Fallout: A Post-Nuclear Mafia Game (END)

[Creature]

What evidence is there to suggest that Mac was recruited?

I said possible recruit, not definite recruit

[Creature]

It's not evidence, but it's indication: his play majorly changed.

[Sloonei]

What evidence is there to suggest that Mac was recruited?

I think it would be better to take a step back before exploring this question, actually.

How do we think sabie (and her partner, if they were active Day 1) would have treated their recruit?

Bearing in mind that the recruit would have been pseudo-lynchproof. They began the day with a -2 vote count, and would also have been indestructible at night. So they would not necessarily need protection in the short term, but there'd be no need to expose them to the threat of long term scrutiny either.

For instance, if the recruit had received the highest vote total Day 1, they would be likely to survive in spite of this as long as somebody else was within 1-2 votes of them on the poll. This would be a major red flag to every civilian. The mutants would absolutely want to avoid hanging their impending partner out to dry like that right off the bat (baseball metaphors activated). So I think it's likely they would have wanted to pitch around that player. But it's also worth noting that (I think) the recruit would have been unaware of their recruited status on Day 1, so they certainly would have also been unaware of their partners' identities. This is the ultimate advantage of the recruit; they are a genuine and earnest civilian on Day 1. The two original mafia members probably would want to avoid heavy confrontations with their recruit -- nothing high and tight off the plate -- for everyone's benefit; if Recruited Goon gets all worked up about something The Master did Day 1, then Recruited Goon needs to find an excuse to back off their target on Day 2, or else the team is caught in a bussing trap of their own making.

SO I guess what I'm saying is I'd expect mafia to tread lightly around their recruited player on Day 1.

[Sloonei]

What evidence is there to suggest that Mac was recruited?

I said possible recruit, not definite recruit

Everyone's a possible recruit. Why speculate if you're not gonna attach reasons to it?

It's not evidence, but it's indication: his play majorly changed.

How so? He was less of a presence, but I'd attribute that more to availability than alignment.

Macdougall is not a player who's afraid of the spotlight when he's mafia.

[MacDougall]

Creature is talking like someone who was recruited imo.

[Glorfindel]

Sloonei: I’m more than happy to address your concerns my friend.

1. Words are important and I fear that you have (presumably inadvertently) misrepresented my remarks in that post of mine that you quoted. I said that what caught my attention was how yours and Sabie’s comments on Jack aligned, not that they were identical. By this, I meant simply that you both clearly found something inherently suspicious in his play worthy of calling out publicly.

My concern is that I did not intend to frame Jack's behavior as suspicion. What I meant in my original analysis of him was that his play aligns more closely with Town Jack, but that I wanted more from him in spite of this. I don't think it's damning by any means that you interpreted as suspicion in line with what sabie was saying, but it's something I've taken note of.

2. I bought into the suspicion on Sabie but openly admit that I bought into mot wanting to lynch her based on THAT post of Epi’s and her prestations about being an easy early game mislynch. Believing that my early suspicions of her were errant, I assumed that based on her comments about Jack and your comments about his play this game as sufficient reason to place my vote on him Day 1. I found (and still do) his posts to have an unusually high fluff content which is not what I recall having experienced from playing with him in the past. Yes, I’ll admit that Sabie flipping Mafia makes his Mafia alignment look a lot less likely but doesn’t necessarily rule it out entirely.

3. My question to Mac was (in part) a perhaps clumsy attempt at advancing the game (no, I’m not a player of Jay’s calibre and doubt that I ever will be but please give me credit for trying). Further, the scenario I presented to Mac was far from hypothetical. I think you’ll find that at the time I made that post, you and Creature were the joint lead wagons and the suspicions on Sabie had appeared to have gone cold (following Epi’s post, etc. etc...). I was concerned that our Mafia friends may have been attempting to build momentum to lynch you and wanted to feel Mac out to discern if he was likely to support what (at the time) was looking like a distinct possibility to me.

If I’ve failed to address your concerns, I’m happy to continue this conversation with you for however long it takes for you to see the truth. I’ve been honest in my response to you so I trust you will I understand that if I come off sounding either naive or clueless.

I object to none of this.

Who should we be looking at to begin this day?

[mention]Sloonei[/mention] I’m afraid that you’ve caught me at a somewhat awkward moment. I’m about to head into a funeral. Will address your question once it lets out.

[Sloonei]

sorry glorf, you have my condolences. this game doesn't matter

[Sloonei]

Creature is talking like someone who was recruited imo.

