Blue Velvet Mafia {THE END}

#801

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 6:33 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 6:09 pm It does make things a little more difficult to work out. I mean... maybe we're one lynch away from victory?
That's not possible for you.

Are you the last one? Just be honest.

#802

DAY 3

Spoiler: show

90. INT. DOROTHY'S APARTMENT - NIGHT

SUDDENLY, Jeffrey hears something. A key going in the door. He bolts toward the closet. He flies inside it and is swinging the door shut as the front door opens.

The front door shuts and the living room lights go on. Jeffrey can see Dorothy come toward him. She walks RIGHT UP, almost to his face, when the phone RINGS.

She turns immediately and goes to answer it. Jeffrey almost passes out. He thought he'd had it. He overhears.

DOROTHY
(on the phone)
Hello. Yes. yes sir, Frank. Let me talk to him. Please Frank, sir. I like to sing Blue Velvet. Don? It's okay. Don't worry. Don? Can you hear me? Is Little Donny really dead? Is he there? Don? What teenage girl? Frank?! Is Little Donny dead, that's what I want to fucking know. When? Okay. In an hour. I'll be sweet. Momma loves you. Okay Frank, sir.

She hangs up the phone hard and puts her head in her hands.

DOROTHY
(to herself)
Frank, you son of a bitch!

91. INT. DOROTHY'S APARTMENT - NIGHT

Jeffrey's face. He sees Dorothy - in a towel. He quickly moves back into the closet as far as he can.

She opens the door, reaches in and gets a blue velvet robe. She doesn't see Jeffrey even though he isn't well hidden. She closes the door. It CLICKS shut.

He HEARS her WALKING AGAIN. Now he can see her. She sits down on her bed. She looks up. Just as Jeffrey shifts his weight. She looks at the closet strangely, but then calmly picks up a book and thumbs through it. She slowly gets up.

SUDDENLY, he hears a DRAWER OPEN, and just as suddenly, the CLOSET DOOR FLIES OPEN, and there she is with a pistol pointed right at him. When
she realizes that SOMEONE IS REALLY THERE, she SCREAMS ONCE, very loud.

DOROTHY
(crazy scream, then)
GET OUT OF THERE!! GET OUT!! Put your hands up, on your head. GO ON!! Get down on your knees - DO IT!! What are you doing? Who are you? What's your name? WHAT'S YOUR NAME?

JEFFREY
Jeffrey. Jeffrey Beaumont.

DOROTHY
What're you doing in my apartment, Jeffrey Beaumont?

JEFFREY
I wanted to see you.

DOROTHY
What? Are you kidding me? Who sent you here?

JEFFREY
Nobody.

DOROTHY
Shit. You better tell me something.

JEFFREY
It was an experiment. Just to see if I could do it.

DOROTHY
An experiment? Hey, I've seen you before.

JEFFREY
I sprayed your apartment. I took your key. I really didn't mean to do anything but see you.

DOROTHY
Tell me what you saw tonight. TELL ME.

JEFFREY
(scared, nervous)
I saw you come in, talk on the phone. Get undressed.

DOROTHY
(interrupting)
The phone. What did you hear on the phone? Tell me. Word for word.

JEFFREY
(trying to remember)
You said hello. to Frank. You wanted to talk to someone? Don? You said something about Little Donny being dead and something about a teenage girl. I don't remember any more. Then you got undressed.

Dorothy stares at Jeffrey studying him for some time thinking.

DOROTHY
How many times have you sneaked into girls' apartments and watched them undress?

JEFFREY
(quietly; feeling guilty)
Never before this.

DOROTHY
How'd you like it if someone sneaked into your house and watched you?
(gets an idea)
Get undressed. I want to see you.

JEFFREY
No. Come on.

DOROTHY
NO, you come on. Take off your pants. I want to see you.

JEFFREY
Look. I'm sorry. Just let me leave.

DOROTHY
No way.

Dorothy moves to the kitchen counter and gets a knife. She goes to Jeffrey. Now she has a knife and a gun. He's scared.

DOROTHY
Get undressed. I want to see you.

Jeffrey begins to undress. First he takes off his shoes and socks, then his shirt. He undoes his belt and unzips his pants and takes them off. Now he is only in his underwear.

Dorothy has a strange look on her face. She reaches out and pulls Jeffrey's underpants down to his knees. She looks at him.

DOROTHY
Don't move. Don't look at me.

Jeffrey's eyes close with nervous ecstasy as Dorothy begins touching him.

DOROTHY
Do you like that?

JEFFREY
Yes.

He tries to touch her.

