[END] Pikmin Mafia

[Enrique]

I voted Simon, let's see how this shakes out, shall we? Tied it up for sig and Simon.

Why?

[Marmot]

MM is assuming I'm bad first and then making the evidence fit his conclusion. That's clear enough to me anyway.

Let's try again. Are you a boss?

[Sorsha]

Sorsha, what is your opinion on Epi's opinion of Simon? Do you think they are teammates or that Epi is trying to take advantage of his own son?

Also - is it normal for Scotty to gloss over accusations as scum or civ? because he focused on my post about how people were treating Simon but not the one about why he chose Simon over Epi

I agree with the logic ddl has broken down for us here:

On the Epi/Simon matter, there are 4 possibilities (thank God no SK):

They are both civs: and Epi is not as good at reading his son as he thinks he is. Can happen.

Only Simon is mafia: and Epi is right in his read. Can happen too.

Only Epi is mafia: eh... no. Like FZ pointed out, I can't see someone doing that with their own child. Maybe later in the game, but not on day 1. There is a line to be drawn on competitiveness.

They are both mafia: unlike the later, this one can be possible, because Simon actually benefits from it in a way, so it's not exactly a betrayal if they talk about it. My problem with it is that, unlike in Guess Who (where Epi was only arguing with me on day 1, and only make a strong push for a lynch after Roxy and G-Man did), in this game Epi can be easily pointed out as the main responsible for Simon getting any suspicion at all. He is even bringing RL evidence to support the case, showing how he is really determined to get Simon lynched, something a smart mafia player would actually avoid. This is looking less likely imo.

Either way, it depends on whether Epi can trust his own read on Simon or not. I dunno.

what happens if we lynch Simon and he comes back civ? Do we just move on to sig? Epi? I don't see epi doing this to his son if Simon was civ I guess. I don't want this thread to be focused on these three players forever and I haven't really been able to get past them so I'd like some kind of answer on the topic.

As for other suspects: I don't really have much at this point. Once I get to work I'm going to try to get some re-reading of day one/ the Zeebs lynch in to see if I come up with some. I'm getting some pretty good civ civs from a few players but I don't plan on spilling that right now. I'm just being too distracted by sig/epi/Simon right now.

Also I need some major caffeine, like in an IV stat!

[Simon]

Simon, what is your favorite animal?

Is it this cute little guy?
http://s1.postimg.org/na4eh83vv/dog.png

No actually. It's a hedgehog.

[DrWilgy]

I voted Simon, let's see how this shakes out, shall we? Tied it up for sig and Simon.

Let's play a game Daisy, what will you do now?

[DrWilgy]

Also, Simon, I'd reccomend voting Sig, otherwise you will surely die.

[Boomslang]

I'm gonna tie this up based on the backpedaling of sig, which strikes me as a really bad move, and because I don't think Simon deserves the lynch quite yet. *votes sig*

[Enrique]

I don't like this.

[Simon]

Hey SIMON, let's vote for your pop!

Simon, do you rat on your siblings? Are they older or younger than you?

I agree. I think Daddy's boss because he was quick in thinking that e and Sig are teammates.

I am the oldest sibling. I'm eight years old. My sister is six. She just had her birthday. My brother is three. I tell on them and boss them because I'm the oldest.

[Spacedaisy]

I voted Simon, let's see how this shakes out, shall we? Tied it up for sig and Simon.

Why?

Because I think Epi is civ who truly believes his son is bad. And I think there is some merit to his reasoning. And I also have mild suspicion of sig, so either way I think we might learn something.

[Typhoony]

I'm saving my vote to create the biggest distance possible between Simon and Sig. I'd very much prefer a Sig lynch fwiw, but a close lynch is a useless lynch in this game imo.

[Spacedaisy]

Hey SIMON, let's vote for your pop!

Simon, do you rat on your siblings? Are they older or younger than you?

I agree. I think Daddy's boss because he was quick in thinking that e and Sig are teammates.

I am the oldest sibling. I'm eight years old. My sister is six. She just had her birthday. My brother is three. I tell on them and boss them because I'm the oldest.

This post is like the cutest thing ever and makes it so hard to vote Simon, but I'm going to leave my vote there... I'm an awful persooooooooon!

