Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Game Over

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Will you run, hide, or die?

Poll ended at Thu Dec 15, 2016 8:58 pm

Elohcin
2
20%
Epignosis
0
No votes
insertnamehere
0
No votes
MovingPictures07
4
40%
Quin
0
No votes
Sorsha
0
No votes
Spacedaisy
0
No votes
No lynch
0
No votes
I do not have any milk (host/nons)
4
40%
 
Total votes: 10
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#601

Post by JaggedJimmyJay »

Quin is confronted by complaining customer. He targets customer with a silence.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#602

Post by Spacedaisy »

if only it were that easy in retail...
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#603

Post by Quin »

:haha:
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#604

Post by Golden »

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Quin is confronted by complaining customer. He targets customer with a silence.
Insanification would be more amusing:

"Peter knavery that you give me guinde money Red King!"
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#605

Post by Elohcin »

Quin wrote:
Elohcin wrote:Good luck, Quin. What are you interviewing for?
A customer service role at a marketing firm. Not that extravagant but it's a good step in the direction I want to go.
That's how reach goals :)
Banners are cool, but a pain to scroll through so...
I've won a lot of games. I've hosted some games. The end.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#606

Post by Spacedaisy »

sorry for not being as present right now guys, trying to spend some time with Alex before he leaves for a week and a half... :(
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#607

Post by Tangrowth »

I haven't yet had time for this game. Sorry all. Between spending time with Annie and packing, and then leaving out of Austin tomorrow, it'll be busy. I'll do what I can.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#608

Post by Epignosis »

I need to entertain the idea that MP and Eloh are both bad and I've been had. I'll do that later this evening.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Night 3

#609

Post by insertnamehere »

Let's break it down.
MovingPictures07 wrote:
insertnamehere wrote:One could easily say that you're doing the same exact thing, dude, by saying Elo definitively wasn't saved by either CFD's.

It's less of a leap for me that they were saved than it is for me to assume that they weren't, and it's all some wacky coincidence.

Furthermore, DF did consider other factors, and misrepresenting him as some one-issue pony is doing him a disservice.

He made 24 posts in this thread and the Hatch thread. Only 1/8th of them said anything about Day 1 being a save.

You're honestly gonna tell me that I'M misrepresenting YOU?

Whatever dude.
....I NEVER SAID EITHER OF THESE THINGS.

INH, seriously, if you are town and you want us to have a constructive conversation, politely I'm going to have to tell you to go back and reading my freaking posts. I'm not going to respond to you if you keep throwing out blatant misrepresentations literally every time you talk about me, because that's all you've done.
You misrepresent and suspect anyone who thinks Elo was saved on Day 1 or 3 by painting them as small minded people who aren't considering the bigger picture. You accuse anyone who suspects you of blatant misrepresentation, forcing them to waste an hour of their life combing through your post history highlighting examples in order to force you to actually answer the points they made against you.

WALL OF QUOTES:
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:
insertnamehere wrote:I really dislike the CFD shenanigans that occurred here. Going into Day 2, the Soneji voter-dudes are who I'm gonna be looking at.
Why wouldn't you look at and evaluate everyone's votes?
Attempting to discourage me from looking at Soneji voters.
MovingPictures07 wrote:"Save" arguments are putting the cart ahead of horse. It's just as likely that the baddies took advantage of a multi-town wagon.
MovingPictures07 wrote:I don't agree with sweeping generalizations, and I think that teammate interactions cannot be accurately surmised until we have one mafia flip. Everyone should be individually assessed for their votes.
Discouraging people from reading D1 as an Elo save attempt; covering his ass.
MovingPictures07 wrote:If anything, I find DF and Elo's predetermined hyperfocus on Soneji voters to be suspicious at face value, but I'm trying not to let disagreements in approach color my vision there too much.

First attempt to cast shade against people who think Elo was saved. Funny how his attempt to not let his vision get colored by disagreements in approach lasted roughly 2 phases.

After this, and in the Hatch thread, MP goes after Elo pretty hard, and votes for her D2. *cough*DISTANCING*cough*

aaaaand then this happens:

MovingPictures07 wrote:
DFaraday wrote:That's just one factor. The bigger issue for me is the Day 1 lynch, which still looks like a blatant save attempt. Since G-Man wasn't being saved, the most logical option is Elo. And of course Rico suspected Elo shortly before his demise.
I found this dubious before, and I still find it dubious.

If anyone is taking advantage of a scummy-seeming town Elo, it's DFaraday.

Interesting back-pedaling. Lemme put on my tinfoil: mayhaps he was attempting to bus Elo D2, but luckily G-Man got the numbers to be eliminated. Plus there was a definite need to distance himself after D1. Now that he has a vote for Elo on his record, he can turn around and start going after the people who think Elo was saved. Tinfoil off.

MovingPictures07 wrote:I could see a universe in which DF and INH are bad and are 'setting up' easy mislynches.


The only person who is mislynching anyone is you, MP. In fact, if you get your wish, and I get lynched today, you'll be personally responsible for 3/4ths of why the civilians lost this game. You're a smart cookie, MP, so I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming you're doing this out of malevolence.

But yeah. We say Elo was saved D1. You go after us for it, while insisting that "you're open to both sides." C'mon. You really expect us to buy you're hemming and hawwing over whether or not Elo and DF were saved?

Whatever dude.

MovingPictures07 wrote:I'm torn on Elo. I really, really thought she was bad. I'm less inclined to think she is, but I am not completely ignoring the perspective that she's just feigning all of this. Her contributions are weak either way, and I still think her town read of me reads like she has information that I'm town rather than any compelling in-thread reason to believe I'm town.

What exactly made this flippy floppy? Were you tryin' to do your best? You need to lock the door and kill the beast!

Kill it!

But seriously, this explanation for why he went from trying to lynch Elo D2 to trying to lynch her accusers D3 is as vague as a Brian Eno ambient track. Got anything you want to add?
First you insinuated that I wanted DF gone because he suspected me... and he never named me by name.

Furthermore, in here, I've never said that Elo and G-Man were never saved. I just thought the notion was incredibly dubious, because I initiated the CFD, and I know I'm town, Daisy joined me and I'm pretty sure she isn't town, and generally it's much more common that mafia members will try to pile on various town wagons on d1 precisely for this reason. All I've said all game is that there's no reason to believe there was a save any more than there's reason to believe that there wasn't a save and everyone who had votes on d1 was town. I've never debunked or "definitively" said there wasn't.

Also, I never said that's all DF posts said; I said that the ONE ASSUMPTION that dictated all of his suspicions was that "there was a d1 save". This is true. If you can find literally any suspect that DF had that wasn't dictated by this one flimsy assumption, INH, by all means.
I'm sorry MP, but I'm not you. I don't know that when you do suspicious looking things, you mean well because you're a civilian. I just see a person doing suspicious things.

Lemme isolate this one quote from the above:
All I've said all game is that there's no reason to believe there was a save any more than there's reason to believe that there wasn't a save and everyone who had votes on d1 was town.
I disagree with this. With this logic, literally all vote histories are completely inadmissable. You're trying to say that lynching a civilian isn't an inherently suspicious act, and rather the suspicion lies with those who find others for it. That's some weird, flawed, desperate justification-y logic right there.

You expect others to seriously not find people suspicious for lynching a civilian?

