The Syndicate 2014 Game of Champions [ENDGAME]

[Turnip Head]

Is it any comfort at all that you probably got me killed Dom?

[Dom]

Is it any comfort at all that you probably got me killed Dom?

It's a comfort that MP lost tbh

[Marmot]

Dh--- you played our team amazingly well. I wish it would have turned out better.



TBH-- Epi you are a great host. I love your games a lot.

Everyone on the team played amazingly. I was just the last one to get shot in the face.

our BTSC chat was awesome too. I'll miss it.


TBH, DH, you have more patience than I do-- I would have, and did, have an in-thread fit. You played it better than I ever could.

I was almost gonna lose it when the Ghost that got rezzed due to clever role claiming/outing also infodumped the Gandalf thing.

Well, I lost it when MP outed me-- you are a better man than I.

Sorry for your luck Dom. I think people should start getting modkilled again.

Don't be sorry-- that doesn't change anything.

Lynch and kill outers. Ruin their games. Make their lives miserable. Ruin everything for them. Make them feel how I have felt when I have played flawless games (see Doctor Who Mafia) and still get lynched simply because all the civvies out themselves.

Modkills would certainly do it imo. At least have it as a warning against info-dropping/outing. Players wouldn't out themselves if they're going to lose as a result of it.

I think it was X-Men where players were info-dropping, and so Rob kept giving us baddies extra little bonuses to compensate for it. Either it didn't matter, or we just didn't play well enough.

[Dom]

TBH, Info dumping CAN improve a game.

Role outing does not.


I'm so sick of this. I'm so sick of having that discussion-- it's not the first time.

[bea]

I feel very torn and upset by this whole thing. Because I guess I keep thinking I know where the line is and then I over step it. I honestly don't think I did anything wrong this game. If anyone wants to search my posts and PLEASE tell me where I did anything wrong. Do it and PM it to me because I want to be a better player and I *though* was was becoming one.

I literally feel sick to my stomach that I helped make this game so unenjoyable for so many people. I want to get better but if I'm not shown better ways of playing things, I can't learn. Show me how civ bts was played better. Then I can learn.

[thellama73]

I still like you, bea. I think you're cool.

[bea]

Thanks llama - I am pretty cool in lots of things -but I'm not great at mafia - and I never claimed to be. I do however, love to learn and welcome instruction.

you're cool too sir!

TH - you would have been fun to have back too! I voted where I wanted to there. I couldn't believe anyone who picked Abed is Batman was bad.

[Long Con]

I agree, I think "info dumping", or at least info-hinting, should be a vibrant part of Mafia. It's the reason why giving the baddies a dead-role-checker (or even a regular role-checker) is so good. What an opportunity!

Perhaps the better way to combat the perceived info-dumping problem is for hosts to introduce things into the game to specifically neutralize the possibility. More baddie roles that can cause wrong information to seem right, variants on the Seemer role, roles that are listed as Civvie but are actually bad...

Also, it's worthwhile to point out that the baddies have a WAY better record on this site than the Civvies. The baddies win disproportionately more. So an infodumping problem isn't hurting the overall baddie win chances.

[DharmaHelper]

I agree, I think "info dumping", or at least info-hinting, should be a vibrant part of Mafia. It's the reason why giving the baddies a dead-role-checker (or even a regular role-checker) is so good. What an opportunity!

Perhaps the better way to combat the perceived info-dumping problem is for hosts to introduce things into the game to specifically neutralize the possibility. More baddie roles that can cause wrong information to seem right, variants on the Seemer role, roles that are listed as Civvie but are actually bad...

Also, it's worthwhile to point out that the baddies have a WAY better record on this site than the Civvies. The baddies win disproportionately more. So an infodumping problem isn't hurting the overall baddie win chances.

Baddies win more than civvies here because the civvies do not play. Nonparticipation significantly drops the difficulty for mafia

[thellama73]

I agree, I think "info dumping", or at least info-hinting, should be a vibrant part of Mafia. It's the reason why giving the baddies a dead-role-checker (or even a regular role-checker) is so good. What an opportunity!

Perhaps the better way to combat the perceived info-dumping problem is for hosts to introduce things into the game to specifically neutralize the possibility. More baddie roles that can cause wrong information to seem right, variants on the Seemer role, roles that are listed as Civvie but are actually bad...

Also, it's worthwhile to point out that the baddies have a WAY better record on this site than the Civvies. The baddies win disproportionately more. So an infodumping problem isn't hurting the overall baddie win chances.

