The Syndicate

What?! You are on page 4?! Umm......This is why I don't play big games, Epi. I will see you all when we are down to about 12 players and one of you can catch me up.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:31 pm Long Con can have a vote.

why LC?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:58 pm

Kylemii wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:54 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:22 pm Starting the day with a vote on kyle.

can i ask why?

the only time you've mentioned me negatively was after my first post for "trepid introductory nonstance", is that it?

also, while you're here, can i ask for a (brief) explanation of your read on Made and Made's read on you, from your perspective?

You've seemed focused on the mechanics of the game so far. I'm wondering what people have to say about that.

I did not pay attention to Day 0. But, after being with Kyle in Vocaroo....I don't see this as a baddie tell for him. He seems to be the type of player that will focus on game mechanics and possibly overlook baddie hunting even as a civ. I think we should give him the benefit of the doubt for now. Kyle, show us your baddie slaying skills.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:03 pm As for Made, I came out feeling good about him because he felt compelled to post a Day 0 rainbow unprompted. That's a bold move for scum to make. Since then, however, I've only had questions for him and none of them have been answered (I don't blame him for that, he's just been absent.) I can't offer a take on his read of me because I can't see where it comes from. He implied that he perceived me as feeling heat on Day 0, but I actually felt like I had achieved an inordinate amount of townie cred for that phase of the game. I don't know where any of his reads come from right now, and that's problematic. Maybe the boldness of the Day 0 rainbow was Made's principal motivation. He just played a solid scum game in Vocaroo but had his credibility destroyed when game mechanics all pointed to him. Maybe he drew another scum role in this game and wanted to come out swinging.

This description of Made has me questioning his goodness. Rainbow list on Day 0 sounds like a baddie move trying to get civ cred. The rest of these points don't help him as well. I have to be honest, I am not going back to read Day 0. And, I am not sure I can even catch up on the 4 pages that have already been written today. But from this post alone...Made doesn't look good. @Made...if you have a defense....please bring it.

(Alright....three pages to go. But I gotta go do RL crap today. For the record, I'm trying )

I realize I am behind and thing may have conspired that I am unaware of. But...As I read, I am just going to post my thoughts so I am at least getting something into the thread.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:06 am @Sloonei @Jackofhearts2005 @Long Con
Why not?

I could vote chuck. Three people inquire about his vote for marmot and this is his response.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:53 am Nobody is talking about Wilgy.

Vote 1 Quin. But yeah wilgy. That guy is bothersome.

Agreed. Wilgy often gets by just because of his meta of being apathetic. I could vote him today just because :P

(Thank God for Saturdays and people with lives. Thread hasn't grown much. Two more pages.)

Everyone is being quite crazy with their votes right now. I don't like this lack of seriousness in the beginning of big games like this. Everyone thinks they can just play around and vote here or there and it won't matter much. Dudes (and dudettes), if we try hard enough, we might be able to get a scum on Day 1.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:05 am If I do have a concern about Kyle, it'd be his continued obsession with Made's little Kyle/speedchuck comment. What is the urgency about uncovering that specific mystery?

Still not too concerned about what I am reading of kyle. He is easily distracted and might easily lead himself down a rabbit hole. But this is just me thinking of his vocaroo play. I don't remember him from any other game.

Quin wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:21 am

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jan 11, 2018 5:02 pm oh hey guys

most of the people who have posted so far look civ so far, but then most of them are the people who always look civ to me. Sloonei's alternate interpretation of Quin is interesting though and Quin is someone I'm always waffly on.

Made is zany as usual. Not sure what he's on about but I think he's just being Made.

Out of the so-far-civ-reads I think my strongest 3 are Sloonei, Kyle, and Jack. They're safe from my D1 vote at this point unless something changes.

oh and welcome new people! I'm getting tired of reading posts from the same 6-7 people so let's see some thoughts k

hey found the nutella post

This is all well and good @nutella...but who do you see as bad?

(one page)

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:26 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:26 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:31 pm Long Con can have a vote.

why LC?

