[ENDGAME] Seinfeld Mafia

[Principal Skinner]

So I know that I'm a mod and I should be in the know, but I still don't get the difference between LYLO and MYLO. Can someone please explain these concepts for me?

Thanks for asking! I have/had the same questions.

Jerry, thanks for answering.

[Julinook]

HEY GANG!

I think I know what I'm going to be doing today, I'm just waiting for a response.

[Spooky Ghost]

I don't see a reason for a no lynch at this point.

Jerry and Leo are town.

Peterman has 17 posts. I'm not losing this game to him.

If Jerry is the last scum, despite everything then 1. I'll never, ever play with him again :P and 2. he deserves the win tbqh.

Possibly the most frustrating game I've ever played. I've never played with such a disconnected scum team!

[Spooky Ghost]

I am basing my Leo read entirely on his possible lynch reaction. It was an outraged, appalled, upset townie. And he played with out emotions, and made us feel guilty. A scum wouldn't resort to that, I believe.

[Spooky Ghost]

I am basing my Jerry read on how well he's played as Townie, and my early intuition, despite how shit he's made George Costanza's mafia life, and how helpful he's been and his outrage at my accusation of him possibly being the god father (including how much time he's dedicated to this game and slacking behind in real life obligations, total disgust at the implication he may be scum). I dig that. I felt it.

[Julinook]

Just one question, [mention]George Costanza[/mention]. Do you think Peterman could have delivered the most recent night kill?

@MovingPictures07

If the mafia team doesn't submit a kill, is there no kill at all or a randomized kill?

No kill.

Just as I would treat any power role (i.e., if a standard cop was in this game and did not submit a check Day 1, I wouldn't randomize one for them).

[Spooky Ghost]

I saw Peterman's last post stating he'd be busy at a music festival over the weekend. If I was the last scum and I was anticipating a busy weekend where I had a target to submit, I'd more than likely send my kill to the mod ahead of time. Unless that would go against the rules and the scum is only allowed to send in the kill after the lynch is revealed? Is that what you're saying?

[Julinook]

I saw Peterman's last post stating he'd be busy at a music festival over the weekend. If I was the last scum and I was anticipating a busy weekend where I had a target to submit, I'd more than likely send my kill to the mod ahead of time. Unless that would go against the rules and the scum is only allowed to send in the kill after the lynch is revealed? Is that what you're saying?

Let's ask!

[mention]MovingPictures07[/mention], is it legal for mafia members or power roles to submit actions prior to a night phase if necessary?

[Spooky Ghost]

If the mod says we aren't allowed to submit night kills ahead of time...

Do we really want to go back to implicating Leo after all that was said and done? Do I really want to believe a scum leo would resort to emotional blackmail of sorts to get us off his back I don't know. I have no idea who is behind the sock and what s/he is capable of, but I kind of don't want to believe it (despite everything else screaming for a lynch of him before).

WHY AM I DOUBTING MYSELF SO MUCH.

I think we'd need clarification from the mod if night kills are allowed to be sent in ahead of time.

[Spooky Ghost]

I saw Peterman's last post stating he'd be busy at a music festival over the weekend. If I was the last scum and I was anticipating a busy weekend where I had a target to submit, I'd more than likely send my kill to the mod ahead of time. Unless that would go against the rules and the scum is only allowed to send in the kill after the lynch is revealed? Is that what you're saying?

Let's ask!

@MovingPictures07, is it legal for mafia members or power roles to submit actions prior to a night phase if necessary?

further, and pending what MP says, is it possible for Peterman to have logged in quickly from his phone at any point during the night phase and simply sent in a name for the night kill without making an appearance itt?

[Julinook]

If the mod says we aren't allowed to submit night kills ahead of time...

Do we really want to go back to implicating Leo after all that was said and done? Do I really want to believe a scum leo would resort to emotional blackmail of sorts to get us off his back I don't know. I have no idea who is behind the sock and what s/he is capable of, but I kind of don't want to believe it (despite everything else screaming for a lynch of him before).

WHY AM I DOUBTING MYSELF SO MUCH.

I think we'd need clarification from the mod if night kills are allowed to be sent in ahead of time.

I don't want to imply that I trust Peterman more or Leo less or you less. There are explanations here. I am just exploring an angle before I take the dive and click that fateful button.

[Julinook]

further, and pending what MP says, is it possible for Peterman to have logged in quickly from his phone at any point during the night phase and simply sent in a name for the night kill without making an appearance itt?
[/quote]

Sock accounts like these are blocked so that we cannot see one another online, and we also cannot see the last log-in time for any sock. It prevents us from solving games this way. So yes, it is plausible that Peterman logged in, sent a kill, and did not say anything. That's a guess we have to make based on our intuitions.

