Mass Effect Mafia (END)

#1451

Now what I am about to say regarding this post may seem insignificant, but in hindsight, I think it's important.

"Epignosis" is a Greek word meaning "toward knowledge." It's my username because it defines what I'm about.

gfishfunk got the meaning wrong.

Epignosis - has knowledge of of the spiritual realm above, if names are to be believed.
I might forgive it, except that he said "if names are to be believed."

That tells me he didn't look up my name. "Epignosis" doesn't inherently have anything to do with spiritual things or heaven or any of that. My music has such themes.

What I'm driving at is this: Gfishfunk is on a team with somebody who knows I'm religious but doesn't know what my name means. In other words, I believe someone from The Syndicate is on his team, because his understanding of Koine Greek is shit. How did he know my name could be religious?

On another note, "Long Con" is a fairly simple name to say something about. gfish took a stab at my name, which is fairly more complicated, but for Long Con, had this to say: "I have nothing witty to say about this person. It can be argued that I haven't said anything witty yet, either."

I believe Long Con was paralyzed. That is to say I believe he was Gfishfunk's teammate, but, due to the circumstances, he couldn't comfortably move his vote even if he wanted to. So he stayed on me. He had no comfortable avenue to vote elsewhere.

And gfishfunk being mafia gives credence to my little scheme with respect to Long Con. The fact that they both tried to "expose" me shows they are working together.

I will stop here to flush my system. I will resume later. I encourage everyone to look at these posts and see potential teammate interactions.

This definitely sounds interesting, but I don't know what exactly is learned from this. The top several google results for your name are all religious in nature, he could have clicked on one of those and gotten that result.
You already suggested that Long Con was on the same a GFish, so that isn't exactly new.

#1452

WTF. Epignosis is a hydra account. Wikipedia says so.

#1453

DrWilgy wrote:@Dom - My suspicion on Nut is just there because she hasn't contributed enough for me to say otherwise. She's not a Cerberus, and I don't trust her yet... So Reaper!

@EVERYONE
I'm tired of this Judge Judy bullshit. I need from each player, in only 3 sentences minimum, who are GFish's teammates and why.

My own -
LC and Raven are GFish's teammates. LC for his interactions with Epi during the past cycle. Raven for Gfish's "out of left field" question, and acceptance of sub-par answers (IMO).

I think the fastest way for us to deal with Cerberus is to tie up both LC and Raven. Lay them both down so their heads are relatively on top of each other, then drop a really, really, heavy rock on both of their heads. There will be a crunch, then a host message that Cerberus has been womp womp'd.

linki - neat!

My very tentative guess is MP and Silver, about neither of which am I in any way confident. MP kind of just showed up, voted for GFish and left without posting much, which seems unusual. I would similarly be suspicious of Adam, but this just cancels out some of my earlier town reads for him today. Since I don't think Nifty and GFish are on the same team based on their completely different attacks on Epi with different goals in mind and Nifty rescinding his vote early, and I do think there is another hcrealms member on that team, my remaining options are JOH, Silver, and IR. Metawise, all of these players have seemed off, but JOH has made reads and IR has remained relatively quiet, which leaves Silver.

#1454

Epignosis wrote:
Spoiler: show
Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:
Long Con wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:@Dom - My suspicion on Nut is just there because she hasn't contributed enough for me to say otherwise. She's not a Cerberus, and I don't trust her yet... So Reaper!

@EVERYONE
I'm tired of this Judge Judy bullshit. I need from each player, in only 3 sentences minimum, who are GFish's teammates and why.

My own -
LC and Raven are GFish's teammates. LC for his interactions with Epi during the past cycle. Raven for Gfish's "out of left field" question, and acceptance of sub-par answers (IMO).

I think the fastest way for us to deal with Cerberus is to tie up both LC and Raven. Lay them both down so their heads are relatively on top of each other, then drop a really, really, heavy rock on both of their heads. There will be a crunch, then a host message that Cerberus has been womp womp'd.
I don't know if you are worth trying to reason with, but you are wrong. I'm not Cerberus. Go drop a rock on your own head, as far as I'm concerned there's no reason not to believe you're a Reaper.
M'kay, do you have reason to believe I AM a Reaper? By all means, drop a rock on my head if you think that'll win you the game.
Well, you've been fawning over Epignosis for quite a while now. Since I believe he's chosen to be a Reaper, that makes you my number one choice as a Reaper suspicion.
How do I choose to be a Reaper?

Explain it to me using my role description.
Are you fucking kidding me? Why are you dancing the Obtuse Dance?
I don't choose to be a Reaper. I choose to win with them.

That's a big difference.

So at this point, you are claiming town unfriendly neutral and you think that... what? That will go well for you?

#1455

TonyStarkPrime wrote:
Epignosis wrote:I don't choose to be a Reaper. I choose to win with them.

That's a big difference.
So at this point, you are claiming town unfriendly neutral and you think that... what? That will go well for you?

I assumed that he meant "My role doesn't give me the option to choose to be a Reaper. My role gives me the option to choose to win with them."

#1456

Caught up:

Fredwood wrote:Dizzy, floating through the thread like a adhd butterfly whose wings sprinkle a dusting of cocaine in her wake.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:Lol I hate your gambit, Epi.

Cause you could be a bulletproof don. You could be the Cylons and you then side with the mafia, especially if we lynch a townie or two. I'm gonna feel stupid if either of these turn out to be the case, whereas I won't feel stupid if we lynch you no matter what. But like....I believe this is a thing you would do. It's exactly the kind of outside the box "I am so much smarter than you" trickery you'd pull. And if you are the Geth, you don't know if the people going after you are Cerberus or Reapers so you're knowingly opening the possibility of weakening one of your potential sides to help the town.

But you know they're not town? =)

CaptainNifty wrote:I could say the same to you.

