The Syndicate

DharmaHelper wrote:Which part was role claiming when you were Tyler Durden? When you said "Hey guys I'm Tyler Durden" or when Epi said "Tyler Durden has the kill" and you said 'Who do you guys want me to kill?"

Then I lost the game at the very last minute due to outing myself. Good times. Can't say I didn't deserve that one.

RIP bea. Wonder what the thought process was behind that one.

Regarding other events/posts, I'll see when I can respond to those and start properly contributing for d5, but I've been occupied with Battle of the Hosts hype as well as PhD writing, and will continue to be for the bulk of tomorrow.

DharmaHelper wrote:MP pulled a fucking Tyler Durden again. He cannot be stopped.

I'm much more proud of this one though; despite OKing everything through the hosts that time, I crossed over the line into role outing with the Tyler Durden incident. And this one took some actual effort on my part to make myself seem suspicious enough, the last time I was able to start Durdenizing the thread because people like to target me at Night likely as a result of me talking too much.

Oh, quick EBWOP: Please note that my thoughts regarding Typhoony need to be updated. The more I actually think about it, the less I think that the case brought forth about him being Penguin makes sense. I'll also give Enrique a good look for making me reexamine that issue, since he could have sat there and shut up while I continued to maintain a faulty line of reasoning.

The best case scenario right now, in fact, would be if Scotty is a potentially mafia-friendly inmate. They'll kill him, then Robin gets 12%, the civilians are rid of a potential threat, and no civilian dies. If I was Robin, that's exactly the kind of scenario I'd try to set up.

However, all of that's the mafia's call to make. I don't think any further speculation is possible or warranted, but I figured I'd throw my thoughts out there.

Rather, I think trying to find Nero's teammate, or better yet, cracking open the other mafia team is preferable. So who wants to talk about my rainbow list? What do you all think? Which player(s) do you disagree with my assessment on; why? Which player would you like to lynch tomorrow?

I have to head out again, but because I'm a shameless mafia addict, I'll surely be back at some point when I want a break again.

Again, operating under a certain set of assumptions, Robin already used both of his lynch stops, since we've seen two, presumably; he's literally a vanilla with no power at this point who can win dead or alive. An absolute waste of an NK if the mafia were to ever kill him.

The smart move would be for the mafia to kill Scotty, but again, he could be GCPD or Wayne Manor for all they know, or I could totally be fucking with them and he could be neither, or I could have no information on Scotty (and instead I had it on Wilgy, or I have none at all because I'm not Robin). They don't know what's going on in my head.

It's as if, again assuming I am Robin and not a trickstery inmate which I could totally be, the entire thread just got two free alignment checks. I think that was worth it.

Bullzeye wrote:So then what have we really gained? A lynch with no result and MP surely getting killed tonight now that it's obvious he's Robin?

What do you mean what have we really gained?

You're two players closer to endgame now, if I am Robin, because that means Scotty and I both cannot be mafia. That's two night kills that the mafia must now use to take us out of the game.

I'd really love to see the mafia try and kill me. It'd be ridiculously stupid on their part. Not only do they not need me dead to win, if I am Robin, but also I can win dead or alive. It means nothing to me whether I'm alive or dead at this point. That's a kill that they could have used on a civilian, but instead they'll waste it on me.

That's valuable.

One last point before I have to go back to PhD work for a while:

I do not want d5 to go blindly into a lynch of Glorfindel. There are reasons to suspect him, yes, but there are plenty of other players that should be thoroughly examined, and I think that recently (partially due to my fault, I take responsibility for that) there has been less "spreading the love" of suspicion around at players. As such, I will view any push to coalesce around Glorfindel only, in terms of vote and/or discussion, going forward with suspicion.

Matt wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Matt wrote:Why can't you be Rupert Thorne, MP?

There are no *Secrets* by Ruper Thorne's role, so although there is inevitable ambiguity due to the "as yet" in his role description, as you illustrated, I didn't include him in the list of potential roles, because there's no reason to believe that he would gain a lynch stop.

If we suspend disbelief and contend that there is reason to believe that he could gain a lynch stop at any point in the game, then it seems reasonable to me that we can come up with reason to believe that any role could gain a lynch stop at any point in the game. I see no reason to believe Rupert Thorne possesses any attributes that are any different than any of the other non-*Secrets* roles.

Yes, there is a reason to believe that, hence Rupert being of little strength "as yet". Sure, it could be something else entirely that Rupert eventually gets, but it could be a lynch stop.

Anyway, as I already stated, I think the more likely answer is Robin, but Mac saying you're def not mafia is not true.

You fail to recognize, however, that you reading into the "as yet" requires Rupert Thorne to have secrets to his role that are not stated in blank on the front page. It literally gives no role ability indication of him having any incremental power, other than that little bit in his role description.

