The Syndicate

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:11 am Now I have to ask: why did you care about that?

I wanted to see if the defense was as well thought out and insightful as it was this time around. Personally, I find it lacks that je ne sais quoi.

Dragomir wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 4:56 pm Its gonna be hard for me to participate in these remaining hours. I'm quite busy right now so EoD activity is a no go from my side.

My reads right now still have LC as scum but it's not as strong as before. Leetic has creeped up in my scum reads, but it's not very strong either. My reasons don't felt good enough to support a vote on him and I have had a couple mindmelds with him. His defense against my recent accusations were just as well.

Speedchuck is probably my strongest scum read atm doubt that's not saying much as it's still kinda weak, just barely above the other two. I don't think I'll be voting anybody for this phase.

My town reads, on the other hand, are quite strong. max, Sloonei, and FG are the highest; all three equal with each other. Turnip Head, TS, Ted, and Epi follow behind.

Radish and TSP are my remaining null reads.

Here is dragomir's last will. It is not much to go on, since they only had one real scum read that was shared by many other players to begin with. I will assume that Dragomir softed or slipped PR somewhere, as that would be a better reason to kill drago over another person with drago's scum reads.

Sloonei: Have you found that post wherein ted defends macdougall as a partner with a wallpost?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 1:22 amTH is not totally off base for having this suspicion.

I am surprised you can say this without erupting into a fit of the giggles.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 1:12 am I don’t have a horse in this race, but you’ve not disproven anything.

I said nearly. There is a world where I did not realize Funnygurl was my partner until halfway through the phase.

Dragomir in deadchat: "Occam's Razor is stupid, it shouldn't be a real thing, I've seen plenty of times where the simplest explanation wasn't what happened!"

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 1:04 am Anyways I'm shutting up about this now because I know I sound like a crazy person until someone else sees what I see

I just provided you sound logic that nearly disproves the entire wolf team, and the best you could do is "You were planning for this, the scenario where someone brings up this exact trio, all along and brought suspicion on your partner day 1 when it wasn't necessary just so that you could shut down the three-player associative on day 2!" No, apply Occam's Razor, and you should find your answer.

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 1:02 am Okay but see that's exactly what I'm saying. As soon as someone brings up the possibility of you being aligned, you've immediately got the perfect "proof" lined up that they aren't

Probably because it is factual that we are not aligned...

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:55 am
ts account wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:51 am I hate to be the person to bring it up, but it is interesting Turnip Head is looking for a team of three. I thought with 15 players it would be more likely that we are looking at a team of four.
Three would be my assumption too, for what it’s worth. But I also suspect our two absentees are self-aligned. Maybe they’re split.

Hmmm... the OP says there are only two factions. I interpret that to mean no third parties, either.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 1:00 am
ts account wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:58 am
Turnip Head wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:54 am
ts account wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:51 am I hate to be the person to bring it up, but it is interesting Turnip Head is looking for a team of three. I thought with 15 players it would be more likely that we are looking at a team of four.
I'm not looking for a team of three I think I found a team of three
I am trying to see how you can come up with this scum team but I do not see it. As the person most familiar with funnygurl in this game, why would I warn everyone of her incredibly dynamic wolf game? I could simply say her wolf game is obvious and that she slanks hard as a wolf- the fact that she is here at all guarantees she is town, and then rely on my own aggressive personality to shut down dissent. That does not work. Furthermore, ted posted a massive wall town casing me seemingly with the intent to make sloonei shut up. I do not believe that is partnery behavior either, as it requires a lot of effort and insight on ted's behalf, more than is required to defend a partner. I think they are just town.
For what it’s worth, ted posted a massive wall in defense of mac (his teammate) at one point last game.

Idk if he’d pull out the exact same move two games in a row when his entire team from the previous game is also on this one.

Would you mind quoting this wall?

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:54 am
ts account wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:51 am I hate to be the person to bring it up, but it is interesting Turnip Head is looking for a team of three. I thought with 15 players it would be more likely that we are looking at a team of four.
I'm not looking for a team of three I think I found a team of three

I am trying to see how you can come up with this scum team but I do not see it. As the person most familiar with funnygurl in this game, why would I warn everyone of her incredibly dynamic wolf game? I could simply say her wolf game is obvious and that she slanks hard as a wolf- the fact that she is here at all guarantees she is town, and then rely on my own aggressive personality to shut down dissent. That does not work. Furthermore, ted posted a massive wall town casing me seemingly with the intent to make sloonei shut up. I do not believe that is partnery behavior either, as it requires a lot of effort and insight on ted's behalf, more than is required to defend a partner. I think they are just town.