Baddies win more than civvies here because the civvies do not play. Nonparticipation significantly drops the difficulty for mafia

Stay tuned for what we hope will be a pleasant surprise on that front.

[DharmaHelper]

I agree, I think "info dumping", or at least info-hinting, should be a vibrant part of Mafia. It's the reason why giving the baddies a dead-role-checker (or even a regular role-checker) is so good. What an opportunity!

Perhaps the better way to combat the perceived info-dumping problem is for hosts to introduce things into the game to specifically neutralize the possibility. More baddie roles that can cause wrong information to seem right, variants on the Seemer role, roles that are listed as Civvie but are actually bad...

Also, it's worthwhile to point out that the baddies have a WAY better record on this site than the Civvies. The baddies win disproportionately more. So an infodumping problem isn't hurting the overall baddie win chances.

Baddies win more than civvies here because the civvies do not play. Nonparticipation significantly drops the difficulty for mafia

Stay tuned for what we hope will be a pleasant surprise on that front.

Well now I feel like the kid who opened his gifts the night before Christmas

[Dom]

I agree, I think "info dumping", or at least info-hinting, should be a vibrant part of Mafia. It's the reason why giving the baddies a dead-role-checker (or even a regular role-checker) is so good. What an opportunity!

Perhaps the better way to combat the perceived info-dumping problem is for hosts to introduce things into the game to specifically neutralize the possibility. More baddie roles that can cause wrong information to seem right, variants on the Seemer role, roles that are listed as Civvie but are actually bad...

Also, it's worthwhile to point out that the baddies have a WAY better record on this site than the Civvies. The baddies win disproportionately more. So an infodumping problem isn't hurting the overall baddie win chances.

It ruins the game for the player, eh?

The game, in general, has a huge problem with info-dumping lately. You know that.

[DharmaHelper]

Thanks llama - I am pretty cool in lots of things -but I'm not great at mafia - and I never claimed to be. I do however, love to learn and welcome instruction.

you're cool too sir!

TH - you would have been fun to have back too! I voted where I wanted to there. I couldn't believe anyone who picked Abed is Batman was bad.

It's not my place nor fair of me to say you played poorly or to "teach" you how to play. You *could* have been more subtle, and I think that was the thing for me is how obvious both you and Eloh were about it. Save the cheeky obvious stuff for BTSC chat.

[DharmaHelper]

Speaking of cheeky obvious stuff, What was it in the sign ups thread you guys were talking about? Completely missed it.

[Dom]

Of the people in the end game, the only person who was not outed/didn't out themselves was DH-- when excluding inactives because they don't matter at that point.

That's a problem.

Honestly, this is the second game on this site that has been absolutely DESTROYED because of info dumping and role outing. There's good in info dumping, but there's also, "hey i'm not bad and it rhymes with "prom".

[Marmot]

I agree, I think "info dumping", or at least info-hinting, should be a vibrant part of Mafia. It's the reason why giving the baddies a dead-role-checker (or even a regular role-checker) is so good. What an opportunity!

Perhaps the better way to combat the perceived info-dumping problem is for hosts to introduce things into the game to specifically neutralize the possibility. More baddie roles that can cause wrong information to seem right, variants on the Seemer role, roles that are listed as Civvie but are actually bad...

Also, it's worthwhile to point out that the baddies have a WAY better record on this site than the Civvies. The baddies win disproportionately more. So an infodumping problem isn't hurting the overall baddie win chances.

It is when infodumping is against the rules, which is generally the case.

Perhaps that should/could be changed for future games?

[DharmaHelper]

SVS is gonna be so mad at me when she wakes up tomorrow.

[DharmaHelper]

Just to circle the wagon back to the inactive thing:

Lizzy, Lorab, Sabie, and Reywas were ALL civvies. When that big a chunk of civvies are inactive, its not surprising to me that the mafia win more often than not.

[Dom]

SVS is gonna be so mad at me when she wakes up tomorrow.

tbh she will never trust you again

[Long Con]

Of the people in the end game, the only person who was not outed/didn't out themselves was DH-- when excluding inactives because they don't matter at that point.

Hey hey hey!

[Marmot]

Of the people in the end game, the only person who was not outed/didn't out themselves was DH-- when excluding inactives because they don't matter at that point.

Hey hey hey!

Perhaps you were included as an inactive?

[Dom]

Of the people in the end game, the only person who was not outed/didn't out themselves was DH-- when excluding inactives because they don't matter at that point.

Hey hey hey!

