The Syndicate

When I caught up to my death I had realized that JJJ was bad and Epi was town. I was screaming about it in the deadie chat for the past week -__-

I'm screaming.

Dammit JJJ, why'd you go and start the Wilgy wagon while I was away.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:You also noted the #1 Feb often leads lynches. Mindset behind this, I read this from many angles and the angle that makes the most sense to me is "The baddie who is scared of the wagon they just made". Which would also reflect why you moved your vote around as much as you did, only to move it back.

This is where you lose me, Wilgy. Can you try to expand on why you are inclined to view Epi's observation about his tendency to lead lynches despite winning often as a bad guy as stemming from the mindset of a "baddie who is scared of the wagon they just made"? When I see that comment, and when I pair it with the source, I see incredulity. It's an external observation by a guy who is aware of two truths: "I have a lot of mafia wins" and "I lead a lot of lynches". These truths exist regardless of his alignment, and the potential for the observation to be made would seem to exist also in any game regardless of alignment.

I'd like to think that the proclaiming of this observation has more when to it to be observed.

What was it's purpose given that the wagon Epi had wanted just took off?

It was a strong case and wagon in Epi's mind. It prompted him to ask who was bussing their teammate. Due to this, I see his statement as a regret other than an irony. It weakened his own case and I'm unsire why.

If it was because he regretted the wagon I can see 2 reasons,
1. He's uncomfortable leading a wagon on a civ.
2. He wants others to form ideas and not just bandwagon.

Reasons why I have trouble reading into option 2, the civ angle is because he moved back when the wagon was well stacked up. He took away his high momentum vote, put it in the same spot, just as a low momentum vote.

I don't think Epi would do that if he had a thought that players were sheeping.

The other reason why I have trouble reading into option 2 is the wondering of who is bussing. If a civ stated this, it would mean they believe in their vote. Why not be happy the person you think is bad is getting lynched?

Epignosis wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:

Epignosis wrote:I answered your original question. Now you are asking a new question.

What prompts you to think that is needed?

"Do you think I tunnel you without thought or judgement?"

"I do."

Implicit in that response is the response to your previous question: I think you come after me without thought or judgment, and so it's best if I go away so you can do better.

I disagree with this, but I do somewhat believe you when you say that you say this based on your interactions with me and Marmot in Blue vs Red.

Epi here's what I saw. MP was a primary force on FZ being bad. FZ was a counter force in that exchange, causing what I would say to be an almost even clash during it's time. Think of two different colered clouds bumping into each other but not mixing.

Then a tertiary force comes along with a Hazlenut vote. Clearly a high momentum force that sways the MP force away. That was you Epi. Then that momentum blew away the FZ suspicion and the thread began to fluidly mix again.

Here's the problem I have with that. I know that as a baddie, you are good with momentum. The example I hinted at was vocaroo. You placed a vote on me when other players where discussing my lynching. I saw this as an attempt to save Zebra by you swaying the thread/vote momentum.

Unlike vocaroo though, this one took off and you questioned if it was a bus. I don't think you really thought it was a bus. I don't think many people would see it as a bus either considering the votes went from 3v0 to 3v4.

You also noted the #1 Feb often leads lynches. Mindset behind this, I read this from many angles and the angle that makes the most sense to me is "The baddie who is scared of the wagon they just made". Which would also reflect why you moved your vote around as much as you did, only to move it back.

Now, you are stating that you'd rather be killed so I do better? do you honestly believe that? wouldn't a civilian mindset prefer "We should kill you so that we can move past your suspicion of me?" especially if the suspicion came from what you felt was nowhere?

There is an angle where I can see otherwise, but I don't think this is the case. The chances aren't as great.

Is my suspicion still unwarranted?

Epignosis wrote:I answered your original question. Now you are asking a new question.

What prompts you to think that is needed?

Epignosis wrote:

Long Con wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:No, quite the opposite. MP being civ supported Epi and FZ being bad.

Lynching MP would've validated that or invalidated that.

The lack of stability in my read is that mafia made the kill that gave us the info. Had it been a lynching I would've voted FZ and Epi the next cycle in a heartbeat.

The reassessment I called for was because of this. I need to take a step back and reread with the flow of the conversation in mind, subject points and focuses of interaction to see if my original observations are supported by the new information (though it was gained through a nk).

Epi, during my brief skim, I recall you stating something along the lines of "Lynch me so Wilgy can be done with me" yes? What prompts you to think this is needed? Do you think I tunnel you without thought or judgement?

Not bad.

