STAR WARS Mafia [ENDGAME]

[Tangrowth]

im not feeling so good anymreo so i think i will put my computere down now but ill be back later

[Marmot]

No hang out for a bit!

What do you think of bcornett? MacDougall?

[a2thezebra]

Until MP returns what do YOU think of those two, MM?

[DrWilgy]

That was an amusing front page check... Still -250 ish posts...

[Marmot]

Spoiler: show

I've got to tell you guys, I feel so far out of my depth right now. From my limited experience, what passes for evidence this early on in Mafia games is often little more than a combination of bravado and overactive imagination. All I can see is some particularly harsh accusations being thrown around by some VERY enthusiastic players. I have been around long enough not to mistake aggressiveness in these games with Mafia guilt so a couple of feuding prominent players (at this stage of the game) doesn't convince me that one is necessarily Mafia. From what I've read, Golden seems to make a lot of sense to me...

Like I said, I'm having a lot of trouble trying to follow you guys...

Day 1: Makes a general observation of the game thread up to this point. This is a general statement though, and no players are named aside from observing that Golden makes a lot of sense (he's pretty good at that tbh).

Spoiler: show

Forgive me Guys but am I to understand there is some criticism of me voting down MattF (a bad guy) without having made a whole bunch of wild accusations for the entire first day phase when there are some players that didn't even vote at all? For what it's worth, I only realised when I came on this morning how close the deadline was and decided to go on instinct (something which has in the past stood me in good stead - I'm sure Sig will vouch for that...).

Day 1: Defends his Day 1 vote for Matt. His main point here is stating that he's not used to the good form of posting with your vote. I forgive him for this. Nothing wrong with voting gut on Day 1 either.

Spoiler: show

You have votes from Dom (5), Roxy (7), Glorfindel (13), Dragon D. Luffy (14), nijuukyugou (15), Golden (18), Sorsha (22) as of right now.

Of those only 2 have actually read the thread. There has been little to no activity from Dom (5), Roxy (7), Glorfindel (13), nijuukyugou (15), or Sorsha (22).

So that brings me to my next point. Elo said yesterday she believed most mafiosos were among lurkers.

I'm sorry but an assertion like this is borderline absurd. I've yet to play in a Mafia game yet where this happened. This is without much doubt one of the lamest attempts at diverting attention to somewhat hapless new players I've seen. Sure, we're a little disoriented playing with people and rules with which we are largely unfamiliar and it's easy to make us look guilty. I'd be really surprised if any of the experienced non-Mafia players here would take any of this seriously and further, it REALLY does little for the credibility of the person making such assertions.

I haven't done an ISO on them, but Glorfindel's vote catches my attention because of his complete lack of explanation of it at the time. He just came in, dropped a vote in the highest voted person at the time and left without saying a thing. Not sure about the others.

Are you able to provide an accurate list of the sequence of the votes on Matt F's bandwagon? I for one would be interested to see it. I don't recall there were so many votes on it when I voted. And AGAIN (because I obviously didn't explain it sufficiently well the first time...) I was at work on Friday and I'd lost track of the deadline. I think when I voted it was only about an hour and a half to go and I simply didn't have the time to detail the explanation for my vote on him - not that there was one - I just thought he came across as suspicious from the tone of his posts. I'm struggling enough with this game thank you very much! I'd appreciate it if you'd grant me the courtesy of cutting me just a little bit of slack as a consequence

Day 2: So Glorfidel finds himself defending his actions again. First defending from the suspicion of lurkers. I disagree with this. Lurkers have less content to observe, and are harder to decide upon alignment. DDL is the one who brought this point up (and he was just nightkilled).

His other point was describing the thought process behind his Day 1 vote. I don't have any qualms with this defense.

Spoiler: show

MPs wall of text is a carefully constructed magnum opus designed to ensure players constantly over-analyse Zebra's posts I reckon. It's a genius scum play because Zebra is eminently lynchable early game yet here has a load of town reads so by doing so Zebra is quite likely to start doing things to raise the ire of other vociferous players. What a smart way to knock off the dominant town player.

MP you devilish fiend.

linki: Yes. I had a leadership seminar at work that I couldn't sneakily play Mafia instead of attending.

Honestly I don't see how it would be really effective at making people suspect Zebra, really. Be paranoid about her posts, sure, but we aren't having a 180º on our view of her unless she does say something really suspicious.

You have votes from Dom (5), Roxy (7), Glorfindel (13), Dragon D. Luffy (14), nijuukyugou (15), Golden (18), Sorsha (22) as of right now.

Of those only 2 have actually read the thread. There has been little to no activity from Dom (5), Roxy (7), Glorfindel (13), nijuukyugou (15), or Sorsha (22).

So that brings me to my next point. Elo said yesterday she believed most mafiosos were among lurkers.

I'm sorry but an assertion like this is borderline absurd. I've yet to play in a Mafia game yet where this happened. This is without much doubt one of the lamest attempts at diverting attention to somewhat hapless new players I've seen. Sure, we're a little disoriented playing with people and rules with which we are largely unfamiliar and it's easy to make us look guilty. I'd be really surprised if any of the experienced non-Mafia players here would take any of this seriously and further, it REALLY does little for the credibility of the person making such assertions.