LC I am sorry for the oversight-- I am a bit drunk.




TBH you played an amazing game. I am very happy you won-- we agreed, as a team, that you should.

[Long Con]

I agree, I think "info dumping", or at least info-hinting, should be a vibrant part of Mafia. It's the reason why giving the baddies a dead-role-checker (or even a regular role-checker) is so good. What an opportunity!

Perhaps the better way to combat the perceived info-dumping problem is for hosts to introduce things into the game to specifically neutralize the possibility. More baddie roles that can cause wrong information to seem right, variants on the Seemer role, roles that are listed as Civvie but are actually bad...

Also, it's worthwhile to point out that the baddies have a WAY better record on this site than the Civvies. The baddies win disproportionately more. So an infodumping problem isn't hurting the overall baddie win chances.

It is when infodumping is against the rules, which is generally the case.

Perhaps that should/could be changed for future games?

I would like to see that. I think some of the ideas I put out there could really lessen the negative impact of an "infodump".

Thanks, Dom, I really appreciate that. I can only imagine what you guys thought of Gollum throughout the game!

[Marmot]

I agree, I think "info dumping", or at least info-hinting, should be a vibrant part of Mafia. It's the reason why giving the baddies a dead-role-checker (or even a regular role-checker) is so good. What an opportunity!

Perhaps the better way to combat the perceived info-dumping problem is for hosts to introduce things into the game to specifically neutralize the possibility. More baddie roles that can cause wrong information to seem right, variants on the Seemer role, roles that are listed as Civvie but are actually bad...

Also, it's worthwhile to point out that the baddies have a WAY better record on this site than the Civvies. The baddies win disproportionately more. So an infodumping problem isn't hurting the overall baddie win chances.

It is when infodumping is against the rules, which is generally the case.

Perhaps that should/could be changed for future games?

I would like to see that. I think some of the ideas I put out there could really lessen the negative impact of an "infodump".

Thanks, Dom, I really appreciate that. I can only imagine what you guys thought of Gollum throughout the game!

[Marmot]

^^^D'oh, forgot to type a message.

I agree with your points from your previous post LC.

[Long Con]

Of the people in the end game, the only person who was not outed/didn't out themselves was DH-- when excluding inactives because they don't matter at that point.

Hey hey hey!

LC I am sorry for the oversight-- I am a bit drunk.




TBH you played an amazing game. I am very happy you won-- we agreed, as a team, that you should.

I made it a point to specifically not out DH, because I wanted to play at a higher standard. I really thought I would be successful with the semi-bogus case against him, but DAMN is he slippery!

Also, he admitted to me in the Gollum chat that his Day One Misfits ploy was all bullshit. So I tried to focus everyone on it. I still don't know why no one ever analyzed it and saw that it was ludicrous... another testament to DH's abilities!

[Black Rock]

This game was lame. Black Rock was killed night one! Why? WHY!!!???? I loved my role and so wanted to play it. You broke my heart Suits, BROKE MY HEART! I had to follow along the game as a deady ALL game. So very sad. I deserved a chance. I hope you four realize what I have to do to you. It will be very sad for you as well. I had to throw a real life fit at that post, a real life fit. Imagine what LC had to witness. It was awful, his life was changed forever. You will now have to suffer these real life situations for the rest of your life... as long as I have opportunity. I'll never have this role again, I hope it was worth the agonizing death I must bestow upon you.

Yes, LC has been feeding me Rye and Coke all night.

I am a drama queen without this... your names have been recorded... in the brain.

[Black Rock]

DH I have to congratulate you in a different post (had to have my drama post first). Congratulations on not killing me night one, that was a good decision. I will forever admire you for that. Seriously though, you played an excellent game. I can't believe you lasted so long. Just reading the thread you were such an obvious choice, but they all past you by. Crazy! You have a way with words.

[Marmot]

This game was lame. Black Rock was killed night one! Why? WHY!!!???? I loved my role and so wanted to play it. You broke my heart Suits, BROKE MY HEART! I had to follow along the game as a deady ALL game. So very sad. I deserved a chance. I hope you four realize what I have to do to you. It will be very sad for you as well. I had to throw a real life fit at that post, a real life fit. Imagine what LC had to witness. It was awful, his life was changed forever. You will now have to suffer these real life situations for the rest of your life... as long as I have opportunity. I'll never have this role again, I hope it was worth the agonizing death I must bestow upon you.

Yes, LC has been feeding me Rye and Coke all night.

I am a drama queen without this... your names have been recorded... in the brain.

