Mountain Mafia [END]

[Sloonei]

Moved my vote to speedchuck

He's my current ISO in progress. What motivates your vote now?

I find myself struggling to recall a single original stance he's taken in this game. I asked him more than once to tell me what he liked about my colonialbob ISO and he's answered less than once.

[Sloonei]

If bob is a mafioso and Sloonei is a civilian, he was met with a challenging scenario after the Day 2 no lynch. Sloonei's general credit in the thread improved in that period, and then he made a big ISO for Bob himself. In this scenario, mafia Bob saw his attempted lynch target gain a strong foothold and then turn the sword against him in quick succession. I draw this image to facilitate a perspective of the post above wherein Bob assesses Sloonei's case against him -- that it started from a point of bias and wasn't alignment indicative. It strikes me as a necessary condition that for Sloonei to be susceptible to this bias, he must first be a civilian. A mafia Sloonei operates with a deliberate slant, not an pre-biased mindset. I don't care for this response. I described the challenge a mafia Bob would have faced handling Sloonei's ISO, and this response does bear an appearance of "I don't know what to do about this."

This point reignited my bob suspicion a little bit.

[Long Con]

I think the votes moved off of Jack because the case around him kind of crumbled. It could be that there were opportunistic scum on his bandwagon, but I don't get any impressions of him being saved. But I've changed my mind on him about 8000 times this game, so who knows?

I disagree, Epignosis had an important role in saving Jack in that lynch. It was his push that made it all start happening in the end there.

Shit Epi they're onto us!



But seriously, LC. You don't see my halo and my spikey shoes? The case can't keep twisting and turning to fit whatever new tinfoil should arise.

Can you explain what you mean here?

Sloonei said he thought the votes moved off you because the case crumbled. I reminded him of Epignosis' non-case-related reasons to not vote for you. Then you accuse me of "twisting and turning" for some tinfoil case?

That reaction just looks so bad to me.

[Sloonei]

I think the votes moved off of Jack because the case around him kind of crumbled. It could be that there were opportunistic scum on his bandwagon, but I don't get any impressions of him being saved. But I've changed my mind on him about 8000 times this game, so who knows?

I disagree, Epignosis had an important role in saving Jack in that lynch. It was his push that made it all start happening in the end there.

Shit Epi they're onto us!



But seriously, LC. You don't see my halo and my spikey shoes? The case can't keep twisting and turning to fit whatever new tinfoil should arise.

Can you explain what you mean here?

Sloonei said he thought the votes moved off you because the case crumbled. I reminded him of Epignosis' non-case-related reasons to not vote for you. Then you accuse me of "twisting and turning" for some tinfoil case?

That reaction just looks so bad to me.

Name three suspects.

[colonialbob]

If bob is a mafioso and Sloonei is a civilian, he was met with a challenging scenario after the Day 2 no lynch. Sloonei's general credit in the thread improved in that period, and then he made a big ISO for Bob himself. In this scenario, mafia Bob saw his attempted lynch target gain a strong foothold and then turn the sword against him in quick succession. I draw this image to facilitate a perspective of the post above wherein Bob assesses Sloonei's case against him -- that it started from a point of bias and wasn't alignment indicative. It strikes me as a necessary condition that for Sloonei to be susceptible to this bias, he must first be a civilian. A mafia Sloonei operates with a deliberate slant, not an pre-biased mindset. I don't care for this response. I described the challenge a mafia Bob would have faced handling Sloonei's ISO, and this response does bear an appearance of "I don't know what to do about this."

This point reignited my bob suspicion a little bit.

Ask Jack about Nightblue and why I'm skittish about going into ISOs with preconceived notions. (Tl;dr I recently got mislynched because of it and I'm still a little salty about it)

[Kylemii]

Jay's iso case posts read sincere to me.

[Long Con]

I think the votes moved off of Jack because the case around him kind of crumbled. It could be that there were opportunistic scum on his bandwagon, but I don't get any impressions of him being saved. But I've changed my mind on him about 8000 times this game, so who knows?

I disagree, Epignosis had an important role in saving Jack in that lynch. It was his push that made it all start happening in the end there.

Shit Epi they're onto us!



But seriously, LC. You don't see my halo and my spikey shoes? The case can't keep twisting and turning to fit whatever new tinfoil should arise.

Can you explain what you mean here?

Sloonei said he thought the votes moved off you because the case crumbled. I reminded him of Epignosis' non-case-related reasons to not vote for you. Then you accuse me of "twisting and turning" for some tinfoil case?

That reaction just looks so bad to me.

Name three suspects.

The main three on my mind are Jack, speedchuck, and Epignosis.

