Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

[Tangrowth]

discussion of no lynching is a great way to bring early content into the thread though.

also puts LC in a good light for me.

+1

This is Quin's first post regarding anything alignment-related. It's not ideal because it's just echoing someone else's sentiment without explaining why he feels that way.

I feel comfortable enough moving my vote to Quin for now, partially out of self-preservation but because I've already seen enough in his ISO that leaves some to be desired. I'll keep digging a bit though.

[Tangrowth]

Quin, would you please tell me what you think of LC?

LC, can you please tell me your thoughts on Quin?

Thank you.

He's unlikely to get my vote today.

This doesn't expand upon his previous "+1". I'm not inspired. If Quin has a reason for townreading LC, he hasn't really explained it.

[sig]

Can't talk in class will explain vote later

[Tangrowth]

Sorry for spamming a bunch of posts in a row, just trying to get as much out there as quickly as I can. Please someone else say something. I would have made more time but I really can't even afford what I'm doing now.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Socky, I'm sorry if I'm wrong because you're awesome and I know you are so busy.

But I can't help but feel this ISO of yours is staged.

I could see you voting for Quin at the end of it as you wrote it. Because that's the self prervation vote you have to make.

So it's very suspicious that you come here near the end of the phase, ISO Quin, and slowly but steadly realize he has been bad all along. Seems like you don't want us to think this is just a self defense vote.

I'm not you, but if I were a civ, I'd just be blunt and say it was a self preservation vote.

[speedchuck]

Can't talk in class will explain vote later

[Tangrowth]

Quin's other posts that have anything to do with assessing content or alignment that I've seen so far are just questions like this and this. They're good questions, but I hesitate to give major townie points because I'm not sure how these are helping to develop Quin's own thoughts and reads.

[Kylemii]

I toooooold you ties can be informational

[Tangrowth]

Socky, I'm sorry if I'm wrong because you're awesome and I know you are so busy.

But I can't help but feel this ISO of yours is staged.

I could see you voting for Quin at the end of it as you wrote it. Because that's the self prervation vote you have to make.

So it's very suspicious that you come here near the end of the phase, ISO Quin, and slowly but steadly realize he has been bad all along. Seems like you don't want us to think this is just a self defense vote.

I'm not you, but if I were a civ, I'd just be blunt and say it was a self preservation vote.

I'm assessing Quin in real time. That much should be evident. I am obviously in deep trouble, so of course the first players I should pick to assess should be the others who have votes.

If you have a beef with it, tough shit. You're wrong.

If you have a disagreement with anything I've observed, state it now. Why should Quin be townread?

I think you're either misunderstanding or manipulating the purpose of my exercise. I haven't condemned Quin; I'm actively trying to develop a read on him right now with my incredibly limited thread knowledge and time available for investigation.

[Tangrowth]

3 minutes later:

Nah, DDL's good. I'm going to vote to make Sig our first wagon of the day.

Why is DDL good?

Check his ISO. He's been very straightforward, unafraid to say what he thinks. Each directed question pushes people in a specific way that puts pressure on them. I agree with his way of looking at things. From what little I've seen, DDL isn't someone I want lynched D1 this game.

He's not confirmed town or anything. I'm just not wanting to lynch him

linki: good question

linki'd again, but I'm going to go ahead and post.

His straight-forwardness is something I'm used to from town DDL (though I haven't seen scum DDL yet). It keeps himself in the spotlight, which in itself isn't something I'd readily expect from a baddie.

This is the first post from Quin where he provides substantiation for a read he has (apparently, since I didn't see any mention of DDL prior to this, but it's possible I missed it).

I like it well enough. This is something.

[Tangrowth]

I'm not really getting anything alignment-indicative out of Quin's comments re: fake claims.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I think Quin is bad.

I'm currently deciding whether I'm more suspicious of his game mechanic posts or your opportune ISO at the end.

[speedchuck]

I toooooold you ties can be informational

It's not a tie so THERE!

[speedchuck]

MP and Quin not W/W btw.

