Death Note Mafia [END]

[Matahari]

FZ- I read the posts about Llama, and you came right to the point. He hasn't been killed yet, which made me laugh. I don't really trust Llama and I could see a vote for him. I also trust ppl who are susp of MM, and I could vote there as well. Made and TH are ppl I have voted because I couldn't understand their behavior. I was wrong about them, but still, it was my reason, and I can do that again. But there is still time, I'd rather my vote counted for something, so I'll wait a bit longer.

[Matahari]

I also should have mentioned I don't know what to make of bea. I think it's doubtful she will get lynched today and I'm interested to see what position she takes once she makes it through this lynch. She's just on my watch list for now.

Mata yes I was going to put a sad smiley up because you forgot me! No biggie though.

and this made me laugh too

[FZ.]

I really need to go...
Also, llama asked not to be lynched while he's gone, or has guests or whatever, so I'm going to give him the courtesy and not push for his lynch (even if he won't do the same). I'm not sold on MM, but I have no idea how to read him, and I trust the people who voted for him, not to mention TH has raised some good points, so if nothing dramatic happens in the next...minute, he's getting my vote.

linki: Thanks Mata. My sentiments exactly regarding the people voting for MM. As for TH, I didn't get what he was doing, but I think bad TH wouldn't do that. I think it's possible he's SIdoh or something like that and is trying to work with the detectives or something like that. I have other ideas, but I'll leave it at that.


Okay, voting MM and hoping we're right on this one

[FZ.]

Good night

[boo]

Have to vote now, and a better Mikami candidate hasn't been brought up, so I'm going with FZ.

[Matahari]

I set my DST, but the time on the poll says 9:44 pm, is that right for someone in EST? That seems later than our time usually is

[DharmaHelper]

DnD and other assorted roleplaying stuff is over for the evening. Time to catch up.

[Tangrowth]

I set my DST, but the time on the poll says 9:44 pm, is that right for someone in EST? That seems later than our time usually is

This is correct. Day 7 ends at 8:44PM CST, with DST in effect.

It is later than normal because of the fact that my post was roughly 30 minutes late for Night 6, as well as the time change.

In order to get back on a more normal schedule, Night 7 will only be 22 hours instead of 24. I will announce this again later.

[Tangrowth]

With that said, I am only awaiting 5 votes at the moment. If those votes all arrive early, I will end the day early. But no rush.

[Matahari]

With that said, I am only awaiting 5 votes at the moment. If those votes all arrive early, I will end the day early. But no rush.

Thanks, I'm going to go vote now, and I'll go with MM.

[Marmot]

With that said, I am only awaiting 5 votes at the moment. If those votes all arrive early, I will end the day early. But no rush.

YES RUSH!

[Marmot]

In other games where Metalmarsh has been bad, he's certainly been more involved than he has here. Despite his 13 pages of posts, very little of it relates to his own suspicions and thoughts. He's always just playing off of other's thoughts, commenting from the peanut gallery. That doesn't feel like detective behavior to me in the slightest.

Hi Mr. Kettle.

[Tangrowth]

With that said, I am only awaiting 5 votes at the moment. If those votes all arrive early, I will end the day early. But no rush.

YES RUSH!

Doesn't get much better than that.

[Turnip Head]

With that said, I am only awaiting 5 votes at the moment. If those votes all arrive early, I will end the day early. But no rush.

Thanks, I'm going to go vote now, and I'll go with MM.

This vote surprised me a little. You hadn't really weighed in on my case against him, and you didn't really give a reason here either... you had just said earlier that MM was acting "wacky" and you lumped him into your gray area with a bunch of players you said you knew nothing about And you put Epi and Llama as the only people on the bad side of your fence, yet you didn't vote for one of them.

[Turnip Head]

In other games where Metalmarsh has been bad, he's certainly been more involved than he has here. Despite his 13 pages of posts, very little of it relates to his own suspicions and thoughts. He's always just playing off of other's thoughts, commenting from the peanut gallery. That doesn't feel like detective behavior to me in the slightest.

Hi Mr. Kettle.

No no, you've got that wrong. I would be Mr. Pot in this scenario.

[Marmot]

In other games where Metalmarsh has been bad, he's certainly been more involved than he has here. Despite his 13 pages of posts, very little of it relates to his own suspicions and thoughts. He's always just playing off of other's thoughts, commenting from the peanut gallery. That doesn't feel like detective behavior to me in the slightest.

Hi Mr. Kettle.

No no, you've got that wrong. I would be Mr. Pot in this scenario.

A valid point. I'll have to change the lyrics to the song I was writing about us then.

[Matahari]

With that said, I am only awaiting 5 votes at the moment. If those votes all arrive early, I will end the day early. But no rush.

Thanks, I'm going to go vote now, and I'll go with MM.