[Sloonei]

If bob is a mafioso and Sloonei is a civilian, he was met with a challenging scenario after the Day 2 no lynch. Sloonei's general credit in the thread improved in that period, and then he made a big ISO for Bob himself. In this scenario, mafia Bob saw his attempted lynch target gain a strong foothold and then turn the sword against him in quick succession. I draw this image to facilitate a perspective of the post above wherein Bob assesses Sloonei's case against him -- that it started from a point of bias and wasn't alignment indicative. It strikes me as a necessary condition that for Sloonei to be susceptible to this bias, he must first be a civilian. A mafia Sloonei operates with a deliberate slant, not an pre-biased mindset. I don't care for this response. I described the challenge a mafia Bob would have faced handling Sloonei's ISO, and this response does bear an appearance of "I don't know what to do about this."

This point reignited my bob suspicion a little bit.

Ask Jack about Nightblue and why I'm skittish about going into ISOs with preconceived notions. (Tl;dr I recently got mislynched because of it and I'm still a little salty about it)

That's not my concern. The concern is, as Jay pointed out, that the premise which you labeled as "not alignment-indicative" would, in reality, have to be indicative of a town-aligned player. If I was giving into confirmation bias while ISOing you, that means I'm town, does it not?

[Sloonei]

Jay's iso case posts read sincere to me.

me too

[Kylemii]

when did you punks get so good at mafia it used to be like super fucking easy to read people

[Sloonei]

I think the votes moved off of Jack because the case around him kind of crumbled. It could be that there were opportunistic scum on his bandwagon, but I don't get any impressions of him being saved. But I've changed my mind on him about 8000 times this game, so who knows?

I disagree, Epignosis had an important role in saving Jack in that lynch. It was his push that made it all start happening in the end there.

Shit Epi they're onto us!



But seriously, LC. You don't see my halo and my spikey shoes? The case can't keep twisting and turning to fit whatever new tinfoil should arise.

Can you explain what you mean here?

Sloonei said he thought the votes moved off you because the case crumbled. I reminded him of Epignosis' non-case-related reasons to not vote for you. Then you accuse me of "twisting and turning" for some tinfoil case?

That reaction just looks so bad to me.

Name three suspects.

The main three on my mind are Jack, speedchuck, and Epignosis.

why? why? why?

[malakim2099]

@malakim2099 would you please do me a solid and describe your past mafia experience, to whatever extent you're comfortable with?

Sure! I've only really played at HCRealms, as JoH and Cbob can attest. But I've been playing for quite a while (about 9 years now, I think). The running gag there is that I'm always mafia, because I'm about two standard deviations more likely to be mafia than town in all the games I've played in (seriously, we ran the numbers, it was a little frightful.)

Here, I helped JJJ run the Mass Effect game, and then I played in the SF side-game a few months ago as Balrog (hence the avatar). Anyway, hope that helps.

Just got back from playing MTG so I need to catch up on the past few hours.

[malakim2099]

As y'all know, Thursdays are rough for me as Im put of the house basically all day and focused soley on the rugrats. It's now Friday but tomorrow is my daughter's birthday party and so today is another full day. I'm really not trying to cheat here, but I thinknits kind of crucial we actually get a baddie today. So...can someone kind of recap for me a little of what's goibg on. I know the lynch was pretty quickly switched to mesk. I know I had my doubts about her civvieness, but who ever actually listens to me? Did Jay stir up suspicion on her and eventually get her lynched? Is this why several of you are voting for him?

everyone is going to laugh and make fun of me again, and I don't care. I think language is important. If we get a sense of guiltiness from a player, there's something to be read. Likewise, when Eloh says "she's really not trying to cheat here", it strikes me as someone who felt guilty I took her heartfelt sickness/lurking post to mean townie, and I may have kind of manipulated her into thinking I believed "she's not an evil woman, she won't lie about using sickness as an excuse to get off the hook for lurking / sidelining". The result? She feels bad about being "under the radar" and possibly being a town read due to inactivity -- "cheating"



I've had neutral leaning bad, then bad, then neutral leaning bad feelings about her all game. The only reason my suspicions are not sticking is because everyone is defending her meta, saying she looks town. I haven't played with her before so I can't claim I know what her scum/town distinctions are, but I know I've been leaning bad all game.

I will say I have limited experience with Elo, but I did make an effort to paint her behavior as mafia-esque in the SF game. Not sure how well it succeeded, but I did survive to the end for the win there?

[Kylemii]

malakim2099 would you please do me a solid and describe your past mafia experience, to whatever extent you're comfortable with?

Sure! I've only really played at HCRealms, as JoH and Cbob can attest. But I've been playing for quite a while (about 9 years now, I think). The running gag there is that I'm always mafia, because I'm about two standard deviations more likely to be mafia than town in all the games I've played in (seriously, we ran the numbers, it was a little frightful.)

Here, I helped JJJ run the Mass Effect game, and then I played in the SF side-game a few months ago as Balrog (hence the avatar). Anyway, hope that helps.

Just got back from playing MTG so I need to catch up on the past few hours.