DOROTHY
Don't move or I'll kill you.

There's a KNOCK, KNOCK on the door. Dorothy looks VERY frightened. She quickly moves a finger to her lips in a "quiet" sign and whispers to Jeffrey.

DOROTHY
(whispers, frantic)
Shut up. Hurry! Go in the closet. Don't say anything or you'll get killed. I mean it.

KNOCKING is heard louder at the door. Jeffrey picks up all his clothes and gets in the closet. He's naked and hiding in the closet. Dorothy closes her robe and glides to the front door.

Jeffrey sees THE MAN IN THE LEATHER JACKET, FRANK BOOTH come in.

He comes into the room slowly, always looking at Dorothy. He sits on the couch.

DOROTHY
Hello, baby.

FRANK
(annoyed, condescending)
Shut up. It's daddy. Shithead.

DOROTHY
Hello, daddy.

FRANK
(can't-you-remember-anything-attitude)
My bourbon.

Dorothy goes into the kitchen to get Frank his drink. As she passes the closet, Jeffrey can see the fear in her face.

She returns with a small glass of bourbon and hands it to Frank. Frank sips on it.

FRANK
Did you get my love letter? Little fucker died quickly. Like he knew what was comin'.

Dorothy begins to silently cry.

FRANK
Now, I thought, that'd be the end of the shit. Kill her kid, and she'll shut the fuck up, and realize the fucking situation. But no, as I'm walking over to this apartment, guess who I see?

DOROTHY
(feebly)
Who, Frank?

FRANK
Some blond teenage cunt. Sitting out front, listening to some fuckin' annoying ass song about someone named Poppy or some shit. It was so fuckin' loud.

DOROTHY
(interrupting)
I don't know any teenage girls, Frank!

FRANK
Shut the fuck up. So, I ask her what the fuck she's doing, with a little persuasion from my gun, and she starts sobbing like a baby about her dead parents, and how it's all my fault.

JEFFREY
(himself)
Sandy...

DOROTHY
I don't know what this has to do with me-

Frank SLAPS Dorothy in the face.

FRANK
Then I ask her why she knew where to find me. And she starts fucking saying all sorts of shit about you, Dorothy.

DOROTHY
What-what happened?

FRANK
(mocking)
What happened? I blew her fucking brains out in her car, that's what happened.

Ricochet has died. He was Sandy Williams, a vanilla civilian.

It is now Day 3. You have 48 hours to vote in the poll.

#803

DrWilgy/Detective Williams: Vanilla civilian
Sprityo/Little Donny: Vanilla civilian
G-Man/Mrs. Williams: Vanilla civilian
Ricochet/Sandy Williams: Vanilla civilian

**http://www.last.fm/user/nutella23** · #804

insertnamehere wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 8:06 pm DrWilgy/Detective Williams: Vanilla civilian
Sprityo/Little Donny: Vanilla civilian
G-Man/Mrs. Williams: Vanilla civilian
Ricochet/Sandy Williams: Vanilla civilian

Well damn.

#805

nutella wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 8:14 pm
insertnamehere wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 8:06 pm DrWilgy/Detective Williams: Vanilla civilian
Sprityo/Little Donny: Vanilla civilian
G-Man/Mrs. Williams: Vanilla civilian
Ricochet/Sandy Williams: Vanilla civilian
Well damn.

Were you hoping one of them would be a power role?

#806

So civilians are taking votes for doing zany things. Gee- didn't see that one coming.

Ricochet wanted llama lynched. That's what I took away from his most recent posts.

sprityo looks like a safe kill since he declared he was going to keep his cards close to his chest and then made like he had some other revealing information to share. Protip: If you have something important to tell, either tell it, or say nothing at all. Announcing you have something is only useful if you were trying to draw the kill, in which case, congratulations sprityo.

#807

After the rain is done, and just before the man is set to collect his $500, four more men come into town.

"That's the guy who says he can make it rain." they say, pointing at the fellow.

"You know him?" say the townsfolk.

"Yeah, he owes each of us $100."

#808

A Rico kill makes me think these idiot mafia are being dumb.

#809

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 8:52 pm After the rain is done, and just before the man is set to collect his $500, four more men come into town.

"That's the guy who says he can make it rain." they say, pointing at the fellow.

"You know him?" say the townsfolk.

"Yeah, he owes each of us $100."

Then the four new men go to the saloon and...

Spoiler: show

#810

Would it make sense for mafia who are paying attention to the game to kill Rico, a fellow who had accrued so much suspicion.