[Spooky Ghost]

I have unvoted. I want to see what MP will say. I don't want to be an accidental reason for an easy hammer (I just realized there's a hammer now)

[Julinook]

Fixed:

further, and pending what MP says, is it possible for Peterman to have logged in quickly from his phone at any point during the night phase and simply sent in a name for the night kill without making an appearance itt?

Sock accounts like these are blocked so that we cannot see one another online, and we also cannot see the last log-in time for any sock. It prevents us from solving games this way. So yes, it is plausible that Peterman logged in, sent a kill, and did not say anything. That's a guess we have to make based on our intuitions.

[Spooky Ghost]

I still feel if we add everything up, Peterman is the best case.

[Spooky Ghost]

But I'll go back and check over the Leo phase after that thing that made us all change our minds about him.

[Julinook]

I still feel if we add everything up, Peterman is the best case.

I want to emphasize that this doesn't necessarily reflect Jerry changing his mind for the nine millionth time. I'm just tying up a loose end.

[Julinook]

Okay. I don't actually care about MP's answer to that question. Regardless of the rule, there's an explanation available which allows Peterman to deliver that kill, and it's not one that requires a great deal of mental gymnastics. He logged in, sent a kill, and fucked off to wherever.

My purpose here was to test George one last time. I'd say the test was passed. If after all this I am still wrong, then I'll just have to live with that. We had George lynched and I turned it away from that at the 11th hour. I'm genuinely sorry to the civilian team if I made the wrong decision.

I don't think I am going to sell myself on a Leo lynch, and I don't want to try. If he's mafia, then good game sir and you deserve your banner.

And, though I don't like to be in a position to make this kind of call -- I agree that losing to a man with 17 posts would be hard to take.

*Vote Peterman*

[Spooky Ghost]

I feel better about Leo at this point after re-reading the interactions he had with Whatley and how Whatley reacted to Leo.

[Spooky Ghost]

It won't be very fruitful to see what Peterman had to say, but also reassessing what Whatley had to say about Peterman, he seems like the most likely suspect at this point.

[Spooky Ghost]

Who was it that made the comment about the Estelle and "villread"? I like it. Has experience, but is not using it.

Almost forgot about that one - if Mrs Costanza does have extensive Mafia experience, then she is certainly not attempting to use it.

The only interaction between Jackie and Peterman...

[Spooky Ghost]

George - George's outlier vote last round doesn't look so great. George also keeps saying he'll go back and look at players he's suspicious of, but doesn't. Except Uncle Leo, which honestly, I agree with a suspicion of Leo. But these outlier votes and this new agreement to "do what the town does" but not really doesn't look great. Not a fan.

Tim Whatley - Good Jackie vote last round. My issue at this point is that he keeps saying he voted me and is voting people for reactions, but I haven't seen much of what intel he's actually garnered from these so-called reactions. It makes me think he's just saying that to say something. Have I missed an explanation?

Uncle Leo - Uncle Leo, why don't you like me? I see you voted me because I haven't said much and I had a bad vote. Haven't we all had a bad vote? But what I do like about Leo is, he's not afraid to go after anyone, no matter how "cleared" they may appear.

So, from what I've gathered, I'm happiest to vote George, Whatley, or Frank today. And maybe Leo. But less likely Leo.

this post with all his intel, reads differently now that we know Whatley is scum.

He included Whatley as a suspect between 3 other of the bigger suspects itt. He agreed with my suspicion of Leo, but I'm guessing it's mostly because Leo was putting pressure on him and he didn't like it. I'm guessing, as he didn't give a reason. His blurb about Leo "not afraid to go after anyone, no matter how "cleared" they may appear" - I don't get that. When did Leo go after someone who was "cleared"?

Then he names me, Frank and Whatley as his top three suspects, casting a brief suspicion again towards Leo, despite speaking mostly positive things about him in his little blurb except for his suspicions against him. I don't like that. Reeks a bit. Jerry has been on my ass all game, but as a townie, I tried to explain why I'm not guilty of what he's seeing. I don't praise him for being confrontational then name him as a suspect without any other reasons given. That reeks something scummy to me.

[Julinook]

I generally hate that Peterman went to all the trouble of making that post of reads just to arrive at a "conclusion" of four possible votes.

[Spooky Ghost]

Too loose, right? Time to lose Peterman.

[Spooky Ghost]

I am waiting for Leo to show up and offer his bit before casting a vote, though.

[Spooky Ghost]

I'd be more than happy to hear from Peterman too in the interim if he so chooses to login and grace us with his arrogance.

[Julinook]

George has looked very town in this MYLO. If I'm still wrong then I'm going to be in throw-arms-up mode.

[Spooky Ghost]

If we lose this, this will literally be us:

[Spooky Ghost]

Waiting for Uncle Leo like

[Spooky Ghost]

George needs a nap (sleep). I don't think Peterman or Leo are showing up any time soon.

[Julinook]

That New York time zone, I tell ya what.

[Spooky Ghost]

[Julinook]

You could use a little relaxation, George.