Thank you! Unfortunately I forgot why I asked you this in the first place

What are your current thoughts at?

[Jackofhearts2005]

I think the votes moved off of Jack because the case around him kind of crumbled. It could be that there were opportunistic scum on his bandwagon, but I don't get any impressions of him being saved. But I've changed my mind on him about 8000 times this game, so who knows?

I disagree, Epignosis had an important role in saving Jack in that lynch. It was his push that made it all start happening in the end there.

Shit Epi they're onto us!



But seriously, LC. You don't see my halo and my spikey shoes? The case can't keep twisting and turning to fit whatever new tinfoil should arise.

Can you explain what you mean here?

Sloonei said he thought the votes moved off you because the case crumbled. I reminded him of Epignosis' non-case-related reasons to not vote for you. Then you accuse me of "twisting and turning" for some tinfoil case?

That reaction just looks so bad to me.

The case is nothingness. It's reaching for slips and it's "this post is weird." It's all tone and gut, even if you don't want to admit it.

Epi decided to not vote for me. Daisy and Eloh started tone reading me good.

The case twists because when the first nonslip is rejected by enough people, we come up with a new slip. I'm buddies with Jimmy per Dunya. I'm buddies with Epi now per you. Earlier I was buddies with Bob and I think I was accused of being buddies with Speed twice.

It's all bullshit. Tone reads for the townies (play more better) and frame ups for the baddies (play more better).

Why does my reaction look bad?

[DrWilgy]

why is drwilgy the best lynch option today?

Beefs stated here

J3, why did you ignore the fact that I agreed with both lynching you and the suspicion of you? I felt like that'd be a pretty important part of an ISO especially with you as the observer.

Im still on mobile so I'll see if there's anything I need to address later.

[DrWilgy]

Dunsparce also has access to the serene grace ability which lets it use air slash's heightened flinch rate and thunderwave to completely block their opponent from attacking, although togekiss does it a little better and benefits from the flying type move... I guess Dunsparce could use the normal type headbutt for the same purpose but I don't know for sure if it gets access to that move outside of heart gold and soul silver

Togekiss does the same thing and it has better stats and access to Tailwind (if you play doubles) or Defog (if you play singles) which are good support options. it can also self recover.

Jirachi is a more offensive option for Togekiss too, if you are not playing an official tournament.

Dunsparce is outclassed, sadly.

Are y'all going to participate in cbc 2018? I think the season just started. I'm currently training a Dunsparce for it.

[Sloonei]

I feel my thoughts are very much in sync with DDL.

I am hesitant to vote Jay with him, but "I like this Jack more than Day 1" Jack sums up my exact feelings.

What about voting Malakim with me?

I can't promise to not swap later.

*Malakim*

Hey wilgy why were you willing to follow DDL onto malakim?

[Jackofhearts2005]

Can I please request a link to a past game with a typical civvie Jay

Also while you're at it can I see a game with a baddie dunya, please

Jay once replaced into an HCRealms game and doubled the town's post count and found the whole mafia in one day phase. It was embarrassing.

(This story is actually true. L)

[Sloonei]

Can I please request a link to a past game with a typical civvie Jay

Also while you're at it can I see a game with a baddie dunya, please

Jay once replaced into an HCRealms game and doubled the town's post count and found the whole mafia in one day phase. It was embarrassing.

(This story is actually true. L)

too be fair i'd already caught one of them but nobody would listen because my methods were weird and foreign.

[colonialbob]

If bob is a mafioso and Sloonei is a civilian, he was met with a challenging scenario after the Day 2 no lynch. Sloonei's general credit in the thread improved in that period, and then he made a big ISO for Bob himself. In this scenario, mafia Bob saw his attempted lynch target gain a strong foothold and then turn the sword against him in quick succession. I draw this image to facilitate a perspective of the post above wherein Bob assesses Sloonei's case against him -- that it started from a point of bias and wasn't alignment indicative. It strikes me as a necessary condition that for Sloonei to be susceptible to this bias, he must first be a civilian. A mafia Sloonei operates with a deliberate slant, not an pre-biased mindset. I don't care for this response. I described the challenge a mafia Bob would have faced handling Sloonei's ISO, and this response does bear an appearance of "I don't know what to do about this."

This point reignited my bob suspicion a little bit.

Ask Jack about Nightblue and why I'm skittish about going into ISOs with preconceived notions. (Tl;dr I recently got mislynched because of it and I'm still a little salty about it)

That's not my concern. The concern is, as Jay pointed out, that the premise which you labeled as "not alignment-indicative" would, in reality, have to be indicative of a town-aligned player. If I was giving into confirmation bias while ISOing you, that means I'm town, does it not?