This vote surprised me a little. You hadn't really weighed in on my case against him, and you didn't really give a reason here either... you had just said earlier that MM was acting "wacky" and you lumped him into your gray area with a bunch of players you said you knew nothing about And you put Epi and Llama as the only people on the bad side of your fence, yet you didn't vote for one of them.

I said earlier that I had MM in with players who are off to me. I questioned him earlier in the game, then slacked off because humor charms me. But you, Made, Russ, and MM have been playing off at different times in the game, and that can be bad to ignore. I voted you and Made for the same reason, but have since re-evaluated. That doesn't mean that because some of the off ppl are ppl I now feel wrong about, that all of them will be.

And- I'm not ready to vote Llama or Epig yet, because I want to have something to more to present than 'feels'.

If you are looking for feedback on your posts, I will be happy to oblige, it wasn't meant to be a slight. I just had my own reasons for considering MM, and I didn't go further than that.

[Marmot]

With that said, I am only awaiting 5 votes at the moment. If those votes all arrive early, I will end the day early. But no rush.

Thanks, I'm going to go vote now, and I'll go with MM.

This vote surprised me a little. You hadn't really weighed in on my case against him, and you didn't really give a reason here either... you had just said earlier that MM was acting "wacky" and you lumped him into your gray area with a bunch of players you said you knew nothing about And you put Epi and Llama as the only people on the bad side of your fence, yet you didn't vote for one of them.

I said earlier that I had MM in with players who are off to me. I questioned him earlier in the game, then slacked off because humor charms me. But you, Made, Russ, and MM have been playing off at different times in the game, and that can be bad to ignore. I voted you and Made for the same reason, but have since re-evaluated. That doesn't mean that because some of the off ppl are ppl I now feel wrong about, that all of them will be.

And- I'm not ready to vote Llama or Epig yet, because I want to have something to more to present than 'feels'.

If you are looking for feedback on your posts, I will be happy to oblige, it wasn't meant to be a slight. I just had my own reasons for considering MM, and I didn't go further than that.

What's off about me?

[Matahari]

With that said, I am only awaiting 5 votes at the moment. If those votes all arrive early, I will end the day early. But no rush.

Thanks, I'm going to go vote now, and I'll go with MM.

This vote surprised me a little. You hadn't really weighed in on my case against him, and you didn't really give a reason here either... you had just said earlier that MM was acting "wacky" and you lumped him into your gray area with a bunch of players you said you knew nothing about And you put Epi and Llama as the only people on the bad side of your fence, yet you didn't vote for one of them.

I said earlier that I had MM in with players who are off to me. I questioned him earlier in the game, then slacked off because humor charms me. But you, Made, Russ, and MM have been playing off at different times in the game, and that can be bad to ignore. I voted you and Made for the same reason, but have since re-evaluated. That doesn't mean that because some of the off ppl are ppl I now feel wrong about, that all of them will be.

And- I'm not ready to vote Llama or Epig yet, because I want to have something to more to present than 'feels'.

If you are looking for feedback on your posts, I will be happy to oblige, it wasn't meant to be a slight. I just had my own reasons for considering MM, and I didn't go further than that.

What's off about me?

I like funny. But humor might be hiding a deep-seated desire to kill ppl.

[Marmot]

I hope you all enjoy lynching me.

[Turnip Head]

With that said, I am only awaiting 5 votes at the moment. If those votes all arrive early, I will end the day early. But no rush.

Thanks, I'm going to go vote now, and I'll go with MM.

This vote surprised me a little. You hadn't really weighed in on my case against him, and you didn't really give a reason here either... you had just said earlier that MM was acting "wacky" and you lumped him into your gray area with a bunch of players you said you knew nothing about And you put Epi and Llama as the only people on the bad side of your fence, yet you didn't vote for one of them.

I said earlier that I had MM in with players who are off to me. I questioned him earlier in the game, then slacked off because humor charms me. But you, Made, Russ, and MM have been playing off at different times in the game, and that can be bad to ignore. I voted you and Made for the same reason, but have since re-evaluated. That doesn't mean that because some of the off ppl are ppl I now feel wrong about, that all of them will be.

And- I'm not ready to vote Llama or Epig yet, because I want to have something to more to present than 'feels'.

If you are looking for feedback on your posts, I will be happy to oblige, it wasn't meant to be a slight. I just had my own reasons for considering MM, and I didn't go further than that.

It's just that you seemed to have a lot to say about a variety of topics, but not as much to say about the player who earned your vote. You elaborated on many things, including people you feel good about who weren't necessarily even lynch candidates today (myself included), but I didn't feel you elaborated on your suspicion of MM to the same degree. Just has me a little curious, that's all

[Matahari]

With that said, I am only awaiting 5 votes at the moment. If those votes all arrive early, I will end the day early. But no rush.

Thanks, I'm going to go vote now, and I'll go with MM.

