The Syndicate

Congrats, Wolbre, on the quiz (and the ass class win). You're one of the best new players I've seen around in a while. Can't wait to play more with you!

Won't be here, but I'm looking forward to reading the quiz!

Lol at me guessing Jack's strategy.

I wasn't trying to survive at that point in the game. All my burnout permitted was me figuring out jack and confusing everyone regarding my allies. Worked okay.

Good game, all. Town had us sweating even in the first half of the game. Thanks to Nova for aligning woth the guy who was trying to buy town points off of his flip.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed May 16, 2018 6:27 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Wed May 16, 2018 6:20 pm remember when kyle only cared about having fun. remember when kyle used to mock me and jay for playing for the win. remember those days?

don't worry Kyle, we have this.

simple game victories don't do it for me any more

the only win i care about is winning the top rank in the "who's won the most games in 2018" list

By introducing you to the real game, I've ruined mafia for you. Never again will the individual games hold the same gravitas. Now go sign up for literally everything.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed May 16, 2018 6:19 pm plz don't let speedchuck's team win this one, cus if they do I'm gonna be at a 2 game deficit for most games won in 2018 and it's gonna be a bigger hassle to fix :\

Scotty wrote: ↑Mon May 07, 2018 12:09 pm Why has no one done a speedchuck breakdown yet?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 5:19 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 4:48 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:39 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:32 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:10 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:04 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:02 pm It appears one of the indies has not picked a side yet. Why are you sure that’s not Jack, speedchuck?

Jack had an abrupt change in behavior today. One of the 3Ps had an abrupt change of alignment today.
That's my theory. It's not bulletproof.

It seems he’s become more serious. Is that a problem?

Why would it be a problem?

It's a solution.

I was under the impression that you’ve been pushing him as a suspect. Was that a mistake on my part. I see you are voting for quin now, and you said you could vote for nova out of self-preservation. Who’s your real top suspect?

It's clearly Sprityo.

I'm playing Process of Elimination here. Trying to sort people out.

This addresses none of my questions.

I missed the first question. No, twas not a mistake. If you read my posts, you would see the thought process.

Don't have a top suspect. I am equal opportunity suspects. That's how I POE.

I'm not going to be here for poll end, and I expect to spend the few minutes I have left today on The Genius. Lynch who you want.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:39 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:32 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:10 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:04 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:02 pm It appears one of the indies has not picked a side yet. Why are you sure that’s not Jack, speedchuck?

Jack had an abrupt change in behavior today. One of the 3Ps had an abrupt change of alignment today.
That's my theory. It's not bulletproof.

It seems he’s become more serious. Is that a problem?

Why would it be a problem?

It's a solution.

I was under the impression that you’ve been pushing him as a suspect. Was that a mistake on my part. I see you are voting for quin now, and you said you could vote for nova out of self-preservation. Who’s your real top suspect?

It's clearly Sprityo.

I'm playing Process of Elimination here. Trying to sort people out.

Scotty wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:27 pm Tinfoil: jack is indie, has been communicating anonymously with the leader of the Persians, speed. He’s since figured out speed’s identity, since the leader of the Athenians is already dead. He’s since joined town and is selling out speed

Also, if the leader of Athens died, someone would take over the anon communication seamlessly. It says in the leader's post that he communicates through the host.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:10 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:04 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:02 pm It appears one of the indies has not picked a side yet. Why are you sure that’s not Jack, speedchuck?

Jack had an abrupt change in behavior today. One of the 3Ps had an abrupt change of alignment today.
That's my theory. It's not bulletproof.

It seems he’s become more serious. Is that a problem?

Why would it be a problem?

It's a solution.

Scotty wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:27 pm Tinfoil: jack is indie, has been communicating anonymously with the leader of the Persians, speed. He’s since figured out speed’s identity, since the leader of the Athenians is already dead. He’s since joined town and is selling out speed

See, this is how players should be thinking.

It's wrong, but it at least considers game mechanics.

linki: oh good Jack confirmed.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:25 pm Okay great. My theory is the same. You care more about if I’m 3P and if so, what I will do with that than you care about finding baddies. Cause you know where the baddies are. Cause you’re bad.