#811

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:01 pm Would it make sense for mafia who are paying attention to the game to kill Rico, a fellow who had accrued so much suspicion.

Perhaps one or two of them are among the folks who were most annoyed by Poppy.

#812

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:11 pm
DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:01 pm Would it make sense for mafia who are paying attention to the game to kill Rico, a fellow who had accrued so much suspicion.
Perhaps one or two of them are among the folks who were most annoyed by Poppy.

So annoyed they killed their biggest, best distraction?

#813

I'd really love to know if Rico just chose that Poppy thing on his own or if it was built into his role.

But jeez, not one bit of good news in the alignment reveals, except for the lack of power roles I guess.

#814

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:13 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:11 pm
DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:01 pm Would it make sense for mafia who are paying attention to the game to kill Rico, a fellow who had accrued so much suspicion.
Perhaps one or two of them are among the folks who were most annoyed by Poppy.
So annoyed they killed their biggest, best distraction?

Perhaps.

#815

llama has been both annoyed and distracted.

thellama73 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 3:52 pm The question re: rico is, how much of a distraction is he being? I am okay with lynching sufficiently distracting players, as it improves the efficiency of future play.

thellama73 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:33 am ALl in favor of voting to lynch the most annoying player?

thellama73 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 1:51 pm I guess an explanation for my inactivity is in order. I have been traveling the last two weeks, and will be traveling again tomorrow. In the meantime, I'm catching up on work and preparing for when I will be gone, so mafia is unable to recieve my full attention. I'll sure try not to miss votes though!

#816

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:29 pm llama has been both annoyed and distracted.

thellama73 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 3:52 pm The question re: rico is, how much of a distraction is he being? I am okay with lynching sufficiently distracting players, as it improves the efficiency of future play.

thellama73 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:33 am ALl in favor of voting to lynch the most annoying player?

thellama73 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 1:51 pm I guess an explanation for my inactivity is in order. I have been traveling the last two weeks, and will be traveling again tomorrow. In the meantime, I'm catching up on work and preparing for when I will be gone, so mafia is unable to recieve my full attention. I'll sure try not to miss votes though!

The top post reads like he's asking permission to start a push against Rico. I don't see how the bottom post is relevant here though.

#817

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:31 pm
Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:29 pm llama has been both annoyed and distracted.

thellama73 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 3:52 pm The question re: rico is, how much of a distraction is he being? I am okay with lynching sufficiently distracting players, as it improves the efficiency of future play.

thellama73 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:33 am ALl in favor of voting to lynch the most annoying player?

thellama73 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 1:51 pm I guess an explanation for my inactivity is in order. I have been traveling the last two weeks, and will be traveling again tomorrow. In the meantime, I'm catching up on work and preparing for when I will be gone, so mafia is unable to recieve my full attention. I'll sure try not to miss votes though!

The top post reads like he's asking permission to start a push against Rico. I don't see how the bottom post is relevant here though.

That would be the distracted part.

#818

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:32 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:31 pm
Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:29 pm llama has been both annoyed and distracted.

thellama73 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 3:52 pm The question re: rico is, how much of a distraction is he being? I am okay with lynching sufficiently distracting players, as it improves the efficiency of future play.

thellama73 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:33 am ALl in favor of voting to lynch the most annoying player?

thellama73 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 1:51 pm I guess an explanation for my inactivity is in order. I have been traveling the last two weeks, and will be traveling again tomorrow. In the meantime, I'm catching up on work and preparing for when I will be gone, so mafia is unable to recieve my full attention. I'll sure try not to miss votes though!

The top post reads like he's asking permission to start a push against Rico. I don't see how the bottom post is relevant here though.
That would be the distracted part.

I took "distracted" in this conversation to mean "distracted by Rico", not "distracted in general." I don't fault a player for being busy. I don't give him town cred for it either.

#819

I think you're misunderstanding.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:24 pm
DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:13 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:11 pm
DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:01 pm Would it make sense for mafia who are paying attention to the game to kill Rico, a fellow who had accrued so much suspicion.
Perhaps one or two of them are among the folks who were most annoyed by Poppy.
So annoyed they killed their biggest, best distraction?
Perhaps.

DH suggested the Ricochet kill was because the mafia wasn't paying attention (i.e., distracted).

You suggested the Ricochet kill was because the mafia were annoyed.

I am suggesting it's both.