I think it's obvious, but needs to be said.

[Tangrowth]

I think Quin is bad.

I'm currently deciding whether I'm more suspicious of his game mechanic posts or your opportune ISO at the end.

I assume you've said elsewhere why you believe he's bad, but quickly provide why you think so if you don't mind?

What is your beef with my investigation specifically? You have now implied I'm doing this opportunistically twice. I came into the thread, saw I had a few votes which I can't say I know the reasons for, and I have limited time to make a decision, so why the fuck would I ISO someone with no votes before someone with multiple?

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I don't do post by post analysis anymore. I used to do it, then I lost 7 consecutive games as a civ in the Syndicate. It taught me where my strengths lie, and it's not at dissecting someone's ISO like a science project. I prefer to try to spot one little detail everybody is missing.

[Tangrowth]

Spoiler: show

alright. it's business time. 1 - 5, 5 being definitely good, 1 being definitely bad, and 3 being average.

DDL: 2.5
Most of his posts are about game mechanics, he notes to MP that he was lacking baddie reads even though he'd provided none himself, voted sig for asking the cop to play recklessly proactively... just generally ping-y. Like it's mostly gut feel and maybe it's just how he is regularly but there's a definite general pingy-ness there for me. I had him with a lower score before Speedchuck's point about nosebops, i can see how the same tactic could be used as a townie to stir the pot and open up discussion

Dr. Wilgy: ???
LIterally has only posted emoticons? is this normal for Wilgy?

Dunya: 3.5
My gut feel on her is good. Her posts read authentic to me. It's not much more than gut.

Long Con: 3.25
Very thorough and generally positive influence on the thread. He'd be higher but i believe he's very well capable of smoke-screening as a baddie.

MP: 3
he has a lot of posts because of the 1 quote per post thing he did. he's doing work and making shit happen but there's not enough there to sway me either way on him.

NewTraditionist: Null
Only post is about the day 0 vote. Please speak up.

Quin: 2.75
Uneasy but nothing concrete. they say a lot without saying much. throwing out "townie points" is.... i just don't trust that at all. i don't trust that metric

sig: 3.25
actually reads kind of civ to me??? i get where people are coming from with the copclaim suggestion thing but the thing is, he's right. it's mathematically the best choice in a vacuum. other variables exist as well if the cop can reliably wait a cycle and possibly catch a second badboy then like... that's a different matter.

Spacedaisy: 2.5
She's one of the 4 players with only 1 post but she's different in that i usually expect her to be more active than this. she's been around and posting in other places here. I wouldn't vote her over it because i don't think she'd use inactivity as a baddiestrat, but i guess what i'm saying is, hey spacedaisy, come plaaaaay with us. in this space we've made.

Spankgangsta: Null
he's newer, right? come plaaaaaayyyyyyyyy. with us. come out and plaaaaaaaaay

Speedchuck: 3.5
very blunt. I think good? i disagree with some/most of the stuff he says but his posts read as a townie who is trying hard


I see that my reads on Sig and DDL aren't concurrent with the rest of the thread so i'm going to review those two as well as LC

Did you just reduce my content to a town read I made at the very beginning of Day 1? Does the amount of nothings I've said really outweigh the somethings I've said?

I don't like this response from Quin. It reads like a player more upset with Kyle's characterization of his play than someone trying to make alignment assessments.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I think Quin is bad.

I'm currently deciding whether I'm more suspicious of his game mechanic posts or your opportune ISO at the end.

I assume you've said elsewhere why you believe he's bad, but quickly provide why you think so if you don't mind?

What is your beef with my investigation specifically? You have now implied I'm doing this opportunistically twice. I came into the thread, saw I had a few votes which I can't say I know the reasons for, and I have limited time to make a decision, so why the fuck would I ISO someone with no votes before someone with multiple?

I do think you could be doing it as a civ.

I just think it's too much of a coincidence.

Out of all things to deduce, you decide Quin has been bad all along, after not suspecting him for the rest of the day.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Also I suspected him because he spent such a long time arguing about fake claiming it looked like blending.