He was the first name that came to my mind after I typed my long-winded spiel about how the mutants would have treated their recruit.

sabie had next to nothing to say about him early, though I do believe she plopped some arbitrary shade on him late in Day 2 when he was getting votes (and also voted for him, I think?), but at that time both of them were exposed to heavy scrutiny and the necessity to avoid bussing would not have applied.

[MacDougall]

It's not evidence, but it's indication: his play majorly changed.

I wanted Sabie lynched. I voted for Sabie. I had said my piece at length about Sabie on day 1 and I got nowhere with it. People just opposed me because of the innate contrarianism.

Fast forward to day 2. I vote for her and say shit all and she gets lynched and flips wolf.

I changed the way I played day 2 because the way I played on day 1 yielded no result.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

The poll is up, but the deadline is manual. See the poll question.

Dragomir has been killed by the host. He was IAN.

[Glorfindel]

The poll is up, but the deadline is manual. See the poll question.

Dragomir has been killed by the host. He was IAN.

Whilst it’s absolutely tragic that we’ve lost another of our number, I think we can count ourselves a little lucky at not having to deal with the potentially unfortunate impacts of this role...

[Glorfindel]

sorry glorf, you have my condolences. this game doesn't matter

Thank you, my friend but the funeral was for the mother of someone that I’d worked with for rather a long time. Not emotionally shattering like my last funeral but sad nevertheless.

[birdwithteeth11]

ColinIsCool - ColinIsNotCool
Creature - Obvtown through EOD2
Dragomir - Useless slot
Glorfindel - Town
Jackofhearts2005 - I might've been too precipitated to townread here
MacDougall - Possible recruit
Oreki / birdwithteeth11 - Been worthless so far
Sloonei - Town
sprityo - Town
TonyStarkPrime - Town

No u

But seriously, how have I been worthless so far?

[birdwithteeth11]

Creature is talking like someone who was recruited imo.

And there it is.

Between you and Creature, I feel like I've seen a bigger change with Creature's behavior. So I would be more inclined to think he is the potential recruit over you.

[Glorfindel]

Creature is talking like someone who was recruited imo.

And there it is.

Between you and Creature, I feel like I've seen a bigger change with Creature's behavior. So I would be more inclined to think he is the potential recruit over you.

Creature would (I think) be an odd choice as a recruit although the Mafia team wouldn’t have had anything to go on in terms of his play when they had to make their choice. Still, I think it’s unlikely. And I agree with you, I think you’ve been anything but useless since you’ve returned to us. I thought you’ve been most constructive in your comments and observations.

[Glorfindel]

May I please have a copy of yesterday’s final lynching poll?

[Sloonei]

May I please have a copy of yesterday’s final lynching poll?

Spoiler: show

Tandi is a bloody mess. Who could do such a thing?
Poll ended at Tue Jun 25, 2019 6:00 pm
Please note that if you vote, your vote will be visible.


ColinIsCool
0
No votes
Voters: None
Creature
3
21%
Voters: sprityo, Glorfindel, sabie12
Dragomir
0
No votes
Voters: None
Glorfindel
0
No votes
Voters: None
Jackofhearts2005
0
No votes
Voters: None
Long Con
0
No votes
Voters: None
MacDougall
0
No votes
Voters: None
Oreki
0
No votes
Voters: None
sabie12
5
36%
Voters: Creature, MacDougall, TonyStarkPrime, Sloonei, ColinIsCool
Sloonei
2
14%
Voters: Jackofhearts2005, Long Con
sprityo
0
No votes
Voters: None
TonyStarkPrime
0
No votes
Voters: None
Not voting presently
0
No votes
Voters: None
Bethesda dialogue writers (host/dead/non)
4
29%
Voters: Epignosis, leetic, JaggedJimmyJay, juliets
Total votes: 14

[Glorfindel]

Spoiler: show

May I please have a copy of yesterday’s final lynching poll?

Spoiler: show

Tandi is a bloody mess. Who could do such a thing?
Poll ended at Tue Jun 25, 2019 6:00 pm
Please note that if you vote, your vote will be visible.