The 3P players are equal in number to the scum players, and are the difference right now as to whether we are about to lose horribly or are POEing down to victory among friends. They also explain, in my opinion, a lot about the flow in the thread. I can't ignore them.

And because I've been focused on you, trying to ascertain your alignment, you think I'm overly focused on 3Ps. (and also because I was asked about them.)

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:19 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:18 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:15 pm Why do you think Quin is bad?

Usually Quin is my first townread in a game. I usually see a genuine spark of towniness from him early. But in this game, I'm hard-pressed to say that he's had any impact on me one way or another. I have zero reason to read him as town.

Well, I pretty much feel the exact same way. I don't have a reason to scum read him either really, but here we are.

I guess it's more of a meta-read then.

He's not even in the IDGAF crowd. He's just invisible. I try to pay attention to the flow of the game, and the way people are playing it, over 'scumtells.' That's where my 3P read on Jack comes from. Quin is just playing invisible, and that's something I'd expect from scum, and definitely not from town Quin.

That's why your 'flow' irked me in the moment when you jerked the Marmot rug out from under me right after explaining why he was metatown. Most of your other content has been decent.

That's how I read nowadays. I don't have time to play like I did in Phenon a year ago.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:21 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:04 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:02 pm It appears one of the indies has not picked a side yet. Why are you sure that’s not Jack, speedchuck?

Jack had an abrupt change in behavior today. One of the 3Ps had an abrupt change of alignment today.
That's my theory. It's not bulletproof.

I thought your theory was that I would change based on how you flip. Now I’ve changed based on a changed alignment of a 3P that hadn’t happened yet?

None of this does anything but underline that your’re more concerned with 3P than scum, which is a good portion of my arguement against you.

That WAS my theory. The theory has changed thanks to new info from the OP. New theory makes more sense with your're playstyle and POV.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:15 pm Why do you think Quin is bad?

Usually Quin is my first townread in a game. I usually see a genuine spark of towniness from him early. But in this game, I'm hard-pressed to say that he's had any impact on me one way or another. I have zero reason to read him as town.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 3:02 pm It appears one of the indies has not picked a side yet. Why are you sure that’s not Jack, speedchuck?

Jack had an abrupt change in behavior today. One of the 3Ps had an abrupt change of alignment today.
That's my theory. It's not bulletproof.

[VOTE: Quin] aubergine for now.

I will totally vote Nova to save myself. I'm not THAT confident in my townreads. :P

linki: I had a hard Nova townread on D1, and since then, the only suspicion I've noted against him has been "Oh, you defended/pursued the wrong people" which is like, the easiest way to frame someone because townies don't know what they are doing.

But I've been skimming. What's up?

So yeah, if Jack is 3P, he's picked an alignment now. Which aligns with his play and makes me less likely to consider him as a scum pretender.

Don't really want to lynch Nova though.

Scotty wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:48 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:42 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:38 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:38 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:34 pm i feel most comfortable after negotiation with the voices in my head with nova getting lynched, then speed. But I feel like it would be asking a lot of the 6 people on speed’s train to switch and I don’t really feel like I have any footing to defend speed with any confidence so.

Just for shits. (Turnip, don’t think jack is taking off today anyway)

[VOTE: Nova] aubergine

I’ll keep the nova train healthy

I’m still thinking over everything. I don’t want to railroad speed but at the same time I don’t feel inspired to move.

lol I don’t feel inspired to get you to move

Same here, and I feel bad about it.

It's like when you set aside time for homework and all you wanna do is play video games. I'm pretty sure that if I don't get lynched today, I'll get lynched tomorrow. The only alternative on the menu that I think is scummy is Jack. MP's not on the menu. Quin's probably not on the menu, and it would take like an hour of work to get him on there.

Who are the 3 indies in your opinion?

Well, I was just checking the role list. New development. Technically, there's only one indy left. Choutas or Quin are not bad picks for it. Though Quin's not a bad pick for scum either.