[Enrique]

I voted Simon, let's see how this shakes out, shall we? Tied it up for sig and Simon.

Why?

Because I think Epi is civ who truly believes his son is bad. And I think there is some merit to his reasoning. And I also have mild suspicion of sig, so either way I think we might learn something.

So do I, but why would you tie it up?

[Spacedaisy]

I just explained why, I'm ok with either one right now so I would like to see how this shakes out.

[Epignosis]

MM is assuming I'm bad first and then making the evidence fit his conclusion. That's clear enough to me anyway.

Let's try again. Are you a boss?

That's a Boss. I'm a Brown.

[Marmot]

MM is assuming I'm bad first and then making the evidence fit his conclusion. That's clear enough to me anyway.

Let's try again. Are you a boss?

That's a Boss. I'm a Brown.

Did you move to Cleveland?

[sig]

Simon lets have fun, vote for Scotty with me and make it a three way tie. I'll address some things in a moment. First off did I say I would vote for Scotty/DDL? No what I said was out of these two and Epi one is mafia. I was willing to go with the thought EPi wasn't mafia, however I'm more confident that this isn't the case. I've also considered that Simon is civ I've said he could be a civ and Epi is bussing him, however it makes more sense for them both to be mafia.

So what you are saying is that you intentionally tried to dig your own grave to see who would bite?

Can you point out in your posts where you tried digging your own grave, ie what part of your posts would have been different if you did not have this plan?

If I was scum, I wouldn't have gone after Epi. I'm not the most aggressive scum player,and I certainly wouldn't have targeted a high profile civ who could rip to shreds an argument against him. The digging of my own grave was targeting Epi and pursuing him, as well as the way I answered his accusation that Simonand I are teammates.

sig's immediate reaction to me linking him and Simon together was to call me bad and say that I'm trying to set him up.

But why doesn't sig make the same allowance for Simon?

Doesn't happen. sig instead jumps to the idea that I'm on the same team as Simon, and that I'm throwing Simon under the bus.

Your trying to play the emotional card here. My point still stands your not really pushing for your own kids lynch, you're pushing for my lynch with the theory Sig/Simon are scum. I flip civ then Simon will look cleaner.

Also right back at ya about being confident people are baddie,you somehow nailed 2/3 of the scum team.

Linki: TAaaaaa Da I said this at the beginning of the phase, Epi would end this phase lynching me based on a weak reasoning or my reaction post, his lynch of Simon was a smokescreen vote.

At 8:35pm EST-

Epi is scum, lynching Zebra is a waste of time.

At 8:51pm EST-

It makes no sense what so ever for me as scum to target a player like Epignosis day 1.

Enrique I'm looking at my past meta and how scum react to my game play and how civs react to my gameplay. Epignosis is not reacting the same way as he usually does to my gameplay as he does when he is civ and people throw out such accusations against me.

My bet is Zebra and Epi could be on team team, if not both then one of them. I will also be keeping my eye on DDL.

Zebra's logic for voting for me is illogical she doesn't agree with EPi, yet she thinks I'm on a teamwith Simon and we are both scum and that I would make such a mistake.
My day 1 scum team
Simon
Epi
Zebra

At 9:10pm EST-

I'd rather lynch Epi today, but a Zebra lynch is good to. If she flips mafia or civ my opinion of Epi won't have changed that much.

linki: why Enrique?

At no point does sig entertain the idea that I could be bad and that I'm setting up two civilians. His theory is that I'm bad with Simon and we are setting up one civilian. Keep in mind in all of this, sig's first on-topic post was to say he would not vote for Simon. By the end of the day, he has zebra, Simon, and me on a team. Why would a civilian jump to that conclusion rather than give Simon the benefit of the doubt if he genuinely thought I was Mafia?

You are wrong here, never did I say you were throwing Simon under the bus. Your goal was to distance yourself from Simon and semi clear him. Never were you actually attempting to lynch him, I've said this many times and looking over your posts it is fairly obvious you had no intention of getting Simon lynched.

I'm starting to feel tempted to grab Occam's Razor and use it to stab Sig's throat. Indeed, there are A LOT of contradictions in his posts. He changes his votes every time his reads seem artificial. If he is mafia, that's pretty sloppy mafia play, but hey, most games have one of those.

That, and I don't feel particulary good about this Simon vote, although I have logic supporting it.