Try to use less arrogance, bullshit, or whatever your trying to sling. Syndicate may think you are some kind of mafia genius, but half the players here don't know you or frankly care about your reputation.

Without you giving something up, or someone else providing more info, I see no reason to move my vote.

This tenacity reads more town to me.

Dom wrote:POLL: Do you think Jack was really making a fucking rainbow list, using color codes that are all in HEX (right-- that's HEX right?) in quick reply?
That sounds like some serious bullshit to me.

This argument is sexy regardless of if it's right or not.

TonyStarkPrime wrote:Last night, Reaper targeted CBob. Unless JOH is totally tricking me, what he said about CBob on day 1 suggests to me that he would not go for CBob for a night kill night one, as he basically prepped the other team to do that.

Wait what? How do you know this? Why are you talking about Jack as comfirmed scum here?

#1457

People I would invite to my birthday party:
Fred - Potty mouthed friend.
Nut - Hazelnut spread friend.
LC - I will yolo this read to my grave.
Wilgy - Yaaaas, bruh.

People I would go for long walks with (but maybe bring a knife in my back pocket just in case)
SVS - Tinks thoughty thoughts.
Adam - Makes me sane.
Nifty - Has the grrrs.
MP - Because I thought so D1.

People I want to get to know better:
Dom - Is like a mix of Epi and Llama and it's fun.
Sprit - Is standing on the outside looking in.

People I'm looking at while lifting one eyebrow:
TSP - Says some weird things I don't follow.
Raven - I've kind of forgotten the concrete reasons, so let's call it gut. (Actually the reasons are a bit silly).

People I will throw rocks at:
Silver - Doesn't feel like he did to me last game. Lack of scum hunting?
Jack - I don't feel like explaining this in detail. I think "not finding his footing" like Adam said is a good analogy. Many words, much mental gymnastics, which can go on forever, but I can see through it. His pokes on me is a placeholder, as it is with Nut.

Oh, and that guy:
Epi - Hi.

#1458

Immediate thoughts on teamed with Gfish is Jack and Raven. Jack because I read him strongly as scum and I recall Gfish ninja switch to Llama to make it possible for Jack to save himself from being lynched D1. I also think Silver is scum but more likely Reaper because of his post about Epi, he didn't seem concerned at all, but I don't think Jack and Silver are teamed. I mean, it's possible but it's wow much bus. I remember thinking some Gfish/Raven interaction made them look teamed. Something about some player giving Raven some leeway because of health issues, (Get well btw Raven!), but Gfish seemed to have a different attitude to this which struck me more strict teammate distancy kind of thing. Outside possibilities would be Adam and Nifty, but I read them both more town independently. I don't buy Gfish and LC as teamed.

#1459

Golden wrote:WTF. Epignosis is a hydra account. Wikipedia says so.

*war flashbacks*

Dyslexicon wrote: People I want to get to know better:
Dom - Is like a mix of Epi and Llama and it's fun.

I find this highly amusing.

#1460

Congrats Fish voters!

I had family issues drop up late in day so I couldn't be around but should be fine today.

#1461

Dizzy I see you in thread right now, if you're actually here, how do you want to "get to know me better?"

#1462

TonyStarkPrime wrote:Last night, Reaper targeted CBob. Unless JOH is totally tricking me, what he said about CBob on day 1 suggests to me that he would not go for CBob for a night kill night one, as he basically prepped the other team to do that.
Wait what? How do you know this? Why are you talking about Jack as comfirmed scum here?

I am saying that if JOH were scum, I don't think he would be a reaper.

#1463

nutella wrote:First you then a bunch of bible related stuff. It's pretty clearly used in religious contexts.

Someone should really update that Wikipedia page. It's way inaccurate.

#1464

Dyslexicon wrote: Dom - Is like a mix of Epi and Llama and it's fun.

You have no idea how much I want to put this in my signature.

#1465

@Dizzy

Define placeholder.

Why is SVS good? Why is Adam good?

#1466

@TSP

I feel you.
Maybe you can feel me later?

#1467

nutella wrote:Awesome result! I'll do some investigating later to see if I can figure out who might be gfish's teammates, I bet there's a busser or two in the last few votes. Maybe Adam, he voted with no real explanation and had some suspicious interaction with gfish earlier re: voting for epi.

Wilgy, why do you think I'm reaper??
Ftr I think Silver is probably reaper especially after what he said about epi siding with town.

I'm also the one who pointed out that gfish was either town thinking he blocked a kill or mafia that had discovered opposing scum. This was before Epi's Geth reveal. Why would I plant that seed if I was with gfish?

#1468

Dom wrote:Why Adam Might Be Cerberus

Adam, leading up to gfish's lynch, made five posts in which he mentioned gfish.

Post #1: A Read List where he lists him as a civ read.

Here, he takes the side of gfish against epignosis.

"my inclination is that gfish is town"

With very little explanation, his read switches to bad.

His vote on gfish

It's not very little explanation.

I laid it out in an earlier post. If there were only one mafia, a scum gfish would not have come out with the RB against Epi. But in a two mafia game, he would definitely do that if he thought he found someone on the other scum team. A possibly-Reaper aligned neutral fits that.

After Epi's tuck and roll claim was brought to light, and I thought Epi was town, I assumed gfish was also town, because I couldn't see mafia gfish going after a townie that hard on a RB. I assumed gfish was town that made a mistake. When it turned out Epi is a possibly town-hostile neutral, it made me think gfish is more likely scum, because scum gfish will make a big play to try and lynch rival scum and earn himself town cred.
What do we think?

#1469

EBWOP: My content got included inside the quote tag there, apparently.