ColinIsCool
0
No votes
Voters: None
Creature
3
21%
Voters: sprityo, Glorfindel, sabie12
Dragomir
0
No votes
Voters: None
Glorfindel
0
No votes
Voters: None
Jackofhearts2005
0
No votes
Voters: None
Long Con
0
No votes
Voters: None
MacDougall
0
No votes
Voters: None
Oreki
0
No votes
Voters: None
sabie12
5
36%
Voters: Creature, MacDougall, TonyStarkPrime, Sloonei, ColinIsCool
Sloonei
2
14%
Voters: Jackofhearts2005, Long Con
sprityo
0
No votes
Voters: None
TonyStarkPrime
0
No votes
Voters: None
Not voting presently
0
No votes
Voters: None
Bethesda dialogue writers (host/dead/non)
4
29%
Voters: Epignosis, leetic, JaggedJimmyJay, juliets
Total votes: 14

[mention]Sloonei[/mention] Thank you

[Glorfindel]

[mention]Sloonei[/mention] in answer to your question from earlier, it seems to me that the focus (for a large part of the game now) appears to have fallen on Sprityo and Creature and to a lesser extent on JackofHearts and ColinisCool. Of the four, I think I’m less concerned about Colin. From my understanding of Sabie’s role, she was reduced to the status of a goon after she enlisted her target N0. Given that she’d come under early suspicion (and kinda heavily at that) I’d expect that there is a distinct possibility that her partners may have planned prudently to jettison her if she’d become a liability and that they thought they could get some mileage from contributing to her lynching. If this were planned with her knowledge, I think it could have easily contributed to bussing and distancing from her.

For that reason and the fact that (to this point) I feel strong Town vibes from most everyone else, I’ll be looking for a Mafia or two out of either Creature, Sprityo and Jack.

[Sloonei]

sabie was also a roleblocker.

[Glorfindel]

sabie was also a roleblocker.

She was? Sorry, missed that

[TonyStarkPrime]

Okay time for the nightly analysis.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Wait is today 48 hours? At the beginning it was 24

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Apologies, the day is 24 hours. I fixed the poll title deadline.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Wild Wasteland tinfoil mode engaged. You are invited to come along

I’m not saying that your theory is beyond the realm of possibility but that’s one train I think I’ll refrain from jumping aboard for now, Colin. Realistically, it’s rather likely it will be a decision that will be taken out of my hands before very long.

I’m with Glorf on this. Possible? Yes. Probable? No.

[TonyStarkPrime]

This became boring too soon.

Day 1 creature: I don’t like this too boring
Day 2 creature: I don’t like this it got boring

The night 1 kill reads to me as a very active candidate that the mafia team is trying to eliminate. So the stifling worthwhile discussion route might be in play here?

Interesting idea. Can you elaborate?

I mean, it wouldn't be the first time I've seen a mafia team try to quash discussion as much as possible by killing off the people who are talking/contributing the most. It lets them lead the civvies like lemmings if the civ team isn't super active/engaged through the whole game to an easy baddie victory.

But it was just a hunch and I would need more evidence than just one nightkill to confirm this idea.

What’s your continued thoughts on this with the LC kill? Who do you think would kill Epi and LC?

[TonyStarkPrime]

Time for everyone’s favorite game where I get mislynched again

Should I roll over and die. Save my breath-

Or rebuke these false pretense messages that the above people say means something?

Hmm.
NAI?
I’d normally say maf but also 1) that’s meta dependent and 2) spirtyo posted this very early

[TonyStarkPrime]

Spoiler: show

A more in-depth interactive sabie ISO

So mac has given up on defending himself or making cases on people he accuses? Or does that not even need to happen anymore because in games I've played lately it seems like people don't have to bother to give reasons anymore. Every time I think mac is bad because he's given up and doesn't care I end up being wrong so I dont know.

As of right now I don't know for sure. I have such a hard time making reads day 1. The exchange between creature and epi was interesting but I thought that about creature and another player before and everyone was like oh that's not weird and they weren't bad so I don't know. Could they be teammates? Maybe but I feel like they wouldn't be that obvious about it.

I feel like Jack and spirityo are usually more quick to go around making accusations and getting people to talk but have been more cautious this day 1. BWT also was quick to say vote epi but didnt and hasnt said much other than that they didnt know if they checked in.

We have yet to hear from oreki colin and dragomir

I dont think I've ever played with TSP before so I dont have anything to go on. Sloonei and LC seem like they're usual selves at this point.
Glorfindel seems to be making an effort to follow Jimmy's guide and be like a super civ. Could be an effort to make sure they seem as civ as possible when maybe they aren't.

I've already talked about this post a handful of times, but it's important. LC and I are her only positive reads. Jack, sprit, and glorfindel have varying degrees of negativity around them, and Mac has the tiniest bit of shade. Everyone else just gets neutral mentions.

Sabie, I see you. Give us your brain thoughts!