This vote surprised me a little. You hadn't really weighed in on my case against him, and you didn't really give a reason here either... you had just said earlier that MM was acting "wacky" and you lumped him into your gray area with a bunch of players you said you knew nothing about And you put Epi and Llama as the only people on the bad side of your fence, yet you didn't vote for one of them.

I said earlier that I had MM in with players who are off to me. I questioned him earlier in the game, then slacked off because humor charms me. But you, Made, Russ, and MM have been playing off at different times in the game, and that can be bad to ignore. I voted you and Made for the same reason, but have since re-evaluated. That doesn't mean that because some of the off ppl are ppl I now feel wrong about, that all of them will be.

And- I'm not ready to vote Llama or Epig yet, because I want to have something to more to present than 'feels'.

If you are looking for feedback on your posts, I will be happy to oblige, it wasn't meant to be a slight. I just had my own reasons for considering MM, and I didn't go further than that.

It's just that you seemed to have a lot to say about a variety of topics, but not as much to say about the player who earned your vote. You elaborated on many things, including people you feel good about who weren't necessarily even lynch candidates today (myself included), but I didn't feel you elaborated on your suspicion of MM to the same degree. Just has me a little curious, that's all

When wd and td go off, I promise I will requote my posts on why I think ppl playing oddly or flying low need to be looked at, if there is nothing else really damning to look at. And you may be right, sometimes I don't make as much sense as I think I do.

[Black Rock]

I'm going to vote MM. I wasn't sure if I was totally sold on the idea but after a brief review of his posts I am much more comfortable with it. I think this lynch will help me decide on a few other players.

[Bass_the_Clever]

TH, regarding your wanting to return to discussion on MM, can you link to your case on him? Or just maybe mention the major points about him and that will jar my memory.

Click this post and then keep reading down the page. Just read and absorb, form your own opinion, then come back to my analysis here...



Eventually MM makes a list of Kira suspects that fit a profile he seemed to have created on the fly... and until today, after being prompted by Bea herself to do so, he hasn't voted for or pursued any of those suspects. The question I ask myself is, is he even interested in catching Kira? The evidence says no.

I would love to point to the other times I tried to engage with MM in the same way as I did above, but after that exchange he tended to outright ignore my direct questions to him, skulking away into the shadows, only to accuse me yesterday of not bringing up any points about him. When I proved him wrong on that, he scurried back into the shadows once again. Hah!

I agree with a lot of stuff thats being talked about because of this post. I find it odd that MM had all those suspects and didn't really question any of them or vote any till pressed to. I will be voting MM today because of this.

Sorrry I just got off the road and realized I had to vote so now I'm going to bed . good night.

[Ricochet]

Well with less than half an hour left to vote, I feel I definitely can't build a proper reasoning on voting MM. TH's particular case on him does put him in a suspicious light, but I would only be following his [TH's] read rather than thinking it through and in a bigger picture - which is that I don't have a strong opinion on MM, currently. With the current tally, I guess we'll find out if it was a good issue to pick up on; hopefully it was and he is bad.

What I've focused more was on FZ., the cases against her and her rebuttals. I think Llama's case was a bit retroactive, but sufficient. I think Epig's initial case was even better. But some of FZ's rebuttal also strike me as genuine (and others already found it the same way) and, as I've said, I have to choose between believing her frustrations and pleads that her lynch will prove very wrong are either genuine or bluffing. She aggravated things with her unawareness of Russ' revealed secrets (in context of DH's theory that the Kiras are unaware of much of the developments). The whole discussion may have influenced Russ being written down in the Death Note, but it's not decisive, since Kira could have actually been aware all along. However, Epig updated his case on this Day to include Russ' "180 on FZ" and his "differently timed voted for her" and this is a case I find myself agreeing with a lot. I also don't understand why FZ. chose to downplay the relevance of Russ' check, in case he was indeed Mogi and got to check her; Mogi's role check accuracy is realistically one of the best the detectives had, the only other 50% procent check/find accuracy having been Matsuda's (who is also dead). I would also note that this aspect wasn't discussed enough by others afterwards (partly out of the regular disregard for Epig's cases or because other discussions and whatnot). But really, going back to her dismissive reaction to Russ' possible check on her and vote in accordance to that, I really can't understand it coming from a fellow detective, even if she was defensive about the whole assumption. In light of this, I've decided to vote for FZ.

[Tangrowth]

Hey guys! Just give me a little bit here to finish dinner and complete the Day post. Shouldn't be too long.

[DisgruntledPorcupine]

Yikes, looks like I'm running out of time. I guess when it comes to the main votegetters I feel most comfortable going after MM. I really haven't noticed him a ton this game despite him being the 3rd highest poster which is pretty off to me. Anyways I'm at a friend's watching a movie so seeyas.

[Epignosis]

Nobody asked me, but I think MM is a Shinigami.

[Turnip Head]

Nobody asked me, but I think MM is a Shinigami.

