The Syndicate

Hmm. Perhaps LC is independent, then? If he didn't realize/his PM didn't indicate his alignment or gave him some sort of indie win condition?

I like trees. I don't want to chop them up. But I'll have to pick one I guess. And the event... yeah public protection doesn't seem like it makes sense, but then again it does ensure that player won't die but it pretty much ensures that someone else will be targeted and likely die (rather than have a chance of protecting the right person, as non-public protections can). The BTSC block might be better though, especially if we already suspect that someone (e.g. LC) may have ulterior anti-town motives in attempts to contact people.

I'm voting for the btsc thing, and douglas firs because I love Christmas trees.

Hm. I believe LC and Dys are telling truths.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:42 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:51 am Hm. I believe LC and Dys are telling truths.

Why?

Just because. They sound legit. I buy LC's story about assuming LMS with a vanilla role. Your assessment of that makes sense as well. He could be an actually LMS role, but that seems much less likely.

And I suppose I've been misguided in reading Dys before, but I'm really only getting genuine town vibes so far. Except I'm pretty baffled by her strong desire to lynch llama (which rico seems to agree with inexplicably). Why lynch llama, what's the reasoning?

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 5:44 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Sun Jun 11, 2017 10:34 pm Hmm. Perhaps LC is independent, then? If he didn't realize/his PM didn't indicate his alignment or gave him some sort of indie win condition?

I like trees. I don't want to chop them up. But I'll have to pick one I guess. And the event... yeah public protection doesn't seem like it makes sense, but then again it does ensure that player won't die but it pretty much ensures that someone else will be targeted and likely die (rather than have a chance of protecting the right person, as non-public protections can). The BTSC block might be better though, especially if we already suspect that someone (e.g. LC) may have ulterior anti-town motives in attempts to contact people.

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:33 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:42 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:51 am Hm. I believe LC and Dys are telling truths.

Why?

Just because. They sound legit. I buy LC's story about assuming LMS with a vanilla role. Your assessment of that makes sense as well. He could be an actually LMS role, but that seems much less likely.

And I suppose I've been misguided in reading Dys before, but I'm really only getting genuine town vibes so far. Except I'm pretty baffled by her strong desire to lynch llama (which rico seems to agree with inexplicably). Why lynch llama, what's the reasoning?

An interesting change of heart, one must admit.

A few questions:

1. Why in your initial statement do you say "we" instead of "i"? It sounds to me you're trying to make the LC suspicion seem a little more credible/widespread by insinuating that it is a widely held suspicion. It also smells of disassociation (i.e "We all thought it! I wasn't the only one! if it blew up in your face later).

2. What about LC's defense did you specifically "Believe" from point A to point B? You seem confident enough at least in the beginnings of your LC suspicion to base your D0 vote around the idea (by blocking BTSC, in your own words, with the targeted goal of affecting LC).

3. How did you go from putting such stock into the initial LC suspicion (enough so to push it in that one post on two separate statements, as highlighted) to believing that your own assessment was "much less likely"

You are reaching pretty far here. I used LC as an example because people were already questioning his motives early in day zero, but that didn't mean he was a serious suspect by the time the game actually got going. Like, yeah, I was initially a little suspicious of his mix-up, but the more he and others talked about it the more clear it became to me that he just made a legitimate mistake. In the first post you quote, I did think it was reasonably possible he had a LMS/indie role of some kind that supported his assumption, but afterward he explained that he had already thought it was a LMS game and just didn't process the "vanilla civ" part of his pm, and that made sense to me.

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 12:52 am What do you think of this Dyslexicon/Long Con/Epignosis drama Nutella? Do you find anyone caught up in it suspicious?

Nah, not particularly.

I haven't really seen much reason to suspect anyone yet. As it usually goes on day ones. I'm always wary of Wilgy when he's cryptic like this though. Gonna throw a vote on him just to pick someone (just realized we only have a few hours left and I don't want to miss it)

Holy votespread batman

Intrigued by mutiny though I have no idea what it means; would be open to any of these events tbh, they all sound fine. Voting LC for protection because I believe he's civ. Could change. Maybe to myself, I'm flattered that I have some votes

RIP sprit.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jun 15, 2017 7:26 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Jun 15, 2017 7:25 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jun 15, 2017 7:24 pm Voting nutella to start the day.

Sounds like a delicious part of a balanced breakfast.

Not if I'm just scooping it straight from the jar.

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Thu Jun 15, 2017 8:27 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jun 15, 2017 8:26 pm

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Thu Jun 15, 2017 8:23 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Jun 12, 2017 12:14 am I'm interested in the public vote as a scum hunting mechanism.

