Survivor: Mafia [Day 4: Atamai Tribe]

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What's your strongest game trait?

Honesty
1
8%
Perseverance
1
8%
Competitiveness
2
17%
Patience
2
17%
#Swagger
1
8%
Watching (Host/Non-player Option)
5
42%
 
Total votes: 12
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#361

Post by LoRab »

Quin wrote:LoRab, the only thing missing that distinguishes 'suggesting strategies' and saying 'there are strategies' is me copy and pasting the damn thing on the thread. I told you to find them and by the looks of it nobody actually did.
What makes you think that no one looked at strategies? The items were placed based on strategy and the items were searched for based on strategy. There are multiple strategies for battleship that exist. The strategies chosen may not be the ones you would have chosen. They may not even be the ones that you found in the article you read in the quick google search you did. But that doesn't mean that someone else didn't find an article in a different google search. SVS even posted an article (demonstrating that it's factually untrue that nobody actually did).

The difference between "suggesting strategies" and "there are strategies" is that clearly you had a particular strategy in mind, and you are not happy that it was not the strategy that was used. But no one had any way of knowing what your opinion was about which strategy you would have preferred based on the one you read about because you didn't say which one it was. Therefore, someone using a different strategy (whether known through a google search or through life and playing battleship and already knowing strategy that exists) cannot imply that they didn't act strategically.

And you cannot claim that you made suggestions of what strategy should be used. Until you said differently, there was no way for anyone to know that you wouldn't have done things in exactly the same way, based on what you had posted before you went to bed.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#362

Post by Quin »

All you've done is reiterate the same debunked contributions. You did nothing today that anybody else either didn't already or couldn't do. You've also proved that you're completely untrustworthy as a tribemate. Strength of integrity matters just as much as challenge ability.

Another question: Why can't we bring you up if we're discussing votes? You aren't leading this tribe.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#363

Post by Quin »

LoRab wrote:
Quin wrote:LoRab, the only thing missing that distinguishes 'suggesting strategies' and saying 'there are strategies' is me copy and pasting the damn thing on the thread. I told you to find them and by the looks of it nobody actually did.
What makes you think that no one looked at strategies? The items were placed based on strategy and the items were searched for based on strategy. There are multiple strategies for battleship that exist. The strategies chosen may not be the ones you would have chosen. They may not even be the ones that you found in the article you read in the quick google search you did. But that doesn't mean that someone else didn't find an article in a different google search. SVS even posted an article (demonstrating that it's factually untrue that nobody actually did).

The difference between "suggesting strategies" and "there are strategies" is that clearly you had a particular strategy in mind, and you are not happy that it was not the strategy that was used. But no one had any way of knowing what your opinion was about which strategy you would have preferred based on the one you read about because you didn't say which one it was. Therefore, someone using a different strategy (whether known through a google search or through life and playing battleship and already knowing strategy that exists) cannot imply that they didn't act strategically.

And you cannot claim that you made suggestions of what strategy should be used. Until you said differently, there was no way for anyone to know that you wouldn't have done things in exactly the same way, based on what you had posted before you went to bed.
I don't care that the strategies I had in mind weren't used. Not once did I say that.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#364

Post by LoRab »

Quin wrote:
LoRab wrote:
Quin wrote:LoRab, the only thing missing that distinguishes 'suggesting strategies' and saying 'there are strategies' is me copy and pasting the damn thing on the thread. I told you to find them and by the looks of it nobody actually did.
What makes you think that no one looked at strategies? The items were placed based on strategy and the items were searched for based on strategy. There are multiple strategies for battleship that exist. The strategies chosen may not be the ones you would have chosen. They may not even be the ones that you found in the article you read in the quick google search you did. But that doesn't mean that someone else didn't find an article in a different google search. SVS even posted an article (demonstrating that it's factually untrue that nobody actually did).

The difference between "suggesting strategies" and "there are strategies" is that clearly you had a particular strategy in mind, and you are not happy that it was not the strategy that was used. But no one had any way of knowing what your opinion was about which strategy you would have preferred based on the one you read about because you didn't say which one it was. Therefore, someone using a different strategy (whether known through a google search or through life and playing battleship and already knowing strategy that exists) cannot imply that they didn't act strategically.