#820

fair 'nuff

#821

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:29 pm llama has been both annoyed and distracted.

thellama73 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 3:52 pm The question re: rico is, how much of a distraction is he being? I am okay with lynching sufficiently distracting players, as it improves the efficiency of future play.

thellama73 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:33 am ALl in favor of voting to lynch the most annoying player?

thellama73 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 1:51 pm I guess an explanation for my inactivity is in order. I have been traveling the last two weeks, and will be traveling again tomorrow. In the meantime, I'm catching up on work and preparing for when I will be gone, so mafia is unable to recieve my full attention. I'll sure try not to miss votes though!

llama did not vote for alignment reveals.

#822

Do we think Sprityo was killed because he said he had some revelations or because he said very little at all?

Do we think it is odd that the mafia have yet to punch any big tickets?

Are they picking kills nobody would give a shit about on purpose?

#823

Also RIP RIcochet I'm sorry you got so much guff for your gimmick.

#824

I assumed sprit was killed because he was a safe option, unlikely to receive public protection.

#825

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 11:36 am
Epignosis - My opinions regarding Epi's behaviour during Dealgate are already known.

At this stage, LC had opinions about me because of "Dealgate" (whatever that was). He voted for me.

It was Day 2 that LC accused me of "laying low" and having too narrow of a focus, and that apparently was all it took to convince him.

Do you know who else LC called "low-laying" and having too narrow of a focus?

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 11:36 am TheLlama73 - Pretty low-laying, just a bit of Rico action. Not very impressive. Now he's the one with three votes.

Lookie there. Yet not a single mention of suspicion.

And before anyone responds, "Well gee Epi, LC has been paying attention and he's a strategic player and all. He wouldn't do something so silly as kill Ricochet knowing that Rico is an easy lynch!"

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Jun 17, 2017 1:37 pm
Mass Effect Epignosis:
Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Apr 10, 2017 10:42 am Long Con believes in killing his own teammates.
Blue Velvet Epignosis:
Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Jun 12, 2017 10:29 pmLong Con had his own team kill him once.
Obvious parallels. Attempt to discredit your accuser as a method of avoiding suspicion. This is a proven Epignosis baddie tactic. How else can you discredit your accusers? Maybe rolling your eyes at them?

I will discredit the fuck out of my accusers every single time.

#826

thellama73

#827

A layman might wonder why Epi is using his suspicions of Long Con to justify a vote for Llama.

#828

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 11:11 pm A layman might wonder why Epi is using his suspicions of Long Con to justify a vote for Llama.

That's true. A layman might wonder that, because he's a fucking backwards-thinking layman.

A professional would recognize that I suspect thellama73 because of the Ricochet kill, and examined Long Con's mentions of thellama73 in order to see if he's treating people honestly within the bounds of his own criteria for what constitutes evil activity according to him. My conclusion is that Long Con gave thellama73 a pass for two things he accused me of being. If thellama73 is bad, then the kid gloves from Long Con is significant.

#829

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 10:55 pm I assumed sprit was killed because he was a safe option, unlikely to receive public protection.

Was the public protection thing not on a poll? If so killing the 'safe' option feels counterproductive.

#830

also i didn't catch up but that's okay because some reason

#831

I'm hot for a llama lynch in an INH game just to sort of close that loop, but I want to be super careful because apparently we're pretty far up shits creek with these deaths already.

**http://www.last.fm/user/nutella23** · #832

I'm cool with lynching llama. I can dig the distraction+annoyance Rico-kill analysis.

#833

Poppy...

Poppy...

Poppy...

Poppy...

#834

Ok Epignosis, which would you like people to believe: that you are careless and forgetful, or that you are trying to deceive everyone?

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 11:36 amTheLlama73 - Pretty low-laying, just a bit of Rico action. Not very impressive. Now he's the one with three votes.

Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:23 am
Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 11:36 amSprityo - Content-light. He kinda wants to lynch Rico and I think maybe he suspects Llama?
That was the most individually threatening thing I could find in sprit's ISO. So Llama gets a slight uptick of suspicion due to sprityo's death.

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Jun 17, 2017 4:29 pmLlama is being sketchy/lazy, which is a bit annoying, and not really helpful. I feel like he has been 90% Rico-focused. Also, he was one of [sprityo's] only suspicions.

I corrected this post from "Sloonei" to "sprityo" because I mixed up my S-names on the original post

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Jun 17, 2017 4:40 pmOk, good reread. You spent almost all of Day 1 focusing on my LMS mistake. Otherwise, mostly you've been looking at G-Man. What do you think of Llama?

Epignosis is bad, and Llama is his teammate. Llama is hardly present in this game, and has given Epignosis permission to bus him for cred because they can see that Epi is going to be lynched soon.

Oh, and guess who actually has never mentioned Llama before today? I'll give you a hint: he has a "pig" in his name.