Ohhhhh ok. So not alignment indicative - if Sloonei is town, his ISO started with the premise that I was bad and found reasons to believe so (confirmation bias). If he's mafia, his ISO started with the premise that I was bad and found reasons to believe so (because he's mafia and wants me to look bad). It's basically impossible to tell the difference because it's all in the motivation, the end behaviors look the same, and are thus not alignment-indicative.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I guess since you're possibly the least biased on the topic then Sloonei may I ask you to describe Dunya's baddie history?

I don't have a good description. The site we played at has been defunct for a few years now and she wasn't bad regularly. Her town game was characterized by crazy good intuition and palpable sincerity, but again, this was a few years ago. Her baddie game, I think, would be a bit more reserved, as sincerity is a hard thing to fake.

I'm currently reading her as town.

I think this still describes Dunya's town game, especially the second one.

[Long Con]

Well, with Jack, it started with his mirroring of my stance in the Epignosis Day 1 stuff, and he's just seemed super-scummy to me in, frankly, a non-stop way. I haven't said much because there has been plenty of suspicion on Jack, which I seriously approve of.

Epignosis, well, on one hand he's being impossibly contrary, which is just his nature, but on the other hand I can't shake the feeling that he and Jack are teammates. Little interactions, too-ironic-to-not-believe faketeaming, just the way they played both sides on me during Day 1. Epignosis is notoriously inscrutable, but gun to head I still suspect him.

And speedchuck... I totally forget why, but I know he's my third of Top 3 Suspects. I'll post this, and get back to you on speedy.

[colonialbob]

Can I please request a link to a past game with a typical civvie Jay

Also while you're at it can I see a game with a baddie dunya, please

Jay once replaced into an HCRealms game and doubled the town's post count and found the whole mafia in one day phase. It was embarrassing.

(This story is actually true. L)

I modded that game and it was amazing (Sloonei was awesome too)

[Sloonei]

Jack, having just stolen my ship and marooned me on a desert island with speedchuck as your partner, what is your opinion of him in this game?

[Jackofhearts2005]

Can I please request a link to a past game with a typical civvie Jay

Also while you're at it can I see a game with a baddie dunya, please

Jay once replaced into an HCRealms game and doubled the town's post count and found the whole mafia in one day phase. It was embarrassing.

(This story is actually true. L)

too be fair i'd already caught one of them but nobody would listen because my methods were weird and foreign.

Also you were caught up on some mechanical stuff.

[Sloonei]

If bob is a mafioso and Sloonei is a civilian, he was met with a challenging scenario after the Day 2 no lynch. Sloonei's general credit in the thread improved in that period, and then he made a big ISO for Bob himself. In this scenario, mafia Bob saw his attempted lynch target gain a strong foothold and then turn the sword against him in quick succession. I draw this image to facilitate a perspective of the post above wherein Bob assesses Sloonei's case against him -- that it started from a point of bias and wasn't alignment indicative. It strikes me as a necessary condition that for Sloonei to be susceptible to this bias, he must first be a civilian. A mafia Sloonei operates with a deliberate slant, not an pre-biased mindset. I don't care for this response. I described the challenge a mafia Bob would have faced handling Sloonei's ISO, and this response does bear an appearance of "I don't know what to do about this."

This point reignited my bob suspicion a little bit.

Ask Jack about Nightblue and why I'm skittish about going into ISOs with preconceived notions. (Tl;dr I recently got mislynched because of it and I'm still a little salty about it)

That's not my concern. The concern is, as Jay pointed out, that the premise which you labeled as "not alignment-indicative" would, in reality, have to be indicative of a town-aligned player. If I was giving into confirmation bias while ISOing you, that means I'm town, does it not?

Ohhhhh ok. So not alignment indicative - if Sloonei is town, his ISO started with the premise that I was bad and found reasons to believe so (confirmation bias). If he's mafia, his ISO started with the premise that I was bad and found reasons to believe so (because he's mafia and wants me to look bad). It's basically impossible to tell the difference because it's all in the motivation, the end behaviors look the same, and are thus not alignment-indicative.

Do you currently think I'm town? what about jack?

[Jackofhearts2005]

Jack, having just stolen my ship and marooned me on a desert island with speedchuck as your partner, what is your opinion of him in this game?

Bad.

There's no smoking gun like him shooting Wilgy and then no lynch last game but he feels way too passive. More like Pirates Speed than any other version of Speed.

[DrWilgy]

I feel my thoughts are very much in sync with DDL.

I am hesitant to vote Jay with him, but "I like this Jack more than Day 1" Jack sums up my exact feelings.

What about voting Malakim with me?

I can't promise to not swap later.

*Malakim*

Hey wilgy why were you willing to follow DDL onto malakim?

I wanted to see if something would happen.

[Long Con]

I think the votes moved off of Jack because the case around him kind of crumbled. It could be that there were opportunistic scum on his bandwagon, but I don't get any impressions of him being saved. But I've changed my mind on him about 8000 times this game, so who knows?

I disagree, Epignosis had an important role in saving Jack in that lynch. It was his push that made it all start happening in the end there.