JoH is possibly the indy that just picked, since he's getting all into the game now. Since he already picked and I'm not dead... it's more likely he picked town. Because he wouldn't pick scum after convincing himself that I am scum and pushing so hard for my lynch.
Lowers the odds that he's scum, given the way that the timing lines up.

The other 3P picked an alignment on N2 I think. Right after the Colin lynch. That would lead me to think they picked town as well. It was also so early that they probably haven't been playing like a typical 3P. They have been town (or technically mafia) for a while now. If it's town, they're probably Nova, Kylemii... Sloonei picked up a lot after D2 as well. Cbob is also an option.
If they're scum... then it's just another scumster, hunted normally.
Really this 3P could be most anyone I guess. The only candidates that played too hard for one side on D1 or D2 are dead by now.

Hard to narrow it down. Maybe Quin, Jack, Sloonei?

Scotty wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:38 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:38 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:34 pm i feel most comfortable after negotiation with the voices in my head with nova getting lynched, then speed. But I feel like it would be asking a lot of the 6 people on speed’s train to switch and I don’t really feel like I have any footing to defend speed with any confidence so.

Just for shits. (Turnip, don’t think jack is taking off today anyway)

[VOTE: Nova] aubergine

I’ll keep the nova train healthy

I’m still thinking over everything. I don’t want to railroad speed but at the same time I don’t feel inspired to move.

lol I don’t feel inspired to get you to move

Same here, and I feel bad about it.

It's like when you set aside time for homework and all you wanna do is play video games. I'm pretty sure that if I don't get lynched today, I'll get lynched tomorrow. The only alternative on the menu that I think is scummy is Jack. MP's not on the menu. Quin's probably not on the menu, and it would take like an hour of work to get him on there.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:33 pm Speed, you also keep calling me a scum read for a while now. I have no idea why you’re doing that. You cited, to my recollection, one reason prior to “twisting” your words today, and that was for my change in opinion of Marmot. You did not elaborate on how that makes me bad.

Your reads are the opposite of transparent; please elaborate more.

You went from "I have a solid reason why Marmot is meta good, and I cannot see him being bad" to "Okay, maybe Marmot is bad" in like, 2 hours. He didn't even do anything.

It's off. THAT read is the opposite of transparent.
And then you're basically forcing me into defense mode today, which is all fun and good until you complain about it. I've harped on this over and over again. Don't send a person into the leading lynch train and then complain when they defend themselves. Human psychology doesn't work like that.

Is the case for lynching Nova literally the same as the case for lynching Luna? Or am I missing something?

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:30 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:27 pm Funny enough, it's the three scumreads on my list that are twisting my words the most.

MP: All Speedchuck cares about is warning us about LYLO. (No, that was in the context of Jack's possible motives)

You’re twisting my words right now.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 10:12 am speed's posts do nothing but convince me he's bad. His line of defense is continued "it's going to be LYLO" if you lynch me. He does hardly anything to hunt or explain his reads.

speed, if you're town, hunt. Stop saying it'll be LYLO. I don't give a shit about that. I give a shit about your reads.

Scotty wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:29 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:29 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 2:28 pm I'm removing Scotty from my scumreads.

Ok I think MP is town, so who would you be voting for if you didn’t have to save yourself

Would it still be jack? Who conveniently is the secondary wagon right now?

I'm the reason Jack is a wagon, dude.

I'm removing Scotty from my scumreads.

Funny enough, it's the three scumreads on my list that are twisting my words the most.

MP: All Speedchuck cares about is warning us about LYLO. (No, that was in the context of Jack's possible motives)
Jack: Speed knows I'm not scum, so he must be scum. (No, I know he's PLAYING like a 3P. Which could be an easy scum move, or he could actually be 3P. Not town.)
Scotty: Here are Chuck's defenses of people. I'm going to pick out which ones are town buddying or which ones are scum defenses. (Actually, since this is planning for after I 'flip scum'... Scotty either doesn't know my alignment and has good intentions, or he's doing a great job of faking it. I lean former. Go Scotty.)