WHat is Occam's razor?

This is a lie, I've never changed my vote. I voted for Epi, said I would vote for Epi, and never switched from Epi.
He on the other hand has switched his vote multiply times, he has gone from thinking Zebra was a good lynch, to saying she was bad. As well as saying he wasn't pushing for my lynch, and then tried to get me lynched and dropped Simon.

@MM: Some good points. The distancing Epi performs after the lynch result is pretty astounding, especially given his vote changes, especially especially given that he did that vote change out of necessity.

However, I'm curious what you think about the timing of the sig-Epi interactions. Especially the leap sig makes from "lynching Zebra is a waster of time" to "a Zebra lynch is good too" in the span of roughly 30 minutes.

Some of Zebra's posts changed my mind. Her posts about lynching me for flip value, then lynched SImon then lynching Epi seemed scummy. So yes I did change mymind about her.

I think Glorfindel is scum, his posts are off, his defense and his argument against me is based around Zebra being dead and flipping civ.

[sig]

Psh Simon voted for me, kids these days no respect for their elders.



oh no I'm starting to sound like the old farts who actually know what Pikmin is

:P

[Marmot]

Sig, why did you decide that zebra was not a good lynch choice and then change your mind?

[Simon]

I vote for Sig because I had to break the tie. A lot of people are voting for me. I could almost get lynched.

[sig]

I thought she wasn't a good lynch choice, but I changed my mind to being fine with her lynch.
Mainly this post.

I did not believe Simon and sig were teammates. However, I was leaning towards it I admit, and I needed a way to be sure. I sensed ulterior motives from a number of players including Simon and sig themselves, so I pulled some WIFOM out of my butt to gauge reactions. At the time I disagreed with either one of them being lynched, there really wasn't any information or connections that could be analyzed from their flip, whatever that may be. Not enough anyway. Now, there is tons of content related directly to the different interpretations of what's really going on, so a lynching of either of them (especially sig) will prove massively helpful. I am still not sure if they are teammates or not, but I think a sig lynch will be beneficial because for one, I think he is bad regardless of whether Simon slipped or not, if he is teammates then we've got two of the bosses with plenty of time left to get the third, and if he is good we can look at the Epi/Simon theory that has been proposed (and denied by Epi because he wouldn't bus his own son? Nonsense, of course he would) and see if it has any merit. A sig lynch will immensely beneficial, in stark contrast to both an Enrique lynch and a me lynch.

I left "too early" ambiguous on purpose.

linki - My death might be informative as well.

But also her general interaction regarding Epi. She disagreed with him about Simon/Sig team, but thought I was bad and in the above post quoted said it could have been true. It seemed to be like she was setting up other people for a lynch after me. Or if Simon was civ she would have lynched me, then lynched Simon. She would have then said no point in lynching Epi since I'm wrong. If they were teammates.

linki:

[Marmot]

I changed my vote to sig.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Sig: yeah I said it wrong. You don't change your votes, but you keep changing your mind in a way that seems artificial. That's the problem.

[Marmot]

I thought she wasn't a good lynch choice, but I changed my mind to being fine with her lynch.
Mainly this post.

I did not believe Simon and sig were teammates. However, I was leaning towards it I admit, and I needed a way to be sure. I sensed ulterior motives from a number of players including Simon and sig themselves, so I pulled some WIFOM out of my butt to gauge reactions. At the time I disagreed with either one of them being lynched, there really wasn't any information or connections that could be analyzed from their flip, whatever that may be. Not enough anyway. Now, there is tons of content related directly to the different interpretations of what's really going on, so a lynching of either of them (especially sig) will prove massively helpful. I am still not sure if they are teammates or not, but I think a sig lynch will be beneficial because for one, I think he is bad regardless of whether Simon slipped or not, if he is teammates then we've got two of the bosses with plenty of time left to get the third, and if he is good we can look at the Epi/Simon theory that has been proposed (and denied by Epi because he wouldn't bus his own son? Nonsense, of course he would) and see if it has any merit. A sig lynch will immensely beneficial, in stark contrast to both an Enrique lynch and a me lynch.

I left "too early" ambiguous on purpose.

linki - My death might be informative as well.