And you cannot claim that you made suggestions of what strategy should be used. Until you said differently, there was no way for anyone to know that you wouldn't have done things in exactly the same way, based on what you had posted before you went to bed.
I don't care that the strategies I had in mind weren't used. Not once did I say that.
No, but you've said that you suggested people look at strategies and clearly they didn't. What makes you believe that is true, other than the fact that you didn't like the strategies you had in mind?
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#365

Post by Quin »

LoRab wrote:
Quin wrote:
LoRab wrote:
Quin wrote:LoRab, the only thing missing that distinguishes 'suggesting strategies' and saying 'there are strategies' is me copy and pasting the damn thing on the thread. I told you to find them and by the looks of it nobody actually did.
What makes you think that no one looked at strategies? The items were placed based on strategy and the items were searched for based on strategy. There are multiple strategies for battleship that exist. The strategies chosen may not be the ones you would have chosen. They may not even be the ones that you found in the article you read in the quick google search you did. But that doesn't mean that someone else didn't find an article in a different google search. SVS even posted an article (demonstrating that it's factually untrue that nobody actually did).

The difference between "suggesting strategies" and "there are strategies" is that clearly you had a particular strategy in mind, and you are not happy that it was not the strategy that was used. But no one had any way of knowing what your opinion was about which strategy you would have preferred based on the one you read about because you didn't say which one it was. Therefore, someone using a different strategy (whether known through a google search or through life and playing battleship and already knowing strategy that exists) cannot imply that they didn't act strategically.

And you cannot claim that you made suggestions of what strategy should be used. Until you said differently, there was no way for anyone to know that you wouldn't have done things in exactly the same way, based on what you had posted before you went to bed.
I don't care that the strategies I had in mind weren't used. Not once did I say that.
No, but you've said that you suggested people look at strategies and clearly they didn't. What makes you believe that is true, other than the fact that you didn't like the strategies you had in mind?
Because nobody talked about them, and because DH never regarded my contributions when he threw me under the bus as a vote candidate.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#366

Post by DharmaHelper »

Quin wrote:All you've done is reiterate the same debunked contributions. You did nothing today that anybody else either didn't already or couldn't do. You've also proved that you're completely untrustworthy as a tribemate. Strength of integrity matters just as much as challenge ability.

Another question: Why can't we bring you up if we're discussing votes? You aren't leading this tribe.
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Debunked how? I don't think you can argue my contributions were useless because "other people could have done that". Sure, other people could have, but I did. I posted a color coded map that helped at least one person understand the challenge better. I suggested quadrants and helped organize our tribe into those quadrants. I think anyone who looks back at my performance in that challenge and says I did the tribe harm is lying .

Why can I not be trusted? The opposite is true. My word was given to these 3 people that I would protect and watch over them, and I intend to do that and hope they intend to do the same. Why? because they earned my trust. Something you haven't had the time to do yet.

I haven't said you "Can't" bring me up, only that if your argument is to vote out the people who make the tribe weakest, you "shouldn't" because I "don't".
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#367

Post by DharmaHelper »

EBWOP: As a matter of fact, if you can explain to me what you did during today's challenge that someone else "couldn't have or didn't already", I'm more than happy to listen.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#368

Post by Quin »

Your dishonesty and hierarchy are making this tribe look pretty weak right now.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#369

Post by Quin »

DharmaHelper wrote:EBWOP: As a matter of fact, if you can explain to me what you did during today's challenge that someone else "couldn't have or didn't already", I'm more than happy to listen.
I wasn't here for the bulk of it, so I can't. I'm just not going to oversell what I have done like you are.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#370

Post by DharmaHelper »

Quin wrote:
DharmaHelper wrote:EBWOP: As a matter of fact, if you can explain to me what you did during today's challenge that someone else "couldn't have or didn't already", I'm more than happy to listen.
I wasn't here for the bulk of it, so I can't. I'm just not going to oversell what I have done like you are.
You keep saying I'm overselling what I did, but you can't point out how.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#371

Post by Quin »

DharmaHelper wrote:
Quin wrote:
DharmaHelper wrote:EBWOP: As a matter of fact, if you can explain to me what you did during today's challenge that someone else "couldn't have or didn't already", I'm more than happy to listen.
I wasn't here for the bulk of it, so I can't. I'm just not going to oversell what I have done like you are.
You keep saying I'm overselling what I did, but you can't point out how.
I did like three times.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#372

Post by LoRab »

EBWOP: That you didn't like the strategies that were used, and that the strategies you had in mind weren't used.

linkitis: Apparently didn't need the EBWOP.

But how could they have been discussed if no one knew what they were? There was discussion of how to play. DH made a suggestion of how to place the tiles, which was a strategy based suggestion, and asked for input before submitting it. There was discussion of how to strategize searches. It included an article online, which I assume SVS found on a google search. What that you suggested wasn't talked about in figuring out how to approach the challenge?

