[END] Turf Wars: Battle of the Hosts

[Prisoner 509378]

Also, I do have a record of success here. I was right on Radical Fuzz and right on DDL. I really don't appreciate the insinuation otherwise.

Quite frankly, I'm getting annoyed again.

To be frank, I think egos are swelling too much on both sides of this conversation. You have confidence in your Mafia skillset, and that's fine. Other people are interpreting you as being condescending of their skillsets, rightly or wrongly, and it's turning them off from following your lead. You probably don't intend that, but it's happening IMO. Consider the way you carry yourself as a brand new player to this group and the way that will influence their treatment of you -- both within the confines of making reads in this game, and beyond that. I truly mean no offense; I am just stating what I think I see.

[Prisoner 509378]

That's probably enough to put a damper on any townies game.

[indiglo]

I really want to take a leap of faith and trust Silver about ika.

Here's what my paranoia is doing to me - what if ika is scum and several scum team members are voting ika (a member of their team) for civ cred? (While they let a bunch of civs follow another mislynch.)

Not that I think Boomrique is a mislynch, but this is what my brain does every time I try to make a freaking decision in this game!


Whoa, linkola~

[Prisoner 509378]

Wasn't DDL a civvie?

SW read him as a civvie.

[Epignosis]

Silverwolf...again with the D-word.

You asked a question, and I answered it. Personally, I think you discredited yourself yesterday, but I'm not getting into that again.

If I said to you, "Hey Silverwolf, I can read Turnip Head extremely well. I've been playing with him for years. We've been bad together once, but we've had lengthy conversations about the way he plays when he's bad. He's not posting a lot, so that must mean he's bad," would you believe me?

Why or why not?

[Scotty]

How can we have this much division on Day 6? This is ridiculous. There is obviously at least a few coppers walkin the beat on these lynches, and I'm just hoping I picked the one with the cop.

Do we think both could be cops and ika is just beyond saving?

[Turnip Head]

I can see the Bloom lynch, and I'm fine with it. However I think Ika is a better choice and I don't understand how 509 and the other Ika defenders don't see his obvious attempt at emotional manipulation. I don't think Ika thought Silver would ever get 100% scum read on him, he said so many times he would let himself be lynched if she thought he was 100% scum. SO why as soon as she believed this he pulled such a manipulative move? I think he is scum who believed he had tricked Silver, and when he realized he didn't he attempted to appeal to her emotions. Which worked until she reread his post.

I don't think so, Epi wasn't catching any steam even before the CFD. If anything it would have made more sense to wagon onto Fuzz. This didn't happen however, look at the people on the Ika wagon who have been lynched. Gleam and LC I believe both flipped civ. LC was the player who tied the wagon to Fuzz. SO either he is the seemer which we agreed isn't likely. Or a portion of the people on Ika are civ as well. So I think it is extremely possibly we had two scum wagons, and if there was any planning it was clear Ika had a better chance to survive them Fuzz so they went with a Fuzz lynch.

Thinking about it more, I still believe there is a chance Epi is mafia. However, I'm more certain Ika is mafia. If I'm wrong lynch me tomorrow it will happen sooner or later anyway.

Also why do we so quickly see SW reads being golden to being bad? If Ika and when he flips mafia, those who are know discounting SW are most likely mafia.

linki: Nice Quin real nice. You do realize I made that post after Ika's emotional bullshit post right? How is that me sticking my fingers in a pie. I've been for an Ika wagon all day today and yesterday. I've gotta go soon but I implore you all to vote for Ika.

There's the conspiratorial sig I know and love

I don't ever want to lynch you. I'll go down with the ship holding onto my town read of you.

[S~V~S]

Wasn't DDL a civvie?

SW read him as a civvie.

Thank You.

[Turnip Head]

I really want to take a leap of faith and trust Silver about ika.

Here's what my paranoia is doing to me - what if ika is scum and several scum team members are voting ika (a member of their team) for civ cred? (While they let a bunch of civs follow another mislynch.)

In that case we should lynch him and sort out the rest when we get there.

[Silverwolf]

Silverwolf...again with the D-word.

You asked a question, and I answered it. Personally, I think you discredited yourself yesterday, but I'm not getting into that again.