But also her general interaction regarding Epi. She disagreed with him about Simon/Sig team, but thought I was bad and in the above post quoted said it could have been true. It seemed to be like she was setting up other people for a lynch after me. Or if Simon was civ she would have lynched me, then lynched Simon. She would have then said no point in lynching Epi since I'm wrong. If they were teammates.

linki:

Back to Epignosis.

[Epignosis]

Revisionism and lies!

Number one:

Simon lets have fun, vote for Scotty with me and make it a three way tie. I'll address some things in a moment. First off did I say I would vote for Scotty/DDL? No what I said was out of these two and Epi one is mafia. I was willing to go with the thought EPi wasn't mafia, however I'm more confident that this isn't the case. I've also considered that Simon is civ I've said he could be a civ and Epi is bussing him, however it makes more sense for them both to be mafia.

I have bussed one teammate ever early on- DDL in Guess Who? in all my time in Mafia. I wouldn't throw my own kid under the bus Day 1 if we were on a team. Just wouldn't happen- sorry. I'd be coaching the kid and making him a top-notch FEB like his old man.

And if I were bad and he wasn't, I wouldn't kill him either (at least not early on).

Number two:

If I was scum, I wouldn't have gone after Epi. I'm not the most aggressive scum player,and I certainly wouldn't have targeted a high profile civ who could rip to shreds an argument against him. The digging of my own grave was targeting Epi and pursuing him, as well as the way I answered his accusation that Simonand I are teammates.

When did you dig your own grave and target and pursue me? Please point to where this happened. I'm certain I debunked this silly falsehood of yours.

Number three:

You are wrong here, never did I say you were throwing Simon under the bus. Your goal was to distance yourself from Simon and semi clear him. Never were you actually attempting to lynch him, I've said this many times and looking over your posts it is fairly obvious you had no intention of getting Simon lynched.

Never was I attempting to lynch him? What do you call voting for him? I had no intention of getting Simon lynched? Tell me, please, how I can do that by myself. What I said was that I know no one is going to lynch an 8-year-old Day 1. That proved to be true. But Day 2? Lookie lookie there. Does it look like I'm trying to clear Simon now?

Number four:

This is a lie, I've never changed my vote. I voted for Epi, said I would vote for Epi, and never switched from Epi.
He on the other hand has switched his vote multiply times, he has gone from thinking Zebra was a good lynch, to saying she was bad. As well as saying he wasn't pushing for my lynch, and then tried to get me lynched and dropped Simon.

When did I ever think that Zebra was a good lynch? I threatened him briefly for not voting either you or Simon and moved my vote off of him anyway.

[Typhoony]

Voted Sig.

[DrWilgy]

I gave you every chance in the world Sig. All you needed to do was address me.

Plus... I like Simon's presence still.

[Marmot]

When did I ever think that Zebra was a good lynch?

Close enough.

[Epignosis]

When did I ever think that Zebra was a good lynch?

Close enough.

It ain't a threat if it ain't believable.

[Soneji]

I gave Sig some leeway yesterday because while I am not big on players responding to accusations with conspiracy theories, I gave him the benefit of the doubt due to people who know him saying he can dig his own grave and Sorcha seemingly aiming to fan the flames between Epi and Sig. Now however, with Sig saying he was purposely baiting Epi, I am inclined to vote for him as that claim seems fairly ludicrous. So early on you are going to hatch a plan to try to "catch" a big fish player?

This doesn't eliminate Sorcha from my list, though I am willing to see the Sig lynch through.

[VOTE: ] aubergine

[Glorfindel]

Sig, I'm sorry. I just can't get past my suspicions of you. The evidence against you seems more valid than anything I've seen over anyone else. After WW Mafia, I know you'll understand.

[Marmot]

When did I ever think that Zebra was a good lynch?

Close enough.

It ain't a threat if it ain't believable.

I found it believable. Were you being disingenuous?

[Marmot]

I gave Sig some leeway yesterday because while I am not big on players responding to accusations with conspiracy theories, I gave him the benefit of the doubt due to people who know him saying he can dig his own grave and Sorcha seemingly aiming to fan the flames between Epi and Sig. Now however, with Sig saying he was purposely baiting Epi, I am inclined to vote for him as that claim seems fairly ludicrous. So early on you are going to hatch a plan to try to "catch" a big fish player?

