The Syndicate

Quin wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 11:24 pm I was wondering what the reaction would be if I was lynched for DDL's theory that I was the SK and flipped mafia. It was really exciting.

The thought crossed my mind to chaos vote you at the last second and make it a tie but it would have been too embarrassing if DDL did turn out to be mafia.

It was the nature of the bus moreso. It really was well done but jeez it was risky to help civs lynch your homeboy on the first day.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 10:52 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 10:48 pm

Quin wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 10:40 pm 70 percent of the mafia win in this game was because we were collectively a successful mafia team.
30 percent was because of civilian inactivity at EoD.

We've all seen the benefits of an active EoD first hand. Don't neglect it.

I was here. I tried. I rationalised wrongly.

Epi looked like the most suspicious player on the day he was lynched to everyone but the one person with the benefit of knowing his role, himself.

Same for DDL.

Not that either looked all that bad. You had done a great job looking like a civ moreso. You bussed Bob and played a gambit that Faraday didn't freak out at enough.

Linki:

I showed my working. I had more suspicion of DDL than Quin after I had a chance to think about it. Quin had more outs man. DDL looked like the flailing scum. It was an echo of Shockheaded Peter.

That's my grievance though:

I laid out a specific reason or series of reasons why three people had to be civilians.

The only people I couldn't do that for were you and Quin.

You lynched me and said then seemed to be angry at the result. That's fine, but what I was hoping to hear was,"I'm a civilian, and Epignosis was a civilian. Therefore the last bad guy is Quin."

If I had have gone after Quin I wouldn't be surprised if it backfired on me. That aside, I just didn't feel like DDL's civilian claim was as good as Quin's.

[mention]ColinIsCool[/mention] god damn it you were here too defend yourself lol.

Quin did well. I didn't see him as Mafia at all really except for that one glimmer that faded that you quoted. I thought he was a civ out of the block. Maybe his bullshit analysis's that I caught onto I should have been more sure of or something. I'm pretty happy with my effort here. I don't think I could have done much better without Quin fucking something up more. I nailed Bob on the first day and wanted to go Nova over Leetic until it got to a tie. Maybe I fucked up there by not standing by my read. I'm pretty okay with my effort.

Quin wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 10:40 pm 70 percent of the mafia win in this game was because we were collectively a successful mafia team.
30 percent was because of civilian inactivity at EoD.

We've all seen the benefits of an active EoD first hand. Don't neglect it.

I was here. I tried. I rationalised wrongly.

Epi looked like the most suspicious player on the day he was lynched to everyone but the one person with the benefit of knowing his role, himself.

Same for DDL.

Not that either looked all that bad. You had done a great job looking like a civ moreso. You bussed Bob and played a gambit that Faraday didn't freak out at enough.

Linki:

I showed my working. I had more suspicion of DDL than Quin after I had a chance to think about it. Quin had more outs man. DDL looked like the flailing scum. It was an echo of Shockheaded Peter.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 10:28 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 10:26 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 10:02 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 9:46 pm

Quin wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 9:40 pm I almost went the whole game without using my role at all. I RB'd DF last night to guarantee the doctor's death and would've used it on Colin tonight, but I never used my role check.

It was a good game all around, it got tight at the end with basically everyone having some sort of soft-clear I had to fight but it worked out in the end. If people were around at this EoD it may not have gone the same way.

In my mind you won the game because of your CBob vote. The cajones.

If you watched my Shockheaded Peter game, you must understand why I was in no mood to award civilian credit just because someone voted a mafia member- even a powerful one.

If the civilians would have followed my LOGIC, the civilians would have won the game (even if it meant you dying). My enthusiasm in the late game was because I had figured it all out, and we had the lynch to spare.

The funny thing, Mac- and you tell me right now if I am wrong- is if I had gunned hard for Quin first instead of you, things would have turned out differently.

Lol the hubris. You spent your entire last day trying to lynch a civilian. To say you "had figured it all out". Come on man.

I will give you that if you hadn't have wrongly attacked me and instead tried to make a case on ... not me ... then I might have been able to entertain it. Given I was a civilian, I just couldn't agree with your assertions that I was in fact not one.