I look forward to hearing your reassessment conclusions.

Not bad? It's horrible. This is a closed setup where a lynch or Night kill provides the same information. MP being lynched wouldn't change the fact that I am a civilian and FZ. is whatever she is.

Horrid thinking.

No, it doesn't change your role. It changes how I approach a read.

Epignosis wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:Epi, during my brief skim, I recall you stating something along the lines of "Lynch me so Wilgy can be done with me" yes? What prompts you to think this is needed? Do you think I tunnel you without thought or judgement?

I do.

Can you answer the full question? Do you think my thoughts on you come from genuine suspicion?

No, quite the opposite. MP being civ supported Epi and FZ being bad.

Lynching MP would've validated that or invalidated that.

The lack of stability in my read is that mafia made the kill that gave us the info. Had it been a lynching I would've voted FZ and Epi the next cycle in a heartbeat.

The reassessment I called for was because of this. I need to take a step back and reread with the flow of the conversation in mind, subject points and focuses of interaction to see if my original observations are supported by the new information (though it was gained through a nk).

Epi, during my brief skim, I recall you stating something along the lines of "Lynch me so Wilgy can be done with me" yes? What prompts you to think this is needed? Do you think I tunnel you without thought or judgement?

Long Con wrote:Hardly the strongest convictions. It's a little much to publicly lament their reassessment.

But it really did. I'm unsure of the three I felt that there was a baddie amongst.

Now I have to rejudge that initial thought along with decide whom to vote. (My time is limited to also do so until tomorrow -__-)

Yee

DrWilgy wrote:

Long Con wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:Why MP?

I need to reassess.

This post stinks to me.

What is so unfathomable about MP dying if Wilgy genuinely thinks I'm bad? I've killed MP plenty of times.

Also, how was MP not at the top of the "likely to be killed" list? Most Active Civ, tried to protect the cop, seemed like he might BE the cop. If Wilgy needs to reassess, I'd like to hear what his original assessment of MP was, where he was an unlikely kill.

Y'all need to read my posts. There aren't many.

Fixed.

Long Con wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:Why MP?

I need to reassess.

This post stinks to me.

What is so unfathomable about MP dying if Wilgy genuinely thinks I'm bad? I've killed MP plenty of times.

Also, how was MP not at the top of the "likely to be killed" list? Most Active Civ, tried to protect the cop, seemed like he might BE the cop. If Wilgy needs to reassess, I'd like to hear what his original assessment of MP was, where he was an unlikely kill.
Y'all need to read my posts. There aren't many.

Why MP?

I need to reassess.

Epignosis wrote:

Epignosis wrote:How so, doctor?

Of course. Nothing to say.

I'm not going to sit here and deal with "He's so good at being bad I have to suspect him here." That isn't going to fly. Figure me out. Learn me. Get in my head. Don't come in here with "likeliness" nonsense. None of that is true.

If I take Wilgy's vote all game, he will have never once voted for mafia.

Good mornimg Epi. Of course I have something to say, so just chill a moment.

When you receive a baddie role it clearly changes your brain. What players are on your mind are different when compared to a civ, the cause and effects within the game are different to you as well. The processing of data obtained is manipulated by the fact that you have knowledge a civ wouldn't.

That's how the game works Epi. If mafia had no teammates or btsc, then yes the difference in how your brain is would be minimal, but the fact that you can receive a card that tells you an alignment puts different factors on the mind.

Civilian Epi can notice the trend of "I have the most baddie wins, why does everyone follow me."

I think it's more likely that baddie Epi can notice the trend "I'm bad, why do people follow me?" Then change that.

Who is more likely to be a baddie is all we got Epi. Telling me that it's nonsensical is silly.

Epignosis wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:What reason does a civ have to make the post below?

Epignosis wrote:I am continually amazed that the #1 FEB on the site leads more lynches than anybody else.

I also think its more likely that mafia Epi would notice this trend than civ Epi.

Right. My alignment determines whether or not I can go into the Hall of Fame, see that I've won more times than anyone else as mafia, and then revel in the irony that I lead more lynches than anybody else.

Get out of the city.

But I just moved back to the city.


Likeliness is what determines this. It's not impossible for that post to be civ. I just don't think it's likely.

Likelihood has nothing to do with it. My brain doesn't change because I get one alignment or the other.

Umm... but it does.

Epignosis wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:What reason does a civ have to make the post below?

Epignosis wrote:I am continually amazed that the #1 FEB on the site leads more lynches than anybody else.

I also think its more likely that mafia Epi would notice this trend than civ Epi.

