The Syndicate

DrumBeats wrote:Possible options for both 3 letter R words:

rip
ram
rat
rad
rap
ray
rob
rod
row
rag
raw
rib
rid
rig
rim
rug
rub
rum
rut

Golden wrote:After R

r~~ ~~n~~ r~~~e~~ ~~ ~~~~~~ ~~ r~~ ~~r~~n ~~~~~

ika wrote:

Epignosis wrote:I think the third word is "RETREAT."

r~~ ~~n~~ r~~~e~~ ~~ ~~~~~~ ~~ r~~ ~~r~~n ~~~~~

no cant be retreat. the e is not in there twice

Epignosis wrote:

Golden wrote:After R

r~~ ~~n~~ r~~~e~~ ~~ ~~~~~~ ~~ r~~ ~~r~~n ~~~~~

"retreat to"

Silverwolf wrote:r~~ ~~n~~ r~~~e~~ ~~ ~~~~~~ ~~ r~~ ~~r~~n ~~~~~

I hate to say it, but I don't have a clue with this.

Wheel of Fortune was never my strong suit.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:So say we all and what the fuck ever.

I just won an incredibly stressful game in Yorkshire. I'm good here, so yep. Hello.

Hello!

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:So say we all and what the fuck ever.

I just won an incredibly stressful game in Yorkshire. I'm good here, so yep. Hello.

Hello!

For some reason, I just really wanted to vote for you in the other game that just ended, but I couldn't. So I voted for you here.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Epignosis basically just posted a rainbow list. Old school style.

Ricochet wrote:Epignosis is becoming a lynch subject and I can't say his posts are defensible. He cut short his D0 activity and his return was apparently in low mood. Of substance was only a top/bottom 3, posted (at JJJ's request?) without reasoning. The sequence of banter with MM, especially around MM's wild vote on him, seems casual dismissal. Anyway, as non-contributors go, his name is pretty relevant. I'm not entirely sure what read to extract out of this, the only instance I remember of him intentionally wanting to pedal less in a mafia game was THM (civilian) and even then he got in slight trouble for it.

Silverwolf wrote:

S~V~S wrote: Ithink you are infuriating Rico becasue he is cornered,tbh. And don't vote me let me at least get started.

This is not a terrible point.

I hate being indecisive.

What does anyone think of Epi? He's usually more involved as town.

S~V~S wrote:@ Epi can you explain your read of Drumbeats? Even though I show up on his list, I feel pretty good about him.

ika wrote:ok im all caught up, based on what i have seen in my 3 games with epi i find it odd as well hes not dong anything

sig wrote:Yeah so all three of Glorfindel's posts are fluffy (also thanks for the congratulation)
I'm not liking that, I'd like some content from him.

I'm surprised by how few posts we have from Epi, true he did just finish another game, but besides his puzzle solving stuff he hasn't put forth much content.

sig wrote:

Epignosis wrote:I am going to name some people I think are good and some people I think are bad. Old school style.

ika
MM
Matt

That's three I think are good.

Three I think are bad?

Ricochet
Drumbeats
G-Man

That something for 3J. Knock yourself out man. I'm tired after today.

This is his list I find it interesting.
@Epi could you explain your mafia reads?

ika wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

ika wrote:ok im all caught up, based on what i have seen in my 3 games with epi i find it odd as well hes not dong anything

I find it odd that you're breaking the rules.

i am?

Silverwolf wrote:

sig wrote:So Epi has three votes, and I don't like it. I've got a civ lean on Epi.
I dislike that one of the three votes on him is MM who voted out of a joke then have SW and Ika on it.

I really dislike zebras vote for BK.

Explain what you don't like about it. Or why you have a civ read on Epi? I dislike people casting doubt on the leading wagon close to EoD because it looks like you either know it's town because you are not, or you strongly believe Epi is town and are defending a townread. So which is it in this case I wonder?

Silverwolf wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Silverwolf, you cast an immutable vote against me on a day I was mostly unavailable, yet you are here now and could have saved your vote until this time to hear what I had to say. Why did you not do that?

Because you hadn't been around and barely posted and iirc, you didn't say you were not going to be here due to RL (if I'm wrong, correct me here) so I had not way of knowing you'd be back. At the time, I felt you were not contributing and I know via Downtown Abby and Turf Wars that you contribute more as town so I felt comfortable with the vote because of this and because I had no better scumread as I was (and still am) doubting my scumread on Rico as I may be changing my mind on that and want more time to figure him out.

linki-I put a second vote on you. Not exactly bandwagoning and I waited until late today to do so.