I understand your frustrations of dying early on in the championship game. Unfortunately I have no beer in the house right now.

[S~V~S]

DH, not mad. Impressed, SO impressed. I was so sure you were bad, and you turned it around.

I did not see a list of recruits, gonna go look for it again.

[Snow Dog]

First of all congrats to DH. You played an awesome game, it was a pleasure to be on a team with you. I am sorry I messed up that day 1 vote. I tried to play like my indecisive civvy Who game. Problem was in Panic I left my vote on MM. I tried to move my vote but it was too late. A huge error on my part. I am so sorry team. I think it was this that got me. Shame I got lynched for being a suit though. That sucked.

[Snow Dog]

LC, why did you spell it "rumour"?

[S~V~S]

He is Canadian.

[zeek]

Yeah, sorry about that Snowy. I knew you weren't by the actual day you were lynched. Timmer learnt about the ring and when Roxy died, due to voting you, we knew you were the Necromancer. So we just continued the Suit talk!

[Snow Dog]

He is Canadian.

I asked in chat if Canadians spelled it the UK way but no one came up with canadian players. No one seemed to want to persue it as I was no way convinced about zeek.

Also it was stupid to target MP when we knew he was Tyler. We didn't read his role descriptin though. can you believe that?

NP zeek. I had no idea why Roxy died.

[zeek]

Well done Snowy. Are you really leaving Mafia? Hint: correct answer is no

[Long Con]

LC, why did you spell it "rumour"?

I just prefer to spell things correctly whenever possible. Americans apparently don't like the letter "u" as much as the rest of the world, so they drop it from words like colour, honour, neighbour, rumour, etc.

[S~V~S]

Also Gleeok got changed, very clever way to work in that 31st player Epi

I was sooo sure Bea was a companion, lol. I was amazed no one went after her for being the 31st person to sign up when the host said that he prerandomed the roles by order of sign up. So with 30 roles, the 31st player had to be...a secret role.

But no one really went with that. I came close, but then I reread Elo since there was the mega early vouch, and could see she was civ. So i backed off Bea, thinking the 31st role was a companion, since Dr Whos role SAID he travels with a companion.

Linki~ I tend to use Commonwealth spelling when I am in a sock game or secret BTS since I have some very obvious typing tells. I remember someone, maybe jason, telling me they use US spelling in those situations for the same reason.

[Epignosis]

epi - who would have come back if the other poll options for the dead players had won?

I'm dying to know who put Abed is Batman.

Marshy - for what it's worth - I did actually want to die so we could bring someone back. I was going to try to bring you back if it happened. Sadly no one tried to NK me.

This whole time you thought you needed to be Night killed? You needed to be lynched!

Let's see. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, as I'm going to attempt this from memory:

Sorcerers knew Boddy (Made)

There's a seemer (Dom) I really thought this was clever and that it would bring Dom back into the game.

DON't TRUST PICTURES (Bass)

Who is dead (Roxy)

Tyler Durden lies (llama) He originally sent in "Boomslang is bad" but changed when he saw Boom was going down.

Daisy killed me (Russ)

Abed is Batman (TH)

Wisdom Courage Power (nijuu)

Also Gleeok got changed, very clever way to work in that 31st player Epi

I was sooo sure Bea was a companion, lol. I was amazed no one went after her for being the 31st person to sign up when the host said that he prerandomed the roles by order of sign up. So with 30 roles, the 31st player had to be...a secret role.

But no one really went with that. I came close, but then I reread Elo since there was the mega early vouch, and could see she was civ. So i backed off Bea, thinking the 31st role was a companion, since Dr Whos role SAID he travels with a companion.

I had no idea what I was going to do when bea signed up. I spent a couple of hours thinking about it. I couldn't just add a 31st role (even a secret one) because everyone would know bea had it. When, after the game began, you PMed me with the "Ah, so they are the Doctor and a companion," I thought, "Well damn, that would have been a good idea too!"

You need winner's banners, Epig?

I have not made them yet. If you are volunteering, that would be most welcome.

LC, why did you spell it "rumour"?

I just prefer to spell things correctly whenever possible. Americans apparently don't like the letter "u" as much as the rest of the world, so they drop it from words like colour, honour, neighbour, rumour, etc.

I parodied this in my Doctour Who post.

[Elohcin]

SUCH a fun game Epi. Thank you to everyone who made it so fun!