Nobody huh

[Tangrowth]

DAY 7

Who is Kira?

Poll ended at Sun Mar 08, 2015 8:44:40 pm


Bass_the_Clever
0
No votes
bea
3
bea (8), Metalmarsh89 (9), Boomslang (11) 14%
Black Rock
1
DharmaHelper (5) 5%
boo
0
No votes
Boomslang
0
No votes
DharmaHelper
0
No votes
DisgruntledPorcupine
0
No votes
Epignosis
0
No votes
FZ.
4
Epignosis (2), thellama73 (4), boo (16), Ricochet (20) 19%
juliets
0
No votes
Matahari
0
No votes
Metalmarsh89
9
Turnip Head (3), Spacedaisy (12), zeek (13), juliets (14), FZ. (15), Matahari (17), Black Rock (18), Bass_the_Clever (19), DisgruntledPorcupine (21) 43%
Ricochet
0
No votes
Russtifinko
0
No votes
Spacedaisy
0
No votes
thellama73
0
No votes
Turnip Head
0
No votes
zeek
0
No votes
Kira, the bastard! Why haven't those players caught him yet? (host, deadies, nons)
4
MovingPictures07 (1), AceofSpaces (6), Made (7), S~V~S (10) 19%
Total votes : 21

No missing votes!!!!!!

[Tangrowth]

Day 7: Happy With What You Have to Be Happy With

METALMARSH89: I'm getting lynched? Huh. How about that.
EPIGNOSIS: Nobody asked me, but I think MM is a Shinigami.

Sockface picked up his Lynch Note and was about to write down Metalmarsh89's name when suddenly he heard music. His hand stopped. He looked behind him to see Metalmarsh89 had a record player and hundreds of records.

SOCKFACE: Oooooh. Music!

Sockface stuck the Lynch Note in his bag.

TURNIP HEAD: What about the lynch?
SOCKFACE: Eh, there's always tomorrow.


No one has been lynched.

It is now Night 7.

You have 22 hours to send in your night actions.

[Tangrowth]

Please note that Night 7 is 22 hours, not 24. This is in order to get us back on a normal schedule. Night 7 will thus end at 6:58:49 CST.

[Ricochet]

Welp.

[Marmot]

I'm getting lynched? Huh. How about that.

[Epignosis]

And another lynch burned.

This is the second time Matahari voted for a rising vote-getter instead of FZ. for a less than satisfying reason.

Only three people so far are putting any faith in Russ' final breath. Makes me think there aren't very many detectives alive at all.

[Marmot]

And another lynch burned.

This is the second time Matahari voted for a rising vote-getter instead of FZ. for a less than satisfying reason.

Only three people so far are putting any faith in Russ' final breath. Makes me think there aren't very many detectives alive at all.

Your insight justifies my reasoning that you are not a detective Mr. Not-Detective.

[Turnip Head]

Only three people so far are putting any faith in Russ' final breath.

Because Russ' 50% certainty is something we should all put our unconditional faith in and not ask questions. Is what you seem to be saying.

[thellama73]

Okay, I am back now, and what happened in my absence is pure unadulterated madness. Are any of the detectives even trying this game? Wake up, people!

I also agree with Epi that Matahari's vote record is the height of opportunism.

[boo]

I am going over the voting record (as you do), and there are 4 people I want to bring up as a result. Those 4 are: Bass, Boomslang, Juliets, and zeek. I'm pointing these people out because I think their voting records are interesting. I'm including who they voted for, who got lynched with how many votes, who else (if there was anyone else) was a contender for being lynched, and how many votes they took. I'm not trying to contextualize it beyond that.

I'll pull the record for each to save you time (the overall voter number is changed to remove non-player votes):

Day 1 - Trice (detective) is lynched with 8 votes, was not a close lynch with the next highest voters taking 3 at the most.:
Bass voted for Trice (1st trice voter, first voter overall).
Boomslang voted for Trice (6th trice voter, 16th voter overall).
Juliets voted for Trice (4th trice voter, 12th voter overall).
Roxy (who zeek replaced) missed the vote.

Day 2 - BWT (yotsuba) is lynched with 8 votes, it was very close with Snowman at 7 and llama at 6.:
Bass voted for BWT (6th BWT voter, 22nd voter overall).
Boomslang voted for BWT (1st BWT voter, 12th voter overall).
Juliets voted for BWT (5th BWT voter, 21st voter overall).
zeek voted for Snowman (5th Snowman voter, 10th voter overall).

Day 3 - Snowman (sympathizer) is lynched with 18 votes, obviously no one else anywhere near close.:
Bass voted for Snowman (13th Snowman voter, 16th voter overall).
Boomslang voted for Snowman (4th Snowman voter, 6th voter overall).
Juliets voted for Snowman (7th Snowman voter, 9th voter overall).
zeek voted for Snowman (5th Snowman voter, 7th voter overall).

