Game of Champions 2017 - GAME OVER

[Spacedaisy]

Im just gonna try to post this once a phase until I die or the hosts put up a comparable list on the front page, cuz my memory ain’t what it used to be and it's a pain to search for this shit. I’ll do this one with only the facts as we know it:

DEATHS:

Color key:
Out of game, mafia team Evil Evens
Out of game, mafia team Strexcorp
Out of game, Civilian
Out of game, alignment unknown

D1 - Quin (no lynch) (link)
N1 - nijuu (link)
D2 - speedchuck (link)
N2 - Scotty (link)
D3 - nutella (changed from DDL) (link)
N3 - JackofHearts (link)
insertnamehere dies (link)
D4 - Long Con (link)
N4 - No kill (link)
D5 - Long Con (link)
N5 - Sig (link)
D6 - Colonialbob (link)
N6 - SVS (link)
D7 - Marmot (link)

BUTTON

N7 - JackofHearts (link)
Nutella dies (link)
D8 - Marmot (link)
N8 - Sprityo (link)
LoRab Dies (link)

MERGE

D9 - Wilgy (link)
N9 - DharmaHelper (link)
D10 - speedchuck (link)
N10 - No kill (link)
D11- Wilgy (link)
N11 - Dharma Helper (link)
D13 - sig (link)
N13 - Quin (link)

—————————————————————————

Current Lives Left (as of D13)

Boomslang - 2
colonialbob - 1
Dom - 2
Dragon D Luffy - 2
Epignosis - 2
insertnamehere - 1
Kylemii - 2
LoRab - 1
Nijuu - 1
Quin - 1
Scotty - 1
Sloonei - 2
SpaceDaisy - 2
sprityo - 1
SVS - 1

Revealed Roles

Speedchuck's role reveal during Day 7 - link
Blooper's role reveal during Day 12 - link

Guess since I voted to lynch Scotty I should update this handy dandy information post myself. Seems rude to ask him to do work for me and then vote to lynch him.

[Kylemii]

my greatest hits are
all cool dogs that I've met once
in my life. five dogs.

[Kylemii]

one a dog. and two?
another dog! what about...
three through five? all dogs.

[Spacedaisy]

The answer is he knew LC was going to get lynched and he saw something from DH that made his eyebrow twitch so he decided to put some pressure on DH instead.

Someone gets it.

Yeah, there are just too many people I feel could get pinned for possibly orchestrating an attempted lynch of sig over LC, I don't feel like it's strong enough evidence and when I read your ISO that was the impression I had of what you were saying. I can't dismiss you entirely as a suspect but I have no desire to vote you anytime soon unless something changes my mind.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

[VOTE: lorab] aubergine

I like Epi's case on her, I don't like the Scotty lynch, and as much as I'm suspicious of Sloonei I'm also wary of lynching another civ leader after the Chuck fiasco (and the Sig one, to a lesser extent). I'm okay with taking down a low poster instead.

Though is you guys wanna start a Bob wagon I'm interested too.

[Kylemii]

what is the case on
lorab? I get the deal with
Scotty. three. more. words.

[Scotty]

Im just gonna try to post this once a phase until I die or the hosts put up a comparable list on the front page, cuz my memory ain’t what it used to be and it's a pain to search for this shit. I’ll do this one with only the facts as we know it:

DEATHS:

Color key:
Out of game, mafia team Evil Evens
Out of game, mafia team Strexcorp
Out of game, Civilian
Out of game, alignment unknown

D1 - Quin (no lynch) (link)
N1 - nijuu (link)
D2 - speedchuck (link)
N2 - Scotty (link)
D3 - nutella (changed from DDL) (link)
N3 - JackofHearts (link)
insertnamehere dies (link)
D4 - Long Con (link)
N4 - No kill (link)
D5 - Long Con (link)
N5 - Sig (link)
D6 - Colonialbob (link)
N6 - SVS (link)
D7 - Marmot (link)

BUTTON

N7 - JackofHearts (link)
Nutella dies (link)
D8 - Marmot (link)
N8 - Sprityo (link)
LoRab Dies (link)

MERGE

D9 - Wilgy (link)
N9 - DharmaHelper (link)
D10 - speedchuck (link)
N10 - No kill (link)
D11- Wilgy (link)
N11 - Dharma Helper (link)
D13 - sig (link)
N13 - Quin (link)

—————————————————————————

Current Lives Left (as of D13)

Boomslang - 2
colonialbob - 1
Dom - 2
Dragon D Luffy - 2
Epignosis - 2
insertnamehere - 1
Kylemii - 2
LoRab - 1
Nijuu - 1
Quin - 1
Scotty - 1
Sloonei - 2
SpaceDaisy - 2
sprityo - 1
SVS - 1

Revealed Roles

Speedchuck's role reveal during Day 7 - link
Blooper's role reveal during Day 12 - link

Guess since I voted to lynch Scotty I should update this handy dandy information post myself. Seems rude to ask him to do work for me and then vote to lynch him.

How sweet of you.

Do remember to change the D13 and N13 to D12 and N13, I farked that one up last time.

