The Syndicate

Oh yeah.

Low impact playing - expect nothing, prepare for anything.

Oh, the evolution thing. Honestly I prefer VT roles, but if you find it in your heart that I'm town and you love me and care for me then vote me and say "Dizzy - I choose you!"

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:57 pm Cool. Who wants to pile all the points on one person?

Seems unecessary.

There are things to discuss strategy wise though.
1. Should this voting be public?
Pro - Mafia can't pile evo points on each other without making it obvious in thread because every point will have to be publicly accounted for.
Con - Mafia would know who is evolving and who is not, and would likely make NK decisions based on this.
(Maybe pro - Could force more concrete reads in thread).

Since we're 19 players we could evolve as many as 6 players this first night even. If it's public, Mafia would likely try to pick off someone who is evolved, however there would be too many to deal with immediately for them. If our town reads are any good we would evolve more town than mafia and also likely force mafia to not vote each other. Knowing who is evolved and not can also guide night actions.

Not that it's explicitly said anywhere that evolving means NA - but it's pretty reasonable to assume as much.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 12:03 amDizzy thinks outside the box. I bet they can kick butt with powers. I town read Dizzy when we were both good in Phenon. My catching scum Dizzy in Mass Effect was pure POE based on me knowing a lot as opposing scum. Maybe.

Hai! \o/
Didn't follow the Mass Effect game after the site change stuff happened - but you were scum in it too, right?

nutella wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 5:26 amBtw, I didn't realize Dizzy was on the player list for this; I think they're indefinitely gone from the site after alluding to some sudden life stuff, so hosts might want to consider looking for a replacement unless you've heard back?

I can play. I just couldn't right at that time. Thank you for thinking of it though.^^

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:55 am I think Dizzy is town.

And loving it.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 10:08 am @Dizzy

From experience, whatever night powers mafia gets from evolution will probably pale in comparison to the advantage of knowing what the town power roles are and killing them before they can act. So Id rather keep the votes secret.

My point is, we would be able to evolve a potential of 6 town the first night if we get it right. Mafia can't kill 6 players at once (or lol game). Giving up the three evo points that scum will give each other is actually a total of one evolution that could go to town players instead - which would make it an even trade. So taking away mafia's opportunity of boosting each other is pretty good imo. Another point is that, depending on thread flow and how the game develops and yadda yadda, it's not unreasonable to assume that mafia can sniff out who are the most likely to have evolved and not even if we do make the voting secret.

I mean, I'm not married to the idea of having this be open voting, but generally I see the more coordination and teamwork in a game, the easier it is for town to come together and for scum to get revealed. It's difficult to organize and coordinate because pretty much everyone have to agree, but it's certainly not impossible. The discussion is good for N0 in any case.

Right now I think it's too early to open vote anyway, and the whole idea depends on good reads which may vary from game to game. Some games I can feel good about pointing out 6 reasonable town reads, and some games I can't.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 10:15 am I have a question tho: how do we know mafia is keeping their side of the bargain? Are votes public?

Assuming we get this organized - If we split evo votes so that we plan it that 6 people will get three each, this will be tracable. Let's say me, Jack and you according to the plan are going to vote for Nut to have an evolution. If Nut wakes up and has not evolved, then evidently one of us didn't do what we were supposed to. So it would not benefit mafia to not go along with the plan.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 10:19 am Another problem: phase ends in 7 hours. Are we sure we can get everyone to come online, agree with this system, agree on who to vote and then vote under that time? That sounds impossible, at least for this day 0.

I don't think it's realistic to get this organized this phase. And I don't think it's realistic to even assume to have 6 good enough town reads to do it. But if town puts in some work, it would be doable from N1. This plan can be implimented any night phase of this game. Or stopped any night phase. For example, it doesn't benefit town so much to do this if there are only 1 mafia left, as they can't vote for themselves anyway.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 10:29 am Well if we can get universal coordination you are right. That gives us a small poll of scum if they choose to betray us.

I will join if such a coordination happens. Right now Im skeptical about it.

All it takes for a coordination to happen is for people to join and just do it.
For me, the more working together the better for town.

This also all hinges on active alignment hunting and normal game play.

As yet another point, having a pool of 6 players that has evolved gives the power holders even better targets for their powers. Say if we have things like watchers or doctors, knowing who to protect or who to watch is also beneficial.

Anyway, I'm mostly thinking out while I'm typing. I see many good sides to this. I also like the idea of working together with special mechanics instead of just having them there and let mafia coordinate with them (cause we know they are able to). It's something I see town have the opportunity of doing in games, but it rarely happens for some reason. If anyone has strong objections or arguments against that hasn't come up yet it should be voiced though.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 10:33 am

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 10:15 am I have a question tho: how do we know mafia is keeping their side of the bargain? Are votes public?

If we want them to be.

If you me and Dizzy say we vote for Nutella and Nutella doesn't have a power, we know there is a baddie between the four of us.

G-Man wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 12:10 pm I like this whole trying to break the game open and looking for tactical advantage. Reminds me of the old days. Question for you big thinkers- if we pile up 3 evolution votes on a player who is mafia, what's to stop them from saying, "Hey, yeah, I evolved," when they didn't?

Pretty sure Mafia can evolve too - so nothing is stopping them no. That wasn't the point either.

Also, if this plan goes through, you should probably try to mandate people not just alternate between the same people if they're still alive. In theory, a baddie could just switch back and forth between their teammates if two baddies wind up in the evolution pool.