My thoughts are really not positive at the moment. Realizing how much I get killed off so quickly really makes me frustrated and upset and this game isnt supposed to make you feel that way. I am terrible at reading people day 1 and whenever I try people think I'm bad even though I'm not which has been just insanely frustrating for me.

Colin asks her for reads and she doesn't really supply them. Noted.

I guess for me my suspicion is towards Jack and spirityo as when civ they usually are more aggressive in scum hunting and posting and this game they seem less so.

I'm sorry I'm not super familiar with glorfindel didnt mean any offense in the accusation just speculating on things. TSP is putting in effort to be involved and producing reads. I'm not suspecting either of them at this time. I dont remember playing with either of them before so by saying I dont have a lot to go on I just meant I dont know their playstyle. They're probably doing better than I am at this point.

Mac has gotten me mislynched day 1 before but he was civ just had the wrong idea about me.

Reiterates the Jack and sprit suspicions. One or neither of them are bad. Idk. Jack is pushing for sprit right now, but that's exactly what he'd be doing if he was bad.

This is where she walks back the Glorfindel suspicion. Mr Stark is also given sabie's stamp of approval here. She besmirches Mac a little without really implicating him. Mac and Tony shared my top tier of town reads before we knew sabie was bad, and her flip only strengthened each of those reads.

If only one of Jack and spirtyo is maf which is it
Make a case
Convince me

What I've found is that when Jack is a civ he goes after people asks questions gets discussion going gets really into it and posts a lot. As a baddie he wasn't like that he was a lot more chill. This game I haven't seen the usual civ Jack so far.


I guess the same could be said of bwt who you have voted for. As he also has not been as active as he was in the previous game where he was civ and has not provided much depth to suspicions and reads thus far this game.

When pressed to choose one or the other between her two suspects, she chooses Jack and then also pivots onto bwt out of nowhere. That part looks particularly opportunistic. I don't know if she's looking for an alternative to her teammate, Jack, or if she's just looking to broaden her horizons now that birdwithteeth is on the menu. Her vote ended up on Jack this day, which goes against the "jack is her teammate" argument.

Well out of the options currently being voted for Im more inclined to go with bwt as they have been voting with no explanation and haven't put forth as much effort as they normally do.
Epi could be bad with his hiding behind the video game speak but I always find him so hard to read.

I've said in multiple games that Jack has a different way of posting when good and bad. Other people also have utilized this knowledge of how people act in games to gauge what alignment people might be. Why does that make me bad? I sometimes feel like I must be speaking a different language because I think what I'm saying makes sense and everyone is always like whaaaaaaaa?? Whenever I post.

Yeah this doesn't look like a bus job. She wants Jack to get got. The vote.

I'm sorry BWT RIP! I agree this lynch was difficult because I felt I had some town reads but I was unsure about some of the less active players. I felt like it was out of character of Jack and spirityo to not be as involved as they usually are hopefully they'll come in and participate more. I'm still iffy on them. I think the shorter than usual day phase may have also caught some people off guard.
And to answer epis question mac has definitely been wrong about me before.

She kind of abandoned sprit for a while, but now that the lynch has passed he's back on the menu. Maybe I do want to lynch him.

I am trying to keep up. I really didnt want to go into my personal real life problems on here because who wants to hear me complain about my life and ruin this game no one. Basic is the boyfriend is very sick and I now work over 10 hour days at a high stress job.

I am trying to keep up. I don't even understand the suspicion on me or where it comes from. I keep trying to make an effort. It's like lately people just decide they want to suspect me and go for it.

Spirityo continues to not provide much of anything on the way of reads. Even after hes been under some suspicion haven't seen him be his usual aggressive self. I was also saying that about Jack but he did at least come back into it. Oreki and dragomir I assume are probably not planning on coming back at this point.

Creature is a hard one to read he came in on end of day and was all over the place with the votes and posting. I'll have to look more at that.

I will be at work for like forever but I'll try to check in. I didn't want to bail on the game. I'm glad for the extra time today. Putting my vote on no vote currently but will check in periodically.

Day 2 and sprit has seeminly leapfrogged Jack as her top suspect. Jack started getting more involved, which took away sabie's argument against him. She throws oreki and dragomir into the paragraph about sprit, and then follows it up with her first mention of Creature. Preliminary good look for Creature; this looks opportunistic.

Today was fun worked forever went to urgent care went to pharmacy finally home.
I get the creature suspicion. When looking at his ISO it's all just like maybe one sentence of random thoughts and changing suspicions. He was saying this game is too boring and people are uncreative with their votes and suspicions without really doing much delving into anything either. His end of day posting was just all over the place amd changing votes without trying to solve anything. He could have broken the tie but also did not.

