Mountain Mafia [END]

[Kylemii]

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

Hypocrisy.

it's different cus he was rude about it and interrupted my philosophy lesson.

[Kylemii]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

[Sloonei]

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

Hypocrisy.

it's different cus he was rude about it and interrupted my philosophy lesson.

i said please

[Sloonei]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

Epi cast his vote for Dom early in the day phase when the other leading bandwagon was a player he firmly reads as town and with some stated precedent for voting for Dom.

You voted for Mesk because everyone else was doing it at the last second.

[Kylemii]

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

Hypocrisy.

it's different cus he was rude about it and interrupted my philosophy lesson.

i said please

please doesn't automatically make something polite, this isn't the 1840's

[Sloonei]

Town: Epignosis, spacedaisy
scum: Jay, you

I'd like to hear an explanation on 3 of those.

Epi is visibly trying to solve the game. I don't know why I wouldn't read him as town.

Jay is bad because he's not seeking to generate content, he's just trying to trap people in his arguments.
You're bad because I've been reading you as town all game and I feel lost.

[Sloonei]

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

Hypocrisy.

it's different cus he was rude about it and interrupted my philosophy lesson.

i said please

please doesn't automatically make something polite, this isn't the 1840's

with sugar on top

[Epignosis]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

No. It isn't. I am a highly successful Mafia player and I don't do shit to gain "information" (as you apparently use the term).

If you come back and tell me that "information" is somebody voted for a guy who flipped mafia, I will tell you that isn't information. That's a fact that everyone knows and everyone is free to interpret differently.

You have not given me ONE PIECE of information from the Mesk lynch that is unique from what we might have learned had Dom gotten lynched instead. You've provided what you think, who voted where- so fucking what. None of that is information. It's opinion. It's hot takes. It's garbage. It's whatever you deem it to be.

[Epignosis]

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

Hypocrisy.

it's different cus he was rude about it and interrupted my philosophy lesson.

i said please

please doesn't automatically make something polite, this isn't the 1840's

That's good news for you. If it were, I would have a literal rope.

[Kylemii]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

Epi cast his vote for Dom early in the day phase when the other leading bandwagon was a player he firmly reads as town and with some stated precedent for voting for Dom.

You voted for Mesk because everyone else was doing it at the last second.

sorry I guess I didn't realize that voting for someone I've been low-key suspecting and pushing for most of the game is somehow more suspicious than is actually just "doing it cus everyone else was doing it"

[Sloonei]

Extrapolating information is the silver lining we can pull out of the aftermath of a lynch, if we put the work in. If we're lynching purely for information, we're lynching for the wrong reasons.

[Kylemii]

but also, don't ever tell me what to do.

Hypocrisy.

it's different cus he was rude about it and interrupted my philosophy lesson.

i said please

please doesn't automatically make something polite, this isn't the 1840's

with sugar on top

much better

[Sloonei]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

Epi cast his vote for Dom early in the day phase when the other leading bandwagon was a player he firmly reads as town and with some stated precedent for voting for Dom.

You voted for Mesk because everyone else was doing it at the last second.

sorry I guess I didn't realize that voting for someone I've been low-key suspecting and pushing for most of the game is somehow more suspicious than is actually just "doing it cus everyone else was doing it"

Did you vote for mesk for information or because you suspected her?

[Epignosis]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

Epi cast his vote for Dom early in the day phase when the other leading bandwagon was a player he firmly reads as town and with some stated precedent for voting for Dom.

You voted for Mesk because everyone else was doing it at the last second.

sorry I guess I didn't realize that voting for someone I've been low-key suspecting and pushing for most of the game is somehow more suspicious than is actually just "doing it cus everyone else was doing it"

If you are a civilian, why are you "low-key" suspecting someone?

[Epignosis]

Extrapolating information is the silver lining we can pull out of the aftermath of a lynch, if we put the work in. If we're lynching purely for information, we're lynching for the wrong reasons.

[Kylemii]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

No. It isn't. I am a highly successful Mafia player and I don't do shit to gain "information" (as you apparently use the term).

If you come back and tell me that "information" is somebody voted for a guy who flipped mafia, I will tell you that isn't information. That's a fact that everyone knows and everyone is free to interpret differently.

You have not given me ONE PIECE of information from the Mesk lynch that is unique from what we might have learned had Dom gotten lynched instead. You've provided what you think, who voted where- so fucking what. None of that is information. It's opinion. It's hot takes. It's garbage. It's whatever you deem it to be.