[Tangrowth]

I don't do post by post analysis anymore. I used to do it, then I lost 7 consecutive games as a civ in the Syndicate. It taught me where my strengths lie, and it's not at dissecting someone's ISO like a science project. I prefer to try to spot one little detail everybody is missing.

You're not me. I determined this to be the most fruitful use of my limited time. If you have a reason to think I'm being opportunistic, state it, otherwise, frankly, you're wasting my time and I'm done engaging you on this. My life is on the line and you're him-hawing suspicion of me but not giving me anything to work with. Either get in my face or out of my way.

[Kylemii]

What is W/W? Is there a glossary somewhere I can use

Is it wolf/wolf?

[Sloonei]

~45 minutes

[Quin]

Well this doesn't look good.

[Tangrowth]

I think Quin is bad.

I'm currently deciding whether I'm more suspicious of his game mechanic posts or your opportune ISO at the end.

I assume you've said elsewhere why you believe he's bad, but quickly provide why you think so if you don't mind?

What is your beef with my investigation specifically? You have now implied I'm doing this opportunistically twice. I came into the thread, saw I had a few votes which I can't say I know the reasons for, and I have limited time to make a decision, so why the fuck would I ISO someone with no votes before someone with multiple?

I do think you could be doing it as a civ.

I just think it's too much of a coincidence.

Out of all things to deduce, you decide Quin has been bad all along, after not suspecting him for the rest of the day.

I think that's a misrepresentation of what I've been uncovering. I haven't been here the rest of the day, and when I have, I've been barely familiar with content up through page 4 or so. I find your summation of my activity outright manipulative at this point.

I would like to lynch DDL at this juncture. CFD anyone?

[Tangrowth]

Quin, why are you town? Help. I came into the thread into a similar situation. If we're both town, I need you to work with me here.

I'm moving to DDL while I await your further response.

[Quin]

Tequila really sucks 4/10 wouldn't recommend.

Second Hey! Lets get this lynch train started.

I think we should eye people who are to heavy on the role play, it could be used to avoid scumhunting/be left alive out of amusement. However, that shouldn't be the only reason to lynch someone.

I think you should have said that after the people worth eyeing had already shown themselves

Looking back, I’m not sure what to make of this post. I came to the same conclusion as Quin did here, but I don’t feel like Quin does anything with it. It’s like Quin just made an observation but didn’t use it as the basis for developing a read on sig.

I have a habit of tunneling on sig because he sets off my alarms too easily. I wasn't going to go down that path 5 hours into Day 0. As far as I'm concerned its NAI.

This explanation appeased me at the time. I have to ask though, why didn't Quin say this without me prompting him? I just don't understand the mindset behind Quin making either of these posts, like where's his investigative spirit? Maybe I am asking for too much, considering this was pretty early in the game and it's not like I've done any better.

You are asking for too much.

[Quin]

1 little, 2 little, 3 little MP posts
4 little, 5 little, 6 little MP posts

Actually, a no lynch gives town some time to get free info if there is an info role. Quick math:

No lynch:
D1: 10 players
D2: 9 Players
D3: 7 Players
D4: 5 Players
D5: 3 Players (LYLO if 1 scum)
D6: Scum overrun if we get here and game isn't over.

Lynch on D1:
D1: 10 Players
D2: 8 Players
D3: 6 Players
D4: 4 Players (MYLO if one scum)
D5: 2 Players Scum overrun if we get here and game isn't over.

So in each case, ignoring D1 on the no-lynch side, town gets the same number of days to try and lynch the scummers. No matter how many scum there are. For every scum, take off a day's worth o' time. See how it works? An' the No Lynch D1 gives townies more info on their allotted lynch days.

HOWEVER!

This only works perfect if'n we got no doctors, vigs, or scumblockers. So I'm more inclined to lynch a scallywag on the bright and early day.
Long Con, what say ye ta that?

