Mountain Mafia [END]

[Kylemii]

huh interesting.

gimme two town reads and two scum reads. please and thanks

You do it too.

[Epignosis]

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

Hypocrisy.

[Sloonei]

huh interesting.

gimme two town reads and two scum reads. please and thanks

Spacedaisy, Nutella
Jay, epignosis

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

You've been talking with Epi for a while and I've been loosely following along. what is the crux of your suspicion of him?

[Sloonei]

huh interesting.

gimme two town reads and two scum reads. please and thanks

You do it too.

Town: Epignosis, spacedaisy
scum: Jay, you

[Kylemii]

huh interesting.

gimme two town reads and two scum reads. please and thanks

Spacedaisy, Nutella
Jay, epignosis

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

You've been talking with Epi for a while and I've been loosely following along. what is the crux of your suspicion of him?

I mostly named him cus he was fresh in my mind and your wording implied you wanted answers quickly. Our discussion has nothing to do with him being a suspect, I'm actually just interested in the philosophy, and I don't even think of him as a big suspect.

He's been neutral but leaning slightly towards mafia since he came after me for voting Mesk when he also was going to vote for Dom. I understand his Ralph Waldo Emerson anecdote but I don't think Ralphie was talking about opinions you state within the space of 24 hours.

[nutella]

Good philosophy. "Sometimes a hypocrite is nothing more than a man in the process of changing."

[Elohcin]

I wish you'd have lynched me, even! I wouldn't have even been mad. That would have been more useful than a Mesk flip.

eeeeggghhhhhwwwwwgh

If you're defending this, I hate you too.

Oh you voted for Dom.

Please tell me, how you thought a Dom flip would assist us in scumhunting more than any other player.

If you're telling me after 2600 posts itt you didn't have any better leads than Dom, then you're scum.

Screw you mate. I already put my thoughts down on the infolynch stuff earlier. Look for it. I'm not going to be helpful while you're being all self-righteous and crap. Reminds me of stuff I would do as mafia, too. Coming in after a lynch and being all strong-willed, condemning, and self-righteous. you aren't doing yourself any favors with this post train of snit.

As for the "eeeeggghhhhhwwwwwgh" post, I was reacting to your "I wish I had died instead." Bull crap for a few reasons.
1. You, if town, are more useful than mesk right now.
2. You, if town, know your alignment is town and that there was a chance mesk was scum.
3. I've seen townies prop the perspective that "townies don't need much self-preservation." That's stupid. I will call it stupid in every game I see it, and I will be wary of any posts that say, esp. after the fact, "Man, you should have just killed me instead. Because I'm totally town and don't care if I die. riiight? It would have been better because info." Heck, mesk could have said the same thing if we switched to you. "Oh, you shoud have lynched me. I'm town so I don't care if I live, and I wouldn't have been as big a loss. Because I'm totes town. Riiiggghhhttt???"

So yeah, this post is crap and managed to, along with all the posturing you're doing right now, squash my townread on you.
You wanna act all self-righteous and condemning? Here, have some conflict.
(And for the record, if I was here at EOD, I wouldn't have been on Mesk. Probably J3.)

You look very town in this post.

I agree and its throwing me for a loop because he is convincing. I don't know who to be suspicious of.

[Kylemii]

Town: Epignosis, spacedaisy
scum: Jay, you

I'd like to hear an explanation on 3 of those.

[Epignosis]

huh interesting.

gimme two town reads and two scum reads. please and thanks

Spacedaisy, Nutella
Jay, epignosis

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

You've been talking with Epi for a while and I've been loosely following along. what is the crux of your suspicion of him?

I mostly named him cus he was fresh in my mind and your wording implied you wanted answers quickly. Our discussion has nothing to do with him being a suspect, I'm actually just interested in the philosophy, and I don't even think of him as a big suspect.

He's been neutral but leaning slightly towards mafia since he came after me for voting Mesk when he also was going to vote for Dom. I understand his Ralph Waldo Emerson anecdote but I don't think Ralphie was talking about opinions you state within the space of 24 hours.

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

[Sloonei]

huh interesting.

gimme two town reads and two scum reads. please and thanks

Spacedaisy, Nutella
Jay, epignosis

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

You've been talking with Epi for a while and I've been loosely following along. what is the crux of your suspicion of him?

I mostly named him cus he was fresh in my mind and your wording implied you wanted answers quickly. Our discussion has nothing to do with him being a suspect, I'm actually just interested in the philosophy, and I don't even think of him as a big suspect.