Shit Epi they're onto us!



But seriously, LC. You don't see my halo and my spikey shoes? The case can't keep twisting and turning to fit whatever new tinfoil should arise.

Can you explain what you mean here?

Sloonei said he thought the votes moved off you because the case crumbled. I reminded him of Epignosis' non-case-related reasons to not vote for you. Then you accuse me of "twisting and turning" for some tinfoil case?

That reaction just looks so bad to me.

The case is nothingness. It's reaching for slips and it's "this post is weird." It's all tone and gut, even if you don't want to admit it.

Epi decided to not vote for me. Daisy and Eloh started tone reading me good.

The case twists because when the first nonslip is rejected by enough people, we come up with a new slip. I'm buddies with Jimmy per Dunya. I'm buddies with Epi now per you. Earlier I was buddies with Bob and I think I was accused of being buddies with Speed twice.

It's all bullshit. Tone reads for the townies (play more better) and frame ups for the baddies (play more better).

Why does my reaction look bad?

It looks bad because it jumps to the conclusion that I'm attacking you, when in reality I was just pointing out a fact to Sloonei. Massively overdefensive. You didn't have to say anything about it, but you said "Whoa, what a tinfoil, this case is bull!" Y'know?

[Jackofhearts2005]

Can I please request a link to a past game with a typical civvie Jay

Also while you're at it can I see a game with a baddie dunya, please

Jay once replaced into an HCRealms game and doubled the town's post count and found the whole mafia in one day phase. It was embarrassing.

(This story is actually true. L)

[mention]dunya[/mention]

Re: Jack ignoring things

You'll notice I'm responding to things from page 74 and 80. I've been doing this all game because I do mostly play on my phone while at work.

Idk if that changes anything for you.

[nutella]

Jay's iso case posts read sincere to me.

I must say I strongly disagree. They look so, so fake to me. Either way, they will be interesting to consider once we know his alignment.

[Elohcin]

Moved my vote to speedchuck

He's my current ISO in progress. What motivates your vote now?

I find myself struggling to recall a single original stance he's taken in this game. I asked him more than once to tell me what he liked about my colonialbob ISO and he's answered less than once.

Shoot... I forgot about chuck. I don't trust him either. I don't know who is best to vote for, but I have to get some sleep...been up since 5am.

[colonialbob]

Jay's iso case posts read sincere to me.

I must say I strongly disagree. They look so, so fake to me. Either way, they will be interesting to consider once we know his alignment.

Intrigued. How so? Are you saying you don't see yourself moving off JJJ today?

[colonialbob]

speedchuck

[colonialbob]

If bob is a mafioso and Sloonei is a civilian, he was met with a challenging scenario after the Day 2 no lynch. Sloonei's general credit in the thread improved in that period, and then he made a big ISO for Bob himself. In this scenario, mafia Bob saw his attempted lynch target gain a strong foothold and then turn the sword against him in quick succession. I draw this image to facilitate a perspective of the post above wherein Bob assesses Sloonei's case against him -- that it started from a point of bias and wasn't alignment indicative. It strikes me as a necessary condition that for Sloonei to be susceptible to this bias, he must first be a civilian. A mafia Sloonei operates with a deliberate slant, not an pre-biased mindset. I don't care for this response. I described the challenge a mafia Bob would have faced handling Sloonei's ISO, and this response does bear an appearance of "I don't know what to do about this."

This point reignited my bob suspicion a little bit.

Ask Jack about Nightblue and why I'm skittish about going into ISOs with preconceived notions. (Tl;dr I recently got mislynched because of it and I'm still a little salty about it)

That's not my concern. The concern is, as Jay pointed out, that the premise which you labeled as "not alignment-indicative" would, in reality, have to be indicative of a town-aligned player. If I was giving into confirmation bias while ISOing you, that means I'm town, does it not?

Ohhhhh ok. So not alignment indicative - if Sloonei is town, his ISO started with the premise that I was bad and found reasons to believe so (confirmation bias). If he's mafia, his ISO started with the premise that I was bad and found reasons to believe so (because he's mafia and wants me to look bad). It's basically impossible to tell the difference because it's all in the motivation, the end behaviors look the same, and are thus not alignment-indicative.

Do you currently think I'm town? what about jack?

Yes I feel quite good about you being town. Jack is still in my bottom half, want to ISO his stuff today/yesterday though as I got a generally better feeling and I want to see if there's real behind that or just gut.

[Elohcin]

Look at me voting alongside sloonei, another suspicion of mine. This game is so crazy. Fun, but crazy.

[nutella]

Eloh I've found it odd that most of your suspects throughout the game have been the most common town reads. And you seem to be completely ignoring the generally accepted analyses that have more or less confirmed both Sloonei and myself as town.

[colonialbob]

Look at me voting alongside sloonei, another suspicion of mine. This game is so crazy. Fun, but crazy.