[Scotty]

I still farted it up

[Dragon D. Luffy]

The answer is he knew LC was going to get lynched and he saw something from DH that made his eyebrow twitch so he decided to put some pressure on DH instead.

Someone gets it.

Yeah, there are just too many people I feel could get pinned for possibly orchestrating an attempted lynch of sig over LC, I don't feel like it's strong enough evidence and when I read your ISO that was the impression I had of what you were saying. I can't dismiss you entirely as a suspect but I have no desire to vote you anytime soon unless something changes my mind.

The first thing you need to understand about me in this game is that I'm not fully involved in it, hasn't been since the start and probably will not be until the end. Something about the tribe system and the lives system and playing other games made this one feel like a chore. Sometimes I have moments where I suspéct someone and make my traditional loose moves, but most of the time I'm just forcing myself to catch up and vote.

Sorry.

[Scotty]

FARKED*

[Sloonei]

Sloonei's greatest hits:
5. The first time I reached the fence in Little League
4. Opposite field double, splitting the gap between RF and CF.
3. First inside-the-park home run, Little League
2. Line shot over the left fielder's head to lead off the league championship series, age 15.
1. walk-off inside-the-park grand slam, age 15

[S~V~S]

[mention]Spacedaisy[/mention]

Thanks for making me reiterate the thing that reminds people why they ignore me

First, Nutellas role has no bearing on my thoughts on Chuck. It only ever mattered because people thought she had targeted him, which turned out to be not the case. Other people said that, not me. I only mentioned in in order to refute it.

This in Spoilers is the post I made explaining LCs lynch when I first got to Cerberus, after Chucks "reveal" as the civvie role:

Spoiler: show

Re: Cerberus Tribe - Night 4
#1481 Post by S~V~S » Sat Mar 17, 2018 6:25:16 am
"Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Mar 06, 2018 6:16:56 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue Mar 06, 2018 6:12:14 pm
Sloonei, tell me about Pikachu. Why was LC lynched?
I saw some people accusing him of faulty logic in earlier phases, I think. I don't recall who was saying these things though. I never read LC well, and he wasn't the most prominent name in any of the discussions that I read. He would not have been my preferred lynch over there."
~~~~~
OK, my take on this.

Before he took suspish, him and Quin sparred a bit, as Quin keeps reminding us.

LC made a post where he mentioned "Cerberus". No one noticed this, until Dom pointed it out. He asked how LC knew the name of the other tribe. Before anyone answered, Dom asked Nutella and I what we thought of it, maybe he asked us because we were old time Lostpedia players. We both said something like, "He is prolly just using it as an example, it used to be his player name on LP".

At that point, he could have come in and said, yup, that's it.

But (and I don't know how important this is, I just bring it up because otherwise I don't get why LC said what he said) then I said something like, "Well, let's see what he says. And since Sloonei is here, if that really is their name, he will need to have a story that will convince them as well as us." (Maybe this is why what happened happened, but I don't know for sure. But I honestly don't get why he would say what he said otherwise).

Then LC came back and said, "The hosts told me before the game, we were talking about the tribe names, and I suggested Cerberus for the lulz"

And ALL HELL BROKE LOOSE.

LC (and Chuck) almost immediately deflected to Dom. "Well oh yeah, Dom knew it too!! Otherwise how could he point it out." kinda thing.

A few people posted something like, "LOL, *VOTE LC*". At some point, someone, maybe Quin, pointed out that Sloonei was long gone from our thread when LC made the slip.

There was some back and forth, slips arent real yada yada, then after his first role flip there was a lot of discussing of his role, well that sounds civvie, no it doesn't yada yada. DH came in right after the reveal and says, "Well, that's that." and seemed to think the role flip vindicated LC. He dropped that, though.

On the second lynch, LC came back, and elaborated on the "hosts told me" story with "MP was there too" (extraneous details make lies more believable), and they had this discussion on Facebook.

ALL HELL BROKE LOOSE again. That damn hell won't stay put.

Most people voted immediately for LC. I think DH did too, but I don't recall the vote order.

Chuck and LC tried aggressively again to lynch Dom.

I kept asking people if they REALLY thought the hosts told LC and MP, two potential GOC players game secrets on Facebook, every single time someone seemed to be wavering away from voting LC.

At one point, DH said If LC flipped civ, I was obvs bad because I did not give him a chance to defend himself, I kept casting doubt on him (???????????). But he eventually started to tow the party line, him and LC had a big happy, "Sorry bro but you're bad", "No worries you did what you had to do" convo.

LC died and flipped as a role that could make someone look like another role on death.

Chuck almost immediately dropped Dom as a suspect. DH started saying he lynched LC.

PIKACHU PEEPS, is any of this wrong?

At some point, Chuck, using the Maths, determined that he and Quin were "townfirmed" based on LC's & DDL vote manip powers in their first lives.

Then the host made a post with Chucks role saying he was a civvie (it was random, not a night/lynch post, it came mid cycle).It was a role from Elemental, and had random effects depending on elements chosen. But definitely a civ.

And that is the story of LC's death.

My thoughts on Chuck are complicated. But not as complicated as it sounded when people were all going crazy that Nutella must have targeted him. I never got why anyone would think she would do that when she was killed by a vig midday. She did not know she was dying. Maybe I just havemore experience of Golden (and Jules) as a host, since they have the same love of Chaos Mafia that I do

After LC died, I was ready to go balls to the walls for Chuck, when his role was mysteriously revealed as a civ role. Initially I was like, well, there it is in black and white, he's a civ. So I went back and reread some of the LC lynch, and I just did not buy it.I just kept thinking about it and thinking about it. I still didn'tknow if I bought it.

I just wanted to watch him and try to catch him, since I knew no one would ever want to lynch someone with a civ role reveal becasue, you know, if the host posted it it must be true, right? Then Nutella flipped and once again ALL HELL BROKE LOOSE. So I felt they were suspecting a baddie for the wrong reasons, and he was gonna flip civ and we would have learned nothing. While I am glad Nutellas role was gone, I wish the vig had waited a few more days so I could have watched Chuck in peace.

LC flipped as someone who could make someone else flip as a different role on his second lynch. I was (and kind of still am) of the opinion that when it became apparent he was going to be lynched, he used his power on Chuck to make Chuck appear civ. I felt this was possible because LC would have targeted Chuck before he died, and when I asked the host about my poison effects, he told me people still were poisoned after I died, becasue they got poisoned while I was alive. So I thought it was possible for it to be the same with LC.

So in a nutshell, I felt Chuck was LC's teammate (possibly a second life baddie, not an original, or maybe Nutella was, it doesn't matter) and that LC targeted him to appear civ. I still kind of think that tbh. I really am having a hard time getting past how Chuck behaved during LCs second lynch, and the only way I see a baddie doing that is if he would flip civ. Even then, it was hard to grasp.

Please don't ask me to talk about this again, Thank You

linki @ Sloonei, Yay for all baseball hits!!

[Sloonei]

Epi's investigative journalism is the most thorough case-making we've had in the thread so far, and I don't disagree with his assessment of LoRab. I can put a vote on her. I haven't had a reason of my own to town read her, and her participation in this game has been mostly spotty. Not that I have been much better recently. But she's more of a suspect I can't argue against, rather than one I can argue for.

On the other hand, the issue of sprityo's death remains pretty urgent, although there's still a part of me that feels like we are barking up the wrong tree. I struggle to suspect any of the players from that pool independently. I have been feeling fleeting suspicion toward Scotty as votes have piled on him the last few days, but they never last long and on the whole I feel like he's sincere. But, as he's said numerous times, scum have incentive to be sincere in this game given the multiple teams. I also have seen SVS's intuition work wonders in past games, and she seemed confident that Scotty was bad even before POE was a factor.

Somebody, probably Scotty, will object to me playing both sides, leaving the door open for either option here. Sure, that's true. I hold a critical vote right now and my mind is not made up on what I want to do with it. I'm going to use it and it's going to matter. Help me make my decision, friends.

[Sloonei]

[mention]Scotty[/mention] what do you feel is the strongest argument in your favor this game?

[Spacedaisy]

Ok, so I'm sorry I asked you to repeat yourself and while I appreciate the whole recounting of everything you thought every step of the way, I really was just looking for I think he was actually civ, or I think he was possibly bad and made to look civ. Which you did answer. And I will not ask again.

Here is the thing... LC was lynched on Days 4 and 5. Which means he only had the fake role flip ability for one night. N4. I think we have pretty much agreed that we believe Marmot used the blizzard on N4, so it's impossible that he successfully targeted Speedchuck. This means Speedchuck either really was civ or someone other than LC targeted him for a fake role flip and Nutella (or perhaps someone on the other team also has a mirrored ability of both of theirs) also targeted him. Or else Speedchuck was actually civ and was targeted by someone who is a civ with the ability to reveal someone's role without any manipulation. I just think the latter is the most likely explanation that requires the fewest assumptions, though it also can't be assumed to be true. However, this puts me in a place where I might feel like it calls into question whether or not Blooper's role reveal was true or false? It could be that a civ with the ability to reveal a real role may have two shots instead of one like Nutella did? But I don't know. I feel concerned about what we are assuming to be true right now.