#1470

Adam wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:
Adam wrote:
DrWilgy wrote: How does that work in this environment?
I'm not entirely sure yet. That's really the fun of a crossover game, isn't it?
So, now instead of explaining the wagon with the most votes as a pressure, how about you tell me what you think of Gfish and Nifty? How do you feel about them being the only 2 voting with you?
They're both playing as I expect them to. Nifty's gotten a lot better recently with his tells and behaving consistently no matter his alignment. I started off reading him a little on the scum side, but I don't know if that's recency bias or not. Gfish has been playing loud, but nothing he's done so far is inconsistent with how he would play as town. He also tends to intentionally play as a scum-seeming townie, which provides him with cover when he's bad.

This role block of Epi tells me: Someone definitely role blocked (or attempted to role block) Epi

I see multiple scenarios for how gfish would act
1) If gfish was a town RB, I would expect him to call out Epi, especially if it was a one-shot RB
2) If gfish was mafia in a game with only one mafia, I don't think he would out the target of his RB because he knows it would be town
3) In this game with two mafias, and gfish was on one of the two mafias and thought he stopped the opposing mafia's kill with a RB, he would definitely fight full force to get that player lynched and be a successful scum hunter.

If in the end gfish had not backed off of Epi, I think he would be mafia, but based on how easily he let it go once Epi claimed, my inclination is that gfish is town.

This first post took place after Epi had (hint)claimed town and before he claimed Geth. It was an analysis made on the belief that Epignosis was town.

Adam wrote:Fred is taking the lead as confirmed town and I like it.

Epi being non-town makes me suspect gfish a little more. Scum gfish only makes the blocked kill gambit if he thinks he's caught other scum.

I like Epi's gambit. Those pushing for his lynch now are most likely Cerberus, I'm thinking. Easy non-mafia lynch.

Dom seems extraordinarily focused on Jack. Wilgy seems almost as focused on gfish. I feel like gfish and Jack haven't interacted as much as on Day 2 as on Day 1. Possibly teammates? I could definitely see a mafia with Jack and gfish going for cbob night 1.
Not sure how I feel about Dom. Wilgy seems townish to me. I also like S~V~S's play so far.

I like that TSP is getting in the game a bit. I haven't seen much from sprityo but what I'm seen feels civ. Dyslexicon seems less involved today than yesterday. nutella I'm still unsure about. I also haven't seen mp much today.

I don't like that Silver hasn't contributed much of anything so far. I like Fred's analysis of that situation.

This second post is after Epi revealed as Geth. The fact that the player gfish was gunning for was non-town made it far more likely in my eyes that gfish's mafia discovered Epi was not town and wanted to lynch him.

If I were gfish's Cerberus teammate, I would not have so easily backed off Epi in the first place if I thought he was lying about being town, and I would have jumped right back onto Epi's train when it turned out he was Geth. Most of the day was spent with the largest trains on Jack and Epignosis, and it would have been really easy and justified for me to park on the Epi train and stay there, but I never did. If I was Cerberus, I would absolutely want Geth gone and pushing for it. It's such an easy case to make as Cerberus. Gfish's teammates are almost assuredly voting for Epignosis after he came out as Geth.

#1471

Epignosis wrote:
Dyslexicon wrote: Dom - Is like a mix of Epi and Llama and it's fun.
You have no idea how much I want to put this in my signature.

Can all three of us do that?

Adam wrote:
Dom wrote:Why Adam Might Be Cerberus

Adam, leading up to gfish's lynch, made five posts in which he mentioned gfish.

Post #1: A Read List where he lists him as a civ read.

Here, he takes the side of gfish against epignosis.

"my inclination is that gfish is town"

With very little explanation, his read switches to bad.

His vote on gfish
It's not very little explanation.

I laid it out in an earlier post. If there were only one mafia, a scum gfish would not have come out with the RB against Epi. But in a two mafia game, he would definitely do that if he thought he found someone on the other scum team. A possibly-Reaper aligned neutral fits that.

After Epi's tuck and roll claim was brought to light, and I thought Epi was town, I assumed gfish was also town, because I couldn't see mafia gfish going after a townie that hard on a RB. I assumed gfish was town that made a mistake. When it turned out Epi is a possibly town-hostile neutral, it made me think gfish is more likely scum, because scum gfish will make a big play to try and lynch rival scum and earn himself town cred.
What do we think?

So multiple posts of town reads were wiped away by less than 3 lines of text?

Adam wrote:
Adam wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:
Adam wrote:
DrWilgy wrote: How does that work in this environment?
I'm not entirely sure yet. That's really the fun of a crossover game, isn't it?
So, now instead of explaining the wagon with the most votes as a pressure, how about you tell me what you think of Gfish and Nifty? How do you feel about them being the only 2 voting with you?
They're both playing as I expect them to. Nifty's gotten a lot better recently with his tells and behaving consistently no matter his alignment. I started off reading him a little on the scum side, but I don't know if that's recency bias or not. Gfish has been playing loud, but nothing he's done so far is inconsistent with how he would play as town. He also tends to intentionally play as a scum-seeming townie, which provides him with cover when he's bad.

This role block of Epi tells me: Someone definitely role blocked (or attempted to role block) Epi

I see multiple scenarios for how gfish would act
1) If gfish was a town RB, I would expect him to call out Epi, especially if it was a one-shot RB
2) If gfish was mafia in a game with only one mafia, I don't think he would out the target of his RB because he knows it would be town
3) In this game with two mafias, and gfish was on one of the two mafias and thought he stopped the opposing mafia's kill with a RB, he would definitely fight full force to get that player lynched and be a successful scum hunter.

If in the end gfish had not backed off of Epi, I think he would be mafia, but based on how easily he let it go once Epi claimed, my inclination is that gfish is town.
This first post took place after Epi had (hint)claimed town and before he claimed Geth. It was an analysis made on the belief that Epignosis was town.

Adam wrote:Fred is taking the lead as confirmed town and I like it.