You seem to have almost no problem with MM's vote. In fact, you accepted it with very little fuss. You also seem to have no trouble with ika following me. I don't really understand how you so easily accept their votes, and call out mine.

Silverwolf wrote:Actually Epi trying to discredit me reminds me of Turf Wars where he was bad and did that constantly.

Epignosis wrote:

Silverwolf wrote:Actually Epi trying to discredit me reminds me of Turf Wars where he was bad and did that constantly.

You voted for me. Am I to say, "Oh yes, please listen to Silverwolf! She's always right!"

Get out of here with that.

ika wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Silverwolf, you cast an immutable vote against me on a day I was mostly unavailable, yet you are here now and could have saved your vote until this time to hear what I had to say. Why did you not do that?

why do you direct that at silver and not me or MM who did it at beginig of day?

Black Rock wrote:

ika wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Silverwolf, you cast an immutable vote against me on a day I was mostly unavailable, yet you are here now and could have saved your vote until this time to hear what I had to say. Why did you not do that?

why do you direct that at silver and not me or MM who did it at beginig of day?

Am I crazy or have you voted for Epig yet?

The conversation between the three of you lead me to believe you had voted, and yet you have not.

Black Rock wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Black Rock wrote:

ika wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Silverwolf, you cast an immutable vote against me on a day I was mostly unavailable, yet you are here now and could have saved your vote until this time to hear what I had to say. Why did you not do that?

why do you direct that at silver and not me or MM who did it at beginig of day?

Am I crazy or have you voted for Epig yet?

The conversation between the three of you lead me to believe you had voted, and yet you have not.

He voted the host option illegally, but voted me in the thread using red after Silverwolf voted me.

Oh. I missed that. So you have three votes?

ika wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

ika wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Silverwolf, you cast an immutable vote against me on a day I was mostly unavailable, yet you are here now and could have saved your vote until this time to hear what I had to say. Why did you not do that?

why do you direct that at silver and not me or MM who did it at beginig of day?

Already answered, boss man. Read before you write.

i am reading, but i want to hear why im not getting harped on either?

Silverwolf wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Silverwolf wrote:Actually Epi trying to discredit me reminds me of Turf Wars where he was bad and did that constantly.

You voted for me. Am I say, "Oh yes, please listen to Silverwolf! She's always right!"

Get out of here with that.

This is a further discredit. Nowhere did I imply, in any way, shape, or form that people should listen to me because I'm always right. I never once even came close to saying that.

ika wrote:

Epignosis wrote:ika, I'm not going to go back and forth with you about Silverwolf. I'd rather fix a dryer.

then dont dsiscredit her like you are now. when you attack her vote only and not me nor mm it shows singling out and im gonna go after that.

Silverwolf wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Black Rock wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Black Rock wrote:

ika wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Silverwolf, you cast an immutable vote against me on a day I was mostly unavailable, yet you are here now and could have saved your vote until this time to hear what I had to say. Why did you not do that?

why do you direct that at silver and not me or MM who did it at beginig of day?

Am I crazy or have you voted for Epig yet?

The conversation between the three of you lead me to believe you had voted, and yet you have not.

He voted the host option illegally, but voted me in the thread using red after Silverwolf voted me.

Oh. I missed that. So you have three votes?

Looks like it. MM because he's MM, Silverwolf because I wasn't home, and ika because SW voted me.

No, because you hadn't contributed anything and even when you were here, it was very underwhelming. I knew from Downtown Abby and Turf Wars that you are more active as town. So no, it's not just because you weren't around and I didn't know if you would be by EoD or if I would and didn't want to miss the vote; it's because you hadn't contributed much when you were here and you were away from the thread a lot otherwise. You did come around to say you were drained from the other game and gave some unexplained reads but that's not enough for me to read you as town.

Silverwolf wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Silverwolf wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Silverwolf wrote:Actually Epi trying to discredit me reminds me of Turf Wars where he was bad and did that constantly.

You voted for me. Am I say, "Oh yes, please listen to Silverwolf! She's always right!"

Get out of here with that.

This is a further discredit. Nowhere did I imply, in any way, shape, or form that people should listen to me because I'm always right. I never once even came close to saying that.

Huh? You voted for me. Am I supposed to agree with your opinion?

No, but you are misrepresenting my reasons for doing so. Repeatedly.