If I said to you, "Hey Silverwolf, I can read Turnip Head extremely well. I've been playing with him for years. We've been bad together once, but we've had lengthy conversations about the way he plays when he's bad. He's not posting a lot, so that must mean he's bad," would you believe me?

Why or why not?

You forgot I played in a scum hydra with ika and have watched many of his scum games. I know how he plays. I'm not gonna continue this with you. I honestly don't care if you believe me or not on if I can read him. The more pressing matter is, if I've made good enough points that others will listen to me and lynch him.

[Prisoner 509378]

I can see the Bloom lynch, and I'm fine with it. However I think Ika is a better choice and I don't understand how 509 and the other Ika defenders don't see his obvious attempt at emotional manipulation. I don't think Ika thought Silver would ever get 100% scum read on him, he said so many times he would let himself be lynched if she thought he was 100% scum. SO why as soon as she believed this he pulled such a manipulative move? I think he is scum who believed he had tricked Silver, and when he realized he didn't he attempted to appeal to her emotions. Which worked until she reread his post.

The reason I read it the way I did was just my gut judgment of how ika behaves around Silverwolf. I think it literally hurt his fingers to type "yes, she's wrong" and "I'm disappointed in you" and all that jazz. If it was anyone else I wouldn't read it that way. It's specific to the ika/Silverwolf dynamic which is just a unique friggin' thing in a Mafia game. But that's also a good reason for me to hesitate on making a hard judgment without willingness to budge, because I don't understand their interaction at all.

[indiglo]

I really want to take a leap of faith and trust Silver about ika.

Here's what my paranoia is doing to me - what if ika is scum and several scum team members are voting ika (a member of their team) for civ cred? (While they let a bunch of civs follow another mislynch.)

In that case we should lynch him and sort out the rest when we get there.

Well, I do think SW is town. Even with continued issues with miscommunication. Prisoner50 said we know who we trust, it's time to take a leap of faith. Ergo, I leap with her.

On the flip side, the past few times I have changed my vote close to EoD (even for what seemed like good reasons) it has not gone well for the lynch.

I know I am overthinking this, but then I overthink that too - which direction am I overthinking in? And that type of shit.

[Silverwolf]

Silverwolf...again with the D-word.

You asked a question, and I answered it. Personally, I think you discredited yourself yesterday, but I'm not getting into that again.

If I said to you, "Hey Silverwolf, I can read Turnip Head extremely well. I've been playing with him for years. We've been bad together once, but we've had lengthy conversations about the way he plays when he's bad. He's not posting a lot, so that must mean he's bad," would you believe me?

Why or why not?

You forgot I played in a scum hydra with ika and have watched many of his scum games. I know how he plays. I'm not gonna continue this with you. I honestly don't care if you believe me or not on if I can read him. The more pressing matter is, if I've made good enough points that others will listen to me and lynch him.

Oh and BTW, I've played in many games where he's been town. So I know his town game and this isn't it.

[Quin]

Quick question: Is there anybody here who hasn't scum-read ika at some point?

[Epignosis]

Silverwolf...again with the D-word.

You asked a question, and I answered it. Personally, I think you discredited yourself yesterday, but I'm not getting into that again.

If I said to you, "Hey Silverwolf, I can read Turnip Head extremely well. I've been playing with him for years. We've been bad together once, but we've had lengthy conversations about the way he plays when he's bad. He's not posting a lot, so that must mean he's bad," would you believe me?

Why or why not?

You forgot I played in a scum hydra with ika and have watched many of his scum games. I know how he plays. I'm not gonna continue this with you. I honestly don't care if you believe me or not on if I can read him. The more pressing matter is, if I've made good enough points that others will listen to me and lynch him.

And you didn't answer my question. Okay.

[Quin]

I really want to take a leap of faith and trust Silver about ika.

Here's what my paranoia is doing to me - what if ika is scum and several scum team members are voting ika (a member of their team) for civ cred? (While they let a bunch of civs follow another mislynch.)

In that case we should lynch him and sort out the rest when we get there.

Well, I do think SW is town. Even with continued issues with miscommunication. Prisoner50 said we know who we trust, it's time to take a leap of faith. Ergo, I leap with her.

On the flip side, the past few times I have changed my vote close to EoD (even for what seemed like good reasons) it has not gone well for the lynch.