Epi being non-town makes me suspect gfish a little more. Scum gfish only makes the blocked kill gambit if he thinks he's caught other scum.

I like Epi's gambit. Those pushing for his lynch now are most likely Cerberus, I'm thinking. Easy non-mafia lynch.

Dom seems extraordinarily focused on Jack. Wilgy seems almost as focused on gfish. I feel like gfish and Jack haven't interacted as much as on Day 2 as on Day 1. Possibly teammates? I could definitely see a mafia with Jack and gfish going for cbob night 1.
Not sure how I feel about Dom. Wilgy seems townish to me. I also like S~V~S's play so far.

I like that TSP is getting in the game a bit. I haven't seen much from sprityo but what I'm seen feels civ. Dyslexicon seems less involved today than yesterday. nutella I'm still unsure about. I also haven't seen mp much today.

I don't like that Silver hasn't contributed much of anything so far. I like Fred's analysis of that situation.
This second post is after Epi revealed as Geth. The fact that the player gfish was gunning for was non-town made it far more likely in my eyes that gfish's mafia discovered Epi was not town and wanted to lynch him.

If I were gfish's Cerberus teammate, I would not have so easily backed off Epi in the first place if I thought he was lying about being town, and I would have jumped right back onto Epi's train when it turned out he was Geth. Most of the day was spent with the largest trains on Jack and Epignosis, and it would have been really easy and justified for me to park on the Epi train and stay there, but I never did. If I was Cerberus, I would absolutely want Geth gone and pushing for it. It's such an easy case to make as Cerberus. Gfish's teammates are almost assuredly voting for Epignosis after he came out as Geth.

Considered and will respond fully later.

#1472

Dyslexicon wrote:Caught up:

Fredwood wrote:Dizzy, floating through the thread like a adhd butterfly whose wings sprinkle a dusting of cocaine in her wake.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:Lol I hate your gambit, Epi.

Cause you could be a bulletproof don. You could be the Cylons and you then side with the mafia, especially if we lynch a townie or two. I'm gonna feel stupid if either of these turn out to be the case, whereas I won't feel stupid if we lynch you no matter what. But like....I believe this is a thing you would do. It's exactly the kind of outside the box "I am so much smarter than you" trickery you'd pull. And if you are the Geth, you don't know if the people going after you are Cerberus or Reapers so you're knowingly opening the possibility of weakening one of your potential sides to help the town.
But you know they're not town? =)

CaptainNifty wrote:I could say the same to you.

Try to use less arrogance, bullshit, or whatever your trying to sling. Syndicate may think you are some kind of mafia genius, but half the players here don't know you or frankly care about your reputation.

Without you giving something up, or someone else providing more info, I see no reason to move my vote.
This tenacity reads more town to me.

Dom wrote:POLL: Do you think Jack was really making a fucking rainbow list, using color codes that are all in HEX (right-- that's HEX right?) in quick reply?
That sounds like some serious bullshit to me.
This argument is sexy regardless of if it's right or not.

TonyStarkPrime wrote:Last night, Reaper targeted CBob. Unless JOH is totally tricking me, what he said about CBob on day 1 suggests to me that he would not go for CBob for a night kill night one, as he basically prepped the other team to do that.
Wait what? How do you know this? Why are you talking about Jack as comfirmed scum here?

@Dizzy

The point was that while Epi was doing his gambit to catch scum trying to kill him, HE didn't know if he would catch bots or dogies but he did it anyway. So as a player that can win with the boys or the town, he made a gambit that could hurt the bots, which is a good look. (Assuming he's actually the Geth, which we can't know since GFish was a doggie.)

#1473

Whelp, I was wrong about gfish again. Damnit.

Still not sure why Wilgy has it in his head that I'm somehow gfish's teammate. As much as I defended gfish, it was more about not liking Wilgy's read on gfish than outright defense. And then Wilgy did other stuff to piss me off like deliberately twisting what I said. Anyhow, I need to take a larger view as there are other players here.

If there's a connection between myself and Dom, I'm unaware of it. When did someone dream that up.

JoH is reading Civ to me. He's trying to respond to too many folks right now. He could sit back and let people go after others but he's trying a lot to dissuade suspicion when he doesn't need to. That reads more strongly Civ than either scum team in my book.

If we're guessing at gfish's teammates, Long Con and Silver fit for me. Silver is all over the board, very inconsistent. Long Con seemed to defend me and looking at my overall play, I think he's a scummer banking on me being Civ (I am) and looking good for not going after me.

#1474

sprityo wrote:Dizzy I see you in thread right now, if you're actually here, how do you want to "get to know me better?"

I think it shows I'm in the thread if I leave the window open and jump out of it to go play in the park. I'm here now for like 15 minutes though.

TonyStarkPrime wrote:
TonyStarkPrime wrote:Last night, Reaper targeted CBob. Unless JOH is totally tricking me, what he said about CBob on day 1 suggests to me that he would not go for CBob for a night kill night one, as he basically prepped the other team to do that.
Wait what? How do you know this? Why are you talking about Jack as comfirmed scum here?
I am saying that if JOH were scum, I don't think he would be a reaper.

Why though? How did Jack prep the other team then to go after Bob. This reads all sorts of weird to me.

Epignosis wrote:
Dyslexicon wrote: Dom - Is like a mix of Epi and Llama and it's fun.
You have no idea how much I want to put this in my signature.

I don't, but

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:@Dizzy

Define placeholder.

Why is SVS good? Why is Adam good?

Probably not the right word to use. It feels like a "I have to suspect some of my accusers". And they are good because I say so.

#1475

Fredwood wrote:So Epi, Wilgy and Nut are all for sure not Cerberus.

I'm willing to say Jack isn't Cerberus.

Possibly, but this down here, sure looks a some teammate distancing from a scummer that knows he's headed to the gallows:

gfishfunk wrote:So, all we really need now are two to three people to switch to JoH. Any takers?