Also, you think SD is scum? Where did this come from?
MovingPictures07 wrote:If Daisy is bad, I will record video of myself eating a hat. This is her town game.
Alas, I think the earlier post is a typo, and we shall see no hat-eating videos.

But yeah, I think you and Daisy both are as suspicious as that Henry Gale guy for lynching those two civilians. Sorry, three civilians in Daisy's case.

It's like when Jill Stein says "we need to look into whether vaccines cause autism" and responds to criticism with "what? I never said I think vaccines cause autism, I was just saying we can't definitively rule it out!"

You saying "we can't judge the people who joined either CFD" is pretty much the same as saying "the CFD's weren't save attempts" in my book, no matter how hard you spin it.

Coming up: a special section about how MP's case on DF as well as everything else he's said about him is misrepresenting compost.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#610

Post by insertnamehere »

First you insinuated that I wanted DF gone because he suspected me... and he never named me by name.
Wrong.

I insinuated that you wanted DF gone because he thought Elo was saved D1, which implicated you. Just him bandying about the idea that it was a save, and basing some suspicions on it was enough for you to both completely discredit and lynch the dude.
Also, I never said that's all DF posts said; I said that the ONE ASSUMPTION that dictated all of his suspicions was that "there was a d1 save". This is true. If you can find literally any suspect that DF had that wasn't dictated by this one flimsy assumption, INH, by all means.
Let's flex our high-school English muscles and analyze the diction of this quote.
ONE ASSUMPTION
dictated all of his suspicions
literally
flimsy assumption
This is the most discrediting "I DON'T AGREE WITH THIS PERSON" language imaginable.

But yeah, let's take MP's sneering little wager, and climb into the ISO time machine to once again analyze DF's posts, because if I don't, MP just won't respond to me.

Nice trick, this. Switching the roles, making your accuser be the one on the defensive while you ignore his points and force him to comb through ISOs.

I'll remember this next time I'm bad, it'll come in handy.

OTHER SUSPICIONS DFARADAY HAD:
Spoiler: show
Anyway, I don't think it's a coincidence that two of Rico's top suspects, G-Man and Elo, were here in the hatch with Rico and he turns up dead. WIFOM and all that, but right now I'd wager it's one of those two.
G-Man looks worse than Elo in this regard since she claimed hatch before Rico did. I mean to get to the other hatch residents as well, but I'm almost likely not voting for any of the beach dwellers this time, since we know for a fact that a baddie is here. Unless someone can present an outstanding case for one of them, I'll be voting someone on our side.
G-Man's reluctance to share throughout this game makes me view him more suspiciously as well.
DFaraday wrote:
Sorsha wrote:And I think it's borderline mean to pick on me for low contribution on day one when that pretty much all I ever have on day one
Sorsha wrote:Lower posters, Scotty and DF declared their locations fairly quickly and skedaddled. That seems a bit suspicious to me, knowing how civs like to tear themselves apart in games- it would benefit them to get business out of the way and then fade out of the convo.
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DFaraday wrote:
Scotty wrote:I literally hopped on here last second to vote and saw I had voted so I voted Soneji. To save myself
You had one vote on you, mate. I mean, that's not exactly mortal danger, is it?
DFaraday wrote:
Elohcin wrote:You said, you understand what Quin is doing. You say it's done a lot in small games like this. I am 100% honest in saying that I have NO CLUE what you are talking about. What is done a lot in small games like this one?

Linki.....now see...you are evading my questions too. You and Quin are having yourselves a little laugh in the BTSC thread aren't you?

"LOL, Quin, I'm getting in on this too. I'm going to annoy Eloh just like you have been. It, it, it! :P"
"Good job, Sorsha. We can easily get her lynched if we keep this up. And look, Daisy is being fooled by it all too. That other game where she fooled Epi is really playing in our favor."
"Wassup guy!, DF here. Epi is on to me. :O"

More linki....Quin, I have too much stuff that goes on in my life. I don't remember crap from game to game. Once the game is over, I have to empty out the details so I can function as a business owner, stay-at-home, homeschooling mother of three.

More linki (from SD)I will read in a minute
But if you knew about the power claiming stuff in another game, that doesn't seem the sort of thing you'd up and forget all about. Also, nice triple NO U. Voting Elo.
To compare, here's everything DF said about D1 being a save:

Spoiler: show
DFaraday wrote:
insertnamehere wrote:Hey guys, has anyone seen Libby around? We were gonna go have a picnic, and she said she was gonna go grab some blankets...

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But seriously, I really dislike the CFD shenanigans that occurred here. Going into Day 2, the Soneji voter-dudes are who I'm gonna be looking at.
That was absolute bollocks. Nobody talks about Soneji all day, then with ten minutes to go the votes pile on? That's bloody ludicrous!

If anyone asked me, I'd think the baddies are made up of two Soneji voters and either Eloh, Sorsha or G-Man. This just screams save. :disappoint:
DFaraday wrote:That's just one factor. The bigger issue for me is the Day 1 lynch, which still looks like a blatant save attempt. Since G-Man wasn't being saved, the most logical option is Elo. And of course Rico suspected Elo shortly before his demise.
I think one or two of the Soneji voters were trying to save someone (I think G-Man). Since Rico died I'm feeling either Elo or G-Man is the culprit.
Now here's how MP painted DFaraday to the thread. I've bolded some descriptive language MP uses for emphasis.
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:I found this dubious before, and I still find it dubious.

If anyone is taking advantage of a scummy-seeming town Elo, it's DFaraday.
MovingPictures07 wrote:I could see a universe in which DF and INH are bad and are 'setting up' easy mislynches.
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Spacedaisy wrote:Why would you have not voted for Scotty? I don't know if it was a bad choice, but it makes no sense to flip your vote all over the place and not give any reason why you are voting for that person. And the fact that Scotty (the person you said you wanted to vote for) had already voted for him, it makes even less sense to me. At least I had a reason for my vote.

As far as the assessment of me, I can understand why he thinks that. He's wrong, I was not aware voting for G-Man would prevent Elo from dying. I wasn't saving her. I wasn't saving her the first time either. But I can understand why it might look that way yes. My eyeroll was not about that it was about the fact that of course you would jump on that, considering everything I've said before that about you.

Right now I could see casting a vote for Elo, Scotty, or Sorsha right now. Probably in that order. Though I might be willing to swap Scotty and Elo, I don't know. Epi's defense of her is holding me back, because he usually seems to be right, but she has gotten good at fooling him I've noticed, so yeah... Meh.
What do you make of DFaraday?
Giving Daisy the opportunity to agree so that her vote doesn't seem random.
MovingPictures07 wrote:Quin v. Elo is increasingly reading town v. town to me. I think our mafia are sitting back and letting town fight it out. I'm inclined to think some combination of DF, INH, Scotty, and Sorsha are our baddies.
MovingPictures07 wrote:Everything about DF's gameplay is really bugging me. This is basically what he's done since the Soneji CFD:

- Soneji voters must be bad! Look at how they mislynched him out of nowhere! They were saving G-Man or Elo for sure.
- Votes for G-Man based on that logic, comes up town. It must be Elo!
- Then proceeds to vote for Elo based on the same faulty logic.