I haven't done an ISO on them, but Glorfindel's vote catches my attention because of his complete lack of explanation of it at the time. He just came in, dropped a vote in the highest voted person at the time and left without saying a thing. Not sure about the others.

Are you able to provide an accurate list of the sequence of the votes on Matt F's bandwagon? I for one would be interested to see it. I don't recall there were so many votes on it when I voted. And AGAIN (because I obviously didn't explain it sufficiently well the first time...) I was at work on Friday and I'd lost track of the deadline. I think when I voted it was only about an hour and a half to go and I simply didn't have the time to detail the explanation for my vote on him - not that there was one - I just thought he came across as suspicious from the tone of his posts. I'm struggling enough with this game thank you very much! I'd appreciate it if you'd grant me the courtesy of cutting me just a little bit of slack as a consequence

It's not absurd, it's entirely likely. I played a game like that not long ago. In a game where about half of the players have low activity, what's the probability of a bunch of them being mafia? Not that low.

I'm pointing this out because there is a tendency in those games to ignore people that don't post much (since they don't give material for us to read) and focus on the big posters who say suspicious stuff every now and then. And if the RNG gods happened to give us mafia teams full of inactive, that behavior will screw us up.

The list of votes is in the poll thread. Matt was leading them at the time.

To be fair, I'm liking your defenses for now, though I'd like to see more of you trying to solve the game, not just defenses.

I'm not cutting you any slack though. Suspecting people is part of the game, deal with it.

Okay looking at Brian's post out of these seven almost all are null. I'm thinking Golden isn't mafia, but besides that nothing from this list. I think we do have at least one or two mafia member here and I do agree with Dragon these players have had little activity, but this also seems like Dragon is trying to get us to focus on those who haven't posted at all, and this is a good way to lynch civs who are easy lynches and won't attract attention to those who pushed for there lynch if they flip civ.

And focusing only in the active ones won't lynch civs? Let's be honest here, we have no idea where the mafia is, whether they are among the actives, inactives or both. I'm just saying we should look at both, and discussing the fact most actives, save very few exceptions, seem to be getting townreads by everyone.

I suspect my friend that we may be well on the road to common ground here. I do appreciate your point about inactive players 'lurking' but from my experience, if inactive newbie players are drawn Mafia (I thought someone said in the sign-up thread that doesn't usually happen here ) they end up slipping up themselves sooner or later. What I think should be a higher priority is:

a) those experienced players that suddenly drop off the radar (unfortunately, I've no experience from playing with all but one of you so in so far as this category is concerned, I've got nothin') and

b) those players that post a lot about their suspicions and make extensive commentary about players. I personally see that as subtle manipulation of the vote and an experienced player in that position represents to me, a clear and present danger.

I know I sound like I'm harping here, but there's not a lot I can offer here. I don't know a lot of you and I have no point of reference in regard to your respective play styles. I can assure you though - from having played extensively with Sig, he is cast iron Town to me and I think despite the vacillation of his most recent posts you can have a lot of confidence in him. As for the rest of you, just when I think you're OK, someone comes along and casts dark clouds of doubt and suspicion in my mind. It really is too early in this game still, to draw many conclusions...

Day 2: Continues his discussion with DDL with regards to players' playstyle. He continues to harp on that he is not familiar with players here, and thus is having trouble reading players. The one exception is that he calls sig a strong town read.

The lack of suspicions at this point is a little disappointing. His post quantity is quite low, but Glorfindel's post quality is pretty high. His posts are dense, and he's taken to engaging players in conversation. Unfortunately, his conversations to this point have never been about specific players, but about the other things.

Spoiler: show

You have votes from Dom (5), Roxy (7), Glorfindel (13), Dragon D. Luffy (14), nijuukyugou (15), Golden (18), Sorsha (22) as of right now.

Of those only 2 have actually read the thread. There has been little to no activity from Dom (5), Roxy (7), Glorfindel (13), nijuukyugou (15), or Sorsha (22).

So that brings me to my next point. Elo said yesterday she believed most mafiosos were among lurkers.

I'm sorry but an assertion like this is borderline absurd. I've yet to play in a Mafia game yet where this happened. This is without much doubt one of the lamest attempts at diverting attention to somewhat hapless new players I've seen. Sure, we're a little disoriented playing with people and rules with which we are largely unfamiliar and it's easy to make us look guilty. I'd be really surprised if any of the experienced non-Mafia players here would take any of this seriously and further, it REALLY does little for the credibility of the person making such assertions.

I haven't done an ISO on them, but Glorfindel's vote catches my attention because of his complete lack of explanation of it at the time. He just came in, dropped a vote in the highest voted person at the time and left without saying a thing. Not sure about the others.

Are you able to provide an accurate list of the sequence of the votes on Matt F's bandwagon? I for one would be interested to see it. I don't recall there were so many votes on it when I voted. And AGAIN (because I obviously didn't explain it sufficiently well the first time...) I was at work on Friday and I'd lost track of the deadline. I think when I voted it was only about an hour and a half to go and I simply didn't have the time to detail the explanation for my vote on him - not that there was one - I just thought he came across as suspicious from the tone of his posts. I'm struggling enough with this game thank you very much! I'd appreciate it if you'd grant me the courtesy of cutting me just a little bit of slack as a consequence

Glorfindel,

Do you suspect DDL for this line of questioning?