I know I am overthinking this, but then I overthink that too - which direction am I overthinking in? And that type of shit.

Do you think my suspicion of ika is faked?

[Silverwolf]

Silverwolf...again with the D-word.

You asked a question, and I answered it. Personally, I think you discredited yourself yesterday, but I'm not getting into that again.

If I said to you, "Hey Silverwolf, I can read Turnip Head extremely well. I've been playing with him for years. We've been bad together once, but we've had lengthy conversations about the way he plays when he's bad. He's not posting a lot, so that must mean he's bad," would you believe me?

Why or why not?

You forgot I played in a scum hydra with ika and have watched many of his scum games. I know how he plays. I'm not gonna continue this with you. I honestly don't care if you believe me or not on if I can read him. The more pressing matter is, if I've made good enough points that others will listen to me and lynch him.

And you didn't answer my question. Okay.

Nope, I didn't. It's irrelevant.

[Prisoner 509378]

Nope, I didn't. It's irrelevant.

I don't think it is. If you give the question a chance maybe you'll see things from his point of view. That's the point?

[indiglo]

I really want to take a leap of faith and trust Silver about ika.

Here's what my paranoia is doing to me - what if ika is scum and several scum team members are voting ika (a member of their team) for civ cred? (While they let a bunch of civs follow another mislynch.)

In that case we should lynch him and sort out the rest when we get there.

Well, I do think SW is town. Even with continued issues with miscommunication. Prisoner50 said we know who we trust, it's time to take a leap of faith. Ergo, I leap with her.

On the flip side, the past few times I have changed my vote close to EoD (even for what seemed like good reasons) it has not gone well for the lynch.

I know I am overthinking this, but then I overthink that too - which direction am I overthinking in? And that type of shit.

Do you think my suspicion of ika is faked?

No, I don't. I am not reading you as scum either. However some people I trust have been seeing you in that light for quite some time. So I'm led to consider why they think that, because I don't think their suspicion of you is faked either. Do they have info? Are they just incorrect?

I am in a pickle over the whole thing. And I feel like a dolt because of it, but I also have to congratulate all the cops on confusing me so well.

[Prisoner 509378]

Meahwhile, ika is farting around in the interrogation room while his head is being noosed. SW, please get him in here.

[indiglo]

He's probably going poo. He loves doing that.

[Silverwolf]

Nope, I didn't. It's irrelevant.

I don't think it is. If you give the question a chance maybe you'll see things from his point of view. That's the point?

Questioning if I can read ika or not when I've been 100% accurate on that is not relevant to this game. What's relevant is, if I'm making good points on him and can convince enough people. I think what Epi is doing is scummy but then town keeps jumping to his defense. I have no interest in listening to a scummy discredit job when I know ika better than anyone here.

[Epignosis]

He's probably going poo. He loves doing that.

You have elicited too many laughs from me. Skeletor doesn't laugh at indiglos.

[indiglo]

Nope, I didn't. It's irrelevant.

I don't think it is. If you give the question a chance maybe you'll see things from his point of view. That's the point?

Questioning if I can read ika or not when I've been 100% accurate on that is not relevant to this game. What's relevant is, if I'm making good points on him and can convince enough people. I think what Epi is doing is scummy but then town keeps jumping to his defense. I have no interest in listening to a scummy discredit job when I know ika better than anyone here.

What if answering Epi's question helped convince enough people?

[S~V~S]

Nope, I didn't. It's irrelevant.

I don't think it is. If you give the question a chance maybe you'll see things from his point of view. That's the point?

This 100%

Questions are not irrelevant, evenif you do not understand the perspective of the asker.

Linki, the question was not about ika, it was about trying to get you to see his point of view, at least as I read it.

[Quin]

I really want to take a leap of faith and trust Silver about ika.

Here's what my paranoia is doing to me - what if ika is scum and several scum team members are voting ika (a member of their team) for civ cred? (While they let a bunch of civs follow another mislynch.)

In that case we should lynch him and sort out the rest when we get there.

Well, I do think SW is town. Even with continued issues with miscommunication. Prisoner50 said we know who we trust, it's time to take a leap of faith. Ergo, I leap with her.

On the flip side, the past few times I have changed my vote close to EoD (even for what seemed like good reasons) it has not gone well for the lynch.