I hate to be the person to bring it up, but it is interesting Turnip Head is looking for a team of three. I thought with 15 players it would be more likely that we are looking at a team of four.

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:49 ami mean he was right

I do not hear this often so I am taking the liberty of quoting this whenever it is true again.

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:46 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:43 am
Turnip Head wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:42 am Scum team could be Mikey, funny girl and tedextr as far as I'm concerned
Why these three names in particular?
It feels like they're working together to win the game.

I will give you a hint, I was scum reading funnygurl for most of the day.

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:44 am if he's a wolf then i'ma be sad so i'm hoping he really is town here so we can WORK TOGETHER and WIN THE GAME

Scout's Honor, not a wolf this time.

I have a bit of an abstract question, because it is worth keeping in mind, but I do not think it is worth answering out loud.
Given characters are not alignment indicative, what knowledge could you expect to gain from knowing somebody's character?

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:40 am Sounds like following the letter of the law and not the spirit of it. The game is rarely so cut and dry. I feel like you're only taking this stance because it suits your agenda.

I am taking it, because if they want to die, I want them to die.

I have made a Team Aqua Grunt outfit and Trainer Red outfit in Animal Crossing, and they look pretty good, if I do say so myself. Does anyone have recommendations?

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:29 am I don't recall you pushing leetic being in his town meta before the lynch was over. Is this hindsight or "I told you so?" And why should long con die if he's overwhelmingly likely to be town?

I wanted to lynch Dragomir yesterday, but I was happy with Long Con dying especially after their self vote. I was pushing a counterwagon to leetic, and had leetic as hard town in all of my read lists rather than a town lean or anything. If somebody self votes, it means they believe they are the best lynch. So, I should also believe they are the best lynch, because a towny will usually believe they are not the best lynch being guaranteed town. If you do not like policy lynches, then this would make less sense to you, probably.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:02 am i feel a little bad for voicing it so loudly now.

What is your general impression of that lynch now that we've had 24 hours to stew in it?

If somebody self votes, they should just always be the lynch. For anyone who is vaguely aware of leetic they were safely within their town meta anyway. I still think Long Con should die even if they are overwhelmingly likely to just be town with how things stacked up.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Apr 03, 2020 11:56 pm
ts account wrote: ↑Fri Apr 03, 2020 11:52 pm What is your analysis of the nightkill?
Drago was the most obvious civilian in the game.

Nightkill analysis is not my strengh. I'm open to theories if anyone's into that, but at this stage in the game I don't know how far it's going to get us.

I could dig through their iso for potential PR softs, but I do not think that would be fruitful. I think the wolf team must have agreed with your read of Drago.

What is your analysis of the nightkill?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Apr 03, 2020 11:33 pm Long Con was the competing wagon to leetic. They ended up tied. Nobody sprang to save him. What does this mean? I can go either way on it.

What do you think it means?

So, I still do not like Long Con's behavior last EOD. I also do not like the leetic wagon very much; however... I believe speedchuck is likely to be mafia just due to the tendency for a single mafia to stay off lead wagons. Epignosis or Turnip Head could both be mafia as well for this reason, but I have liked Epignosis' play much less.

Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 6:39 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 6:34 pm Way too much omgus in this game.
I'm more in OMGIS mode right now. [VOTE: Long Con] aubergine

If you are town then this means you believe you are the best lynch.

[VOTE: Long Con] aubergine
I am happy lynching here barring a role claim.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 5:34 pm We get all the time. Extra time after hammer is for discussion.

Can we not also discuss things before the lynch?

Dragomir- scum
Epignosis- null
Funnygurl555- town lean
leetic- town
Long Con- scum
MacDougall- town
Master Radishes- town
Sloonei- scum lean
speedchuck- null
tedxtr- town lean
ts account- town
TonyStarkPrime- null
Turnip Head- town lean

I am feeling a lot better about my reads today. I have plenty of town to work with, that I am confident in. I still do not commit to the hard ted town read, even though it is probably my strongest town lean of the three I have. But ted is an extraordinarily good player if they are able to fake the mindset they have been showing while solving. Epignosis plays similarly to Mantichora, in my opinion, but possibly without the pedigree of the latter? Speedchuck is a curious case, because I remember liking both their tone and them as a person, yet I do not feel so emotionally attached to them here.
I would like to see more from Tony as I believe the null read there is due to their content not really impressing upon me. I find that they have made a few good points but lack any sort of followup or worldbuilding.

I will ask you a question, then. What knowledge did you gain from your catch up?

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 2:49 am
ts account wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 2:35 am
Master Radishes wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 2:25 am Good morning folks. Just spent an hour reading (er, some skimming) to catch up. AMA. My answer will undoubtedly be 'dunno, don't remember what was said'.
That is a nice scumtell you have there.
Thanks, been working hard on it.