Re: underlined, who's "us"?

Also, re: your question about the vote sequence, have you seen the Polls thread?

No, not necessarily. I do however find experienced players casting shade on newbie players (who by the very nature of them being new severely restricts their ability to contribute in a constructive way) to be inherently suspicious. Oh, and please don't make the mistake of assuming that you, yourself did precisely the same thing...

'Us' is a reference to Savage and all those others for whom this might be one of their first on this site. I'd have thought that reference to have been self evident and I am now trying to consider how you could've interpreted it any other way?

And yes, if you'd read the last page, you'd have seen that question had already been answered which again has me questioning your attention on me...

As for my thoughts, I don't know. Early on, I really liked Golden. His posts resonated with me and I'd read him to be total Town. After reading his more recent posts though, I'm beginning to have some doubts. Enrique, again, originally he seemed suspicious to me then he started to read more Town and now I find my support for him slipping a little. No one (at this stage of the game) stands out as being particularly bad. I have a presentation for work this morning and preparation to do for it beforehand so from very shortly, I will be absent until the end of this day phase. Accordingly, I will need to place my vote earlier than I'd otherwise prefer. Let me read a little more...

OK, this is ridiculous. I'm totally torn here. I don't feel remotely comfortable voting for someone that I don't feel is conclusively Mafia but again, I'm left with no time. I'm going to vote for Russtifinko if for no other reason that he doesn't appear (to me) to be an influential player here and his alignment might reveal something conclusive in respect of the whole MP/Enrique mess...

Day 2: Ok now we see a couple reads. They aren't strong reads, but they're something. Says he liked Golden early on, but it's less strong now. Similarly, he says he liked Enrique, but that support had waned. No baddie reads yet.

But he does end up voting Russtifinko, in the hopes that it will help sort out the MP/Enrique mess.

Spoiler: show

I'm not liking Glorfindels post right know, he keeps referring to himself as a new player, while he is new to this website he isn't new to mafia at all. He also never answered my question.
@Glor please answer my question your posts are starting to make me uncomfortably.

I will once again be voting for enrique I believe he is scum, his posts today has just reinforced this.
enrique

I'm sorry, I'm not with you at all on this one? I never said I was new to Mafia - that is in truth an entirely different thing to being unfamiliar with the way it works and the people here. I honestly don't understand what is so hard to understand about that

As for your 'question', what question? I had a look back and I couldn't see any question you addressed to me directly in any of your recent posts...

Day 2: Responds to an accusation from sig. I don't understand this response. Also there was no follow up to this question that sig asked Glorfindel, but this may come from sig's end.

Spoiler: show

Not a good result. RIP Bass.

I've skimmed quickly. Don't have time for a detailed catchup this morning.

For now, I have the following thoughts:

1) Glorfindel, you're suspicious based on tone as well as the lack of thoughts you espew. Also, your Day 2 vote stinks

You call that a thought? A comedy routine more likely. Just how pray tell is my tone suspicious? And MY Day 2 vote stinks? At least I made one which is more than I can say for a lot of players this game and yet you target me? Again? My vote wasn't on one of our power roles nor was it on what is looking to me like an increasingly Town-looking Enrique... I expect we'll find out soon enough then. You don't know that Russtifinko isn't non-Town (whatever they're called) so for you to criticise my vote just makes you look like you're grasping at straws and pretty transparently at that...

Night 2: Responds to MP's thought(s). Glorfindel defended his "stinky" Day 2 vote with the statement that at least the outcome of his vote was not bad.

I don't like this defense. 1) He started by pointing at the players who did not vote. Glorfindel was recently explaining to DDL that lurking behavior looks less bad than proactive behavior. This doesn't directly correlate with a player's tendency to vote, but it's pretty close. Anyway, Glorfindel points a finger at the players he was defending against recently. 2) Glorfindel stated that his vote wasn't bad because he didn't lynch a power role. Again not good. I think Glorfindel addressed this later, but any civ loss hurts. On Day 2, how is anyone supposed to know who is who, and in a game where role-claiming is against the rules, how could one know they are voting for a "power role"? 3) He continues to defend Enrique. There could be reason for this, but I'll ask.

Glorfindel, why do you think Enrique is town?

Spoiler: show

I NEVER said anything like "I'm good because I'm poisoned." Sig is not just equally manipulative of the facts, but completely redundant. He's especially good at pointing out options THAT EVERYONE KNOWS ALREADY. Seriously. Look over his post history. He does it over and over and over again.

I guess I stand corrected? It sure as suit seemed like you were trying to make it appear as if you being poisoned made you look better (and it seemed to work on your teamma-I mean, Elohcin), but okay. My point still stands that you are not helping yourself by posting nothing that isn't related to you or any scumhunting that includes some honest, original input.

Which is a bullshit point on itself? I'm talking about myself a lot because I've happened to be relevant a lot of the time, but uh yes I consider myself very much a part of the thread on other fronts.