I feel very torn and upset by this whole thing. Because I guess I keep thinking I know where the line is and then I over step it. I honestly don't think I did anything wrong this game. If anyone wants to search my posts and PLEASE tell me where I did anything wrong. Do it and PM it to me because I want to be a better player and I *though* was was becoming one.

I literally feel sick to my stomach that I helped make this game so unenjoyable for so many people. I want to get better but if I'm not shown better ways of playing things, I can't learn. Show me how civ bts was played better. Then I can learn.

BTSC was hit or miss for Bea and I b/c of busy schedules I suppose. After Bea had posted about her trust in me since receiving her role PM, I felt the need to reciprocate so that you all didn't suspect her wrongly. It got out of hand I guess, but I didn't realize it at the time. Like Bea, I didn't know I was doing anything wrong. I read through the rules several times before posting about my trust of Bea. I wanted to make sure I was not role outing whatsoever. And really, I didn't. No one knew we were gleeok. However, I hate that our explicit trust of each other ruined fun for others and I apologize for it.

[thellama73]

LC, why did you spell it "rumour"?

I just prefer to spell things correctly whenever possible. Americans apparently don't like the letter "u" as much as the rest of the world, so they drop it from words like colour, honour, neighbour, rumour, etc.

But we like the letter Z more than the rest of the world, so we say criticize instead of criticise. In this I dissent from my countrymen, as I find Z to be horribly crass and vulgar.

[Snow Dog]

LC, why did you spell it "rumour"?

I just prefer to spell things correctly whenever possible. Americans apparently don't like the letter "u" as much as the rest of the world, so they drop it from words like colour, honour, neighbour, rumour, etc.

But we like the letter Z more than the rest of the world, so we say criticize instead of criticise. In this I dissent from my countrymen, as I find Z to be horribly crass and vulgar.

And therefore very American.

[Snow Dog]

Well done Snowy. Are you really leaving Mafia? Hint: correct answer is no

It was not a ruse. I have quit mafia.

(But I may just need a break)

[zeek]

I hope it's just a break, Snowy

I'm resuming my break now, so I'll see when I'm up to the task again. I get so involved in these games it would be hard to stay sane playing too frequently.

[Snow Dog]

I hope it's just a break, Snowy

I'm resuming my break now, so I'll see when I'm up to the task again. I get so involved in these games it would be hard to stay sane playing too frequently.

I never said it before but congratulations on your engagement.

[Dom]

Dom srsly why vote for someone who isn't even playing?

Does LoRab's absence make her not the Doctor?

I randomized, why are you criticizing that? Other people did the same.

LOL in retrospect!

[juliets]

Of the people in the end game, the only person who was not outed/didn't out themselves was DH-- when excluding inactives because they don't matter at that point.

That's a problem.

Honestly, this is the second game on this site that has been absolutely DESTROYED because of info dumping and role outing. There's good in info dumping, but there's also, "hey i'm not bad and it rhymes with "prom".

I never outted myself.

[Dom]

Of the people in the end game, the only person who was not outed/didn't out themselves was DH-- when excluding inactives because they don't matter at that point.

That's a problem.

Honestly, this is the second game on this site that has been absolutely DESTROYED because of info dumping and role outing. There's good in info dumping, but there's also, "hey i'm not bad and it rhymes with "prom".

I never outted myself.

Juliets, like LC, I apologize, I was not in my right mind when posting that and didn't even consult a player's list.

[DharmaHelper]

Of the people in the end game, the only person who was not outed/didn't out themselves was DH-- when excluding inactives because they don't matter at that point.

That's a problem.

Honestly, this is the second game on this site that has been absolutely DESTROYED because of info dumping and role outing. There's good in info dumping, but there's also, "hey i'm not bad and it rhymes with "prom".

I never outted myself.

Juliets, like LC, I apologize, I was not in my right mind when posting that and didn't even consult a player's list.

Still, 3 of however many is a problem :P

[juliets]

Of the people in the end game, the only person who was not outed/didn't out themselves was DH-- when excluding inactives because they don't matter at that point.

That's a problem.

Honestly, this is the second game on this site that has been absolutely DESTROYED because of info dumping and role outing. There's good in info dumping, but there's also, "hey i'm not bad and it rhymes with "prom".

I never outted myself.

Juliets, like LC, I apologize, I was not in my right mind when posting that and didn't even consult a player's list.

No problem Dom.

I've been trying to figure out how you "out" someone as opposed to accuse them. If you "out" them does that basically mean you info dumped about them? Because building a case on them to be someone in particular obviously isn't outting - it's building a case.