Epig what do you think "information" is? Do you think that vote analysis isn't part of gathering information? Do you think that meta reads aren't part of information?

I don't believe that you don't do things in mafia with the intention of getting information with them, I'm pretty sure you're just not agreeing with me on the definition of what information is.

[Kylemii]

Did you vote for mesk for information or because you suspected her?

Both things. Have I seriously not made that clear?

If you are a civilian, why are you "low-key" suspecting someone?

It was her first game here, I didn't want to lynch her right away. I wanted to give her a chance, but I suspected her from day one when she buddied me.

All this information is readily available to both of you if you want to just search my posts in this thread for Mesk mentions.

[Sloonei]

Here's an example of what I am talking about RE: Jay not generating content

Wow you guys went ahead and vote me under no premise?

I could just not answer, is that better?

Gah. Whatever

Given that you're not caught up, based on what do you assert that your voters have acted "under no premise"?

IVE DONE NOTHING BUT VOTE FOR NUTELLA, JAY

I would argue that you made 15 posts prior to the protest I quoted there in addition to voting for nutella, and that those 15 posts serve as a premise which can justify a vote for you. You're not void of content here, but there's not much to inspire within that content (hi Quin).

Well you can expect more of me not being here.

I’m stepping away for the night.

Do what you wish, I don’t care

You're not leading the tally presently; there's no need to take your ball and go home. I'm not talking to you here just to irritate you.

This was Day 2 when the pressure was mounting against sprityo (now dunya). Sprit shows up and objects to the votes, and Jay's response is to reframe the argument against him and push him right back into it. He doesn't invite sprit to offer his thoughts on anything. And then he caps it off by saying he's not trying to irritate sprit. I don't believe that. I see a Jay whose primary focus is on digging sprit's hole deeper rather than allowing him a chance to get out of it.

[Epignosis]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

No. It isn't. I am a highly successful Mafia player and I don't do shit to gain "information" (as you apparently use the term).

If you come back and tell me that "information" is somebody voted for a guy who flipped mafia, I will tell you that isn't information. That's a fact that everyone knows and everyone is free to interpret differently.

You have not given me ONE PIECE of information from the Mesk lynch that is unique from what we might have learned had Dom gotten lynched instead. You've provided what you think, who voted where- so fucking what. None of that is information. It's opinion. It's hot takes. It's garbage. It's whatever you deem it to be.

Epig what do you think "information" is? Do you think that vote analysis isn't part of gathering information? Do you think that meta reads aren't part of information?

I don't believe that you don't do things in mafia with the intention of getting information with them, I'm pretty sure you're just not agreeing with me on the definition of what information is.

I don't care about discussing what "information" is.

That isn't my problem with you.

My problem with you is that you are content with lynching someone because it will "help you" in the future.

Fuck that.

Lynch someone who is bad.

[Epignosis]

Did you vote for mesk for information or because you suspected her?

Both things. Have I seriously not made that clear?

If you are a civilian, why are you "low-key" suspecting someone?

It was her first game here, I didn't want to lynch her right away. I wanted to give her a chance, but I suspected her from day one when she buddied me.

All this information is readily available to both of you if you want to just search my posts in this thread for Mesk mentions.

How did she "buddy" you? She was a fucking a civilian. You lynched her because you were absolutely 100% wrong about her intentions and you can't be assed to say so OR you are bad. Which is it?

I swear to God people around here need some Gatorade.

[Sloonei]

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

kyle, I didn't get an answer to this.

[Kylemii]

I don't care about discussing what "information" is.

That isn't my problem with you.

My problem with you is that you are content with lynching someone because it will "help you" in the future.

Fuck that.

Lynch someone who is bad.

Oh my god Epi just go read my posts and stop being difficult. I suspected Mesk from Day 1.

[Sloonei]

Kyle, why do you suspect Jay?

[Kylemii]

]

How did she "buddy" you? She was a fucking a civilian. You lynched her because you were absolutely 100% wrong about her intentions and you can't be assed to say so OR you are bad. Which is it?

I swear to God people around here need some Gatorade.

Her first post was talking about how she definitely read me as town and that she wanted to be best friends how is that not what buddying means?

[Kylemii]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

I responded here.

[Sloonei]

I didn't excuse my vote for Dom as "for information."

Epig everything in mafia is done to gain information. Your argument on that point is semantic at best.

Do you think your vote for mesk is directly equivalent to Epi's vote for Dom much earlier in the day?