Shiver me timbers if'n I ain't about to throw a vote on me swabbie Dunya, fer the brine'd do 'im good I reckon!

linki: I am a cat. I swat at people until they respond, and then run away.
I kid. I have no idea what my gameplay style is. I've been told it's analytical, with a lot of chewing over motive and vote placement.

I'll throw this landlubber some early townie points for this. Savor them, you dog.

Did Quin ever explain why he was giving speedchuck townie points for this? it's not self-evident.

Yes.

[Tangrowth]

I'm moving on from Quin. Going to ISO DDL.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I don't do post by post analysis anymore. I used to do it, then I lost 7 consecutive games as a civ in the Syndicate. It taught me where my strengths lie, and it's not at dissecting someone's ISO like a science project. I prefer to try to spot one little detail everybody is missing.

You're not me. I determined this to be the most fruitful use of my limited time. If you have a reason to think I'm being opportunistic, state it, otherwise, frankly, you're wasting my time and I'm done engaging you on this. My life is on the line and you're him-hawing suspicion of me but not giving me anything to work with. Either get in my face or out of my way.

Sorry the post was a stream of thought I didn't explain well.

I'm just saying I'm not paying much attention to what you are saying about Quin, specifically. Because everything is subjective and honestly believing it or not is like flipping a coin.

I'm suspicious of the fact, the coincidence, of you coming here with one hour left, ISOing the guy you have to vote for, and slowly deciding he is bad. It seems artificial.

[Quin]

Asking me about my own MO isn't the best way to go about it, methinks. I do what I want, others may see a meta in there somewhere.

This is another post where I get the impression Quin is criticizing the way another player (this time Kyle, last time sig) went about developing game-based content, but is making seemingly no effort to determine their alignment based on it. I think that's not a red flag or anything, but it's certainly less than ideal.

It wasn't related to developing a read. I'm not great at understanding my own meta, because as for as I'm concerned, I do what I want. Therefore he's better asking someone else.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I won't keep arguing, I've already made my point., I want to see what happens in the next half hour.

[Tangrowth]

Voting Sig.

DDL, can you explain what inspired this vote? I didn't see anything prior to this post upon first glance.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I know it sounds silly, but you seem to townie at the moment. Kind of like how you acted in Scrimmage mafia.

So I'm of two mind with Speed, one his post that LC pointed out was a fillerish post, however he posted it very early and was stating his view on no lynches so it was useful insight. So it could have just been a mafia member posting to look involved, but it felt like he was genuine in trying to state his view. In fact after thinking it over this makes me more suspicious of LC, I feel like he could be fishing for potential bandwagons. However, it usually takes me a few phases to get a good read on LC. Maybe by night 2 or 3 I'll have a better feeling.

Right now I'd rather lynch a player who isn't contributing then someone who is, unless we have a strong reason to suspect they're mafia, and I'm not seeing anything very obvious yet.

Also and I should've brought this up sooner, but If we have a cop and they get a red check I suggest they role claim immediately, with only 3 mafia members sacrificing the cop to get a mafia member is worth it, also other civs should take advantage of role claiming if they have useful information that will catch mafia members, AND I CAN'T STRESS THIS ENOUGH AS A CIV DONT FAKE CLAIM COP!!!!!!!!!!

@Long Con What do you think of me? And can you go a bit more in-depth on your Scum reading for Speedchuck?

I won't say I necessarily agree or disagree with it but I certainly don't like you asking the cop to claim.

[Tangrowth]

I see nothing wrong with the cop claiming when they've got a red check. Why wouldn't they claim? I'd also like to add in if the watcher targets a player who ends up targeting someone who dies they should also claim it. We might have lost a powerful civ role, but one civ is worth one mafia member no matter what power the civ has.

One cop is more valuable than just "one civ".

Either way, I don't want to argue this. I'm more interested in the fact you are trying to get the cop to clim early rather than later. Mafia's #1 priority should be to find the cop, assuming there is one, so this is line with what mafia would want.

Nevermind, I presume this was your beef with sig.

Why does this behavior make you think sig was bad, though? I'm not seeing that and it's mildly concerning/confusing.

