Tree Mafia [GAME OVER]

[Diiny]

Oh, I thought he was accusing me of that but I guess he was just saying what happened generally?

In which case floyd tell me which of these votes are the most suspicious. Five to choose from.

[Diiny]

Ignore the previous rant bb <3

[Epignosis]

Me too. Why can't you talk about the potential baddie influence on lynching the cop AND be interested in floyd?

Why "can't?"

Is there some restriction on me?

I'll talk about what I like. I have nothing to say about it.

I want to lynch FLOYD.

You keep saying that but you're not trying to convince anybody to do it.

Floyd doesn't give me anything to convince anybody with. What would you have me do?

His only post today is "another needless last minute switch." When was there another last minute switch?

[MacDougall]

Me too. Why can't you talk about the potential baddie influence on lynching the cop AND be interested in floyd?

Why "can't?"

Is there some restriction on me?

I'll talk about what I like. I have nothing to say about it.

I want to lynch FLOYD.

You keep saying that but you're not trying to convince anybody to do it.

Floyd doesn't give me anything to convince anybody with. What would you have me do?

His only post today is "another needless last minute switch." When was there another last minute switch?

I know. So if you have nothing to convince other people with, what have you go to convince you?

[Marmot]

PULL

This forest hasn't been clear-cut and turned into a casino yet.

[DrWilgy]

Happy birthday!!

[JaggedJimmyJay]

While I wasn't around at EOD, I'm not sure I would have changed my vote if I had been. I can understand Enrique's late phase behavior making him look worse to the people who were present, but I do think it's important that he claimed cop two minutes prior to his death (with a two vote lead over Diiny) and there didn't seem to be much budging in response. One switch from him back to Diiny would have forced a tie and possibly rescued him.

I swear if you didn't counter claim earlier...

Doc, you seemed to be conscious of the possibility that he was being truthful. Please try to describe your mindset in those final moments and what prevented you from moving your vote.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Epignosis's crusade against Floyd is based upon what strikes me as close to nothing, so I view it dubiously. Regardless of Floyd's alignment, I don't understand Epi's conduct as a town approach -- he is shouting his desired target and apparently doesn't care much at all about anything else happening in the game. That's not inspiring, and even if he is right about Floyd it would strike me as luck at best and calculated at worst. Epi doesn't strike me as the guy that plays for a lucky break.

I don't know how one can have any conviction in reading Floyd as town or mafia right now. There's not enough there.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Mac, Diiny, and MP also appear to have been present at EOD when Enrique claimed cop (via green-checking Sorsha with two minutes remaining) -- I'll also ask them what impact that move by Enrique had on their mindsets in the heat of the moment.

So, uh... I ask you all that.

[DrWilgy]

While I wasn't around at EOD, I'm not sure I would have changed my vote if I had been. I can understand Enrique's late phase behavior making him look worse to the people who were present, but I do think it's important that he claimed cop two minutes prior to his death (with a two vote lead over Diiny) and there didn't seem to be much budging in response. One switch from him back to Diiny would have forced a tie and possibly rescued him.

I swear if you didn't counter claim earlier...

Doc, you seemed to be conscious of the possibility that he was being truthful. Please try to describe your mindset in those final moments and what prevented you from moving your vote.

I was conscious, but as I explained there was not enough time for me to accurately judge his truthfulness. I took it as a last second gamble for survival. Now that I've had time to process the claim, I should've changed off of him. Possibility of lynching a baddie should've been taken, and I should've taken the choice where we would've gained more time.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

It'd be so neat to hear what DFaraday thinks about stuff.

On Day 1 I liked MP's early enthusiasm about getting into the fake peek drama, but the good vibes are weaker now. This post appears rather baked to me, like MP was actively trying to cool on his town read of Diiny and took the opportunity in response to Doc's admission that the red peek was false and subsequent review.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

While I wasn't around at EOD, I'm not sure I would have changed my vote if I had been. I can understand Enrique's late phase behavior making him look worse to the people who were present, but I do think it's important that he claimed cop two minutes prior to his death (with a two vote lead over Diiny) and there didn't seem to be much budging in response. One switch from him back to Diiny would have forced a tie and possibly rescued him.

I swear if you didn't counter claim earlier...

Doc, you seemed to be conscious of the possibility that he was being truthful. Please try to describe your mindset in those final moments and what prevented you from moving your vote.

