[ENDGAME] Seinfeld Mafia

[Chuck]

Horrible. You've killed one of my most exemplary customers. Swift moves, always clear with his order, no small talk, biggest jambalaya fan.

This Seinfeld guy is probably trying to run my business into the ground, just like his abominable lady friend.

Well, NO SOUP FOR YOU TODAY AND DAY TWO.

[Chuck]

Thanks for playing NewTraditionalist. Join us again soon!

The worst thing about a crappy Day 1 isn't that it's hard to decide who to vote for. It's that there's close to nothing to analyze about it beyond basically randomized voting. Moving forward we're an entire day phase behind the mafia now, and not just because a civilian was lynched.

Let's do better, or we're not winning this game. It's not good enough.

Look at all this shameful verbal compensating for lynching a citizen.

You are up to no good.

[Chuck]

[Julinook]

Thanks for playing NewTraditionalist. Join us again soon!

The worst thing about a crappy Day 1 isn't that it's hard to decide who to vote for. It's that there's close to nothing to analyze about it beyond basically randomized voting. Moving forward we're an entire day phase behind the mafia now, and not just because a civilian was lynched.

Let's do better, or we're not winning this game. It's not good enough.

Look at all this shameful verbal compensating for lynching a citizen.

You are up to no good.

"Verbal compensating"? What is that?

Day 1 was garbage, and civilians usually lose when they don't try. If it doesn't change the game is already over. It's annoying enough that I've had to break role play numerous times now as the namesake character just to make the thread move.

Talk to me about Puddy immediately. I don't care about your soup ban.

[Chuck]

I don't know any Puddy. You switched from him without a care last day. Get out.

[Kent Brockman]

Puddy is awesome! High five!!!

[Julinook]

Puddy is awesome! High five!!!

Who do you trust? Who do you not?

[Kent Brockman]

Soup Nazi. I see you banned Jerry, Elaine, and George from your aoup today. Does this mean you think they are bad and going to hell? Explain.

[Kent Brockman]

Jerry, I don't trust Mr. Soup. Something isn't right with him. I think he's going to hell.

[Kent Brockman]

I'm not all too worried though. 'Cause I know I'm not goin' there.

[Kent Brockman]

There are a lot of quiet players though. That doesn't sit right with me either. Lots of quiet players means there are probably some hell-goers lying low and good people not helping. No high fives for them.

[Principal Skinner]

Jerry, Hello! How could you do this to Newman? Your cousin Jeffrey, you know, at the parks department, can't believe you'd get something like this wrong. What a guy that Jeffrey.

So now that that's out of the way,

Newman did very clearly state that he was innocent. On day 1, what more could he have said to indicate that he was "trying?"

For the record, I am a senior citizen with a record (it was a crime of passion!) however, I am innocent of all other crimes.

I am suspicious of Steinbrenner for "latching on to me" as someone put it. It didn't hold or gain traction so it makes sense that he changed his vote. Still, suspicions exist. Call it retaliatory, call it whatever. I know that I am good and until Steinbrenner gives me a reason to change my mind, he is as good a target as I was to him initially.

As for Puddy (high five!), you are good and not going to hell, so why no vote? Were you too busy at a hockey game and forgot?

I would also be suspicious of Elaine & our resident sweetheart, Soup Nazi. Potential throwaway votes against each other (because we had a clear victim with votes stacked up against Newman) "backed up" by phony talk in the thread. I guess we will see how they vote in the future.

[Kent Brockman]

I btoke character and posted why no vote. Read the thread or you might be going to hell!!

[Julinook]

I would also be suspicious of Elaine & our resident sweetheart, Soup Nazi. Potential throwaway votes against each other (because we had a clear victim with votes stacked up against Newman) "backed up" by phony talk in the thread. I guess we will see how they vote in the future.

You know Leo, sometimes you drive me nuts, but this? This is good. This is real good.

[Principal Skinner]

I btoke character and posted why no vote. Read the thread or you might be going to hell!!

I rescind my high five because obviously I don't deserve it.