Spirityo eh I'm still iffy on him. He maybe had some motive to kill epi as epi was kind of calling him out.

The number of people here that wouldn’t lynch Glor if he said “I am town” but who are voting Creature is interesting.

That number appears to be two.

Lol and one is Glor. Awesome.

Unsure what that's all about exactly.
Still think Jack is acting weird but at least he kinda came back in.

I really have to do real life stuff I'm really trying to be here as much as I can.

She quietly jumps on board with the Creature wagon. Opportunism 101. Her line on sprit the whole time has been "he's iffy" and that read hasn't really progressed. I could see them as teammates, but that does not need to be the case.
Part of me wants to read that bottom portion as a soft, indirect defense of Glorfindel.

And that's where we're at. Creature and Mac look pretty good here, as does Jack. sprit is iffy. There are juicy bits involving Glorfindel, but I'm not completely sure which way to lean on those. I'd favor town for now, but those are open to interpretation.

I ran similar analysis and came up with different results but the general agreement is sprit looks bad. 2 mafia on the day 1 trains could explain why that was weird. Esp. with sprit gone at EOD. Sabie still would’ve wanted to vote BWT though.

[TonyStarkPrime]

That scene in the newest Halloween movie where Myers is in the house and you hear the baby cry and then he goes through the house and idr if he stops and looks at the baby or not but then he just leaves.

Fucking stupid.

If Myers is supposed to be evil personified, he would have no problem killing a baby. If you don’t want him to kill a baby in your movie, don’t put him in the same house as a baby.

Felt like the scene was written to make the audience go “oh no” and then to make everyone breathe a sigh of relief with no regard to plot or characterization. Basically a jump scare only less prevalent.

Rest of the movie was good though.

Technically I don’t examine ot content on principle but this is where I decided that Jack was town.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Creature is talking like someone who was recruited imo.

And there it is.

Between you and Creature, I feel like I've seen a bigger change with Creature's behavior. So I would be more inclined to think he is the potential recruit over you.

Creature would (I think) be an odd choice as a recruit although the Mafia team wouldn’t have had anything to go on in terms of his play when they had to make their choice. Still, I think it’s unlikely. And I agree with you, I think you’ve been anything but useless since you’ve returned to us. I thought you’ve been most constructive in your comments and observations.

Has Creature not played much around here?

[Sloonei]

Creature is talking like someone who was recruited imo.

And there it is.

Between you and Creature, I feel like I've seen a bigger change with Creature's behavior. So I would be more inclined to think he is the potential recruit over you.

Creature would (I think) be an odd choice as a recruit although the Mafia team wouldn’t have had anything to go on in terms of his play when they had to make their choice. Still, I think it’s unlikely. And I agree with you, I think you’ve been anything but useless since you’ve returned to us. I thought you’ve been most constructive in your comments and observations.

Has Creature not played much around here?

I believe this is his third syndicate game. He was previously in Better Off Ted and Arrowverse, which ran concurrently just a couple weeks ago.

He's played a lot elsewhere, i dunno where though. MU I think.

[MacDougall]

That scene in the newest Halloween movie where Myers is in the house and you hear the baby cry and then he goes through the house and idr if he stops and looks at the baby or not but then he just leaves.

Fucking stupid.

If Myers is supposed to be evil personified, he would have no problem killing a baby. If you don’t want him to kill a baby in your movie, don’t put him in the same house as a baby.

Felt like the scene was written to make the audience go “oh no” and then to make everyone breathe a sigh of relief with no regard to plot or characterization. Basically a jump scare only less prevalent.

Rest of the movie was good though.

Technically I don’t examine ot content on principle but this is where I decided that Jack was town.

Wtf why?

[MacDougall]

Creature is talking like someone who was recruited imo.

And there it is.

Between you and Creature, I feel like I've seen a bigger change with Creature's behavior. So I would be more inclined to think he is the potential recruit over you.

Creature would (I think) be an odd choice as a recruit although the Mafia team wouldn’t have had anything to go on in terms of his play when they had to make their choice. Still, I think it’s unlikely. And I agree with you, I think you’ve been anything but useless since you’ve returned to us. I thought you’ve been most constructive in your comments and observations.

Has Creature not played much around here?

I believe this is his third syndicate game. He was previously in Better Off Ted and Arrowverse, which ran concurrently just a couple weeks ago.

He's played a lot elsewhere, i dunno where though. MU I think.