And DH didn't throw you under the bus as a vote candidate. He suggested that you were one of 2 people he is considering for the vote. As I've shared, I'm in the same boat as he is. I value loyalty and I've given my word to people. It's not a tribe thing, it's an individual word thing.

This isn't mafia, so throwing under the bus doesn't really carry the same weight (no pun intended) and we need to vote for someone. Would you have preferred there be no discussion of the vote? How would you have preferred the vote discussion to happen?
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#373

Post by DharmaHelper »

Quin wrote:
DharmaHelper wrote:
Quin wrote:
DharmaHelper wrote:EBWOP: As a matter of fact, if you can explain to me what you did during today's challenge that someone else "couldn't have or didn't already", I'm more than happy to listen.
I wasn't here for the bulk of it, so I can't. I'm just not going to oversell what I have done like you are.
You keep saying I'm overselling what I did, but you can't point out how.
I did like three times.
Could you reiterate, because I'm confused if your argument is that I didn't do anything anyone "couldn't or didn't already...

Nobody did anything in that challenge that someone else "couldn't" hypothetically do.

I was (to my recollection) the first person to hit on an item, which is something actually nobody "already did".

I never said I was the only reason we did so well, But I definitively played a major part. So, I'm just wondering what part of what I did was insufficient?
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#374

Post by DharmaHelper »

Quin wrote:
DharmaHelper wrote:EBWOP: As a matter of fact, if you can explain to me what you did during today's challenge that someone else "couldn't have or didn't already", I'm more than happy to listen.
I wasn't here for the bulk of it, so I can't. I'm just not going to oversell what I have done like you are.
You quite literally said I aped your strategy when all you did was say the words "there are battleship strategies"

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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#375

Post by DharmaHelper »

I really should go to bed as now I'm actually in the position Quin was during the challenge it's like 3 AM :haha:
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#376

Post by Quin »

LoRab wrote:EBWOP: That you didn't like the strategies that were used, and that the strategies you had in mind weren't used.

linkitis: Apparently didn't need the EBWOP.

But how could they have been discussed if no one knew what they were? There was discussion of how to play. DH made a suggestion of how to place the tiles, which was a strategy based suggestion, and asked for input before submitting it. There was discussion of how to strategize searches. It included an article online, which I assume SVS found on a google search. What that you suggested wasn't talked about in figuring out how to approach the challenge?

And DH didn't throw you under the bus as a vote candidate. He suggested that you were one of 2 people he is considering for the vote. As I've shared, I'm in the same boat as he is. I value loyalty and I've given my word to people. It's not a tribe thing, it's an individual word thing.

This isn't mafia, so throwing under the bus doesn't really carry the same weight (no pun intended) and we need to vote for someone. Would you have preferred there be no discussion of the vote? How would you have preferred the vote discussion to happen?
I know the dynamic isn't the same. I'm not treating this as the same thing as mafia. But the fact remains that you may staked your word on it, but he is not somebody who can be trusted to work for the good of this tribe. You are not in his long term future, LoRab. I tell you this because I know who is.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#377

Post by Quin »

DharmaHelper wrote:
Quin wrote:
DharmaHelper wrote:EBWOP: As a matter of fact, if you can explain to me what you did during today's challenge that someone else "couldn't have or didn't already", I'm more than happy to listen.
I wasn't here for the bulk of it, so I can't. I'm just not going to oversell what I have done like you are.
You quite literally said I aped your strategy when all you did was say the words "there are battleship strategies"

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False.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#378

Post by LoRab »

Quin wrote:All you've done is reiterate the same debunked contributions. You did nothing today that anybody else either didn't already or couldn't do. You've also proved that you're completely untrustworthy as a tribemate. Strength of integrity matters just as much as challenge ability.
Sometimes, it's the reverse.

In fact, DH has demonstrated integrity in keeping his word to people to whom he has given his word. Are you suggesting that he go back on his word and break promises? Is taking back a promise to protect another individual how you define trustworthiness?
Quin wrote:Your dishonesty and hierarchy are making this tribe look pretty weak right now.
I disaagree, Quin. :kadaj: I think our openness and loyalty is what makes this tribe strong.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#379

Post by Quin »

LoRab wrote:
Quin wrote:All you've done is reiterate the same debunked contributions. You did nothing today that anybody else either didn't already or couldn't do. You've also proved that you're completely untrustworthy as a tribemate. Strength of integrity matters just as much as challenge ability.
Sometimes, it's the reverse.