Why are you suspicious of Sloonei?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

speedchuck stuff

Spoiler: show

I'm starting a new job tomorrow. No idea what my web status will be like.

But if I was to vote now, I'd vote for Sloonei

Voting LC for page 4 stuff that I said I was gonna vote Sloonei for.

Wait wtf why is sloon voting on LC?

*keeps reading*

speedchuck's earliest set of posts follow a sort of stream-of-consciousness thread parallel to his continuing read through the thread. This little progression here is cute. I mean that in a good way. The first two would be a creative means of manufacturing fake poop to throw (the poop isn't stated and merely implied to exist). It's similar to what Quin did with the "why will I vote Epi" thing. It's atypical of mafioso game-entry.

Spoiler: show

Uh, you pick two Civs and buddy them so they trust you and don't lynch you. Long game benefit: survival, and more likely to lynch Civs along the way. You intimidate Sloonei out of coming after you. Benefit: One less Civ coming after you; survival; more likely to lynch a Civ along the way.

Wait a minute.

How does Long Con know Mesk, coolonialbob, and Sloonei are civilians?

Oh come on

In the hypothetical that LC is putting forward, of course they'd be likely civs.

This is always a stupid argument

While I agree with the logic of speedchuck's assertion here, it's unclear whether this is meant to reflect any particular way on Epignosis (the one who provided the argument being shat on). Logical gripes in a vacuum don't add much.

Spoiler: show

Mkay

I think the Epi train was formed out of nothing, and from now on, I'm going to pick two peeps not to lynch on D1 of every game and announce it to the world just to prove it. It's a stupid start to a stupid argument filled with stupidity, and the only reason Epi hasn't fought his way out of it is that he doesn't know how to defend against asininity.

(I love you guys <3 But I calls them as I sees them)

Eliminating possibilities for lynch on D1 is not a scumtell, and that's where the whole thing started. Once it became LC vs Epi, the arguments went the same way they usually do. Having caught up, I would posit that both are bull-headed town. And the strongest point against Epi is probably Nutella.

So I'm not going to vote for any of the three. Lemme see what my other options are

This one seems more inclined toward a stance, sort of. It's defensive of Epi in that it is critical of those who opposed him. The specific read on Epi himself remains unclear -- only that he provided a perceived stupid argument and that Epi doesn't know how to "defend against asininity". I cannot believe "asininity" is a word. I thought for sure there'd be a red squiggly coming. I learned something today!

Spoiler: show

(Basically I would think LC is scum but following such a stupid argument if he didn't genuinely see something in Epi is suicidal)

(And that's a town meta read on LC for me)

TMI Alert. My initial reception of speedchuck's handling of LC/Epi was a positive one, but I disagree with myself now.

In a scenario where both Epi and LC are civilians, speedchuck has exonerated one and defended the other based on what I perceive to be pretty dubious premises. High-roading both of them, by essentially suggesting both were being dumb instead of being suspicious, may be suggestive of unique information in speedchuck's possession -- information which could only come from a mafia alignment at this point in the game.

Spoiler: show

Just a friendly reminder that the buddying case on Epi was just the worst

speedchuck really hates this argument. It's just so dumb. And Epi's handling of it was dumb. So much dumb.

I appreciate that speedchuck made a good effort to remain relevant under the restriction he posted with on Day 2. He did participate less than in prior phases, but I think that's understandable. It can't be easy to find inspiration (hi Quin) for slick new poems over and over. He made the most of the posts he made. Decent look.

Spoiler: show

So I wasn't here for dayend, and I moved from Sprityo to Jack to try and save sloonei from a BS lynch. Kinda wish I hadn't now.

And Jack wasn't an infinitely better option.

Cbob is easy for me to see as scum, and I'm glad someone brought it up. I didn't feel like posting much during the day. It all started when Cbob saw my firey post against LC and jumped on the bandwagon against him. But for those that remember, my post train wasn't condemning of LC's alignment, only his reasoning. Cbob wasn't looking for a read, he was looking for an excuse.

In general, it feels like Cbob is trying to hide his lack of scumhunting behind aggression and agreement, depending on the tide of the game. Most of the end of D2 had Cbob waving his vote in sloon's face without substantiating it or arguing it.

"But he seems so confident!"
Yeah, that's what I do as scum. I'd vote there.

Sprit is still somewhat below null for me. The freak-out/leave-thread post didn't really affect that.

Sloon is top town read (and was before the lynch, thanks). DDL is prob good. I waffle on Jack.

Regarding Sig's spec: I usually don't worry about 3rd parties until a kill shows up. Or at least some kind of marks.

The green highlighted portion is another example of general criticism to arguments/cases provided -- in this instance it was the Sloonei near-lynch which was super dumb.

The orange portion is rather yuck at face value.