All of this despite me and Epi telling him that literally all of his suspicions/thoughts are based on one flimsy assumption: that someone was being saved on Day 1. I think that's ridiculously dubious.
MovingPictures07 wrote:I don't get the impression at all that DF cares about solving the game at all. I'd like to lynch him today.
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Spacedaisy wrote:@ MP - Up until your post on him setting up easy lynches, I hadn't really thought anything of him. In reading the Hatch thread I thought briefly that he seemed more engaged that he normally comes across to me, but I don't think that is necessarily a baddie tell or anything, he is usually disengaged either way I believe. But your post about setting up lynches was a good point. He basically has a lynch lined up no matter what result Elo might flip, which would be a nice place for a baddie to be sitting. It is something to consider.
INH is doing the exact same thing in that post I quoted. I find it equally suspect.

Both DF and INH seem so uninterested in actually hunting for mafia. They're just drawing connections based on incredibly dubious assumptions.
MovingPictures07 wrote:I'm voting DFaraday as well. He's not considering any perspectives that don't fit his incredibly rigid plan that someone was being saved d1. I think he's using it as a smokescreen to set up consecutive mislynches.

He says, after saying that they should lynch INH next. :meany:

MovingPictures07 wrote:
Quin wrote:I don't like either of the two who are currently voting with me. But I also don't want to move my vote.
I understand your reservations about Elo. Trust me. I came into this thread ready to grill her to oblivion. I still have doubts lingering in the back of my mind.

But contrast her game with DF and INH's games. Their games are the epitome of lacking any town spark whatsoever. They don't indicate any consideration of hunting.

Take a leap of faith with me.


The complete frankly ridiculous level of hyperbole in the third line makes me snigger like a schoolgirl every time I read it. I'm considering adding "lacking any town spark whatsover" to my signature as a badge of honor.

MovingPictures07 wrote:What puts INH over DF for you specifically?

I'm open-minded to considering INH; we just have to make sure we have a sufficient wagon going. I'd rather vote for DF because I feel ever so slightly more confident about him, but as long as we're lynching one of them over someone else, I don't really care.
MP, you're very resistant to anyone calling D1 a save, because you led the CFD, and you know you're a civilian, so naturally, they must be patently incorrect.

You can maybe see how when I read the sentence "as long as we're lynching one of them over someone else, I don't really care," and you were talking about two people I know to be civilians, I was more than a little bit suspicious of you.

MovingPictures07 wrote:Epi and Elo, would you be willing to vote INH?
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Elohcin wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:Epi and Elo, would you be willing to vote INH?
Not at this time. I am not convinced he is bad.
Why? What specifically do you find suspicious enough about DF to vote for him, but not about INH?


Now he's trying to lynch me, despite barely interacting with me the entire game, because I've considered D1 to be a save. That, plus my evident complete and utter lack of town spark.
MovingPictures07 wrote:
DFaraday wrote:What the bloody hell bollocks is this? I'm getting lynched for being too focused on one sodding person? MP, you say I am not trying to solve the game. What about all the players just voting with the flow? Is that really better? The baddies are obviously steering the lunches. At this point I bet it isn't even Elo. It's probably the sodding band wagoners.
That's not the reason.

The one assumption that literally your entire game has focused on has been "someone was saved d1", even though you have no reason to believe that to be more likely than all of the vote-receivers being town on d1. I have pointed this out. Epi has pointed this out. You don't seem to care.
MovingPictures07 wrote:DF's response is unconvincing. I'm content with my vote.
MovingPictures07 wrote:Dinner time, BBL.

Linki: Well, fuck. RIP DF. I'm sorry I was wrong, but I don't regret my decision; I still stand by my assessment.

Now I suppose it's time to re-assess again.
MP uses the same loaded language over and over when referring to DFaraday and yours truly. He calls thinking D1 was a save a "flimsy and dubious assumption" upon which "literally DF's entire game" was based upon. Plus, "DF and INH aren't hunting," and "lack town spark."

I'm surprised he didn't just start calling DF "Lyin' Faraday."
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#611

Post by insertnamehere »

i'm gonna go watch the Survivor finale.

Be back later with a summation of everything, and an analysis of how MP responded to me post-D3.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#612

Post by Golden »

insertnamehere wrote:i'm gonna go watch the Survivor finale.

Be back later with a summation of everything, and an analysis of how MP responded to me post-D3.
Damn I hate having to download it. And be at work while it's on. I'm jealous.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#613

Post by Quin »

Quin wrote:
Elohcin wrote:Good luck, Quin. What are you interviewing for?
A customer service role at a marketing firm. Not that extravagant but it's a good step in the direction I want to go.
Ah, so turns out me and the company have a definition of what 'customer service means'.

To them, it means door knocking for donations. Pass.


I'm back now, I'll get back into the swing of things soon enough.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#614

Post by Tangrowth »

My time for this Day phase will pretty much be limited to what I can contribute over the next hour tops, so here goes my best effort at least.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Night 3

#615

Post by Tangrowth »

Elohcin wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Elohcin wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:I'm calling a baddie team of Elo/INH/Quin right now.
Why would I be teammates with Quin? That makes no sense at all MP. Listen, I think you are civ. But I also think you need to take a step back to evaluate your read on me here. I called out Quin for THREE days. And I called out INH today. You all were so convinced that Quin was claiming a power role to distract the baddies. I thought he was doing it b/c he knew he wasn't in trouble of being killed b/c he WAS a baddie. Now how do you change your story on that topic? Was I correct on the matter? Would I call out a teammate like that if I were bad and if I were correct on that matter. Your reads are getting all jumbled, MP. I think the baddies are Scotty/Sorsha, INH, and Quin. I think that makes a lot more sense.

I know Scotty is a new name for me to throw around, but I just about forgot he was even playing :p
Why that combination? I mean, if you could succinctly summarize why you think the behavior of those players displays mafia-aligned behavior, and why the behavior of players you DIDN'T include in your fictional team, that'd be great. I know you've talked about it before, but just brief little blurbs about each player would be nice.

I'm remaining open-minded myself, hence why I said "right now" in that quote you're responding to. I don't think I'd agree with last night MP right now. I'm not sure what I would say right now. I need to dig through ISOs first... I hope I have time to.
Is it rude to ask you to just reread my posts? I'm just really not feeling well...got a cold Sunday night and its kicking my butt.
It's not rude, but I think it's prudent that we all re-assess. We haven't lynched a single member of the mafia. If you're still holding onto weak or Day 1 reasons to town read someone, that's not sufficient. So I was asking for updated reads from you, which I think is a more than fair request.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#616

Post by Tangrowth »

Quin, I appreciate your ISO analyses; I apologize to you and the rest of town that I haven't been able to hold my end of the deal on performing all of that like I've wanted to. Reading them now.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#617

Post by Tangrowth »

Epignosis wrote:Hatch

DFaraday -Lynch
Elohcin
G-Man - Lynch
Insertnamehere
MovingPictures07
Quin
Ricochet - Kill

Beach

Dom - Kill
Epignosis
Scotty - Kill
Sorsha
Spacedaisy

From the hatch, that leaves:

Eloh
INH
MP
Quin

I stand by my assessment of Eloh and MP. If I'm wrong, oh well. That means my vote today is going to either Quin or INH.
I'm not impressed. What are your actual thoughts on Quin or INH?
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Night 3

#618

Post by Tangrowth »

insertnamehere wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:The problem with INH's strategy, if he is mafia, is that he could have selected a different player to tunnel out of the end of d3 and convinced someone more easily to vote for them, Elo, Sorsha, and Scotty I think would have little resistance.

Since we're going into LYLO tomorrow, the tides turning on me in the moment appeared blatantly sinister, but if that is the case, it seems to be a completely reactive and perhaps poor mafia strategy.