#1476

Fredwood wrote:I might be giving Jack too much credit though, but would he sacrifice a gridlock with a non-team member to bus a team member in order to survive a lynch?

Yes he would. It is a strong play cause not only does it make you seem like you're not on the teammate's mafia, but the opposing mafia possibly won't be gunning for you right away since they'll probably think the same thing.

#1477

I wish we had double lynched.

#1478

Dyslexicon wrote:I wish we had double lynched.

Lynches* But both apply I guess.

#1479

Dyslexicon wrote:Immediate thoughts on teamed with Gfish is Jack and Raven. Jack because I read him strongly as scum and I recall Gfish ninja switch to Llama to make it possible for Jack to save himself from being lynched D1. I also think Silver is scum but more likely Reaper because of his post about Epi, he didn't seem concerned at all, but I don't think Jack and Silver are teamed. I mean, it's possible but it's wow much bus.

This and Nutella's earlier post saying the same thing are such BS... If I was Reaper, I would be trying to distance myself from Epi not be so dumb as to defend him when he is essentially a neutral survivor that cannot win with one of the mafias.

Epi's claim was sorta suicide anyway. Once we get to day 3 or 4 (or whatever where he has to pick) if No Reaper are dead and town is sort of decimated, he will choose Reaper, and thus town will possibly assume this and lynch him, or Cereberus will take him out. If Reaper is decimated he jumps on Alliance. It's lazy as hell to suggest that I would support him for the possibility that I am mafia and hope he might side with me 3 days from now. Just a bad argument really.

#1480

TonyStarkPrime wrote:
TonyStarkPrime wrote:Last night, Reaper targeted CBob. Unless JOH is totally tricking me, what he said about CBob on day 1 suggests to me that he would not go for CBob for a night kill night one, as he basically prepped the other team to do that.
Wait what? How do you know this? Why are you talking about Jack as comfirmed scum here?
I am saying that if JOH were scum, I don't think he would be a reaper.

Why though? How did Jack prep the other team then to go after Bob. This reads all sorts of weird to me.
[/quote]

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:Sobered up. Since I'm gonna talk about Bob, it's worth stating that my earlier post about Bob/Ice (who is not in the game, though I wish he was) was a joke. I hadn't actually read any content at the time.

I do not consider Bob's actions as outlined by MP protown or antitown.

Bob is by my estimation the best HCRealms player who isn't me. He's great at strategic analysis. I totally expected his first posts to be clarifying rules/tricky roles and especially meta/Syndicate strategy. That is outside his alignment and is step one to playing this game from his (and my) standpoint. You have to understand the whole picture before you can play well. In no universe does Bob ignore this and in no universe is he scared to engage the Syndicate players in this type of discussion.

The only thing that Bob has done that is potentially alignment indicative is voting for Dizzy. Bob, can you explain your vote?

This is JOH's first post of substance.

#1481

Silver Lantern wrote:
Fredwood wrote:I might be giving Jack too much credit though, but would he sacrifice a gridlock with a non-team member to bus a team member in order to survive a lynch?
Yes he would. It is a strong play cause not only does it make you seem like you're not on the teammate's mafia, but the opposing mafia possibly won't be gunning for you right away since they'll probably think the same thing.

It was more of me responding to TSP's assumption that Jack can't be Reaper.

I'm still willing to say Jack is Cerberus but if he's scum he's much more likely to be Reaper in my mind.

As far as Cerberus goes.
Nifty, Silver, Dom, TSP all feel like strong candidates...though I have different levels of suspicions for them. LC can go here, just because LC is weird.

Adam, SVS, MP, Spirit Could possibly be Cerberus but I currently or have had positive reads on them. I'll put Diz in this group as well, but I think Diz is less likely to be Cerberus then all of them but there is a chance so, I'll note it.

Jack, IR. There's a possibility that they are Cerberus it's just not likely from my point of view. However, I am suspicious of them in general.

I know people are pinging on Adam, but I've been paying attention to him, and his posts make sense to me and it feels genuine that he's trying to ISO people when he thinks it's necessary. Him changing his vote like that at the end with no explanation is pretty standard for Adam. Though I have said it before Adam does exploit my blind spot.

I also don't get the feeling Spirit was screening at the end for Fish. It didn't feel like a screen, and the timing wasn't right for a screen anyway, Fish was already fried at that point.

MP and SVS weren't really here, day 1 MP pinged town a little bit. So I'm still granting some leeway.

Dom completely avoided Epi, gfish...and really anybody that wasn't interacting with him and Jack. Maybe that's distancing, maybe he's tunneling, either is possible.

Long Con's narrative just makes no sense to me in general. From what I've seen him as scum, I guess I wouldn't be surprised if he deflected his own teammates pressure of who they think is opposite Don, only to resume pressure later. It also wouldn't surprise me if he was a Reaper, knew Vega was a safe claim and then tried to pin Epi in a different way.

IR may just naturally buddy with Gfish since they are buddies, so I'm always careful when trying to decipher their interactions. Still I don't think scum teammate IR and Gfish buddy that hard in their first exposure to so many players, I would think opposite no? Maybe another Realmser can weigh in on this.

#1482

[quote="Jackofhearts2005"]
As for Silver, here is my case against him. Summarized, he's acting like scum Silver, not town Silver. He's going through the motions, taking easy ways out, not explaining himself. He's throwing fits but they feel forced. He's not doing anything to help the town because he's not town. He also refused to vote Epi or GFish.
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... er#p357024
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... er#p356785
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... er#p356734
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... er#p356882
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... er#p355632
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... er#p356076
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... er#p356238
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... er#p356295

[quote]

If I am scum, then why isn't the opposing mafia killing me Jack? I mean, it's not like anyone was eager to jump on your little Silver train that couldn't roll 2 feet anyway, so it's not like I am gonna be lynched soon at this rate. Meanwhile, the mafias are loving all the distraction cause heat isn't on them.