Did you ever make something of this, Sloonei?

No.

Could you?

A hat, perhaps, or a brooch, or a pterodactyl?

@Dys hope everything's ok

I'm sorta tempted to vote for Rico because I'm pretty damn sick of the annoyingness, but Epi's pushing me to reconsider since I don't really think Rico necessarily looks like/is behaving like a baddie. Like, he could be "hiding behind" the singsong bullshit and the no-u pattern, but I don't have a particularly strong reason to think that. But the more he's getting pushed on it and remaining stubborn, the more I'm doubting his innocence... idk. WIFOM and all that jazz. If I can't make up my mind on Rico I might join DH in voting for G-Man -- the points there don't feel like much but it's more than I have on anyone else.

Ooo LC's case on Epi is fascinating. I'm a little hesitant to buy into the "tells" from Mass Effect as he was indeed an independent rather than a mafia, but his response has been largely inadequate imo, especially with regards to the "phoning it in"/narrow focus accusation. I don't understand how that one tiny inconsequential response/request for clarification to me, which I didn't even feel merited a response let alone constituted any expression of suspicion, counts as an original contribution. It seems to be just some confusion on my wording, which for what it's worth I'll answer now since he does appear to be taking it rather seriously: I merely meant, Epi, that your post (about considering whether Rico's behavior actually indicated alignment) caused me to take a step back and reconsider that point/whether I should actually vote for him or not. I suppose "pushing" was not really the best word; I didn't really mean to imply heavy agency on your part (though no doubt there was some intent in your post to have the effect it successfully had on me) or that you were putting pressure on me specifically. I just meant to convey my thought process regarding the Rico situation and how you affected it, but I didn't use the most precise language.

Anyway, putting a vote on Epi for now. Really not getting good vibes from his responses to LC or from all the eye-rolling.

Care to explain your vote?

You have not once given a single reason for suspecting me. I don't ever want to play with you again if you continue to do this. It's insulting.

I'm not "falling" for any "bullshit." I recognize that he was incorrect about a couple things from Mass Effect here, but even when discrediting the flawed parts of his argument I found myself agreeing with many of the points he was making against you.

And I already explained the pushing thing. I did not mean to imply that much agency, but you are in a way partially responsible for my decision not to vote for him because a post that you made affected my thought process.

Sorry, but you haven't convinced me on point 3 yet, and your interaction with LC has added another point or two against you. As I said, I have not gotten good vibes from the tone of your responses -- it feels like you have been caught and are trying to claw your way out. Worse, you ignored questions where answering them would have helped you defend against point 3 -- it took you way too long to give an answer for who your suspects are, and even then you did not explain them well. And now you are trying to flip the attention onto me.

So why do you even suspect LC? You didn't explain that one, other than saying "he's doing the same stuff he did as an evil independent in Mass Effect." Ha ha.

llama vote for epignosis pls k

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sat Jun 17, 2017 3:03 pm I moved my vote to Dyslexicon.

Why?

Ha oh yeah it totally has to be. INH is double-Lynching all of us.

Alignment reveals pleeeeaase. G-Man's role sounds more likely to be a civ I think (at least to me knowing nothing about the movie); sorry to see you go.

I got the semantics joke get rekt LC

insertnamehere wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 8:06 pm DrWilgy/Detective Williams: Vanilla civilian
Sprityo/Little Donny: Vanilla civilian
G-Man/Mrs. Williams: Vanilla civilian
Ricochet/Sandy Williams: Vanilla civilian

Well damn.

I'm cool with lynching llama. I can dig the distraction+annoyance Rico-kill analysis.

So, btw, I'd already changed my mind about Epi yesterday because he PMed me, told me he was a vanilla civ, and more or less convinced me through his genuine-sounding tone. I told him I would back off of him in the thread, but at this point there's no reason for me to not just be honest about this. I simply believe him.

At the same time, Long Con has been one of my stronger civ reads for the whole game (and LMS-gate caused me to believe he is most likely a vanilla civ). So, get this, I think Epi and LC are both civvies and this argument is getting us nowhere.

That being said, I think Llama is a perfectly fine choice to lynch today. Regardless of the crazy theories that Epi or LC is his teammate, I think he is a reasonable candidate for having killed Ricochet.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 10:32 pm What's amusing to me in all this is that there has been more talk over which of LC or Epi is throwing llama under the bus and more talk of what if we're teammates.

There's been little to no talk of whether we're both innocent or, if one of us is guilty, who may the third teammate (assuming there is a third, but I'm assuming that).

Guess I'm "little to no." I very clearly stated that I believe you are both innocent.

Iiiiiinteresting.

