[END] Talking Heads Mafia (RYM #90)

[Marmot]

Choutas, you're telling me that we've been reading and going back and rereading and making cases all day today, and 5 minutes before the deadline, you're going to "put your neck out" with an obscure comment that looks borderline OB?

What?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Choutas, have you done anything prior to this point to suggest you have a town read on seaside? Hurry.

[Elohcin]

I find Choutas' defense of seaside suspect, by the way. So that's at least a tiny bit encouraging.

I've supected Chou all along but mostly b/c of a gut thing

[Diiny]

I encourage others to vote seaside in light of this revelation. At this juncture, I'm not budging from a seaside vote.

If he's good, then Choutas has access to info, God help him.

It he's bad, then Choutas is a Cootie, and God help him.

Wait, this is smart!

Seaside

[Choutas]

Choutas, you're telling me that we've been reading and going back and rereading and making cases all day today, and 5 minutes before the deadline, you're going to "put your neck out" with an obscure comment that looks borderline OB?

What?

JUST TRUST ME. Seaside is town. This lynch will end up killing a townie.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Yeah okay that's good enough Epi.

I'll stay put.

[Epignosis]

ELOH

What do you think of a seaside lynch?

Looks like a lot went down while I was watching netflix. And I only have 6 minutes to catch up :o Quck give me a summary of seaside

It's Day 7. Choutas defends seaside but cites "Infodumping" as a reason he can't say more. But on his Day 7 rainbow list, seaside was in the middle, not at the top.

Furthermore, there was no Night 6, so Choutas couldn't have gained info in the interim.

Lynch seaside, and then lynch Choutas either way next for playing a foul trick at the eleventh hour.

[Choutas]

My first rainbow reads.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

and we are just giving up on JJJ being bad as he is voting seaside?

I'm going to post less frequently on Day 8 if it makes you feel better.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

My first rainbow reads.

That was on Day 7.

It's currently Day 7.

Why didn't your rainbow reflect your town read on seaside?

[Marmot]

Choutas, you're telling me that we've been reading and going back and rereading and making cases all day today, and 5 minutes before the deadline, you're going to "put your neck out" with an obscure comment that looks borderline OB?

What?

JUST TRUST ME. Seaside is town. This lynch will end up killing a townie.

After what Epignosis pulled up, not happening.

[Choutas]

ELOH

What do you think of a seaside lynch?

Looks like a lot went down while I was watching netflix. And I only have 6 minutes to catch up :o Quck give me a summary of seaside

It's Day 7. Choutas defends seaside but cites "Infodumping" as a reason he can't say more. But on his Day 7 rainbow list, seaside was in the middle, not at the top.

Furthermore, there was no Night 6, so Choutas couldn't have gained info in the interim.

Lynch seaside, and then lynch Choutas either way next for playing a foul trick at the eleventh hour.

OK just be the first when seaside flips town to acknowledge my good will to save him.

linki: cause you wouldn't believe me if I told you.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

linki: cause you wouldn't believe me if I told you.

You're talking to the guy who defended a confirmed scum for days and days. I'm willing to listen, but you're going to have to speak.

[Marmot]

Choutas, you're telling me that we've been reading and going back and rereading and making cases all day today, and 5 minutes before the deadline, you're going to "put your neck out" with an obscure comment that looks borderline OB?

What?

JUST TRUST ME. Seaside is town. This lynch will end up killing a townie.

This doesn't at all account for how a lynch of Jay or Floyd would result.

Honestly, if seaside flips mafia, I believe that Floyd and Jay should be cleared.

But if you're right about seaside, well I guess we'll see how things turn out first.

[Russtifinko]

Day 7 rainbow list

Epignosis

motel room
Ricochet
Metalmarsh89
Matt F

Russtifinko
JJJ
seaside
Bullzeye
Strawhenge
Roxy
Elohcin
RadicalFuzz
Diiny

bcornett24
DrWilgy
Black Rock

sig
fingersplints
TheFloyd73

Choutas, you're telling me that we've been reading and going back and rereading and making cases all day today, and 5 minutes before the deadline, you're going to "put your neck out" with an obscure comment that looks borderline OB?