If I am so obvious Reaper or Cereberus, why isn't the opposing mafia killing me tonight?

I am Civ, so you know what: HEY MAFIAS I AM ON THE OPPOSING MAFIA, COME AT ME BROS!

Watch, I will bet you neither mafia comes after me tonight either.

You know why, cause I am not mafia.

And meanwhile, you keep gunning for me like a a bunch of starving diabetic fat kids at an all you can eat cupcake buffet, and distracting the town with how I am not "town silver", when I linked like 10 games for everyone to see with their own two eyes and judge for themselves. Because scum Silver would surely go through that trouble, right? The guy who mails it in as scum?

#1483

Fredwood wrote: IR may just naturally buddy with Gfish since they are buddies, so I'm always careful when trying to decipher their interactions. Still I don't think scum teammate IR and Gfish buddy that hard in their first exposure to so many players, I would think opposite no? Maybe another Realmser can weigh in on this.

RE: IR & Gfish. Quite the opposite. Those guys notoriously gun for each other. Nothing friendly about their play towards each other traditionally.

#1484

Taking the liberty of paraphrasing

Jack: "Silver isn't hunting, ergo he's scum silver."

I openly admit that I have not led and I have not been hunting at all.

But you know what stops Town Silver from hunting Jack? Constantly being on the defensive from your BS accusations. You know that you know how to push my buttons like nobody's business and you know that by pushing on me, you will keep me tied up from participating with the town.

That right there is reason #1 why you're scum.

#1485

Immortal_Raven wrote:If we're guessing at gfish's teammates, Long Con and Silver fit for me. Silver is all over the board, very inconsistent. Long Con seemed to defend me and looking at my overall play, I think he's a scummer banking on me being Civ (I am) and looking good for not going after me.

Actually, keep looking, I am not GFish's teammate. When did I defend/buddy you?

#1486

Fredwood wrote:Long Con's narrative just makes no sense to me in general. From what I've seen him as scum, I guess I wouldn't be surprised if he deflected his own teammates pressure of who they think is opposite Don, only to resume pressure later. It also wouldn't surprise me if he was a Reaper, knew Vega was a safe claim and then tried to pin Epi in a different way.

What about my "narrative" doesn't make sense to you?

#1487

Adam - posts
CaptainNifty - posts
Dom - posts
DrWilgy - posts
Dyslexicon - posts
Epignosis - posts - Claimed Neutral Geth (can align with Town or Reaper)
Fredwood - posts - Claimed some townie... by accident, allegedly...
Immortal_Raven - posts
Jackofhearts2005 - posts - Probably scum
Long Con - posts
MovingPictures07 - posts
nutella - posts
Silver Lantern - posts
sprityo - posts
S~V~S - posts
TonyStarkPrime - posts

DEAD

thellama73 - posts - Dr. Karin Chakwas - Lynched on Day 1
colonialbob - posts - EDI - Killed on Night 1
gfishfunk - posts - Donnel Udina - Lynched on Day 2

Anyone else claim so far?

Here is my rainbow:

Adam
Dom - posts
DrWilgy - posts
Fredwood - posts - Claimed some townie... by accident, allegedly...
MovingPictures07 - posts

CaptainNifty - posts
Dyslexicon - posts
Epignosis - posts - Claimed Neutral Geth (can align with Town or Reaper)
sprityo - posts
TonyStarkPrime - posts

Immortal_Raven - posts
Long Con - posts
nutella - posts

Jackofhearts2005 - posts
S~V~S - posts

#1488

Here's why Nifty is pinging me so hard, I figured I had to make a seperate post because a lot of things he did yesterday bothered me, and kept building.

He was on the Epi pressure originally with gfish, despite his rainbow having gfish pretty low on his first rainbow list.

Spoiler: show

Maybe this is different playstyle, but I really don't follow one of my biggest danger reads on a pressure train, even if it's on my strongest scum reads. Additionally there's no other additional information or explanation about his rainbow list aside from some generic statements in a previous post about gfish epi and myself. To me if you're gonna bother to do a rainbow, at least give people a chance to argue against it...dunno.

Spoiler: show

CaptainNifty wrote:
gfishfunk wrote:
Bad town picks realizing that this is just my thought process: thellama73 (Don't tell me what to do), CaptainNifty (MovingPictures07), Jackofhearts2005 (MovingPictures07), and Adam (colonialbo). The commonality is that they all mentioned someone that had already been mentioned. (Yes, Adam, I was spamming so that the prior results were always close by). I hardly care who they picked, but I do care that they picked someone that already was posted. I give you a 90% chance one of these people is mafia.
I'm compelled to point out that this is ridiculous argument against me. I pointed out MP well before Jack did.

Fredwood wrote:So Saren is in the game, I'm vanilla now.

Kinda sucks, not as much as EDI dying (sniff)
I didn't initially follow this, but Wigly(?) connected the dots for me. Still, Why would you jump to the Saren thing instead of reading your own damn role? This might have been a mistake (Lord knows I've made similar in mafia), but I don't think you'll ever be able to get out of the yellow now for me.

gfishfunk wrote:Right now, my topic scum pick is Epignosis for a simple reason.

Epi was pinging some of the syndicate and did not vote. I targeted Epi with a role block. Only one kill occurred last night, and there should have been two (see the roles in he beginning). With no doctor and no bodyguard, the lack of a kill is indicative of a role block.
Epi is pinging me as well, and it's not a playstyle thing. If I had a roleblock I probably would have used it on him to. I know Syndicate people aren't used to info dump, but I'd like one from Epi. That's where my vote is going to go.

DrWilgy wrote:I think it's safe to assume we will lynch a baddie if we choose either Gfish today, or Hazelnut Spread friend.