My conclusion is that Epignosis gave thellama73 a pass for the very thing he accused me of doing. If thellama73 is bad, then the kid gloves from Epignosis is significant.

#835

Well shit as long as you both agree Llama is bad.

#836

Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:08 am Ok Epignosis, which would you like people to believe: that you are careless and forgetful, or that you are trying to deceive everyone?

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 11:36 amTheLlama73 - Pretty low-laying, just a bit of Rico action. Not very impressive. Now he's the one with three votes.

Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:23 am
Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 11:36 amSprityo - Content-light. He kinda wants to lynch Rico and I think maybe he suspects Llama?
That was the most individually threatening thing I could find in sprit's ISO. So Llama gets a slight uptick of suspicion due to sprityo's death.

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Jun 17, 2017 4:29 pmLlama is being sketchy/lazy, which is a bit annoying, and not really helpful. I feel like he has been 90% Rico-focused. Also, he was one of [sprityo's] only suspicions.
I corrected this post from "Sloonei" to "sprityo" because I mixed up my S-names on the original post

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Jun 17, 2017 4:40 pmOk, good reread. You spent almost all of Day 1 focusing on my LMS mistake. Otherwise, mostly you've been looking at G-Man. What do you think of Llama?
Epignosis is bad, and Llama is his teammate. Llama is hardly present in this game, and has given Epignosis permission to bus him for cred because they can see that Epi is going to be lynched soon.

Oh, and guess who actually has never mentioned Llama before today? I'll give you a hint: he has a "pig" in his name.

My conclusion is that Epignosis gave thellama73 a pass for the very thing he accused me of doing. If thellama73 is bad, then the kid gloves from Epignosis is significant.

What did I accuse you of doing that I gave thellama73 a pass for, and how is me voting for him now that we've had lynch reveals treating him with kid gloves?

Your assertion that thellama73 and I are teammates is a swift conclusion to draw. You have given no independent reasoning whatsoever to established that, on his own, thellama73 is bad. Given the degree of comfort that a number of people have recently suggested with lynching llama (DH, nutella, me), the outlook for thellama73 surviving today is grim. This tells me that you know thellama73 is bad, and you need a way to frame his lynch in a way that incriminates me. How did I determine this?

A few things:

First, you included an extravagant detail in your accusation against me: That thellama73 gave me permission to throw him under the bus. I wouldn't need permission to throw thellama73 (who knows he can't really participate) under the bus, and more importantly, this shows you lack an understanding of the dynamic he and I have when we're bad together (or how we think in general). thellama73 wouldn't need to give me permission, and I wouldn't feel the need to ask him of it (someone else like S~V~S or nutella would be a different story).

Second, the impression you are trying to maintain- that you know how I operate when I'm bad- has betrayed you. I have been evil over twenty times across three sites. In that stretch, I have intentionally thrown a teammate under the bus one time (Dragon D. Luffy), and it wasn't even because he was inactive; rather, it was because I had never done it before and wanted to see how it would play out. It played out well, but I have never done it since. There were only two other times I had to go against my teammate in the thread, and they weren't orchestrated. In one case, Scotty slipped badly, and there was no salvaging him. The other was ika- I'll leave it at that.

On the contrary, you can go as recent as Vocaroo Mafia and see (or hear, rather) that when I had an absentee teammate, I outright defended a2thezebra. I am continually amused by this reputation I somehow sustain that I work to lynch my teammates for credibility when I have only ever done it one time and never again since. Furthermore, I am all too aware of the credibility paradox: If people keep accusing me of throwing a teammate under the bus for credibility, I know that I cannot obtain credibility by leading a lynch on a teammate, and for that reason the play has a negative expected value.

So in over twenty starts as mafia, I have never thrown a teammate under the bus because he or she couldn't play. If anything, I request a replacement, because I know that Mafia is a game of numbers. The more teammates you have, the closer endgame is, and the fewer lynches you have to work your way out of. In Vocaroo Mafia, I lost my sole teammate Day 1, and ultimately became a last man standing role, which stacked the odds against me right out of the gate. I ended up winning, but it was a long, lonely, and difficult journey. I don't lynch my teammates if I can help it.

Need more proof of that? Turf Wars. In that game, I tried desperately to preserve a team that made a career out of trying to lynch one another. One of my teammates couldn't play. Instead of joining my team in cutting the dead weight for credibility, I found a replacement: Elohcin, who didn't even want to play, but subbed in as a favor to me. We just needed the numbers long enough. It was a risky play, because it was obvious that Eloh wasn't an enthusiastic participant, and that she was only showing up voting where her team was telling her. That pointed a pretty accusatory finger at me, but I didn't mind being lynched when the time came, because we had just about done enough to get the win, and I was running out of plays anyway.