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 1:57 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 1:53 pm I put out a list earlier in the day. The only thing that's changed is that Jack is actually trying now.

yeah but that was a really long time ago and you have 7 votes now

But despite what MP said, I'm pretty sure the only people that care about my content are the ones that are twisting it to their own ends.

who are those people

The votes on me won't change my mind much. Why would they?

Look at some recent posts for yourself. "Chuck defended Luna because she was town." "Chuck defended Nova because he is scum."
Really now?

"Chuck thinks JoH is playing like a 3P. Therefore he must know that Jack is not scum, and therefore be scum."
Ridiculous. And when I quoted the conversation I had with MP about the possibility scum acting like 3P and 3P players being dangerous unknowns, everyone ignored it.
If Jack is 3P, he's dangerous.
If Jack is scum playing like 3P, he's doubly dangerous.
If Jack is town playing like 3P, Why?

I put out a list earlier in the day. The only thing that's changed is that Jack is actually trying now.

But despite what MP said, I'm pretty sure the only people that care about my content are the ones that are twisting it to their own ends.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sun May 06, 2018 10:25 am On the chance speed is town, it would behoove him and the rest of town greatly for him to come in here with the biggest flame up his ass imaginable and expand upon reads with the utmost urgency. Otherwise, my vote stays.

Reason 1 to vote for a 3P-looking player:

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Fri May 04, 2018 7:15 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Fri May 04, 2018 7:13 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Fri May 04, 2018 7:11 pm Wouldn't it be in a mafiaoso's interest though to seem like an independent?

I mean I guess that's a good point. But it would also be in their interests to seem town. Which is easier?

...

Yeah okay that's a really good point.

I'm just saying that in a game with this setup with an independent faction of 3, it might be easier for a mafia player to fake being a disengaged independent than a supatown or something.

Reason 2: Based on his current actions, I think he's looking to side with scum

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 9:22 pm The point is you are treating me like scum would treat 3P.

My theory is that if you lynch me, you will be.

There are 2 3P players that are biding their time, waiting on trading their last item so they can choose alignment. Jack fits that MO, and I think he's using me to either push to LYLO or gain some town glory before choosing.

But if you lynch me, LYLO will be the result, and Jack will hop ship with the other 3P.

(It's only LYLO if the other 3P chose to be scum, technically. I operate in worst possible results time)

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 9:19 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 8:43 pm Nova is town.

Jack is trying to prove a point. He might actually think I'm bad if he's 3P. He's wrong, and he doesn't care. He never cared before I prodded back at him.

Way I see it, if Jack is 3P, he cannot lose with my lynch. When I flip town, he'll send out his last offer and join scum. If I flipped scum, he'd join town with that extra cred. Tell me his MO doesn't look like this.

hey by the way what the heck does this mean, do you think jack is 3p?

Fixed a typo.

I think it's likely.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 9:15 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 12:59 am Speedchuck is blatantly bad. My suspicions really started when he put me and TH low on his rainbow, which is dumb. He’s continued to push that angle in the gentlest of ways. It reeks of not only low hanging fruit but pointing out how nice the fruit is and hoping someone will get it for him. He’s afraid to stick his neck out and go for it himself, which mirrors his passive scum behavior in Pirates and Fire Emblem. He’s complained that I haven’t pursued my read on him in a meaningful way, which until now, is true. However, he’s done nothing to pursue his read of me or any of his reads, really. Without checking, do you know any of Speedchuck’s reads that I didn’t just tell you? Can you think of any hunting or any meaningful contribution he’s made all game? Of course you can’t. No. Speedchuck’s reactions to me are of a scummer who thinks I’m Indy and hopes I’ll never actually push him or that I’ll get myself lynched. His every post is testing the waters for one of those things. He’s not hunting.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 8:43 pm Jack is trying to prove a point. He might actually think I'm bad if he's 3. He's wrong, and he doesn't care. He never cared before I prodded back at him.

Way I see it, if Jack is 3P, he cannot lose with my lynch. When I flip town, he'll send out his last offer and join scum. If I flipped scum, he'd join town with that extra cred. Tell me his MO doesn't look like this.

