Hogwarts Mafia - END

[JaggedJimmyJay]

It was clear, I am saying that you have been guilty of the very same.

Angry civilian reactions don't take into account that the person they are reacting to are possibly Mafia, ever. It is a common theme and it is commonly called out in the way that you just did, rarely rendering a positive result.

I don't know if you follow the point.

For nutella to be arrogant, even if it was just an angry comment on your part, implies that she believed she had unique insight about you based upon her skills (and her confidence in her skills). That would imply that her read on you is a read and not something fake.

So, she'd be a civilian in that world. Yes?

Holy fuck, of course I follow the god damned point. I am saying that when civilians get angry at other posters they don't usually go "oh wait she might be Mafia, better adjust my off the cuff angry reaction" because humans don't do that ever.

Did you fuck up, Mac? Did you fuck up?

[MacDougall]

I don't think that is comparable Jay because I actually wasn't going to reveal how I felt about you until you insisted upon me revealing my train of thought whereas Colin's comment was in immediate retort to my voting of him.

I don't think your "suspicion" of me existed until five minutes ago.

As for the other kills here are some possibilities:

1. The two dead mafia are civilian vigilante kills and the dead civs are Mafia kills
2. The two dead mafia are serial killer kills and the dead civs are Mafia kills
3. The two dead mafia are dead civilians killed by Mafia and the Mafia had a limited number of additional kills of this nature
4. The two dead mafia are millers
5. Any combination of the aforementioned

Forgive me for being skeptical but I just am too cynical to believe that the consecutive dead Mafia night kills are pure and perfect and there is nothing to worry about. If it seems to good to be true it usually is. And frankly I refuse to believe a vigilante would use their kills the way they did either.

"Possibilities" is close to meaningless. Which of those, from 1-5, is the most probable given what is written about the game setup in this thread?

All things are meaningless.

My suspicion of you has been present in every game that we have ever played. I never trust you. I have been suspicious of you since the day you were born.

I would say the most probable is number 5 actually.

There are secrets in the death eaters abilities. It makes flavour sense for them to be able to put the dark mark on dead civs or something of that nature.

[MacDougall]

It was clear, I am saying that you have been guilty of the very same.

Angry civilian reactions don't take into account that the person they are reacting to are possibly Mafia, ever. It is a common theme and it is commonly called out in the way that you just did, rarely rendering a positive result.

I don't know if you follow the point.

For nutella to be arrogant, even if it was just an angry comment on your part, implies that she believed she had unique insight about you based upon her skills (and her confidence in her skills). That would imply that her read on you is a read and not something fake.

So, she'd be a civilian in that world. Yes?

Holy fuck, of course I follow the god damned point. I am saying that when civilians get angry at other posters they don't usually go "oh wait she might be Mafia, better adjust my off the cuff angry reaction" because humans don't do that ever.

Did you fuck up, Mac? Did you fuck up?

No, I didn't fuck up.

Notwithstanding that I never fuck up when I am Mafia. It's only when I am Mafia that I actually do meticulously proof my posts before I read them, and I never let myself angry post when I am Mafia. Not legitimately.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

No, I didn't fuck up.

Notwithstanding that I never fuck up when I am Mafia. It's only when I am Mafia that I actually do meticulously proof my posts before I read them, and I never let myself angry post when I am Mafia. Not legitimately.

Every time I tell you I think scumslips are stupid, you tell me about how often you scumslip.

[MacDougall]

It is my place in this game to be the voice of contradiction and doubt. That is the purpose I have chosen for myself. To ensure that we don't just walk down the well lit garden path into the jaws of death itself.

[MacDougall]

No, I didn't fuck up.

Notwithstanding that I never fuck up when I am Mafia. It's only when I am Mafia that I actually do meticulously proof my posts before I read them, and I never let myself angry post when I am Mafia. Not legitimately.

Every time I tell you I think scumslips are stupid, you tell me about how often you scumslip.

Well I don't know what to say. You've hounded civilian Mac into a situation where you've caught me out in a lie. Kudos, only you could accomplish such feats.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[mention]MacDougall[/mention], so seriously though, why Colin? Gimme the deets.

[MacDougall]

[mention]JaggedJimmyJay[/mention] I feel like Colin is present enough to hide in plain sight and isn't really contributing to the in therad analysis going on in a way that matches up with the frequency of his attendance. Though this can be said for Long Con, Quin, Jack and Epignosis too. Perhaps this is hypocrisy but I only have my own role card. I also will note that I am just shit slinging a bit.