No, thellama73 didn't give me permission to throw him under the bus, nor am I throwing him under the bus. Were I on his team, I would be trying to obtain a replacement. But you didn't consider any of this about me.

Nor did you entertain the scenario in which I am bad and I am setting thellama73 up as a patsy. You immediately went for the "Epignosis is throwing thellama73 under the bus for credibility," which only works if you know how thellama73 is going to flip. If thellama73 comes back civilian, then your crusade against me loses some steam, since your assessment of the situation will have been proven incorrect. I think you've shown there's no chance of that happening though.

But I'm not through with you.

Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:08 am Oh, and guess who actually has never mentioned Llama before today? I'll give you a hint: he has a "pig" in his name.

I'm not going to comment on the italicized adverb here (oy). I'll leave that alone.

No, this little jab proves to me that you are not being fair in your suspicion of me.

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Jun 17, 2017 12:29 am Epignosis. You have pretty much only focused on Dyslexicon as a suspicion. How does Dizzy's imminent replacement affect your opinion, and who else do you think is bad?

Your criticism of me here is that I "pretty much only focused on Dyslexicon as a suspicion."

I've already commented that I thought it was ironic of you to complain about my narrowed focus, but then ask me a question about Dyslexicon.

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Jun 17, 2017 1:12 am No, I'm asking you questions because all you're doing is accusing Dizzy and defending Rico, and laying low.

Once again, your problem with me is that all I was doing was accusing Dyslexicon and defending Ricochet (which I don't maintain I was doing, but okay).

Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:08 am Oh, and guess who actually has never mentioned Llama before today? I'll give you a hint: he has a "pig" in his name.

Which would you prefer? That I only talk about people I have mentioned before today, or that I take into consideration the fact that we now have alignment flips to go off of, and that I can look back at the posts of the deceased and draw more informed conclusions? You gave me shit for only accusing Dyslexicon and not talking about other people, and now you're giving me shit for talking about someone new after alignments have been revealed.

You are not genuine, and you know thellama73 is bad. There is only one reason that makes sense, and it isn't because you are a cop, or your crusade against me would have ended by now.

Thanks for playing.

#837

#838

FWIW I can think of at least one game Epignosis and I were partners and he threw me under the bus.

#839

This Epig/LC brouhaha has my head spinning, but I can get on the llama train.

#840

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 11:24 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jun 18, 2017 10:55 pm I assumed sprit was killed because he was a safe option, unlikely to receive public protection.
Was the public protection thing not on a poll? If so killing the 'safe' option feels counterproductive.

Yes. But they wouldn't have known who was going to win the vote, and the poll was tight. Choosing a player like sprit all but ensures that their target would not receive a flurry of votes and cancel out their kill unexpectedly.
It could also have been because he was hinting at "information", or they just wanted to keep us off balance, since he was not a player many people were discussing at all.

#841

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 10:55 am FWIW I can think of at least one game Epignosis and I were partners and he threw me under the bus.

I was just about to say that if llama is scum, he's a good bus candidate. Not necessarily Epi throwing him under the bus, but someone out there could be doing it. If he is scum.

#842

Star Wars Mafia was the game I was making mention to.

#843

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 10:10 amWhat did I accuse you of doing that I gave thellama73 a pass for, and how is me voting for him now that we've had lynch reveals treating him with kid gloves?

Maybe, for the fun of throwing your words back in your face, I said it wrong. YOU are the one who has never mentioned Llama before today. That is what you are falsely (proven) accusing me of, but you're the one doing it.

Your assertion that thellama73 and I are teammates is a swift conclusion to draw. You have given no independent reasoning whatsoever to established that, on his own, thellama73 is bad. Given the degree of comfort that a number of people have recently suggested with lynching llama (DH, nutella, me), the outlook for thellama73 surviving today is grim. This tells me that you know thellama73 is bad, and you need a way to frame his lynch in a way that incriminates me.

That's funny, that's exactly what I would say to you.

A few things:

First, you included an extravagant detail in your accusation against me: That thellama73 gave me permission to throw him under the bus. I wouldn't need permission to throw thellama73 (who knows he can't really participate) under the bus, and more importantly, this shows you lack an understanding of the dynamic he and I have when we're bad together (or how we think in general). thellama73 wouldn't need to give me permission, and I wouldn't feel the need to ask him of it (someone else like S~V~S or nutella would be a different story).

