lynch (blocker or a lynch pardoner?) and Typh was in fact not the target N1.

But moving on for now, so that I don't continue to "repeatedly" bring up things that you don't agree with.

------

DrWilgy wrote: Linki - because it's odd scum behavior with you being a defining pillar of said behavior.

I'm sorry, what? I am a defining pillar of odd scum behavior? What does that even mean? I've been mafia once. I'm not sure how you can draw anything from that. I don't even know what my scum behavior is, or even if the sample size is big enough. But ok.

Typhoony wrote: Scotty, I'll try and formulate why I think you're bad tomorrow.

Ok. I mean you named me as your top suspect at top of the night yesterday with no reason, but yeah, take your time.

Well that death was expected. RIP Sorsha

It looks like people have me on their lists.

Typhoony wrote:Although Scotty probably #1 now, Epi #2, Wilgy #3

Why?

S~V~S wrote:

Typhoony wrote:My list sounds reasonable yet the two people I suspect the most are not on your list.

Well, you are more reasonable than I am, lol. y u make me spell this out????

Your nose is brown

Listen, I think milk is bad because it smells funky and comes out in chunks. Plus there's little little number clump on the side which spells out the expiration date. I can't really respond to your suspicions because all your posts are like calling milk bad without any discernible spoiled qualities. If you think I'm spoiled, explain why, and then don't drink me, but only in that order pls.

DrWilgy wrote:Actually... It's Scotty and Nutella. Just looked at Matt's ISO.

There's a post where he calls me civ, while not mentioning Scotty. I think at that point I was still purposely parroting Scotty though, so it doesn't make sense.

His only mentioning of both Epi and Nutella was done jokingly, so one of those two. Nutella's vote last round is the one off key though.

Linki - Will someone explain why I'm suspect instead of just throwing my name?

Linki linki - A jab at Zebra, nothing more.

This suspicion makes sense I guess. So I'm sorry Matt didn't name me in his ISO I guess? I can't wholly see how that makes me bad.

nutella wrote:I've finally changed my mind on Zebra (it's been a gradual process over the last couple days tbh). I think Wilgy and Scotty are our uzzers.

That funny because i think you and zebra are our others.

im very busy at work right now this week, but will be on as much as I can. I hate apologizing, but I really am squeezed for time, and will try to devote as much as I can.

ok I think you'll all get a kick out of this: on my plane adventures the past few days, one of my connecting flights went through LAX. And I kid you not, swear to god the following is true.
There was a man sitting next to me that was coming from a funeral for his dad in Sydney. He was Australian, but was almost a spitting image of Locke. His wife, sitting next to him on the aisle, was a paraplegic. There was a man behind me that was probably as husky as a sea lion talking about the powerball and how he chose to use the numbers from that show "Lost". Lastly was a dude with a thick and hick-y accent, long hair, and a hunter's cap in first class. Like, wtf. I was extremely nervous that flight, tbh

Linki: good show, lads

nutella wrote:lmao this game is ridiculous. it's pretty clear that the baddies in fact know which characters are in the game and golden has totally fucked with us and especially messed with me because I stupidly assumed there must be a Sun. Sneaky tricky :\

Though with your vote still on zebra, it appears you are still holding out hope that Matt is just a friendly civ liar.

Matt wrote:Matt

Long Con, MY DUDE, just know I did request that we leave you alone Night 1 for precisely the reason I stated earlier, i.e. "why I wouldn't kill Long Con".

Floyd, no hard feeling my bro. I know your relatively new so I'm not sure you knew what you were doing with that last post. The reason I'm not freaking out at you right now is because I've also accidentally said too much before, though never after I was dead. Oh, and also because your role reveal almost guaranteed my lynch today anyway.

I won't be posting any further but I did have a blast peeps. Oh, and Wilgy requested I tell you all he's my teamie because wifom.

Let's skip to the end phase, then. Nothing more I see here folks. Thanks for playing, Matt, and I hate that I backed you up on day 2.

S~V~S wrote:This is like a freaking comedy routine in here.

when I was in high school, I tried stand up for the talent show day. And the only reason they let me in to perform was because I made one of the auditors laugh at my joke about Dubya Bush. I don't even remember what it was. But when I went out there and performed, I bombed. Sort of like how Dubya bombed Iraq searching for WMDs. It was traumatizing and embarrassing, and I'll never do stand up again.

Typhoony wrote:

Scotty wrote: Again, SVS, I think highly of you as a person, but I don't buy for a second if you were bad that you wouldn't do what you have to do to win.

I would.

And if you believe that I was attacked, then you should trust my word on this. I 100% believe SVS on this and have no intention of lynching her. on you Scotty.