I was conscious, but as I explained there was not enough time for me to accurately judge his truthfulness. I took it as a last second gamble for survival. Now that I've had time to process the claim, I should've changed off of him. Possibility of lynching a baddie should've been taken, and I should've taken the choice where we would've gained more time.

I'm not sure what you mean by the highlighted portion.

[DrWilgy]

I would've had more time to judge in my head had I swapped to Diiny, someone I also was ok with lynching.

I suppose the easiest way for me to phrase my response is that I regret my reaction. What I don't regret is my suspicions.

Wilgy drinking starts in about 30 min... Just a heads up.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I have very little time tonight unfortunately. I have to go into town to do laundry and then get some sleep before yet more work.

Epignosis[/note]

I should be available more tomorrow evening, and might even make it to the deadline since it'll be Friday and my peers don't have my kind of fun. :P

[JaggedJimmyJay]

EBWOP

I have very little time tonight unfortunately. I have to go into town to do laundry and then get some sleep before yet more work.

Epignosis

I should be available more tomorrow evening, and might even make it to the deadline since it'll be Friday and my peers don't have my kind of fun. :P

[Diiny]

He claimed cop ("sorsha green at 2:19") after the deadline (XX:18) right?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

He claimed cop ("sorsha green at 2:19") after the deadline (XX:18) right?

You're probably right actually. MM's post came at XX:21 so that's what I was thinking, but yeah he probably didn't produce that immediately upon the bell's ring.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

So basically Enrique gave everyone no chance and then told us we suck.

[Diiny]

No, he LITERALLY gave everyone no chance.

[Diiny]

lmao is it confirmed that wilgy's bullshitting now? talking about a thought process that mechanically couldn't have happened?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

lmao is it confirmed that wilgy's bullshitting now? talking about a thought process that mechanically couldn't have happened?

...

Paging DrWilgy

[Diiny]

I don't think he's a real doctor

Wilgy

That should work

[Epignosis]

Epignosis's crusade against Floyd is based upon what strikes me as close to nothing, so I view it dubiously. Regardless of Floyd's alignment, I don't understand Epi's conduct as a town approach -- he is shouting his desired target and apparently doesn't care much at all about anything else happening in the game. That's not inspiring, and even if he is right about Floyd it would strike me as luck at best and calculated at worst. Epi doesn't strike me as the guy that plays for a lucky break.

I don't know how one can have any conviction in reading Floyd as town or mafia right now. There's not enough there.

I don't need a lecture about being inspiring and playing for lucky breaks from a guy who voted out the cop Day 1.

[DrWilgy]

lmao is it confirmed that wilgy's bullshitting now? talking about a thought process that mechanically couldn't have happened?

No fuckin shit.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I don't need a lecture about being inspiring and playing for lucky breaks from a guy who voted out the cop Day 1.

Horseshit ad hominem is beneath you. You're bad.

[TheFloyd73]

Me too. Why can't you talk about the potential baddie influence on lynching the cop AND be interested in floyd?

Why "can't?"

Is there some restriction on me?

I'll talk about what I like. I have nothing to say about it.

I want to lynch FLOYD.

You keep saying that but you're not trying to convince anybody to do it.

Floyd doesn't give me anything to convince anybody with. What would you have me do?

His only post today is "another needless last minute switch." When was there another last minute switch?

Are you really that simple minded? It's the reason why we lost out cop!

[JaggedJimmyJay]

lmao is it confirmed that wilgy's bullshitting now? talking about a thought process that mechanically couldn't have happened?

No fuckin shit.

So, concession?

[TheFloyd73]

Oh, I thought he was accusing me of that but I guess he was just saying what happened generally?

In which case floyd tell me which of these votes are the most suspicious. Five to choose from.

Epi voting for me, although I think he just has a problem with me which he won't mention.

Motel's vote for Dfaraday is the one the also perplexes me.

[Epignosis]

I don't need a lecture about being inspiring and playing for lucky breaks from a guy who voted out the cop Day 1.

Horseshit ad hominem is beneath you. You're bad.

That's not an ad hominem, nor is it horseshit.

[a2thezebra]

This game cray

[Diiny]

Oh, I thought he was accusing me of that but I guess he was just saying what happened generally?

In which case floyd tell me which of these votes are the most suspicious. Five to choose from.

Epi voting for me, although I think he just has a problem with me which he won't mention.

Motel's vote for Dfaraday is the one the also perplexes me.

I mean of the five votes for enrique.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I don't need a lecture about being inspiring and playing for lucky breaks from a guy who voted out the cop Day 1.