He's been neutral but leaning slightly towards mafia since he came after me for voting Mesk when he also was going to vote for Dom. I understand his Ralph Waldo Emerson anecdote but I don't think Ralphie was talking about opinions you state within the space of 24 hours.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

[Kylemii]

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

Hypocrisy.

it's different cus he was rude about it and interrupted my philosophy lesson.

[Kylemii]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

[Sloonei]

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

Hypocrisy.

it's different cus he was rude about it and interrupted my philosophy lesson.

i said please

[Sloonei]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

Epi cast his vote for Dom early in the day phase when the other leading bandwagon was a player he firmly reads as town and with some stated precedent for voting for Dom.

You voted for Mesk because everyone else was doing it at the last second.

[Kylemii]

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

Hypocrisy.

it's different cus he was rude about it and interrupted my philosophy lesson.

i said please

please doesn't automatically make something polite, this isn't the 1840's

[Sloonei]

Town: Epignosis, spacedaisy
scum: Jay, you

I'd like to hear an explanation on 3 of those.

Epi is visibly trying to solve the game. I don't know why I wouldn't read him as town.

Jay is bad because he's not seeking to generate content, he's just trying to trap people in his arguments.
You're bad because I've been reading you as town all game and I feel lost.

[Sloonei]

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

Hypocrisy.

it's different cus he was rude about it and interrupted my philosophy lesson.

i said please

please doesn't automatically make something polite, this isn't the 1840's

with sugar on top

[Epignosis]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

No. It isn't. I am a highly successful Mafia player and I don't do shit to gain "information" (as you apparently use the term).

If you come back and tell me that "information" is somebody voted for a guy who flipped mafia, I will tell you that isn't information. That's a fact that everyone knows and everyone is free to interpret differently.

You have not given me ONE PIECE of information from the Mesk lynch that is unique from what we might have learned had Dom gotten lynched instead. You've provided what you think, who voted where- so fucking what. None of that is information. It's opinion. It's hot takes. It's garbage. It's whatever you deem it to be.

[Epignosis]

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

Hypocrisy.

it's different cus he was rude about it and interrupted my philosophy lesson.

i said please

please doesn't automatically make something polite, this isn't the 1840's

That's good news for you. If it were, I would have a literal rope.

[Kylemii]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

Epi cast his vote for Dom early in the day phase when the other leading bandwagon was a player he firmly reads as town and with some stated precedent for voting for Dom.

You voted for Mesk because everyone else was doing it at the last second.

sorry I guess I didn't realize that voting for someone I've been low-key suspecting and pushing for most of the game is somehow more suspicious than is actually just "doing it cus everyone else was doing it"

[Sloonei]

Extrapolating information is the silver lining we can pull out of the aftermath of a lynch, if we put the work in. If we're lynching purely for information, we're lynching for the wrong reasons.

[Kylemii]

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

Hypocrisy.

it's different cus he was rude about it and interrupted my philosophy lesson.

i said please

please doesn't automatically make something polite, this isn't the 1840's

with sugar on top

much better

[Sloonei]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

Epi cast his vote for Dom early in the day phase when the other leading bandwagon was a player he firmly reads as town and with some stated precedent for voting for Dom.

You voted for Mesk because everyone else was doing it at the last second.

sorry I guess I didn't realize that voting for someone I've been low-key suspecting and pushing for most of the game is somehow more suspicious than is actually just "doing it cus everyone else was doing it"

Did you vote for mesk for information or because you suspected her?

[Epignosis]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

Epi cast his vote for Dom early in the day phase when the other leading bandwagon was a player he firmly reads as town and with some stated precedent for voting for Dom.

You voted for Mesk because everyone else was doing it at the last second.

sorry I guess I didn't realize that voting for someone I've been low-key suspecting and pushing for most of the game is somehow more suspicious than is actually just "doing it cus everyone else was doing it"

If you are a civilian, why are you "low-key" suspecting someone?

[Epignosis]

Extrapolating information is the silver lining we can pull out of the aftermath of a lynch, if we put the work in. If we're lynching purely for information, we're lynching for the wrong reasons.

[Kylemii]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

No. It isn't. I am a highly successful Mafia player and I don't do shit to gain "information" (as you apparently use the term).

If you come back and tell me that "information" is somebody voted for a guy who flipped mafia, I will tell you that isn't information. That's a fact that everyone knows and everyone is free to interpret differently.

You have not given me ONE PIECE of information from the Mesk lynch that is unique from what we might have learned had Dom gotten lynched instead. You've provided what you think, who voted where- so fucking what. None of that is information. It's opinion. It's hot takes. It's garbage. It's whatever you deem it to be.

Epig what do you think "information" is? Do you think that vote analysis isn't part of gathering information? Do you think that meta reads aren't part of information?

I don't believe that you don't do things in mafia with the intention of getting information with them, I'm pretty sure you're just not agreeing with me on the definition of what information is.