The only way that she is bad is if I was not the target in some weird way and I think that has a very low probability now that we know Floyd was a powerrole as well.

Sorsha says she chose to save you on N1, which is the only info we have on that failed attempt. That doesn't clear you, but it is a strong possibility that is what happened. So I would like to believe that is what happened, and if you are positive that she wouldn't do that, I'll keep that in mind.
The other possibility is that you weren't the target on N1, and something else was at play here (like a block or a missed Mafia kill, though that seems less likely)

Typhoony wrote: SVS, you do realize that if you lied about trying to kill me, I will never, ever, trust you in a mafia game again.

The semantics of this is astounding to me, because if Typh was targeted and SVS does turn out to be bad, it would come completely out of left field.

On one hand, SVS seems like a woman of her word when it comes to promises and such, but IMO if you are barred by these imaginary rules of semantics as a mafia, you are giving yourself more opportunities to fail. I have been Mafia exactly once and as Mafia I may make promises that I won't be able to fulfill. This is getting meta, but on the surface SVS doesn't seem like the type of person that would break a pre-game vow like that. I would like to think she wouldn't.

But.

Hypothetical:
If she were bad, what better way to build civ cried than being involved in Typh's death? Notice I said involved, not committed. Maybe if she didn't want to go through with the kill, and chose one of the other Mafia members to do it, she would be absolved of any wrong doing.

I could be reading too much into that, but when people make statements that "oh, I would never do that" or "I'm an honest and noble person as a baddie, I hate being Mafia" it makes me tense up. Could just be a personal play style but if I am ever Mafia again I think anything is fair game.

Again, SVS, I think highly of you as a person, but I don't buy for a second if you were bad that you wouldn't do what you have to do to win.

a2thezebra wrote:There's a number of things wrong with that rainbow list of mine, yet it takes more than a quick glance to notice all of them.

1. Epignosis, who I'm currently voting for, is fairly high among the civilian reads.
2. DFaraday, Floyd, and Long Con (who is a neutral gun-to-head scum read) are all dead.
3. Ricochet isn't playing this game.
4. Rain Man does not exist.
5. Golden is the host.
6. I have a very strong scum read of myself.

Scotty only noticed (or at least only made note of noticing) Number 3.
nutella only noticed (or at least only made note of noticing) Number 6.

Everyone else made no mention of the list at all, which I find interesting.

You are a conundrum, my friend. Was that some sort of test? Did I pass? Do I graduate Mafia community college?

What is your opinion on Floyd's initial post at the beginning of day 2 where he votes Matt? Do you think it's damning at all?

DrWilgy wrote:Voted fer Matt.

Matt, who is definitely not on your team other than Zebra?

Matt, what do you think of my friend Scotty?

Scotty, what do you think of SVS?

I think SVS has been slinking through the past few days. I haven't rea d back on her because I've been a little preoccupied today, but I don't remember her other suspicions taking flight besides for Matt. Which is why I really think discovering Matt's alignment is important.

delta scheduled me on 3 different connecting flights today spanning 15 hours to get to a destination 3 hours direct away I would rather crash on an island with time and space travel, you know what I mean?

I got 10 minutes before this plane departs, so quickly::
I dunno how to feel about Matt. On one hand, I feel like Floyd's post (his living post) seems to be pretty clear, but also keeping in mind that he voted Matt D1 and continued his voting for Matt unabated. I think Epi has a point that he would probably check the guy he voted for N1, but all of that is heresay.

I think that is our best bet in info today, because honestly I don't trust any of you with your alibis. LC dying as Locke debunks my smoke monster theory, so I feel like the baddies could be any shell of a castaway.

Voting Matt. This will also inform my opinion of several people that have been on and against him since the start of the game.

Rip LC.

a2thezebra wrote:nutella
DFaraday
Floyd
S~V~S
Epignosis
Typhoony
Bullzeye
Rain Man
Scotty
Ricochet
Long Con
Sorsha
Matt
Golden
a2thezebra
DrWilgy

I'm glad you can't make up your mind on Ricochet, as well as the fact that you trust him less than me.


in other news, I missed my connecting flight into Alaska because of a 2 hour weather delay. Literally ran across the airport and watched the flight take off. So now I'm stuck in Minneapolis for an entire day. I'm a sad sad Scotty

Long Con wrote:Sketchy stuff all around! If I'm Locke, I probably have a cool power role, because I'm Special, right?

Depends on how you look at it. Spoiler if you haven't seen Lost! I originally had Locke pegged as the investigator, as in the investigator of the island, but I was wrong. I'm not sure what else he could be as a PR.