That notwithstanding yes had Colin, DFaraday and DDL sided with you against me rather than me against you then there's a strong chance that Quin would have been lynched the next day. I can see that.

Sorry I pushed your mislynch.

I just don't understand why, after a fresh mafia lynch, the enthusiasm in the thread took a massive shit. I mean, what the hell? Everybody should be in the thread going nuts- not "yeah, Epi is a good vote." *chews cud*

You and I were the ones driving the discussion. We were both attacking civilians so the other one was never given a chance to see the other as anything but an adversary.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 10:25 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 9:28 pm I am clutch.

Y'all lynching clutch.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 10:02 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 9:46 pm

Quin wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 9:40 pm I almost went the whole game without using my role at all. I RB'd DF last night to guarantee the doctor's death and would've used it on Colin tonight, but I never used my role check.

It was a good game all around, it got tight at the end with basically everyone having some sort of soft-clear I had to fight but it worked out in the end. If people were around at this EoD it may not have gone the same way.

In my mind you won the game because of your CBob vote. The cajones.

If you watched my Shockheaded Peter game, you must understand why I was in no mood to award civilian credit just because someone voted a mafia member- even a powerful one.

If the civilians would have followed my LOGIC, the civilians would have won the game (even if it meant you dying). My enthusiasm in the late game was because I had figured it all out, and we had the lynch to spare.

The funny thing, Mac- and you tell me right now if I am wrong- is if I had gunned hard for Quin first instead of you, things would have turned out differently.

Lol the hubris. You spent your entire last day trying to lynch a civilian. To say you "had figured it all out". Come on man.

I will give you that if you hadn't have wrongly attacked me and instead tried to make a case on ... not me ... then I might have been able to entertain it. Given I was a civilian, I just couldn't agree with your assertions that I was in fact not one.

That notwithstanding yes had Colin, DFaraday and DDL sided with you against me rather than me against you then there's a strong chance that Quin would have been lynched the next day. I can see that.

Sorry I pushed your mislynch.

Quin wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 9:40 pm I almost went the whole game without using my role at all. I RB'd DF last night to guarantee the doctor's death and would've used it on Colin tonight, but I never used my role check.

It was a good game all around, it got tight at the end with basically everyone having some sort of soft-clear I had to fight but it worked out in the end. If people were around at this EoD it may not have gone the same way.

In my mind you won the game because of your CBob vote. The cajones.

Sorry to the other civs, especially DDL and Epi. I used to be with 'it', but then they changed what 'it' was. Now what I'm with isn't 'it' anymore and what's 'it' seems weird and scary.

Well done Quin.

Sorry DDL.

Wow.

Am I tripping? 4 mins til EOD and all have abandoned?

13 mins. Anyone care to speak?

45 mins

Jeez that post was a clusterfuck of English

Colin and Quin are both fairly quiet. That makes me think they are civilians. If they were indie or Mafia they'd be trying to control the game outcome more, like DDL is.

I do believe it's possible that there is a Mafia and an indie left. A 2 player Mafia team in this game is too underpowered to make sense. I don't think there is only an indie and it is possible there are no indies. I'd say the former is rather likely. Given that there has only been one kill each night with the exception of Colin's vig kill it would seem like any indie present isn't a killing one. If there is a Mafia left it's damn certainly DDL. Not even he is making a case on anyone else being Mafia.

Colin has demonstrated an ability to kill (once) and Quin had a bulletproof vest. Of the two, a bulletproof vest is something that is often given to LMS indies to give them a better chance of survival. So I think DDL would be right about Quin being an indie. The question is whether he is benign or not.

So how do civilians win here if there is in fact both a Mafia and an indie left if that indie can't win with the civilians (and possesses the ability to make a kill after the Mafia faction is eliminated ie. after DDL is voted does Quin just kill one of us and win the game)?

If Colin and I are the only civilians left and Quin is a bad indie and DDL is Mafia. If we lynch DDL now thee game will end with Quin winning if he has a night kill. If the game continues and there is no night kill Colin and I should be able to just vote for Quin.