[Spooky Ghost]

[Tangrowth]

I saw Peterman's last post stating he'd be busy at a music festival over the weekend. If I was the last scum and I was anticipating a busy weekend where I had a target to submit, I'd more than likely send my kill to the mod ahead of time. Unless that would go against the rules and the scum is only allowed to send in the kill after the lynch is revealed? Is that what you're saying?

Let's ask!

MovingPictures07, is it legal for mafia members or power roles to submit actions prior to a night phase if necessary?

This is a good question, but let's talk about this one post-game. I don't want to answer it now because even though I know my answer and I stand by it, I feel like regardless of my answer, just providing one will unduly influence the game, and I shouldn't be influencing the game. This is player v. player after all, not player v. host.

[Principal Skinner]

Uncle Leo is here. I have a an extremely busy day tomorrow and a lot of prepping to do tonight. I can check periodically. I do have a post in my history that says "Peterman, definitely mafia." It was the first mafia read I made, IIRC. I know minds have changed 100 times throughout these 30 pages... but why isn't peterman here defending himself? When I was on the verge of being lynched, I posted a lot (for me). I was here fighting. Since George has been on the cusp of being lynched, he has been here, fighting. Jerry -- I'll say it again, if he is mafia, I never ever had a chance.

Where's JP? But also, if he made the kill, why did he not also post? Easy enough to type on your notepad in your phone and copy + paste in multiple posts in the thread. Peterman is such an easy lynch based on his absence. TOO easy? If it's NOT peterman, though, it's Jerry or George and see above for that.

[Julinook]

It definitely easy, Leo. It doesn't necessarily imply it's wrong. I thought Peterman may have given up yesterday because he thought he was screwed.

If it's not him it's George. And if George has been fudging this MYLO and playfully role playing around right in my face while I contribute to losing the game to him, that's cold blooded.

[Larry David]

So sorry, so sorry - my little vacation in the wonders of music took longer than expected. All right, who's dancing?

No one?

Well, I'll just have to get things started.


Or, you know, finished. I know I've been shit. I'm surprised I've survived this long with how I've been playing. But I don't want to waste time garnering pity - I just want to finish this out right. I may be paying attention badly, but I'm not bad. I am, however, sitting here in paranoia trying to figure out who is. I want to dance with the group, but the group's not dancing with me.

I will say that in the back of my mind, I've gone back to Jerry in my paranoia - I'd given him a pass a while back for switching to Jackie, but that's not indicative of goodness at this point. ARGH. Worthless commentary!

I'm rambling now. I know I need to read more thoroughly, but (theme of my game) I don’t have the time or energy to do so like the game deserves. I will, however, read and perhaps talk a very little bit tonight and vote from there. We’ve got this. I hope.

Linki - What to defend against? I've been doing so for much of this game. My vote record is terrible and I've been horrifically unengaged. I have fewer than 20 posts (I didn't even realize that until it was pointed out) and I have not the time to create a counter-case at this point except emphasizing some detached paranoia since I've been wrong far too often. So, I'm at a loss. And now I'll stop rambling. I think.

[Principal Skinner]

It definitely easy, Leo. It doesn't necessarily imply it's wrong. I thought Peterman may have given up yesterday because he thought he was screwed.

If it's not him it's George. And if George has been fudging this MYLO and playfully role playing around right in my face while I contribute to losing the game to him, that's cold blooded.

So he gives up and takes one last dig to take out Big Stein. Rough.

At this point, I don't anticipate anything new coming out and being some sort of shocking revelation that leads me to change my vote. if JP isn't it, JP isn't it. I'm prepared to join you in a vote for Peterman. If we figure this out tonight, that's great. I will be gone from tomorrow AM and totally 100% out of pocket until tomorrow late evening. If we havent decided by bedtime tonight, I guess I need to move to un/no since I can't read/respond/act.

[Principal Skinner]

If I had come back to seeing people all over my case, I would vehemently argue that I am innocent even if I can't provide all the supporting materials until I go back through. Peterman's response does not scream I AM INNOCENT, STOP THIS MADNESS!

[Spooky Ghost]

And if George has been fudging this MYLO and playfully role playing around right in my face while I contribute to losing the game to him, that's cold blooded.

I'm cold, but not cold blooded.

[Spooky Ghost]

Hammer time.

[Spooky Ghost]

[Spooky Ghost]

[Julinook]

Terrified.

[Spooky Ghost]

I've seen a man who could change his face, the way that other men change their clothes.

Spoiler: show

[Spooky Ghost]

Not sure how much more of this I can take. Come on MP!

[Julinook]

Sorry, civilians. This one's on me. We had it and I blew it. I've had bad games before, but I haven't singlehandedly lost one. I have now.

[Spooky Ghost]

Don't blame yourself too harshly Seinfeld. You didn't stand a chance against the Costanza charm.

[Spooky Ghost]

Costanza baldness I mean.

Boldness I mean.