I think it's stretching, therefore, to suspend disbelief specifically with regards to a scenario in which Rupert Thorne has secrets to his role with no *Secrets* qualifier, that I am that role, and that I happened to align myself with a mafia team, AND that my behavior consistently lines up with that possibility.

Because I think that's a theory grounded in practically nothing, I can't help but view your contention otherwise with suspicion.

Enrique wrote:We learned something, MP, but with that said I do think your lynch was pretty unnecessary. Couldn't you just have done that any other time if the situation lent itself instead of encouraging/forcing it?

btw, I haven't explained my vote for Glorfindel. Basically, at that point in the race, MP was leading 6-2 (Marmot's vote snuck up on me), and every subsequent vote was obviously gonna go to MP. My idea was to bring Glorf closer to the race, and then just baiting for MP's teammates to try to save him. Clearly it didn't work out, especially after the revelations of the lynch result. Typhoony's vote was questionable, but even if he's bad, I don't think MP is his teammate. We got our fair share of sketchy votes anyway so it didn't matter a lot.

linki-
re: Typh, well, I just don't think there's any evidence besides the idea that you got blackmailed. He could well be the Penguin, yeah, but I have no reason to think it's him over practically anybody else.
re: rainbow list, yeah actually I wanted to make a post addressing that some point. Just gimme till I decide to get on my computer sometime today

I suppose you could say it was unnecessary, but I was poisoned Night 1 (if you believe me), and I had literally no information regarding retrieving the antidote nor did I have any idea how long it would take to kill me. And, although DH made fun of me for not visiting the hospital (somewhat rightfully so, although I did do it on purpose to get some more attention), I'm not convinced Epi and LC would have made retrieving the antidote a mere matter of:
- Go to hospital.
- Get antidote by picking hospital.

Because, if that were the case, then Poison Ivy has a really dumb power. Consequently, I had a sense of urgency driven by that fact, and I already started picking up substantiated suspicion due to my voting for sig d2 in spite of placing Nero (then confirmed to be mafia) at the bottom of my list. There was nothing fabricated about that behavior; I legitimately dug myself a bit of a hole there that led me to believe I'd be getting some suspicion sooner rather than later.

In addition, the longer I live, the longer I am a distraction. I've played enough mafia games in general, but especially on this site, to know that I am almost always an inevitably huge distraction. Dom, for example, has focused his attention on me for multiple cycles now, and I can't say I necessarily blame him. I wanted my name to be out of the running for potential mafia as soon as possible, because then that's one step closer to being able to solve the game by process of elimination (POE).

EBWOP: To add to that, Matt, Rupert Thorne seems like a mere "alignment copier" kind of role to me, which is quite powerful in and of itself. If, as you propose, he "copied" a mafia team's alignment, then that team would have 4 effective members. I think if he had an additional power that provided incremental benefits that we'd see a *Secrets* qualifier.

Matt wrote:Why can't you be Rupert Thorne, MP?

There are no *Secrets* by Ruper Thorne's role, so although there is inevitable ambiguity due to the "as yet" in his role description, as you illustrated, I didn't include him in the list of potential roles, because there's no reason to believe that he would gain a lynch stop.

If we suspend disbelief and contend that there is reason to believe that he could gain a lynch stop at any point in the game, then it seems reasonable to me that we can come up with reason to believe that any role could gain a lynch stop at any point in the game. I see no reason to believe Rupert Thorne possesses any attributes that are any different than any of the other non-*Secrets* roles.

Enrique wrote:linki2- Did you mull over the Typh thing yet? Is there another element I'm missing, or is it what it looks like?

I have, and I realize there are technically other possibilities for his role, so I'm willing to reexamine him. I'm not sure I believe he can't be Penguin though.

What do you have to say in response to my placing of you at the bottom of my rainbow list, anything? I did throw some content down there; did you feel any of it is possible to address and/or worth addressing?

Dom, I'd like to know if there are any other players you "trust" more than me at the moment, and why that is the case, since you seem intent on continuing to spread a lack of trust for me in the thread.

For those of you who contend that my actions have resulted in a lynch in which we "learned nothing" and are doubting that there was a point to everything, let me lay out the following:

- The only role with a publicly known lynch stop is Robin. He is a town-friendly independent.
- The only other roles that could be responsible for a lynch stop inevitably are those with *Secrets* qualifiers. There are no GCPD or mafia roles with *Secrets*, thus making the other possibilities inmate-based.

The inmates with *Secrets* in their roles are: Joker (deceased, Black Rock), The Riddler, Poison Ivy, and Bane.

That leaves three distinctly independent possibilities for my actions. Poison Ivy, if you're inclined to believe I was not lying about being poisoned, is not only an illogical fit for my behavior but a thematically unlikely one. Given PI can poison someone every night and her role seems to center around that function, it doesn't stand to reason why she would have a lynch stop. The Riddler and Bane are possible. I will not role hint or role out myself, but I have given you all the following information:

I can only be one of four roles. None of those roles are Mafia roles (or GCPD, for that matter).