Bake him away, toys.

Yes, I read that post. I dunno why you're pointing back to it. "Oh, I know what he thinks of my alignment and so that means I must be right." Non-sequiter.

Nova is town.

Jack is trying to prove a point. He might actually think I'm bad if he's 3. He's wrong, and he doesn't care. He never cared before I prodded back at him.

Way I see it, if Jack is 3P, he cannot lose with my lynch. When I flip town, he'll send out his last offer and join scum. If I flipped scum, he'd join town with that extra cred. Tell me his MO doesn't look like this.

Oh I caught up. Literally nothing has happened. The two things I want to comment on are things I can't comment on. Welp.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 2:01 pm i wanna see what happens if i [vore]speedchuck[/vore]

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 1:59 pm @colonialbob

Tell me why Speedchuck is not a good lynch today.

Because then tomorrow will be LYLO

colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 1:48 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 12:19 pm

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 12:17 pm nah dude let's pretend I'm bussing you first

I don’t get lynched but even if I did, I imagine you wouldn’t go after Speed next so that’s a no go.

This is a thing bad Jack says.

Strike 2.

I want to agree. But source?

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 1:36 pm

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 1:34 pm who shot first between speed and jack? what's the timeline

I’ve been saying Speed is bad for the entire game. I just wasn’t trying very hard at being convincing until last night.

Why not?

Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 1:32 pm

wolbre04 wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 1:25 pm I have speed as a town read, if I don't lynch him that makes me look bad

civs don't worry about looking bad, they worry about finding baddies. U Bad wolbre?

This is true and BS at the same time

Scotty wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 1:16 am I think jack is distancing from nova and maybe speed. Can’t determine yet. I’m now convinced jack is only choosing to be “straight” because he has pressure.

I'm catching up, just so you know

[VOTE: Jackofhearts] aubergine

Tomorrow my wife has a frisbee game so I'll be around for like all of the final hours

Holy goodness I'm getting lynched all of a sudden

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 5:37 pm

Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Sat May 05, 2018 5:25 pm Didn't that literally just happen with me.... ?

yeah and i guess it was cool and everything but like.... it seems like a lot of the time now people get lynched now after just like not being around

i miss the whole "hey don't lynch me, heres some reasons why i'm good and also heeres some reasons to lynch this other guy instead" thing, i miss the 90's

how am i supposed to know who's reacting to dying properly without them showing up to reactt

@novaselinenever @speedchuck @Jackofhearts2005

what're u doing

A tabletop gaming birthday party

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri May 04, 2018 7:27 pm

speedchuck wrote:...If the IDGAF crowd is mostly townies, Scotty is buying a one-way ticket to a scum win...

No, if the IDGAF crowd is mostly townies, all the townies are fucked

Not if we (and they) play our cards right.

I agree that we need to not give them a free pass. But we should have started weeding yesterday instead of last-minute lynching Luna for no reason.

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri May 04, 2018 7:23 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Fri May 04, 2018 7:20 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Fri May 04, 2018 6:54 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Fri May 04, 2018 6:00 pm Interesting. Last time I saw myself mentioned by you, it was a scum read in your rainbow list iirc. What's changed? You haven't exactly engaged me in any meaningful way. I have no idea what you think of me in fact.

You seem like you're genuinely hunting instead of just trying to get past D1 before paris-ing. Plus you are getting into this game emotionally. Hard to imagine you faking that.

But I've never played with scumnya

Did not understand the underlined part.

I am always emotional in mafia, whichever side I play on tbh. I give it all my effort and when I feel like I haven't been giving it all my effort, that upsets me.

I don't like how waffly you are tbh; it's already day 5 and i feel youve gone this long without having strong stances in the game yet. Like, you're not very memorable for someone with as many posts as you have. It's similar to FE scum speedchuck I think. I followed that game closely after you replaced me...I know what I'm talking about.

"Oh look, someone suspects the same person as me, but for actual reasons. I'm going to latch onto that."