He answered that, it's because I haven't contributed anything to the game. It's not because I'm bad, it's because I have nothing to say at this time. Only one thing has triggered me as suspicious, and it's Made's player salad a few posts back, asking like 10 people a different quick question. I'll vote for Made for now. Other than that, not much has pulled me into this game, just a lot of huffing and puffing that doesn't much strike me as particularly civ or bad.

I think he is just trying to get you to talk, I guess. I agree with you about made. I know I mentioned him earlier. But this new post of his pinged me too. Trying to get discussion is a good thing, but the way he is going about it doesn't seem civ. I will wait and see what he does with the answers he receives. 'Til then he remains a suspect of mine.

Can't finish catching up now....got some places to be. Be back late tonight.

I'm 8 pages behind. I honestly won't catch up but...from what I have read and posted....I am going with a made vote. I'm not sure why people are going for Mac so if anyone wants to share, that would be cool.

What are you guys thinking? This could have been a baddie lynch. Should we assume not though?

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 9:31 pm

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:42 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:33 pmReads like he's already made up his mind on the direction he'd like to see the thread move in and is just trying to push it there.

for any other players i'd see that as a red flag, but is it alignment indicative for MacDougall? he did the same thing with me, and it sounds like this might just be part of his meta

Yuck for some who ultimately voted Mac.

I understand that Mac could be civ and probably is. But, this post from Jack pings the hell out of me. It sounds like he is laying the groundwork for him to be able to pull "suspicions" out of his hat later in the game.

*sigh*...I'm so far behind. Look at all of you acting like talkative children. Separate yourselves and go to your rooms for a while. Mommy needs some quiet time to herself.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 5:34 pm

dunya is replacing Gumshoe.

Now why can't the rest of you be as sweet as dunya, here. Her mother must be proud. And I just have all of you sitting around here quoting this person or that person, making jokes, and acting like we don't have a lynch ahead of us. Focus, children!

I see one of my children has lashed out against me. All I do for him and he goes and places a vote on me. TSP, you ought to be ashamed of yourself. It's the spanking spoon for you, my dear. This will hurt me more than it hurts you. I hope you learn your lesson.

dunya wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 9:34 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 9:32 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 9:31 pm What's the case against TSP?

I didn't care for what I perceived to be shade he was throwing at people who weren't cursed just for not being cursed. TSP, if that's inaccurate then say so.

He called me a narcissist, so it is inaccurate.

He voted for me and I saw no reason for it.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 9:50 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 9:49 pm Glorf is like a golden retriever puppy. No way will I ever lynch him.

If Glorfindel said "I'm a member of the town faction" and then someone claimed cop with a red check on him, I would sooner lynch the other guy.

I have to agree with this. I will believe whatever Glorf says about his role.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 9:58 pm @Elohcin

@DrWilgy

Please name one thing you have done to help catch any baddies.

I haven't been getting in the way of myself, this if how I help. I know a couple things about myself as a civ in a big game:

1) I am no good at keeping up in big games (jobs)
Why did I sign up, you ask? As a favor to my sweet husband who put so much time into the game and wanted it to get started.
2) Early in a big game, I cannot speak freely of my thoughts of a player without sounding wishy-washy because I will go back and forth on everyone. This will get me lynched and then all the civs are like, "man, we mis-lynched her again?!"

I know me. And I know that as a civ in a big game, I need to stay out of the way and go along for the ride until we are down to about 12 players. THAT is how I help my civ team. Once we get down to a manageable number for my brain to keep organized, I can come out guns blazing on the baddies. If we get there, and I am not contributing, you can lynch me. Fair enough?

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 10:07 pm

Eloh became a new ping for me. The recent vocaroo game was a virtual hellscape for participation. There were fewer posts obviously but many of the posts took up to 5 minutes to read. It presented a challenge for participation that put a lot of people in a position of lagging behind, some days I had to sit listening to other players speak for 2 or 3 hours before I could post anything relevant. Eloh maintained a position of being one of the most active players in that game despite all that and had frequently Meanwhile in this game, which has honestly a pretty standard length mafia game other than the the 16 page long day 0 and the dumpster fire that we all just experienced.