What?

These are good points. I don't trust Choutas a bit here, and revealing baddie BTSC would be info dumping. Defending a teammate this late would also be sticking your neck out. Went with my strongest lynchable read. seaside

Linki: Epi, 2 cautions:

1) Deciding who to lynch the day before the lynch rarely works. I don't see how Choutas looks bad if seaside flips civ, could you explain? Unless you mean he purposely offered a defense so suspect he knew it would convince more people to switch, which seems very involved.

2) In Death Note, llama knew I was civ and purposely read me in the middle of his list so I wouldn't be NK'ed. It may not be super likely, but it's at least possible this is happening here.

Linki again: pleas elet me post.

[Elohcin]

I voted seaside

who was the person to bring up this suspicion?

[Choutas]

linki: cause you wouldn't believe me if I told you.

You're talking to the guy who defended a confirmed scum for days and days. I'm willing to listen, but you're going to have to speak.

Tomorrow it's five o'clock in the morning.
Goodbye everyone.

PS: Scum/SK please kill me tonight. Seriously kill me. I don't have the power to continue, you would do me a favor. I'll owe you one irl.

[Marmot]

2) In Death Note, llama knew I was civ and purposely read me in the middle of his list so I wouldn't be NK'ed. It may not be super likely, but it's at least possible this is happening here.

Good point Russti.

But now we wait and see. I hope you're wrong.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I was hoping Choutas would be able to give that explanation without it being handed to him first.

[Epignosis]

Linki: Epi, 2 cautions:

1) Deciding who to lynch the day before the lynch rarely works. I don't see how Choutas looks bad if seaside flips civ, could you explain? Unless you mean he purposely offered a defense so suspect he knew it would convince more people to switch, which seems very involved.

2) In Death Note, llama knew I was civ and purposely read me in the middle of his list so I wouldn't be NK'ed. It may not be super likely, but it's at least possible this is happening here.

Linki again: pleas elet me post.

1) I think Choutas is a lying liar. seaside couldn't defend what he meant about context, and Choutas couldn't either. The lynch is close enough, that Choutas comes in with an eleventh hour "infodump" clearing seaside. Bullshit. If seaside is a civilian, then this was a piss poor play.

2) We had rainbow lists in Death Note? I don't recall those.

[motel room]

Alright going back to this

I actually wouldn't be opposed to a seaside lynch if there's time - dude's been acting weird since D1. However, motel room voted for him, and motel room just took a big jump up my suspect list.

I'd definitely be down to try to pull votes onto motel room.

Why?

Mainly, he's throwing out totally unsupported opinions, every so often and saying we should believe them just because.

He was on Rico for days for being bad, and then suddenly N5 he thought Rico was good "despite really wanting you to be scum".

Since D3 he's been saying JJJ, espers, Diiny, and Zebra were bad, for no other reason than that they voted Rico on D3. (He later retracted his suspicion of Zebra upon learning Zebra was a dead civ when he posted this, and he's since back off of also-dead-civ espers.) This post in particular reeks:

anyway, i reakon there is a strong chance one of those three are scum
i'm not saying those three are my most suspicious (or suspicious at all) but i think 1 of the 3 could be scum

He hasn't offered even a modicum of a case against any of them, but is trying like hell to get people to join him in a lynch just because. He even tried to use JJJ's move away from Mac yesterday to get Diiny.

Today, though, he's all about the easy JJJ lynch. He has precisely one point of evidence: he's been going on about JJJ's Mac connection all day, despite the fact that everyone is perfectly clear on it. I think he's trying to lock up the lynch without making it look like he is. Which actually makes me wonder if my vote should be on Floyd after all. If there has been a save attempt in the thread so far, this is the one. It's just subtle enough that people might miss it, and just unsubstantiated enough that he might be able to laugh it off.

motel room for now. Come join! It's a nice big room, and we have free HBO and a continental breakfast.

It isn't free. It's included in the price of the room.