This doesn't eliminate Sorcha from my list, though I am willing to see the Sig lynch through.

[VOTE: ] aubergine

[VOTE:

Pssst, her name is Sorsha.

Also, voting sig.] aubergine

[Tangrowth]

DAY 2

Who wants to eat all of the pikmin?

Poll ended at Tue Dec 15, 2015 8:13:45 pm


agleaminranks
0
No votes

Boomslang
0
No votes

Dragon D. Luffy
0
No votes

DrWilgy
0
No votes

Enrique
0
No votes

Epignosis
1
sig (17) 4%

FZ.
0
No votes

Glorfindel
1
Matt (8) 4%

kneel4justice
0
No votes

Matt
0
No votes

Metalmarsh89
0
No votes

Scotty
2
kneel4justice (11), agleaminranks (12) 9%

sig
10
Enrique (7), Dragon D. Luffy (9), FZ. (10), Boomslang (15), Simon (16), DrWilgy (19), Typhoony (20), Glorfindel (21), Soneji (22), Metalmarsh89
(23) 43%

Simon
3
Scotty (4), Epignosis (5), Spacedaisy (14) 13%

Soneji
0
No votes

Sorsha
0
No votes

Spacedaisy
0
No votes

Typhoony
0
No votes

Sockface! (host, deadies, non-players)
6
MovingPictures07 (1), a2thezebra (2), TheFloyd73 (3), Tranq (6), S~V~S (13), juliets (18) 26%

Total votes : 23

[Tangrowth]

Day 2

sig has been lynched. He was:

Spoiler: show

Yellow (Leaf) Pikmin.

He had not been gathered by any protagonist.

Day 2 has ended.

It is now Night 2. You have 24 hours to send in your Night PMs.

[Marmot]

First zebra, now sig who dies twice in a 15 minute span.

[Epignosis]

That is disappointing.

[Sorsha]

ugh... I guess I won't be voting today then

RIP sig

[Spacedaisy]

Well that sucked.

[Enrique]

First zebra, now sig who dies twice in a 15 minute span.

What?

RIP sig.

[Marmot]

First zebra, now sig who dies twice in a 15 minute span.

What?

RIP sig.

Zebra died in two games in a 15 minute span the other day when she was lynched. Then it happened to sig today.

[sig]

It's gods way of telling me to only play one game at a time.

[Scotty]

Welp.
I'm sorry to see you go, sig.

What say you now, Epi?

Because I still believe one of you or Simon is bad. And I feel like a broken record at this point. But apparently only a handful of people are willing to go there because it's "cluttering up the thread".

[Scotty]

EBWOP: I believe either one or both of you are bad.

[Epignosis]

Welp.
I'm sorry to see you go, sig.

What say you now, Epi?

Because I still believe one of you or Simon is bad. And I feel like a broken record at this point. But apparently only a handful of people are willing to go there because it's "cluttering up the thread".

What say me now? I didn't lynch sig.

[Glorfindel]

Hey SIMON, let's vote for your pop!

Simon, do you rat on your siblings? Are they older or younger than you?

I agree. I think Daddy's boss because he was quick in thinking that e and Sig are teammates.

I am the oldest sibling. I'm eight years old. My sister is six. She just had her birthday. My brother is three. I tell on them and boss them because I'm the oldest.

This post is like the cutest thing ever and makes it so hard to vote Simon, but I'm going to leave my vote there... I'm an awful persooooooooon!

Indeed you are Spacedaisy... Seriously though, I agree - that post of Simon's was one of the most special things I've seen playing Mafia anywhere. I honestly can't see me ever voting lynch Simon after this...

[kneel4justice]

RIP Sig.

[Matt]

Peace out sig.

Can we lynch Glorfindel next day phase?

I'm also all for lynching Simon. Again, I figure if sig is civ and Simon is bad, then Glorfindel needs to go.

[Spacedaisy]

Can you please explain the reasoning there?

[Matt]

Can you please explain the reasoning there?

Yes. 2+2=4 therefore since sig is civ, and if Simon is bad, then Glorfindel needs to go.

But I'm also cool with skipping straight to lynching Glorfindel if everyone else is up for it.

Also, Enrique, what do you think of Boomslang's "I'm not down for lynching Simon...yet" Ha!