I can listen and do other things at the same time. I cannot read and do other things at the same time.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2018 10:07 pm

the fact that her communication during chaos day was limited despite her relatively easy curse doesn't help things much either. I don't see the same elohcin drive as I saw in vocaroo mafia. It's a strange juxtaposition.

funny, in vocaroo mafia I was said that I could be bad BECAUSE I was posting a lot. That's the thing with mafia games....you can get called out for acting one way or get called out for acting the opposite.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:02 am

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:07 pm Everyone is being quite crazy with their votes right now. I don't like this lack of seriousness in the beginning of big games like this. Everyone thinks they can just play around and vote here or there and it won't matter much. Dudes (and dudettes), if we try hard enough, we might be able to get a scum on Day 1.

I'd like people to weigh in on this post.

This implies Eloh is ready to go, excited to play and down to catch some scum....but then she never tries.

Did she get busy? Or is she faking?

I had to scold you all like you were children. What else was I supposed to say that pertained to mafia? We are not down to 12 yet.

I am here. I cannot read because scrolling hurts my head too much. I see we are leaning toward Dunya, Simon, or chuck. How can I help?

I haven't read in a couple days, but I do remember Dunya coming in here defending Simon a lot to someone who was suspecting him. So, that alone is a Simon/Dunya teammie ping. I will put my vote on Dunya since she has the most already. And if she turns out bad, I say we go Simon next.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 1:19 am

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:32 pm I haven't read in a couple days, but I do remember Dunya coming in here defending Simon a lot to someone who was suspecting him. So, that alone is a Simon/Dunya teammie ping. I will put my vote on Dunya since she has the most already. And if she turns out bad, I say we go Simon next.

Yuckyuckyuck.

Y'all told me to just pick someone to vote for. And now you want to say, "yuck"? The two with the most votes were dunya and Simon. Dunya had the most. And I am not sure, but I think if I had voted Simon, it would have made a tie. No, thank you.

My migraine let up for about an hour or two yesterday evening but came back in the middle of the night. I'm starting to think something is wrong with me.

lapluie wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 3:09 am For the record, I had my vote on Simon before dunya when I agreed to removing my vote from her. speedhcucks logic on how Simon is no good. I dont know what happens if votes are tied, I still don't think simon is bad just because he's noncommittal & lacking communication throughout this entire game. Mac's logic made most sense to bus simon out of the game because itd be an easy target & it seemed believable that it'd happen. I switched in fear knowing I would have made a bad decision if I didn't go with mac's words how dunya is probably manipulating us to sympathize. I realised we fudged up when she told us to check Elohcin right after polls closed.

I don't understand what this is talking about...check me after polls are closed. Can you explain?

lapluie wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 3:17 am @Elohcin did chime in asking who to pick for lynch, out of simon & speed. why dunya?

I chose dunya cause she had the most votes at the time. I asked who I should pick out of dunya, Simon, and chuck becuase they were the top three voted for at the time.

(Yes, I am resorting to searching for my name in the thread and responding. I just want to be open and honest with you all. I am seriously in pain and just trying to get through these days and keep up with the things I am responsible for i.e. mafia, laundry, feeding my children, etc. Bare minimum is what you all are getting from me and that's just gotta be enough for you right now.)

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 2:31 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 2:18 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 1:19 am

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:32 pm I haven't read in a couple days, but I do remember Dunya coming in here defending Simon a lot to someone who was suspecting him. So, that alone is a Simon/Dunya teammie ping. I will put my vote on Dunya since she has the most already. And if she turns out bad, I say we go Simon next.

Yuckyuckyuck.

Y'all told me to just pick someone to vote for. And now you want to say, "yuck"? The two with the most votes were dunya and Simon. Dunya had the most. And I am not sure, but I think if I had voted Simon, it would have made a tie. No, thank you.

My migraine let up for about an hour or two yesterday evening but came back in the middle of the night. I'm starting to think something is wrong with me.

Your vote is not yuck (though I wish you had voted Simon).