In fact, DH has demonstrated integrity in keeping his word to people to whom he has given his word. Are you suggesting that he go back on his word and break promises? Is taking back a promise to protect another individual how you define trustworthiness?
Quin wrote:Your dishonesty and hierarchy are making this tribe look pretty weak right now.
I disaagree, Quin. :kadaj: I think our openness and loyalty is what makes this tribe strong.
I define trustworthiness as being loyal to people who deserve it.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#380

Post by LoRab »

Quin wrote:
LoRab wrote:EBWOP: That you didn't like the strategies that were used, and that the strategies you had in mind weren't used.

linkitis: Apparently didn't need the EBWOP.

But how could they have been discussed if no one knew what they were? There was discussion of how to play. DH made a suggestion of how to place the tiles, which was a strategy based suggestion, and asked for input before submitting it. There was discussion of how to strategize searches. It included an article online, which I assume SVS found on a google search. What that you suggested wasn't talked about in figuring out how to approach the challenge?

And DH didn't throw you under the bus as a vote candidate. He suggested that you were one of 2 people he is considering for the vote. As I've shared, I'm in the same boat as he is. I value loyalty and I've given my word to people. It's not a tribe thing, it's an individual word thing.

This isn't mafia, so throwing under the bus doesn't really carry the same weight (no pun intended) and we need to vote for someone. Would you have preferred there be no discussion of the vote? How would you have preferred the vote discussion to happen?
I know the dynamic isn't the same. I'm not treating this as the same thing as mafia. But the fact remains that you may staked your word on it, but he is not somebody who can be trusted to work for the good of this tribe. You are not in his long term future, LoRab. I tell you this because I know who is.
I don't see what he's done that isn't for the good of this tribe.

And please, enlighten me.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#381

Post by Quin »

LoRab wrote:And please, enlighten me.
You're going to have to earn it.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#382

Post by DharmaHelper »

Quin wrote:
DharmaHelper wrote:
Quin wrote:I might be inclined to vote for you. Why weren't you helping around camp today? I think you were being sneaky, and were looking for an idol. I think that enough shows that even while you and the rest of the tribe were sick you were more interested in your own self-preservation than helping at camp.
I think after putting together the winning strategy to give us food and water via reward, busting ass during the challenge, being the first person to find an item, I earned a nice stroll through camp, don't you?

I may not have gone fishing, or gone to get water, but my performance in the challenge provided us with both. And now we have eggs.

Is there anyone else you've got an eye on?
Got a problem with this too. Half the stuff you presented as the 'winning strategy' was stuff I'd already directed the tribe to in my goodnight post. You alone didn't win us the reward, in fact I think you screwed up more than anybody else by putting two of our biggest blocks together. That could have gone horribly wrong.

Finding the first item was a matter of probability. It doesn't earn you anything in my book.

Are you suggesting that because you found eggs you were valuable to the tribe? Unless you knew that by going there you'd find a chicken, you didn't. You got lucky. Or am I wrong?
Quin wrote:These time zone differences are worse than I thought :p

Going to bed. I looked up a battleship strategy that gives a couple of tips that might help with placement and also searching. Might be a good idea for people to have a look before making any decisions.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#383

Post by DharmaHelper »

LoRab wrote:
Quin wrote:All you've done is reiterate the same debunked contributions. You did nothing today that anybody else either didn't already or couldn't do. You've also proved that you're completely untrustworthy as a tribemate. Strength of integrity matters just as much as challenge ability.
Sometimes, it's the reverse.

In fact, DH has demonstrated integrity in keeping his word to people to whom he has given his word. Are you suggesting that he go back on his word and break promises? Is taking back a promise to protect another individual how you define trustworthiness?
Quin wrote:Your dishonesty and hierarchy are making this tribe look pretty weak right now.
I disaagree, Quin. :kadaj: I think our openness and loyalty is what makes this tribe strong.
I would agree here, LoRab. Thank you.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#384

Post by Quin »

What do you think you have, DH? I pointed the tribe to strategies. Said strategies were the same as many of the ones you were implementing on your own. And this isn't even the context of the beef we're having.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#385

Post by Quin »

A 'loyal' ally would not be out searching for an immunity idol while his tribe mate was two challenges away from running out of energy.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#386

Post by Quin »

Plus the whole everyone being sick thing. The reward we *might* get is no excuse.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#387

Post by DharmaHelper »

Quin wrote:What do you think you have, DH? I pointed the tribe to strategies. Said strategies were the same as many of the ones you were implementing on your own. And this isn't even the context of the beef we're having.
You said I oversold what I contributed to the challenge. You also said "Half" of what I contributed, you directed the thread to do first.

