Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

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Arrrrrrrrrrr and stuff

Poll ended at Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:11 pm

colonialbob
3
33%
Dragon D. Luffy
0
No votes
Jackofhearts2005
0
No votes
Kylemii
0
No votes
sig
0
No votes
speedchuck
0
No votes
Unvote
0
No votes
No lynch
2
22%
Host/dead/non
4
44%
 
Total votes: 9
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1501

Post by JaggedJimmyJay »

The only reason I think a "no double targeting" rule has any value is to prevent protective roles from completely dictating mafia kill decisions (to permanently protect a single player, for example). I think that problem persists in a lesser form if the mafia team cannot double target between members.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1502

Post by Tangrowth »

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:10 pm The only reason I think a "no double targeting" rule has any value is to prevent protective roles from completely dictating mafia kill decisions (to permanently protect a single player, for example). I think that problem persists in a lesser form if the mafia team cannot double target between members.
This was always my logic as well.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1503

Post by Long Con »

Sloonei wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:07 pm
Long Con wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:04 pm
Sloonei wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:01 pm Additionally, if the mafia kill was a team ability rather than an individual player's nightly action, the watcher would be a pointless role.
Not if the team can't double target, but they still pick a killer. :shrug:
I suppose so. I've always preferred to designate a specific player each night to perform the kill, because I usually find this to be more of a risk/challenge for the mafia team. They have to pick the right person to perform the kill without being caught in any traps/IDs each night. But there are situations like this, or when a certain team member might be an obvious target, where it can give them an advantage.
I totally agree, I just think it should go alongside a no double targeting rule for the kill.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1504

Post by JaggedJimmyJay »

It occurs to me that we haven't posted the actions, though they may be known now.

Day 1

DrWilgy lynched

Night 1

dunya watches Spacedaisy
Spacedaisy protects Long Con
SpankGangsta kills Long Con (failed)

Day 2

MovingPictures07 lynched

Night 2

dunya watches speedchuck
Spacedaisy protects kylemii
speedchuck kills Long Con

Day 3

Quin lynched

Night 3

dunya watches sig
Spacedaisy protects Kylemii
speedchuck kills dunya

Day 4

No lynch

Night 4

speedchuck kills Spacedaisy

Day 5

colonialbob lynched

Night 5

sig killed

End game
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1505

Post by dunya »

I kind of agree with LongCon fwiw. Giving mafia team the ability to rotate so they can outsmart the no double target rule, but speedchuck placed the kill three or four successive times anyway seems a little imbalanced. I like LongCon's logic where both teams have the rule. It makes it a bit more challenging.

p.s. Daisy, that's ok! I was trying to watch you *but I thought I was tracking you hence my confusion first night*. Also, I fucked up by not watching longcon.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1506

Post by Tangrowth »

Numerous town players really deserve some accolades for their performances this game, IMO, despite the loss. There was some seriously incredible town play on D1 especially -- LC, Daisy, dunya, and Kyle in particular, though there were many of you all giving a genuine effort. I can say it was really tough for me personally to fabricate content amid all of that, especially being rusty (somehow I haven't been mafia-aligned in forever) and lower on time than I would have liked. I thought we were likely screwed after how much attention (some of it rightfully so) I received on D1 leading to my lynch and having an inactive on our team.

Don't let the game slipping away from you all keep you from seeing what you did right as well, because town looked good at the start of this game.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1507

Post by dunya »

Still I think I made a lot of mistakes that could have resulted in a better result for town, and some other townies felt the same way, so I'm not hating the result cos mafia team deserved the win.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1508

Post by dunya »

MovingPictures07 wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:39 pm Numerous town players really deserve some accolades for their performances this game, IMO, despite the loss. There was some seriously incredible town play on D1 especially -- LC, Daisy, dunya, and Kyle in particular, though there were many of you all giving a genuine effort. I can say it was really tough for me personally to fabricate content amid all of that, especially being rusty (somehow I haven't been mafia-aligned in forever) and lower on time than I would have liked. I thought we were likely screwed after how much attention (some of it rightfully so) I received on D1 leading to my lynch and having an inactive on our team.

Don't let the game slipping away from you all keep you from seeing what you did right as well, because town looked good at the start of this game.
hell even after the kyle and speedchuck and colonialbob no lynch, there was a point the next day where I saw everyone possibly directed to speedchuck and I thought shit this could still work.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1509

Post by Tangrowth »

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:03 pm Nobody singlehandedly lost this game. There were numerous factors which contributed to the end result:

~ The total civilian effort was fantastic through 90% of Day 1 and then it fell off of a cliff. The DrWilgy lynch was really bad from my perspective, and it was an unfortunate way to end one of the most active Day 1s we've ever had in a heist game here. It seemed like a great deal of hard work was forgotten at the last minute and the easiest lynch available (the guy being weird) was selected instead of one informed by the discussion.
To be fair to the town as well, part of this was because speedchuck and I made a concerted effort to make the Wilgy mislynch happen. I really didn't want to get lynched on D1. Wilgy put us in a tough spot and in retrospect we both handled him horribly. Our treatment of him was suspicious as fuck and we should have received more beef for it than we did even.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1510