I know I am overthinking this, but then I overthink that too - which direction am I overthinking in? And that type of shit.

Do you think my suspicion of ika is faked?

No, I don't. I am not reading you as scum either. However some people I trust have been seeing you in that light for quite some time. So I'm led to consider why they think that, because I don't think their suspicion of you is faked either. Do they have info? Are they just incorrect?

I am in a pickle over the whole thing. And I feel like a dolt because of it, but I also have to congratulate all the cops on confusing me so well.

Prisoner aside, unless you have BTSC together then the person you trust the most could be manipulating you. If you don't scum read me, what makes you trust me less than the others? Because they lynched more people? Are you still suspicious of me? To answer both points, lynching ika would help you answer those questions.

[Epignosis]

Nope, I didn't. It's irrelevant.

I don't think it is. If you give the question a chance maybe you'll see things from his point of view. That's the point?

Questioning if I can read ika or not when I've been 100% accurate on that is not relevant to this game. What's relevant is, if I'm making good points on him and can convince enough people. I think what Epi is doing is scummy but then town keeps jumping to his defense. I have no interest in listening to a scummy discredit job when I know ika better than anyone here.

I'm sorry I don't take your word as gospel.

Actually, no I'm not.

[Silverwolf]

Meahwhile, ika is farting around in the interrogation room while his head is being noosed. SW, please get him in here.

I can try but he has a mind of his own.

indiglo-I'm pretty sure he's not pooping cuz I'm pretty sure he can't format mobile and wouldn't take his computer in the bathroom.

[Silverwolf]

Nope, I didn't. It's irrelevant.

I don't think it is. If you give the question a chance maybe you'll see things from his point of view. That's the point?

Questioning if I can read ika or not when I've been 100% accurate on that is not relevant to this game. What's relevant is, if I'm making good points on him and can convince enough people. I think what Epi is doing is scummy but then town keeps jumping to his defense. I have no interest in listening to a scummy discredit job when I know ika better than anyone here.

I'm sorry I don't take your word as gospel.

Actually, no I'm not.

Thank you for this enlightening post.

[Prisoner 509378]

Nope, I didn't. It's irrelevant.

I don't think it is. If you give the question a chance maybe you'll see things from his point of view. That's the point?

Questioning if I can read ika or not when I've been 100% accurate on that is not relevant to this game. What's relevant is, if I'm making good points on him and can convince enough people. I think what Epi is doing is scummy but then town keeps jumping to his defense. I have no interest in listening to a scummy discredit job when I know ika better than anyone here.

Epi's question wasn't about ika. He was trying to illustrate how it's hard for us to just dive headfirst into an ika wagon because of your read. That's why I don't think it was an effort to discredit -- I completely understand where he is coming from. That problem has played into my own mindset too. I am not nefarious. You don't hate my guts. What Epi has tried to convey you; I could have also tried to convey to you. Does that mean anything to you? He's being asked to dedicate his vote to a lynch that he has made clear he doesn't stand for (for specific reasons unrelated to your read), and your confidence in your ika read and your claimed history with ika is not good enough to change his mind. That makes perfect sense to me.

[Silverwolf]

Nope, I didn't. It's irrelevant.

I don't think it is. If you give the question a chance maybe you'll see things from his point of view. That's the point?

Questioning if I can read ika or not when I've been 100% accurate on that is not relevant to this game. What's relevant is, if I'm making good points on him and can convince enough people. I think what Epi is doing is scummy but then town keeps jumping to his defense. I have no interest in listening to a scummy discredit job when I know ika better than anyone here.

What if answering Epi's question helped convince enough people?

I've already addressed it. He's trying to distract the conversation onto me. I'm not going to let him. I really wish town would stop defending him because it's annoying the shit out of me.

[Epignosis]

Would ika kill you in a Mafia game or leave you alone?

[ika]

Meahwhile, ika is farting around in the interrogation room while his head is being noosed. SW, please get him in here.

I can try but he has a mind of his own.

indiglo-I'm pretty sure he's not pooping cuz I'm pretty sure he can't format mobile and wouldn't take his computer in the bathroom.

You should know i would take my computer into the bathroom if i needed to poo. I must of never done it with you yet

I havent been posting much cus i still feel bad about the post i directed at silver.