Silverwolf wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Black Rock wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Black Rock wrote:

ika wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Silverwolf, you cast an immutable vote against me on a day I was mostly unavailable, yet you are here now and could have saved your vote until this time to hear what I had to say. Why did you not do that?

why do you direct that at silver and not me or MM who did it at beginig of day?

Am I crazy or have you voted for Epig yet?

The conversation between the three of you lead me to believe you had voted, and yet you have not.

He voted the host option illegally, but voted me in the thread using red after Silverwolf voted me.

Oh. I missed that. So you have three votes?

Looks like it. MM because he's MM, Silverwolf because I wasn't home, and ika because SW voted me.

No, because you hadn't contributed anything and even when you were here, it was very underwhelming. I knew from Downtown Abby and Turf Wars that you are more active as town. So no, it's not just because you weren't around and I didn't know if you would be by EoD or if I would and didn't want to miss the vote; it's because you hadn't contributed much when you were here and you were away from the thread a lot otherwise. You did come around to say you were drained from the other game and gave some unexplained reads but that's not enough for me to read you as town.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

Epignosis wrote:I'll be back. I'm not going to go back and forth with two people who voted for me because I wasn't home on Mothers Day.

You're being accused of discrediting Silverwolf not merely because she voted for you, but because you're presenting her reason for voting for you as this. It's untrue. If she's wrong, then there's probably a way to convey that which doesn't reduce her accusations to just this blatant silliness. Essentially, you're suggesting that Silverwolf's vote was hardly motivated more by relevant thought than MM's was.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

ika wrote:

Black Rock wrote:
I was just trying to help with another perspective from someone who has played with him longer.

golden said the same thing about MP in champ game calling him town. MP was scum

I think this is a valid point, because there is a growing list of examples of "I've known this player for years and trust my ability to read him/her" proving disastrously wrong in recent memory. If I limit it just to The Syndicate:

Talking Heads: Non-Syndicate regulars are heavily suspicious of Long Con. Syndicate regulars defend Long Con because they know him better. Long Con is mafia.
Talking Heads: Syndicate regulars are heavily suspicious of MacDougall. Non-Syndicate regulars defend MacDougall because they know him better. MacDougall is mafia.
Turf Wars: Newer Syndicateer is heavily suspicious of Epignosis. Syndicate regulars defend Epignosis because they know him better. Epignosis is mafia.
Scrimmage: Newer Syndicateer and visiting players are heavily suspicious of MovingPictures07. Syndicate regulars defend MovingPictures07 because they know him better. MovingPictures07 is mafia.

We need to learn from this trend.

ika wrote:

Black Rock wrote:

ika wrote:

Black Rock wrote:
I was just trying to help with another perspective from someone who has played with him longer.

golden said the same thing about MP in champ game calling him town. MP was scum

Hey, I'm not set Epig is town. It's day one. There's just not any reason for me to vote him.

I did miss your reason. You have way to many posts to look through. Can you help a lady out? It would be helpful to see all positions here.

well adding in dsicreding silver and ignoring other votes (example turf wars)

he has low activity (truf wars)

funny enough in the short term of champ game he was much diffrent to silver the he is now

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I would absolutely loathe mislynching Epignosis on Day 1. I have always said that in all circumstances the most suspicious player should be lynched regardless of who or when. So with this stated:

Epignosis, if you're town then I don't think it's terribly likely you're going to change the mind of either Silverwolf or ika. To continue discussing it with them would be fruitless and perhaps even make it worse. So it'd probably be better both for your faction and for yourself if you'd drop that discussion and focus solely on your own suspicions and other reads. You've proven repeatedly to have good instincts and to be a valuable component of any civilian team, and I don't want to see that wasted.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

ika wrote:

Black Rock wrote:
I was just trying to help with another perspective from someone who has played with him longer.

golden said the same thing about MP in champ game calling him town. MP was scum

I think this is a valid point, because there is a growing list of examples of "I've known this player for years and trust my ability to read him/her" proving disastrously wrong in recent memory. If I limit it just to The Syndicate:

1. Talking Heads: Non-Syndicate regulars are heavily suspicious of Long Con. Syndicate regulars defend Long Con because they know him better. Long Con is mafia.
2. Talking Heads: Syndicate regulars are heavily suspicious of MacDougall. Non-Syndicate regulars defend MacDougall because they know him better. MacDougall is mafia.
3. Turf Wars: Newer Syndicateer is heavily suspicious of Epignosis. Syndicate regulars defend Epignosis because they know him better. Epignosis is mafia.
4. Scrimmage: Newer Syndicateer and visiting players are heavily suspicious of MovingPictures07. Syndicate regulars defend MovingPictures07 because they know him better. MovingPictures07 is mafia.