Horseshit ad hominem is beneath you. You're bad.

That's not an ad hominem, nor is it horseshit.

You ignored my accusation and attacked my credibility. Ad hominem.

My part in yesterday's lynch is irrelevant, and I did not lecture you.

I'm going to level with you. If you're town, you stink. You've done shit all and pretend to have high ground because shit all is better than a vote for the cop.

You're bad.

[a2thezebra]

FZ's grappling with Wilgy makes sense to me, it's a confusing situation, and FZ strikes me as someone wanting to get to the bottom of it quick. What gives me more pause is her stance on me which isn't very solid. I'd be glad to see someone say I wasn't bad normally, but she seemed to want to stay out of the entire conflict, possibly because she knows I'll flip town if I die but doesn't want the hassle of defending someone a lot of people think is bad. She has some pretty brutal disses in her post history.

Audio Version:


link: fug

How poetic that my biggest scum read understands the reasoning behind my second biggest scum read better than anyone else.

Wait, this reasoning for your second scum read doesn't even make sense if I'm scum. And you underlined stuff that involved me being town specifically. What's up?

It makes sense because my suspicion of FZ isn't dependent on you being her teammate as others seemed to think it was. Her distancing of you while simultaneously voting for you is equally questionable whether you're her teammate or not. If you're scum, it makes just as much sense and actually makes her distancing of you more easily understood. What on earth did I underline that involved you being town? You're not town.

[Epignosis]

Me too. Why can't you talk about the potential baddie influence on lynching the cop AND be interested in floyd?

Why "can't?"

Is there some restriction on me?

I'll talk about what I like. I have nothing to say about it.

I want to lynch FLOYD.

You keep saying that but you're not trying to convince anybody to do it.

Floyd doesn't give me anything to convince anybody with. What would you have me do?

His only post today is "another needless last minute switch." When was there another last minute switch?

Are you really that simple minded? It's the reason why we lost out cop!

I must be simple minded. I don't understand what the underlined means. The reason the cop died is because he had the most votes. My question was "When was there another last minute switch?"

The MacDougall mega list of confirmed scum and confirmed townies

Confirmed townies;

1. Enrique
2. Zebra

Confirmed scum;

1. Diiny
2. FZ

Can't disagree with that.

I think Diiny is scum. I think DrWilgy most likely is but until Diiny is gone, we don't want to lynch him.

Can't disagree with that either.

At the moment, Diiny, Wilgy and FZ are on my scum radar.

Enrique
5
JaggedJimmyJay (11), DrWilgy (12), MovingPictures07 (13), MacDougall (15), Diiny (16)
31%

After that turnaround, after having agreed (er, not disagreed) with Mac's list of "confirmed townies," after witnessing Mac put the deciding vote on Enrique the cop, after all that, you don't have ONE thing to say about MacDougall?

Maybe I'm not so simple minded.

[a2thezebra]

Zebra btw, nice avatar

DrWilgy, stop trying to intoxicate us with the wine por favor

@Diiny While I appreciate that you elaborated on your (supposed) thought processes with those posts I mentioned, I still don't buy it. Sorry. Bedtime for me too.

Zebra noting that my play is all WIFOM...

and...
actually that's it! woo! EZ!
Zebra denotes my play as WIFOM, and stays away from it. Rather get involved with me, Zebra looks at how players responded to my lie.
Zebra, you are a beautiful human.

You too, are a beautiful human DrWilgy. I'm glad someone gets where I was (and am, I suppose) coming from.

[Tangrowth]

Hey all! Just popping in to say I will try to maximize my contributions, but they will be inevitably limited because I'm in crunch mode for this accounting research final until Tuesday morning (the 8th). I also am trying to get Smashfest 2 up and running ASAP, so when I'm around to do that tonight (Central time), I'll pop in here as well. Friday is TBD.

[a2thezebra]

this is me rn



Wilgy you're full of shit and I look forward to lynching you tomorrow. I'm out rn but I'll be back in like an hour prob.

Anyway, you're full of shit.

While I was shocked checking in post-lynch to find you dead, I am significantly less shocked after seeing this. It doesn't feel genuine at all. It was, but it doesn't feel like it was. I don't think we suck for lynching you (granted I initially did), and if I was present near the end of the day I might have contributed to that lynch myself.

[a2thezebra]

I'm 100% serious btw. If Wilgy dies tonight I will ask to be replaced. I won't make another post on the thread. I'm out completely. I feel stupid for even entertaining the idea that he was trying to do something good. Wilgy is the worst of the worst.