[Chuck]

I would rather kiss a goat than ever be involved with that horrible woman.

[Julinook]

...and they're spectacular tier:
Uncle Leo
Jackie Chiles

This feels like the good side of role play tier:
George Steinbrenner
The Soup Nazi

The yada-yada tier:
J Peterman
George Costanza
Kramer
Kenny Bania

What's up with _____ tier:
Estelle Costanza
Frank Costanza
Elaine Benes
David Puddy

[Julinook]

Come on guys, play the game or I'm going to have to go read lines from those awful scenes with Isabel. I swear, it's a war between my genitals and my brain with her.

[Kent Brockman]

I btoke character and posted why no vote. Read the thread or you might be going to hell!!y

I rescind my high five because obviously I don't deserve it.

I actually think you're just alright. High Five!!

[Echo]

...and they're spectacular tier:
Uncle Leo
Jackie Chiles

This feels like the good side of role play tier:
George Steinbrenner
The Soup Nazi

The yada-yada tier:
J Peterman
George Costanza
Kramer
Kenny Bania

What's up with _____ tier:
Estelle Costanza
Frank Costanza
Elaine Benes
David Puddy

Why thank you, Mr Seinfeld! Though I agree on Frank Costanza, I don't think the courts would side with you over Estelle - unless you mean to just prod her. In my experience, someone bad will often try to get suspicion in there, on the record. Estelle strikes me as a civilian who is disoriented, perplexed, and bewildered.

In fact, here's some 'best of' Estelle Costanza scenes for our friend:

[Echo]

Pardon me, it seems there are a couple of scenes from another show advertised during this series of clips. It's a slap in the face of Lady Liberty, and I assure you I will do everything in my power to make sure justice is done.

[Nicol Bolas]

I would also be suspicious of Elaine & our resident sweetheart, Soup Nazi. Potential throwaway votes against each other (because we had a clear victim with votes stacked up against Newman) "backed up" by phony talk in the thread. I guess we will see how they vote in the future.

You know Leo, sometimes you drive me nuts, but this? This is good. This is real good.

Real good? Jerry, this is not real good. There was no clear victim when I voted, and my vote was certainly not a throwaway. When I voted, I made it a three-way tie.

Your agreement with your uncle is fake, Jerry. Fake, fake, fake, fake, fake.

[Spooky Ghost]

...and they're spectacular tier:
Uncle Leo
Jackie Chiles

This feels like the good side of role play tier:
George Steinbrenner
The Soup Nazi

The yada-yada tier:
J Peterman
George Costanza
Kramer
Kenny Bania

What's up with _____ tier:
Estelle Costanza
Frank Costanza
Elaine Benes
David Puddy

Don't insult me, my friend.

You were after all the deciding vote in Newman's fate, were you not?

[Spooky Ghost]

But I'm going to make an exception here... Incoming thoughts.

[Spooky Ghost]

Of the people with more than one vote, I could lynch Newman or Soup Nazi. Not lynching Big Stein.

How about Puddy though? What is it with this guy?

Why Newman? You could have swung with Soup Nazi and left it to fate.

What's the obsession with Puddy? What are you trying to say about him?

[Spooky Ghost]

I will obviously vote for the worst customer of the day. Such insolence.

Did you vote Elaine for anything specific or just that you have a personal vendetta against her (and to a lesser extent me, and Jerry)?

[Spooky Ghost]

Hey Kenny Bania. What's your story?

[Spooky Ghost]

I'm feeling good about you people
Kramer
George Steinbrenner
Uncle Leo
Jerry
Jackie

I got bad feelings about you people
Elaine
The Soup Nazi
Estelle
Dad

I got no feelings about the rest of ya.

[Spooky Ghost]

Jerry always says...

[Chuck]

[Chuck]

I will obviously vote for the worst customer of the day. Such insolence.

Did you vote Elaine for anything specific or just that you have a personal vendetta against her (and to a lesser extent me, and Jerry)?

Yes, it was very specific, unlike your reading skills.