[S~V~S]

Ok, so I'm sorry I asked you to repeat yourself and while I appreciate the whole recounting of everything you thought every step of the way, I really was just looking for I think he was actually civ, or I think he was possibly bad and made to look civ. Which you did answer. And I will not ask again.

Here is the thing... LC was lynched on Days 4 and 5. Which means he only had the fake role flip ability for one night. N4. I think we have pretty much agreed that we believe Marmot used the blizzard on N4, so it's impossible that he successfully targeted Speedchuck. This means Speedchuck either really was civ or someone other than LC targeted him for a fake role flip and Nutella (or perhaps someone on the other team also has a mirrored ability of both of theirs) also targeted him. Or else Speedchuck was actually civ and was targeted by someone who is a civ with the ability to reveal someone's role without any manipulation. I just think the latter is the most likely explanation that requires the fewest assumptions, though it also can't be assumed to be true. However, this puts me in a place where I might feel like it calls into question whether or not Blooper's role reveal was true or false? It could be that a civ with the ability to reveal a real role may have two shots instead of one like Nutella did? But I don't know. I feel concerned about what we are assuming to be true right now.

He could use it day or night.

96: Michaelangelo, forger (Phenon). You may choose one player, and have them appear as any affiliation that you wish upon death. You may change the identity of that player at any time other than during the last hour of a phase. You are MAFIA and a member of the EVIL EVENS.

[S~V~S]

Although I totally get your willies re Niju. I think the lynch was headed her way when she was role revealed.

[S~V~S]

I think he had it on Dom, until they realized Dom wasn't going to be lynched, so they changed it to Chuck. Thats why they went so hard for Dom, they seemed him. Another reason why I would look more at the LATE push in the corresponding sigwagon at Cerberus, something I did not take into account until now. They were trying to get Dom lynched as their priority. NOT lynching LC was a secondary. So lynching sig became more of a priority after they realized DSom wasn't going to get lynched.

I will get on that tonight, but I have to do some stuff tonight

[Sloonei]

[VOTE: scotty] aubergine

[Spacedaisy]

He could use it day or night.

96: Michaelangelo, forger (Phenon). You may choose one player, and have them appear as any affiliation that you wish upon death. You may change the identity of that player at any time other than during the last hour of a phase. You are MAFIA and a member of the EVIL EVENS.

I guess I read that to mean as the last hour of a night, but it doesn't specifically say that so it could be true.

[Spacedaisy]

I like how you think SVS. Thank you.

[S~V~S]

He could use it day or night.

96: Michaelangelo, forger (Phenon). You may choose one player, and have them appear as any affiliation that you wish upon death. You may change the identity of that player at any time other than during the last hour of a phase. You are MAFIA and a member of the EVIL EVENS.

I guess I read that to mean as the last hour of a night, but it doesn't specifically say that so it could be true.

It's a beautiful baddie utility role, it doesn't make them use up their one shot based on feelings the night before. My guess (if I am right about Chuck, and there is no way of knowing) is that if they could not change it, then Chuck would have stayed on Dom.

Or I'm a loon, lol. Equally, maybe even more, possible.

[Spacedaisy]

But it would go back to Speedchuck's role reveal being false, and nutella's role can't target her own teammates. So, for this to be true you basically would require it to be a collaboration of two opposing teams.

Despite not feeling like I am coming to the same conclusions as you, I think I find you genuine in how you are thinking it through and I also like that you are catching things I miss, so thanks for talking to me about it.

You feel comfortable with Blooper's flip then?

[S~V~S]

This has nothing to do with Nutella.

[S~V~S]

And I am not sure about Bloopers flip. But since I doubt there was power duplication, I think it looks more real than not.

[S~V~S]

But it would go back to Speedchuck's role reveal being false, and nutella's role can't target her own teammates. So, for this to be true you basically would require it to be a collaboration of two opposing teams.

Despite not feeling like I am coming to the same conclusions as you, I think I find you genuine in how you are thinking it through and I also like that you are catching things I miss, so thanks for talking to me about it.

You feel comfortable with Blooper's flip then?

OH I SEE> You mean the part where LCs role says "upon death"? That might preclude the seemer flip on reveals?



Hadn't thought of that.

[S~V~S]

I so wish that the vig had waited to kill Nutella. I think her power was never used. None of this has anything to do with her.

[Spacedaisy]

lol, we should talk to each other more I think. We seem to compliment each other's thought processes.

[S~V~S]

lol, we should talk to each other more I think. We seem to compliment each other's thought processes.

Ha ha when you mentioned Nutella again, I was like,



Then I looked at LC's role again, lol. Yeah, if that is to be interpreted that way, i was unfair to Chuck and probably owe him an apology at game end when the roles are all revealed for reals. But I honestly want to know from him at that time what he was thinking with that LC defense.

[Spacedaisy]

[Jack Shephard]

[S~V~S]

Ugh, why not Ben again? Or even Sawyer?

[Spacedaisy]

Ugh, why not Ben again? Or even Sawyer?

Agreed....

[Sloonei]

A couple of posts from Scotty on Night 8 (From Pikachu, the night sprityo died)

if there is a kill tonight, and there are only 2 teams, that means Evil Evens kill tonite. It’s already lost 2 members, and the killer on the team can only target someone on their tribe. So I guess we’ll see if there is a kill and which tribe still has Evil Evens on it, if any.

This tribal switch is going to turn this game into a Sudoku to solve

Scotty acknowledges early on, and without being prompted, that the Evil Evens are likely to kill that night and that we can start limited our pool of suspects based on this knowledge. If Scotty is the Even who was there with us, this is some delicious wifom. I don't know though. Gun to my head, this feels like an earnest observation.

I feel as though things look bleak for me tonight with jack going buh bye last night. It’s the first time mafia have shown a desire to totally eliminate someone :/

This was a popular refrain for Scotty in the middle of this game, and I was never clear on why. He kept foretelling his own death, but it never came. Could be a tricky compensation for his inability to be killed. Scotty, why did you consistently feel like you were on death's door earlier?

[Sloonei]

MacDougall was hunched in a corner, musing to himself about how best to put his plans into actions. His acolytes were waiting for instruction.

"Those fools" said MacDougall "They actually believe the Citadel Council put MacGoogle into the system. And did they really think I would be hired to be a train engineer? This lot are so naive. They couldn't even tell that I'd faked my own death.

But we have a problem. The Citadel Council have clearly got plants, people in the system who are doing their bidding. It's getting in the way of my plans for world dominance. Or at least, for dominance of the Syndicate once and for all. I see no other option, devotees. It's time to be ruthless."

"We know what we must do." said an acolyte. They stood up and departed.

Night 2 has ended. Scotty has been killed. He was:

Infinity: The Reapers (Mass Effect). You are only here to influence the minds of all sentient beings and then reap their souls. You can insanify a player of your choice each night.

It is now day 3. It will last for 48 hours.

Scotty died on an even night. Just for the record.