So I have the following questions for you:
1) If I am Robin, then what explanation do you see in my ISO for my behavior?
2) If I am The Riddler, then what explanation do you see in my ISO for my behavior?
3) If I am Bane, then what explanation do you see in my ISO for my behavior?

Since we don't know the *Secrets* to The Riddler and Bane, let's talk about Robin.

Robin is rewarded for every mafia (5%) and inmate (12%) lynch, and punished for every GCPD (negative 2%) and Wayne Manor (negative 8%) lynch. Even though the punishment for a dead GCPD may seem minuscule, it is mathematically difficult to reach 100% to begin with, let alone with each additional GCPD death; moreover, it is mathematically impossible for Wayne Manor to win if GCPD do not win.

If I am Robin, therefore, I have no reason to actively work against the GCPD's cause; if anything, I have incentive to work with it. In addition, we all know that the lynch was stopped d1 when Scotty and DrWilgy were tied for the lynch. If anyone recalls my Wilgy = Robin theory, the main result out of it was that I proposed that Scotty is confirmed civilian. If instead I am Robin, I gained by perpetuating that theory because, if I did save Scotty, it gives me a way to disseminate information about a civilian without outing myself.

Note that the Mafia have no incentives whatsoever to kill any of Wayne Manor, since they win once GCPD are dead. Since I am confirmed not to be GCPD, then there is no reason for me to draw any night kills. If I do, then that's a night kill that doesn't go to a civilian, and the mafia are stupid. Conversely, there is no reason for me to be lynched, since GCPD and inmates do not need me dead specifically (again, there are *Secrets*, but we can't speculate on unknown qualities). Regarding Scotty then, since he was nearly lynched d1, he is saved from being lynched subsequently, and if the Mafia want to get rid of him, they will have to use up a night kill to do so. But in doing so, they don't even know whether Scotty actually is GCPD or whether he's Wayne Manor, the latter of which they do not need dead to win.

Now, if I'm The Riddler or Bane, then I want to tell you as little as possible about my *Secrets*, I would imagine, and I would want to float this "I am Robin" theory as much as I can without directly outing myself, since it would be in my own best interest.

It's up to you to decide what role you think my actions reflect. I had been catching suspicion since the start of the game, but it intensified in the aftermath of the d2 lynch. I figured my lynch would be inevitable; rather, I wanted it to be, and I thought it would be best to get it out of the way now before any other variables mess with the plan. In addition, most of my chaos posting specifically designed to get myself lynch was enacted before I was cured of poison, and I wanted to be lynched before the poison could take its toll.

At the bare minimum, now you all know that I can only be less than a handful of roles, and that there is potential additional information. Of course, this is all assuming that none of the roles excluding *Secrets* do not have additional abilities or information.

So, please, tell me how we've "learned nothing".

Enrique, let me mull on that.

BBL all.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Whatever just happened in that lynch, I think it really benefited the civilian cause.

Where did I say this would really benefit the civilian cause? Link please.

Only popping in for a minute, but I can confirm that those sockpuppets are not of relevance to this game.

Golden wrote:MP, I feel as though you have pro-town motivations for this whole lynch thing, but I still want to hear more from you, within the bounds of what can be said.

Stuff like, well... this ... makes me paranoid.

You mean my usage of that emoticon? Lol, I was just playing. Or do you mean something else?

What questions do you have for me specifically?

I'm in intermission at a play with my wife at the moment, and I'm not sure what the evening will bring thereafter, and I've got a full phd schedule tomorrow, so just a heads up. I'll contribute as much as I can when I can though. On that note, if anyone has any questions on my rainbow list or wants to engage me in conversation about any player that'd be great. Just let me know.

BBL

Linki let me address this more later, but if you want an indirect answer I would suggest skimming my ISO, since I think my thought process is there to a degree.

Golden wrote:Yeah, not really surprised. MP has some explaining to do about why that would be in our interests.

I do? What were you expecting exactly?

Have I not said that you all would be wasting your time?

Enrique wrote:MP I know you're straight up lying if you say the Typh as the Penguin theory "makes sense," unless you're not giving it any thought at all. Reassess, and if you're still alive, tell me what you think.

Sure, I'll take a detailed look. Do you have any posts that you or others made that you particularly want me to consider?

S~V~S wrote:MP when someone does not shut up no matter what I say to them, I don't want to talk anymore. Take that as you may. If all kinds of people see bread crumbs, the last thing that is fun for me is arguing with someone loves nothing more than talking about themself. I just give up.

Duly noted, thanks for the explanation.

Well now that we got that over with...

EoD 4 MP rainbow list:

Confirmed Civilian
Scotty -- Top bloke, good egg.