Right. My alignment determines whether or not I can go into the Hall of Fame, see that I've won more times than anyone else as mafia, and then revel in the irony that I lead more lynches than anybody else.

Get out of the city.

But I just moved back to the city.


Likeliness is what determines this. It's not impossible for that post to be civ. I just don't think it's likely.

Epignosis wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:Going back to work. Lynch Epi everyone.

Your fascination with me is adorable.

Isn't it? Is it not? I think you gave me mafia ptsd in vocaroo.

Dyslexicon wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:Expanding on this, at the time of this posts it was 3 vs 4 with Hazelnut in the lead.

The order of votes was that the 3 on FZ came before the 4 on Hazelnut. I don't think it's likely there was a bussing on Hazelnut meaning a busser would have to tie thier teammate up if they are into that, then put them in the lead.

The exception would be Epignosis. Epignosis wouldn't have known in a 3v1 scenario that Hazelnut could take the lead, thus making him a possible busser.

This is all on the assumption Hazelnut is bad.

Going back to work. Lynch Epi everyone.

If this reasoning hinges on Nut being scum, why not vote Nut instead who actually already have a vote on her? As I see it Epi is pretty unlikely to get lynched as it stands, or do you disagree with this?

This isn't the reason why Epi is bad. Just an observation that includes someone I'm suspicious of.

@MP, how well did poe work out for you last time?

MovingPictures07 wrote:Bold assertion:

FZ. and nutella are mafia teammates.

Dammit. I was hoping you weren't bad. Now I'm not sure. Why even post this? Why title it a bold assertion? No duh it's a bold assertion.

Epignosis wrote:

nutella wrote:

Long Con wrote:Hi MP! You're probably bad k

I'm going back to wanting to think this as well.

More wiggle words from the wiggly won.

FZ. wrote:Civ reads:

Epi
Wilgy
Chuck

...

Oh, you answer this later, nvm

nutella wrote:Ugh lame. Good luck civs even if everyone is doing a shit job so far. Talk about disorganized.

If it makes you feel any better I missed out on my revenge because you died. Womp womp.

speedchuck wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:Ok... what the hell happened? I just got home from work...

We didn't lynch Epi


Why should we lynch Epi tomorrow?

Same reason when I called him bad originally.

What reason does a civ have to make the post below?

Epignosis wrote:I am continually amazed that the #1 FEB on the site leads more lynches than anybody else.

I also think its more likely that mafia Epi would notice this trend than civ Epi.


Tomorrow we could lynch FZ, MP, or Epi. I can confidently say that there is a baddie in this group. I doubt MP and Epi is a team however. I also doubt that FZ and MP are a team. Epi + FZ is plausible.

Ok... what the hell happened? I just got home from work...

DrWilgy wrote:Just considering the flow of votes, this is more likely a save than a bus.

Oh well.

Expanding on this, at the time of this posts it was 3 vs 4 with Hazelnut in the lead.

The order of votes was that the 3 on FZ came before the 4 on Hazelnut. I don't think it's likely there was a bussing on Hazelnut meaning a busser would have to tie thier teammate up if they are into that, then put them in the lead.

The exception would be Epignosis. Epignosis wouldn't have known in a 3v1 scenario that Hazelnut could take the lead, thus making him a possible busser.

This is all on the assumption Hazelnut is bad.

Going back to work. Lynch Epi everyone.

Epignosis wrote:I am continually amazed that the #1 FEB on the site leads more lynches than anybody else.

Aww... Epi is bad again.

Just considering the flow of votes, this is more likely a save than a bus.

Oh well.

Voted nutella for voting me in phenon.

Marmot wrote:

Epignosis wrote:I have voted DrWilgy. I will likely do so until I am satisfied with his production.

Remember that other game where DrWilgy's prosuction never met your standards? Why do you vote him here on Day 1?

You did play Blue vs Red right?

Epignosis wrote:I have voted DrWilgy. I will likely do so until I am satisfied with his production.

Boo!

Epi, you bad?

speedchuck wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:speedchuck makes me a nervous horse

As a horse farmer, I resemble that?

If a sheep tender is a shepard, what is a horse tender?

Eloh, are you bad this game?

JaggedJimmyJomps has been hacked by Vomps!

What a twiiiiiiiist!!!

Mafia, plz don't kill me early. I had to move away from my Wilgette and need this to keep my mind busy.

(and I'm still most definitely a doctor... just a zonked one...

So, who is bad?

Voted left for that dank tie.

Dyslexicon wrote:I'm town.

Doubt it.