Lots of event choices, but double lynch sounds like the best way to go considering we just missed one.

...did you guys just entirely miss the post where speedchuck talked about that?? He said he got the mutiny but since he didn't have internet he wasn't able to follow through with it and iirc he claimed he didn't even get to find out who his partner would have been.

also I'm pretty sure it was by opt-in PM, I remember you talking to INH about that...

something going on with your memory dude?

Oh dang, nice!! Rip daisy but awesome to see llama is a dead mafioso.

By my POE instincts I think the baddies are within Sloonei, SVS, and/or Quin. I'll vote for one of them.

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Jun 21, 2017 10:00 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jun 21, 2017 9:55 pm Oh dang, nice!! Rip daisy but awesome to see llama is a dead mafioso.

By my POE instincts I think the baddies are within Sloonei, SVS, and/or Quin. I'll vote for one of them.

Why not Timmer and speedchuck, in your words?

I think speedchuck is most likely civ because of the mutiny thing. I think Timmer is most likely civ because -- well, also the mutiny thing apparently, but he just revealed that, and I've thought he was civ the whole game mostly because of his posts during LMS-gate on day 0 and the way he described interpreting his own role pm, and he's seemed reasonable/civ-like since then.

Linki: Oooo, now that's interesting, re Dys/Quin.

Epignosis is lying. Maybe he's been lying the whole time (*cough* like when he told me his role); that would be a pretty impressive ploy. A... a long con, if you will. Then again, maybe he really is civ and is lying about killing llama for some other inexplicable reason. Who knows.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2017 12:40 am

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jun 21, 2017 9:55 pm Oh dang, nice!! Rip daisy but awesome to see llama is a dead mafioso.

By my POE instincts I think the baddies are within Sloonei, SVS, and/or Quin. I'll vote for one of them.

If nutella's POE is accurate, then I have a 100% of voting right today. Should I trust nutella?

I don't understand this. Explain?

Okay.
*votes Quin*

POE is pretty self-explanatory, yeah? Each of the other players I think is more likely civ than not, and you guys are left. What more elaboration do you need? That's... that's just what POE is.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:50 am

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2017 12:56 am Epignosis is lying. Maybe he's been lying the whole time (*cough* like when he told me his role); that would be a pretty impressive ploy. A... a long con, if you will. Then again, maybe he really is civ and is lying about killing llama for some other inexplicable reason. Who knows.

I didn't even register this part of the post earlier.
If Epi is lying about something, why is he not on your POE list?

Well, he just explained it, lol. I won't say anything else on the matter.


About the POE list, I feel like for each player I have already at some point given a reason I believe them to be civ, so look at my iso for those. Might be missing one or two in there, but if you really want to ask my opinions on specific players you're welcome to do so. But I don't need to freely give out my reasons for everything, and I've already stated most of them anyway.

I have stated that I think speedchuck is most likely a civilian because of the mutiny thing. As for SVS, she ended up on the POE because I haven't been thinking much of her at all; she was pretty active at the beginning and seemed like her typical self (meaning she could be any alignment) and then her activity dropped off, so I'm wary of her.


I still think Epi is a civilian, I regret calling him out on his lie, and I will not comment further on the incident for the sake of everyone involved.

Sloonei you clearly haven't read the thread lol it's right there in the open

Well, I find it pretty silly to answer a question whose answer is literally in a post that you quoted and on a topic on which I have promised to refrain from commenting.

Nice case. Feeling worse about SVS and better about you. I'd be happy if SVS and Quin were the top two lynchees (mmm lychee lol) and not you.

Quin wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2017 9:46 pm

timmer wrote: ↑Mon Jun 12, 2017 9:59 pm My catch-up took all of about 3 minutes, but when I read my role PM it made it pretty clear that I'm a good guy, thus I too am skeptical of LC not knowing there were civs and others in the game. Barring developments, that is a pretty sizeable Day 1 ping.

I suspect timmer for this post. My role card came in with my character name, a whole load of flavour and then my super definitely town alignment as a side note at the very end. It was not 'pretty clear'. There is room to forgive LC for his LMS thought process.

What made you just pull this out of nowhere? Playing the "convincingly civ description of my role card" card, four game days after timmer's post but fairly soon after I said it's a major reason I trust him?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:04 pm Quin, talk about this succession of posts:

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 10:31 pm llama did not vote for alignment reveals.

Quin wrote: ↑Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:09 pm I figured I'd take a look at llamas posts to see what's going on there. I don't really see anything that leads me to read him any way or another. I do notice that he mentioned making a deal, and I don't know what's up with that.