Sorsha wrote:

Scotty wrote:

Sorsha wrote:Seeing as the doctor and the cop are accounted for and there is a third power role out there I don't understand zebras insistence that him role claiming would be so detrimental to the civvie cause. I could see a couple of the roles already claimed fitting with a power so I'm not inclined to trust his claim.

I understand the hesitancy beforehand, (and I'm still slightly mad at you for claiming so early ) because at that point there was still secrecy that could be used to our advantage. I don't trust ANY claims except you right now.

Typhoony wrote:Are we to assume that all 3 power roles are civs btw?

Well I never thought of that, but I find that unlikely in any case. OR at least I hope so.

Don't be mad at me, be mad at the redneck jackass

I mean, in the end, he didn't make you claim. He badgered, for sure, but in the end, you chose to end it to get a monkey off your back. The best way to get a monkey off your back is to perform a Samoan driver over your shoulder and slam him down. But if all else fails, build a raft and get off the island.

S~V~S wrote:In other games like this it often is the Godfather iirc, can't die until his other teammates do. But anything is possible.

I have not played many of these on other forums. But I have never heard of baddies being given fake roles to claim, but what do i know?

Who even initially brought that up as a thing?

Sorsha wrote:Seeing as the doctor and the cop are accounted for and there is a third power role out there I don't understand zebras insistence that him role claiming would be so detrimental to the civvie cause. I could see a couple of the roles already claimed fitting with a power so I'm not inclined to trust his claim.

I understand the hesitancy beforehand, (and I'm still slightly mad at you for claiming so early ) because at that point there was still secrecy that could be used to our advantage. I don't trust ANY claims except you right now.

Typhoony wrote:Are we to assume that all 3 power roles are civs btw?

Well I never thought of that, but I find that unlikely in any case. OR at least I hope so.

The cop just can't get a break in these heist games.

So now, Typh, that our most important civ has been lynched for whatever reason, claiming is fine in my book, because as far as I'm concerned we're back to square 1. Looking at votes. And I hope to do another vote analysis at some point, but I'm on a plane to Alaska tomorrow and- barring some electromagnetic shits don't down the plane- will be afk. Not ideal, but work has been grabbin at my balls this week. Next week will be even more involved. And I apologize ahead of time.

Right now, Sorsha's implication that she saved Typh is the best info we have. This does not directly mean that either Sorsha or Typh are cleared, but I trust Sorsha and Typh in that order. Everyone else is fair game as far as I'm concerned.
There is still one power role. This could be any myriad of different roles. That person should NOT claim yet, unless it directly helps the town toward winning.

Oh, and happy birthday, Bullzeye! I'd sing the happy birthday song, but it's copyrighted.

So I guess I'll just dance on the beach.

I actually agree with zebra on this matter, but also know that even a baddie could have a similar viewpoint. So I'm conflicted.

@Wilgy man, what are your thoughts?

Typhoony wrote:I really have trouble seeing how someone can be so against the idea. It pings the shit out of me honestly.

Do you know why Epignosis knows your role?

Because if you were paying attention I've probably hinted at it several times early on.

I'm sorry that pings you that I don't like giving baddies ammo to pull from.

Now all of this is to say that we believe each other in our claims. It still dumbfounds me that Sorsha came out so early against a little pressure from Epi as a really useful role. Let's say you're Rose. What good is Rose? She isn't. If Golden gave Rose a role or a place in this game, then I would also be dumbfounded. Because Rose is hardly an important character. So if you were to come out and say that you were Rose, what are the chances that the smoke monster would say, "Oh, she needs to die next!"

0%. Because it's Rose.

Typhoony wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:

Typhoony wrote:You realize that this is an easy way for a baddie to not go along with outing right?

That's why I want more specifics.

And do you realize that, if you're bad, which I am unaware of, what you're doing is an easy way to find out whether or not I'm a serious threat to you?

Nope. You're acting very much like you have a power role, so you're doing a good enough job of acting like you are a serious threat to the baddies all by yourself. Problem is that I'm not sure I believe this, since you are really over the top. But I have no interest in lynching you right now, let that be very clear.

Claiming a role in itself is not that big. I'm pretty sure I can come up with useful powers for most of the Losties that I can think of, so then it is up to the baddies to figure out what roles Golden actually gave a power. I think that is worth tradeoff with everybody claiming a role.

The role in itself doesn't mean that much. Look at the rules:

There are only three power roles, but it is not known what they are. It should not be presumed that they are all necessarily useful.

If we assume that Sorsha's claim is true, that's one power role that actually is useful. Maybe your role is useless.

Are you still suspicious of Matt Zebra?

