The Syndicate

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon Jan 01, 2024 7:37 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Mon Jan 01, 2024 4:05 am Perhaps the biggest problem with the game's balance is that, even if all of Porscha's, robyn's, and tutuu's complaints about the setup were fixed, the Oracle still would have broken the setup. Let me explain.

Now this is my first time playing in a game that had any sort of Oracle role in it. Now the difficult thing about balancing Oracles is that it's not the role itself that causes problems, it's the information that the host gives the Oracle that determines the level of power. Now for the first two days, it was fine. D1, "no townies had BTSC" was effectively confirmed due to the other statements being contradictory, but it was no big deal; it isn't exactly a huge revelation about the game and Mason and Neighborizer are virtually never used as scum fakeclaims anyways. D2 was also fine, "double targeting" was meaningless to someone who didn't understand the hosting and "one person was found to be town" isn't something that can't be confirmed by a well-placed Voyeur shot. The problem was in D3, with the statement "No one has a voted for a baddie yet." This is an absurd amount of information to give any role, as it basically confirmed a lot of people as town and singlehandedly jeopardized any chance the wolves had of winning. If the wolves hadn't forfeited, I definitely would have looked into who would have been indicted by this; I distinctly remember thinking that tutuu, who I otherwise townread, would have been indicted by this and so I began to doubt in that slot. In fact, the main reason I was hesitant to believe it is tat I thought it would be a ridiculous amount of information to give to someone; it is almost on the level of allowing someone in spoiled chat to still post. Even without the host slip that basically confirmed that a Janitor wasn't in the game, the fact that Long Con was familiar enough with your hosting style to know that a janitor was very unlikely was enough information to almost confirm it, and just one wolf flip would have immediately sealed the deal for the entire team. If you are going to use a role like that in the future, please consider the implications on the game if each of the "true" statements were mod-confirmed, since the information I got out of the Oracle role is much more than any Cop or Watcher could ever hope for. Oh well, at least I can count this as the game where I randed the most overpowered town role.

As for the setup itself, I don't have as much complaints as some others. Town blocker is fine, 1x Vig is fine, JOAT is fine, Doctor is mostly fine though I would have replaced it with a weaker role like Bodyguard or Angel given the amount of protection already in the setup, even night Ascetic is mostly fine though there probably should have been a limit to how deathproof they were, post restrictor is not fun to be hit by but not overpowered per se. The big issue here was mechanics, the wolves not being able to kill anyone they had targeted the previous night turns every wolf role into effectively being an Angel, which makes them arguably negative utility for wolves. This especially could have led to really weird -yLo shenanigans. Another thing I suggest for hosts is that if one of your rulings differs from the standard, then players should know at the beginning of the game! This is something I've had issues with as a host before, to be fair, but the wolf team should at the very least have been able to plan around the no double targeting rule from the beginning, and I honestly would have not had it in effect for N1 since they couldn't have reasonably fully anticipated the effects of their N0 actions.

Overall, I did have some fun here (when I was not being post restricted) and I am glad to have my first win in a while. Still, I understand why the wolves are frustrated here.
But the statement was false. Robyn had been voted and so had Porscha. So it meant nothing. All you knew if you pieced it correctly was that a wolf had been voted and well duh.

It was confirmed true by there not being a janitor in the game, so it was likely referring to not having any votes at EoD, which still cleared a lot of people

Perhaps the biggest problem with the game's balance is that, even if all of Porscha's, robyn's, and tutuu's complaints about the setup were fixed, the Oracle still would have broken the setup. Let me explain.