I have two different perspectives on this game that adjust my train of thought somewhat:

1. The scum team has Jay and/or nutella on it
2. The scum team does not

If I can figure out the truth of which of these is accurate it will go along way to me solving the game.

I think that historically I have a tendency to misread you Jay because of my natural cynicism towards other loud players, you always being this. Golden also cops this from me. Because I am self aware of this flaw I also have a tendency to ignore my instincts and try to focus elsewhere until something occurs that makes me feel a need to vocalise my feelings. In this particular game my primary suspect all along has been nutella but I am giving her the benefit of the doubt because she is so prominent. My suspicion of you is far less than my suspicion of her.

If I could choose a lynch today I would lynch nutella, but I have not been present enough, not focused enough to have any good case, and I was trying to avoid having to rationalise what amounts to tone and gut in any meaningful way by just outright not saying anything of substance until I was able to actually formulate a case.

If I were to be brutally honest I think that it's quite possible that you and Epignosis are possibly Mafia together this time out on account of the fact that they aren't engaging one another very meaningfully.

Tl;dr words that someone is invariably going to reply to with an unexplained vote on me as though this makes me obvscum, to which I will get extra mad and then storm off leaving myself to get mislynched.

[MacDougall]

So to summarise.

Leave me alone.

[Quin]

[VOTE: macdougall] aubergine

Spoiler: show

loljk

[Quin]

seriously tho let's lynch [VOTE: nutella] aubergine

[timmer]

Skimming through to catch up... Mac's focus on the chance that we are not in fact down two dead baddies is interesting, to say the least, but I'm not sure where to go with it . I'll admit I'm at a loss in the game right now... my suspicions have flopped, my thoughts on lc last night make no sense to me now, I'm going to watch the pats/packers game and then regroup later tonight.

[Quin]

Janitoring is possible if Polyjuice potion is a hidden dark art thing. I would actually be surprised if it wasn't in the game given that it's such an important thing in the books.

[Jackofhearts2005]

The two dead Mafia were both night kills btw so that leads me to doubt their legitimacy quite frankly. I wouldn't be surprised if they were fake flips.

Is there evidence in support of this theory? Question is for everybody, not just Mac.

Not really.

There have been multiple kills. The idea that a vig missed and scum killed and forged some flips vs vig just hitting correctly is not appealing.

What is the actual case against Mac? Cause it seems like Jay and Nutella are just taking advantage of a busy player who of course won’t have a good answer for them. Feels like Jay vs me in AssClass, which was civ/civ, too.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Mafia does have Role secrets though.

[MacDougall]

Skimming through to catch up... Mac's focus on the chance that we are not in fact down two dead baddies is interesting, to say the least, but I'm not sure where to go with it . I'll admit I'm at a loss in the game right now... my suspicions have flopped, my thoughts on lc last night make no sense to me now, I'm going to watch the pats/packers game and then regroup later tonight.

Heyyyy this is that scum tell that Russtifinko pointed out in that game we played a while ago. The Adolf Hitler scum tell.

[Jackofhearts2005]

The what?

[MacDougall]

This was one of my favourite recent posts. Russ absolutely nailed someone with this.

1. MP will remember that in high school English class, Mr. Goldfuss once told us about an analysis that was done on Hitler's speeches. A univeristy group had apparently analyzed a large number of them line by line and found that nearly every one had a net "opinion content" (I'm paraphrasing here) of 0. What they meant was, every time Hitler expressed an opinion in a speech, he offset it by saying the opposite thing with about the same intensity somewhere else in the speech. This made him very appealing, because everyone in a crowd could find something to agree with him about. (Mr. Goldfuss was weird, and recommended we try to follow this model for some speeches.) Mr. Goldfuss also lied a lot, and it's possible he made up that story entirely, but the core of it applies really well to some posts by Alien. Let's play a game: I'll post an Alien quote, highlight anything where he expresses a positive opinion in green, and highlight anything with a negative opinion in red. I think we'll find quite a few offsetting posts.

[MacDougall]

Skimming through to catch up... Mac's focus on the chance that we are not in fact down two dead baddies is interesting, to say the least, but I'm not sure where to go with it . I'll admit I'm at a loss in the game right now... my suspicions have flopped, my thoughts on lc last night make no sense to me now, I'm going to watch the pats/packers game and then regroup later tonight.

This is exactly that.

Timmer's post is designed to make me feel good (humouring me) but at the same time those that are doubtful of me also feel good (doubting me). It's a massive hedge. It's exactly what Russ used to nail Infected Alien.