He does play on MU. I just played in a 51 player game with him. We were both civilians. We lost. He was obviously a civ there. I don't get what Jack is doing with the meta thing because he was more obvious civ there in a 51 player game than he is here. He's just phoning it in here imo. Maybe he is a civ and Jack is guilty of TMI.

[sprityo]

So yeah as of yesterday is when the recruit both lost their abilities and came into btsc with the master and lou

Anyone else not clear on that but is now? I wasn’t

[sprityo]

Day1

birdwithteeth11: Creature, Sloonei
Epignosis: Long Con
Glorfindel: birdwithteeth11
Jackofhearts2005: sabie12, Glorfindel
Sabie12:TonyStarkPrime, MacDougall
sprityo: ColinIsCool, Epignosis
Not voting presently: sprityo, Jackofhearts2005



Day 2
Creature: sprityo, glorf, sabie
Sabie: sloonei, mac, TSP, creature, colin
Sloonei: Jack, LongCon
Didn’t vote: BWT2

Here’s a vote chart

[sprityo]

So hmmm

Creature and tsp switched from colin to sabie bear end of day

So for either of them to be mafia theyd have to want to buss their own role blocker which seems entirely wasteful and not likely

[TonyStarkPrime]

I fell asleep before posting this.

That wasn’t that much new stuff which is concerning. I’m gonna ISO sprityo again, but I think that’s the best place to start today. Sprityo maintained a safe but not too dramatic distance from sabie and hasn’t seemed up for much town discussion outside of a few pokes in the right direction. Colin is also a suspect in my mind because I think his votes have seemed opportunistic but he had good town indicative interactions with Sabie so that’s a step in the positive direction.

As far as the recruit candidate goes I’d be looking at Jack, Mac, Sloonei, and Creature mainly with potential in theory for other options (Glorf seems like it’d be a cruel joke but maybe ). Jack and Mac both posted very little in phase 0 so they seem like unlikely choices for the recruit. Sloonei and Creature were both town read in phase 0 with top post counts but apparently Creature hasn’t played much around here? And I townread sloonei. I think best bet is to keep looking for the master and hope the recruit becomes more obvious over time.

[TonyStarkPrime]

That scene in the newest Halloween movie where Myers is in the house and you hear the baby cry and then he goes through the house and idr if he stops and looks at the baby or not but then he just leaves.

Fucking stupid.

If Myers is supposed to be evil personified, he would have no problem killing a baby. If you don’t want him to kill a baby in your movie, don’t put him in the same house as a baby.

Felt like the scene was written to make the audience go “oh no” and then to make everyone breathe a sigh of relief with no regard to plot or characterization. Basically a jump scare only less prevalent.

Rest of the movie was good though.

Technically I don’t examine ot content on principle but this is where I decided that Jack was town.

Wtf why?

he just is

[sprityo]

Yeah I think jack sounds like a good vote right about now

[VOTE: jack] aubergine

[TonyStarkPrime]

So an updated rainbow:
TonyStarkPrime
Macdougall
Glorfindel
Long Con
sabie
birdwithteeth
Jackofhearts
Dragomir
sprityo
Colin
Creature

Sloonei, you’ve probably answered this, but given this as your rainbow list just before EOD yesterday what compelled you to vote for Sabie over Creature?

[sprityo]

Wasn’t he already voting Sabie though most of the day before that?

@TSP

[TonyStarkPrime]

Wasn’t he already voting Sabie though most of the day before that?

@TSP

I don’t think so? Let me check. In any case he wasn’t close to EOD and there’s no reason why he would given Sabie’s position on his own rainbow list.

[TonyStarkPrime]

He was for about an hour before moving it to Colin which I criticized then too. It’s completely random to vote for someone you townread and then not vote for them and then vote for them again at the end of the day.

Now it resulted in us lynching scum but it also suggests some knowledge that a townie wouldn’t have.

[Sloonei]

He was for about an hour before moving it to Colin which I criticized then too. It’s completely random to vote for someone you townread and then not vote for them and then vote for them again at the end of the day.

Now it resulted in us lynching scum but it also suggests some knowledge that a townie wouldn’t have.

I can’t claim to have a very elaborate reason for my vote. I cast it about 20 seconds before the poll closed. At the time we were deadlocked at 4 votes apiece for Creature and Sabie. I was on sabie. Nobody else appeared to be moving. My main motivation was to avoid another tie. But I also started to feel better about Creature in the final moments. I talked about this briefly in the moment (there wasn’t time to explain anything in depth). It was a very impulsive vote, dictated more by emotion than reason. I remind you again that I always hold onto my votes verynloosely. I can change it at any time, and when it comes to the final result optics are not a consideration; my vote goes where I want it to go in the moment.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Voting Sprit for now. Vote data is a simplistic case but it’s a strong suggestion especially given how close the lynches were. Additionally while his posts haven’t particularly pinged me in the wrong way, they’ve given off the substance feel that scum would want without containing much content that could be incriminating.