...What is it?

The AMA.

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 2:25 am Good morning folks. Just spent an hour reading (er, some skimming) to catch up. AMA. My answer will undoubtedly be 'dunno, don't remember what was said'.

That is a nice scumtell you have there.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:55 am I was disengaged for a while. I wasn't fully here for much of the day. I had half an eye on the thread, the other eye and a half on real life.
I'm not sure what your last sentence means. I'm also not sure what your read of me is here. What does all of this tell you about my potential alignment?

I guess it is more of an abstract thought than normal. You could either be town deferring to town MacDougall, or you could be scum who no longer has thread control, if that makes sense.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:45 amDragomir was frustrated with his reads and the direction of the thread a couple hours ago, so dropped everything and went back to the beginning to form new reads from scratch. That is the most civilian thing I've seen all game.

Also your suspicion of me earlier stemmed from a belief that I was trying to get you lynched. I am now calling you one of my strongest town reads in the game. Please respond to that.

Most of the new content I have seen from you has felt much more subdued than when we were in our 1v1, though that perception could be due to me being a passive observer. For a time you seemed disengaged with the thread, around the time MacDougall was starting to engage everyone, and now that everything has relatively settled down by comparison, it looks like you are back to picking and prodding, but I get the sense you do not feel as though you have the same audience you did before.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:34 am
ts account wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:27 am [VOTE: Dragomir] aubergine
Sloonei is near lock towning Dragomir in case you didn't notice. I bring this up not because it should make you change your opinion but moreso because I'm curious how that makes you feel about Sloonei?

I have not felt great about Sloonei either. I do not claim to be great at reading alignments, and my strength as a player is tied to my ability to obvtown. I have no great faith that Dragomir would flip wolf, but the posts they are making leads me to believe that is the case, so that is what I will continue to push for, until proven wrong. This particular vote was a bit of a kneejerk to their most recent interaction with leetic, which I felt was in bad faith. I will likely go back to Long Con, who I feel has quite a bit of wolf equity. I just want it known that I do not agree with apparent reset buttons on the slot, I suppose.

Upon seeing your POE I am not sure I am comfortable with your desired pace of the game.

[VOTE: Dragomir] aubergine

Dragomir wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 11:14 pm
ts account wrote: ↑Mon Mar 30, 2020 11:38 pm I have a soft mindmeld with leetic re: sloonei. However, I'm more suspicious of it because I do not think speculation of sloonei's nature is pro-town in any way. Since it is early enough in the game, this read is more of a town read on leetic than a condemnation of sloonei. I also want to point out TonyStarkPrime's callout of LongCon (and sloonei's somewhat, but Tony was not involved before this) which I think is not justified.

I can't make any more judgements until RVS is over, which is hopefully soon.

PS The submit and preview buttons are backwards.
I don't recall you ever following up on this tsp thought. Did something change for you on him?

I do not remember, honestly. At the time I saw players voting LongCon for something that I did not see as too out of the ordinary, and I did not feel that TSP should vote there, for some reason. In hindsight I disagree with myself quite a bit, and more agree with the version of me who questioned the mention of JJJ.

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 11:14 pm can i multiquote on this forum oh my god

I feel your pain. Try using Notepad or text editing software of your choice in a second window, and just copy paste.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 10:29 pm I gave you some data. I want to know your interpretation of it. I know what I think and I'll comment on it directly.

Well, if you insist. I think it is stupid to expect a player to do something so narrow and minute twice and then base a read on it.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 10:25 pm
ts account wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 10:24 pm
Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 10:21 pm MacDougall presented an idea in a recent game he was good in. He said I was bad because I refused to talk to my teammates. Mac didn't say shit about that here. There are plenty of people I've not engaged with.
What is your point with this?
I'd expect him to fling the same shit here. He's not doing it.

Is your conclusion that he is scummy for it?

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 10:21 pm MacDougall presented an idea in a recent game he was good in. He said I was bad because I refused to talk to my teammates. Mac didn't say shit about that here. There are plenty of people I've not engaged with.

What is your point with this?

leetic wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 9:49 pm Anyway, I'll at least list my reads from towniest to scummiest (that were up to date a couple pages ago):

1. MacDougall
2. ts account
3. Sloonei
4. Master Radishes
5. Epignosis
6. Funnygurl555
7. Long Con
8. TonyStarkPrime
9. Turnip Head
10. Dragomir
11. speedchuck
12. tedxtr

Interesting, with a capital Q. I thought you had a vague scum read on me last we checked in.

Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Mar 30, 2020 10:45 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Mon Mar 30, 2020 10:22 pm Usually much more has happened by now. This feels weird.