Scotty wrote:

Typhoony wrote:I agree with LC on this. I see no issue with claiming.

Ok mister wise pants. Sorsha just claimed Jack, the doctor.

She just out a gigantic target on her back.

once everyone claims their respective role, assuming that baddies can just claim like fucking Vincent or something, it won't take a genius to figure out what power roles they could be.

Again, I think it's worth the tradeoff. The baddies do not know what roles have powers, so they would have to think of potential powers for every roleclaim and work around that.

LC, why don't you be the leading man and claim your role?

Typhoony, I really want to believe that you are civ and were saved last night as Sorsha claims, but there are only several characters that I can see as having any relevancy, and would very much prefer you didn't entice people into giving out chocolate like it's free. Chocolate is never free. If it is, it's probably riddled with salmonella.

Long Con wrote:

Scotty wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Scotty wrote:I do not wish to claim my role...yet. Suspect me for that if you like, but I am immediately suspicious of anyone that asks everyone to claim.

I already know your role.

Same to you, cowboy.

Matt wrote:Yo peeps! Well I'll be smack in the middle of my ten hour shift when the lynch takes place. I PMed Golden to see if I could do this and he said yes sooooo

I am not the moon. That is all.

Peace and good luck town!

I don't remember the moon being a big part of the lore. What am I missing here?

He's not "the moon". He's "NOT-the-moon". You know, wife of "not-rum-or-vodka"?

Holy hatch!. This took me way too long.

Typhoony wrote:I agree with LC on this. I see no issue with claiming.

Ok mister wise pants. Sorsha just claimed Jack, the doctor.

She just out a gigantic target on her back.

once everyone claims their respective role, assuming that baddies can just claim like fucking Vincent or something, it won't take a genius to figure out what power roles they could be.

Epignosis wrote:

Scotty wrote:I do not wish to claim my role...yet. Suspect me for that if you like, but I am immediately suspicious of anyone that asks everyone to claim.

I already know your role.

Same to you, cowboy.

Matt wrote:Yo peeps! Well I'll be smack in the middle of my ten hour shift when the lynch takes place. I PMed Golden to see if I could do this and he said yes sooooo

I am not the moon. That is all.

Peace and good luck town!

I don't remember the moon being a big part of the lore. What am I missing here?

Typhoony wrote:

Scotty wrote:What in the ever loving crap just happened in the past day? Reading back and will comment in a bit

Everybody realized you were bad and voted you.

Oh lol nice.

Long Con wrote:We lost Home Alone Mafia because everyone was too polite to just role-claim when it was within the rules to do so. Our community is really touchy on roleclaiming, so much so that many of us can't do it even when it's an allowed part of the game.

Why is that?

One answer could be that if everyone just claimed their role, then it would be far too simple to find the baddies and the detective-style Mafia game would be shunted aside for a simpler version of the game called "Who is lying?"

However, I don't want to lose because I'm too polite. I don't really see the difference between saying "I'm not the moon get what I did there? " and saying "I am Sun".

So, if we're doing this, then let's not dance around it. Why not just state our roles at (or near) the outset?

Matt wrote:LC, my dude! I thought we shared something special as host/player in AWR, I suppose I was wrong. Haha!

Matt, my dude! You were one of the most special gems in the entire game for me. Your passion and drive and successes were shining examples of what makes it all worthwhile to me. I was deeply grateful that I had a fine player like you in A World Reborn. If the game was made up of 30 Matts, it would have been absolutely spectacular.

This is dangerous on many levels, LC.

DON'T JUST WILLY NILLY CLAIM YOUR ROLE.

In Home Alone, town would have won on the onset if they just outright claimed due to the open setup.

But this is closed set-up. I don't know if you've ever done a closed setup before, LC, but claiming roles THIS EARLY is very bad.

Don't you think Golden would put safeguards in place for that very reason? Anyone of us could be lying.

Granted, no one has counterclaimed Sorsha and Typh did not die last night, so that is a safe assumption. But color me pissed that that came out in Day 2.

I do not wish to claim my role...yet. Suspect me for that if you like, but I am immediately suspicious of anyone that asks everyone to claim.

What in the ever loving crap just happened in the past day? Reading back and will comment in a bit

I wonder what nutella thinks about all this game stuff.

Typhoony wrote:If Matt is bad she is already a huge target for tonight. Which means she is also a huge target for a protector role if that role is actually in the game.

Don't see a problem with Zebra saying she has info if she does.

Ok, but if she's protected tonight, what then after that? I would assume the protector can't help her Night 3 because of double-targeting rules?
I would think if you have info, you would at least be a little more subtle about it this early in the game or at least wait a little longer down the line where she can be more useful.