[Sloonei]

[VOTE: LoRab] aubergine
I'm having aubergine waffles for dinner.

[S~V~S]

A couple of posts from Scotty on Night 8 (From Pikachu, the night sprityo died)

if there is a kill tonight, and there are only 2 teams, that means Evil Evens kill tonite. It’s already lost 2 members, and the killer on the team can only target someone on their tribe. So I guess we’ll see if there is a kill and which tribe still has Evil Evens on it, if any.

This tribal switch is going to turn this game into a Sudoku to solve

Scotty acknowledges early on, and without being prompted, that the Evil Evens are likely to kill that night and that we can start limited our pool of suspects based on this knowledge. If Scotty is the Even who was there with us, this is some delicious wifom. I don't know though. Gun to my head, this feels like an earnest observation.

I feel as though things look bleak for me tonight with jack going buh bye last night. It’s the first time mafia have shown a desire to totally eliminate someone :/

This was a popular refrain for Scotty in the middle of this game, and I was never clear on why. He kept foretelling his own death, but it never came. Could be a tricky compensation for his inability to be killed. Scotty, why did you consistently feel like you were on death's door earlier?

This is something how Scotty discussed the double kill of Jack, when he is on my list of possible Strex (I could place him on either team) and that's how DH died, two shot hardcore death.

[Sloonei]

A couple of posts from Scotty on Night 8 (From Pikachu, the night sprityo died)

if there is a kill tonight, and there are only 2 teams, that means Evil Evens kill tonite. It’s already lost 2 members, and the killer on the team can only target someone on their tribe. So I guess we’ll see if there is a kill and which tribe still has Evil Evens on it, if any.

This tribal switch is going to turn this game into a Sudoku to solve

Scotty acknowledges early on, and without being prompted, that the Evil Evens are likely to kill that night and that we can start limited our pool of suspects based on this knowledge. If Scotty is the Even who was there with us, this is some delicious wifom. I don't know though. Gun to my head, this feels like an earnest observation.

I feel as though things look bleak for me tonight with jack going buh bye last night. It’s the first time mafia have shown a desire to totally eliminate someone :/

This was a popular refrain for Scotty in the middle of this game, and I was never clear on why. He kept foretelling his own death, but it never came. Could be a tricky compensation for his inability to be killed. Scotty, why did you consistently feel like you were on death's door earlier?

This is something how Scotty discussed the double kill of Jack, when he is on my list of possible Strex (I could place him on either team) and that's how DH died, two shot hardcore death.

I'm not sure I understand what are saying

[S~V~S]

Scotty was discussing teams double NK killing, and DH was double NK killed. Just an interesting coincidence, since Scotty is on my list of possible Strex, and they killed DH.

I am beginning to think I need to reevaluate my thought that I had a good command of the English language, lol, since I spend alot of time clarifying my own statements

[Sloonei]

wait, you think Scotty is strex?

[S~V~S]

ARRRGGGHHH!!!!

I said I could place him on either team. I wrote a gigantic post about it. You didn't read it

[Sloonei]

There's a lot I haven't read. I don't like jumping into reading cold turkey when I'm behind.

But also, as I see it, Scotty is either an Even or he's good.

[S~V~S]

This one. I later corrected it that since Scotty (and you) actually joined Picachu before the merge, it still was applicable since that happened on an Even, and DH was first killed the next available odd.

I just started rereading Cerberus from this perspective; why these targets?

I am gonna drop the eggplant on INH for now. He defended Wilgy quite a bit in early days, and again in later days. J O'H, who was the civviest civ to civ was on his back, and subsequently died via Strex. And if there is one person that I think INH would expect to see through his baddie self, it would be DH. And DH was killed with extreme prejudice starting Night 9 (the merge was Day 9), then Night 11, INHs' first two nights in the room with DH. He asked about Negan sightings when we first got to Pikachu, first thing. He never mentioned it here, not even to razz DH about it, although that seemed to be his primary interest when the Pikachus got to Cerberus.

I did not finsih rereading him at Cerberus, and I did not read him in ISO after the Merge, so my Aubergine could change, but right now I feel he is the person who is most likely to have wanted DH dead who did not interact with him before the merge.

Tossing the Aubergine, *VOTE INH*

damn it S~V~S, I was nodding my head at 90% of your posts before this.

Wilgy bamboozled me. I was worried about the thread going after easy targets, and, to borrow a phrase from Sloonei, barrelling down the path of least resistance, and saw him mainly as a scapegoat-patsy. I didn't like Daisy's case against him, and to be honest, I still don't. I defended the wrong person for, in my opinion, the right reasons. Also, TBH, my massive wall-post about him on Day 11, in which I fully admitted that I expected Wilgy to be lynched, and that there was nothing I could do to stop it, was more to caution people to put more thought into their votes, and encourage more critical discussion.

I honestly don't think I've played non-LMS mafia with DH for literal years. After I took an extended sabbatical from the site, and came back in 2016, we haven't played many games together. We were both in Survivor Mafia, which was an LMS game, and he was in a couple games I hosted, but that's it. I strongly disagree with your assertion that I'd think he'd be able to "see through [my] baddie self," and I'm frankly confused why you immediately looked my direction when he was killed. We sim together, and he plays my games, but we don't play together.

The Negan thing was an icebreaker, mainly. Also, it was a bit of a poke at you for being so uncomfortable with his Negan RP in Survivor. Apologies for not making it into a running gag.

Thank you! Like Daisy, one thing I was iffy about was your rather strong defense of Wilgy. I doubt that Golden would put a Seemer style role on both teams ([aside]LCs role was why I was suspicious of both DH and Chuck, even though they fairly aggressively either defended LC (Chuck), tried to deflect to Dom (both) or tried to discredit me (DH) for pounding down "Do you think the hosts told LC that blah blah" everytime someone started to waver on voting for LC. Although in the last case, DH sounded pretty genuine to me, he really did think I was potentially railroading LC, so that was why I eventually turned to Chuck, rather than him [/aside]). So I think a super strong defense of a bad teammate who wants to be replaced, especially with Marmot bussing him right out the door, that does give me pause. Before DH was killed x2 and I started reading the beginning of the merged thread (whenever I tried to go in there it was all Lords of the Flies in there, with "kill the baddies" pitchfork waving manliness dripping off of every surface, lol, I had to get out of there for a while, so I just came back to vote and avoided reading much of anything) my thought was that you and he were avoiding EACH OTHER. But no way of really knowing that. My opinion on DH is fairly unreliable, he scares me, and he makes me nervous, and he and I seem to be super good at pushing each others buttons, a rather dubious superpower.

As for the Negan thing, I appreciate the sensitivity. DH said something similar. But it was menacing in Survivor for a different reason. It possibly would have been funny here, but I do appreciate the consideration from you both. It wasn't specifically that, it was that after your frustration, after being in two different thread with two very different personalities, I would have expected you and DH to interact more, to toss ideas off each other and that did not happen. Even if you don't play alot of games together I view you as friends. But that is subjective. And that also might be too obvious. But there most def was less interaction than I expected.

INH, Other than sig (and you could be right there) what are your thoughts on everyone else? I am going to pull my vote off of you for now, and move it to Scotty. Partially for your defenses, but also becasue of Quins opinions.