Post by Tangrowth »

dunya wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:40 pm Still I think I made a lot of mistakes that could have resulted in a better result for town, and some other townies felt the same way, so I'm not hating the result cos mafia team deserved the win.
Oh yeah, unfortunately I stopped following this game with the revolving door of company Daisy and I had the past week and a half, but speedchuck and Jack clearly put in a ton of effort and dug us out of a pretty bad spot. They deserve recognition for that as well. I really appreciate them carrying us through to the win. You guys were obviously the best teammates I could have asked for, and sorry I couldn't do more myself. :beer:

I just know how it is to be on a losing town team despite an initial good effort and how demoralizing that can be, so I wanted to go out of my way to make sure you all know that there was some seriously good performances in this game. Don't let the end result get you down.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1511

Post by dunya »

we'll get you next time speedchuch/jack :fist: :biggrin:
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1512

Post by JaggedJimmyJay »

If there aren't protective/blocking roles then I don't think there's even a reason to implement a rule against double-targeting. I think that's something that has just become typical or standard here over the years. There are sites that never have that rule. RYM rarely had it.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1513

Post by Kylemii »

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:33 pm Spacedaisy protects kylemii
Spacedaisy protects Kylemii
Awww thanks :daisy:
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1514

Post by Sloonei »

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:51 pm If there aren't protective/blocking roles then I don't think there's even a reason to implement a rule against double-targeting. I think that's something that has just become typical or standard here over the years. There are sites that never have that rule. RYM rarely had it.
It could make a watcher/tracker, or a roleblocker overpowered. They could all just plant themselves on a particular player and reap the results of whatever occurs.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1515

Post by Sloonei »

But it is true that RYM rarely had an issue with double targeting. It was a pretty foreign concept to me when I first came here, so my ideas on it are not as fully former as others.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1516

Post by JaggedJimmyJay »

Kylemii wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:06 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:33 pm Spacedaisy protects kylemii
Spacedaisy protects Kylemii
Awww thanks :daisy:
Yeah that's an error. I one of those should be someone else. I can't remember. :p
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1517

Post by Kylemii »

I agree with LC's thoughts on the double targetting thing, mainly cus that's how it's always been in communities I've been a part of.

The wifom will-they-won't-they shit is the most important part of the doctor role and it's also why the doctor is so important as a role, and honestly the most interesting part of choosing a kill as mafia. With double targeting kill rules the mafia has to consider whether their target might be protected. Without it that stress is still there but worst case scenario, second times a charm right? It give you incentive to find and kill the doctor that you wouldn't have had before as mafia.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1518

Post by Kylemii »

MovingPictures07 wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:39 pm Don't let the game slipping away from you all keep you from seeing what you did right as well, because town looked good at the start of this game.
Well lesson #1 is that I'm never going to shy away from forcing ties on day 1
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:18 pm Yeah that's an error. I one of those should be someone else. I can't remember. :p
Hurtful, and also rude. :(
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1519

Post by JaggedJimmyJay »

Sloonei wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:11 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:51 pm If there aren't protective/blocking roles then I don't think there's even a reason to implement a rule against double-targeting. I think that's something that has just become typical or standard here over the years. There are sites that never have that rule. RYM rarely had it.
It could make a watcher/tracker, or a roleblocker overpowered. They could all just plant themselves on a particular player and reap the results of whatever occurs.
Roleblocker agreed. Watcher/tracker meh. They have no unique insight about the value of targeting any single player, and if they do catch someone red-handed once by repeat targeting then they guarantee that their max utility is getting one catch -- something they're supposed to aspire to anyway with those roles. I think that'd be a silly strategic decision for any investigative role.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1520

Post by JaggedJimmyJay »

I think anything that significantly hampers the civilian control over the lynch is a problem. I think anything that significantly hampers the mafia control over their night kills is a problem. Those are the fundamental means by which each faction progresses toward their win conditions, and screwing with them more than a little bit is not something I'm ever keen on as a host. Others differ, that's fine, it's a free planet. :p
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1521

Post by Kylemii »

I mean as long as the physics are outlined from the beginning anything goes.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1522

Post by Jackofhearts2005 »

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:51 pm If there aren't protective/blocking roles then I don't think there's even a reason to implement a rule against double-targeting. I think that's something that has just become typical or standard here over the years. There are sites that never have that rule. RYM rarely had it.
I think that silencing roles (which are objectively bad but whatever) shouldn't be allowed to double target.

Being silenced once isn't fun. Being silenced four days in a row kills 100% of the enjoyment of a game and I say this from personal experience.