Day 4 - No one lynched, TH survived with 10 votes, made had 6 votes.:
Bass voted for Made (2nd made voter, 12th voter overall).
Boomslang voted for TH (9th TH voter, 20th voter overall).
Juliets voted for Made (4th made voter, 14th voter overall).
zeek voted for TH (4th TH voter, 8th voter overall).

Day 5 - Eloh (sympathizer) lynched with 17 votes, obviously no one else was close.:
Bass missed the vote (-).
Boomslang voted for Eloh (5th Eloh voter, 5th voter overall).
Juliets voted for Eloh (7th Eloh voter, 7th voter overall).
zeek voted for Eloh (8th Eloh voter, 8th voter overall).

Day 6 - Made (yotsbua) lynched with 8 votes, FZ took 4, bea took 3, so not really a close one.:
Bass voted for Made (4th Made voter, 10th voter overall).
Boomslang voted for Made (5th Made voter, 11th voter overall).
Juliets voted for FZ (4th FZ voter, 14th voter overall).
zeek voted for Made (3rd Made voter, 8th voter overall).

Day 7 - No one lynched, MM took the most with 9 votes, once again FZ at 4 and bea at 3, so also not really a close one.:
Bass voted for MM (8th MM voter, 15th voter overall).
Boomslang voted for bea (3rd bea voter, 7th voter overall).
Juliets voted for MM (4th MM voter, 10th voter overall).
zeek voted for MM (3rd MM voter, 9th voter overall).

So... what's my point? I think these 4 people have an interesting voting record, I think they're all in a fairly similar spot:
Bass has 49 posts.
Boomslang has 47 posts.
Juliets has 142 posts.
zeek has 87 posts.

Some variation in the number of posts (obviously juliets is well ahead of the others in that area), but I think it's fair to say all four of them have been fairly low radar players in this game.

So what's my point (version 2.0)?:
I was looking for other potential people for Mikami (and Kira/sympathizers in general) before I voted for FZ, or for anyone else to bring up someone I think was a good potential suspect for the role. That did not happen (I mean... and MM lynch? Who has MM played the most like this game? TH. What happened when an attempt was made to lynch TH? Nothing. What should have been the reasonable assumption a lynch attempt on MM would probably result in? Nothing.), so I went with FZ (I still might, but I'd like to see, and help make, an actual attempt to find other potential Mikami's in case people do not want to lynch FZ again tomorrow, or we do lynch FZ but she doesn't wind up actually being Mikami. Or to find people I think could be other Kira or sympathizers if FZ is lynched and is Mikami). These are the four people I'd like to see included in that discussion, since I think there's a good chance Mikami and sympathizers/Kira in general, are playing a low flying/blendy game.

Final point: I'm not saying I think all four of them (or even more than 1 or 2 of them if I'm right in the kind of people we should be looking at) are baddies, I haven't done a close read of any of them recently (I haven't done a full read of juliets or zeek, and I built cases on both boom and bass earlier in the game, but haven't paid either a lot of attention since then), which is the next step for trying to figure out any of them are actually bad, I'm just saying that's something I would like to try and do before casting my next vote, and I think if other people agree with me that their voting records are interesting, it's something you should make an effort to do. The detectives (in terms of lynches) have done a fairly good job, with only 1 actual detective being lynched so far. Outside of the Yotsuba, who knows if they can be trusted, so who (outside of non-lynched Yotsuba) can say whether those were a good use of lynches for the detectives. And then two Sympathizers have been lynched (how often do you see a game where at Night 7, more confirmed baddies have been lynched than confirmed civvies?). But the lynches where no one died worry me, because those were lynches where that result seemed (to me) to be quite predictable, and if we keep up doing lynches in that way, it only serves to help the Kira, since they'll just be able to continue working at their win condition by NKing, while the detectives pretty much cease working at theirs by wasting lynches.

[boo]

I've decided to read zeek first.

I was going along, and up until this post from D2, the blendiness was strong.

I don't feel good about voting for anybody, but I have to because I need to sleep. I've looked into most of the main players being talked about and this post pinged me harder than others.

Buuuuuuuut, it is a social deduction game. Maybe good civvies behave differently, if this were live, I'd be looking at faces and body language. On a bulletin board, we look at posts, and something about how I post strikes some as a Stone-Cold-Kira. I'm not disappointed, but I want to improve and better support my team in the future, while still having fun. Maybe one day I will earn the "Well, that's just him, he's always like that" status that Epi and Russ seem to benefit from.

I'm not voting Snowman based on jumping onto bandwagons, but that is a factor, I'm voting Snowman because the underlined section worries me. This isn't Donner Party, there's no civ team per se. This terminology could be poor language selection by a new player or it could be a slip. Either way, he's got my vote because I just don't feel comfortable placing it anywhere else.