Right now, [VOTE: Sloonei] aubergine. He is usually one of the more active people who tries to get stuff going, but right now his only contributions have been setup speculation. I'm not really seeing him trying to get any meaningful discussion going so I have to be suspicious.
I would also say the same about JaggedJimmyJay, but he's Schrödinger's player right now. I'll join you on the Sloonei vote, he has three posts and they're all about an issue that's above his pay grade as a player. In A World Asunder, town Sloonei opened Day 1 with two town reads and a vote on a suspect. [VOTE: sloonei] aubergine

It was Long Con.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 9:38 pm Who was it earlier in the game that earnestly made a read on JaggedJimmyJay? We should lynch whoever that was.

I do not believe it was a read on JJJ so much as them comparing another player to JJJ for seemingly no reason.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 9:20 pm
Yes!

I wrote Chapter Two:

Spoiler: show

I get the feeling you don't approve of this gimmick.

For April Fool's day today, I cooked some eggs and toast for my mom. It was hilarious because she did not know what to do with them, and refused to eat them.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 9:02 pm
What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little wolf? I’ll have you know I graduated top of my class in the scum hunting, and I’ve been involved in numerous secret raids on Mafia Universe, and I have over 300 confirmed scum lynches.

I am trained in mafia theory and I’m the top wolf hunter in the entire syndicate. You are nothing to me but just another target. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Earth, mark my fucking words.

You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over the Internet? Think again, fucker. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of spies across the INTERNETS and your IP is being traced right now so you better prepare for the storm, maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You’re fucking lynched, kid. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can lynch you for at least 3 different reasons, and that’s without a single wallpost.

Not only am I extensively trained in scum hunting theory, but I have access to the entire arsenal of RateYourMusic.com back history and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your miserable ass off the face of the assassins creed mafia, you little shit. If only you could have known what unholy retribution your little “clever” comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have held your fucking tongue.

But you couldn’t, you didn’t, and now you’re paying the price, you goddamn idiot. I will shit fury all over you and you will drown in it.

You’re fucking lynched, kiddo.

Aaaaand... pocketed.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:53 pm
ts account wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:40 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:37 pm
ts account wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:10 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:54 pm
Or maybe I'm a town who thinks the cases on me don't make sense?
Attempting to dismantle an established scumtell does not seem a towny-driven method to escape the noose, in my opinion. I find it interesting that both times I have brought up established scumtells, you have resorted to attacking the legitimacy of the scumtell itself, anyway.
Tell me, what would you do in my situation?
To be quite honest, I believe I was already in your situation when sloonei was arguing with me. So, I would make my best attempt to dismantle the actual suspicions, perhaps compare them to what I would actually do as scum, and when that does not work, collapse in a fit of rage and overwhelming paralysis.
To be honest all you really said was that my posts were bad and awful and lazy.

W@ell, they were, and I did my best to explain why.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:40 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:37 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:36 pm I am officially vetoing Long Con suspicion for the remainder of this day.
why
1 - The amount of chatter about him being suspicious is unwarranted and is consistently based on untruths.
2 - The amount of anti LC chatter makes me think that there are at least wolf or wolves pushing that narrative, and in this current threadstate there is no cause for distancing or bussing.

I think that an LC lynch day one is very likely to flip a townie.

If we instead lynch Long Con day two, does that then flip wolf?

Dragomir wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:37 pm
ts account wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:10 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:54 pm
Or maybe I'm a town who thinks the cases on me don't make sense?
Attempting to dismantle an established scumtell does not seem a towny-driven method to escape the noose, in my opinion. I find it interesting that both times I have brought up established scumtells, you have resorted to attacking the legitimacy of the scumtell itself, anyway.
Tell me, what would you do in my situation?

To be quite honest, I believe I was already in your situation when sloonei was arguing with me. So, I would make my best attempt to dismantle the actual suspicions, perhaps compare them to what I would actually do as scum, and when that does not work, collapse in a fit of rage and overwhelming paralysis.

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:23 pm tr me mikey. DO IT

This is when I like to have a cop check, so that I can check you and come in tomorrow being confident that my friend is town with me. I can't give blind faith like you...

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:23 pm I still don’t care about supposed scum tells. What did Dragomir do and why did he do it?

I believe Dragomir was bringing up multiple names and looking for either resistance or support, to help push the EOD to somewhere they were more comfortable with as scum. It seems they have a pattern of asking "who would vote for this player? Would you vote for this player?" I can see a townie trying to shake things up near EOD if they feel that scum are controlling the narrative, but I have not seen hints from Dragomir to suggest that they believe this could be the case. It really does just look like they are trying to find a safe lynch.

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