Yeah yeah, Epi is a big shot who doesn't need permission from anyone to do anything. Gotcha. Everybody understand that? Epi doesn't need permission to throw a teammate under the bus. Glad we got that covered, so we can move on to some topics that are actually relevant.

No one cares about understanding the dynamic Llama and you have when we're bad together (or how you think in general). This is just filler talk to make it look like you have more to say than you do. If someone other than the two of you felt like coming up and saying "hey, I have in-depth knowledge of the Llama/Epi dynamic and how they think together in general" then that would be interesting. Coming from you or him? Totally worthless. You don't get to define your own secret meta.

Second, the impression you are trying to maintain- that you know how I operate when I'm bad- has betrayed you. I have been evil over twenty times across three sites. In that stretch, I have intentionally thrown a teammate under the bus one time (Dragon D. Luffy), and it wasn't even because he was inactive; rather, it was because I had never done it before and wanted to see how it would play out. It played out well, but I have never done it since. There were only two other times I had to go against my teammate in the thread, and they weren't orchestrated. In one case, Scotty slipped badly, and there was no salvaging him. The other was ika- I'll leave it at that.

And, what, maybe four or five people have read this line of crap, and already one of them has disproven it.

On the contrary, you can go as recent as Vocaroo Mafia and see (or hear, rather) that when I had an absentee teammate, I outright defended a2thezebra. I am continually amused by this reputation I somehow sustain that I work to lynch my teammates for credibility when I have only ever done it one time and never again since. Furthermore, I am all too aware of the credibility paradox: If people keep accusing me of throwing a teammate under the bus for credibility, I know that I cannot obtain credibility by leading a lynch on a teammate, and for that reason the play has a negative expected value.

What reputation? In what world do you have a reputation for throwing a teammate under the bus??

You're not going to wipe away proven points like my case against you by dazzling people with terms like "credibility paradox", and no one is going to believe your self-defined meta that you're trying to cram down our throats.

So in over twenty starts as mafia, I have never thrown a teammate under the bus because he or she couldn't play. If anything, I request a replacement, because I know that Mafia is a game of numbers. The more teammates you have, the closer endgame is, and the fewer lynches you have to work your way out of. In Vocaroo Mafia, I lost my sole teammate Day 1, and ultimately became a last man standing role, which stacked the odds against me right out of the gate. I ended up winning, but it was a long, lonely, and difficult journey. I don't lynch my teammates if I can help it.

Great, wow, I can pick out thirty games in which I didn't bus a teammate, and there's a few where I did do that. Probably everyone playing here has similar history. Doesn't change the fact that if Llama came to you and said "hey, I don't have time for this, and the vultures are already circling me, so please bus me", you would do it. I don't care if you have five hundred games where that never came up. Stop inventing your meta to get yourself out of hot water.

Need more proof of that? Turf Wars. In that game, I tried desperately to preserve a team that made a career out of trying to lynch one another. One of my teammates couldn't play. Instead of joining my team in cutting the dead weight for credibility, I found a replacement: Elohcin, who didn't even want to play, but subbed in as a favor to me. We just needed the numbers long enough. It was a risky play, because it was obvious that Eloh wasn't an enthusiastic participant, and that she was only showing up voting where her team was telling her. That pointed a pretty accusatory finger at me, but I didn't mind being lynched when the time came, because we had just about done enough to get the win, and I was running out of plays anyway.

Cool, like I said, I can also pick and choose from countless games where I didn't do action A, B, or C that I am accused of in any given game. That proves nothing about this game.

No, thellama73 didn't give me permission to throw him under the bus, nor am I throwing him under the bus. Were I on his team, I would be trying to obtain a replacement. But you didn't consider any of this about me.

If you're Mr Replacements, then why haven't you said or done anything about replacing the players who have actually requested them? If "trying to obtain a replacement" for other players is what you do, then where is it? Have you asked Elohcin to replace Dizzy?

Nor did you entertain the scenario in which I am bad and I am setting thellama73 up as a patsy. You immediately went for the "Epignosis is throwing thellama73 under the bus for credibility," which only works if you know how thellama73 is going to flip. If thellama73 comes back civilian, then your crusade against me loses some steam, since your assessment of the situation will have been proven incorrect. I think you've shown there's no chance of that happening though.

I don't know how Llama is going to flip, but I am very sure how you are going to flip. You have a lot more bad on your record than him. Also, "recently","immediately", "importantly", "desperately", "ultimately"?

But I'm not through with you.

Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:08 am Oh, and guess who actually has never mentioned Llama before today? I'll give you a hint: he has a "pig" in his name.
I'm not going to comment on the italicized adverb here (oy). I'll leave that alone.

Except you did comment on it. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

No, this little jab proves to me that you are not being fair in your suspicion of me.

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Jun 17, 2017 12:29 am Epignosis. You have pretty much only focused on Dyslexicon as a suspicion. How does Dizzy's imminent replacement affect your opinion, and who else do you think is bad?
Your criticism of me here is that I "pretty much only focused on Dyslexicon as a suspicion."

I've already commented that I thought it was ironic of you to complain about my narrowed focus, but then ask me a question about Dyslexicon.

That's not ironic. Maybe if you're Alanis Morrisette. But... now you suspect people for irony? Why don't you delve into your extensive self-meta playbook and pull out a time when you caught a baddie based on irony? That would be a lot more entertaining than you going on and on about how you would never bus a teammate.

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Jun 17, 2017 1:12 am No, I'm asking you questions because all you're doing is accusing Dizzy and defending Rico, and laying low.
Once again, your problem with me is that all I was doing was accusing Dyslexicon and defending Ricochet (which I don't maintain I was doing, but okay).

I haven't bothered to comment on your argument because I assume the others can just click on your ISO button and see that I'm right. Go ahead guys, try it out!

Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:08 am Oh, and guess who actually has never mentioned Llama before today? I'll give you a hint: he has a "pig" in his name.
Which would you prefer? That I only talk about people I have mentioned before today, or that I take into consideration the fact that we now have alignment flips to go off of, and that I can look back at the posts of the deceased and draw more informed conclusions? You gave me shit for only accusing Dyslexicon and not talking about other people, and now you're giving me shit for talking about someone new after alignments have been revealed.

I would prefer that you rewrite this post without making references to your own invented meta. Except then it would be a really short post, and I know that you want to have a nice big tl;dr kind of post to make it look like you have a lot of legs to stand on. But the thing is, you don't.

You are not genuine, and you know thellama73 is bad. There is only one reason that makes sense, and it isn't because you are a cop, or your crusade against me would have ended by now.

Thanks for playing.

You're welcome, I also appreciate your presence in the game. Just not for much longer.

I'm a hell of a lot more sure that you are bad than Llama, which makes your Day 3 ploy that much easier to see through. We can lynch Llama, and then you, or we can lynch you and then Llama. It's all the same to me, I'd just like to see what Llama has to say before nailing his coffin lid shut.

#844

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:34 am
DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 10:55 am FWIW I can think of at least one game Epignosis and I were partners and he threw me under the bus.
I was just about to say that if llama is scum, he's a good bus candidate. Not necessarily Epi throwing him under the bus, but someone out there could be doing it. If he is scum.

Exactly. But it's Epi.

#845

Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 12:10 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:34 am
DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 10:55 am FWIW I can think of at least one game Epignosis and I were partners and he threw me under the bus.
I was just about to say that if llama is scum, he's a good bus candidate. Not necessarily Epi throwing him under the bus, but someone out there could be doing it. If he is scum.
Exactly. But it's Epi.

Maybe. I haven't been following too closely. Why do you think this?

#846

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 12:11 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 12:10 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:34 am
DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 10:55 am FWIW I can think of at least one game Epignosis and I were partners and he threw me under the bus.
I was just about to say that if llama is scum, he's a good bus candidate. Not necessarily Epi throwing him under the bus, but someone out there could be doing it. If he is scum.
Exactly. But it's Epi.
Maybe. I haven't been following too closely. Why do you think this?

I am quite sure Epi is bad. I'm connecting the dots backward based on his treatment of Llama today.

#847

What if both LC and Epi are bad.

#848

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 12:16 pm What if both LC and Epi are bad.

Then you guys are screwed.

#849

Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 12:13 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 12:11 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 12:10 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:34 am
DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2017 10:55 am FWIW I can think of at least one game Epignosis and I were partners and he threw me under the bus.
I was just about to say that if llama is scum, he's a good bus candidate. Not necessarily Epi throwing him under the bus, but someone out there could be doing it. If he is scum.
Exactly. But it's Epi.
Maybe. I haven't been following too closely. Why do you think this?
I am quite sure Epi is bad. I'm connecting the dots backward based on his treatment of Llama today.

Can I have the abridges version of your case?

#850

Either LC is bad, and is bussing llama for cred and to get to Epi later, or Epi is bad and is bussing llama to get to LC later, or Epi and LC are both bad and llama is a civ.

Anyway, voting Llama.

What parts of the game do you feel worked?