"The lack of defense cbob is getting is kinda disturbing"

I acknowledge speedchuck was answering my own prompt here, but I'm still not sure this content is going somewhere. All possibilities are discussed, and a semi-conclusion is derived -- without being conclusive. The latter post strikes me as pointless.

"blatant misreprentation"

I don't hate this defense he provided against my grievance. I can understand why a civilian speedchuck would be irritated in this circumstance, and why the suspicion would be reflected.

Spoiler: show

I think my use of misrepresentation was inspired by Epi.

I spent ten minutes or so tone-reading your mafia game and looking for nebulous similarities. Pleh. I'm not clearing you, but I'd probably give you a light town read.

Also wow I played a really different game in Currents.

He forgave me really fast, based only on this meta stuff from the two past mafia-aligned games I provided.

Night 2 rainbow

At this point in the game, I'd say these reads were pretty much with-the-grain across each tier, excepting only Epignosis. It's surprising to see Epignosis, a player speedchuck has spoken of frequently in this post history, stuck in the yellow pile alongside the guy with zero posts.

Spoiler: show

Totally judging you all on your GTH reads of me

So like, one person townreads you. How does that make you feel?

Like I clearly need to play more games, firmly establish my meta.
Or maybe it's their fault. Thus the judging.

A lot of people seem to be put off by self-meta like this, but I tend to be a fan -- at least in the right dosage. In this regard I appreciate speedchuck's willingness to shoo at the bad GTH reads he received based on perceived meta misinterpretation. Some baddies don't even try it. Cool beans.

Big ass reads list

It must be said that this is the most substantive full reads list that exists in this game thread, at least to my memory. I think speedchuck is capable of making this post as a bad guy, but that's really the worst thing I can say about it. I think it's a quality contribution and a good look for him. The reads not labeled "EGH" are assertive for the most part and bear an agreeable tone. The reads labeled "EGH" are understandable. Conclusive reads on everyone is a lot to ask. It should also be noted that a more concrete stance on Epi was taken here, specifically in the negative direction. That at least resolves a long-standing void in this post history.

"Screw you mate"