Anyway, sorry if you were good Matt. I tried

Typhoony wrote:

Epignosis wrote: Tuft-Head is probably not bad. I am confident that the probability that he is bad is 25%- the same as it is for everybody.

Technically it is higher than 25% or lower than 25%, since you know if you yourself are bad or not.

Taking a wild stab in the dark without any added info that any one of us is bad = ~28% chance you will be right.
I think it would idiotic for zebra to come out and say she has info on someone if she is civ, because that will get her killed tonight.

So to come out with an absolute is not a terrible bet to make. And even if she is wrong, hey- she committed to her choice. Has to count for something, right?

a2thezebra wrote:Scotty what's the point of the coughing after what I've said? You're damn right I'll have a lot to answer to if Matt flips good.

Guess why I'm not worried about it. Go on, guess.

Because you're statistically more likely of "catching" a baddie based on your logic over the train Day 1? And that is supposed to make you look good whether or not Matt is bad. Is that it?

Or is it because whether or not he is bad you are just happy to commit to a vote because it shows strength?

Or is it because you are actually bad and know whether or not he is?

Or is it because you stole Biff's almanac?

DrWilgy wrote:Hey Scotty, what do you think of SVS?

I think SVS has appealed to emotion over this game, and while she hasn't exactly gone above and beyond digging into Matt, she has not brought up any more relevant reads. A majority of her responses have her 'thinking about it more', but I'm still waiting on more reads than Matt. The whole SVS-Matt-Bullzeye thing is wearing on me, honestly. I still believe Matt to be good, and one or more of the current voters on him bad.

I do believe that if this vote stands and Matt turns out to be good, several people including SVS *cough cough and Zebra cough cough* will have a lot to answer to.

Long Con wrote:LOL

Well, it's late, I've had my last drink, and everything I said was just the truth. It's always best to have some suspicion in order to keep the baddies from wanting to nightkill you. Assuming they want to kill the Civviest-looking players that they'll never be able to lynch.

Assuming they can kill. Suckas. It reminds me of my last game, the Home Alone Christmas game - the Doctor protected me on Night 1 and the kill failed, so he knew I was a Civ. We still lost in classic tragic form, but that was a good start at least.

I will laugh if that happened again. I mean, I think it happened, and that the Doctor (shall we say Jack?) now knows for sure the identity of a Civ... but if it was me again, that would just tickle me.

Yes, I was a baddie that game. I remember fondly trying to kill you, and it was very frustrating. But it all worked out in the end

I'm out for a majority of tomorrow but will be back hopefully a bit before deadline to catch up.

Long Con wrote:

Scotty wrote:From a cursory glance, you tied the vote up twice earlier on, before declaring on a 5-4 count that you had "no interest in tying it up or letting a baddie decide." So to me, it seemed messy, like you were forgetting what your strategy was. You definitely made a statement by putting the nail in the coffin for DFaraday. Would a baddie be so bold as to do that to protect a baddie in broad daylight? Maybe. Mayne not.

Maybe it was messy, I am perfectly willing to change directions midstream when a new idea of how baddies might think/react occurs to me. Sometimes, my stated intent is not my real intent, but merely what I need the baddies to think it is in order to gauge reactions that they don't know I'm looking for. Shit gets messy sometimes, I can't help that. I'm far from a perfect player. Maybe a little messy is what we need to get a baddie off-balance.

You realize that you knowing that you made the final vote doesn't help us out, right? It's almost as useful as looking at the winning lottery numbers from 2 weeks ago. (Hint: the second number is 8)

Oh yes, I realize it entirely. I chose to do what helps ME know certain truths. The Civvies can choose to trust me or not to. And that just means to trust that I'm Civ, not to trust that I know what's best or who is bad. Mostly I'm a pretty bad player, and sometimes I do something worthwhile. I don't know when that is going to happen, I just have to try stuff.

I respect trying stuff. I mean hell, I'm rather messy myself. I overlook stuff. And if we really want to have a heart to heart, sometimes I feel like I might have undiagnosed ADHD. Or consistently polarizing bouts of laziness. I can never tell.

But messiness can also be a detractor and a canned excuse, y'know.
"my stated intent is not my real intent" You realize then how shady this sounds out of context? Hell, even in context. I'm not gonna criticize how you play, but I will point out that that isn't how to get people to trust you.

I used to go around in my middle school years explaining my motivation to girls: "My goal is to get you to trust me". By blurting that out, no girl would trust me. So I learned to just keep that to myself. Needless to say, I didn't have a lot of girlfriends in school.

DrWilgy wrote: Why the exception for my buddying Scotty?

Call it a leap of faith.