[MacDougall]

Okay, so reading owner's iso, I'd say he really and oddly blindered onto DH very early, and for what seems like entirely prev-game reasons. This allows him to talk a lot about suspicions towards sh, but without having to defend anything he says because, hey, is based on last game. And when pressed about it, he just versions of iunno I just feel it...

This can be a baddie move, but it can also just be blindering which ive done in the past. Those who know owner well, do you get any kind of alignment read from this angle?

Another example of the same.

[MacDougall]

Just did a quick skim on lunch break. My day is consisting of grinding chunks of people into pulp, so time is short.

Whoever had mentioned that my posts were hedgy, you are absolutely right. I always stress that my thoughts on day 1 are based on very little substance, because it's day 1, so I use a lot of mights, mays and coulds. Get used to it, my opinions don't form up better until about day 3.

Ah I see Timmer has already tried to fend this off.

[MacDougall]

Lol now nobody wants to post. How annoying.

[Quin]

This was one of my favourite recent posts. Russ absolutely nailed someone with this.

1. MP will remember that in high school English class, Mr. Goldfuss once told us about an analysis that was done on Hitler's speeches. A univeristy group had apparently analyzed a large number of them line by line and found that nearly every one had a net "opinion content" (I'm paraphrasing here) of 0. What they meant was, every time Hitler expressed an opinion in a speech, he offset it by saying the opposite thing with about the same intensity somewhere else in the speech. This made him very appealing, because everyone in a crowd could find something to agree with him about. (Mr. Goldfuss was weird, and recommended we try to follow this model for some speeches.) Mr. Goldfuss also lied a lot, and it's possible he made up that story entirely, but the core of it applies really well to some posts by Alien. Let's play a game: I'll post an Alien quote, highlight anything where he expresses a positive opinion in green, and highlight anything with a negative opinion in red. I think we'll find quite a few offsetting posts.

I caught scum Fredwood this way in Phenon.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Okay, so reading owner's iso, I'd say he really and oddly blindered onto DH very early, and for what seems like entirely prev-game reasons. This allows him to talk a lot about suspicions towards sh, but without having to defend anything he says because, hey, is based on last game. And when pressed about it, he just versions of iunno I just feel it...

This can be a baddie move, but it can also just be blindering which ive done in the past. Those who know owner well, do you get any kind of alignment read from this angle?

The OG timmer hedge, and still a large component of my suspicion of him.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[VOTE: nutella] aubergine

[ColinIsCool]

I’ll reiterate, to anybody who wants to lynch me ... go ahead. Just give me that Phoenix right afterward.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[mention]MacDougall[/mention], find the bad people and the good people.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I’ll reiterate, to anybody who wants to lynch me ... go ahead. Just give me that Phoenix right afterward.

So long as you are alive this is meaningless. Why lynch Jack?

[Quin]

I’ll reiterate, to anybody who wants to lynch me ... go ahead. Just give me that Phoenix right afterward.

kinda do want to lynch you now

[Quin]

Nobody cares about Colin right now. Why is he throwing in the towel?

[Quin]

aside from mac the most recent suspicion of colin that i know of (from looking at his iso) came from nutella as a "maybe" while presenting three others as clearer targets for scrutiny. There's no way in hell colin legitimately buckles under that pressure.

[DharmaHelper]

I'm just glad my fun word "garbo" is catching on in the mafia lexicon. Boom.

[Long Con]

Maybe he wants the perks that come with being a Confirmed Civ. He could reasonably expect protection from kills. I don't know, it's pretty weird. I'm sure the Phoenix Down owner has a plan, no need to "lynch a Civ" to get a good target. Maybe he's a baddie with the ability to appear Civ upon their lynch. Get lynched - look Civ - use up rez - PROFIT!!!

[Long Con]

I'm just glad my fun word "garbo" is catching on in the mafia lexicon. Boom.

I think "primo garbo" is particularly strong.

[MacDougall]

@MacDougall, find the bad people and the good people.

INH interacts very little with scum teammates. It's his meta. He is not someone that dances around with wifom distancing tricks from what I have ever seen.

Who did he interact with exactly zero times?

[MacDougall]

I'm just glad my fun word "garbo" is catching on in the mafia lexicon. Boom.

Sorry mate. Wilgy is the progenitor.

search.php?keywords=garbo

[JaggedJimmyJay]

MacDougall, find the bad people and the good people.

INH interacts very little with scum teammates. It's his meta. He is not someone that dances around with wifom distancing tricks from what I have ever seen.

Who did he interact with exactly zero times?