Could you elaborate on how exactly you are a part of the thread on other fronts?

like shit what am i even supposed to say. I contribute where I can, form a part of discussion, I don't fucking know what you want from me. I play a certain way and why you think you know it and why you think you can expect something different from me I have no clue. I'm pretty much the only one still giving a shit about Russ, found a possible connection to MP, a possible slip by Glorfindel, speculated about the secret roles, expressed opinions on who I trust and who I don't, what posts I believe and which I don't. I have no idea what answer you're looking for, and you don't even have to agree with anything, but don't try to minimize my efforts like I'm not offering more than most of the playing roster right now. I'm sorry if I'm not good enough for you.

Quite a piece of work aren't you, Enrique? If I'd voted for YOU, you'd very likely be toast by now. But no, I took you at your word and instead voted for Russ in (an apparently misguided attempt) to confirm your innocence. And what do I get in return? You throwing shade at me for a remark that I made (entirely valid in my view) about the loss to our team of Admiral Ackbar. I certainly hope that for your sake, you never end up in a situation again where you requie my support for your survial after this

And I reiterate my comment from my last post - we lost a player with a useful ability (in my view a power role in comparison to our vanilla roles) for whom I at least was not so misguided as to have voted. My point being that for the second consecutive Day phase my vote has been competent and hell, if nothing else, at least I just VOTED which is more than I can say for some players here

Night 2: This interaction with Enrique... I need to think on this. My intial thought is that it is two scum teammates interacting.

I mean MP calls Glorfindel out, and Glorfindel gets in his face and gives him the evil eye smiley . Enrique calls Glorfindel out, and Glorfindel gives him a grumpy face .

Spoiler: show

I thought we had lynched Matt F, but I think Enrique is his ghost!

I think Enrique is sincere and I'm not really as suspicious of him any more as I was yesterday. I think his responses have made sense and seemed genuine. However, I'm not going to entertain this notion of the dots he has put together at all. Enrique, you may believe it all you like, but I don't think you are right about it.

It's not like I can be sure either, but I prefer working based on those dots than being in the dark completely. I think the Tuskan Rider poison secret role is about the best explanation as to how that could happen especially on Night 1 before the Jawas started selling their shit. I don't think Russ is up to any good either, which has been a thing since before I got poisoned. So 2 and 2 together, and this is me hoping to get a straight answer.

@Glor- Chill. I appreciate your vote and all but that comment immediately stuck out to me. Vanilly is one of my earliest Mafia memories (that must've been like what, early 2012?) and I think it's a funny mistake for rookie or more lackadaisical players to make. idk what you are, but I'm pretty sure the only completely vanilla role in this game is the Stormtrooper (which would be a silly role to claim..). I guess the concept of a "power role" is vague enough that I can get an idea of what you mean.

As a general and I guess more personal note, something came up and I haven't been feeling very well today. I don't know if I'll be much better tomorrow, but I don't think it's a good idea to be putting a lot of energy into Mafia right now. I do it anyway because you know I love it. Just know I may not be thinking completely straight and showing a lot less patience than usual. (If that even means anything. I'm having to rewrite my sentences a few times to make sure they make sense and I just can't think too hard, especially in English.)

OK, I get it now... Where I come from, traditionally only a small selection of the game roles are ever posted at the beginning of the games thread (Sig can verify that). I only briefly perused that list at the start of the game working under that assumption - hence my recollection of having seen Admiral Ackbar and remembering that he had some ability that I considered significant. I'd assumed that there would have been a considerable number of vanilla type roles for this game. My apologies for not paying closer attention there and I take back what I said about you Enrique - it was a stupid misunderstanding (on my part) and I trust we can let bygones be bygones on that one?

@a2thezebra: Well, I'm kinda convinced Enrique is telling the truth. Maybe I'm just being naive but I just can't see him being anything other than Town. I too am suspicious of Russtifinko and at this stage, I expect that my vote may end up back there this Day phase. Early on in this game, I was 100% convinced Sig was Town but after his bizarre post accusing me of not answering questions that he doesn't appear to have asked I'm starting to have some doubts. Outside of this game, he's a really great guy so I'm tending to strongly give him the benefit of the doubt. It really is hard when we have such a large number of players that don't appear to have even appeared in this game (they don't even vote ). Same with Golden actually - really liked him for Town at the beginning of the game - it seems the deeper we get into this game, the more cloudy and dubious the whole thing appears...

Day 3: Responds again to Enrique about the "power role slip", and the one I commented on previously. I think this is genuine at least, but Glorfindel is willing to forgive Enrique pretty quickly.



One thing I noted: Every single post Glorfindel has made (of relevance) this game has been a response to another player who is engaging him. Glorfindel has not gone out of his own way to suspect another player, interact with another player, and even his Day 2 vote stemmed from someone else's thoughts. I'm assuming this last point because Glorfindel didn't declare these thoughts on his own, nor did he address someone else's.

Another note: Glorfindel defended the lurkers and low posters group as a whole on Day 2. There was no kill on Night 1, and it was possibly even missed.

[Marmot]

Until MP returns what do YOU think of those two, MM?

Neutral on Mac. I voted him on Day 1, and that seemed to get him moving. It was all jokes and smokes before I voted him, and it was business afterward. Do you think that is a baddie reaction or civvie one?

Slight mafia on bcornett. I don't like his vote from Day 2, but I'm still waiting on a response for him, because I may have misunderstood him. What do you think about bcornett?

[Dom]

Enrique-- who do you want to lynch?

[Glorfindel]

hello sockface!! I am around... who do yout hink ois a bad guy?