If stopping a doc from parking on one player is the other goal of the double targeting rule, I say scum should be allowed to double target with the kill and doctors can double target after a successful save.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1523

Post by JaggedJimmyJay »

Yes I can agree with silencing being a no-double-target role.
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1524

Post by JaggedJimmyJay »

In fact I prefer to disallow silencers from targeting any player twice period.
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Overall: 73-57 (.56) | Town 49-41 (.54) | Mafia 18-11 (.62) | Independent 6-4 (.60)

The Syndicate: Town 23-26; Mafia 10-5; Indy 5-1 | RateYourMusic: Town 14-13; Mafia 5-4; Indy 0-3 | Mafia Universe: Town 6-0; Mafia 1-0 | Student Doctor Network: Town 2-1; Mafia 1-0 | HeroClixRealms: Town 1-0; Mafia 0-1 | Bulbagarden: Mafia 0-1; Indy 1-0 | 2+2 POG: Town 1-0 | Naruto Forums: Town 0-1 | Personality Café: Town 1-0 | Vendetta Strada: Town 0-1 | Mafia451: Town 1-0 | Wintreath: Mafia 1-0

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The Syndicate

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Student Doctor Network

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Rate Your Music

Best Townie, Maffies 4, 8 and 9
Best Scum, Maffies 3
Best Moderator, Maffies 8 and 9
Most Valuable Player, Maffies 7 and 9
Best Roleplay, Maffies 4 and 6
Spirit Award, Maffies 9
Hall of Fame inductee, Maffies 4

Mafia Universe

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Hosts:

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Tangrowth
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1525

Post by Tangrowth »

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2017 2:36 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:51 pm If there aren't protective/blocking roles then I don't think there's even a reason to implement a rule against double-targeting. I think that's something that has just become typical or standard here over the years. There are sites that never have that rule. RYM rarely had it.
I think that silencing roles (which are objectively bad but whatever)
:srsnod:
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speedchuck
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1526

Post by speedchuck »

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2017 3:19 pm In fact I prefer to disallow silencers from targeting any player twice period.
:grin:
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Kylemii
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1527

Post by Kylemii »

well I guess I better put the "Oops! All Silencers!" themed mafia game I was planning in the fucking trash :/
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colonialbob
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1528

Post by colonialbob »

Kylemii wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2017 6:24 pm well I guess I better put the "Oops! All Silencers!" themed mafia game I was planning in the fucking trash :/
The regular trash will be fine.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1529

Post by JaggedJimmyJay »

I'm not a huge fan of silencers either, but I don't fault hosts for throwing them in there once in a while. If the game is meant to be classically constructed, there are only a handful of other standard mafia-aligned power roles commonly employed (i.e. roleblocker, role cop, godfather, strongman). A silencer just adds a little spice and diversity.

I do agree though that it's not great to prevent someone from talking in a game designed around talking.
Spoiler: show
Overall: 73-57 (.56) | Town 49-41 (.54) | Mafia 18-11 (.62) | Independent 6-4 (.60)

The Syndicate: Town 23-26; Mafia 10-5; Indy 5-1 | RateYourMusic: Town 14-13; Mafia 5-4; Indy 0-3 | Mafia Universe: Town 6-0; Mafia 1-0 | Student Doctor Network: Town 2-1; Mafia 1-0 | HeroClixRealms: Town 1-0; Mafia 0-1 | Bulbagarden: Mafia 0-1; Indy 1-0 | 2+2 POG: Town 1-0 | Naruto Forums: Town 0-1 | Personality Café: Town 1-0 | Vendetta Strada: Town 0-1 | Mafia451: Town 1-0 | Wintreath: Mafia 1-0

Awards:

Spoiler: show
The Syndicate

ImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImageImage

Student Doctor Network

ImageImageImageImageImage

Rate Your Music

Best Townie, Maffies 4, 8 and 9
Best Scum, Maffies 3
Best Moderator, Maffies 8 and 9
Most Valuable Player, Maffies 7 and 9
Best Roleplay, Maffies 4 and 6
Spirit Award, Maffies 9
Hall of Fame inductee, Maffies 4

Mafia Universe

Mafia Championship Finalist, 2015 and 2020
Best Town Player, 2020

Hosts:

Spoiler: show
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Quin
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1530

Post by Quin »

Kylemii wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2017 6:24 pm well I guess I better put the "Oops! All Silencers!" themed mafia game I was planning in the fucking trash :/
I'm hanging my 'All insanifiers!' themed mafia game on the fridge for everyone to see.
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1531

Post by Kylemii »

Link please
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Quin
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Re: Pirate Mafia [END GAME]

#1532

Post by Quin »

Kylemii wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2017 8:42 pmLink please
idk i havent made it yet
Lunalee wrote: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:13 amQuin's ISO is full of posts that are actually trying to be helpful to the game. This doesn't look like town Quin.
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