Now this is my first time playing in a game that had any sort of Oracle role in it. Now the difficult thing about balancing Oracles is that it's not the role itself that causes problems, it's the information that the host gives the Oracle that determines the level of power. Now for the first two days, it was fine. D1, "no townies had BTSC" was effectively confirmed due to the other statements being contradictory, but it was no big deal; it isn't exactly a huge revelation about the game and Mason and Neighborizer are virtually never used as scum fakeclaims anyways. D2 was also fine, "double targeting" was meaningless to someone who didn't understand the hosting and "one person was found to be town" isn't something that can't be confirmed by a well-placed Voyeur shot. The problem was in D3, with the statement "No one has a voted for a baddie yet." This is an absurd amount of information to give any role, as it basically confirmed a lot of people as town and singlehandedly jeopardized any chance the wolves had of winning. If the wolves hadn't forfeited, I definitely would have looked into who would have been indicted by this; I distinctly remember thinking that tutuu, who I otherwise townread, would have been indicted by this and so I began to doubt in that slot. In fact, the main reason I was hesitant to believe it is tat I thought it would be a ridiculous amount of information to give to someone; it is almost on the level of allowing someone in spoiled chat to still post. Even without the host slip that basically confirmed that a Janitor wasn't in the game, the fact that Long Con was familiar enough with your hosting style to know that a janitor was very unlikely was enough information to almost confirm it, and just one wolf flip would have immediately sealed the deal for the entire team. If you are going to use a role like that in the future, please consider the implications on the game if each of the "true" statements were mod-confirmed, since the information I got out of the Oracle role is much more than any Cop or Watcher could ever hope for. Oh well, at least I can count this as the game where I randed the most overpowered town role.

As for the setup itself, I don't have as much complaints as some others. Town blocker is fine, 1x Vig is fine, JOAT is fine, Doctor is mostly fine though I would have replaced it with a weaker role like Bodyguard or Angel given the amount of protection already in the setup, even night Ascetic is mostly fine though there probably should have been a limit to how deathproof they were, post restrictor is not fun to be hit by but not overpowered per se. The big issue here was mechanics, the wolves not being able to kill anyone they had targeted the previous night turns every wolf role into effectively being an Angel, which makes them arguably negative utility for wolves. This especially could have led to really weird -yLo shenanigans. Another thing I suggest for hosts is that if one of your rulings differs from the standard, then players should know at the beginning of the game! This is something I've had issues with as a host before, to be fair, but the wolf team should at the very least have been able to plan around the no double targeting rule from the beginning, and I honestly would have not had it in effect for N1 since they couldn't have reasonably fully anticipated the effects of their N0 actions.

Overall, I did have some fun here (when I was not being post restricted) and I am glad to have my first win in a while. Still, I understand why the wolves are frustrated here.

sig wrote: ↑Sun Dec 31, 2023 4:58 pm Told y’all Robyn was mafia and I was civ

Alsooooooo given the game ended right before the new years I say we count this towards 2024

Come on, it's my one win this year

I do have a couple of criticisms of the hosting, namely, that you confirmed information that shouldn't have been confirmed. Basically confirming that there was no janitor ended up confirming a lot of things and would have basically outed the wolves by itself as a result of my role. Revealing the mafia wasn't targeted by anything to them, even to dissuade them from forfeiting, is also a lot of information that they shouldn't have access to. Also, with directly interacting with players like you did with Serhal, just don't, if you need to send them a message privately.

As for the setup, I'm not exactly a fan of roles like Silencer or Post Restrictor, as they can mess with parity and the former in particular can be ridiculously powerful in wolf hands. The latter was mitigated somewhat by the no double targeting role, but that led to balance issues of its own. Also, if I'm understanding this correctly, can only one of the wolf roles perform nightkills? That would make the setup ridiculously swingy if true

MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 10:25 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 10:23 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 10:19 pm @leetic time to full claim mate. Why'd you silence me?
Why'd you commit wire fraud?
avoiding the question is very sus

I could say the same for you, and that is a much more serious allegation

MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 10:19 pm @leetic time to full claim mate. Why'd you silence me?

Why'd you commit wire fraud?

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 10:04 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 10:03 pm Come on guys, it's obvious that Wolf leetic has a role that forces good Townsfolk to say crazy things. Poor Robyn!
Fuck You're right [VOTE: leetic [VOTE: [vote/]] aubergine] aubergine

[VOTE:

I'm the fucking Oracle. Why wouldn't that be announced when silenced and cursed are?] aubergine

Unless there is a cult in the setup (highly unlikely) town loses nothing by dealing with the wolves first.

robyn wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 9:45 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 9:44 pm If I was the host I'd modkill almost everyone for flagrantly playing against wincon. Just sayin'.
bro we mechanically lost already, u understand that much?

even if ur chopped here for the memes we lose

That's what you want us to think

If I was the host I'd modkill almost everyone for flagrantly playing against wincon. Just sayin'.