[Kylemii]

Did you vote for mesk for information or because you suspected her?

Both things. Have I seriously not made that clear?

If you are a civilian, why are you "low-key" suspecting someone?

It was her first game here, I didn't want to lynch her right away. I wanted to give her a chance, but I suspected her from day one when she buddied me.

All this information is readily available to both of you if you want to just search my posts in this thread for Mesk mentions.

[Sloonei]

Here's an example of what I am talking about RE: Jay not generating content

Wow you guys went ahead and vote me under no premise?

I could just not answer, is that better?

Gah. Whatever

Given that you're not caught up, based on what do you assert that your voters have acted "under no premise"?

IVE DONE NOTHING BUT VOTE FOR NUTELLA, JAY

I would argue that you made 15 posts prior to the protest I quoted there in addition to voting for nutella, and that those 15 posts serve as a premise which can justify a vote for you. You're not void of content here, but there's not much to inspire within that content (hi Quin).

Well you can expect more of me not being here.

I’m stepping away for the night.

Do what you wish, I don’t care

You're not leading the tally presently; there's no need to take your ball and go home. I'm not talking to you here just to irritate you.

This was Day 2 when the pressure was mounting against sprityo (now dunya). Sprit shows up and objects to the votes, and Jay's response is to reframe the argument against him and push him right back into it. He doesn't invite sprit to offer his thoughts on anything. And then he caps it off by saying he's not trying to irritate sprit. I don't believe that. I see a Jay whose primary focus is on digging sprit's hole deeper rather than allowing him a chance to get out of it.

[Epignosis]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

No. It isn't. I am a highly successful Mafia player and I don't do shit to gain "information" (as you apparently use the term).

If you come back and tell me that "information" is somebody voted for a guy who flipped mafia, I will tell you that isn't information. That's a fact that everyone knows and everyone is free to interpret differently.

You have not given me ONE PIECE of information from the Mesk lynch that is unique from what we might have learned had Dom gotten lynched instead. You've provided what you think, who voted where- so fucking what. None of that is information. It's opinion. It's hot takes. It's garbage. It's whatever you deem it to be.

Epig what do you think "information" is? Do you think that vote analysis isn't part of gathering information? Do you think that meta reads aren't part of information?

I don't believe that you don't do things in mafia with the intention of getting information with them, I'm pretty sure you're just not agreeing with me on the definition of what information is.

I don't care about discussing what "information" is.

That isn't my problem with you.

My problem with you is that you are content with lynching someone because it will "help you" in the future.

Fuck that.

Lynch someone who is bad.

[Epignosis]

Did you vote for mesk for information or because you suspected her?

Both things. Have I seriously not made that clear?

If you are a civilian, why are you "low-key" suspecting someone?

It was her first game here, I didn't want to lynch her right away. I wanted to give her a chance, but I suspected her from day one when she buddied me.

All this information is readily available to both of you if you want to just search my posts in this thread for Mesk mentions.

How did she "buddy" you? She was a fucking a civilian. You lynched her because you were absolutely 100% wrong about her intentions and you can't be assed to say so OR you are bad. Which is it?

I swear to God people around here need some Gatorade.

[Sloonei]

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

kyle, I didn't get an answer to this.

[Kylemii]

I don't care about discussing what "information" is.

That isn't my problem with you.

My problem with you is that you are content with lynching someone because it will "help you" in the future.

Fuck that.

Lynch someone who is bad.

Oh my god Epi just go read my posts and stop being difficult. I suspected Mesk from Day 1.

[Sloonei]

Kyle, why do you suspect Jay?

[Kylemii]

]

How did she "buddy" you? She was a fucking a civilian. You lynched her because you were absolutely 100% wrong about her intentions and you can't be assed to say so OR you are bad. Which is it?

I swear to God people around here need some Gatorade.

Her first post was talking about how she definitely read me as town and that she wanted to be best friends how is that not what buddying means?

[Kylemii]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

I responded here.

[Sloonei]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

I responded here.

You did. By asking me something else. I answered yours, care to answer mine?

[Kylemii]

Kyle, why do you suspect Jay?

because of what happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of the EoD 2.

[Sloonei]

Kyle, why do you suspect Jay?

because of what happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of the EoD 2.

What happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of EoD 2?
Do you mean Day 3?

[Kylemii]

You did. By asking me something else. I answered yours, care to answer mine?

I see. My response to that responded the original question as well.

You already know why I voted for Mesk. I don't know why Epig voted for Dom but the fact that he did and then came at me for voting for Mesk seemed to be a contradiction, which is why I addressed it.