There was discussion at the time about his reason for voting Snowman here, and I still think that this reason was highly questionable. Was the eventual Snowman lynch a good result? Yes. Was this initial reason for voting Snowman from zeek a good one? I don't see how anyone can make the argument that it was.

But... then I go back to a previous post from zeek (he made it less than an hour before he made the post where he voted for Snowman):

I have skimmed and gleamed what I can in the available time I have at the moment. I feel bad voting right now because I'm not where I should be with the thread but I don't want to abstain because I don't believe that helps anyone.

llama - He does get called out early and sometimes lynched because of it. I believe he's being helpful and I won't be voting that way today.
Epi - Personally didn't see him as bad, but the Shingami Eye Deal cricked my brow. I considered it a possibility myself, which is why I'm hesitant about voting for him. Still, seems like normal Epi to me.
FZ - Not sure how I feel about her, I find myself agreeing and disagreeing in equal measure.
bea - not feeling the case against her, seems like normal bea to me.
TH - Not been super-talkative or helpful, and he usually is. I love the list though and I may make one at the start of the new week. Don't like him voting so early and then saying he doesn't think llama is bad anymore. Seems like an easy way to avoid responsibility for his vote.
Snowman - Following Donner Party, he doesn't seem that big of a talker to me but you have to be when people challenge you on things. I'd like to hear more from him.
boo - Seemed the voice of reason along with Epi on D0 - full disclosure is I would have voted for the safe standard lynches as well - however the back and forth with llama has made me question this.
Zomberella - One thing I noticed is she used the term "lunched" instead of lynched. Carry over from Donner obviously. She has since said she likes the idea of "lynching" Snowman. Not enough to garner a vote, however nobody corrected her in-thread I believe. Pure speculation but BTSC teammate could have corrected her. Just want it noted.

Did I miss any of the apparent candidates?

All in all, I don't feel comfortable voting for anybody right now.

Linki linki linki

The Snowman post he quoted and used to justify voting Snowman was made hours before zeek came in and made the second quote I pulled from him. At the time, his thoughts on Snowman pretty much started and stopped at wanting to see more from Snowman. Then, without seeing anything new from Snowman to use to justify voting for him, he went back to something he had already seen (and hadn't previously found suspicious enough to mention) and used it to justify voting for Snowman.

So that's a vote that all around, I find very questionable and an attempt (that didn't entirely work since zeek took flak for the reason he used to vote for Snowman, but not really a lot, and certainly not suspicion that has stuck with him).

Then there was the discussion about the reason he used to vote for Snowman. Imo, he became weirdly aggressively defensive at this point, calling the suspicion for the reason bullshit, arguing there's no such thing as a civ team, calling TH a troublemaker (TH was the person mostly arguing with zeek about the reason for his snowman vote), but then that discussion kind of fizzled out, and zeek (while continuing to discuss it) became less aggressive about it, and just made it all seem like a misunderstanding in how people use the terminology.

Then there was a string of posts about confusion of people voting so early (something that has continued during the game). I'm with him on that one.

During D3, he started out with saying he was considering an Epi vote. That got expanded to also include Snowman, then also Zomba, TH, and MM.

This post:

Forgot to reply to this due to EPIc posts.

My problem with Epi right now is that MM's case was good. It showed how inconsistent he has been and his responses have done little to convince me he's good. His tone, deflated and dejected, has however. So I'm back and forth on him.

Then we have Snowman. His responses don't seem genuine to me and he doesn't actually seem frustrated by all this, half-heartedly NO U'ing his detractors.

Still a fair amount of time before the lynch ends but, honestly, these guys may be aligned with Kira but I really doubt either is one.

If not them, who?

I don't know, I feel the Kira would be playing a very simple game not really drawing attention to themselves, so they could be hiding in half the players in the game. Based on aggressive and odd behaviour, I'd tentatively cross off a handful of players from the Kira list.

Is one I just want to point out. I agree with zeek that Kira playing a simple, non-aggressive game seems like a strong possibility. So I'm curious if A) If zeek would agree he can be included as someone playing a game that is similar to what he and I both agree (at the time he made this post) is the type of game the Kira could be playing. And B) If he still thinks it's likely that's the kind of game Kira are playing.

But then there's this:

See above. Safe play =/= flying under radar.

It was after how he had said he thought Zomba was a baddie because she had been playing it safe.

But when I look at this response: "I don't know, I feel the Kira would be playing a very simple game not really drawing attention to themselves, so they could be hiding in half the players in the game. Based on aggressive and odd behaviour, I'd tentatively cross off a handful of players from the Kira list." And compare it to playing safe and flying under the radar as not being the same, I'm not really sure I understand where zeek is drawing that line to distinguish between a player playing a safe game and a player flying low. If the players not playing a safe game are the aggressive players, doesn't that mean the safe players are the players who aren't being aggressive, which means (comparatively) they are the players flying low?