I also am not sure INH would argue with me with such conviction and with such blatant misrepresentations if he were mafia. It seems over the top.
Following this train of thought, if INH is mafia, Quin being his teammate makes little sense. There were moments, both d1 and d3, when INH legitimately could have gotten lynched, and I'm not sure Quin is THAT ballsy to risk going after his teammate relentlessly all game. I think I was suffering tinfoil and recency bias a bit too much when I threw that out there.

Funny what a little backing away emotionally and accompanied sleep will do for a person.
Right now, MP, you're my biggest lynch candidate.

If you think me and Quin are both civ, and you yourself are civ, you need to give me a better alternative here.

GTH, who do you think is the baddie team?
I understand. I realize I haven't been a beacon of townie behavior this game or anything. I hope at least, if you are town, you can re-examine everything I've done and the conversations you and I have had especially of late and see enough of a glimmer of my alignment in there, because if you vote for me this game will be over.

I'm mulling over it; nonetheless, I'll be sure to answer your question. It's difficult to answer because we don't even have a single flip by which to judge any teammate interactions, and the Scotty NK really threw me for a loop.

So yeah, let me get back to you on this after I've caught up.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Night 3

#619

Post by Tangrowth »

insertnamehere wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:INH, I never got a response to this post, and I'd like one because I'm trying to determine whether you're a desperate baddie making a play on mislynching me tomorrow or whether you genuinely believe I'm bad.

MovingPictures07 wrote:
insertnamehere wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Quin wrote:My rainbow list currently has no town reads.
Why?
why not?

some of us are better at seeing town reads than others.
MovingPictures07 wrote:
insertnamehere wrote:Sorsha's the one I have the best view of, but not by much
What is that view? Why is she your top read?
it's like I went through some kind of...procedure of removal...in my mind, and Sorsha was the one who rubbed me wrong the least. She's the least objectionable, not the most commendable. Hence the yellow hue.
I don't understand your first response. What does that mean?

But why? What about Sorsha rubs you wrong the least? What has she done that's least objectionable?
My first response was based on something you said in GY!BE mafia. It was something akin to "I find it easier to townread people than to scumread them." My mind works the opposite way. I'm verrry hesitant to award a town read to someone, especially in a game where we haven't managed to lynch a civilian yet, and it's LYLO time.

My sole townread in this game was DFaraday. And you lynched him for reasons I disagree with.

When I say that I find Sorsha the least objectionable, it's not that I think aspects of her game play indicate her civvieness, it's that I think everyone else has more scummy aspects.

If you asked me what made Sorsha civ, I'd shrug in your face. But if you asked me what makes every single other player, excluding myself and her, suspicious, I'd be able to list a couple things.

She could still easily do something suspicious, and I'd immediately change my view of her.
This all checks out. Thanks for explaining.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Night 3

#620

Post by Tangrowth »

INH, in response to your post:

I think we're misunderstanding each other. I'm not saying that suspicion lies with folks away from the CFD inherently; I think each individual should be judged on a case by case basis. Regarding Daisy and Quin, I found reason to believe both of their intentions are genuine, and I know I'm genuine, so I found DF's view on the CFD myopic. It's natural that we're coming to different conclusions, and perhaps even natural that you're mafia reading me, because we approach mafia very differently and this game in particular we've not seen eye to eye.

No, I don't think SD is scum; that one instance was a typo. I meant the opposite.

Again, everyone should be judged. I'm not saying we can't judge anyone. I'm also not discounting vote analysis; that's an important tool. But without a single mafia flip, vote analysis all comes down to an individual assessment of each player's vote for sincerity or nefarious intentions. And I think it's logically fallacious to automatically cast more suspicion upon players who have voted for confirmed civilians more than those who have voted for [alignment unknown], because generally (in my experience anyway) I've not found that players who consistently vote for flipped townies are any more often mafia-aligned (who were consistently voting on townie wagons) than town-aligned (who were just flat out wrong).
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#621

Post by Tangrowth »

I'm still entertaining INH as mafia, but his contributions are increasingly strikingly genuine to me. I also think him being town fits into the Scotty NK last night (more on that in a minute).
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#622

Post by Tangrowth »

Alright, so I'm caught up and unfortunately am running low on time, and I'll busy all day tomorrow with travels and such.

Here are my thoughts on the Scotty NK:

It surprised me greatly. It doesn't make sense to me if INH is mafia. Given how d3 and post-d3 n3 discussions transpired, it was evident that INH and I would be squaring off today and that not only would he be likely to vote for me today but also I would be relatively likely to return the favor. It also should have been evident that Epi wouldn't be likely voting for me or Elo and that Daisy and I weren't likely going to be voting for each other either. Separately, Quin has consistently been the town tour de force this game. That leaves INH, Sorsha, Scotty, and me as likely candidates for today's vote. Consequently, it strikes me as strategically unsound for INH, as a likely lynch candidate for d4 (LYLO at that) to kill off another possible lynch candidate. Now Scotty hasn't had tremendous heat applied to him (but others haven't either) and we don't often lynch low posters around these parts, but given his absence, I think the potential for some serious heat could have headed his way today. Furthermore, Epi, Elo, Daisy, and even Quin would have been more logical choices for the NK since they have less potential for being today's lynch candidate. So... why the hell would a mafia team with INH, the guy with maybe the most potential to be lynched today after our conversation yesterday and Elo saying he wasn't being convincing, leave any of those players alive in favor of NKing Scotty?

I don't feel inclined to hand my vote to INH. I also don't feel inclined to give it to Daisy or Quin. That leaves just Epi, Elo, and Sorsha.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#623

Post by Tangrowth »

I've found Epi's contributions genuine throughout this game, but thinking on it, I'm not entirely sure why. His contributions leave a bit to be desired. He doesn't seem too interested in actually uncovering who the mafia are given our current dire situation; where's the sense of urgency?

I flipped on Elo for what I deemed as legitimate reasons during yesterday's lynch, but I've since been questioning that. I find the following things questionable:
- Why is it that Elo dropped the power role thing upon my explanation when a previous similar explanation was given this game?
- Why was Elo unwilling to vote for INH due to seeming "helpful" only to find his arguments against me last Night unconvincing, and thereby seemingly more likely to vote for him? I don't see any assessment from Elo regarding whether INH's contributions are genuine, regardless of how convincing or not they are.
- Why is Elo still essentially clearing me based on my activity level? This still reeks of TMI, and I wonder if I was too quick to overlook this.

Lastly, regarding Sorsha, I'm torn on her. At times I've found her contributions genuine, but there's some definite reason to suspect her, especially her behavior during d3. What was that voting based on her trusting players, yet having no opinion at all on the two players she was considering voting for? I think that's an awful look.

Nonetheless, I'm torn.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#624

Post by Tangrowth »

I'm not sure what to do. This has been a tough game. And we don't even have a single mafia flip so I hate having nothing tangible by which to judge interactions. I suppose I'll hold off on my vote to see what you all think, continue to mull over all of this, and make some brief time for this tomorrow, but don't expect anything from me other than quick phone posting while I'm at the airport or something.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#625

Post by Tangrowth »

MovingPictures07 wrote:I'm not sure what to do. This has been a tough game. And we don't even have a single mafia flip so I hate having nothing tangible by which to judge interactions. I suppose I'll hold off on my vote to see what you all think, continue to mull over all of this, and make some brief time for this tomorrow, but don't expect anything from me other than quick phone posting while I'm at the airport or something.
I guess if I had to vote literally at this very moment, it'd be for Elo or Sorsha. I'm going to drop a vote on Sorsha for now.