Discuss.
While above I agree with gfish, that doesn't mean that he's not scum. I'm not sold hes civ. I'm leaning to them both as orange right now. I think there's a good chance one of them is scum, but I (and I hate to say this) agree with Jack that it is definitely not safe.

Unless you have some info or special insight - in which case please share.

For what it's worth, I don't think bob got killed because people read him as civ. bob got killed because someone from the Realms told their buddies that the longer bob stayed around the worse it would be for them. Jack is prone to having the town turn against him, I_R was too quiet yesterday to be a factor in the decision, gfish was too suspect to be a good target. I'm never a N1 kill, I don't become dangerous until the midgame. Silver is also under a lot of suspicion and is likely to set himself on fire and take people with him. From a Realms perspective a non-faction cbob or adam are the best first night, and adam has been off his game.

I'll post a rainbow in a bit.

That's the only explanation he has for any of his rainbow.

His gfish suspicion seems weak at best, and it's in response to him calling him out. Putting him at the bottom of this list for no other reason then calling you out seems weak.

Another interesting thing here is his statement about me never leaving yellow, but an hour later completely buys my fuck up as innocent after other players just dismiss it as being suspicious.

Spoiler: show

These post are all kinds of weird to me. The first one is literally the first post after Epi drops his Geth Bomb, it's not a linki, it's 10 minutes after Epi's post. So between the time Epi seemed to be claiming Vega, he switched from Epi to Jack, then the post after Epi plays a gambit, he switches to TSP...what?

The second quote is a response to Jack asking him of the choices between Jack, Epi and Fish who Nifty is most likely to vote for...He responds by saying he's probably going to vote for Silver, but he's going to keep his vote on TSP

So there's 3 legitimate options to vote for, and in a direct question to who you're inclined to vote for you Say you're probably going to vote for a 4th one, but keep your vote on a 5th person? What?

Spoiler: show

Couple of hours after the previous post, sticks to the belief that Epi is the best lynch between Gfish, Jack and Epi...furthering the safest lynch scenario that Gfish put forward. Also there was plenty of time to come on later and change his vote, in fact he did later, this is with 4 hours left in the phase. It wasn't time to take a stand.

Spoiler: show

This post isn't important right now, but it will be later. The time of this post was 1pm when Wilgy is clearly pushing for a gfish lynch, and after I had stated Gfish as an alternative to the current lynch targets because WIlgy was so sure of him.

Spoiler: show

This is his Fish vote, the writing is on the wall at this point. Epi lynch isn't going to happen, and Jack, Dys and I are changing our votes soon. It was stated in thread that we would. Timing doesn't give him credit like nutella's does.

Then his caveat about wanting to vote for him before but there not seeming to be enough traction. BS, Wilgy wanted people to join him earlier, you resisted it. You were asked specifically between 3 options of Epi, Jack and Gfish. You said Epi was better option, but also presented two other options for voting. At no point did you ever push for a Gfish lynch despite some minor bussing and a ceremonial place on your suspect lynch, you hardly mention Gfish.

Spoiler: show

This last post isn't really proof, but it's the first thing that rubbed me the wrong way. I can buy the mistake of not thinking scum didn't have a roleblock. It could possibly be dissemination.

The bigger problem for me was the last part feels like he's trying to preemptively discredit cops, when everyone already knows scum will have cops. Even a scum cop that catches other scum is still good for the town. It feels a very strange thing to bring up in response to a role block

Anyway...that's why Nifty is where he is. Any comments, critiques, rebuttals. Am I crazy or do other people think there is something here?

Also

That's my first ISO you guys!!! hooray

#1489

Long Con wrote:
Fredwood wrote:Long Con's narrative just makes no sense to me in general. From what I've seen him as scum, I guess I wouldn't be surprised if he deflected his own teammates pressure of who they think is opposite Don, only to resume pressure later. It also wouldn't surprise me if he was a Reaper, knew Vega was a safe claim and then tried to pin Epi in a different way.
What about my "narrative" doesn't make sense to you?

The narrative that you are Cerberus.

So do you want to make sense of the Long Con is Cerberus narrative for me?

#1490

Silver Lantern wrote:
Fredwood wrote: IR may just naturally buddy with Gfish since they are buddies, so I'm always careful when trying to decipher their interactions. Still I don't think scum teammate IR and Gfish buddy that hard in their first exposure to so many players, I would think opposite no? Maybe another Realmser can weigh in on this.
RE: IR & Gfish. Quite the opposite. Those guys notoriously gun for each other. Nothing friendly about their play towards each other traditionally.

Fair enough, I can re-assess IR. I usually end up playing in Gfish games not being in a game with gfish (the downside of him being my favorite mod...sorry guys), so I may not have the most complete read on their dichotomy.

What do you make of them buddying in this context then? Do you buy them as scummates?

#1491

Immortal_Raven wrote:Whelp, I was wrong about gfish again. Damnit.

Still not sure why Wilgy has it in his head that I'm somehow gfish's teammate. As much as I defended gfish, it was more about not liking Wilgy's read on gfish than outright defense. And then Wilgy did other stuff to piss me off like deliberately twisting what I said. Anyhow, I need to take a larger view as there are other players here.

If there's a connection between myself and Dom, I'm unaware of it. When did someone dream that up.

JoH is reading Civ to me. He's trying to respond to too many folks right now. He could sit back and let people go after others but he's trying a lot to dissuade suspicion when he doesn't need to. That reads more strongly Civ than either scum team in my book.

If we're guessing at gfish's teammates, Long Con and Silver fit for me. Silver is all over the board, very inconsistent. Long Con seemed to defend me and looking at my overall play, I think he's a scummer banking on me being Civ (I am) and looking good for not going after me.

Why did you civ read me?

#1492

Silver Lantern wrote: Fredwood - posts - Claimed some townie... by accident, allegedly...