Sprityo, convince me that someone else is maf.
You almost definitely won’t be able to do so on Jack.

[ColinIsCool]

[VOTE: JACK] aubergine but if anybody else wants to kill Sloonei please hit me up on MSN Messenger and I’ll be sure to switch.

[Sloonei]

Colin & Sabie

Caught up — I really liked Mac's post re: sabie. I also agree that Creature and Mac look like good town people for coming in and stirring things up a little.

I'd like to give sabie a chance to respond and offer an alternative before voting her, though, because while it's not cutthroat, I don't like that list of all the games she got murked in ...

Supports the sabie case but holds back on it and presents her with a platform to defend herself.

Sabie, I see you. Give us your brain thoughts!

A poke. Okay. Her immediate response was nothing. I could see teammates in this interaction. Colin gives her a generic prod for content and she responds with an emotional and unsubstantial self-defense, as though she didn't actually feel pressure from Colin's post to produce any reads. She did go on to express a few reads about a half hour later, but the time of the initial exchange had passed by then.

These posts do not relate directly to sabie, but I furrowed my brow at them and want to take note of them:

@ColinIsCool besides sabie, is there a player you think deserves suspicion right now?

Long Con, maybe? It seems like he's been kind of ... surfacey, when he usually isn't. That's just the first one to come to my mind.

Why are we not voting out the no-show? [VOTE: DRAGOMIR] aubergine

First, I asked him to name a non-sabie suspect and he came up with Long Con for a reason that I don't really buy and which I'm not sure was really applicable to Long Con in this game, or to Long Con's meta. The second post is a vote for the now-confirmed-civ absentee, which is a big bag of meh. Especially given the context of the Day 1 lynch and where Colin was at. He'd previously denounced the BWT wagon and the only other candidate I see him focusing on in his posts is sabie, who he seems to have a negative read on. But then he tosses Dragomir's name into the ring because... Dragomir.

Another post where he singularly focuses on LC as a vote candidate, ignoring his sabie suspicion.

Colin's vote then bounced around for a while, from Jack and then to sprit where I believe he ended Day 1. Sabie is mentioned 0 times in this spree. After the lynch he makes this post:

I am anticipating some remark from somebody or another about how I'm not taking this game seriously enough/putting forth an effort/how I'm lazy so let this serve as a sort of lodestar for anyone trying to read me.

I don't have a lot of time to do ISOs and deep dives and things like that anymore. I'm going to sheep and I'm going to probably only post little posts. I post my thoughts as they come to me. I don't think anything through so what you see is pure unadulterated Colin brain activity, for better or worse.

Yesterday's lynch had no suspect I really felt was a slam dunk. With regards to the sabie case, it was solid, but so were all the other ones where I lynched her and I was wrong. I can't read her.

And I'll admit that I also wanted to keep her around because she doesn't get a chance to play, and that's a shame. If that makes me bad, then go ahead and lynch me for it.

I do not have a problem with Colin's content being lighter than usual. I do have a problem with Colin announcing that sabie is a suspect, even going so far as to singularly justify the act of not voting for her on Day 1 when no other player gets that treatment, while also making zero mention of her during the most pivotal stretch of time during the Day 1 lynch. That looks bad.

Then this:

Okay we’ve got 40some hours here here are the avenues that I think we should be pursuing

Creature
Colin
Sabie
sprityo

As you’ll note I sorted them by the letters their names start with.

To these four — who’s mafia? Give me names.
As far as everyone else goes, out of these four who is the most likely to be town?
I don’t have much time tonight to talk but if anyone has ideas I’ll take em.

To rank that list (worst to best) sabie, Creature, sprityo, Colin. I’m not a huge fan of that list per se.

Outside of that list I don’t think it’s you, Mac, or Long Con. Everyone else is fair game.

sabie looks worse than sprityo. And so does Creature. But sprityo received Colin's Day 1 vote. Not Creature, and certainly not sabie. For reference, Colin's mention of Creature prior to this moment include an early Day 1 town read and a passive, incidental mention of his name.

I’ve been scum with sprityo and he’s a fair amount more calculated. I won’t vote him.