Now, all that, doesn't necessarily really make me all that suspicious of zeek, I think it's just me not agreeing with how he defines safe play vs. flying under the radar. But I do find how he phrased things that he thinks to be inconsistent, and giving him the benefit of the doubt there over that kind of inconsistency isn't how I do things. So, it results in some suspicion created. I'd at least like to see him discuss what he thinks, what he meant, etc. The kind of thing that I don't think was adequately questioned at the time.

Then he did some puzzle solving.

Post-puzzle stuff, there hasn't been very much from him. He does enough posting to make it seem like he's part of the discussion and lay the ground work for his vote, then he votes without much to it. He likes to wait and see who the top contenders in a lynch are, and go from there. I can appreciate that, it's what I like to do. I think the difference is, there isn't much substance to what he says, he just kind of puts out there what he does and doesn't agree with, and votes accordingly. It doesn't allow for much accountability for his votes. To me, this type of game goes back to exactly the kind of game zeek said he thinks the Kira are likely to play, a safe game. Don't do much to get suspicion, but be around enough to avoid being seen as not participating. So, I guess I can see what he means when he says there's a difference between safe play and low flying (I still think of what he's doing as low flying, but if he sees himself as more active than people less active then him, I can get it, it's just a matter of perspective), but he is still playing a safe game from any perspective I think.

So... I'm suspicious of zeek now. I agree with him on some things, I can see where he's coming from on other things, but I think the things we agree on (the style of game the baddies in this game are likely using) make him suspicious. And that he has recognized and discussed the signs to look for to find a baddie, but exhibited those signs, makes me think he recognized the best way to approach the game as baddie, and then potentially made use of that method.

Right now, if I was actually doing all this to get ready to vote, he wouldn't have earned my vote over FZ. But since there's lots of time between now and the next vote (and lots of time to discuss things with him), there's lots of room for that to change.

[zeek]

I haven't been the most talkative this game but that's due to RL. Anyone whose played with me before can tell you I'm a high poster when I have the time, but a lot of weird shit has happened this game and I haven't had the time to investigate all the possibilities I want to.

I'm not going over my Snowman vote again. It was my first day in the game and it's far more difficult to have anything to go on when you haven't been emotionally invested reading posts (as I hadn't following the game before replacing in). Have I had some poor reasons for voting the way I did? Yes. Have I lynched a detective? No. I haven't lynched a Kira either, but nobody has.

As for Zomba, I think she was playing it safe but that's a matter of opinion. Am I playing it safe? Damn right I am. I will own everything I've said and done in this game but the truth is I just haven't had the time to get into it properly. When I do, you'll see me posting a lot and discussing more, but I've had to play it safe. By all means, twist those words however you want but do not think for a second I've been intentionally flying under the radar. I've given my opinions but my opinions are few because I don't have a proper handle on the game. It's that simple and sad.

Non-aggressive players aren't ALL playing it safe or flying low, and just because you can't see where I draw the line it doesn't mean I'm wrong.

I would like to invite L to investigate me and save everyone the trouble of debating my terminology in the future

[zeek]

Also boo, your last paragraph really doesn't make any sense to me.

You think because we agree on things that's suspicious, but then plenty of people disagree with us, so how is that a baddie thing? And why would I say what to look for in a baddie and then intentionally adopt those characteristics? It's upsetting you think I'd be that stupid.

[boo]

Also boo, your last paragraph really doesn't make any sense to me.

You think because we agree on things that's suspicious, but then plenty of people disagree with us, so how is that a baddie thing? And why would I say what to look for in a baddie and then intentionally adopt those characteristics? It's upsetting you think I'd be that stupid.

We agree on the style baddies are likely to play. You've played using that style. So yes, that's a potential baddie thing.

You only estimated you'd eliminate half the players from being potential baddies based on the safe play method being the baddie strategy. That's still lots of people left who can play like that, and not all of them can be bad. But you recognized it, you discussed it, you still seemed to know the people most likely to be lynched are the more aggressive players (and have voted many times in ways inconsistent with thinking people like that are baddies, which means in your votes, you aren't trying to hunt baddies). All of that put together, plus that you have been busy, gives you the means to excuse the way you've been playing (that you agree is the way at least some baddies probably are), while still suspecting other people with similar behaviour (but without pursuing them with your own vote).

[boo]

I haven't been the most talkative this game but that's due to RL. Anyone whose played with me before can tell you I'm a high poster when I have the time, but a lot of weird shit has happened this game and I haven't had the time to investigate all the possibilities I want to.

I'm not going over my Snowman vote again. It was my first day in the game and it's far more difficult to have anything to go on when you haven't been emotionally invested reading posts (as I hadn't following the game before replacing in). Have I had some poor reasons for voting the way I did? Yes. Have I lynched a detective? No. I haven't lynched a Kira either, but nobody has.