If we vote no lynch and let DDL kill again, he probably kills one of Colin or I and then tries to convince the other to vote with him against Quin at Lylo. In the scenario that the LYLO is a civ/indie/maf LYLO, and the indie stands alone, the civilian cannot win. The civilian becomes kingmaker between to decide who wins out of the other two. If we vote no lynch and let DDL kill again and the indie (quin) can win with the town, there's no purpose to letting DDL get out of today anyway.

So there are really only lynching DDL available here sadly. Either we do so and Quin wins as indie on his own or with us. Or I am wrong and there is no indie at all and the civilians win outright. I am willing to bank on the fact that there isn't a 2 person Mafia team in a game of this size and if there is, well, sorry DDL.

Oh you are referring to you watched as host got it.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2019 6:32 pm This hurts because I spent a full game watching a pack of clueless civs, and mafia, constantly assume I would never add an indie to the setup.

You would think the experience would have been branded on their skins.

But here we are again, assuming indies are less likely to be in the game than a third mafia, for no rational reason.

None of what you said here is actually true though. Nobody has "constantly assumed you would never add an indie." The things you're accusing us of are not true.

I don't think you are genuinely entertaining the notion that there are only two Mafia. You haven't even sought to clarify whether we get told when a faction is defeated. Even if you are, it's the natural thing for a POE clamped Mafia to do.

You're also hell bent on the assertion that Quin is an "SK" that keeps killing after the Mafia die and haven't entertained the notion that perhaps he (or I, or Colin) are indies that aren't malevolent but are rather LMS style indies, which are frequently on this site.

Also 2 Mafia in this game? What a weak Mafia faction. Sucks to be them?

3 people who were on the Bob train vs. 1 that wasn't.

Personally that's enough for me.

Those last two posts are confusing.

Don't get me wrong. I'm gonna vote for DDL unless something absolutely wild happens.

Oi [mention]Quin[/mention]. Before I saw you I didn't know you could stack crap so high.

I want to hear Quin first.

Lol

It's still true? As in you're right I am doing all those things but I really do get mislynched?

Concede?

I do suppose DFaraday's doctor claim needs scrutiny. The strongman kill could have existed to counter Quin.

They're a thing. Common isn't the word though.

Quin wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2019 3:10 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:13 pm DFaraday has a bulletproof claim

Huh?

There is a strongman. Ergo there is a doctor. DFaraday has claimed doctor. Nobody has countered it. He is untouchable. Ergo "bulletproof".

I'm not one to sit around on a critical day and not post anything. That's more of a you thing going by recent history.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:29 pm That said I'm personally offended if you think I can't elaborate most of it in half an hour.

No you aren't.

Yeah maybe I should have also shot a guy and then I would have put in a better effort.

Yeah I really don't feel like I put my best foot forward here. I should have managed to get the Mafia lynched on consecutive days instead of just the Godfather on the first one. Not good enough quite frankly.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:25 pm Don't blame yourself too much, I made a conscious decision to vote for Epi and only come back after the day ended because I thought he was the Occam's Razor vote.

Now the razor is dead and we have to shave using a kitchen knife.

Yeah thanks man I really appreciate it. I was really hard on myself there for a minute and you helped me see the sunshine.

ColinIsCool wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:23 pm

I wasn't saying I believe him. I was just complimenting him for the way he is coddling me.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:18 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:08 pm

ColinIsCool wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:06 pm

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:04 pm Ok hear me out:

1- Quin is a bulletproof serial killer who starts killing after the mafia is gone.

2- Colin is a serial killer who starts killing after the mafia is gone.

Pick one.

How can I have killed nova if I don’t have the ability to kill yet?

Notwithstanding he literally said that the SK kills after the Mafia is gone and then proceeded to make out like the Mafia still need solving.

Good game DDL.

No I didn't.

Here is what i'm trying to say.

We either have 1 mafia or 1 hostile indie left (aka serial killer in most games).

If it's a mafia, one of that has to be true:

- I used my ability to reaload civ shots instead of mafia shots, including a watcher (aka the best investigation ability ever) and a doctor.
- Mafia skipped a kill on purpose just so Quin could fake claim BP.
- Mafia had an extra kill, and Colin used it on a teammate.
- There is no civ doctor in the game, and the strongman role is meant just to bypass Quin
- There is a mafia tracker and you bussed your godfather to save yourself

All 5 of those are crazy. #3 is fucking insane. The others are ridiculous too.