[speedchuck]

What is W/W? Is there a glossary somewhere I can use

Is it wolf/wolf?

Yep!

I'll sit out any Chinese fire drills thanks.

linkilinkilinkiliniki

[Tangrowth]

What is W/W? Is there a glossary somewhere I can use

Is it wolf/wolf?

Yep!

I'll sit out any Chinese fire drills thanks.

linkilinkilinkiliniki

Why? Do you not think DDL is bad? What are your reads? Whom should I investigate?

[Quin]

What specifically is respectable about it?

It's the first rainbow list we've had in this game.

It also had some good townreads on it. I was the one egregious error.

Quin, you're really going to stick to No Lynch?

Probably not. My vote will probably go to a no-poster.

Quin, while I hate to fight you on this especially after 3 of the mafia in the Seinfeld game were low-posters, isn't there anyone who HAS contributed itt who you feel iffy about? That person, if someone else and someone third agrees with you on, should be lynched before someone who hasn't yet even had a chance to defend themselves. And that person can also make an effort to defend his/herself and change your mind.

I don't like lynching no-posters on Day 1.

I love lynching no posters day one. Where are they? Not here. What about current suspects? They're here. If I can't have a no lynch, lynching someone absent is the next best thing in my opinion. I'd rather give more time to someone who's fighting for it than someone who might not be here to contribute anything for another 3 days.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I feel better after seeing you try to CFD me. It's risky as fuck.

I think i'll stay on Quin.

[Tangrowth]

Quin, what are your reads?

[Tangrowth]

Each directed question pushes people in a specific way that puts pressure on them.

can you give some examples of this happening? I was noticing the exact opposite during my read but maybe you saw something i didnt?

He pressured MP about the lack of scumreads.
Pushed Dunya for questioning him.
Didn't give LC any slack for his D1 No Lynch bit.
Pushed Sig over his cop-claim bit.
Voted out in the thread to make a statement.

It's more of a tone-read to me, but I feel like DDL is going around and flicking everyone on the nose. MP is bad about not doing scumreads. LC was getting townreads from his gambit. Same for Sig and his asking the cop to claim.

The generally towniest or most dangerous players in the game are making things happen, and DDL is going around to bop them on the nose. Not a huge amount, but hey, it's D1. And I want to keep that around.

For all it's worth I'm actually reading LC as moderate civ now.

I'm sorry to ask all these questions if they're answered elsewhere, but what was your reasoning for this?

[DrWilgy]

I feel better after seeing you try to CFD me. It's risky as fuck.

I think i'll stay on Quin.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I see nothing wrong with the cop claiming when they've got a red check. Why wouldn't they claim? I'd also like to add in if the watcher targets a player who ends up targeting someone who dies they should also claim it. We might have lost a powerful civ role, but one civ is worth one mafia member no matter what power the civ has.

One cop is more valuable than just "one civ".

Either way, I don't want to argue this. I'm more interested in the fact you are trying to get the cop to clim early rather than later. Mafia's #1 priority should be to find the cop, assuming there is one, so this is line with what mafia would want.

Nevermind, I presume this was your beef with sig.

Why does this behavior make you think sig was bad, though? I'm not seeing that and it's mildly concerning/confusing.

Isn't it explained? Mafia wants to find the cop. I saw it as a manipulative way to get the cop to claim.

But later I decided I was kind of tinfoiling and I have mislynched Sig before for saying stuff like this, so I backed away.

[Kylemii]

What is W/W? Is there a glossary somewhere I can use

Is it wolf/wolf?

Yep!

I'll sit out any Chinese fire drills thanks.

linkilinkilinkiliniki

Why would you say that it's obvious then?

[Tangrowth]

Also i'm getting deja vu on the Sig thing. From other times where he did things that looked silly but he was just being himself.

This reads mildly suspicious just because of how vaguely it's stated. It feels like TMI, as if DDL knows sig is good and is backing away from an easy target.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Each directed question pushes people in a specific way that puts pressure on them.

can you give some examples of this happening? I was noticing the exact opposite during my read but maybe you saw something i didnt?