We need to learn from this trend.

This is the most disingenuous thing I've ever seen from JaggedJimmyJay.

Who are these non-syndicate regulars and who are the syndicate regulars, and why you have lumped them all together?

I can expand on every example. I've added numbers to the quoted post for ease of explanation.

1. People who defended Long Con included but weren't limited to you and Golden. People who suspected Long Con included me and I believe Diiny among others.
2. People who defended MacDougall included me and motel room. People who suspected MacDougall included you and Matt among others.
3. Silverwolf suspected Epignosis. S~V~S and I both spent too much time defending you.
4. Silverwolf and Frog suspected MovingPictures07. Golden defended him.

In each case, the player with the most experience playing with the suspected player was the one who was wrong.

ika wrote:

Epignosis wrote:
In each case, that's a small sample size, I would argue, but assuming I'm cool with it: In your opinion, how does that apply to ika and Silverwolf right now? ika's immediate vote for me alongside Silverwolf (with no independent reason of his own) indicates that he believes she is good.

I don't share that opinion. I think a Sivilianwolf would have waited to hear from me before voting.

note he said on syndicate alone, he has a much hihger sample and i think the games he refrenced is enough as well. not only that but sevral seprate people it has been proven on should be sufficent.

for us i cna show you all of our games if i wasnt ip banned but burden of porficency is on you to dispute the facts he has shown

Silverwolf wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I would absolutely loathe mislynching Epignosis on Day 1. I have always said that in all circumstances the most suspicious player should be lynched regardless of who or when. So with this stated:

Epignosis, if you're town then I don't think it's terribly likely you're going to change the mind of either Silverwolf or ika. To continue discussing it with them would be fruitless and perhaps even make it worse. So it'd probably be better both for your faction and for yourself if you'd drop that discussion and focus solely on your own suspicions and other reads. You've proven repeatedly to have good instincts and to be a valuable component of any civilian team, and I don't want to see that wasted.

Changing their mind isn't my objective. They've already voted, and votes are not changeable.

Do you think a civilian Silverwolf would have waited for me to post? She voted for me way early in the day (judging by the fact that she was here a little while ago). Do you think a Sivilianwolf would follow MM's vote without questioning him about it instead of expecting me to do so?

That's the chief reason why I think Silverwolf is bad at this juncture. Her inability to keep my activity levels straight and her reasoning for suspecting me in other games (two, mind you) are secondary, but there.

Do I think Silverwolf would genuinely suspect you for the reasons she has stated?

Yes.

Do I think Silverwolf voted well earlier than she needed to and could have given you more time to respond to her accusations before placing a binding vote (particularly given her FoS strategies stated earlier)?

Yes.

Do I think it's meaningful that her vote followed MM's dubious vote without concern for that situation?

Yes.

Silverwolf, the latter two points apply to you. Please answer to them.

I voted Epi independently of MM's vote. I used my own reasoning.

I wasn't sure I would be around EoD or that Epi would and I didn't want to miss the vote. Epi was around some during this day phase and had plenty of opportunities to post more meaningful content when he was here. His posts underwhelmed me, then he was barely here. Then he discredits me when I suspect him but gives ika and MM a pass.

This is plenty good reason for a D1 vote. I don't see anyone else putting their neck out to take a vote/stance on anyone. Don't you find that odd also? I do.

DrumBeats wrote:Alright, I just got caught up, and I retain my FoS on Rico. Though I appreciate giving out a few reads now, most of them were relatively neutral, and one was even a straight null null read.

I'm not sure what to make of Epig right now, my gut is scumleaning Epig for the defensive tunneling, but the read is too slight for me to feel good acting upon today without hearing more.

I've got some stuff to do before I update the game I'm hosting later today, so I won't be able to wait out Epig's answers with you guys, I trust that if they do not come you guys will push that vote instead.

Vote: Ricochet

Polo wrote:

Silverwolf wrote:I don't give a flying fuck if you believe me. I was just diagnosed with cancer recently and have to go through chemo so fuck off!!

I'm sorry to hear that. I wish you all the luck and strength in this world.

ika wrote:silver is now confirmed town. i knew she had that issue and she would never bring it up as scum.

if anyone has any comments about the personal amtter of it save it for post game plz.... out of respcte for me and silver. when i heard it i cired for a good 10 mins and im crying all over again........