Sorsha, please come in to this game and provide your suspicions and thoughts in length when you can. Thanks.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#626

Post by Quin »

Quin wrote:@Golden - did the baddies have BTSC while we were separated?
Can Golden answer this? Or say that this is something he can't answer?
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#627

Post by Quin »

MovingPictures07 wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:I'm not sure what to do. This has been a tough game. And we don't even have a single mafia flip so I hate having nothing tangible by which to judge interactions. I suppose I'll hold off on my vote to see what you all think, continue to mull over all of this, and make some brief time for this tomorrow, but don't expect anything from me other than quick phone posting while I'm at the airport or something.
I guess if I had to vote literally at this very moment, it'd be for Elo or Sorsha. I'm going to drop a vote on Sorsha for now.

Sorsha, please come in to this game and provide your suspicions and thoughts in length when you can. Thanks.
I don't like this vote. Aside from you, there are three hatchlings left; Me, INH and Eloh. If you're not bad, then you should know that there is a confirmed baddie among Eloh, INH and myself. Yet you're voting outside of us, where the probability of there even being a single scum there is unknown. You've been making the point that we're in LYLO more than anybody else and yet you're the one taking a risk by choosing the option with an unknown percentage of flipping a baddie, instead of the one where you have between at least a 33% chance.

I voted MP, and I think Eloh is your teammate.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#628

Post by Golden »

Quin wrote:
Quin wrote:@Golden - did the baddies have BTSC while we were separated?
Can Golden answer this? Or say that this is something he can't answer?
The baddies did have btsc while you were in the hatch/beach threads.
Spoiler: show
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#629

Post by Quin »

Golden wrote:
Quin wrote:
Quin wrote:@Golden - did the baddies have BTSC while we were separated?
Can Golden answer this? Or say that this is something he can't answer?
The baddies did have btsc while you were in the hatch/beach threads.
My proposed scum-team is MP, Eloh and Spacedaisy.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#630

Post by Quin »

Sorsha could be subbed in as an alternative to Spacedaisy, but it's unlikely given MP's current vote.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#631

Post by Quin »

To break down my reasoning:

- MP was on board to lynch Eloh when we were separated into the two threads. Having BTSC, and knowing that there were two separate lynch polls, he would be able to co-ordinate with his team if he had a teammate on the other side to have them place a vote to save Eloh (by either SD or Sorsha), with hopes to lynch G-Man instead.

- MP has since avoided lynching Eloh both days since. I found both the DF wagon yesterday and MP's current vote to be fallicious for reasons I just underlined. I think this is justification enough to create the possibility that he and Eloh are teammates. I think MP placing a vote on Sorsha hints towards the fact that they are not teammates.

Therefore, I think MP, SD and Eloh are bad.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#632

Post by Quin »

Golden wrote:
Quin wrote:
Quin wrote:@Golden - did the baddies have BTSC while we were separated?
Can Golden answer this? Or say that this is something he can't answer?
The baddies did have btsc while you were in the hatch/beach threads.
Just so clarify, you do mean ALL the baddies, right? Not just whichever baddies were in the same location?
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#633

Post by Golden »

Quin wrote:
Golden wrote:
Quin wrote:
Quin wrote:@Golden - did the baddies have BTSC while we were separated?
Can Golden answer this? Or say that this is something he can't answer?
The baddies did have btsc while you were in the hatch/beach threads.
Just so clarify, you do mean ALL the baddies, right? Not just whichever baddies were in the same location?
The three baddies all had btsc during that period of time.
Spoiler: show
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#634

Post by Quin »

Cool. If I'm right about this I'm going to buy myself something nice.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#635

Post by Dom »

rez me pls
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#636

Post by Sorsha »

MovingPictures07 wrote: Lastly, regarding Sorsha, I'm torn on her. At times I've found her contributions genuine, but there's some definite reason to suspect her, especially her behavior during d3. What was that voting based on her trusting players, yet having no opinion at all on the two players she was considering voting for? I think that's an awful look.

Nonetheless, I'm torn.
I'm not always going to come up with a novel reason to be suspicious of someone. By saying I trusted certain players I mean that I trust their assessment of the players/situations and agree with them.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#637

Post by Sorsha »

MovingPictures07 wrote:
Epignosis wrote:Hatch

DFaraday -Lynch
Elohcin
G-Man - Lynch
Insertnamehere
MovingPictures07
Quin
Ricochet - Kill

Beach

Dom - Kill
Epignosis
Scotty - Kill
Sorsha
Spacedaisy

From the hatch, that leaves:

Eloh
INH
MP
Quin

I stand by my assessment of Eloh and MP. If I'm wrong, oh well. That means my vote today is going to either Quin or INH.
I'm not impressed. What are your actual thoughts on Quin or INH?
My thinking is along the same lines as Epi here with regards to the hatch people- we know that at least one of these players is the killer. The difference being that I think Quin is the least likely to be bad. If I ranked the hatchlings it would be Quin, MP, INH, Eloh. Including the beach bums I'd put Epi with MP and INH and Daisy a step down from Quin.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#638

Post by Epignosis »

I didn't get to this last night because I was too busy punching in the numbers. I won my first DFS tournament. :slick: Not that money does any good on this island.

Setting aside my preconceptions:
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Spacedaisy wrote:
Sorsha wrote:
Spacedaisy wrote:
Quin wrote:If it comes to a tie breaker I'll be moving my vote to Eloh to save G-Man. I do not want to do that. Alternatively you could all vote INH.
You feel confident enough in G-Man's alignment to save him?

Linki: You're considering voting someone for roleplay/low content?
And?
It's just odd that you want others to excuse your low content because, hey it's Day 1! But you would consider voting someone else for that reason, that's all I'm saying

Quin: Can you please explain why you feel that confident about him this early?

MP: Why Elo over G-Man?

Linki: I'm here, who are we considering?
Because I'm townreading G-Man, whereas I'm just ??? on Elo.

How do you feel about Rico and Soneji?
"just ???? on Eloh." Then a minute later:
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Epignosis wrote:I don't see anything from my wife to suggest she's bad.
I agree.

Whom are you considering?

I'm currently contemplating Rico and Soneji, but I'm listening.
MP- You agreed with me about Eloh but you said you were ??? about her (where ??? stands in contrast to "townreading") a minute prior. How does seeing nothing that suggests someone is bad make you ??? about her?
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Elohcin wrote:Y'all are so fun.

G, why did you wait until the last minute to declare where you would stay for the night?

MP, I am good. You watched lost, right? Read through my posts when you get a chance (just mine) and then make up your mind about me. I know I waffled a little on G, but I always do. I still half think he is good and half think he is bad. He's been helpful, but his motivations could be bad. He waited until the last minute to claim where he will stay, that pings a bit.

But I am more pinged by Sorsha and that is why I voted her. He role played the hell out of these past 48 hours and contributed nothing, imo. She claims that those who came in and claimed their night stay and left are suspicious but I don't find that suspicious at all. I am guessing those are busy people trying to get done what is required of them and then being on their merry way. I think they were bad, they would hold out to see where others were going first.