Some economist.

rekt

Linki: Oh wow, big push toward seaside here. Holy cow. That's a bit nerve-wracking.

motel room, my suspicion of Mac arose because he was willing to lynch civs for no good reason. I've suspected people for less. I'll read you in full by tomorrow, but since you won't be lynched today and I'm short on time it's not worth the bother. As it stands now, I consider you a major suspect. I see you voted me for most of the day - what do you find suspicious about me?

Just so its clear, cos I dont think it's clear, your answers to Epi are regarding seaside right? Cos I didn't do any of that stuff but you're talking about both of us in the "Why?" post Epi asked about.

I found you suspicious from the way Mac treated you and how his "suspicions" of you never panned out. That and how you seem to pop in just to drop a vote and then vanish. But now I also have your actions this end of day to read and figure out how I feel.

[Diiny]

Personal highlight of the day phase:

Floyd not saying why he was voting J, instead citing MetalMarsh's big post... about seaside.

Great stuff.

[Sloonei]

Day 7: The Luckiest Day

Day 7 has ended. Seaside has been lynched. He was The Great Curve

It is now Night 7. You have 23 hours to get your night actions in.

[Sloonei]

DAY 7

Who was in cahoots with Macdougall?

Poll ended at Wed Oct 21, 2015 9:59 pm


bcornett24
1
DrWilgy (22) 4%
Black Rock
0
No votes
Bullzeye
0
No votes
Choutas
1
Ricochet (19) 4%
Diiny
0
No votes
DrWilgy
1
RadicalFuzz (11) 4%
Elohcin
0
No votes
Epignosis
0
No votes
fingersplints
0
No votes
JaggedJimmyJay
3
seaside (6), TheFloyd73 (10), sig (17) 11%
Matt F
0
No votes
Metalmarsh89
0
No votes
motel room
0
No votes
RadicalFuzz
0
No votes
Ricochet
0
No votes
Roxy
0
No votes
Russtifinko
0
No votes
seaside
8
Epignosis (20), motel room (21), Metalmarsh89 (23), JaggedJimmyJay (24), bcornett24 (25), Russtifinko (26), Diiny (27), Elohcin (28) 29%
sig
0
No votes
Strawhenge
0
No votes
TheFloyd73
4
Choutas (7), Strawhenge (13), Matt F (15), Bullzeye (16) 14%
antreas72heep (hosts, deadies, non-players)
10
Sloonei (1), HamburgerBoy (2), MacDougall (3), Sorsha (4), a2thezebra (5), MovingPictures07 (8), Draconus (9), juliets (12), bea (14), Golden (18) 36%
Total votes : 28

[Marmot]

I don't have words.

[Epignosis]

I don't have words.

I had to close the tab that had my baseball bat gif.

I love that gif.

[motel room]

So one of the three players he's been going on about (espers, jjj, diiny) have vote manipulation powers? I don't get why he was so adamant there was a scum in there and he never bothered to explain. Are there no town vote manipulation roles?

[bcornett24]

So one of the three players he's been going on about (espers, jjj, diiny) have vote manipulation powers? I don't get why he was so adamant there was a scum in there and he never bothered to explain. Are there no town vote manipulation roles?

Well if that's true then there are only 2 possibilities left being jjj and diiny as espers obviously had no such powers.

Reviewing roles.

[sig]

Okay JJJ was saved this is similar to what could have happened yesterday, Mac vs Diiny. JJJ is mafia those who pushed seaside are also most likely mafia.

[Epignosis]

Okay JJJ was saved this is similar to what could have happened yesterday, Mac vs Diiny. JJJ is mafia those who pushed seaside are also most likely mafia.

[Elohcin]

I ask again...who came up with the sudden suspicion of seaside?

[bcornett24]

So one of the three players he's been going on about (espers, jjj, diiny) have vote manipulation powers? I don't get why he was so adamant there was a scum in there and he never bothered to explain. Are there no town vote manipulation roles?

Well if that's true then there are only 2 possibilities left being jjj and diiny as espers obviously had no such powers.

Reviewing roles.