I feel sick

[a2thezebra]

And I'm really loving the melodrama btw

More power to you scum

[a2thezebra]

Okay FZ, I was reluctant to call you out on misrepresenting my argument when it comes to what exactly I think Wilgy is doing in this game in the last post I made, because I feel like I call people out on that too often when it's not true and/or warranted. But this is just too much. Let me go back and take a look at your magnificent concoction of assumptions and straw man arguments.

And I need to make it clear and more vocal that there's a difference between being wrong for being wrong and being wrong for being bad.

WTF does that supposed to mean?

You're only trying to justify your Diiny vote as being based on Wilgy's claim because it's easier to pull off as genuine than faking a reason why you think he is actually bad or at least inconspicuously parroting everyone else that does.

This is ridiculous. Either Wilgy is telling the truth or not. If he is, then I find trusting him to be the best thing to do. Since you're not voting Wilgy, I'm assuming you think he's lying about knowing for a fact Diiny is bad. If that's the case, you should be a lot more worried about him than you are me, but don't let logic confuse you.

Alright, so your assumption (and you even admit, it is in fact an assumption) that I think Wilgy is lying stems from me not voting for him? I could write a piece that Ayn Rand fanboys would appreciate based on how illogical that assumption is, but I'll move on instead.

This is most likely because he's your teammate but it's still a valid hypothesis even if he's somehow not.

I must be really dense today, because I swear to god, I'm not understanding half the players this game.

Two options I've seen brought up:

1. Enrique: Wilgy and Diiny are bad. The former is throwing the latter under the bus by fake claiming something that the real cop knows is not true.

2. Zebra: Wilgy is lying, and taking the most stupid risk I've ever seen someone take (it's not like he can use some excuse that his actions got redirected or whatever) which will be discovered the minute Diiny is lynched, and I'm following him because it's easier to show I'm trusting him instead of finding a real reason to suspect someone.

I'd like to call at least one of you bad, but these theories seem so far fetched that I can't possibly think a baddie would be that crazy to try and pin them on people.

So to recap, you've gone from an assumption about one of my hypotheses based on me not voting for a particular player, to representing that assumption that you have made as an "option" that you've seen me brought up. Calling this misrepresentation wouldn't even do this justice anymore. This is lying, plain and simple. I don't think Wilgy is lying and I don't think he's telling the truth either. As I've already made clear earlier, what Wilgy is doing is pure WIFOM to me that could go too many different ways to make any assumptions about, which makes it all the easier for baddies such as yourself to use a fake perspective on what he is doing to your advantage. And you are not following him, you are faking following him. If you can't see that aspect of my argument then that means you've most likely been caught red-handed, because bottom line, that IS the argument itself.

Elaborate upon this.

[a2thezebra]

Crazy theory: I think zebra and FZ. are mafia teammates.

I love it. It's brilliant. I even wish it were true.

[a2thezebra]

Yup, definitely taking the role of observer for a while.

I don't like this post. At all.

If you can't stand the heat, then stay out of the kitchen. I struggle to see why a civilian zebra would want to dial back her participation.

Better to have no opinion than an uninformed one. I value my participation, therefore I want as much of it as possible to have credibility.

[a2thezebra]

I think a push against a Diiny lynch here isn't a great idea. I and others had him as firmly scum well before Wilgy came along being Wilgy.

Amen.

[a2thezebra]

...

I think I've made my point with the FZ vote. Back to Diiny.

What point was that?

That she's bad.

[Diiny]

FZ's grappling with Wilgy makes sense to me, it's a confusing situation, and FZ strikes me as someone wanting to get to the bottom of it quick. What gives me more pause is her stance on me which isn't very solid. I'd be glad to see someone say I wasn't bad normally, but she seemed to want to stay out of the entire conflict, possibly because she knows I'll flip town if I die but doesn't want the hassle of defending someone a lot of people think is bad. She has some pretty brutal disses in her post history.

Audio Version:


link: fug

How poetic that my biggest scum read understands the reasoning behind my second biggest scum read better than anyone else.

Wait, this reasoning for your second scum read doesn't even make sense if I'm scum. And you underlined stuff that involved me being town specifically. What's up?

It makes sense because my suspicion of FZ isn't dependent on you being her teammate as others seemed to think it was. Her distancing of you while simultaneously voting for you is equally questionable whether you're her teammate or not. If you're scum, it makes just as much sense and actually makes her distancing of you more easily understood. What on earth did I underline that involved you being town? You're not town.