In what way is it different?

I responded here.

You did. By asking me something else. I answered yours, care to answer mine?

[Kylemii]

Kyle, why do you suspect Jay?

because of what happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of the EoD 2.

[Sloonei]

Kyle, why do you suspect Jay?

because of what happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of the EoD 2.

What happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of EoD 2?
Do you mean Day 3?

[Kylemii]

You did. By asking me something else. I answered yours, care to answer mine?

I see. My response to that responded the original question as well.

You already know why I voted for Mesk. I don't know why Epig voted for Dom but the fact that he did and then came at me for voting for Mesk seemed to be a contradiction, which is why I addressed it.

[Kylemii]

Kyle, why do you suspect Jay?

because of what happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of the EoD 2.

What happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of EoD 2?
Do you mean Day 3?

Yeah, day 3. Jay had the most votes for a moment and then suddenly Mesk did again.

[Sloonei]

Kyle, why do you suspect Jay?

because of what happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of the EoD 2.

What happened with the votes during the last 3 minutes of EoD 2?
Do you mean Day 3?

Yeah, day 3. Jay had the most votes for a moment and then suddenly Mesk did again.

Okay. Why does this mean Jay was bad? 5 people voted for Mesk: me, you, quin, jay, and wilgy. I was the deciding vote. Your premise suggests at least 2 of these 5 are bad boys. Jay and who else?

[Sloonei]

And how does Dom (malakim) fit into this theory?

[Kylemii]

You did. By asking me something else. I answered yours, care to answer mine?

I see. My response to that responded the original question as well.

You already know why I voted for Mesk. I don't know why Epig voted for Dom but the fact that he did and then came at me for voting for Mesk seemed to be a contradiction, which is why I addressed it.

A contradiction because his reason for complaint was specifically related to the amount of content linked Mesk and by extension the mafia connections to her that would have been revealed if she'd flipped bad. AKA the scumhunting information that Epig says isn't important.

[Kylemii]

Hey Sloonei no offense but I'm not going to spend all night talking to you when you can find like 60% of the answers your looking for by doing your own footwork

[Sloonei]

You did. By asking me something else. I answered yours, care to answer mine?

I see. My response to that responded the original question as well.

You already know why I voted for Mesk. I don't know why Epig voted for Dom but the fact that he did and then came at me for voting for Mesk seemed to be a contradiction, which is why I addressed it.

I do not see this as a contradiction and I wouldn't object to Epi's behavior even if I did. I often grill people for doing things similar to my own actions. I know why I do the things that I do; I don't know why you do the things that you do.

[Sloonei]

Hey Sloonei no offense but I'm not going to spend all night talking to you when you can find like 60% of the answers your looking for by doing your own footwork

If you've already covered anything that I ask about, please point me in the right direction.
I was gettig nowhere in my attempts to catch up on everything that's been said and I always prefer to generate my own content by talking through things with other people anyway. I'm just trying to get a sense for where you're at and also help develop your thoughts so that they're more clear to me.

[Kylemii]

Okay. Why does this mean Jay was bad? 5 people voted for Mesk: me, you, quin, jay, and wilgy. I was the deciding vote. Your premise suggests at least 2 of these 5 are bad boys. Jay and who else?

Idk dude you're putting the cart before the horse. The idea is that it could have been a potential panic save, but I don't even know if it makes sense as a save or just a random vote movement because it's the night phase and I haven't looked into it yet.

And how does Dom (malakim) fit into this theory?

What?

[Kylemii]

Hey Sloonei no offense but I'm not going to spend all night talking to you when you can find like 60% of the answers your looking for by doing your own footwork

If you've already covered anything that I ask about, please point me in the right direction.
I was gettig nowhere in my attempts to catch up on everything that's been said and I always prefer to generate my own content by talking through things with other people anyway. I'm just trying to get a sense for where you're at and also help develop your thoughts so that they're more clear to me.

I see, I guess I get it. I just wasn't really enjoying being grilled by both you and epi about things I've already explained.

[Sloonei]

Okay. Why does this mean Jay was bad? 5 people voted for Mesk: me, you, quin, jay, and wilgy. I was the deciding vote. Your premise suggests at least 2 of these 5 are bad boys. Jay and who else?

Idk dude you're putting the cart before the horse. The idea is that it could have been a potential panic save, but I don't even know if it makes sense as a save or just a random vote movement because it's the night phase and I haven't looked into it yet.