LC - is dead - (Nothing But) Flowers – Can't get used to the lifestyle brought about by the new players. Its vote is worth x3 against players from the opposite forum. It cannot be harmed by night powers used by players from the same forum. If it carries out the kill, it cannot kill players from the same forum.

Drugs – Slips drugs to a player of its choice every even night. That player will start every subsequent lynch with two votes against them. If it carries out the kill, it cannot kill any player it hasn't drugged.

These are the only 2 mafia related voting manipulation roles.

On the other hand, there are 9 roles that relate to voting in some form.

[Diiny]

Okay JJJ was saved this is similar to what could have happened yesterday, Mac vs Diiny. JJJ is mafia those who pushed seaside are also most likely mafia.

Do you understand why everyone voted seaside?

[Diiny]

So one of the three players he's been going on about (espers, jjj, diiny) have vote manipulation powers? I don't get why he was so adamant there was a scum in there and he never bothered to explain. Are there no town vote manipulation roles?

Unsure when vote manipulation comes into this, am I being completely stupid?

[Epignosis]

I ask again...who came up with the sudden suspicion of seaside?

I already made up my pallet.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I think these are all the vote-relevant roles which are potentially still in the game. Please let me know if I omitted something.

Pulled Up - Every time a non-civilian player is lynched, its vote increases by 1. Conversely, if three civilian players are lynched consecutively, its vote decreases by 1. Its vote can be worth negative.

I Zimbra – Insanifies a player of its choice every night, forcing that player to speak in another language of its choice the subsequent day. If that player is from the same forum as I Zimbra, its vote is worth x3; if it is from the opposing forum, it is worth negative x3. The value of the insanified player's vote is unknown to everyone except I Zimbra.

Once in a Lifetime – Asks a player a multiple choice question every night. It must alternate between members of the two forums. If it correctly predicts its target's answer, they both gain an extra vote to be used at any time. If it is incorrect, Once in a Lifetime must vote the same player as it did yesterday; if that player is dead, then it loses one of its extra votes.

Love for Sale – Every night, it offers to sell its subsequent lynch vote to all players. The first player that PMs the host accepting the deal may control how Love for Sale votes the subsequent day. (Secrets)

Blind – Cannot be night killed. At the start of the game, its vote will go to the person voted. In future lynches, however, Blind may not know who it actually is voting for. Any time that a civilian is lynched, then its lynch vote is secretly randomized among the player it voted and the one alphabetically above and below its vote. For every civilian lynch, the possible vote recipient range is increased by one player above and below its current range. In contrast, any time that a mafia is lynched, the range decreases by one player above and below its current range.

Drugs – Slips drugs to a player of its choice every even night. That player will start every subsequent lynch with two votes against them. If it carries out the kill, it cannot kill any player it hasn't drugged.

It seems to me that seaside was suspicious of espers, Diiny, and I because he observed discrepancy in the Rico bandwagon that suggested to him that someone was scum. This only makes sense if it was two extra votes specifically due to the Drugs role. I don't know how seaside's role worked exactly, but would he not just see the name of the player placing those two extra votes? That would eliminate the need for the whole "1 of these 3" thing. He may have just misinterpreted the evidence, there are a pile of town roles that affect voting and even more roles with *secrets* so who knows.

Basically all this tells me is that seaside thought Diiny or I was Drugs, but I don't understand why he'd have any doubt about which one.

[Marmot]

I ask again...who came up with the sudden suspicion of seaside?

I'm certainly a guilty party.

[Diiny]

Oh shit because of his role. I'm fukin dum

[Epignosis]

I think these are all the vote-relevant roles which are potentially still in the game. Please let me know if I omitted something.

Pulled Up - Every time a non-civilian player is lynched, its vote increases by 1. Conversely, if three civilian players are lynched consecutively, its vote decreases by 1. Its vote can be worth negative.

I Zimbra – Insanifies a player of its choice every night, forcing that player to speak in another language of its choice the subsequent day. If that player is from the same forum as I Zimbra, its vote is worth x3; if it is from the opposing forum, it is worth negative x3. The value of the insanified player's vote is unknown to everyone except I Zimbra.