Strongly Leaning Civilian
Turnip Head -- Perhaps the most supatown player we have this game, and I believe it's genuine. Turnip Head has not been shy to voice his opinions about practically every player, and his cases on BR, Mac, etc. were thorough and strike me as genuine hunting for mafia, rather than manipulative. I've seen the town spark in Turnip Head more than any other player in the game. In addition, he has shown a distinct town tell in reevaluation and reassessment by backing off of the Mac case when otherwise he could have otherwise shut up and let the momentum he built inevitably lead to a potential mislynch. Many good looks for TH in my book, but that doesn't keep my paranoia from voicing every once in a while, especially coupled with a late vote for Nerolunar on d2.

Golden -- Like Turnip Head, Golden has been willing to speak his mind consistently throughout the game, and continually reassess. With a gun to my head, I think Golden looked better coming out of the early game Enrique v. Golden fistfights, and that is because I believe Golden genuinely argued on behalf of the belief that the discussion was necessary for town to have. Although he has been busy, I don't feel his contributions have faltered, with the exception of his Floyd vote on d3. That was a bit weak by Golden's standards, but I'm not sure that mafia Golden would make such a brazen vote. With regards to voting record, Golden cast an incredibly solid early vote for Nerolunar during his d2 lynch, an insanely risky move if he were a teammate. If Golden is anti-town, I'm certain he must either be on the other family, an inmate, or the ballsiest teammate busser ever.


Leaning Civilian
Sorsha -- I'm not sure I can articulate this read very well, since I feel it is the most tone-based of my top civilian reads, but Sorsha has read consistently genuine to me throughout the entire game, despite my internal efforts to try to discern some kind of manipulative intention. She has brought some insight to the table as well, despite having difficulty keeping up (understandably), including an early defense of Wilgy amid him receiving d1 pressure, asserting early agreement with the case on Black Rock as well as my Wilgy was Robin theory, among other opinions. Her vote for Nero on d2 being seventh is not as strong as it could be, but it's nonetheless a good look.

MacDougall -- This guy's a tough one to read, always, ever since I saw him absolutely crush the supatown persona as a mafia the first 3 day cycles or so of Talking Heads Mafia. With that said, although I've had my doubts more with Mac than the two above, I am seeing a genuine Mac with regards to baddie hunting and emotion this game. He has been hunting with nothing less from what town should expect from such a strong town-minded player, and he has been openly willing to reassess. His dialogues with various players throughout the game give the impression that he is genuinely trying to engage them to figure them out and to get them into the game, rather than for manipulative reasons. But... trying to assess this is very difficult, since Mac can beautifully recreate that meta as a mafia member. That said, I don't get a sense of "chaos" from Mac this game that I've seen him exude when he's anti-town. His d2 vote for Bullzeye is a bit perplexing, especially since I haven't seen him aggressively pursue that case lately, so despite his in-thread content and well-reasoned defense against Turnip Head's accusations, I don't feel I can as strongly remove the possibility of him being a Nero teammate. I don't have a strong reason to believe he is though. Apparently, I've missed a supposed breadcrumb.


Slightly Leaning Civilian
juliets -- Hands down one of the most difficult players to read for me, ever. I had her as neutral until just recently; thinking on it, she does seem legitimately concerned with hunting. Even if she isn't building cases, she has been clear to add her thoughts whenever possible. Note to self: I need to ISO her... if I have the time.

S~V~S -- NANANANANANA, BATBEAR! For most of the game, S~V~S was right up there with Sorsha in terms of being a completely genuine read, but lately she's dropped off for me. Her early vote for Nerolunar on d2 (second) is awesome; I know how much S~V~S hates to bus her teammates unnecessarily, so I don't think her chances of being on that team are high. With that said, her recent behavior has me a bit puzzled, with her d3 vote on Mac and then subsequent backing off seeming unlike civilian S~V~S. I know she doesn't pride herself on being particularly good at finding breadcrumbs, but I'm not really seeing the town spark (mentioned above for TH) in S~V~S. I would expect a town-minded S~V~S to not so easily give up her suspicion of Mac just because of a breadcrumb, especially since in her posts this game she really downplayed the validity of role hints = genuine.

bea -- Despite usually being in catchup mode, and catching some flak from Mac for agreeing with cases too much, I don't recall anything particularly manipulative about her content or behavior. She has been willing to reassess as well, given her thoughts regarding yours truly. She voted late for Nero, but I know bea tends to vote late anyway (unless she votes early due to knowing she won't be around later, but that doesn't happen too often), so I give her at least somewhat of an OK look for that. Can't discount her at all from being a Nero teammate, but my gut just screams sincerity. When I pushed suspicion on her last night, she reacted the way I would expect civilian bea to react, and I saw some town-minded passion there. I firmly believe that bea would be more disinterested and would emphasize her catching up more if she were anti-town; I know this relies upon meta, but it is what it is. Rather, I feel like bea is using her catchup periods to genuinely contribute her thoughts to the game. I hope to hear more original thoughts from her going forward though.