Goddamn woman was running her mouth, acting like throwing pings here and there, then resorted to reading a line off her script and leave her vote planted on me.

I have customers, I have a reputation. Such slander and weakhunting will not be tolerated, not in my line.

[Julinook]

Why thank you, Mr Seinfeld! Though I agree on Frank Costanza, I don't think the courts would side with you over Estelle - unless you mean to just prod her. In my experience, someone bad will often try to get suspicion in there, on the record. Estelle strikes me as a civilian who is disoriented, perplexed, and bewildered.

Could be. Here's why I don't agree. She used the word "villa" to describe her read on me. This term is distinct to the Mafia Universe sphere of influence, and that implies there is at least some mafia experience behind that sock -- perhaps even someone relatively new to our site here (welcome if so!). So I doubt there's much to be bewildered about beyond just role play. I cannot readily identify a reason to trust her at the moment.

[Julinook]

I would also be suspicious of Elaine & our resident sweetheart, Soup Nazi. Potential throwaway votes against each other (because we had a clear victim with votes stacked up against Newman) "backed up" by phony talk in the thread. I guess we will see how they vote in the future.

You know Leo, sometimes you drive me nuts, but this? This is good. This is real good.

Real good? Jerry, this is not real good. There was no clear victim when I voted, and my vote was certainly not a throwaway. When I voted, I made it a three-way tie.

Your agreement with your uncle is fake, Jerry. Fake, fake, fake, fake, fake.

What was "real good" was Uncle Leo's provision of a unique element of hunting into the game. It made him look "real good". Reference my ensuing reads list.

What doesn't look "real good" is you making a scene about it here, hurling back indignant accusations at me. It reeks of CFTWR (caught for the wrong reasons).

[Julinook]

You were after all the deciding vote in Newman's fate, were you not?

1) No. Newman led the tally with 3 votes and my vote was alone on Puddy. I moved to Newman at the last second to assure the final decision would be civilian-controlled.

2) What is the motivation for your question?

[Julinook]

I still don't like Puddy.

Soup Nazi. I see you banned Jerry, Elaine, and George from your aoup today. Does this mean you think they are bad and going to hell? Explain.

One minute later:

Jerry, I don't trust Mr. Soup. Something isn't right with him. I think he's going to hell.

The question posed for Soup Nazi is fine. Before it could resolve into anything though, I'm being fed (I was specifically addressed) a very vague negative read on Soup Nazi. I don't know why it exists beyond "something isn't right with him". That is nothing.

Soup Nazi strikes me as the easiest player in the thread to suspect right now for a few reasons:

He's been combative and irritable -- true to the character's nature. He hasn't been thorough in his explanations of his suspicions. People get mislynched in every game for reasons like these. I want someone to tell me what Soup Nazi is guilty of which cannot also be said for half the player roster.

Later:

There are a lot of quiet players though. That doesn't sit right with me either. Lots of quiet players means there are probably some hell-goers lying low and good people not helping. No high fives for them.

More vague suspicion, this time directed at some unnamed grouping of "quiet players". Too easy. This looks like a player trying to look like he's doing something, not a player who's doing something.

[Julinook]

The one good thing about Newman being gone is that he can't rat me out to Gina's comatose boyfriend for getting with her.

[Chuck]

Told you that woman is pure evil.

Didn't even catch Puddy guy mentioning me. He's that inexistent.

NO SOUP FOR HIM TOMORROW

[Kent Brockman]

I still don't like Puddy.

Soup Nazi. I see you banned Jerry, Elaine, and George from your aoup today. Does this mean you think they are bad and going to hell? Explain.

One minute later:

Jerry, I don't trust Mr. Soup. Something isn't right with him. I think he's going to hell.

The question posed for Soup Nazi is fine. Before it could resolve into anything though, I'm being fed (I was specifically addressed) a very vague negative read on Soup Nazi. I don't know why it exists beyond "something isn't right with him". That is nothing.