I dont get why ppl are defedning epi either. his entire posts are about how im playing. why should silver see his POV if she thinks he is scum?

She is callign him scum, so she has no bearing to try to see it, its twising at it wrost and thats why my votes still ont here

[Silverwolf]

Nope, I didn't. It's irrelevant.

I don't think it is. If you give the question a chance maybe you'll see things from his point of view. That's the point?

Questioning if I can read ika or not when I've been 100% accurate on that is not relevant to this game. What's relevant is, if I'm making good points on him and can convince enough people. I think what Epi is doing is scummy but then town keeps jumping to his defense. I have no interest in listening to a scummy discredit job when I know ika better than anyone here.

Epi's question wasn't about ika. He was trying to illustrate how it's hard for us to just dive headfirst into an ika wagon because of your read. That's why I don't think it was an effort to discredit -- I completely understand where he is coming from. That problem has played into my own mindset too. I am not nefarious. You don't hate my guts. What Epi has tried to convey you; I could have also tried to convey to you. Does that mean anything to you? He's being asked to dedicate his vote to a lynch that he has made clear he doesn't stand for (for specific reasons unrelated to your read), and your confidence in your ika read and your claimed history with ika is not good enough to change his mind. That makes perfect sense to me.

OH FFS!! IT ISN'T ABOUT WHETHER I CAN READ IKA OR NOT ANYMORE. I'VE LISTED OUT REASONS I THINK HE IS FUCKING SCUMMY AND ONCE AGAIN, NO ONE IS FUCKING LISTENING TO ME BUT INSTEAD DEFENDING A DISCREDIT JOB TO MAKE ME LOOK LIKE I CAN'T READ A PERSON I'VE PLAYED WITH MANY TIMES AND AM DATING BESIDES. DAMN, I'M SICK OF THIS SHIT!!

[Prisoner 509378]

I really wish town would stop defending him because it's annoying the shit out of me.

This. This right here. This is shit town play. I don't give a shit anymore. You're being condescending, and I don't like it. We're defending Epignosis because we think you're wrong. If you don't listen to our reasons for thinking you're wrong, then that's your problem. Jesus H. Christ.

[ika]

Would ika kill you in a Mafia game or leave you alone?

If i wa scum on here first time with her i might leave her jsut so she can get accomidated to site, once we get used to it i would kill her n1 unless she is town reading me and makeing the game fun

[S~V~S]

If Epi wants to discredit someone, you know it. This is not it. I have been on the end of it,and this is not it. Perhaps this is why the [people who know him are defending him.

[S~V~S]

You want us to listen to you, but you don't want to listen to us.

[Silverwolf]

Would ika kill you in a Mafia game or leave you alone?

I don't know. I know I killed him N2 in a game but I replaced in on D2 or I'm sure he would of died N1. He has said he would always kill me N1 in any game he's scum but he also has to get the o.k. of his teammates as well.

[ika]

I really wish town would stop defending him because it's annoying the shit out of me.

This. This right here. This is shit town play. I don't give a shit anymore. You're being condescending, and I don't like it. We're defending Epignosis because we think you're wrong. If you don't listen to our reasons for thinking you're wrong, then that's your problem. Jesus H. Christ.

But the thing is you're speaking like a sith to her, you're not taking any revaluations on it, you're not considering her POV either. What happens to listening to the town core?

[Prisoner 509378]

I really wish town would stop defending him because it's annoying the shit out of me.

This. This right here. This is shit town play. I don't give a shit anymore. You're being condescending, and I don't like it. We're defending Epignosis because we think you're wrong. If you don't listen to our reasons for thinking you're wrong, then that's your problem. Jesus H. Christ.

But the thing is you're speaking like a sith to her, you're not taking any revaluations on it, you're not considering her POV either. What happens to listening to the town core?

I have no idea what you said in this post.

[indiglo]

Nope, I didn't. It's irrelevant.

I don't think it is. If you give the question a chance maybe you'll see things from his point of view. That's the point?

Questioning if I can read ika or not when I've been 100% accurate on that is not relevant to this game. What's relevant is, if I'm making good points on him and can convince enough people. I think what Epi is doing is scummy but then town keeps jumping to his defense. I have no interest in listening to a scummy discredit job when I know ika better than anyone here.

What if answering Epi's question helped convince enough people?