Candid reception of suspicion stated by dunya. That opening statement is rather curt. I'm not sure a mafia speedchuck would reflect suspicion upon dunya, a player who is so likely to engage him in a long argument, with quite the fervor displayed here.

~~~

This was a very mixed bag. I have discussed multiple grievances and positives here. The worst of it is probably the TMI notion I discussed regarding his reception of LC/Epi. The best might be at the very end there, between the reads compilation and his reaction to dunya's accusation. The TMI notion itself is contingent upon other alignments (LC and Epi), and it moves me less. I lean more town than not on speedchuck -- it's a read which I think calls for a lot of dialogue.

[Kylemii]

Jay's iso case posts read sincere to me.

I must say I strongly disagree. They look so, so fake to me. Either way, they will be interesting to consider once we know his alignment.

What would his motivation for making them would be as a mafio?

[malakim2099]

MULTIQUOTE POST FOR THE WIN! Or at least, for the summary.

Let's find replacements for them! Hey, anyone wanna read 76 pages of mafia?

I'm still working on it! Geez. I don't want to punt the the rest of it but I honestly don't know when I'll have TIME to read through everything.

I feel my thoughts are very much in sync with DDL.

I am hesitant to vote Jay with him, but "I like this Jack more than Day 1" Jack sums up my exact feelings.

What about voting Malakim with me?

I like your gall and how you're leading stuff.

Thanks, because I have no idea what i'm doing.

Obviously. Especially since 7 minutes after I say I'm going and will BBL, you drop a vote knowing I won't respond for a while. That, strikes me as particularly sleazy.

Wilgy can go back to smilies. I'm not scum so I won't punch him this time.

All my lunch options look unappealing. I don't want to lunch malakim unless he can replace in again(if town). He might not want to after that. I have no read on him other than the way the d3 lynch shifted. And that may have been us being dumb.

Honestly, if I'm speed-lynched right after replacing someone? Um... yeah, I'll say something short and profane to anyone asking me to sub in again.

malakim2099 would you please do me a solid and describe your past mafia experience, to whatever extent you're comfortable with?

Sure! I've only really played at HCRealms, as JoH and Cbob can attest. But I've been playing for quite a while (about 9 years now, I think). The running gag there is that I'm always mafia, because I'm about two standard deviations more likely to be mafia than town in all the games I've played in (seriously, we ran the numbers, it was a little frightful.)

Here, I helped JJJ run the Mass Effect game, and then I played in the SF side-game a few months ago as Balrog (hence the avatar). Anyway, hope that helps.

Just got back from playing MTG so I need to catch up on the past few hours.

Thank you! Unfortunately I forgot why I asked you this in the first place

What are your current thoughts at?

Honestly, I really dislike DDL and Wilgy. And yes, most of this is the fact that they are voting for me. But then DDL pings me for "laziness" when... I just got here? I mean, I hate to break it to y'all, but 70+ pages of freaking mafia is NOT EASY TO GO THROUGH. And from the last game, I don't want to go off half-cocked and just post something for the purposes of posting something, so I've been trying to refrain until I can read through it.

So yeah, I feel like I'm getting pinned into a place where if I don't read the thread's full backlog and post something that misses what JJJ said on page 47 I'm scummy... but if I don't say much substantive and post very little of real accusations... I'm scummy. This is making me cranky, if you can't already tell.

Of the two, Wilgy's eagerness to jump on the me-train for nothing more than "I seem suspicious" from DDL just feels off. Of course, he was town when he did similar stuff in SF, so I dunno if that's opportunism or something else. Especially given his last post about "I wanted to see if something would happen."

I find it funny that DDL votes for me because I'm slacking, but Wilgy does the same thing (slacking) by effectively going along for the ride.

Elo, I think is town, as she's sounding a lot like she did in SF. To me, anyway.

JJJ, I'm actually thinking now that he's no longer being nihilistic that he's more town. I like his ISO work. Honestly, if he had dropped a vote on me after doing the ISO of me? I'd respect that a lot more than DDL or Wilgy as he had actual reasoning behind it.

Not sure on the others, though with only having one game under my belt (and that was as scum), I'm a little leery of dunya. But I think that's mostly because I feel put on the defensive here. I'm a little leery of CBob, especially after JJJ's ISO, but JoH... JackO is hard for me to read, darnit. I've seen him act this way as town OR mafia.

[nutella]

Jay's iso case posts read sincere to me.

I must say I strongly disagree. They look so, so fake to me. Either way, they will be interesting to consider once we know his alignment.

What would his motivation for making them would be as a mafio?

It's obvious, come on. Several reasons. First of all, he really has no choice at this point since it's his last chance to appear town and convince us that he's his normal supertown self by doing ISOs and scumhunting. Of course he's doing this now. Second, if he's scum I would bet that he is using some sort of wifom trickery/manipulating his ISOs so that when he flips bad we'll be thrown off by his "reads" and not know which ones were real -- so he might be bussing teammates, or defending them, or otherwise completely throwing us off the trail in providing these reads.

[mention]JaggedJimmyJay[/mention] how are you deciding who to ISO? So far you've done bob, wilgy, malakim, and speedchuck. Those seem kind of random. What is your reasoning for choosing them?

[Jackofhearts2005]

I'm also bothered by the lack of votes in this day.

If Jay is bad, it would make sense for there to be some counter-wagon by now (maybe Wilgy is the counter wagon?). And I don't like how everyone who is voting for Jay is someone I'm currently townreading (well there is Jack, but I like current Jack more than Day 1 Jack so i'm still on the fence about him). Maybe mafia is just watching from afar, since the civs are doing their dirty work for them. So they don't need to expose themselves, by making bussing too obvious or risking discussion going against them.

Suspected JJJ teammates: Mal, Speed, Dunya

One voting Jimmy, one voting away from Jimmy. Two not voting.

[Sloonei]

I feel my thoughts are very much in sync with DDL.

I am hesitant to vote Jay with him, but "I like this Jack more than Day 1" Jack sums up my exact feelings.

What about voting Malakim with me?

I can't promise to not swap later.

*Malakim*

Hey wilgy why were you willing to follow DDL onto malakim?

I wanted to see if something would happen.

Like what?

[colonialbob]

MULTIQUOTE POST FOR THE WIN! Or at least, for the summary.

Let's find replacements for them! Hey, anyone wanna read 76 pages of mafia?

I'm still working on it! Geez. I don't want to punt the the rest of it but I honestly don't know when I'll have TIME to read through everything.

tbh just read d3 onward and you'll get most of the important stuff. Enough to be fine I think.

[malakim2099]

Well, I take that back, partly. DDL swapped back over to JJJ based on what I'm seeing. Wilgy's vote is still there.

And yeah, CBob, that's pretty much where I'm at right now. I'm not going to go through and reread everything. I just can't.

[Long Con]

speedchuck stuff
TMI Alert. My initial reception of speedchuck's handling of LC/Epi was a positive one, but I disagree with myself now.

In a scenario where both Epi and LC are civilians, speedchuck has exonerated one and defended the other based on what I perceive to be pretty dubious premises. High-roading both of them, by essentially suggesting both were being dumb instead of being suspicious, may be suggestive of unique information in speedchuck's possession -- information which could only come from a mafia alignment at this point in the game.

Exactly how I feel about that.

[Kylemii]

Now that you mention it it seems strange he's not focusing on people who could viably be lynched today.

[malakim2099]

Also, so there's not a miss.

*Wilgy*

At least for the moment. I am still here and listening and willing to consider alternatives, until the EOD. Now that I'm home and no longer playing Magic.

Got a really cool 4-player EDH match going at the almost local game shop. Was a lot of fun. And now I watch John Wick 2.