He pressured MP about the lack of scumreads.
Pushed Dunya for questioning him.
Didn't give LC any slack for his D1 No Lynch bit.
Pushed Sig over his cop-claim bit.
Voted out in the thread to make a statement.

It's more of a tone-read to me, but I feel like DDL is going around and flicking everyone on the nose. MP is bad about not doing scumreads. LC was getting townreads from his gambit. Same for Sig and his asking the cop to claim.

The generally towniest or most dangerous players in the game are making things happen, and DDL is going around to bop them on the nose. Not a huge amount, but hey, it's D1. And I want to keep that around.

For all it's worth I'm actually reading LC as moderate civ now.

I'm sorry to ask all these questions if they're answered elsewhere, but what was your reasoning for this?

Gut feeling.

[Quin]

Dragon D. Luffy - I've actually come around on him, i read through his day 1 behavior in pokemon and princesses and this seems closer to pokemon than princesses. it's not 1:1 but i can see how this is just like... who he is
DrWilgy - your way of posting is frustrating but now that i've gotten used to it i.... i kind of get it? i was seeing it as a way to avoid responsibility, but you're still changing opinions and prodding at stuff.
dunya - generally still just good vibes. nothing substantial has changed with regards to her.
Kylemii - that's me.
Long Con - i think i said positive before but i'm feeling slightly more sketchy on him than before
MovingPictures07 - his "oh i see i'm joining a wagon but i guess i'll stay there" seems just like.... i don't know how to word it. overly concerned with appearances i guess. it irked me.
NewTraditionalist - get in here friend, come play with us.
Quin - Something bothers me about how they seem very concerned with what people think about their gameplay, i haven't really changed my opinion on them... the "vote low poster" thing also doesn't reflect super well.
sig - no change from before
Spacedaisy - her interractions with MP have put her on a watch list for me, something's fishy.
SpankGangsta - come play with usssssssssssssssss
speedchuck - no change here either.

So....

Frankensteins:
-Kylemii
Ghosts:
-DDL
-dunya
-speedchuck
Zombies:
-Long Con
-Dr. Wilgy
-sig
Werewolves:
- Spacedaisy
Vampires:
- MovingPictures07
- Quin
Ghosts But They're Not Real Ghosts, They're Just Regular Kids Wearing Sheets That Aren't Talking To Anyone And It's Super Weird:
-NewTraditionalist
-SpankGangsta

Actually, I might yet vote Kyle. This is the second time he's misconstrued my entire activity based on one post out of 60.

[Tangrowth]

I see nothing wrong with the cop claiming when they've got a red check. Why wouldn't they claim? I'd also like to add in if the watcher targets a player who ends up targeting someone who dies they should also claim it. We might have lost a powerful civ role, but one civ is worth one mafia member no matter what power the civ has.

One cop is more valuable than just "one civ".

Either way, I don't want to argue this. I'm more interested in the fact you are trying to get the cop to clim early rather than later. Mafia's #1 priority should be to find the cop, assuming there is one, so this is line with what mafia would want.

Nevermind, I presume this was your beef with sig.

Why does this behavior make you think sig was bad, though? I'm not seeing that and it's mildly concerning/confusing.

Isn't it explained? Mafia wants to find the cop. I saw it as a manipulative way to get the cop to claim.

But later I decided I was kind of tinfoiling and I have mislynched Sig before for saying stuff like this, so I backed away.

Okay, this makes sense, thanks. Didn't think of it that way. It seems my mind is all over the place at the moment so I'm just taking in content and asking for how you all meant it.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

If it helps you, I don't have any idea what i'm doing right now.

[Tangrowth]

I'm torn on DDL after looking at some of his ISO and seeing his recent responses. There's some mildly concerning stuff, but some of it feels and reads authentic.

[Quin]

Quin, what are your reads?

LC, speedchuck and DDL are my civ reads. Kyle doesn't look so hot anymore.