Once in a Lifetime – Asks a player a multiple choice question every night. It must alternate between members of the two forums. If it correctly predicts its target's answer, they both gain an extra vote to be used at any time. If it is incorrect, Once in a Lifetime must vote the same player as it did yesterday; if that player is dead, then it loses one of its extra votes.

Love for Sale – Every night, it offers to sell its subsequent lynch vote to all players. The first player that PMs the host accepting the deal may control how Love for Sale votes the subsequent day. (Secrets)

Blind – Cannot be night killed. At the start of the game, its vote will go to the person voted. In future lynches, however, Blind may not know who it actually is voting for. Any time that a civilian is lynched, then its lynch vote is secretly randomized among the player it voted and the one alphabetically above and below its vote. For every civilian lynch, the possible vote recipient range is increased by one player above and below its current range. In contrast, any time that a mafia is lynched, the range decreases by one player above and below its current range.

Drugs – Slips drugs to a player of its choice every even night. That player will start every subsequent lynch with two votes against them. If it carries out the kill, it cannot kill any player it hasn't drugged.

It seems to me that seaside was suspicious of espers, Diiny, and I because he observed discrepancy in the Rico bandwagon that suggested to him that someone was scum. This only makes sense if it was two extra votes specifically due to the Drugs role. I don't know how seaside's role worked exactly, but would he not just see the name of the player placing those two extra votes? That would eliminate the need for the whole "1 of these 3" thing. He may have just misinterpreted the evidence, there are a pile of town roles that affect voting and even more roles with *secrets* so who knows.

Basically all this tells me is that seaside thought Diiny or I was Drugs, but I don't understand why he'd have any doubt about which one.

It isn't complicated. I've had a role like this before. It worked like this:

A: 2 votes
B: 3 votes
C: 4 votes

A got lynched.

D: Using my power.

Host: "A had 4 votes, B had 3 votes, and C had 3 votes"

Basic idea, but there it is.

[DrWilgy]

I leave for afew hours, get ready to sleep, check my phone in bed, all hell breaks loose.

I'll be back in the morning.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Okay JJJ was saved this is similar to what could have happened yesterday, Mac vs Diiny. JJJ is mafia those who pushed seaside are also most likely mafia.

I think you're bad.

You were completely ready to capitalize on The Cakewalk JJJ Lynch, but at the last moment when others were discussing other possibilities you started to "have doubts" -- and only because I was playing hard as I have been doing the whole game anyway.

Now that a townie is dead in my place, you're moving to capitalize again without a thought.

[Marmot]

I think these are all the vote-relevant roles which are potentially still in the game. Please let me know if I omitted something.

Pulled Up - Every time a non-civilian player is lynched, its vote increases by 1. Conversely, if three civilian players are lynched consecutively, its vote decreases by 1. Its vote can be worth negative.

I Zimbra – Insanifies a player of its choice every night, forcing that player to speak in another language of its choice the subsequent day. If that player is from the same forum as I Zimbra, its vote is worth x3; if it is from the opposing forum, it is worth negative x3. The value of the insanified player's vote is unknown to everyone except I Zimbra.

Once in a Lifetime – Asks a player a multiple choice question every night. It must alternate between members of the two forums. If it correctly predicts its target's answer, they both gain an extra vote to be used at any time. If it is incorrect, Once in a Lifetime must vote the same player as it did yesterday; if that player is dead, then it loses one of its extra votes.

Love for Sale – Every night, it offers to sell its subsequent lynch vote to all players. The first player that PMs the host accepting the deal may control how Love for Sale votes the subsequent day. (Secrets)

Blind – Cannot be night killed. At the start of the game, its vote will go to the person voted. In future lynches, however, Blind may not know who it actually is voting for. Any time that a civilian is lynched, then its lynch vote is secretly randomized among the player it voted and the one alphabetically above and below its vote. For every civilian lynch, the possible vote recipient range is increased by one player above and below its current range. In contrast, any time that a mafia is lynched, the range decreases by one player above and below its current range.