In theory they could. The hope would be that the collective reads are better than chance and that we force mafia to not vote each other - at the very least not use all their three votes on each other. The ties between who votes for who to get the evo points could also be read into later with flips etc, if the information is out in the open.

boo wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:18 pmNo. There are roles that can't evolve. And why the four of you? LA not getting a power when three other people supposedly voted for her would say nothing about her alignment.

I think Jack meant that in this hypothetical situation the possibilities are - either me, Jack or Dragon would be lying, and a forth possibility is that Nut would be lying about not having evolved to throw shade at the three of us (I didn't count this as a possibility the first time around cause I didn't think of it). Regardless, if we do organize and openly discuss evo voting, chances are mafia would not want to bring attention to themselves by messing it up.

As far as I can see only 1 town role does not evolve.

boo wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:23 pm I think the type will impact voting. If you vote for someone you're weak against, it isn't worth as much, and it's worth more if you're strong against them. Otherwise business as usual.

That's interesting. If this turns out that voting correspond to type I think that could be potentially game solving? If the ghastly role for example is immune to normal type votes for being a ghost type, that would be exposable.

I don't necessarily think this is the case, personally.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:48 pm I also don't think we have time to organize, but what if we bias the game to get role powers for people?

Like, form a pool of six-ish candidates and encourage people to throw their points into that pool?

Time when? For N1?
If you narrow down to six candidates it would be much better to just assign who votes for who so all six would be boosted. If you do it half way then chances are only a couple or three of those people would evolve. Why not do it all the way?

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:59 pm
This is a good idea.

I submit the pool as: Fred, Tony, LC, Nutella, Speed.

Why not me, the only one you've expressed to think is town?

G-Man wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2017 3:26 pmI'm not fine with putting such a strategy together based solely on one person's preferences. If Jack wants a list, let's all submit five or six names and select the ones that appear the most. If the plan can indeed thumb the scale in our favor, then it's too important to be nonchalant about picking names.

Yeah, it shouldn't be because of one person's preference, it should be more consensus. All in all, coordinating D0 votes in a reasonable way wasn't going to happen with so little time and many players not showing up. We could do it N1.

If I still can give evo points I'm currently considering:
Nut
Timmer
DDL
DF

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:42 amCause you told me you didn't want points.

No?

nutella wrote: ↑Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:29 pm I keep sort of forgetting this is a speed game. We only have 4.5 hours left to lynch someone

Whaaaaat?

I assumed phases was about 2 full days as normal.

In that case, let's just lynch Jack and be done with it.^^

Haven't caught up, and I HAVE TO see Twin Peaks now lol. But really, bf-time and all that.

But I'll catch up before day end. Lurkers can die.

I'm voting Jack for literally no reason. Sue me.

So how long until D2? The phases are way shorter than I expected. O.o

Oh god. Well, I'm visiting my grandparents now. Hopefully phase hasn't changed after I'm home.

Fuck.

Sorry. I blocked this game out of my consciousness.
*slaps self*

Thought this game would be over by now actually. o.o
Lol.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Thu Jul 06, 2017 9:29 amHoly fuck

You speak the truth.
Could you please give me some bullet points of what has happened this game? *continues to slap self*

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Thu Jul 06, 2017 9:32 am I've been trying to lynch you the past 2 cycles. Theres that.

Big one is that Sprityo was bad, we murked him in a tie with Tink.

Minor is that Dom is now Quin, and I still want to murder you.

Alright. Who else has died? Wasn't this an 18 player game or something?

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Thu Jul 06, 2017 9:32 am Review Sprityo's ISO and tell me who his teammates are.

After work. It's the least I can do, gah. >_>

I have no idea who to vote. My slight towns when I left was Nut, Timmer, DF and DDL. The two latter who are left alive are questionable to me seeing the Sprit/Tink vote poll.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Thu Jul 06, 2017 5:17 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Jul 06, 2017 3:20 pm I have no idea who to vote. My slight towns when I left was Nut, Timmer, DF and DDL. The two latter who are left alive are questionable to me seeing the Sprit/Tink vote poll.

Re reading the last cycle may help you. Votes were very spread out and you may be able to sift through who's thoughts were genuine or not.

Without a read from you, I still think culling you is in our best interest.

I'd also happily vote DDL today.

You have any real reason to think I'm scum, or just want to kill me cause I haven't been here? Genuine question. Will read when bf is in bed lulz.

Angleshooty (?) - I would probably never leave a game like that without asking for a replacement if I had known teammates. In any case, should've not neglected the game or asked for a replacement regardless.

Wait, who died? Lol dis game/Lol me. Mostly, lol me.

Lol, I gave DF at least one point thingy. Maybe two, don't remember. >_>

Town VIP. NÆT.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Jul 09, 2017 10:16 am

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sun Jul 09, 2017 8:48 am Lol, I gave DF at least one point thingy. Maybe two, don't remember. >_>

Town VIP. NÆT.

Does Epi ever use jesters in his games?

Because this is ridiculous.

If you are busy at least say so, but what you are doing is tasteless and downright disrespectful to the people playing the game.

Um. Sorry. I don't mean to be disrespectful. I think it was obvious that I'm extremely busy.

So sorry I dropped off the map this game. =(
Also, I was silenced the last day when I was logging in to actually read and post for real. That was painful.

Will try to make sure I know I'll have the time to play before signing up here again.

Thanks for the game, Simon and Epi.