What is yuck is picking to vote for the townie and then tying their alignments together. You avoided lynching a baddie and then put forth an excuse to not vote him later either.

Sorry about your migraine. I hope you feel better.

So we know Simon is bad?

Thanks. I look some tylenol codeine I had left over from surgery recovery (which I hate to do) and it finally helped enough for me to be able to get up and get some things done. Estrogen can be a real bitch.

I'm finally feeling a good bit better, yay. I saw some posts using my real life migraine to decide whether you think I am good or bad in game. I only shared about my RL situation so you all knew why I was so aloof and only responding to posts with my name in them. Don't try to read deeper than that. It isn't fair to use that as an indication of alignment. Just didn't want you guys to think I fell off the face of the earth.

woah linki

lapluie wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 9:43 pm I'm not buying whatever elochin is putting out, my vote will be on her.

I really don't care at this point and won't be trying to defend myself. I have done nothing to help the civs, this is true. And I woke up this morning with my migraine back and on the opposite side of my head and I feel as if I could throw up at any moment. I am so over feelng like crap. So....nope....don't care.

I'm here to vote...here to help even though I know me NOT being here all day has been very unhelpful. I see the votes are pretty spread out.

Quin wrote: ↑Tue Jan 23, 2018 9:09 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Tue Jan 23, 2018 9:08 pm I'm here to vote...here to help even though I know me NOT being here all day has been very unhelpful. I see the votes are pretty spread out.

what are you thinking?

I'm thinking TSP because he gave me some flack.

Quin wrote: ↑Tue Jan 23, 2018 9:09 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Tue Jan 23, 2018 9:08 pm I'm here to vote...here to help even though I know me NOT being here all day has been very unhelpful. I see the votes are pretty spread out.

what are you thinking?

I'm thinking TSP because he gave me some flack.

I'm back, baby! My head isn't 100% but it is a LOT better. I have almost finished working and it's not even 10am. I still have to work out and school the children, but I will be back today. Can't promise on a huge catch-up, but hopefully one of you kind people can catch me up with a summary and I can begin to help find some baddies.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:08 pm

lapluie wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:00 pm Hang on a second..why are we voting simon again?

I think MacDougall's theory that Jack was bussing Simon was merited enough that one of two scenarios is true:

~ Jack knows something about Simon via honest means, and it's more conclusive than a blocked kill.

~ Jack is bussing Simon.

If the former is true, that's a good lead on Simon being mafia. If the latter is true, Simon is definitely mafia.

And if the latter is correct, then Jack is bad too? Just clarifying your thoughts.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:30 pm

lapluie wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:00 pm Hang on a second..why are we voting simon again?

Cause the goal of the game is to lynch the mafia before the kill all the townies.

I think this is pretty hilarious. And I know I haven't been around, but I agree that Simon could be bad. It's a little bit gut, a little bit lack of play, but mostly it was his random vote. He voted for lap, and said it was random. Why would he voting randomly at this point? I know he is 10, but still.

lapluie wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:09 pm
There is no case against simon, I for one am certain simon isn't bad, there's no reason to even lynch him. He's inactive!!!!

=/

I don't like when people throw around words like "certain" in mafia. This makes me think you are bad.

And, your push for nutella and your over the top trust in tony's word terrify me a bit.

I understand why nutella is under the eye and I can probably get on board with her case on another day. Today, I vote Simon.

lapluie wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:31 pm Lol ofcourse Elohcin votes simon, omy to save her mafia partner. I always knew it & dunya did say to keep an eye on her

dunya says so because she is afraid of me

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:32 pm

lapluie wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:31 pm Lol ofcourse Elohcin votes simon, omy to save her mafia partner. I always knew it & dunya did say to keep an eye on her

Can't Simon and nutella both be mafia?

oo, yes, good question.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:38 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:37 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:32 pm

lapluie wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:31 pm Lol ofcourse Elohcin votes simon, omy to save her mafia partner. I always knew it & dunya did say to keep an eye on her

Can't Simon and nutella both be mafia?

oo, yes, good question.

Do you have an answer for it?