What I did:
- Placed the items
- Came up with the grid
- Helped to direct people to their assigned grids
- Through practicing the above strategy, hit the oar on my first guess.
- Provided a colored grid so people like Eloh could follow along easier

My questions are, which you haven't I don't think answered adequately, How have I oversold what I did, and what parts of what I did do you expect to take credit for based on "directing the thread" via the remarks "I looked up a battleship strategy that gives a couple of tips"
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#388

Post by LoRab »

To be fair, DH, that was a serious misuse of the word literally.
Quin wrote:
I define trustworthiness as being loyal to people who deserve it.
Then we have different definitions.
Quin wrote:
LoRab wrote:And please, enlighten me.
You're going to have to earn it.
If you're going to make an offer than involves my voting for someone that I promised I wouldn't vote against, then it's a no go. My integrity is worth more than some alleged information. Nice try, though.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#389

Post by Quin »

DharmaHelper wrote:
Quin wrote:What do you think you have, DH? I pointed the tribe to strategies. Said strategies were the same as many of the ones you were implementing on your own. And this isn't even the context of the beef we're having.
You said I oversold what I contributed to the challenge. You also said "Half" of what I contributed, you directed the thread to do first.

What I did:
- Placed the items
- Came up with the grid
- Helped to direct people to their assigned grids
- Through practicing the above strategy, hit the oar on my first guess.
- Provided a colored grid so people like Eloh could follow along easier

My questions are, which you haven't I don't think answered adequately, How have I oversold what I did, and what parts of what I did do you expect to take credit for based on "directing the thread" via the remarks "I looked up a battleship strategy that gives a couple of tips"
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You placed items in a risky manner. If you'd looked at said strategies you'd have known one of the biggest tips is 'DON'T PUT BLOCKS SIDE BY SIDE'

Okay. You came up with the grid. See above.

You got the ore based entirely on luck. It is nothing more. It will never be anything more than luck. A 1 in 64 chance.

You can have being helpful. You can have the colour grid too. But INH and SVS did grids too, and you weren't the only one helping people like me catch up.

This isn't about me. Don't ask for 'my credit'.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#390

Post by DharmaHelper »

Sorry, I did "oversell" the first guess thing. It was my second guess according to my reading back just now.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#391

Post by Quin »

LoRab wrote:To be fair, DH, that was a serious misuse of the word literally.
Quin wrote:
I define trustworthiness as being loyal to people who deserve it.
Then we have different definitions.
Quin wrote:
LoRab wrote:And please, enlighten me.
You're going to have to earn it.
If you're going to make an offer than involves my voting for someone that I promised I wouldn't vote against, then it's a no go. My integrity is worth more than some alleged information. Nice try, though.
I didn't make you an offer. You can do what you like.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#392

Post by LoRab »

Quin wrote:
LoRab wrote:To be fair, DH, that was a serious misuse of the word literally.
Quin wrote:
I define trustworthiness as being loyal to people who deserve it.
Then we have different definitions.
Quin wrote:
LoRab wrote:And please, enlighten me.
You're going to have to earn it.
If you're going to make an offer than involves my voting for someone that I promised I wouldn't vote against, then it's a no go. My integrity is worth more than some alleged information. Nice try, though.
I didn't make you an offer. You can do what you like.
You implied you might, based on saying I'd have to earn it. I'm not interested in earning enlightenment from you, then. To be more precise.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#393

Post by LoRab »

Quin wrote: You placed items in a risky manner. If you'd looked at said strategies you'd have known one of the biggest tips is 'DON'T PUT BLOCKS SIDE BY SIDE'
Except for the strategies that say: While some say not to put them side by side, it's actually a really good strategy to put them side by side.

Yes, it is risky, but some excellent strategies involve risk.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#394

Post by S~V~S »

DharmaHelper wrote:
Quin wrote:I'll answer you seriously. I think you're undervaluing my own contributions to the tribe. I wasn't here for the start of the challenge because I couldn't be. Otherwise, even while nobody else is here, I'm putting strategies forward and I'm putting my foot first to take care of the tribe.
I made no comments on your contributions, I wanted to let you have the floor before I did that. But you can't argue that what I said about SVS, INH, and myself taking charge of the challenge wasn't true.

It's possible you're right, and you do put strategies forward, and you do have the tribes best interest at heart. I'm a newcomer here, so I'd need to see that for myself or let you make your case.

While I have your attention, something's been nagging at me about the first challenge. From Scotty's write up, it sounded like DFaraday cost you guys the challenge. Scotty wrote that he "fell asleep" and that "the gap [left after the puzzle] was too much to make up."

So my question is, was that a 1-to-1 translation of what went down? And if so, why did you not, as a tribe, vote for DFaraday?
Because sig no showed. I have already said this. And all of us had trouble understanding the directions that day. And as I said, sig helped even less.