Drugs – Slips drugs to a player of its choice every even night. That player will start every subsequent lynch with two votes against them. If it carries out the kill, it cannot kill any player it hasn't drugged.

It seems to me that seaside was suspicious of espers, Diiny, and I because he observed discrepancy in the Rico bandwagon that suggested to him that someone was scum. This only makes sense if it was two extra votes specifically due to the Drugs role. I don't know how seaside's role worked exactly, but would he not just see the name of the player placing those two extra votes? That would eliminate the need for the whole "1 of these 3" thing. He may have just misinterpreted the evidence, there are a pile of town roles that affect voting and even more roles with *secrets* so who knows.

Basically all this tells me is that seaside thought Diiny or I was Drugs, but I don't understand why he'd have any doubt about which one.

My understanding of the power is that it would exhibit that Ricochet had, say 8 votes on Day 3, rather than the 6 that we see.

That would explain his reversal on his read of Ricochet, and his assumption that one of the Ricochet voters is mafia.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Hosts, are you able to confirm/deny this interpretation of seaside's role?

It isn't complicated. I've had a role like this before. It worked like this:

A: 2 votes
B: 3 votes
C: 4 votes

A got lynched.

D: Using my power.

Host: "A had 4 votes, B had 3 votes, and C had 3 votes"

Basic idea, but there it is.

[sig]

Okay JJJ was saved this is similar to what could have happened yesterday, Mac vs Diiny. JJJ is mafia those who pushed seaside are also most likely mafia.

I think you're bad.

You were completely ready to capitalize on The Cakewalk JJJ Lynch, but at the last moment when others were discussing other possibilities you started to "have doubts" -- and only because I was playing hard as I have been doing the whole game anyway.

Now that a townie is dead in my place, you're moving to capitalize again without a thought.

True I had doubts but unlike many others I didn't switch. In the end I stuck by it and with seaside's flip I'm know certain you're mafia.

[Marmot]

Based on this, a Jay lynch should stay on the table for tomorrow, but I'll have to look at Diiny as well.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Okay JJJ was saved this is similar to what could have happened yesterday, Mac vs Diiny. JJJ is mafia those who pushed seaside are also most likely mafia.

I think you're bad.

You were completely ready to capitalize on The Cakewalk JJJ Lynch, but at the last moment when others were discussing other possibilities you started to "have doubts" -- and only because I was playing hard as I have been doing the whole game anyway.

Now that a townie is dead in my place, you're moving to capitalize again without a thought.

True I had doubts but unlike many others I didn't switch. In the end I stuck by it and with seaside's flip I'm know certain you're mafia.

Trust me, your failure to switch doesn't make you look better. The quick counterwagon was town too, so why should you care which one dies?

Why does the seaside town flip make you "certain" I'm mafia?

[motel room]

So one of the three players he's been going on about (espers, jjj, diiny) have vote manipulation powers? I don't get why he was so adamant there was a scum in there and he never bothered to explain. Are there no town vote manipulation roles?

Unsure when vote manipulation comes into this, am I being completely stupid?

It was seaside's role to see through vote manipulation once, he was town so no reason to make shit up, so must've been the reason he was harping on about the three of them.

But then if Drugs is the sole scum vote manipulator its not a direct link. Can't Drugs drug a guy and vote a different way the next lynch?

[TheFloyd73]

Whats with the Google not that keeps viewing the thread?

Triple J, what's your reason for voting for Black Rock?

Here's some reasons.

Here's some more reasons.

What's your reason for voting for me?

Ugh, can't be bothered looking through your posts. Plus, what MetalMarsh sums up my thinking.

Also, Triple J, what's the heck is your comment on my RYM page about?

Which metalmarsh post is this, Floyd?

The annoyingly long one with heaps of spoilers.

http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 80#p187680 This one?

Yep, that one

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Yep, that one

You voted for me because you liked MM's case against seaside?

[motel room]

I ask again...who came up with the sudden suspicion of seaside?

I helped build momentum I think.