Dom -- Why won't he stop suspecting me? But seriously, Dom and I have a rivalry that goes way back to the first game of mafia I ever played. With regards to his behavior this game, he has been, as he has recently observed, very vocal, and has been very active with his questioning-poking hunting style. Although he didn't vote for Nerolunar on d2, I don't get the feeling of a Nero teammate much from his vote, which otherwise landed on me. I felt better about him earlier in the game, and continually feel like I have to keep fighting our very different perspectives, but nonetheless still am judging his hunting to be that of a town-minded player, when push comes to shove. His consistency with regards to suspecting me is a bit unnerving at times where I felt he wasn't interested in trying to comprehened where I was coming from, but contrasted with other times where I felt like he was actively trying to connect with me. Consider me torn a bit.

Lorab -- Sixth vote for Nero, good look. Although she's on the low poster side of things, she still has 31 posts, which is an average of 8 or so per day period, and has been bringing plenty of her opinions to the game. Her responses to Mac, when I read them in real time, gave me good feelings about Lorab, for a combative yet open-minded approach she was displaying. I think her suspicion of Bubbles would be a bit risky for Lorab to take as a mafia member, and it appears grounded in an understandable thought process (and thus leads me to believe she isn't fabricating it), but what do I know?

Bullzeye -- This guy is a mixed bag. I think he is the most likely of my slightly civilian leaning reads to be Nero's teammate, given his third vote for Matt on d2. Tone reads genuine to me though. Then again, he has over 100 posts and I'm having trouble remembering his stances. I need to hear more from him.

sprityo -- The d2 lynch doesn't really give us any information about sprityo (he voted last for Nero, and many of his posts have not been particularly thick in content. In addition, his d3 vote for Floyd could be seen as an easily justifiable vote for a lurker to avoid coming up with suspicions. Not a good look. With that said, I am tone reading him as genuine, and he has brought forth insight throughout the game, mainly in the form of questions. I need to really think about him more though; he's the weakest of my town reads and could easily drop to a mafia read if he doesn't pick up more townie points.


Slightly Leaning Anti-Town
Metalmarsh89 -- The marmot enigma. Seriously, I can't make heads or tails of MM at all, and I feel conflicted on whether he genuinely was one of the first players to really view me as suspicious or whether he latched onto it as an easy option. I've seen his brand of marmoty posts, but to a lesser degree, and haven't seen an accompanied attempt to actually mafia hunt much at all. That said, somehow I'm not really getting any anti-town vibes from him at all, and I get the impression that he's just not incredibly invested in this game... at least until today. His vote for Glorfindel today clearly did not match with previously expressed suspicions of me. I find this suspect.

DharmaHelper -- I know he advocated suspicion of Nero big time, but he never actually voted for him (instead voting for me on d2), and it's not nearly as absurd as DH has been proposing to consider him as Nero's teammate. If anything it's because DH has such an excellent mafia game that he can almost never be absolved, so he should take that as a compliment. I feel as though in recent periods he's gotten lazy, instead fixating on me. I realize I've been acting out to attract suspicion, but he's made no attempt to engage others in discussion about much of anything else, and my leaning is because he's latching onto me for opportunistic reasons. What I find most suspicious is that he seemed to have strong opinions on S~V~S, but his passion for that case has all but vanished; I don't believe a town-minded DH would have just let it go like he has.

DFaraday -- I realize I voted for sig d2, but his late vote for sig could be a way for him to avoid the decision of either saving or bussing his teammate (Nero), in the event that he's mafia. In fact, if any of Nero's teammates did throw off to anyone other than Nero or Matt during that lynch, my best guess would be DF's vote. Previous thoughts regarding DF put forth by Scotty were excellent, for my taste, though DF does at least give a reasonable defense. I'm still watching him, for now, but I'd like to see some town spark from him, since I'm not seeing much of it at all. He must have missed the d3 vote because I don't see anything. Maybe he can provide a list of suspects.

Glorfindel -- My thoughts on Glorfindel can be summed up in my response to Mac. While an incredibly nice guy, he's not giving us much to work with this game, and has hardly thrown out any opinions or hunting that I can see. As a mafia or a civilian, I have meta-based reasons to believe he would want to hunt, or try to appears as though he is hunting; yet he is doing neither. In the early part of the game, he seemed to be trying to stay out of the radar. I think he's most likely an inmate, but I still have enough doubt that I'm placing him in the "slightly" category. With that said, Mac also had a good observation regarding Glorfindel's opinion of sig that has been considered by me and should be by others.