This is the first time we have had to do this type of thing.

I spent my lying in bed with my phone Mafia time reading GOC. So I may not post again for a few hours. When I saw that four of you were coming here I knew you were gonna pick us off first. It's what I would have done.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#395

Post by S~V~S »

Quin wrote:
LoRab wrote:
Quin wrote:LoRab, the only thing missing that distinguishes 'suggesting strategies' and saying 'there are strategies' is me copy and pasting the damn thing on the thread. I told you to find them and by the looks of it nobody actually did.
What makes you think that no one looked at strategies? The items were placed based on strategy and the items were searched for based on strategy. There are multiple strategies for battleship that exist. The strategies chosen may not be the ones you would have chosen. They may not even be the ones that you found in the article you read in the quick google search you did. But that doesn't mean that someone else didn't find an article in a different google search. SVS even posted an article (demonstrating that it's factually untrue that nobody actually did).

The difference between "suggesting strategies" and "there are strategies" is that clearly you had a particular strategy in mind, and you are not happy that it was not the strategy that was used. But no one had any way of knowing what your opinion was about which strategy you would have preferred based on the one you read about because you didn't say which one it was. Therefore, someone using a different strategy (whether known through a google search or through life and playing battleship and already knowing strategy that exists) cannot imply that they didn't act strategically.

And you cannot claim that you made suggestions of what strategy should be used. Until you said differently, there was no way for anyone to know that you wouldn't have done things in exactly the same way, based on what you had posted before you went to bed.
I don't care that the strategies I had in mind weren't used. Not once did I say that.
I copied and pasted a strategy in thread and was told that we should not do that since Epi would probably do that too.

Gotta go shower lol.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#396

Post by S~V~S »

I did it right after Quin mentioned Battleship strategies.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#397

Post by LoRab »

Yes, exactly. So saying that no one looked up considered any strategies is not an accurate statement.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#398

Post by S~V~S »

LoRab wrote:Yes, exactly. So saying that no one looked up considered any strategies is not an accurate statement.
I kind of meant it the other way, as a defense of Quin, but yeah, I see your point :ponder:

And see, this is what I meant by hostility; not "hostile" per se, but both of our lynches were no brainers, a complete zero posts no show and a volunteer. We had no discussion or strife or accusations of *any* kind either time. I will think about it and do what is right for the tribe so going forward we can better come together.

I knew this was coming eventually, but I don't have to like it.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#399

Post by DharmaHelper »

S~V~S wrote:
DharmaHelper wrote:
Quin wrote:I'll answer you seriously. I think you're undervaluing my own contributions to the tribe. I wasn't here for the start of the challenge because I couldn't be. Otherwise, even while nobody else is here, I'm putting strategies forward and I'm putting my foot first to take care of the tribe.
I made no comments on your contributions, I wanted to let you have the floor before I did that. But you can't argue that what I said about SVS, INH, and myself taking charge of the challenge wasn't true.

It's possible you're right, and you do put strategies forward, and you do have the tribes best interest at heart. I'm a newcomer here, so I'd need to see that for myself or let you make your case.

While I have your attention, something's been nagging at me about the first challenge. From Scotty's write up, it sounded like DFaraday cost you guys the challenge. Scotty wrote that he "fell asleep" and that "the gap [left after the puzzle] was too much to make up."

So my question is, was that a 1-to-1 translation of what went down? And if so, why did you not, as a tribe, vote for DFaraday?
Because sig no showed. I have already said this. And all of us had trouble understanding the directions that day. And as I said, sig helped even less.

This is the first time we have had to do this type of thing.

I spent my lying in bed with my phone Mafia time reading GOC. So I may not post again for a few hours. When I saw that four of you were coming here I knew you were gonna pick us off first. It's what I would have done.
I know you said why you voted for sig, I just wanted a second viewpoint.

Also I want to clarify, I suggested we try for strategies that weren't easily googled, I didn't make any demands or anything similar.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#400

Post by LoRab »

S~V~S wrote:
LoRab wrote:Yes, exactly. So saying that no one looked up considered any strategies is not an accurate statement.
I kind of meant it the other way, as a defense of Quin, but yeah, I see your point :ponder:

And see, this is what I meant by hostility; not "hostile" per se, but both of our lynches were no brainers, a complete zero posts no show and a volunteer. We had no discussion or strife or accusations of *any* kind either time. I will think about it and do what is right for the tribe so going forward we can better come together.

I knew this was coming eventually, but I don't have to like it.
No brainers would be nice. Neither of ours were like that, as we described.