WELL i THINk glorfindel may be bad also sig

Strongest argument I've seen yet that excessive alcohol consumpition and sound deductive reasoning don't mix...

[a2thezebra]

Until MP returns what do YOU think of those two, MM?

Neutral on Mac. I voted him on Day 1, and that seemed to get him moving. It was all jokes and smokes before I voted him, and it was business afterward. Do you think that is a baddie reaction or civvie one?

Slight mafia on bcornett. I don't like his vote from Day 2, but I'm still waiting on a response for him, because I may have misunderstood him. What do you think about bcornett?

For Mac, that reaction could go either way with equal likelihood. Personally I think he's genuine.

I disagree with some of bcornett's logic but it doesn't come off as manipulative to me. Golden said earlier that he was ready to vote bcornett and then he convinced him otherwise to the point where he was one of Golden's slight town reads for that same day, and now Golden is back to being ready to vote for him again.

[a2thezebra]

hello sockface!! I am around... who do yout hink ois a bad guy?

WELL i THINk glorfindel may be bad also sig

Strongest argument I've seen yet that excessive alcohol consumpition and sound deductive reasoning don't mix...

I'll ask again, what are some of your reads? And what do you think of MM's lengthy post about you?

[Glorfindel]

@Metalmarsh: Thank you for all the work you put into that ISO read on me. I suppose I should be grateful you considered me worth the time you took to do that... I can't say it wasn't entertaining - you literally had me in fits of laughter with your analysis of my emoticons I've not seen that anywhere before and I can't help but think we're taking this a little too seriously if we use that as evidence to lynch someone!

As for Enrique, I don't know - I could easily be wrong. In my view his posts seem genuine, he posts a lot and his assertions and opinions seem (in my view) to suggest that they are the product of some consideration of players, their comments etc. I personally felt uncomfortable by the way his wagon built up momentum so quickly at the end of the last Day phase to the point where it appeared more opportunistic than anything else. I have a natural tendency to give people the benefit of the doubt and I'm also kinda reserved I guess so this is probably reflected (as you so eloquently) in my apparent reluctance to engage with a whole bunch of people I don't know). I accept that this problem lies squarely with me so I'm not blaming you if you find me suspicous as a result.

I'd also like to take issue with your criticism of my vote on Russtifinko. He's got less than half the posts I do, and I'M the one that's suspicious for allegedly lurking? REALLY?

[a2thezebra]

Yup, Glorfindel's bad.

[Golden]

I'm voting for bcornett

Given we are on Alderaan (and given who has already voted), I can't afford to wait. I hoped he would come back and respond to me earlier.

@zebra - My ping-o-meter for Glorfindel only rises as well.

[a2thezebra]

@Metalmarsh: Thank you for all the work you put into that ISO read on me. I suppose I should be grateful you considered me worth the time you took to do that... I can't say it wasn't entertaining - you literally had me in fits of laughter with your analysis of my emoticons I've not seen that anywhere before and I can't help but think we're taking this a little too seriously if we use that as evidence to lynch someone!

This is such an absurdly over-the-top and fake response. Where do I start? Well you're either misusing the world literally or you are clinically insane if that had you in fits of laughter, and I also think you're misrepresenting his analysis to enforce the idea that his emoticon bit was more a more prominent section than it actually was. And even then if you're just being hyperbolic here it doesn't come across as a natural reaction one bit. You can't say it wasn't entertaining? Really? If you're giving it as little credit as that then why are you in defensive mode instead of attack mode? Oh I know. Because you're bad.

As for Enrique, I don't know - I could easily be wrong. In my view his posts seem genuine, he posts a lot and his assertions and opinions seem (in my view) to suggest that they are the product of some consideration of players, their comments etc. I personally felt uncomfortable by the way his wagon built up momentum so quickly at the end of the last Day phase to the point where it appeared more opportunistic than anything else. I have a natural tendency to give people the benefit of the doubt and I'm also kinda reserved I guess so this is probably reflected (as you so eloquently) in my apparent reluctance to engage with a whole bunch of people I don't know). I accept that this problem lies squarely with me so I'm not blaming you if you find me suspicous as a result.

This first sentence here is transcending wibbly-wobbly. I hope that fence isn't too painful to sit on for so long. "I don't know - I could easily be wrong" Uh, wrong about what? Not knowing? Yeah that's very possible. I can excuse "I don't know" and I can excuse "I could easily be wrong" but both phrases back-to-back? This is not a genuine read at ALL. I also like the "in my view" in parentheses. You have instantly gone from huge feigned confidence against MM's analysis on you to huge orchestrated humbleness when giving your read on another player. Town motivation for such a display as this? None. Scum motivation? Oh yes. I want a rainbow list of reads from you ASAP.

I'd also like to take issue with your criticism of my vote on Russtifinko. He's got less than half the posts I do, and I'M the one that's suspicious for allegedly lurking? REALLY?

Nice straw man.

[a2thezebra]

And for the record regarding that rainbow reads list I want, I'm not telling you what to do and I'm not talking down to you, as a few have accused me of doing earlier. I'm just telling you what I think you should do if you have any interest of convincing me (and probably others as well) that you are town.

[MacDougall]

Metalmarsh...