Bass_the_Clever -- His contributions right off the bat in this game were fantastic; he was questioning players and issuing opinions more so than he typically does, and I saw it as genuine. I would have had him as at the least a slight civilian read roundabout d1 or so. But he's vanished! So I have no content by which to base a judgment for most of the game, which is a problem, hence the decline. It's possible he's disengaged because he's an inmate, but I'm not sold on that theory quite yet.

Equivocate -- Where is he? I really have nothing on which to base a judgment.

Bubbles -- Where is she? I really have nothing on which to base a judgment.

TheFloyd73 -- Where is he? I really have nothing on which to base a judgment.


Leaning Anti-Town
Matt -- Next to Enrique, Matt's behavior reeks of manipulation as well. He looked worse in his 1v1 against zebra in the early stages of the game; since then, I've not really seen any genuine baddie hunting from him. It's almost as if I'm seeing a "Matt by the numbers" in action throughout this game, rather than civilian Matt, if that makes sense to those who've played with him before. I never once have had the impression that he has really believed in a case. The only good look for him is the fact that he was the first player to vote for Nero; I suppose he could have bussed him, but that makes him unlikely as a Nero teammate. I'm thinking he's an inmate; he reads very similarly to Star Wars Matt 1.0 in a way that hopefully I can elaborate upon in more detail later.

ekeknat -- The definition of under the radar. I don't trust him one bit. He needs to contribute something, because he's shown fully capable of casting votes with no reason, or else he'll keep dropping down my list.

Typhoony -- Placed here because I think The Penguin theory makes a lot of sense. Otherwise, he'd probably be a slight mafia read, since I'm not seeing a whole lot of supatown game-solving Typhoony this game.


Strongly Leaning Anti-Town
sabie12 -- She has voted for me today because I said sig a lot and now he's dead; she voted for me yesterday as well citing a similar reason. She has yet to explain how her train of thought regarding this suspicion actually leads her to the conclusion that I'm mafia, which is a piece of the logic in her behavior I'm missing completely. Hence it's a bad look, because otherwise this reads fabricated to me. She voted for Matt on d2 for "strange" knock knock jokes. Another bad look, I can't understand where her mindset is at all. She needs to clarify ASAP. In fact, looking at her d2 behavior, she easily could be Nero's teammate, given she couldn't understand why people weren't voting Matt anymore. Other than that, she's offered no real substantive content. I know she replaced in and the thread is large, but... this is not good in the slightest. She's my number two guess for Nero's teammate.

Enrique -- While he has the second most posts in the game, I'm not convinced he's out for town's best interests. His behavior today (d4) looks worst to me of any of his days, voting for Glorfindel for vaguely cited reasons. I hope he can elaborate upon these. Despite this, he has had bad looks consistently throughout the game. During the early portion of the game, he looked worse coming out of the 1v1 against Golden, from a GTH tone level, but that was only enough for me to consider "slightly" mafia leaning at most. Since then, he pushed suspicion against sig d1, Matt on d2 (bad look) based on a convoluted theory that really was reaching. I get the feeling that he's been making cases to appear as though as he's town, because the connections he continuously is making are based on tenuous, at best, role-based mechanics, rather than in-thread behavior. I think he could be mafia (more on that in a bit). If he's not mafia, I have a backup theory that he could be an inmate that really was pushing the sig agenda, since I don't think his thoughts against sig were town-minded. The distinction about Enrique's reassessments is that he seems to be making them for manipulative purposes, rather than in a hunt to genuinely find mafia. In addition, he has engaged in many back and forths but has spent hardly any recent time actually hunting for much of anything. He has also pushed what I have seen as manipulative conversation about me and others (regarding my rainbow list being questionable), then followed up by endorsing suspicion once it has formed, but later not fully following through with it. It all reeks of opportunism. I firmly believe the d2 Matt vote is a bad look, even if he reassessed; he was basing his reassessment entirely on supposed role hint by Turnip Head that is far from reasonable evidence. I think it's very possible Enrique is Nero's teammate; in fact, he's my number one guess for it.

Well, I am glad I received the most votes, although it is a pro/con deal.

Who wants a legacy post before I leave for a little while?

S~V~S wrote:

LoRab wrote:MP's posts are reading, to me, like someone who wants to be lynched--not in a done with this game sort of way, but in a role needing to be lynched kind of way. Voting that way before I fall asleep on the keyboard.

This.

For the record, just so you all know, I don't need to be lynched. It's a pros/cons thing, but I think there is benefit to it at this stage.

Dom wrote:MP are you bad?

No, I am not.

sabie12 wrote:Voted MP because he kept talking about sig and now sigs dead.

Lolwut?

Explain this logic please.

MacDougall wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I've been getting an inmate feel from Glorfindel, if anything.

Please explain.

Well, when I was his teammate in Star Wars, he felt very uncomfortable and unnatural as a mafia member, and lashed out at anyone who accused him. He also firmly suspected Russ for the duration of his tenure even though holding that suspicion became increasingly less likely due to circumstantial evidence regarding Russ. I'm not really seeing any of that here.