And how does Dom (malakim) fit into this theory?

What?

But you cited this as your reason for scum reading Jay. I'm only following your lead here. If you're unsure of how to read the EoD developments, how confident is that read?


I ask about Dom because he also was a leading vote-getter near the end of the day. If Jay might have been saved, why not Dom as well?

[Sloonei]

Hey Sloonei no offense but I'm not going to spend all night talking to you when you can find like 60% of the answers your looking for by doing your own footwork

If you've already covered anything that I ask about, please point me in the right direction.
I was gettig nowhere in my attempts to catch up on everything that's been said and I always prefer to generate my own content by talking through things with other people anyway. I'm just trying to get a sense for where you're at and also help develop your thoughts so that they're more clear to me.

I see, I guess I get it. I just wasn't really enjoying being grilled by both you and epi about things I've already explained.

if it helps, don't think of me as grilling you. Think of me as a lost 3-year-old who wants to know what mafia is. I play by asking questions.

[Kylemii]

But you cited this as your reason for scum reading Jay. I'm only following your lead here. If you're unsure of how to read the EoD developments, how confident is that read?

I never said it was a confident read. I guess it's more of a lead than a read. Jay is someone I want to look into because of those circumstances.

I ask about Dom because he also was a leading vote-getter near the end of the day. If Jay might have been saved, why not Dom as well?

That's also perfectly possible and worth paying attention to, but pretty much unrelated to Jay unless we think they were both saved?

[Sloonei]

But you cited this as your reason for scum reading Jay. I'm only following your lead here. If you're unsure of how to read the EoD developments, how confident is that read?

I never said it was a confident read. I guess it's more of a lead than a read. Jay is someone I want to look into because of those circumstances.

I assumed confidence because he was one of two named suspects when I directly asked for them. Was I wrong to do this?

I ask about Dom because he also was a leading vote-getter near the end of the day. If Jay might have been saved, why not Dom as well?

That's also perfectly possible and worth paying attention to, but pretty much unrelated to Jay unless we think they were both saved?

It's possible. I wouldn't leap to that conclusion right now, or even pursue without gaining more information first. I just wanted to draw the comparison. If you suspect Jay for x, and x can also be applied to Dom, you should suspect Dom for x.

[Kylemii]

I assumed confidence because he was one of two named suspects when I directly asked for them. Was I wrong to do this?

No, I guess that was a valid way to interpret the data presented to you. I just picked the 4 I could think of most immediately as if it were a gun to head excercise, in response to the urgent tone of your question.

It's possible. I wouldn't leap to that conclusion right now, or even pursue without gaining more information first. I just wanted to draw the comparison. If you suspect Jay for x, and x can also be applied to Dom, you should suspect Dom for x.

Agreed. Arguably almost even moreso since the switch from Dom to Mesk took place over a longer period of time and involved more players.

The same argument could be made for Jack too actually.

[Sloonei]

I think the votes moved off of Jack because the case around him kind of crumbled. It could be that there were opportunistic scum on his bandwagon, but I don't get any impressions of him being saved. But I've changed my mind on him about 8000 times this game, so who knows?

[Sloonei]

I didn't really consider the angle that Jay was being savee because I blamed myself first and foremost for his survival.

[Long Con]

I think the votes moved off of Jack because the case around him kind of crumbled. It could be that there were opportunistic scum on his bandwagon, but I don't get any impressions of him being saved. But I've changed my mind on him about 8000 times this game, so who knows?

I disagree, Epignosis had an important role in saving Jack in that lynch. It was his push that made it all start happening in the end there.

[Sloonei]

I think Epi played a big role in disintegrating the Jack case, yeah.

[Long Con]

I think Epi played a big role in disintegrating the Jack case, yeah.

To my recollection, Epi didn't comment much on the Jack case. He spoke of the value he found from having an active player like Jack in the thread, and that he's happy to revisit lynching him later. I haven't looked back, because I'm not sitting here for long periods, just checking in as I do other things... but that's what I remember.

I don't consider anything "crumbled" about the Jack case.

[Marmot]

OH WHAT A NIGHT!!!

Spacedaisy was once a mountain. Now she's dormant. No longer active or alive in any sense of the word.



Spacedaisy has been nightkilled. It is now Day 4. You have 24 hours to lynch someone.

[malakim2099]

A janitor in this game. Very interesting.

Though I suspect the Martian is involved with that. Too many secrets.

Going to bed now, will poke back after some sleep.