[VOTE: tutuu] aubergine

tutuu wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 9:34 pm also we have no janitor. we don't know how falcon was janitored

once again, it probably came from leetic

It was basically confirmed by the host to be mech, plus you confessed to the kill anyway

Just kill the outed wolves, it's not fucking difficult. This would be the dumbest mislynch of all time. Yes, of all time.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 9:30 pm like imagine if wolves all outed here and poor Leetic is a 3p survivor like... welp

I'm a fucking Oracle

Even if I was a survivor, this would be a guaranteed win unless the wolves decide to be petty (which I have seen before unfortunately)

MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 9:29 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 9:19 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 8:56 pm
tutuu wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 8:55 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 8:54 pm Let's all converge on Porscha so this can be over
i think that we should chop leetic it will be really funny
[VOTE: leetic] aubergine
You really want to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory
Hey guys what if Leetic is a 3p hence why the game isn't over?

You obviously flip the outed mafia first

MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 8:56 pm
tutuu wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 8:55 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 8:54 pm Let's all converge on Porscha so this can be over
i think that we should chop leetic it will be really funny
[VOTE: leetic] aubergine

You really want to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory

tutuu wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 8:55 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 8:54 pm Let's all converge on Porscha so this can be over
i think that we should chop leetic it will be really funny

I think you're a looney

Also don't know why LC is voting with the wolves

Let's all converge on Porscha so this can be over

tutuu wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 7:53 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 7:52 pm
robyn wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 7:51 pm this game was genuinely unplayable
the you 3 gaslighting me while I checkered around narrowing the poe over and over was fun at least...
i agree, it was fun pocketing you and at one point leetic had the 3 of us as top townreads. i said in wolf chat that i'm taking it as a small dub

In fairness, I couldn't do my typical solving with the post restriction

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 7:33 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 2:13 pm Leetic has a passive role that I doubt wolves would roleblock.

I have a reflexive roleblocker.

Leetic was roleblocked.

Nobody was silenced (host confirmed no less).

...

Leetic probably targeted me with silence.

Therefore Leetic is unclaimed silencer who likes silencing townies and is mafia.
here here

You got me! I'm really a cult leader! Night 0 I targeted falcon, night 1 I targeted Serhal, and night 2 I targeted Mac!

More seriously, can we end this now?

tutuu wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 7:20 pm trust me leetic u need to vote for urself

i know u wont believe me

but i have no time to explain

i have mech reasons. we are all afflicted with a curse

u need to do it now leetic. FAST. DONT HESITATE. BEFORE HOSTS MODKILL ME FOR BREAKING THE CURSE

Nice try

tutuu wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 7:16 pm i think i should out my role

i am the grinch

i targeted robyn last night. i cursed them with the affliction that they need to "ruin christmas"

i dont know what this means but i thought it would be funny

anyway looks like robyn is forced to lie about me being mafia with them. im not. im innocent town. robyn might be town too

i think we have a good case that leetic is mafia

Respect for still trying to salvage this I guess

Wolves have outed, why am I still the biggest wagon

robyn wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 7:03 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 7:02 pm Wait, is this over? If so, that was easy
yes, it was

Lame

Wait, is this over? If so, that was easy

tutuu wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 6:51 pm let the calm spirit of water flow within you, robyn

never give up

mafia is not over until the last post has been posted

why did leetic visit mac last night? very suspicious

[VOTE: leetic] aubergine

Why did you rob a bank today? Very suspicious

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:52 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:50 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Thu Dec 21, 2023 1:00 pm This will be an interesting game; I'll have to sort the truth from the lies!
I fucking softed in the ninth post of the game. You really think this is some sort of convoluted gambit to claim my teammate's role?
look. I don't have the exact answer as to what your role is or how it is being used. maybe you are some oracle / mod post role. but you also visited mac. who roleblocks visitors. and there was also no night kill. what else am I supposed to believe happened here?

I did not visit anybody. The only way this works if if you're lying or there is a manipulative role in play.

☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:46 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:46 pm
☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:45 pm Porscha town leetic mod poster

Bet
mod poster?
I posited some time ago that Leetics reliance on mod posts to defend themself is in fact a mafia role that allows them to make mod posts

If I had that ability, why would I waste it on "town has no BTSC"?

☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:46 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:46 pm
☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:45 pm Porscha town leetic mod poster

Bet
mod poster?
I posited some time ago that Leetics reliance on mod posts to defend themself is in fact a mafia role that allows them to make mod posts

If I had that ability, why would I waste it on "town has no BTSC"?

leetic wrote: ↑Thu Dec 21, 2023 1:00 pm This will be an interesting game; I'll have to sort the truth from the lies!

I fucking softed in the ninth post of the game. You really think this is some sort of convoluted gambit to claim my teammate's role?

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:46 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:44 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:43 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:41 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:40 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:40 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:39 pm

is that advice to yourself xd
It's wisdom from the Oracle; you better heed it
sorry, I only heed feedback from the host
And my role is host-confirmed, so…
okay if I take your word on this, all it does is confirm there is an oracle. not that YOU are the oracle
No one cc'd me lol
yes as we all know, cc's always happen right away cleanly and promptly and also never amongst teammates

They had over twenty-four hours, it never happened. Plus, I softed Oracle in my opening post

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:43 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:41 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:40 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:40 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:39 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:38 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:38 pm

it's actually very inconvenient for me
There's a simple solution: don't fakeclaim!
is that advice to yourself xd
It's wisdom from the Oracle; you better heed it
sorry, I only heed feedback from the host
And my role is host-confirmed, so…
okay if I take your word on this, all it does is confirm there is an oracle. not that YOU are the oracle

No one cc'd me lol

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:40 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:38 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:36 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:36 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:32 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:31 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:30 pm

Given that you can't come up with a counterargument, it is
lol

you already know what I saw

and saying "no I didnt" isn't a good defense
Saying "that's not what the SoD posts say" is. If I'm not the Oracle, then who is?
what are you talking about
My role is confirmed by the SoD posts and no one has CC'd me
This is strong proof that either Leetic is telling the truth, or that he claimed his teammate's role. I forget if there was a good reason to do that, when it happened. Dodging trackers I guess? Still seems unlikely.
was there a night kill last night?

You'd know if you actually bothered to read the SoD posts

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:40 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:40 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:39 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:38 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:38 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:37 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:25 pm

I am a 2 shot, holstered n0 and tracked falcon n1 - he didnt move
Also, super convenient you tracked the one person who can't dispute your claim
it's actually very inconvenient for me
There's a simple solution: don't fakeclaim!
is that advice to yourself xd
It's wisdom from the Oracle; you better heed it
sorry, I only heed feedback from the host

And my role is host-confirmed, so…

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:39 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:38 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:38 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:37 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:25 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:24 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:23 pm The clarity is that I tracked leetic last night and received feedback that he visited mac so unless a redirector would like to come forward and take the responsibility for this, then youre lying about your role entirely
Other tracks from previous nights?
I am a 2 shot, holstered n0 and tracked falcon n1 - he didnt move
Also, super convenient you tracked the one person who can't dispute your claim
it's actually very inconvenient for me
There's a simple solution: don't fakeclaim!
is that advice to yourself xd

It's wisdom from the Oracle; you better heed it

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:38 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:37 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:25 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:24 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:23 pm The clarity is that I tracked leetic last night and received feedback that he visited mac so unless a redirector would like to come forward and take the responsibility for this, then youre lying about your role entirely
Other tracks from previous nights?
I am a 2 shot, holstered n0 and tracked falcon n1 - he didnt move
Also, super convenient you tracked the one person who can't dispute your claim
it's actually very inconvenient for me

There's a simple solution: don't fakeclaim!

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:37 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:36 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:36 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:32 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:31 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:30 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:29 pm very good defense!
Given that you can't come up with a counterargument, it is
lol

you already know what I saw

and saying "no I didnt" isn't a good defense
Saying "that's not what the SoD posts say" is. If I'm not the Oracle, then who is?
what are you talking about
My role is confirmed by the SoD posts and no one has CC'd me
how do you mean?