Now if it's a serial killer:

- I'm a serial killer who can reload shots from other players (even crazier than the mafia DDL theory)
- Quin is a bulletproof SK who starts killing after mafia is gone.
- Colin is a SK who could kill before but not every night, or chose not to kill every night.
- There is no civ doctor in the game, and the strongman role is meant just to bypass Quin (same as above)
- Mac is a SK with a tracking ability

Most of those are still insane, but the Quin theory is not. Other than the fact I'm civ reading Quin. But I trust logic before I trust my civ reads.

Either way, I urge you people analyse all 10 of those and see if you agree or disagree with me on which ones are more unlikely.

If you dismiss what I just wrote and just say "lol DDL got caught now he's saying crazy stuff" I'll give you a bastard role in my next game.

I won't say DDL got caught and now he's saying crazy stuff.

What I will say is that you thought long and hard about this and had this entire thing prepared before the Epi flip. This isn't off the cuff. The only way you do this is if you know Epi doesn't flip civ.

You also really laboured on the positive side of why your actions were civ and kind of brushed over the others.

Look man, if you're a civ and right about this theory then hats off to you for being the only one to see it. From my seat I can't see anything but this.

DDL is Mafia. His role is to reload his buddies. He didn't vote for his Godfather. He rationalised that the best use of his role was to make two civs feel more confident that he is a townie by giving them more shots.

I'm sorry, don't get mad, but I just can't buy your theory when this really obvious one is on the table.

See you are doing the right things here. Being all pragmatic. Buttering me up. Not coming out attacking me like Epi did. I want to trust and believe you. I wanted to tear Epi's head off.

If he had have acted like you he probably wouldn't have been lynched.

Bad [mention]Epignosis[/mention]. Smack for Epi.

I do like bastard roles.

ColinIsCool wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:12 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:10 pm Colin please tell me you're a two shot vig lol

Nope, I hung up my guns already.

DDL can you put another bullet in his chamber so he can shoot you please?

Colin shot a Mafia
Mac got a Mafia Godfather lynched on day one
Quin got shot at and lived
DFaraday has a bulletproof claim
DDL has a role that refills chambers

One of those things is not like the other.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:11 pm Mac stop playing like Epi. Also take more than 10 seconds to read before posting. You just misinterpreted a post of mine and now I have to wait time fixing that.

Playing like Epi lol.

Colin please tell me you're a two shot vig lol

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:08 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:07 pm

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:05 pm That's the SK side of things.

The mafia side of things is also possible but afaik we are all soft confirmed.

You're not confirmed. Your role could easily be a Mafia role.

Neither are you. Mafia trackers are a thing.

Fuck Mafia trackers being a thing. Trackers are an easy ass fake claim. You don't even know how to cast doubt on me properly hahaha.

I'm a civilian for the same reason everyone removed me from the pool on day 2. Don't let time mix you up. You're POE jammed as far as I'm concerned.

Don't drink and post as Mafia kids.

I dunno why you did this. You should have just stfu and tried to make a case against me.

ColinIsCool wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:06 pm

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:04 pm Ok hear me out:

1- Quin is a bulletproof serial killer who starts killing after the mafia is gone.

2- Colin is a serial killer who starts killing after the mafia is gone.

Pick one.

How can I have killed nova if I don’t have the ability to kill yet?

Notwithstanding he literally said that the SK kills after the Mafia is gone and then proceeded to make out like the Mafia still need solving.

Good game DDL.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:05 pm That's the SK side of things.

The mafia side of things is also possible but afaik we are all soft confirmed.

You're not confirmed. Your role could easily be a Mafia role.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:04 pm Ok hear me out:

1- Quin is a bulletproof serial killer who starts killing after the mafia is gone.

2- Colin is a serial killer who starts killing after the mafia is gone.

Pick one.

You're talkative all of a sudden.

I'd pick Quin between them if either of those were true.