Exactly zero
Colin
poutanko

Functionally zero if not literally
Bullzeye/speedchuck
MacDougall
Quin

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Note that refers to INH's posts alone, not to the posts of the players listed.

[Quin]

Maybe he's a baddie with the ability to appear Civ upon their lynch. Get lynched - look Civ - use up rez - PROFIT!!!

This.

[MacDougall]

INH- Eh...stop worrying about what other people have to say about you and do something worthwhile with your life, unlike David Lynch.

This is just good advice for me in general.

This interaction is the most eyebrow raising because it almost seems like in thread coaching.

No interactions with:

Colin
DH
Glor
Poutanko
Quin

Poutanko and Glor makes sense. The other three not so much.

If INH is really Mafia, I'd clear nutella, lunalee, Jay and Jack.

[MacDougall]

MacDougall, find the bad people and the good people.

INH interacts very little with scum teammates. It's his meta. He is not someone that dances around with wifom distancing tricks from what I have ever seen.

Who did he interact with exactly zero times?

Exactly zero
Colin
poutanko

Functionally zero if not literally
Bullzeye/speedchuck
MacDougall
Quin

So why is my interaction with him functionally zero and not Jack's which is almost identical in that it was a one emoji reply to a sarcastic insult? Like Jack and my interactions with INH were legitimately as identical as it can get without being literally identical.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

MacDougall, find the bad people and the good people.

INH interacts very little with scum teammates. It's his meta. He is not someone that dances around with wifom distancing tricks from what I have ever seen.

Who did he interact with exactly zero times?

Exactly zero
Colin
poutanko

Functionally zero if not literally
Bullzeye/speedchuck
MacDougall
Quin

So why is my interaction with him functionally zero and not Jack's which is almost identical in that it was a one emoji reply to a sarcastic insult? Like Jack and my interactions with INH were legitimately as identical as it can get without being literally identical.

Yeah him too.

[DharmaHelper]

INH- Eh...stop worrying about what other people have to say about you and do something worthwhile with your life, unlike David Lynch.

This is just good advice for me in general.

This interaction is the most eyebrow raising because it almost seems like in thread coaching.

No interactions with:

Colin
DH
Glor
Poutanko
Quin

Poutanko and Glor makes sense. The other three not so much.

If INH is really Mafia, I'd clear nutella, lunalee, Jay and Jack.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

If INH is really Mafia, I'd clear nutella, lunalee, Jay and Jack.

Why Jack?

[MacDougall]

If INH is really Mafia, I'd clear nutella, lunalee, Jay and Jack.

Why Jack?

I don't see Mafia Jack saying what he said about Mafia teammate INH.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

If INH is really Mafia, I'd clear nutella, lunalee, Jay and Jack.

Why Jack?

I don't see Mafia Jack saying what he said about Mafia teammate INH.

Why the other people, for that matter?

[MacDougall]

@ColinIsCool, as this day phase began you provided a few examples of mafia-INH from past games to describe his treatment of his teammates. I'd like to see how you apply that information to the present game.

Unfortunately I didn’t find anything that excited me. It’s tough to say whether he was bussing or not too because the UPick game didn’t see him have to. Ultimately a null exercise.

Would Mafia Colin have gone to the effort, unprovoked, to start building a distancing/bussing case on INH and then back off it so tepidly?

If INH looked like getting lynched I suspect Colin would have pointed at these posts for cred. It's a bad look imo. It seems like a hedge designed to make him look good in the event of an INH lynch without getting himself into the position of having to actually push it.

[MacDougall]

If INH is really Mafia, I'd clear nutella, lunalee, Jay and Jack.

Why Jack?

I don't see Mafia Jack saying what he said about Mafia teammate INH.

Why the other people, for that matter?

Sincere interactions.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

ColinIsCool, as this day phase began you provided a few examples of mafia-INH from past games to describe his treatment of his teammates. I'd like to see how you apply that information to the present game.

Unfortunately I didn’t find anything that excited me. It’s tough to say whether he was bussing or not too because the UPick game didn’t see him have to. Ultimately a null exercise.

Would Mafia Colin have gone to the effort, unprovoked, to start building a distancing/bussing case on INH and then back off it so tepidly?

If INH looked like getting lynched I suspect Colin would have pointed at these posts for cred. It's a bad look imo. It seems like a hedge designed to make him look good in the event of an INH lynch without getting himself into the position of having to actually push it.

I was about to say something here, but I'll let Colin do answer to it first. [mention]ColinIsCool[/mention] go

[MacDougall]

I'm going back to shit posting now.