I'm also not seeing much of any attempt to mafia hunt, which I firmly think a civilian Glorfindel would do.

For the early part of the game, he seemed to be trying to stay out of the radar.

So he's probably an inmate who doesn't want to be bothered.

I've been getting an inmate feel from Glorfindel, if anything.

Enrique wrote:

MacDougall wrote:Look...

If MP is civ friendly, he is asking to be lynched and says it will be good for the civs.

If MP isn't civ friendly, he is trying to fuck with is.

Worst case scenario is he has a non civ friendly role AND really does want to be lynched. But I don't see anybody choosing that reason not to vote for him, so here we are.

This post I think should sum up the lynch. Lynching MP is a win, no matter what.

Your vote doesn't match this sentiment.

Typhoony wrote:Between Glorfindel and Mp, I'd rather vote Glorfindel.

Why?

You voted for me before. Why not now?

Someone should ISO both MM and Enrique for mentions of me. MM was one of the first players to find me suspicious and it's one of his few suspicions throughout the entire game.

Enrique has questioned my motives on multiple occasions (saying my rainbow list was too easy) but never has been willing to back that up with a vote, despite saying for days now that he'd be OK with my lynch..

I reckon both of them are anti-town.

Enrique and MM's votes both surprise me. I don't like them one bit.

MacDougall wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Who else finds it interesting that Dom has been voicing consistent suspicions of me since Day 0, yet hasn't shown the balls to actually vote for me today? Come on, son, I already have 5 votes and I'm begging to be lynched. What the hell is keeping you?

Lol you're flopping around like a fish out of water m8.

Damn straight I am. You should call me Magikarp.

SPLASH SPLASH

Who else finds it interesting that Dom has been voicing consistent suspicions of me since Day 0, yet hasn't shown the balls to actually vote for me today? Come on, son, I already have 5 votes and I'm begging to be lynched. What the hell is keeping you?

Sorsha wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:Un MP lynch is unleekely tu yeeeld a meffeea fleep in my oopeeniun boot I cun see-a he's gueeng tu be-a a pueent ooff deescoossiun es lung es he's in zee geme-a. I'll gledly iet my het iff he-a fleeps meffeea boot I'm tune-a reedeeng heem es genooeene-a. Glurffeendel is mure-a leekely tu be-a meffeea. I theenk Scutty mede-a a greet oobserfeshun ebuoot heem. Vhee esked vhu he-a soospects he-a curcled eruoond sume-a nemes insteed ooff cummeetting tu unytheeng. Zee ceefiliun Glurffeendel I reed in Peekmin is noohere-a tu be-a fuoond. Bork bork bork!

I'm futeeng fur Glurffeendel.

I agree with this about MP so I've changed my mind about voting him today. I'm guessing he's an inmate, I don't see him asking for lynch and letting either civ or mafia teammates down like that. Of course that could be what he wants us to think

What changed your mind? I've been asking for my lynch since before you changed it, so it can't be that.

Matt wrote:Well, I gotta jet here pretty soon.

Looks like the majority have no interest in lynching Mac/TH. I still have serious reservations about TH being riddled, but I guess I'm not the know-all of how it exactly works. If Glorfindel is actually a contender today, I'd rather see MP lynched.

Peace

What's your reason, sonny boy?

Whoops! I meant to say third person to vote, and that vote was for me. Not third person on my train.

DharmaHelper wrote:YO YOU GUYS REMEMBER THAT DUDE WHO SAID HE WAS SURPRISED HE WAS TAKING SUSPICION SINCE HE WAS PLAYING UP HIS TOWN META LMAO

MovingPictures07 wrote:
There is a very specific reason I've self-voted. It's because I want to be lynched.

I've been provoking my lynch by saying suspicious shit for days on purpose.

Catch a vote son

Thanks, bud!

Just remember, DH, that you were the third person to vote for me.

Dom wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I don't really care to impress or persuade any of you with my play. That's not why I'm playing this game. I've tried my best to get engaged in this game, only to be met with millions of more posts and some attitudes I didn't really care for, on top of being poisoned. When I actually did try, I got caught up in the moment and voted for sig instead of Nero, of course what seems to have been a terrible decision.

Seems you're quick to cast the shade at me, bea, when you've hardly done any case building of your own. As to whom I suspect, that's what the rainbow list is for. The names near the bottom are the ones I suspect.

I can't get my head wrapped around this game; there are too many inmates and still too many posts. I can't be bothered to ISO and analyze. I don't want to and I don't have time to. I asked to be replaced, but considering there are four or five players with much less posts than me that would need to be replaced first still have not, I'm stuck in this game.

I'm just trying to have fun at this point, frankly. I stopped giving a shit about winning a while ago. Just lynch me already.