~~~
I still think the third strex is one of the people from Cerberus who stayed behind at the first button. DH could have easily been killed one or even two times had the killer been in his thread prior. But he wasn't until after the merge, and it was immediately after the merge. I think one of these people killed DH:

Boom
INH
LoRab
Niju
Scotty
sig
Sloonei
Spacedaisy

Boom, I felt better about him before the merge, INH ^^. LoRab, you're busy, you were traveling, it is Passover, but you are creeping the hell out of me. Niju is a civ, I believe the reveal. Scotty I will address in a separate post. I waffle on sig, I see the points on him, but I also see the signess that gets him mislynched, and I am not getting the sly feel I get from bad sig, but I never did read him that well and have joined too many incorrect sig wagons, so i am leery, maybe more so that I should be, of sigwagons. Did DH interact much with sig? If they did I missed it. Sloonei I have mixed feels on, his super civ demeanor is always impressive, but the things he is saying are making me tense. Daisys support is making me trust him a bit more, but only a bit. I feel pretty good about Daisy, from her first post when I read back in Cerberus, she felt civ to me.

I personally would, in addition to Niju, cross LoRab off this list (I don't see her feeling threatened enough to kill anyone twice in a row), and Daisy as well, as my patented "Sloonei Most Town Read" in this group. I might also strike Scotty becasue I think if he's bad, he's more likely to be Even.

I would like to get the person who killed DH becasue they killed him dead with extreme prejudice, but I would be happy with an Even, too.

I have to get ready for work, but I promise I will write a better post re my vote change later, Scotty

[juliets]

Scotty and sprityo were off in one corner, talking amongst themselves.

"I think we should lynch xbox" said Scotty"

"Hmm..." said sprityo "I'm reconsidering my stance burn."

"I still farted it up" said scotty.

"Ki votes count" said sprityo. "Meeit".

In the meantime, Spacedaisy and SVS were talking in another corner.

"We should put our brain hemispheres together" said Spacedaisy "sometimes, I feel as though one of us has two left hemispheres, and the other one has two right hemispheres."

"I have no idea what you're talking about" said SVS "But when you mentioned hemispheres, it was the missing link. I have now solved Hilbert's eleventh problem."

"We make a great team!" said Spacedaisy "If only I could make such a great team with Quin!"