Of course! The answer is yes. Nothing is *certain* unless you are mafia. Then, the only thing you can *know* is who is and is not your teammate.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:41 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:37 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:11 pm One thing that is blindingly clear:

If Simon is mafia then lapluie is not.

I want to hear more about this.

There is no good reason for a mafia member to defend Simon this hard if he is a teammate. It's nonsense. One is forced to invoke the most intense of WIFOM to turn that into a reality, and I think that'd be quite weak.

Mafia members are more likely to be eager to bus their single-digit posting teammate than protect him at all costs. Civilians tend to be clueless about this kind of thing and will by their very nature surround the defender post-mafia-flip with foam dribbling from their mouths waiting to pounce. Simons teammates know that.

The only alternative to consider would be: this is LyLo right now, nutella is a civilian, and lapluie is going for the win. I find that highly unlikely given the numbers.

but nothing is certain. You are not in Lap's brain. She could be Simon's teammate and defending the hel out of him because he has a VERY useful role.

and you have every right to do so

I just remember when I hosted once, the players were doing such off the wall stuff. On top of that, due to game mechanics, powers were not going through and players acted as if they had...it was so weird to watch it from behind the scenes and I will never look at mafia the same again. You cannot expect people to think and play like you think they will.

Wow. I haven't seen a rez on TS in a LONG time. Cool! Welcome back Kyle!

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 12:39 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 12:28 am 1. how does everyone currently feel about lapluie? are they cool?

2. @Marmot how are you? what are your thoughts on Jay?

3. @JaggedJimmyJay same question here as number 2 only about Marmot instead.

1. Civilian read. She had Glorfindel's strong endorsement, and I doubt she'd have handled Simon the way she did as his teammate.

3. He's my top suspect. I've already voted accordingly.

I think lap could be bad. I know Simon voted for her "randomly" at one point and that may make you think she is pretty much confirmed civ. But her reaction to that was too cool. She gave a little post about it and then dropped it. I mean, I guess she knew it wouldn't get her lynched, but still. Maybe the baddie team was coaching Simon on what it means to distance and that was the way he chose to do it. Then, she pushed hard for a nutella lynch over Simon. In fact, now that I type this out. Then there was her certainty about TSP's reads! That was SO pingy. These things with the vibes I was getting from her in the very beginning of the game before my migraine sabbatical make her one of my top suspects.

Kyle, I see in your post that you suspect lap as well, but that Glorf thinking she(?) is civ causes you to rethink. So, obviously Glorf was civ since he was night-killed. But why does his opinion causes you pause? Civ's can be wrong. Am I missing something?

HAHA, JAY, I am here!! I have been here for a few days now...chugging along. I know I don't post as much as YOU! :P

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:43 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:29 pmKyle, I see in your post that you suspect lap as well, but that Glorf thinking she(?) is civ causes you to rethink. So, obviously Glorf was civ since he was night-killed. But why does his opinion causes you pause? Civ's can be wrong. Am I missing something?

in summary, glorfindel's view on lapluie changed overnight. he went from believing lap was definitely mafia and a top priority for lynching to believing they were definitely civ literally overnight. Iirc there wasn't any real in thread reason for him to change his view on lapluie during that time frame so it's possible his view was changed by a night action.

@Elohcin what are your thoughts on marmot?

When I do something like this, no one trusts me. They call me wishy-washy crazy and lynch me as a civ.

I don't have many thoughts on marmot. He isn't memorable except for his self-vote until he moved it. Honestly, I don't even remember who he moved it to. I know people think he is bad. I would have to go and read him to know why. I might be able do that today since I doubt he has many posts.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:50 pm Glorfindel was highly suspicious of lapluie until I talked it over with him. He seemed convinced by my arguments in her favor, though I was still surprised by his level of confidence in her after that point. I'll have to determine whether a night phase ended somewhere during that period to facilitate his having received information.

Please do so. Because if his change of thoughts came just because you convinced him, then I am not convinced.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:56 pm Glorfindel on lapluie, Night 4:

Spoiler: show

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 6:48 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 6:30 pm I sure did. What is your greatest disagreement?