I've already addressed it. He's trying to distract the conversation onto me. I'm not going to let him. I really wish town would stop defending him because it's annoying the shit out of me.

Here's where I am, again. I'm not going to build a case on you, or pull quotes, because I don't think you're scum.

I am hoping to convey to you that while YOU feel you have made plenty of good points on him, you have clearly not convinced enough people in this game thread to lynch him. Not all of those you have not convinced are scum, so are you willing to continue to try to build your case on ika? I am not defending Epi, I am trying to reach you, to help you understand that coming in here - where no one knows you - and saying "ika is scum, because I know him" is not that convincing. Which by this point, is painfully obvious, but how to convey that to you in a way that doesn't upset you is not something I know.

It's not that I think you are teh suck at mafia, or don't know ika, or whatever. It's that I would prefer more information from you in order to put my vote there. Not just repeating the same things you've already said more forcefully.



Linki~ I'm still going to post this so my thoughts are out there.

[Turnip Head]

I really wish town would stop defending him because it's annoying the shit out of me.

This. This right here. This is shit town play. I don't give a shit anymore. You're being condescending, and I don't like it. We're defending Epignosis because we think you're wrong. If you don't listen to our reasons for thinking you're wrong, then that's your problem. Jesus H. Christ.

But the thing is you're speaking like a sith to her, you're not taking any revaluations on it, you're not considering her POV either. What happens to listening to the town core?

It's creepy that you still defend her POV while she calls you confirmed cop

[S~V~S]

I really wish town would stop defending him because it's annoying the shit out of me.

This. This right here. This is shit town play. I don't give a shit anymore. You're being condescending, and I don't like it. We're defending Epignosis because we think you're wrong. If you don't listen to our reasons for thinking you're wrong, then that's your problem. Jesus H. Christ.

But the thing is you're speaking like a sith to her, you're not taking any revaluations on it, you're not considering her POV either. What happens to listening to the town core?

So once again you are defending her calling you a baddie.

[Quin]

Meahwhile, ika is farting around in the interrogation room while his head is being noosed. SW, please get him in here.

I can try but he has a mind of his own.

indiglo-I'm pretty sure he's not pooping cuz I'm pretty sure he can't format mobile and wouldn't take his computer in the bathroom.

You should know i would take my computer into the bathroom if i needed to poo. I must of never done it with you yet

I havent been posting much cus i still feel bad about the post i directed at silver.

I dont get why ppl are defedning epi either. his entire posts are about how im playing. why should silver see his POV if she thinks he is scum?

She is callign him scum, so she has no bearing to try to see it, its twising at it wrost and thats why my votes still ont here

Why should silver completely ignore someone who she thinks is town? Because not doing so is quite frankly a horrible thing to do. I felt the same way back when SVS wouldn't talk to me when she first suspected me. It felt like I was being denied the opportunity to play mafia with her. She's abandoned that tactic for the most part, which I'm thankful for. Besides, if people just ignored their scum reads they wouldn't be able to build their case.

Other than speaking out against this, I don't have much to say between Silver and Epi. I want to see how it plays out, there's probably something tangible in there I can use later on.

[Silverwolf]

You want us to listen to you, but you don't want to listen to us.

I am more than willing to listen to people I'm townreading but that doesn't mean I'm gonna change my mind on ika right now. I'm stepping back cuz town is divided and ika needs to go to prevent this divide from continuing while town fights and scum watches.

[Silverwolf]

Thanks everyone for telling me I suck at this game.

I really feel welcome here.

[ika]

You want us to listen to you, but you don't want to listen to us.

She would listen if you guys are willing to listen to her first. YOu guys are both doing a "NO YOU" type argument where both sides want to be heard but neither is willing to yield.

FMPOV I see this more on you guys then silver. She's the new player, shes the one who wants to be ear. I see everyone else (the site players) kinda joiing up against the solo person and it upsets me as well.

[Prisoner 509378]

Thanks everyone for telling me I suck at this game.

I really feel welcome here.

I don't think you suck. But you've spent the entire game telling everyone else they suck. Stop that.

[ika]

Thanks everyone for telling me I suck at this game.

I really feel welcome here.

I don't think you suck. But you've spent the entire game telling everyone else they suck. Stop that.

Quote her where she said people suck.