*whoosh*

Spacedaisy suddenly entered a flashback. Or possibly a flashforward. Hard to be sure.

"We have to go back" screamed Jack Shepherd

Quin and Spacedaisy compared their notes.

"So" said Quin "What I'm seeing is that somehow we collectively suspect everyone in the game, but don't actually both suspect anyone. Can I get a Venn diagram for this? How is this possible?"

It also turned out that Quin used to deliver fish and chips to Spacedaisy when she was a young girl, even though Quin was pre-embryonic at the time. Spacedaisy had the odd feeling that she was in Lost Season 3, as presented by David Lynch.

*whoosh*



Day 13 has ended. Lorab has been lynched. She was:

You are 99: A Cow (A Game About Chinese Food) - You have the ability to make a trip to get chinese food intolerably boring, and really you just look like a cow, because you are, in fact, a cow. If targeted by a role that can learn affiliation, you will appear to be town. You are MAFIA and a member of STREXCORP.

It is now night 13. It will last for 24 hours, meaning you have 22 hours to get your PMs in

[S~V~S]

Also there was the whole thing he had with Wilgy, where he tried to draw himout on his vote for me. And when no one else picked up on it, he tried again with his "vague feeling of dread" post.

This is where I laid that out:

Spoiler: show

Because Scottys thread is suspicious af and Kyle felt very real today.

How real was I in the 3 weeks before you entered the tunnel?

You know what’s most frustrating? I view you as one of the civviest here. Sucks to not have you on my team here

"Tunnel"; that word doesn't mean what you think it means. I tunnelled CHUCK. I was trying to lynch Chuck after he had a role reveal as a civ before Nutella died.

YOU, I have suspected since right after I started reading Cerberus. I joined Cerberus on March 16th, and first mentioned you negatively on March 18. I have been watching you for over two weeks, prodding you occasionally, but I have voted for you, or pushed others to vote for you ONE TIME.

That is NOT a tunnel, that is hyperbole on your part, to make me look like an obsessive.

Kyle appeared as a null to me before this lynch, and then, for whatever reason, he decided to become involved, and his attempts to become informed and involved played very well to me. As opposed to, say, a few of the people who voted for sig whose only post of the day was their vote post, or the people who didn't even make the vote. Kyle's making an effort to become involved and I don't see bad Kyle bothering at this late stage.

You kind of agreed with me re Kyle on Thursday, but now that Sloonei has drilled it down to you or Kyle, suddenly, not so much, eh?

I’ve enjoyed kyle’s re-entry into the game. A lot of this is gut but he seems readily engaged with the thread again. Could be that all of his baddie teammates keep dying and now he knows he needs to kick it into high gear to stay alive. I’d list him as more a baaaarely civ lean. He could easily fall back into “BAD” read but he’s not at the top of my list right now.

SVS is bad, but I don’t know why. I hAve no desire to lynch her right now, however. Epi is right- at least how I’m interpreting him- in that maybe the low-contributors are the outliers here. Lynching Speedchuck needed to happen ImO but I see the validity in keeping him around now since he was potently adding to discussion and solving the game. But his lynch was probably inevitable until a mechanic revealed itself to the contrary.

I will revisit SVS later as to why i feel that way. What pisses me off is Wilgy’s last comment regarding SVS being bad. It’s a huge soup of WIFOM and I’m trying to ignore it, but Wilgy was all but a dead man walking at that point and it has to be a strategic move. I could very well link her to Wilgy just on that, but then that wouldn’t be fair to SVS. Wilgy never did answer me when pressed on that, so wtf am I supposed to make of that? If anything, I find it most likely she changed alignments from 1 to 2, since y’all seem to think strex was never originally in Pikachu 1.0

This post was Thursday, it now is Sunday.

You're also saying to me,

I view you as one of the civviest here.

Yet a few short days ago you said that up there^^ implying an amorphous dread you had about me. It was like Wilgy dropped this nasty little Easter Egg into the thread, and no one else picked it up, so you did, but no one bit, so you just kind of nudged it into view again. It was part of the reason I had you on my possible Strex list as well, the way Wilgy dropped that bizarre vote for zero reason since there was no lynch switch. Why drop that vote if not to use it as a topic of discussion? Who discussed it? You; trying to reap what Wilgy sowed?

I'll spoiler my Strex post, too big. But you finally got my vote because I think you could be legitimately placed on either team, although I made a mistake in this post, I had forgotten that you went to Pikachu after the first Button, not the second, Sloonei as well. But that doesn't make much difference to my theory as the first button went off during night 7, and we jumped into the new threads on Day 8. So Strex first kill after the first button push was still Night 9. I believe one of these people killed DH:

Boom
INH
LoRab
Niju
Scotty
Sloonei
Spacedaisy

For various reasons, I doubt it is Lorab or Daisy.

Based on Day Seven, I think you are more likely even, but I could also see you on Strex.