Day 1 I made like 2 posts before you cast a locked in vote on me which you knew would be locked in.

You arbitrarily chucked my name into a scum read list merely a page or two ago.

You have been jokier than anyone favouring fuck about stuff like going out of your way to write limericks.

You randomly ask someones opinion on two players including me yet apparently I am a neutral read.

Your interest in bad guy hunting seems like it's less interesting to you and the fuckery seems like your primary motivation.

You are confusing as fuck. You are Darth Somebody.

[Golden]

So, Mac, why the MP vote?

[Marmot]

You arbitrarily chucked my name into a scum read list merely a page or two ago.

It wasn't arbitrary. You were there on my Night 1 list too.

You are confusing as fuck.

Hi I'm Metalmarsh, nice to meet you.

[MacDougall]

Glorfindel has a very awkward way of communicating that makes me uneasy. Metalmarsh is going hard at. I think most people are reading Glorfindel pingy at best. Metalmarsh on the bus or genuinely hunting opposing scum? Or is Metalmarsh through the haze of bullshit actually civ? I think the middle option tastes right.

Let's lynch Glorfindel. Who has a civ read on Glorfindel? Not I.

Linki: MP is a scum read, he pinged me and I voted. If I could have it over I would vote Glorfindel who is pinging me harder and a more likely lynch.

It was arbitrary Metalmarsh because you now, with me having done nothing since have a neutral read on me. Why include a neutral read in a scum list? Why ask people about your neutral reads? It's whack.

[MacDougall]

For reals. When did you have a scum read of me, how and why has it changed to neutral? Why are you asking people to talk to you about a player you feel neutral about? Why not focus on your scum reads? It just tastes erong.

[Marmot]

@Metalmarsh: Thank you for all the work you put into that ISO read on me. I suppose I should be grateful you considered me worth the time you took to do that... I can't say it wasn't entertaining - you literally had me in fits of laughter with your analysis of my emoticons I've not seen that anywhere before and I can't help but think we're taking this a little too seriously if we use that as evidence to lynch someone!

I don't think it's too serious. I have seen it happen many times in mafia where mafia-buddies will attempt to force interaction with each other in a way that's not natural. They'll say "Hey, I'll say such-and-such, and you reply with so-and-so." That's just an example, but I think you get my point.

As for Enrique, I don't know - I could easily be wrong. In my view his posts seem genuine, he posts a lot and his assertions and opinions seem (in my view) to suggest that they are the product of some consideration of players, their comments etc. I personally felt uncomfortable by the way his wagon built up momentum so quickly at the end of the last Day phase to the point where it appeared more opportunistic than anything else. I have a natural tendency to give people the benefit of the doubt and I'm also kinda reserved I guess so this is probably reflected (as you so eloquently) in my apparent reluctance to engage with a whole bunch of people I don't know). I accept that this problem lies squarely with me so I'm not blaming you if you find me suspicous as a result.

Enrique was almost lynched on Day 2 as well. I don't think the wagon was out-of-the-blue or anything.

I'd also like to take issue with your criticism of my vote on Russtifinko. He's got less than half the posts I do, and I'M the one that's suspicious for allegedly lurking? REALLY?

I didn't accuse you of lurking though. In fact, I didn't criticize your vote at all. I did question it, and criticize your later defense of it, but the vote itself, I put a big ol' next to it, because I didn't understand what you meant by "his [Russtifinko's] alignment might reveal something conclusive in respect of the whole MP/Enrique mess...". Why did you feel this way about lynching Russtifinko?

[Marmot]

For reals. When did you have a scum read of me, how and why has it changed to neutral? Why are you asking people to talk to you about a player you feel neutral about? Why not focus on your scum reads? It just tastes erong.

This is what I said on Night 1. I haven't been able to come to a conclusion on me own about your behavior switch.

[Russtifinko]

Hey all. Voting now as I will be traveling tomorrow and really don't want to miss it again.

I hate to admit this, but I'm not really caught up at all. Seattle has been fun but I've had no down time whatsoever. Voting bananananananana because their name makes me laugh. Maybe it's a cover for evil? /sarc

I do plan to be fully involved after the thanksgiving break. Sorry once again

[Marmot]

Hey all. Voting now as I will be traveling tomorrow and really don't want to miss it again.

I hate to admit this, but I'm not really caught up at all. Seattle has been fun but I've had no down time whatsoever. Voting bananananananana because their name makes me laugh. Maybe it's a cover for evil? /sarc

I do plan to be fully involved after the thanksgiving break. Sorry once again

[MacDougall]

Hey all. Voting now as I will be traveling tomorrow and really don't want to miss it again.

I hate to admit this, but I'm not really caught up at all. Seattle has been fun but I've had no down time whatsoever. Voting bananananananana because their name makes me laugh. Maybe it's a cover for evil? /sarc

I do plan to be fully involved after the thanksgiving break. Sorry once again

Hey I know you. You are that Scum Russ that was on my TH team.

[Enrique]

I am voting for Elohcin. I don't feel like her vote for zebra is genuine.

:P

Perhaps you are zebra's teammate.

For real though...Zebra's tone just isn't of her normal civ self imo. Could I be wrong, sure. But I think Bass and Enri both have a good chance of being civ. So I didn't want to place my vote on either.