Soup Nazi strikes me as the easiest player in the thread to suspect right now for a few reasons:

He's been combative and irritable -- true to the character's nature. He hasn't been thorough in his explanations of his suspicions. People get mislynched in every game for reasons like these. I want someone to tell me what Soup Nazi is guilty of which cannot also be said for half the player roster.

Later:

There are a lot of quiet players though. That doesn't sit right with me either. Lots of quiet players means there are probably some hell-goers lying low and good people not helping. No high fives for them.

More vague suspicion, this time directed at some unnamed grouping of "quiet players". Too easy. This looks like a player trying to look like he's doing something, not a player who's doing something.

I'm just trying to stay in character, man. From my research, puddy was a man of few words.

Yeah, that's right.

[Julinook]

I'm just trying to stay in character, man. From my research, puddy was a man of few words.

Yeah, that's right.

He was a man of few words, and a stealer of moves.

I'm never going to disparage role play. It's my favorite. We have got to incorporate real mafia effort into that role play though, or all it gets us is a huge default civilian disadvantage.

[Nicol Bolas]

I would also be suspicious of Elaine & our resident sweetheart, Soup Nazi. Potential throwaway votes against each other (because we had a clear victim with votes stacked up against Newman) "backed up" by phony talk in the thread. I guess we will see how they vote in the future.

You know Leo, sometimes you drive me nuts, but this? This is good. This is real good.

Real good? Jerry, this is not real good. There was no clear victim when I voted, and my vote was certainly not a throwaway. When I voted, I made it a three-way tie.

Your agreement with your uncle is fake, Jerry. Fake, fake, fake, fake, fake.

What was "real good" was Uncle Leo's provision of a unique element of hunting into the game. It made him look "real good". Reference my ensuing reads list.

What doesn't look "real good" is you making a scene about it here, hurling back indignant accusations at me. It reeks of CFTWR (caught for the wrong reasons).

Well, sure it's unique, because anybody paying attention knows that what your uncle said wasn't true, including you, since you could have tied it up. If I said I liked men but was a lesbian, that would be providing a unique perspective too, but would it be right? Would it be correct, Jerry?

[Julinook]

In case I get offed tonight, I want everyone to remember a few things as you proceed deeper into the game.

1) This is a heist and role claiming is legal. Don't let your old Syndicate habits dominate your way of thinking.
2) Provide cover for potential power roles so the real ones can get information into the thread unfettered.
3) Don't tolerate a mafia team coasting through a really slow game, killing people until they earn their default win. Fight back.

[Julinook]

Well, sure it's unique, because anybody paying attention knows that what your uncle said wasn't true, including you, since you could have tied it up. If I said I liked men but was a lesbian, that would be providing a unique perspective too, but would it be right? Would it be correct, Jerry?

I don't remember when everyone placed their poll votes. Neither do you. I don't even know what you mean when you say I could have tied it up. Tied who up with who and when?

Correctness and incorrectness are irrelevant to sincerity and insincerity. I am here to read sincerity and insincerity.

[Nicol Bolas]

Well, sure it's unique, because anybody paying attention knows that what your uncle said wasn't true, including you, since you could have tied it up. If I said I liked men but was a lesbian, that would be providing a unique perspective too, but would it be right? Would it be correct, Jerry?

I don't remember when everyone placed their poll votes. Neither do you. I don't even know what you mean when you say I could have tied it up. Tied who up with who and when?

Correctness and incorrectness are irrelevant to sincerity and insincerity. I am here to read sincerity and insincerity.

Excuse me? Just how are you going to tell me what I remember and what I don't? Oh I remember, Jerry. I remember. I was paying attention. I wasn't distracted by stupid and mainstream movies. When I say you could have tied it up, I mean just that. How do you not know what I mean?

You were after all the deciding vote in Newman's fate, were you not?

1) No. Newman led the tally with 3 votes and my vote was alone on Puddy. I moved to Newman at the last second to assure the final decision would be civilian-controlled.

2) What is the motivation for your question?

You could have moved to someone else with two votes and tied it up.

Maybe the dingo ate your baby.