Okay, so if not Sloonei, Sprityo, or Creature who’s your target? Or don’t know yet?

Sabie, Jack or Dragomir.

Sabie I do feel sympathy for but she hasn’t done anything since the lynch to indicate being town to me and while the info we’d get might be bunk because Epi pretty much saved her in some peoples’ eyes it’d be more informative than the other two.

Jack I can pretty easily see as a mafioso letting the town pick each other apart in a low activity game. The only thing he has going for him is the rationale that he would have voted as scum which is not really that much.

Dragomir isn’t here (right?) even though I did see them on yesterday so it’d be a lotto drawing but it would give us some more time to establish lines of inquiry against suspects and we don’t have to deal with that slot come endgame.

I dunno, pretty uninspiring takes all around but my sleuthing ain’t what it used to be.

Since it's been a topic of much confusion this game, this post here is closer to Player Salad than any of the Lists of Reads folks have been making. Colin plops a few easy names down as viable lynch options. He gives reasons for all of them, but the sin of salad (I think) is that it enables a (scum) player to open the door to a number of lynches without fully committing to any one of them. He would drop a vote on Sabie a little while later and be gone for the day. So if he's scum he eventually committed to bussing her. But he also never actually pushed for her lynch. He repeatedly named her as a suspect, but until these final moments he had always kept her away from the threat of being lynched. I see a lot of potential teammate interaction here.

Since that lynch, I've become Colin's preferred target for reasons unclear.
Here is a post where he recommends the up-fucking of Sloon. Here is another where he slants my treatment of sabie as bussing and reassures us all of his seriousness.

I did not bus sabie. Sloonei is an aggressive busser. ColinIsCool has first hand knowledge of this (Ancient Greece). If I was comfortable bussing sabie, my stretegy would not have been to defend her throughout the day. Colin's tinfoil on me is bogus.

I don't think these interactions need to suggest that sabie and colin are both mutants, but I do not struggle to find evidence for that. If I'm going to argue against myself here, I'd say that Colin's participation has not been super heavy, so his light treatment of sabie at crucial moments on Day 1 and early in Day 2 might not be as damning as they appear under the magnifying glass. And it's not like he was alone in being hesitant to lynch sabie (yo). But at the same time, that latter point is a bit of a concern as well; earnest civilians expressed trepidation about lynching sabie, which would enable her partner(s) to follow the same route.

I could vote for Colin.

[Sloonei]

I can vote for Colin so I did.

[birdwithteeth11]

This became boring too soon.

Day 1 creature: I don’t like this too boring
Day 2 creature: I don’t like this it got boring

The night 1 kill reads to me as a very active candidate that the mafia team is trying to eliminate. So the stifling worthwhile discussion route might be in play here?

Interesting idea. Can you elaborate?

I mean, it wouldn't be the first time I've seen a mafia team try to quash discussion as much as possible by killing off the people who are talking/contributing the most. It lets them lead the civvies like lemmings if the civ team isn't super active/engaged through the whole game to an easy baddie victory.

But it was just a hunch and I would need more evidence than just one nightkill to confirm this idea.

What’s your continued thoughts on this with the LC kill? Who do you think would kill Epi and LC?

See: Who I voted for.

[Sloonei]

Creature & Sabie

Wow sabie is such a wise lynch

" "

Town's lack of creativity here is so worrisome

You don't say.

If sabie is the best they can consider, I am right.

" "

As of right now I don't know for sure. I have such a hard time making reads day 1. The exchange between creature and epi was interesting but I thought that about creature and another player before and everyone was like oh that's not weird and they weren't bad so I don't know. Could they be teammates? Maybe but I feel like they wouldn't be that obvious about it.

Ugh, not sure I like this.

Hold the phone!

Well it's close to end of day so I think my biggest suspicion is on Jack.

This is another lack of creativity.

I don't actually hate this. Creature chastised everybody for doing nothing on Day 1. Sabie was not immune to that.

She's listed as a "scum suspect" on Day 2.

Whatever

[VOTE: sabie12] aubergine

Then he votes for her. He remained fully negative on her throughout the day. If this is bussing, he committed fully to it. It is difficult to get a firm read on Creature because he most deals in vague reads. I speculated that sabie's ISO could provide evidence that Creature was the mafia recruit. That could still be the case, but if it is then he pursued a pretty direct plan to bus her Day 2. I don't think that's out of the question; the heat was on her and she was openly struggling to participate. That's a prime bussing candidate right there.

That said, I see less evidence here to vote for Creature than I do for Colin, if we're comparing the two players I've looked at so far.