Spoiler: show

~~~
DH could have easily been killed one or even two times had the killer been in his thread prior. But he wasn't until after the merge, and it was immediately after the merge. I think one of these people killed DH:



Boom, I felt better about him before the merge, INH ^^. LoRab, you're busy, you were traveling, it is Passover, but you are creeping the hell out of me. Niju is a civ, I believe the reveal. Scotty I will address in a separate post. I waffle on sig, I see the points on him, but I also see the signess that gets him mislynched, and I am not getting the sly feel I get from bad sig, but I never did read him that well and have joined too many incorrect sig wagons, so i am leery, maybe more so that I should be, of sigwagons. Did DH interact much with sig? If they did I missed it. Sloonei I have mixed feels on, his super civ demeanor is always impressive, but the things he is saying are making me tense. Daisys support is making me trust him a bit more, but only a bit. I feel pretty good about Daisy, from her first post when I read back in Cerberus, she felt civ to me.

I personally would, in addition to Niju, cross LoRab off this list (I don't see her feeling threatened enough to kill anyone twice in a row), and Daisy as well, as my patented "Sloonei Most Town Read" in this group. I might also strike Scotty becasue I think if he's bad, he's more likely to be Even.

I would like to get the person who killed DH becasue they killed him dead with extreme prejudice, but I would be happy with an Even, too.

I have to get ready for work, but I promise I will write a better post re my vote change later, Scotty

Happy Easter All! I don't expect to be around much today.

Yep, I absolutely wasn’t sure of you a few days ago. I had a strong civ read, then Wilgy died, and I was left second guessing. But your conviction that I am bad, though egregiously wrong, makes me feel better about you again.

Are you telling me that reads don’t change for you from time to time? My reads are not deadset, otherwise I’d be a statue (a damn sexy gargoyle, if you ask me): so yeah, I’ve oscillated on you, and view you as civ right now.

I get it, I’m not going to sway you from voting me. But if not me, who would you vote?

Sure my reads change all the time. Wilgys lynch was a sea change for me, so was DHs death. But something very specific prompts it. Literally the only thing to happen between Thursday and today is I tried to lynch you. So, while you are coming right out and saying that is why you feel better about me, that whole thing with the Wilgy vote reads as inorganic to me. I don't think you ever thought I was bad. It felt awkward and forced on your part. You feel like you're acting.

I am not sure who I would vote for. I think everyone in this game (me included) is basing things on assumptions we have no way of knowing. With the roles we have seen so far, NOTHING is confirmed. If there is one role that can be a Seemer, or make someone else appear as a different role, there may be another. We have seen at least two roles revealed in thread, and one player revealed as a faux role revealer. Two known vote manipulators. Knowing Golden I would bet my Bunny (and it's a nice English solid chocolate one) that there is a chaos role, one that can scramble all night actions.

I know who I would NOT vote for. Epignosis, Daisy, Quin, Dom. Not Niju, either, although she had my spidey senses tingling like mad before her reveal.

Boom; who's that? When I first read him when I went to Cerberus, he seemed OK, but going back a few days ago in light of subsequent events I fwelt worse about him. I would want to reread him (and actually plan on doing so)

C-Bob and sprit have both changed since they died. Quite a bit in both cases. I would look into either if you were not on the poll.

I don't think LoRab killed DH becasue of what I know of her. That double target business was direct, playing to win, and also maybe a tad harsh. I don't think it is someone who came from our original culture would have done that, especially since he plays so seldom and seemed to be really having fun. Prejudicial and subjective? Yes. But it is how I feel. Doesn't mean she isn't Even, but she feels distracted, not bad, to me.

I waffle on INH, INH is like me in that he is good at faux sincerity. He deos sound sincere to me, and the fact that he kept pushing the sig case actually makes him look better, not worse, to me becasue he stuck to his guns, and if he was bad he would have to realize sig probably wasn't. I would not be *shocked* if INH was bad, but I would not be shocked if he wasn't either.

If kyle keeps it up as he has, I have no reason to think he is bad.

Personally, I think Sloonei could be potentially bad. He waffles, he makes errors I would not expect from him. I think he is trying to be Supatown, but it ain't easy being good when you're bad. BUT the Marmot/Wilgy lynches gave me pause, though, he isn't a Strex. One under the bus, maybe, but two? And on Day 5, when LC was lynched x2 and Cerberus had the sigwagon, Sloonei wanted to lynch Marmot, not sig. He had to be talked into it, and was far from a thread leader that day, so I don't think he is as likely to be Even. My feels on Sloonei are almost total gut, and some of that could be cultural, people talking about how civ they are gets my vote finger itchy. So Sloonei feels bad to me, but I wouldn't vote for him as it could be just that, feels.

So to answer your question, I would probably reread post first death Bob and sprit, and Boom. C-Bob and sprit for possible post first death affiliation change, Boom for his general demeanor and just POE.

Linki YAY!!!! GOOD JOB LORAB VOTERS!!!!

i was totes wrong about her feeling bad about killing DH. Evil LoRab.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Scumget

[Spacedaisy]

That was a beautiful thing! Well done Lorab voters!

[Sloonei]

All I do is lynch strexcorp. I need something that can demonstrate my unevenness.

[S~V~S]

So never mind on a lot of that theorizing on why people could be Strex I posted up there, since the premise (a Cerberus killed DH) was right, but the LoRab being too gushy to do it all cold hearted like that wasn't.

[S~V~S]

How did she die the first time?