Woah linki
Of course I watched LOST; that's how I met a lot of these fine people in our community, including my wife, and discovered mafia. :slick:

You don't have to give me an excuse for an ISO; I'll gladly take a look. :p I've posted like a madperson in GY!BE and am planning on ISOs there too, but I'll maybe throw a few down here soon too.
I don't get anything from this, but I'm including it anyway. This on the other hand:
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Elohcin wrote:MP... I am claire for goodness sakes. Claire is not bad.
This pretty much says it all.

Upgrading Elo to strong mafia read.
Explain how this says it all. What does it say and how does it say it?
It's a non-defense.
This sudden shift came after the Hatch, so time to go there.
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Elohcin wrote:I hit play and danced a jig, G. Thanks for the music.
Quin wrote:Me, because I have a power role.
Why would you say this. Do you WANT to be killed? Or are you mafia? :shrug:

I was thinking MP as well. I think he is civ and I can imagine the baddies picking to off him early.

------------------------------
woah woah woah.....this is nuts. So we are stuck in the hatch for day 2? And Rico is dead. So one of the Hatchlings are bad for sure.
What specifically have I done or said to have you reading me as town?
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Elohcin wrote:Elohcin
G-man
Insertnamehere
DFaraday
MovingPictures07
Quin

After finding out Rico was killed, this is my rainbow list of those here in the Hatch.

linki...what do you mean by hatch claim/overall claim?
And how does you calling me town jive with this list? I don't understand. There's obvious lack of congruence.
Eloh never responded to MP about the "obvious lack of congruence," but said that she thinks MP would be making this more of a priority if he were bad. I don't agree with that assessment and I don't think MP would either.
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Elohcin wrote:
Quin wrote:Sorry, all. My internet has gone to shit again and it's entirely likely I might not get it back for a few days. I can't really address anything specific because I'm using a really bad hotspot internet, but I will when I get a chance. Here's what I can say right now before I check out again.

Eloh's answer to my question isn't great. She reacted like my earlier post about having a power role was so significant, but if she were a civ-minded player in this game, she wouldn't have missed something that significant.

I don't like anything about INH's day 1. I've covered the majority of my thoughts about him in the main thread, so give that a look.

I'm not opposed to a vote for MP. I think my hypothesis about late declarers has some merit, although admittedly it's not the strongest Day 1 thing.


Just so I have a Day 2 vote out there, I'm voting INH again. I'm not caught up in the slightest.


@Golden - if I don't check in for a few days, feel free to replace me.
Yes, I reacted as if your power role claiming was significant b/c I thought it WAS significant. You did it right at the beginning of night 1 as if to day, hey baddie kill ME. That is what made it significant. I don't think a civ would put it out there right at that point. If/when you claimed that in the beginning of the game, it wasn't as significant to me.

I don't want to vote MP today. He's barely here and I think it would be a mistake. I am thinking Sorsha or Quin and here is why. Quin b/c of his power role claim right at the beginning of Night 1 when the killer is thinking about who to kill. And Sorsha b/c of her Day 1 lack of contributions. Searching for Walk is all she did.
Elo, your play is reeking of TMI, as if you know that I'm town. Not a good look.
The only context of their Hatch exchange that makes any sense to me if they are both bad is that Eloh flubbed her rainbow list and MP felt the need to call that out before anybody else did.
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:I suspect Elo and G-Man.
MP did leave the door open to go either way with his vote (despite calling G-Man good Day 1).
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:Between Elohcin's TMI behavior and her suspicion of Quin for hard claiming power role, I feel most comfortable lynching her today. I feel less enthusiastically in support of G-Man's lynch because I feel like the generation of most of his content is lacking a transparent assessment of other alignments, but I don't feel strongly about this.

I'm digging DF's activity and sincerity, but there's some concern for me that keeps him from ranking more highly, namely that he seemed intent on casting shade at Soneji voters which struck me as over-the-top and myopic, and now he seems to have inexplicably changed focus. One could see it as opportunistic.

Quin and INH are certain town reads at the moment. I don't want to lynch either of them. INH's interactions with G-Man are solidly town.
That underlined segment is ironic given the criticism of how "intent" DF was.
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Quin wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:Quin, will you lynch Elohcin with me?
Ask me again in an hour. I want to see how the rest of the conversation plays out.
Fair enough.
This is an unnecessary push if MP and Eloh are teammates. Quin raised the point that Mafia would have the advantage of seeing both sides, so that's worth investigating.
Spoiler: show
Who needs to be hit with the Eko stick?

Poll ended at Fri Dec 09, 2016 7:36 pm

DFaraday
0
No votes

Dom
0
No votes

Elohcin
3
MovingPictures07 (5), G-Man (7), Quin (8)
38%

Epignosis
0
No votes

G-Man
2
insertnamehere (2), DFaraday (4)
25%

insertnamehere
0
No votes

MovingPictures07
0
No votes

Quin
1
Elohcin (6)
13%

Scotty
0
No votes

Sorsha
0
No votes

Spacedaisy
0
No votes

Take me to the question mark (nons/deads)
2
Golden (1), Metalmarsh89 (3)
25%


Total votes : 8


Who needs to be hit with the Eko stick?

Poll ended at Fri Dec 09, 2016 7:36 pm

DFaraday
0
No votes

Dom
0
No votes

Elohcin
0
No votes

Epignosis
2
Scotty (4), Sorsha (5)
33%

G-Man
2
Dom (2), Spacedaisy (6)
33%

insertnamehere
0
No votes

MovingPictures07
0
No votes

Quin
0
No votes

Scotty
0
No votes

Sorsha
0
No votes

Spacedaisy
0
No votes

Take me to the question mark (nons/deads)
2
Golden (1), Metalmarsh89 (3)
33%


Total votes : 6


Dom cast his Beach vote for G-Man the evening before, so G-Man already had one on that side.
MP cast his vote for Eloh at 6:09pm EST after G-Man had two Hatch votes.
G-Man voted Eloh 6:59pm EST
Quin followed suit at 7:02pm EST.
Spacedaisy cast the last vote on the Beach side at 7:15pm EST, which sealed the deal for G-Man.

In the very least, this timeline supports Quin's theory.
MovingPictures07 wrote:
DFaraday wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Quin wrote:
DFaraday wrote:
Quin wrote:In looking into whether I can garner any form of motivation for a Dom kill besides it just being convenient, there wasn't much relevant content related to Dom. I found one post from both SD and DF that I'd like them to talk about some more.
Spoiler: show
Spacedaisy wrote:Literally nothing.

Scotty came in, Sorsha said she suspected him the most but didn't want to vote someone not present to defend himself. She asked me my opinion of MP and my response was I am solidly reading civ MP this game.

Dom voted G-Man with no explanation, which is why I went back to the main thread to see if he voted him Day 1, and he did. Reading Dom in ISO made me feel like I trusted him more than anyone else in my thread at that point too.

Scotty voted Epi/Kate because he didn't flirt more with Scotty/Sawyer in his roleplay. :confused:

Sorsha voted G-Man with no explanation, then quickly switched to Epi with no explanation except that she didn't want to vote for someone not there to defend himself.

I voted G-Man because all I had was Day 1 to go off of, and I only trusted Dom because everyone else was hopped up on drugs or something judging by the way they were popping off votes with no explanation or reasoning.

Epi missed the vote.