It wasn't an accident when I claimed, the fuck up forced the claim.

I thought I was depowered by Saren, when I was depowered because EDI died. So when I made a big scene about Saren being in the game I had to backtrack once I realized.

#1493

Dom wrote:
Immortal_Raven wrote:Whelp, I was wrong about gfish again. Damnit.

Still not sure why Wilgy has it in his head that I'm somehow gfish's teammate. As much as I defended gfish, it was more about not liking Wilgy's read on gfish than outright defense. And then Wilgy did other stuff to piss me off like deliberately twisting what I said. Anyhow, I need to take a larger view as there are other players here.

If there's a connection between myself and Dom, I'm unaware of it. When did someone dream that up.

JoH is reading Civ to me. He's trying to respond to too many folks right now. He could sit back and let people go after others but he's trying a lot to dissuade suspicion when he doesn't need to. That reads more strongly Civ than either scum team in my book.

If we're guessing at gfish's teammates, Long Con and Silver fit for me. Silver is all over the board, very inconsistent. Long Con seemed to defend me and looking at my overall play, I think he's a scummer banking on me being Civ (I am) and looking good for not going after me.
Why did you civ read me?

Did I Civ read you. If I did, I'm really not sure why.

#1494

I'm inclined to believe fredwood is town based off his change in style this game so far.

#1495

Fredwood wrote:
Silver Lantern wrote:
Fredwood wrote: IR may just naturally buddy with Gfish since they are buddies, so I'm always careful when trying to decipher their interactions. Still I don't think scum teammate IR and Gfish buddy that hard in their first exposure to so many players, I would think opposite no? Maybe another Realmser can weigh in on this.
RE: IR & Gfish. Quite the opposite. Those guys notoriously gun for each other. Nothing friendly about their play towards each other traditionally.
Fair enough, I can re-assess IR. I usually end up playing in Gfish games not being in a game with gfish (the downside of him being my favorite mod...sorry guys), so I may not have the most complete read on their dichotomy.

What do you make of them buddying in this context then? Do you buy them as scummates?

I would say that their buddying is not indicative of scum mates (though I do not know exactly what buddying you're referring to). I think that since they know each other IRL and we're playing with basically half new people, it's natural to sort of stick together. I mean I even want to defend JoH when Synd people are rude to him, imagine that...

#1496

Fredwood wrote:
Silver Lantern wrote:
Fredwood wrote: IR may just naturally buddy with Gfish since they are buddies, so I'm always careful when trying to decipher their interactions. Still I don't think scum teammate IR and Gfish buddy that hard in their first exposure to so many players, I would think opposite no? Maybe another Realmser can weigh in on this.
RE: IR & Gfish. Quite the opposite. Those guys notoriously gun for each other. Nothing friendly about their play towards each other traditionally.
Fair enough, I can re-assess IR. I usually end up playing in Gfish games not being in a game with gfish (the downside of him being my favorite mod...sorry guys), so I may not have the most complete read on their dichotomy.

What do you make of them buddying in this context then? Do you buy them as scummates?

I would say that their buddying is not indicative of scum mates (though I do not know exactly what buddying you're referring to). I think that since they know each other IRL and we're playing with basically half new people, it's natural to sort of stick together. I mean I even want to defend JoH when Synd people are rude to him, imagine that...

#1497

sprityo wrote:I'm inclined to believe fredwood is town based off his change in style this game so far.

He seems pretty Civ to me. And he almost NEVER seems Civ to me, so I am not sure if that's good or bad...

#1498

sprityo wrote:I'm inclined to believe fredwood is town based off his change in style this game so far.

To be fair to my scumplay, I was generally considered town til the end of that game and I only got lynched because people thought I was the SK. Also, I'm a confirmed vanilla townie, so it's kind of rare for me to be this vocal unless I'm outed town. I'm pretty sure my play is much different if I could still Busdrive it's likely I wouldn't be playing like this, I'd be more reserved and neutral, secretly driving Wilgy and Nifty.

#1499

Silver Lantern wrote:
Spoiler: show
Fredwood wrote:
Silver Lantern wrote:
Fredwood wrote: IR may just naturally buddy with Gfish since they are buddies, so I'm always careful when trying to decipher their interactions. Still I don't think scum teammate IR and Gfish buddy that hard in their first exposure to so many players, I would think opposite no? Maybe another Realmser can weigh in on this.
RE: IR & Gfish. Quite the opposite. Those guys notoriously gun for each other. Nothing friendly about their play towards each other traditionally.
Fair enough, I can re-assess IR. I usually end up playing in Gfish games not being in a game with gfish (the downside of him being my favorite mod...sorry guys), so I may not have the most complete read on their dichotomy.

What do you make of them buddying in this context then? Do you buy them as scummates?
I would say that their buddying is not indicative of scum mates (though I do not know exactly what buddying you're referring to). I think that since they know each other IRL and we're playing with basically half new people, it's natural to sort of stick together. I mean I even want to defend JoH when Synd people are rude to him, imagine that...

That's what I meant, he kind of teamed up against Wilgy with gfish for a while. It makes sense to me that they're buddying because of them knowing each other in a new environment rather then them being scum. I think if they're scum they're already buddying in their BTSC so buddying in the thread is not needed or actively avoided.

If you ever defend Jack...

#1500

Fredwood wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Fredwood wrote:Long Con's narrative just makes no sense to me in general. From what I've seen him as scum, I guess I wouldn't be surprised if he deflected his own teammates pressure of who they think is opposite Don, only to resume pressure later. It also wouldn't surprise me if he was a Reaper, knew Vega was a safe claim and then tried to pin Epi in a different way.
What about my "narrative" doesn't make sense to you?

The narrative that you are Cerberus.

So do you want to make sense of the Long Con is Cerberus narrative for me?