Quin wrote: ↑Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:13 pm I don't reject the idea that a distracted llama might kill a heavily suspected person, but with 6 votes on him already, I'm not inclined to vote there. My other top of mind options are Epignosis or LC.

Quin wrote: ↑Tue Jun 20, 2017 6:08 pm Reiterating that llama chose to vote for double voting or something over alignment reveals last night. I remember a baddie doing something along these lines happening in The Office, and I didn't pursue it then. So yeah, gut scum read for that.

A gripe I have with Long Con is that he's been vocalising his suspicion of Epi since Day 1, but it was only on Day 3 that he started to discuss it with people who were not Epi. On top of that, he only did that when Sloonei cued him to do so. I don't get the impression he really believes in his case.

First you take note of an odd Llama moment. Then you drop it a few days later, do a quick ISO of llama and come up with nothing conclusive and denounce the wagon that's starting to form against him, but an hour later you're suddenly on that wagon for the initial oddity you had observed two days earlier. You think this computes over here?

Wheewww yeah this series of posts by Quin really stinks to high heavens.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:09 pm I'm interested in Nutella as a player right now. Her Process of Elimination magic has whittled the game down to three possible baddies occupying two available spots. There does not seem to be a whole lot of suspicion around her. If I'm not misreading things, she almost seems like a trusted player to some degree. I've seen her as an excellent townie in past games. If she says she is confident that 2 out of 3 players are scum, and I am one of those three players, then that is something I am going to take interest in. Like I said before, if she is right then I have a 100% chance of voting for scum today by following her.

So what do we think of nutella's thought process? And could you provide more elaboration now, nutella?

I'm trying to let up a bit on the POE and open up to a couple other possibilities of players who could be fooling me, like speedchuck or DH maybe. I could turn my previously rather black-and-white list into a more nuanced rainbow if you like.


BTW, is it just me or has LC completely dropped off the face of the earth? (As has SVS obviously.)

Timmer
Long Con
Epignosis
DharmaHelper
Speedchuck
Sloonei
S~V~S
Quin

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:34 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:30 pm Timmer
Long Con
Epignosis
DharmaHelper
Speedchuck
Sloonei
S~V~S
Quin

I'm interested in Speedchuck and DH here.

They're in the middle because I have had reason to think they are civ but it's possible they are fooling me, and I don't want to entirely discount that possibility. And I'm a bit more wary/think the possibility is a little bit higher of speedchuck.

Btw the font color is the droplet-shaped symbol, right next to the font size menu.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:50 pm

Quin wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:41 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:38 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:20 pm How do you feel about nutella, Quin? The mafia player, not the hazelnut spread.

I am unimpressed by the context in which she first voted for me. For reference, it was that 'look me in the eyes' thing. I agree with Epi's thoughts that she's less likely to be bad since she called Epi out on his lie rather than keeping it to her team, though.

She'd also just named as one of her final 3 candidates for lynching (at the time). I think that's a good enough basis for an early-phase vote.

The main reason I chose to go with Quin in that moment was the recently mentioned catch that llama had voted to protect him(Dys).

Yeah I also got the "if speedchuck goes after SVS he's bad" thing, followed by Wilgy's last words pm which I believe LC is referring to.

Huh. Alright then.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:51 pm I feel like voting for Epignosis.

Why? I don't. He's Mike; that role's existence is confirmed now.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:56 pm The independent throws a wrinkle into my reads. Hm.

Indeed. This is all very interesting.

But guess what? I think you, speedchuck, are the last member of the mafia.

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:02 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:59 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:51 pm I feel like voting for Epignosis.

Why? I don't. He's Mike; that role's existence is confirmed now.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:56 pm The independent throws a wrinkle into my reads. Hm.

Indeed. This is all very interesting.

But guess what? I think you, speedchuck, are the last member of the mafia.

You don't think chuck, the guy who has been acting like a dog all game, is the dog role?

Maybe?

Changed vote to Long Con, but I'm waffling quite a bit between him, Sloonei, and speedchuck.

LC as indie and sloonei as mafia (rather than speedchuck assuming he's the dog) makes sense.

Nice try Sloonei but I am not the last mafia lol sorry

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 12:31 am nutella knew timmer was the llama killer.

Her team didn't kill timmer until after it was obvious that timmer was the llama killer (way to go nutella- we do good work).

Explain to me why nutella would hold off on killer timmer with this information.

wait what? I was not on the team that killed timmer. I was on the team that killed llama.

Long Con, wherever you are, I hope you read this bro, cause guess what, you might still have a chance at a win. Join my partner and I in voting for a civilian today. This will probably result in a tie, so we'll have to cross our fingers. But if it works out, we'll do a Mutiny for 3 so that you can join us, and voilà.