As for Zomba, I think she was playing it safe but that's a matter of opinion. Am I playing it safe? Damn right I am. I will own everything I've said and done in this game but the truth is I just haven't had the time to get into it properly. When I do, you'll see me posting a lot and discussing more, but I've had to play it safe. By all means, twist those words however you want but do not think for a second I've been intentionally flying under the radar. I've given my opinions but my opinions are few because I don't have a proper handle on the game. It's that simple and sad.

Non-aggressive players aren't ALL playing it safe or flying low, and just because you can't see where I draw the line it doesn't mean I'm wrong.

I would like to invite L to investigate me and save everyone the trouble of debating my terminology in the future

As for this post:

1) You're already trying to shut down one area of discussion, when you agree you haven't discussed much. You don't get to set those terms, I'm giving reasons I suspect you, to give you the opportunity to respond. Refusing to discuss something that wasn't fully addressed in the limited way it was previously discussed isn't helpful. It completely goes against " I will own everything I've said and done in this game".

2) You say you'll own what you've said and done, after refusing to own something you've said and done. And the fact is (and you've also agreed with this) is that there isn't much you've said and done for you to own. What little there is, I'm trying to discuss with you so you can be held accountable for it, and you claim you're fine with that, but then you're also trying to avoid accountability.

And you finish by trying to reduce the suspicions I have of you as nothing but a disagreement in terminology, while expecting an anonymous civ to choose to pick you so they can discuss it with you, after talking about how you're unwilling to discuss it.

[zeek]

Okay boo, what you're essentially doing right now is trying your upmost to try and make me talk myself in a corner. I've said all there is to say about my Snowman vote and butted heads with TH enough for you to reread that which you already have. It is explained as much as it can be. I can either be honest and OWN that I didn't have good reasons, or lie to you and say I did. I've already said I didn't.

I am compleyely accountable for my actions, lynch me for them if you want, but how can I be accountable for them if I don't give you the reasons why I've done things? My work life is hectic at the moment and I don't have the time to be invested in this game. Does that mean I've made poor reasoning? YES. So by saying that I'm avoiding responsibility, but if I'm not honest I'm lying which means I'd have to pull a load of bullshit out of thin air and then have to be accountable for that. I'll choose honesty. Lynch me and you won't be losing the biggest contribution to the game for sure, but you'll still be losing a detective.

[zeek]

As for the Kira behavioural study, I changed my thoughts on that days ago. The suspicions fly around so fast and furiously in this game that there would be no point for the to play a safe game because anybody could be lynched any day. There's a middle ground of non-aggressive, at the forefront player that is the best best.

[FZ.]

First of all, why isn't anyone concerned that Epi said he thinks MM is a shinigami after the vote was closed? If he thought it was a waste of vote, shouldn't he have tried to tell us not to vote there? Yeah, he said vote me, but he didn't say he thought MM was a waste of time. It seems very reasonable to conclude that he doesn't care if we waste lynches. In his eyes, either we waste a lynch, or lynch a detective (me).


Second, am I wrong, or is Near the only detective who can't be lynched (other than L, but then someone dies instead of him)? Doesn't this makes the likelihood of MM being bad pretty high?
I'm not sure I get how the mechanics work here, but how are we supposed to get unlynchable people to die?

[Ricochet]

Second, am I wrong, or is Near the only detective who can't be lynched (other than L, but then someone dies instead of him)? Doesn't this makes the likelihood of MM being bad pretty high?
I'm not sure I get how the mechanics work here, but how are we supposed to get unlynchable people to die?

Near and Mello are both unlynchable (but also powerless) until L dies. Where does it say that L cannot be lynched, though?

MM's likelihood of being a bad unlynchable are about the same as TH's, at this point, I think.

All unlynchable "humans" can become lynchable at some point. All unlynchable Shinigamis are not be lynchable at all, at least judging from the revealed secrets (only Rem could sacrifice herself for Misa's sake).

[Turnip Head]

Interesting stuff Boo. I haven't read through all of your analysis yet but I certainly will soon. In the meantime, I have two new suspects of my own based on how these players behaved during the MM non-lynch that I will be investigating as potential Light and Misa suspects.

Unfortunately, I think at this point the only Kira we can lynch is still Mikami (X-Kira), and Mikami could be just about anyone, so I'm really not sure how to proceed in that sense.

[Ricochet]

Interesting stuff Boo. I haven't read through all of your analysis yet but I certainly will soon. In the meantime, I have two new suspects of my own based on how these players behaved during the MM non-lynch that I will be investigating as potential Light and Misa suspects.

Unfortunately, I think at this point the only Kira we can lynch is still Mikami (X-Kira), and Mikami could be just about anyone, so I'm really not sure how to proceed in that sense.

Misa can also be lynched, unless she has relinquished the DN at this point and she is unlynchable for up to three days. Do you think she did that, since you rule her out? If yes, why?