If you can't read the SoD posts, it's not my problem

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:25 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:24 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:23 pm The clarity is that I tracked leetic last night and received feedback that he visited mac so unless a redirector would like to come forward and take the responsibility for this, then youre lying about your role entirely
Other tracks from previous nights?
I am a 2 shot, holstered n0 and tracked falcon n1 - he didnt move

Also, super convenient you tracked the one person who can't dispute your claim

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:36 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:32 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:31 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:30 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:29 pm very good defense!
Given that you can't come up with a counterargument, it is
lol

you already know what I saw

and saying "no I didnt" isn't a good defense
Saying "that's not what the SoD posts say" is. If I'm not the Oracle, then who is?
what are you talking about

My role is confirmed by the SoD posts and no one has CC'd me

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:35 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:34 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:33 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:31 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:30 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:28 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:25 pm

I am a 2 shot, holstered n0 and tracked falcon n1 - he didnt move
No other role has been x-shot as far as I'm aware? The closest is LC's JOAT claim
and?
Why would there be only one, given that tracker isn't really more powerful than e.g. town blocker?

I just remembered Vig was one-shot, but 1x vigs are standard
it's what santa gave me
So what you're saying is someone can confirm that, and if they can't it's confirmed BS
no. i'm saying its what my role isn't.

FTFY

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:33 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:31 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:30 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:28 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:25 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:24 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:23 pm The clarity is that I tracked leetic last night and received feedback that he visited mac so unless a redirector would like to come forward and take the responsibility for this, then youre lying about your role entirely
Other tracks from previous nights?
I am a 2 shot, holstered n0 and tracked falcon n1 - he didnt move
No other role has been x-shot as far as I'm aware? The closest is LC's JOAT claim
and?
Why would there be only one, given that tracker isn't really more powerful than e.g. town blocker?

I just remembered Vig was one-shot, but 1x vigs are standard
it's what santa gave me

So what you're saying is someone can confirm that, and if they can't it's confirmed BS

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:31 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:30 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:29 pm very good defense!
Given that you can't come up with a counterargument, it is
lol

you already know what I saw

and saying "no I didnt" isn't a good defense

Saying "that's not what the SoD posts say" is. If I'm not the Oracle, then who is?

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:31 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:29 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:22 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:21 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:21 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:20 pm My action doesn't even have a target, so how could my target be manipulated even in the event I was redirected?
Well, of course, you would also be accused of lying about your role in this scenario.
But my role is confirmable?
I would take it as "you are the silencer and your teammate is the Oracle" kind of angle.
Why would a wolf Oracle not take advantage of an easily confirmable claim and instead give it to their teammate?
well you cant be an oracle so that's a moot point

But my role is basically mod-confirmed. Do I have to go over this again?

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:30 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:28 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:25 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:24 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:23 pm The clarity is that I tracked leetic last night and received feedback that he visited mac so unless a redirector would like to come forward and take the responsibility for this, then youre lying about your role entirely
Other tracks from previous nights?
I am a 2 shot, holstered n0 and tracked falcon n1 - he didnt move
No other role has been x-shot as far as I'm aware? The closest is LC's JOAT claim
and?

Why would there be only one, given that tracker isn't really more powerful than e.g. town blocker?

I just remembered Vig was one-shot, but 1x vigs are standard

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:29 pm very good defense!

Given that you can't come up with a counterargument, it is

Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:22 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:21 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:21 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:20 pm My action doesn't even have a target, so how could my target be manipulated even in the event I was redirected?
Well, of course, you would also be accused of lying about your role in this scenario.
But my role is confirmable?
I would take it as "you are the silencer and your teammate is the Oracle" kind of angle.

Why would a wolf Oracle not take advantage of an easily confirmable claim and instead give it to their teammate?

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:23 pm The clarity is that I tracked leetic last night and received feedback that he visited mac so unless a redirector would like to come forward and take the responsibility for this, then youre lying about your role entirely

Oracles don't visit anybody.

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:25 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:24 pm
Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:23 pm The clarity is that I tracked leetic last night and received feedback that he visited mac so unless a redirector would like to come forward and take the responsibility for this, then youre lying about your role entirely
Other tracks from previous nights?
I am a 2 shot, holstered n0 and tracked falcon n1 - he didnt move

No other role has been x-shot as far as I'm aware? The closest is LC's JOAT claim

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