[Julinook]

Excuse me? Just how are you going to tell me what I remember and what I don't? Oh I remember, Jerry. I remember. I was paying attention. I wasn't distracted by stupid and mainstream movies. When I say you could have tied it up, I mean just that. How do you not know what I mean?

You just told me that I "knew" Uncle Leo's assertion was untrue. When you figure out how that makes sense alongside your own question there, go ahead and ask me again.

You could have moved to someone else with two votes and tied it up.

Maybe the dingo ate your baby.

So you're talking about the very end, i.e. I could have voted Soup Nazi to tie him with Newman?

Okay, sure, I guess so. Is there a reason I'd have wanted to do that instead of vote Newman?

[Nicol Bolas]

Excuse me? Just how are you going to tell me what I remember and what I don't? Oh I remember, Jerry. I remember. I was paying attention. I wasn't distracted by stupid and mainstream movies. When I say you could have tied it up, I mean just that. How do you not know what I mean?

You just told me that I "knew" Uncle Leo's assertion was untrue. When you figure out how that makes sense alongside your own question there, go ahead and ask me again.

You could have moved to someone else with two votes and tied it up.

Maybe the dingo ate your baby.

So you're talking about the very end, i.e. I could have voted Soup Nazi to tie him with Newman?

Okay, sure, I guess so. Is there a reason I'd have wanted to do that instead of vote Newman?

Your uncle said there was a clear victim, but there wasn't. You had the power to pick somebody else. Yet you acted like your uncle gave you the greatest Christmas card in the world, but he didn't. He gave you something besides a Christmas card, and he rubbed your face all in it. And you liked it.

Did you like rubbing your face in your uncle's Christmas card, Jerry?

[Chuck]

Look at these two goons distancing from each other. Deplorable.

They must be so irritated because they haven't had any soup today.

Ha-ha! Ha! Ha!

[Julinook]

Your uncle said there was a clear victim, but there wasn't. You had the power to pick somebody else. Yet you acted like your uncle gave you the greatest Christmas card in the world, but he didn't. He gave you something besides a Christmas card, and he rubbed your face all in it. And you liked it.

Did you like rubbing your face in your uncle's Christmas card, Jerry?

I had the "power" to pick somebody else, but no actual reason to do that. I had previously stated that I was at peace with a lynch of either Soup Nazi or Newman. Why then would I voluntarily force a coin flip instead of a decisive choice which can more readily be analyzed? I am technically capable of jumping into a bath tub filled with strawberry jam, but I have no particular reason to do that.

I told you that I am judging sincerity and insincerity. That is something different from structural or content validity in an argument. You keep crapping on Uncle Leo's assertion while complaining to me -- do you suspect him for it?

[Julinook]

Look at these two goons distancing from each other. Deplorable.

They must be so irritated because they haven't had any soup today.

Ha-ha! Ha! Ha!

I'm going to hold up your line until you serve me.

[Chuck]

It's closed, you pinhead.

[Nicol Bolas]

Your uncle said there was a clear victim, but there wasn't. You had the power to pick somebody else. Yet you acted like your uncle gave you the greatest Christmas card in the world, but he didn't. He gave you something besides a Christmas card, and he rubbed your face all in it. And you liked it.

Did you like rubbing your face in your uncle's Christmas card, Jerry?

I had the "power" to pick somebody else, but no actual reason to do that. I had previously stated that I was at peace with a lynch of either Soup Nazi or Newman. Why then would I voluntarily force a coin flip instead of a decisive choice which can more readily be analyzed? I am technically capable of jumping into a bath tub filled with strawberry jam, but I have no particular reason to do that.

I told you that I am judging sincerity and insincerity. That is something different from structural or content validity in an argument. You keep crapping on Uncle Leo's assertion while complaining to me -- do you suspect him for it?

No, Jerry, I suspect you for it. I think your uncle is senile and in need of better eyebrows. You didn't question his presentation of the facts. You accepted what he said as factual even though you could have changed things. There was no certain victim. It was still up in the air! My vote wasn't a throwaway. You took what he said for granted like Newman believing the mailmen would save us from the police.