[Kylemii]

Kyle, why do you suspect Jay?

because of what happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of the EoD 2.

What happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of EoD 2?
Do you mean Day 3?

Yeah, day 3. Jay had the most votes for a moment and then suddenly Mesk did again.

[Sloonei]

Kyle, why do you suspect Jay?

because of what happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of the EoD 2.

What happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of EoD 2?
Do you mean Day 3?

Yeah, day 3. Jay had the most votes for a moment and then suddenly Mesk did again.

Okay. Why does this mean Jay was bad? 5 people voted for Mesk: me, you, quin, jay, and wilgy. I was the deciding vote. Your premise suggests at least 2 of these 5 are bad boys. Jay and who else?

[Sloonei]

And how does Dom (malakim) fit into this theory?

[Kylemii]

You did. By asking me something else. I answered yours, care to answer mine?

I see. My response to that responded the original question as well.

You already know why I voted for Mesk. I don't know why Epig voted for Dom but the fact that he did and then came at me for voting for Mesk seemed to be a contradiction, which is why I addressed it.

A contradiction because his reason for complaint was specifically related to the amount of content linked Mesk and by extension the mafia connections to her that would have been revealed if she'd flipped bad. AKA the scumhunting information that Epig says isn't important.

[Kylemii]

Hey Sloonei no offense but I'm not going to spend all night talking to you when you can find like 60% of the answers your looking for by doing your own footwork

[Sloonei]

You did. By asking me something else. I answered yours, care to answer mine?

I see. My response to that responded the original question as well.

You already know why I voted for Mesk. I don't know why Epig voted for Dom but the fact that he did and then came at me for voting for Mesk seemed to be a contradiction, which is why I addressed it.

I do not see this as a contradiction and I wouldn't object to Epi's behavior even if I did. I often grill people for doing things similar to my own actions. I know why I do the things that I do; I don't know why you do the things that you do.

[Sloonei]

Hey Sloonei no offense but I'm not going to spend all night talking to you when you can find like 60% of the answers your looking for by doing your own footwork

If you've already covered anything that I ask about, please point me in the right direction.
I was gettig nowhere in my attempts to catch up on everything that's been said and I always prefer to generate my own content by talking through things with other people anyway. I'm just trying to get a sense for where you're at and also help develop your thoughts so that they're more clear to me.

[Kylemii]

Okay. Why does this mean Jay was bad? 5 people voted for Mesk: me, you, quin, jay, and wilgy. I was the deciding vote. Your premise suggests at least 2 of these 5 are bad boys. Jay and who else?

Idk dude you're putting the cart before the horse. The idea is that it could have been a potential panic save, but I don't even know if it makes sense as a save or just a random vote movement because it's the night phase and I haven't looked into it yet.

And how does Dom (malakim) fit into this theory?

What?

[Kylemii]

Hey Sloonei no offense but I'm not going to spend all night talking to you when you can find like 60% of the answers your looking for by doing your own footwork

If you've already covered anything that I ask about, please point me in the right direction.
I was gettig nowhere in my attempts to catch up on everything that's been said and I always prefer to generate my own content by talking through things with other people anyway. I'm just trying to get a sense for where you're at and also help develop your thoughts so that they're more clear to me.

I see, I guess I get it. I just wasn't really enjoying being grilled by both you and epi about things I've already explained.

[Sloonei]

Okay. Why does this mean Jay was bad? 5 people voted for Mesk: me, you, quin, jay, and wilgy. I was the deciding vote. Your premise suggests at least 2 of these 5 are bad boys. Jay and who else?

Idk dude you're putting the cart before the horse. The idea is that it could have been a potential panic save, but I don't even know if it makes sense as a save or just a random vote movement because it's the night phase and I haven't looked into it yet.

And how does Dom (malakim) fit into this theory?

What?

But you cited this as your reason for scum reading Jay. I'm only following your lead here. If you're unsure of how to read the EoD developments, how confident is that read?


I ask about Dom because he also was a leading vote-getter near the end of the day. If Jay might have been saved, why not Dom as well?

[Sloonei]

Hey Sloonei no offense but I'm not going to spend all night talking to you when you can find like 60% of the answers your looking for by doing your own footwork

If you've already covered anything that I ask about, please point me in the right direction.
I was gettig nowhere in my attempts to catch up on everything that's been said and I always prefer to generate my own content by talking through things with other people anyway. I'm just trying to get a sense for where you're at and also help develop your thoughts so that they're more clear to me.

I see, I guess I get it. I just wasn't really enjoying being grilled by both you and epi about things I've already explained.

if it helps, don't think of me as grilling you. Think of me as a lost 3-year-old who wants to know what mafia is. I play by asking questions.