As far as I know I'm not on zebras team, I'm a part of the rebel alliance so if she is too then yes, we are teammates.

Now, yes. This is an LD verifiable statement. But... it's definitely weird, right? Like, I don't feel it was asked for or anything. Just a random "hey look how civvie I am!" and then that's that.

[Enrique]

Master Yoda says:

Be trusted Enrique cannot. To be on the side of good MovingPictures appears. So friendly some of his words are not. Watched, he must be. Said to be manipulative, zebra's actions are. To consider something we need. Herh herh herh.

I trust Yoda, so I'm voting For Enrique

*eyes roll all the way to the back of my head*

So, just for the thread's consideration. This means I'm leading the poll. Give a shit or not, it might be something to take into account. I have Luke's completely out of nowhere first post in a week vote and two extra ones.

[Enrique]

This is your third. Post.

Yeah this is a sucky trend. C'mon peeps, the least you could do is vote for each other if you're so worried about your p-score.

[Enrique]

Who do you think is mafia?

uymmmm i think amybe glordinfel and sig and mayeb riss and roxy

,man i still need to talk more byt i really thijkoing florfindel

Hey umm so why is this a list of everyone I mentioned in my last post? Had you even been back since? No, like, those are the exact four people I'm not sure about Roxy but I don't remember you having much to say about sig or Glorf.

Then again, drunk post. I just wanna hear more detailed thoughts on why you chose those people.

[Enrique]

Enrique-- who do you want to lynch?

I feel a little out of my depth here. I've spent the last few days kinda sick / exhausted and especially stressed. I still don't think Russ is good, but I don't think anyone gives a shit about that and he hasn't been around for me to add anything new to that so I might have to just drop it for now.

I think there's a pretty decent chance we've found something with Roxy. Now, I don't have a problem with her last couple posts re: what you said about Bass, because let's face it, that's a weird post (I don't give a shit one way or another but I can see why she would). It's just the way she tries so hard and continues to defend her "random" vote. I mean, I really don't think it would be as big of a deal if the majority of her posts weren't just a back and forth with Zeeb that all stems from there. It seriously shouldn't be.

[Enrique]

MM, I don't know what's the deal with Glorf, but leave me out of it. Whatever game he's trying to play, it has nothing to do with me.

Mac, can you name 3 players that you don't think are scum, or at least not yet?

[Glorfindel]

And for the record regarding that rainbow reads list I want, I'm not telling you what to do and I'm not talking down to you, as a few have accused me of doing earlier. I'm just telling you what I think you should do if you have any interest of convincing me (and probably others as well) that you are town.

Let me get this straight - you demand a 'rainbow list' from me after what is one of the worst instances of ridicule and some of the most threatening tone that I've ever seen anyone subjected to and you reckon you're neither telling me what to do or talking down to me? Let me give you a tip - you need to take a good long hard look at yourself my friend.

In all the games I have played at other sites, I've not once EVER compiled a 'rainbow list' and I'm not about to start now. I'm not going to commit myself to saying anyone is Town at this point as (apart from the POSSIBLE exceptions of Sig and Enrique) I don't trust a single one of you. I don't really care less what you think of me, but you make an absolute mockery of everything I've been told about this site and at this point, you won't be needing to worry about me in any game here in the future if this is what passes for objective analysis on this site. Up until now I was pretty solidly convinced you were Town. Now I don't really care.

[Enrique]

Glorf I kinda get the feeling that you're just trusting whoever is nice to you at any given time. Zebra is demanding something from you because this is a game and she thinks that will help her play it better. It's no big deal, and it really shouldn't be getting in the way of your judgement.

[Roxy]

Voting vixen that vexes her victims

[Roxy]

zebra zhas zfound zanother zvictim zthis zday zto ztell zhow zto zplay.
Zi zhope zglorfindal zwill zplay zhere zagain zin z za zgame zthat zzebra zis znot.
zdont zjudge Zthe zwhole zsite zby zone zego zknown zas zzebra <3

[Glorfindel]

Glorf I kinda get the feeling that you're just trusting whoever is nice to you at any given time. Zebra is demanding something from you because this is a game and she thinks that will help her play it better. It's no big deal, and it really shouldn't be getting in the way of your judgement.

To an extent, Enrique - I suppose you are right, I probably tend to see people who aren't obnoxious in a skightly better light. Personally, I see no value in a list that and never have. People have asked me for some of my reads of my fellow players and I've done my best to comply with as constructive an analysis as I am able to muster. I think you or someone else needs to explain how a list of players I pull out of thin air is likely to help Zebra or anyone else play this game any better...? In any case, I stand by my comments in my last post.

@MetalMarsh: I kinda looked at it this way - Enrique believed that Russ was Mafia (of some colour) a lot of people suspected Enrique. My reasoning (albeit potentially flawed) was that if we eliminated Russtifinko (who, has as we continue to see, has contributed far less than even I to this game) and he turned out to be Mafia, that would on the balance of probability suggest that Enrique was Town. At this point however, I feel more convinced than ever of Russtifinko's guilt on his merits.

[Roxy]

I'm just going to leave this here while I have some pasta.

Hey, YOU, player reading and hardly posting.

Guess what?