It frankly astounds me that anyone could read Lapluie’s ISO and deduce from that she is anywhere near Town. You said this of Jack:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:09 pm Jack is red because he continues to push dubious cases with a tone of exaggerated assertiveness while resisting other dubious cases with the same tone, and I question the legitimacy of any civilian mindset he has attempted to portray.

Precisely the same thing could be said of Lapluie (only I think it applies more so in her case).

Don’t get me going on Simon. There’s massive red-herring potential there. If he was Mafia coming in at the last second, surely he’d have nailed TSP’s coffin shut once and for all. But no, he voted for Lapluie which is an encouraging look in my view.

It would seem logical that any POE needs to focus on the LC and TSP wagons. THAT is where we should start looking.

In any case, this will be left up to you guys to determine. I believe that it would be cruel and inhumane of our Mafia team to keep me alive any longer in this game so I hope my game does end here in the next few hours. No one would listen to me when it counted, I don’t expect that’s like to change.

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 10:00 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 7:11 pm

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 7:05 pm If by your last question Jay, you mean someone else that I knew for certain to be a Townie, no.

I can understand why you'd be perturbed given your strong civilian read on Long Con. Whatever brings you to that read, consider how others are going to approach Long Con without the same rationale in mind that you have in yours. He hasn't done very much in this game. He's flown under the radar. I think it's fair to suspect him in the absence of special insight. In lapluie's case, I am pretty sure Long Con voted for her in a tally which could have easily destroyed her. He moved to TSP in the end, but for a long stretch he was on lapluie. Play devil's advocate with yourself and assume lapluie is a civilian -- how is she likely to respond when an under-the-radar Long Con is trying to get her lynched close to EOD?

Now, consider your own role in this incident. You were loudly shouting for LC to be saved. You didn't want that lynch. Anyone who knows you well would be well-advised to listen to you on that front. Does lapluie know you? Does your reputation hold any weight with a player who has never played with you before? What about the LC voters who do know you and still ignored you? Would you agree that there is a more obvious problem with that picture?

Very well, Jay - you have my attention.

Glorfindel on lapluie, Day 5:

Spoiler: show

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:31 pm Also, apologies to you Lapluie. Jay has made me see the light.

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 7:50 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:12 pm

lapluie wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:12 pm Its best to lynch mafia players who are still active now, rather than an inactive player imo.

That's a fair argument. I would consider them both to be active at least in that they can send night actions. You'll note that Simon voted late in the last day phase, and for you.

I voted for Lapluie too and I was wrong. I don’t think Simon making a wrong choice particularly in that instance (sorry, Lapluie) wasn’t necessarily understandable.

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 7:55 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:11 pm One thing that is blindingly clear:

If Simon is mafia then lapluie is not.

Lapluie is NOT Mafia.

You can see a clear transition between phases. On Night 4 he started with strong suspicion of lapluie, and even though he was willing to listen to my argument in her favor he didn't 180 it. When the new day phase began though, he was immediate in absolving her and resolute in defending her.

I'm not lynching that.

perhaps I should not post until I catch up. Even still. I see this change...but it doesn't totally convince me. I mean....what if Glor got wrong info? I have seen things like this happen before. I don't trust any "info" to be 100% true in mafia.

If Jay is civ, why isn't he dead yet?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 4:41 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 4:35 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2018 5:09 pm Marmot,

Why were you resistant to a tie at the very end of the day phase?

I'm always resistant to ties. This game is no different to others.

Then you're mafia. Period.

I don't mean to be all "defend marmot!!" because I have no clue what y'all have on him (and if you don't mind telling me what y'all have on him @JaggedJimmyJay, that would be great), but I feeel the same damn way about ties in mafia whether I am bad or good. I hate them. They may me crazy uneasy for some reason.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 4:43 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 4:32 pm perhaps I should not post until I catch up. Even still. I see this change...but it doesn't totally convince me. I mean....what if Glor got wrong info? I have seen things like this happen before. I don't trust any "info" to be 100% true in mafia.