"Still too many posts"
MacDougall 624
Enrique 533
Turnip Head 425
a2thezebra 387
Golden 376
Matt 360
DharmaHelper 333
MovingPictures07 312
sig 250
Dom 213

These are teh players with more than 200 posts.

I'm calling BS on that.
MP, if there's too many posts why are you 6% of them? I dont' think these two positions square themselves. How can you claim to be overwhelmed by posts and unable to engage when you, yourself have more than 300 of them and more than, let's just use me, me? Me, someone who I would say has been very active, very vocal, and very visible.
Yet, you can't give a single reason behind a rainbow list.

MovingPictures07 wrote:And bea, for someone who seemed so sure that mafia MP would never give up on his teammates and would give them the chance to bus him, you're quick to change your mind. Mac's right; you keep agreeing with case after case and your contributions are opportunistic at best.

You're definitely one to talk, since you're likely anti-town. I'm not.

"Just testing you"

*Made several posts attacking bea
*Didn't go well
*Backed off
B.S.

You weren't just testing Bea. I don't believe that for a second.

MovingPictures07 wrote:I certainly don't feel like anyone is willing to give me any chance, all the more reason I think I made the right move calling for my own lynch.

Lots of people have been willing to give you a chance since Day 1, but you have repeatedly failed to meet the requests of people asking you questions and asking for more detail in your responses.


So, MP, can you give one reason why Enrique is suspicious beyond you saying so?

To me, it's not all that important that you voted sig over nero. I don't really care. What I do care about is that you have been all hunky dory when the discussion isn't about you. Lots of smilies. Lots of jokes. Lots of posts. The second the lynch turns toward you, "oh just lynch me" MP comes out.

Lol, you got me, Dom. Where's my vote?

As for those of you who want substantiated reads from my rainbow, I've been tone reading players since Day 1, and that hasn't really changed. I'll try my best to explain any particular thoughts of a player but I haven't had the time to ISO anybody to back up any of my feelings, or even examine voting records that much, or anything like that. I have tried to voice my thoughts on folks amid all the chaos posting.

Oh, also, MacDougall should be higher again on my rainbow. I don't particularly think he's bad. I thought he was trying to pull something earlier, but eh, I think I was just being paranoid.

I better go to bed, I'm tired.

Linki w/ bea: I was fucking with you to get a reaction. I got it. I still feel good about you, FWIW.

Reaction noted, I still feel good about you by the way. Just testing.

I certainly don't feel like anyone is willing to give me any chance, all the more reason I think I made the right move calling for my own lynch.

Dom, I am cured, yeah. What's your point? I have nothing to say to the rest of your comments.

Enrique, GTH I just don't think sabie seems genuine, and her most recent vote seemed particularly opportunistic to me. But I don't remember much of anything from her other than that.

And bea, for someone who seemed so sure that mafia MP would never give up on his teammates and would give them the chance to bus him, you're quick to change your mind. Mac's right; you keep agreeing with case after case and your contributions are opportunistic at best.

You're definitely one to talk, since you're likely anti-town. I'm not.

I don't really care to impress or persuade any of you with my play. That's not why I'm playing this game. I've tried my best to get engaged in this game, only to be met with millions of more posts and some attitudes I didn't really care for, on top of being poisoned. When I actually did try, I got caught up in the moment and voted for sig instead of Nero, of course what seems to have been a terrible decision.

Seems you're quick to cast the shade at me, bea, when you've hardly done any case building of your own. As to whom I suspect, that's what the rainbow list is for. The names near the bottom are the ones I suspect.

I can't get my head wrapped around this game; there are too many inmates and still too many posts. I can't be bothered to ISO and analyze. I don't want to and I don't have time to. I asked to be replaced, but considering there are four or five players with much less posts than me that would need to be replaced first still have not, I'm stuck in this game.

I'm just trying to have fun at this point, frankly. I stopped giving a shit about winning a while ago. Just lynch me already.

So, by all means, lynch me today, unless you all come up with some real good leads that you'd rather follow instead.

I'm out. Got a busy weekend ahead of me, so no guarantee I'll really be around.

MacDougall wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

MacDougall wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:
There is a very specific reason I've self-voted. It's because I want to be lynched.

I've been provoking my lynch by saying suspicious shit for days on purpose.

If you want to be lynched why are you arguing with people coming up with reasons to lynch you that you yourself have caused? That's unnecessarily contrarian.

Because it's still a waste of time, and because I'm not an anti-town role. And I did not cause them all to begin with, I've largely only started chaos posting since it became apparent that I was going to catch suspicion for the Nero stuff and for my lack of engagement.

So would you lynch be a good thing or a bad thing for the town?

Well, if I didn't personally think it had its benefits, I wouldn't have continued to try to attract suspicion to myself. It's not without its cons though, since it'd be a waste of time. I just think it's a waste of time that's worth the downsides at this point.