Whole lot of nothing. Very confusing nothing.
Daisy, neither of these statements provided a definitive conclusion about you felt about Dom in the wider scope of the game, more-so it was specific to those on the beach. Help me understand why you thought this post was necessary, because I don't know why it matters how you felt about someone among an apart-from-the-obvious completely random minority. I'd also like to know your thoughts on those who were with you on the beach.

@DFaraday - in this post, you've got Dom smack bang in the middle of your rainbow list. What was your reason for this?
I didn't have any read on him at all. Same reason Daisy and Epi were in the middle. Though right now I'd move Epi down, since I'm starting to suspect Epi and Elo are bad together.
Epi not thinking anything in particular about the fact that Eloh considered going left-field with her vote doesn't jive too well with me. If we lynch Eloh and she flips bad, I don't think Epi looks great.
So I'm supposed to think Eloh is bad for that? Is that how this works?
That's just one factor. The bigger issue for me is the Day 1 lynch, which still looks like a blatant save attempt. Since G-Man wasn't being saved, the most logical option is Elo. And of course Rico suspected Elo shortly before his demise.
I found this dubious before, and I still find it dubious.

If anyone is taking advantage of a scummy-seeming town Elo, it's DFaraday.
I didn't see anything in MP's posts to suggest a change of mindset that went from "strong mafia read" to "scummy-seeming town Elo."
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:I'm torn on Elo. I really, really thought she was bad. I'm less inclined to think she is, but I am not completely ignoring the perspective that she's just feigning all of this. Her contributions are weak either way, and I still think her town read of me reads like she has information that I'm town rather than any compelling in-thread reason to believe I'm town.
Now at "torn."
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Elohcin wrote:My only reason I think you are civ, MP is because I think you would be more posty if you were bad. I think you would make it more of a priority to be here and involved throughout the game and not just EoD.

Hey Quin, how is it beneficial to a civ to claim a power role at the beginning of Night when baddies are deliberating who to kill?
I understand; it just seems pretty weak for me to be your top town read. I guess it makes sense, even if I don't believe it's true -- I don't think my activity depends much, if at all, on my alignment.
Nope- MP didn't agree with her assessment of him.
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:Quin v. Elo is increasingly reading town v. town to me. I think our mafia are sitting back and letting town fight it out. I'm inclined to think some combination of DF, INH, Scotty, and Sorsha are our baddies.
From "torn" to "town" in nine minutes. :|
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Quin wrote:I don't like either of the two who are currently voting with me. But I also don't want to move my vote.
I understand your reservations about Elo. Trust me. I came into this thread ready to grill her to oblivion. I still have doubts lingering in the back of my mind.

But contrast her game with DF and INH's games. Their games are the epitome of lacking any town spark whatsoever. They don't indicate any consideration of hunting.

Take a leap of faith with me.
My question regarding the underlined is this: Why wouldn't you grill her anyway? If you had real questions that needed answers, why not do your thing and see what comes of it?
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:I'm calling a baddie team of Elo/INH/Quin right now.
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:MP's Rainbow List #4 - Night 3

Strong Town:
N/A

Moderate Town:
Spacedaisy

Weak Town:
Epignosis

Weak Mafia:
Sorsha
Scotty
Elohcin


Moderate Mafia:
Quin

Strong Mafia:
insertnamehere
To use MP's words, there's an "obvious lack of congruence" regarding this and MP's current vote. To be fair, MP would later call this "gut-based drivel."
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Elohcin wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Elohcin wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:I'm calling a baddie team of Elo/INH/Quin right now.
Why would I be teammates with Quin? That makes no sense at all MP. Listen, I think you are civ. But I also think you need to take a step back to evaluate your read on me here. I called out Quin for THREE days. And I called out INH today. You all were so convinced that Quin was claiming a power role to distract the baddies. I thought he was doing it b/c he knew he wasn't in trouble of being killed b/c he WAS a baddie. Now how do you change your story on that topic? Was I correct on the matter? Would I call out a teammate like that if I were bad and if I were correct on that matter. Your reads are getting all jumbled, MP. I think the baddies are Scotty/Sorsha, INH, and Quin. I think that makes a lot more sense.

I know Scotty is a new name for me to throw around, but I just about forgot he was even playing :p
Why that combination? I mean, if you could succinctly summarize why you think the behavior of those players displays mafia-aligned behavior, and why the behavior of players you DIDN'T include in your fictional team, that'd be great. I know you've talked about it before, but just brief little blurbs about each player would be nice.

I'm remaining open-minded myself, hence why I said "right now" in that quote you're responding to. I don't think I'd agree with last night MP right now. I'm not sure what I would say right now. I need to dig through ISOs first... I hope I have time to.
Is it rude to ask you to just reread my posts? I'm just really not feeling well...got a cold Sunday night and its kicking my butt.
It's not rude, but I think it's prudent that we all re-assess. We haven't lynched a single member of the mafia. If you're still holding onto weak or Day 1 reasons to town read someone, that's not sufficient. So I was asking for updated reads from you, which I think is a more than fair request.
There's a minor tiff between Eloh and MP here, in contrast to the more explosive back and forth between MP and INH.
Spoiler: show
MovingPictures07 wrote:I've found Epi's contributions genuine throughout this game, but thinking on it, I'm not entirely sure why. His contributions leave a bit to be desired. He doesn't seem too interested in actually uncovering who the mafia are given our current dire situation; where's the sense of urgency?

I flipped on Elo for what I deemed as legitimate reasons during yesterday's lynch, but I've since been questioning that. I find the following things questionable:
- Why is it that Elo dropped the power role thing upon my explanation when a previous similar explanation was given this game?
- Why was Elo unwilling to vote for INH due to seeming "helpful" only to find his arguments against me last Night unconvincing, and thereby seemingly more likely to vote for him? I don't see any assessment from Elo regarding whether INH's contributions are genuine, regardless of how convincing or not they are.
- Why is Elo still essentially clearing me based on my activity level? This still reeks of TMI, and I wonder if I was too quick to overlook this.

Lastly, regarding Sorsha, I'm torn on her. At times I've found her contributions genuine, but there's some definite reason to suspect her, especially her behavior during d3. What was that voting based on her trusting players, yet having no opinion at all on the two players she was considering voting for? I think that's an awful look.

Nonetheless, I'm torn.
MP has expressed the gamut of possibilities regarding Eloh. The above is his explanation of that. Having now looked at all of MP's interactions with Eloh, I'm left with this: Why doesn't MP ask her these questions and demand responses? Outside of the Hatch, MP has treated Eloh with kid gloves. I would think that if you are genuinely torn on someone, you would be more eager to strive for answers so that you could gain a clear opinion.

In summary, I am less convinced of MP's goodness than I was, and I cannot rule out an MP-Eloh relationship. However, the points in his favor that I made earlier are still points in his favor.

I don't have time, but if you are interested, here are two times when MP and Eloh have been teammates.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#639

Post by Tangrowth »

I'm here but not for long at all.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#640

Post by Tangrowth »

Quin wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:I'm not sure what to do. This has been a tough game. And we don't even have a single mafia flip so I hate having nothing tangible by which to judge interactions. I suppose I'll hold off on my vote to see what you all think, continue to mull over all of this, and make some brief time for this tomorrow, but don't expect anything from me other than quick phone posting while I'm at the airport or something.
I guess if I had to vote literally at this very moment, it'd be for Elo or Sorsha. I'm going to drop a vote on Sorsha for now.