But in looking in the difference in responses to DH's post between DF and Quin, I see most of the hostility in the conversation for this tribal coming from Quin.

As I have said, I'm keeping my word to the people I have said I will protect.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#401

Post by DharmaHelper »

S~V~S wrote:
LoRab wrote:Yes, exactly. So saying that no one looked up considered any strategies is not an accurate statement.
I kind of meant it the other way, as a defense of Quin, but yeah, I see your point :ponder:

And see, this is what I meant by hostility; not "hostile" per se, but both of our lynches were no brainers, a complete zero posts no show and a volunteer. We had no discussion or strife or accusations of *any* kind either time. I will think about it and do what is right for the tribe so going forward we can better come together.

I knew this was coming eventually, but I don't have to like it.
I understand where you're coming from. But Quin has made some very unconvincing arguments that I think need to be handled. You want less hostility, and I agree. I asked DF ad Quin to state their cases, and Quin's response was pretty hostile.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#402

Post by DFaraday »

LoRab wrote:
S~V~S wrote:
LoRab wrote:Yes, exactly. So saying that no one looked up considered any strategies is not an accurate statement.
I kind of meant it the other way, as a defense of Quin, but yeah, I see your point :ponder:

And see, this is what I meant by hostility; not "hostile" per se, but both of our lynches were no brainers, a complete zero posts no show and a volunteer. We had no discussion or strife or accusations of *any* kind either time. I will think about it and do what is right for the tribe so going forward we can better come together.

I knew this was coming eventually, but I don't have to like it.
No brainers would be nice. Neither of ours were like that, as we described.

But in looking in the difference in responses to DH's post between DF and Quin, I see most of the hostility in the conversation for this tribal coming from Quin.

As I have said, I'm keeping my word to the people I have said I will protect.
Did literally everybody in Manamana swear an oath not to vote for each other? Because it seems statistically improbable that the four who apparently can't vote each other ever all got sent to our camp.

I don't really care whether Quin or DH contributed more to the challenges. This phase has already revealed that in DH's mind, there is his chosen few, and there are the rest of us. By immediately framing the lynch as a choice between myself and Quin, he's made clear that the good of the group is not an option. I do not accept that paradigm. :noble:
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#403

Post by DharmaHelper »

DFaraday wrote:
LoRab wrote:
S~V~S wrote:
LoRab wrote:Yes, exactly. So saying that no one looked up considered any strategies is not an accurate statement.
I kind of meant it the other way, as a defense of Quin, but yeah, I see your point :ponder:

And see, this is what I meant by hostility; not "hostile" per se, but both of our lynches were no brainers, a complete zero posts no show and a volunteer. We had no discussion or strife or accusations of *any* kind either time. I will think about it and do what is right for the tribe so going forward we can better come together.

I knew this was coming eventually, but I don't have to like it.
No brainers would be nice. Neither of ours were like that, as we described.

But in looking in the difference in responses to DH's post between DF and Quin, I see most of the hostility in the conversation for this tribal coming from Quin.

As I have said, I'm keeping my word to the people I have said I will protect.
Did literally everybody in Manamana swear an oath not to vote for each other? Because it seems statistically improbable that the four who apparently can't vote each other ever all got sent to our camp.

I don't really care whether Quin or DH contributed more to the challenges. This phase has already revealed that in DH's mind, there is his chosen few, and there are the rest of us. By immediately framing the lynch as a choice between myself and Quin, he's made clear that the good of the group is not an option. I do not accept that paradigm. :noble:
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You and Quin seem to think that your being on my list has nothing to do with the betterment of the tribe. If you can suggest to me how a vote for someone else would make the tribe better, I will listen. But Quin hasn't done that, instead inventing a reason to attack me.

Faraday, in your view, who makes this tribe the weakest?
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#404

Post by DFaraday »

DharmaHelper wrote:
DFaraday wrote:
LoRab wrote:
S~V~S wrote:
LoRab wrote:Yes, exactly. So saying that no one looked up considered any strategies is not an accurate statement.
I kind of meant it the other way, as a defense of Quin, but yeah, I see your point :ponder:

And see, this is what I meant by hostility; not "hostile" per se, but both of our lynches were no brainers, a complete zero posts no show and a volunteer. We had no discussion or strife or accusations of *any* kind either time. I will think about it and do what is right for the tribe so going forward we can better come together.

I knew this was coming eventually, but I don't have to like it.
No brainers would be nice. Neither of ours were like that, as we described.

But in looking in the difference in responses to DH's post between DF and Quin, I see most of the hostility in the conversation for this tribal coming from Quin.