I wouldn't call it 100% either. I might call it 95% though. At what point does this extend beyond sensible skepticism and into the realm of paranoia or fear-mongering?

like, paranoid that you've been given the wrong info? I wouldn't call it that. I would just call it ignoring the info altogether because you don't know if it's true or not. No reason toe even entertain it, imo.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 4:53 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 4:50 pm I don't mean to be all "defend marmot!!" because I have no clue what y'all have on him (and if you don't mind telling me what y'all have on him JaggedJimmyJay, that would be great), but I feeel the same damn way about ties in mafia whether I am bad or good. I hate them. They may me crazy uneasy for some reason.

I don't object to someone resisting ties in general. So do I. I care about Marmot resisting that tie, and that's all I'm going to say about it. If you'd like a more general case:

Marmot refused to listen to Glorfindel, the guy who never lies, when he was screaming to prevent a Long Con lynch. Marmot just kept asking him "what do you know??" and "why??" as if those are answerable questions, all while leaving his vote planted firmly on LC's face. Fake.

Marmot "tried" to sway the lynch from nutella to Simon (civilian to mafia), but only by begging for vote switches from players who had made it clear all day long that they were voting for nutella and not Simon. Fake.

The first part of this general case just screams marmot to me. Everyone plays mafia differently and I think this is meta for marmot and it gives me no alarms.

The second part of the case is just confusing to me. He wanted people to vote for Simon (mafia) and not nutella (civ). I don't get how that is pingy.

lapluie wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 4:54 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 4:32 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:56 pm Glorfindel on lapluie, Night 4:

Spoiler: show

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 6:48 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 6:30 pm I sure did. What is your greatest disagreement?

It frankly astounds me that anyone could read Lapluie’s ISO and deduce from that she is anywhere near Town. You said this of Jack:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:09 pm Jack is red because he continues to push dubious cases with a tone of exaggerated assertiveness while resisting other dubious cases with the same tone, and I question the legitimacy of any civilian mindset he has attempted to portray.

Precisely the same thing could be said of Lapluie (only I think it applies more so in her case).

Don’t get me going on Simon. There’s massive red-herring potential there. If he was Mafia coming in at the last second, surely he’d have nailed TSP’s coffin shut once and for all. But no, he voted for Lapluie which is an encouraging look in my view.

It would seem logical that any POE needs to focus on the LC and TSP wagons. THAT is where we should start looking.

In any case, this will be left up to you guys to determine. I believe that it would be cruel and inhumane of our Mafia team to keep me alive any longer in this game so I hope my game does end here in the next few hours. No one would listen to me when it counted, I don’t expect that’s like to change.

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 10:00 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 7:11 pm

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 7:05 pm If by your last question Jay, you mean someone else that I knew for certain to be a Townie, no.

I can understand why you'd be perturbed given your strong civilian read on Long Con. Whatever brings you to that read, consider how others are going to approach Long Con without the same rationale in mind that you have in yours. He hasn't done very much in this game. He's flown under the radar. I think it's fair to suspect him in the absence of special insight. In lapluie's case, I am pretty sure Long Con voted for her in a tally which could have easily destroyed her. He moved to TSP in the end, but for a long stretch he was on lapluie. Play devil's advocate with yourself and assume lapluie is a civilian -- how is she likely to respond when an under-the-radar Long Con is trying to get her lynched close to EOD?

Now, consider your own role in this incident. You were loudly shouting for LC to be saved. You didn't want that lynch. Anyone who knows you well would be well-advised to listen to you on that front. Does lapluie know you? Does your reputation hold any weight with a player who has never played with you before? What about the LC voters who do know you and still ignored you? Would you agree that there is a more obvious problem with that picture?

Very well, Jay - you have my attention.

Glorfindel on lapluie, Day 5:

Spoiler: show

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:31 pm Also, apologies to you Lapluie. Jay has made me see the light.

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 7:50 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:12 pm

lapluie wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:12 pm Its best to lynch mafia players who are still active now, rather than an inactive player imo.