Sorsha, please come in to this game and provide your suspicions and thoughts in length when you can. Thanks.
I don't like this vote. Aside from you, there are three hatchlings left; Me, INH and Eloh. If you're not bad, then you should know that there is a confirmed baddie among Eloh, INH and myself. Yet you're voting outside of us, where the probability of there even being a single scum there is unknown. You've been making the point that we're in LYLO more than anybody else and yet you're the one taking a risk by choosing the option with an unknown percentage of flipping a baddie, instead of the one where you have between at least a 33% chance.

I voted MP, and I think Eloh is your teammate.
Oh, I didn't think about it that way. I suppose you're right hat mathematically it makes more sense to limit my scope to the Hatch, but the problem is that we don't know where the other two (?) baddies are, so it's possible that all three were at the hatch (you, Elo, INH), but also possible that two were at the beach and only one at the hatch, making it better to focus on beach folks. There's too much uncertainty. I would rather focus on who is objectively scummy and go from there.

But if I feel about equally about Elo and Sorsha, I should have voted Elo due to the confirmed at least one at the hatch and since I was at the hatch, you're right. I wasn't thinking of that.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#641

Post by Tangrowth »

Quin wrote:
Golden wrote:
Quin wrote:
Quin wrote:@Golden - did the baddies have BTSC while we were separated?
Can Golden answer this? Or say that this is something he can't answer?
The baddies did have btsc while you were in the hatch/beach threads.
My proposed scum-team is MP, Eloh and Spacedaisy.
I know it's not me, and I highly suspect it isn't Daisy. You need to rethink this if you're Town because otherwise we are sunk right now.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#642

Post by Tangrowth »

Quin wrote:To break down my reasoning:

- MP was on board to lynch Eloh when we were separated into the two threads. Having BTSC, and knowing that there were two separate lynch polls, he would be able to co-ordinate with his team if he had a teammate on the other side to have them place a vote to save Eloh (by either SD or Sorsha), with hopes to lynch G-Man instead.

- MP has since avoided lynching Eloh both days since. I found both the DF wagon yesterday and MP's current vote to be fallicious for reasons I just underlined. I think this is justification enough to create the possibility that he and Eloh are teammates. I think MP placing a vote on Sorsha hints towards the fact that they are not teammates.

Therefore, I think MP, SD and Eloh are bad.
I am incredibly flip floppy on Elo. I can't read her for shit. That's my real problem. And it doesn't help that she and Sorsha have been completely absent since yesterday. What the heck is that about?
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#643

Post by Tangrowth »

Sorsha wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote: Lastly, regarding Sorsha, I'm torn on her. At times I've found her contributions genuine, but there's some definite reason to suspect her, especially her behavior during d3. What was that voting based on her trusting players, yet having no opinion at all on the two players she was considering voting for? I think that's an awful look.

Nonetheless, I'm torn.
I'm not always going to come up with a novel reason to be suspicious of someone. By saying I trusted certain players I mean that I trust their assessment of the players/situations and agree with them.
Oh never mind here's Sorsha.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#644

Post by Tangrowth »

Sorsha wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Epignosis wrote:Hatch

DFaraday -Lynch
Elohcin
G-Man - Lynch
Insertnamehere
MovingPictures07
Quin
Ricochet - Kill

Beach

Dom - Kill
Epignosis
Scotty - Kill
Sorsha
Spacedaisy

From the hatch, that leaves:

Eloh
INH
MP
Quin

I stand by my assessment of Eloh and MP. If I'm wrong, oh well. That means my vote today is going to either Quin or INH.
I'm not impressed. What are your actual thoughts on Quin or INH?
My thinking is along the same lines as Epi here with regards to the hatch people- we know that at least one of these players is the killer. The difference being that I think Quin is the least likely to be bad. If I ranked the hatchlings it would be Quin, MP, INH, Eloh. Including the beach bums I'd put Epi with MP and INH and Daisy a step down from Quin.
With Elo and Sorsha going after each other essentially all game I think it's odd that neither of them have shown more desire to convince other players to lynch each other.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#645

Post by Tangrowth »

Not really sure what to make of it though.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#646

Post by Tangrowth »

Epi, sorry my ???? Was unclear. What I meant is that I didn't have any reason to read her bad but I didn't feel I had a compelling reason to Town read her either, hence ????

My immense indecision regarding Elo this game should be clear. It's because it's genuine and I don't know what to make of her. I constantly have been shifting between thinking she is bad to thinking she sounds really genuine and is just making scummy-seeming posts at face value. Right now I'm somewhere in between.

Props to whoever the baddies are in this game because I have no fucking clue who you are.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#647

Post by Tangrowth »

I have to finalize my vote now because we are boarding momentarily and I won't land in Cincinnati until not long after the vote is over. Fuck. I just don't know what to do. It probably doesn't matter anyway because f either quin or (probably) INH is Town and they are voting for me then we have lost this game.

I guess I'll vote Elo. Ugh.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#648

Post by Quin »

MovingPictures07 wrote:Props to whoever the baddies are in this game because I have no fucking clue who you are.
Neither do I. If it's not you, anyway. They deserve this win if that's the case :haha:

I'm definitely voting a hatchling, and I don't think it's going to be INH. So either you or Eloh.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#649

Post by Quin »

MovingPictures07 wrote:
Quin wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:I'm not sure what to do. This has been a tough game. And we don't even have a single mafia flip so I hate having nothing tangible by which to judge interactions. I suppose I'll hold off on my vote to see what you all think, continue to mull over all of this, and make some brief time for this tomorrow, but don't expect anything from me other than quick phone posting while I'm at the airport or something.
I guess if I had to vote literally at this very moment, it'd be for Elo or Sorsha. I'm going to drop a vote on Sorsha for now.

Sorsha, please come in to this game and provide your suspicions and thoughts in length when you can. Thanks.
I don't like this vote. Aside from you, there are three hatchlings left; Me, INH and Eloh. If you're not bad, then you should know that there is a confirmed baddie among Eloh, INH and myself. Yet you're voting outside of us, where the probability of there even being a single scum there is unknown. You've been making the point that we're in LYLO more than anybody else and yet you're the one taking a risk by choosing the option with an unknown percentage of flipping a baddie, instead of the one where you have between at least a 33% chance.

I voted MP, and I think Eloh is your teammate.
Oh, I didn't think about it that way. I suppose you're right hat mathematically it makes more sense to limit my scope to the Hatch, but the problem is that we don't know where the other two (?) baddies are, so it's possible that all three were at the hatch (you, Elo, INH), but also possible that two were at the beach and only one at the hatch, making it better to focus on beach folks. There's too much uncertainty. I would rather focus on who is objectively scummy and go from there.

But if I feel about equally about Elo and Sorsha, I should have voted Elo due to the confirmed at least one at the hatch and since I was at the hatch, you're right. I wasn't thinking of that.
I don't think not knowing where the other two baddies are is a problem you need to care about when you have a one-in-three shot of lynching a bad hatchling and at worst a 0 percent chance of lynching a bad beachbody. I think you slipped up.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Lost Again Mafia (Season 2) - Day 4

#650

Post by Spacedaisy »

I am faced with this following situation. I am very certain Alex is civ. I am fairly certain Epi is civ. I feel like Quin is likely civ judging by his ISOs. I trusted Epi's assessment of Elo yesterday despite my own misgivings on it and that did not work out well for us when DF flipped civ. If I eliminate Alex, Epi and Quin by PoE I have my baddies in INH Sorsha and Elo. I'm voting Elo with MP.
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