As I have said, I'm keeping my word to the people I have said I will protect.
Did literally everybody in Manamana swear an oath not to vote for each other? Because it seems statistically improbable that the four who apparently can't vote each other ever all got sent to our camp.

I don't really care whether Quin or DH contributed more to the challenges. This phase has already revealed that in DH's mind, there is his chosen few, and there are the rest of us. By immediately framing the lynch as a choice between myself and Quin, he's made clear that the good of the group is not an option. I do not accept that paradigm. :noble:
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You and Quin seem to think that your being on my list has nothing to do with the betterment of the tribe. If you can suggest to me how a vote for someone else would make the tribe better, I will listen. But Quin hasn't done that, instead inventing a reason to attack me.

Faraday, in your view, who makes this tribe the weakest?
It clearly doesn't have to do with the betterment of the tribe. You started this phase going, "Well, INH, Elohcin, and Lorab are right out...so, Quin or DF? Who is most detrimental?" That you looked for reasons to justify one of us after doesn't change the fact that you framed this as a choice between me and Quin and nobody else.

In my view, anyone who is not willing to cooperate as a team is most detrimental. I haven't heard anything from Elohcin and INH, so right now, either you or Lorab are the weak link if you insist on making the three of us (because obviously SVS is next) enemies.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#405

Post by DharmaHelper »

So you criticize me for picking two people who weren't in my original tribe by picking two people who weren't in yours.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#406

Post by insertnamehere »

DharmaHelper wrote:So you criticize me for picking two people who weren't in my original tribe by picking two people who weren't in yours.
Aaaand that's where Quin and DF's argument falls apart for me.

Literally everyone on this tribe is playing for self-interest now. At least DH and company are being honest about it.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#407

Post by S~V~S »

Faraday, we have to be realistic and do what we have to do.

And INH, not so condescending, OK? You guys came over here, and have us by the shorts. We have to push back a little.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#408

Post by DharmaHelper »

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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Day 4]

#409

Post by Elohcin »

I've been verybusy this morning, forgive me for not being around. My thoughts are below.
DharmaHelper wrote:I think you're confused Quin. I'm not singling you out, and I've definitely not settled on my vote yet, but you have to look at things from my perspective, if you wouldn't mind:

1. INH, Lorab, and Eloh are all 3 former tribemates of mine that I gave my word on Mamana's beach I would look out for as long as they looked out for me. I don't intend to break my word, and I wouldn't ask that of anyone on this beach.

2. SVS Was instrumental in getting the ball rolling for this challenge, and I haven't initially considered her for a vote

3. I don't know your dynamic, or your records in terms of participation, contribution, etc. That's why I've asked.
It's basically just a "by process of elimination" thing. I don't think DH means any meanness by calling you out. I have to agree with his thought process on all fronts.

Lorab, thanks for mentioning that DH search was not selfish. That's what I was thinking when quin brought that up.

I don't like the hostility come from quin as he Converses with DH.

Also, I picked honesty. I only lied once all game and it was to boomslang who went out night one. He was shady and I told him in BTSC I would not vote him, but I did. I had to for the betterment of our tribe. He deliberately lied to me in BTSC and was not open about other things. After he left, I was open about it in the thread though and have been honest ever since. You can all trust me to be honest with you.
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Re: Survivor: Mafia [Night 4]

#410

Post by S~V~S »

OK, I am gonna bite the bullet here and do what I have to do for the good of all of us going forward. New peeps are now part of Atamai and Atamai FTW. While the people I would have preferred to lynch from original Atamai are all, I'm going to guess, over at mamama lynching *your* former teammates, for us to be able to pull together and win every challenge from here on in, we need to be cohesive.

I don't want to lose another person after this, any of the *SIX* of us remaining, not just Faraday and I, unless it is 100% necessary. We are going to win every immunity challenge.

I know what I am going to have to do in the end, and you need to do it too, Faraday, you know I am right.

Just an fyi, when we did the stone challenge, Faraday hated the idea of sending in a black stone, so negative, standing for self interest and greed (I would not be surprised if Golden or Eloh did/said something similar), but he did it becasue he understood the stakes.

I just want guarantees from the Newcomers that, going forward, we judge each circumstance on merit and value to the team, and not on where your original PM placed you on an imaginary map. I realize you all pledged to each other, and we did the same. And for the sake of peace you are asking us to break that pledge, and even in some cases with the gall to blame us for not liking it and trying to push back against the new majority. I am willing to do it. But I don't want to be faced with this voting bloc again presented as a given. Am I clear here? We'll cooperate, but we want some quid pro quo going forward.
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