That's a fair argument. I would consider them both to be active at least in that they can send night actions. You'll note that Simon voted late in the last day phase, and for you.

I voted for Lapluie too and I was wrong. I don’t think Simon making a wrong choice particularly in that instance (sorry, Lapluie) wasn’t necessarily understandable.

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 7:55 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:11 pm One thing that is blindingly clear:

If Simon is mafia then lapluie is not.

Lapluie is NOT Mafia.

You can see a clear transition between phases. On Night 4 he started with strong suspicion of lapluie, and even though he was willing to listen to my argument in her favor he didn't 180 it. When the new day phase began though, he was immediate in absolving her and resolute in defending her.

I'm not lynching that.

perhaps I should not post until I catch up. Even still. I see this change...but it doesn't totally convince me. I mean....what if Glor got wrong info? I have seen things like this happen before. I don't trust any "info" to be 100% true in mafia.

Well nobody's gonna stop you for voting for me if that was the last result for your decision, but rumor here goes around that glorfindel doesn't lie?

maybe that is what he wants you to think? :P

seriously though....I am not saying glorf lied. I am saying I don't think we can fully trust his info even if he got it from the host himself.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 5:46 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 5:38 pm The first part of this general case just screams marmot to me. Everyone plays mafia differently and I think this is meta for marmot and it gives me no alarms.

The second part of the case is just confusing to me. He wanted people to vote for Simon (mafia) and not nutella (civ). I don't get how that is pingy.

I don't see how "ignore the pleas of the man who never lies" is either a strategy or a play style. It's a refusal to heed the words of someone you claim to trust when it matters most. That's yuck.

I don't really buy that he "wanted" people to vote for Simon. He was making that request of players who had said all day phase long that they were voting for nutella and not Simon. It was pointless.

I think we have to agree to disagree, sorry. I definitely see a marmot playstyle in your case-part 1. And in part 2, it seems like a civ marmot who is really sees a civ nutella and wants people to vote for Simon instead. It's like your process of elimination crap. He saw that he trusted nutella more and so he wanted people to vote Simon. EVERYONE who did not vote for Simon, voted for Nutella. Who was he going to ask other than those who had decided they were voting nutella? Deadies cannot vote, non-players cannot vote.

Honestly...I 100% am scared out of my mind right now because I hate defending people so hard in games because I know it can come back to bite me in the ass. But I have to call bullshit on your claims against marmot. I think they are stupid and feel like it's my responsibility to tell you so.

If marmot is bad....it is NOT for the reasons you are saying. That is all.

so I just looked at the lynch poll. I had no clue Dom was playing and I don't even know a Dave. Have they even posted?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 6:14 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 6:03 pmEVERYONE who did not vote for Simon, voted for Nutella. Who was he going to ask other than those who had decided they were voting nutella? Deadies cannot vote, non-players cannot vote.

Honestly...I 100% am scared out of my mind right now because I hate defending people so hard in games because I know it can come back to bite me in the ass. But I have to call bullshit on your claims against marmot. I think they are stupid and feel like it's my responsibility to tell you so.

He didn't ask "everyone" who didn't vote for Simon. He asked the specific few people who indicated that they would not vote for Simon.

Go read it and then tell me my claims are bullshit.

Were those the specific people who were actually in the thread when he was asking? Did you think of that? Maybe that's why he was asking those people.

linki: Jay "It makes zero sense for Marmot to believe Glorfindel has a moral aversion to lying about his alignment, but no moral aversion to lying about someone else's alignment." This is the ONLY think I agree with you about. But this was NOT in your two-part case against Marmot.

lapluie wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 6:15 pm

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 28, 2018 6:12 pm so I just looked at the lynch poll. I had no clue Dom was playing and I don't even know a Dave. Have they even posted?

I think Dave has only 1 or 2 posts, but dom has been MIA from start of game

we cannot rule them out as mafia....just sayin'

@marmot....those you were asking to vote Simon instead nutella....were those the people in the thread at the time? If not...why were you asking those people specifically?

I told you I would be back when the number of players decreased. Are you sure you still want me?