You're a low poster. You hear me? You will be feeling the heat. You better participate soon. NOT posting is NOT a strategy to play the game, regardless of your alignment.

tthis tpost tis tmean. tplease tstop trequoting tit.
Tthis tmentality twill tdrive tplayers taway tfrom tthe tsite - tnot tattract tthem tto tit. ti tam tsurprised tmp teven tposted tit. tif tit tis trequoted ti twill tquit tplaying there tmyself.

[Golden]

I'm on the side of glorfindel and roxy here.

Although I still suspect glorfindel may be bad. But it's not because he isn't giving 'rainbow lists' and answering every demand. It's just that I've found a couple of the posts ping me a bit.

The attitude of demanding things from other players and expecting it to work is ridiculous. Ask them questions nicely. If they don't reply, suspect them for it or vote them for it. Don't villainise them for it.

[Golden]

(Glorfindel - don't expect this Kiwi to have your back normally, ok? You are still an Aussie. I'm making an exception in the circumstances. )

[Golden]

[Golden]

Whoah, meme, when did you get so big! Oops.

Also please ignore the fact that I can't spell twisdom.

[Roxy]

<3 tgolden

[Glorfindel]

(Glorfindel - don't expect this Kiwi to have your back normally, ok? You are still an Aussie. I'm making an exception in the circumstances. )

I appreciate the consideration my friend You seem like a pretty genuine person and I do honestly respect that a lot (irrespective of your role in this game).

[MacDougall]

MM, I don't know what's the deal with Glorf, but leave me out of it. Whatever game he's trying to play, it has nothing to do with me.

Mac, can you name 3 players that you don't think are scum, or at least not yet?

I don't think Golden is scum. Don't think Roxy is scum. Don't think Zebra is scum.

[MacDougall]

Suslist

Glorfindel
Russtifinko
Metalmarsh89
Simon
Enrique (trending weaker)
MovingPictures07
sig

NFI

Sorsha
DrWilgy
Bubbles
Dom
TheFloyd73
Luke11646
DFaraday
Black Rock
NANANANANANA_BANANA
nijuukyugou
Savage
Elohcin

Me likey

bcornett24
Roxy
Zebra
Canucklehead
Golden

[MacDougall]

Zebra has three votes on her... how... curious.

So many people withholding votes and three votes already BAM right down on her like that. Bought votes, or does someone know something about the Zebs?

The intrigue, it's intriguing.

[sig]

I don't like the votes on Zebra, and can we even still sell votes. Wasn't that a special planet ability?

Simon broke the tie lynching Bass over Enrique, this is slightly pingy, but keeping his age in mind I wouldn't put to much stock in it unless Enrique is scum.
@Enrique how does your poison work, I'm assuming one additional vote each day?
If this is the case what do you think of Luke's vote and who do you plan to vote for today?
I'll be willing to hold back voting for you some of your responses seem civvie, and I'm confident if you're scum you'll slip up soon. So I'd like to discuss who your biggest scum reads are.

Drunken MP is funny, but I must ask MP why do you think I'm scummy?

[Marmot]

@MetalMarsh: I kinda looked at it this way - Enrique believed that Russ was Mafia (of some colour) a lot of people suspected Enrique. My reasoning (albeit potentially flawed) was that if we eliminated Russtifinko (who, has as we continue to see, has contributed far less than even I to this game) and he turned out to be Mafia, that would on the balance of probability suggest that Enrique was Town. At this point however, I feel more convinced than ever of Russtifinko's guilt on his merits.

If we're talking probability, Enrique is more likely to be town than mafia anyway, regardless of Russ's alignment. :P

Contributions come in various shapes in sizes. I don't mean to judge you based on your playstyle, and I don't mean to lynch you just because you won't cater to my demands. But while you're not exactly a low poster, I still have to scratch my head when I read your posts. The point of the game for civilians is to hunt down mafia, and to do that, the civilians need to read through other players' posts, develop suspects, and vote accordingly. When I look at your posts, I don't see any suspicions of other players (up until this post I'm quoting). As I noted before, every post you've made that is on-topic has been a response to somebody else who is engaging you, not because you're are trying to engage other people. This is not proactive behavior, and the lack of suspicions compounds that. Actually, that's not true, as you have mentioned a couple players you find suspicious today, but the suspicious behavior you have pointed at has been people suspecting you, so .

You don't have to post lists. I'm still not a big fan of rainbow lists either (but I'm trying a variation of it). You don't have to use rainbows. You do you. I hope you don't think we're trying to morph you into something else, because variety is the spice of life.

I still think you're mafia.

[Marmot]

Suslist

Glorfindel
Russtifinko
Metalmarsh89
Simon
Enrique (treading water) FIXED
MovingPictures07
sig

NFI

Sorsha
DrWilgy
Bubbles
Dom
TheFloyd73
Luke11646
DFaraday
Black Rock
NANANANANANA_BANANA
nijuukyugou
Savage
Elohcin

Me likey

bcornett24
Roxy
Zebra
Canucklehead
Golden

[Marmot]

I'm voting for bcornett

Given we are on Alderaan (and given who has already voted), I can't afford to wait. I hoped he would come back and respond to me earlier.

@zebra - My ping-o-meter for Glorfindel only rises as well.

Tell me what you think Golden. Since we spend 2 days on each planet, I think that the planet will blow up on the second day we are on the specified planet, not the first.