"possibly because she knows I'll flip town if I die"

You commented that I understand your reasoning but a big part of my reasoning was me being town. I understand your stance as you've posted it just now. Was my understanding of your problem with FZ summed up in "What gives me more pause is her stance on me which isn't very solid. I'd be glad to see someone say I wasn't bad normally, but she seemed to want to stay out of the entire conflict..." ?

[a2thezebra]

...

I talk like myself. Shocker. GG ruining the game.

Once you submitted this post, you submitted your death.

[Diiny]

Linki- I agree FZ, this game is getting pretty awful.

This game is getting worse by the minute

I need to reread people, and I don't have time for it now.

How much do you want to bet that one or both of these posters are scum

[DrWilgy]

lmao is it confirmed that wilgy's bullshitting now? talking about a thought process that mechanically couldn't have happened?

No fuckin shit.

So, concession?

Totes m'boats coatz

[a2thezebra]

Me too. Why can't you talk about the potential baddie influence on lynching the cop AND be interested in floyd?

Why "can't?"

Is there some restriction on me?

I'll talk about what I like. I have nothing to say about it.

I want to lynch FLOYD.

You keep saying that but you're not trying to convince anybody to do it.

B-b-b-b-but FLOYD.

[Epignosis]

I don't need a lecture about being inspiring and playing for lucky breaks from a guy who voted out the cop Day 1.

Horseshit ad hominem is beneath you. You're bad.

That's not an ad hominem, nor is it horseshit.

You ignored my accusation and attacked my credibility. Ad hominem.

My part in yesterday's lynch is irrelevant, and I did not lecture you.

I'm going to level with you. If you're town, you stink. You've done shit all and pretend to have high ground because shit all is better than a vote for the cop.

You're bad.

Attacking your credibility is not an ad hominem. If you are bad, then you should have no credibility.

Now, the underlined, THAT's an ad hominem, Chuckles.

Presently, I have done more for the civilians than you have. You are, as of now, a liability to the civilians. If we had voted out Floyd Day 1 and even then he turned out to be a civilian, that STILL would have been a superior play than what transpired. And your vote for Enrique was the weakest maneuver I've ever witnessed you make. Observe:

Doc's review of Enrique brought me to this post.

u first tiger

right, i'm suss of you because of your little hop away from your Diiny vote to voting Wilgy after his cop claim, to getting back on Diiny. Reads like you didn't know where to sit and now have a theory involving them both being scum.

I want to hear YOUR opinion on Diiny.

For the record, I've always been perfectly okay with a Diiny lynch. Wilgy did look more dangerous for a bit, but really, as long as we get a bad guy today there's no rush. Lynching DrWilgy is taking too big a risk atm when we know so little about what he's trying to do.

I think Diiny is scum. I think DrWilgy most likely is but until Diiny is gone, we don't want to lynch him.

The highlighted bits seem a bit inflated to me -- as in they assign importance and seriousness to something that I don't think needs to be viewed that way. Why is lynching DrWilgy a "big risk" by comparison to lynching the guy he claimed to red peek when most of us thought it was a lie anyway?

Moreover, Enrique has been entertaining the notion that Doc and Diiny are both Mafia, which makes me wonder what he thinks Diiny's lynch would reveal about Doc that he hasn't already implied. If Diiny flips town, his suspicion of Doc can persist for obvious reasons (he lied about a red peek and pushed hard for an errant lynch). If Diiny flips mafia, then his suspicion of Doc can still persist based on his own exploration of the bussing possibility.

So I'm not sure this post aligns nicely with Enrique's own stated mindset.

According to this post, you define "seems a bit inflated to me" as "[assigning] importance and seriousness to something [you] don't think needs to be viewed that way." Aside from the hedged phrasing there ("seems a bit"), the definition of "inflated" you provided is now discredited. You then ask a question that Enrique answered in the post you quoted (it's risky to lynch Wilgy before learning where he was going with his cop claim...bear in mind that it's the cop allowing WIlgy's antic).

In the second section, you preemptively cast suspicion on Enrique based on a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario. That is a rotten tactic, and, ironically, it allows YOU to maintain an Enrique suspicion if Enrique survives Day 1 and Dinny is lynched either way.

So 3J, if you are the arbiter of who is stinking as a civilian, I'm not at all bothered with the insult. But you're not the arbiter of who stinks as a civilians- Mafia don't get to decide that.

I'm calling 3J and Floyd as teammates.