Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:11 am
Okay... so like... if we have a bigger mafia team, we need more people in the PoE (which is the opposite of what you said). An easy example to see this is that if we had 20 mafia (absurd, but proving), then your PoE is not sufficient. Are you drunker than I am? Because I'm pretty drunk and I feel like you're wrong here but should know more than me about this.
To solve a game with a POE pool, you are required to have the entire mafia team contained in the pool. To determine how big that pool must be, you just follow this formula:
# of mafia alive + # of mischops available before limlo
A bigger mafia team maps to a smaller number of mischops available. Sometimes that just offsets to flat zero, but it depends on the numbers and various mechanical factors. To be safe, one would want to assume the minimal number of mischops available, which results in a smaller value produced by the formula.
A bigger team is harder to solve, and a smaller POE is harder to get right. They go hand in hand.
Sure but the mafia team increasing by exactly one never causes the number of mischops to decrease by two+, so the function is strictly non-decreasing.
"5 mischops + 4 mafia = POE pool of 9. Make it 8 if you want to be even safer for a larger mafia team, or just in case of mechanical nonsense. I'll just roll with 9 for now."
Check your math or correct a typo. I didn't bother to check where you're wrong, but I can promise you unless I am way off, you're wrong on one of the two ends
Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:22 am
Sure but the mafia team increasing by exactly one never causes the number of mischops to decrease by two+, so the function is strictly non-decreasing.
"5 mischops + 4 mafia = POE pool of 9. Make it 8 if you want to be even safer for a larger mafia team, or just in case of mechanical nonsense. I'll just roll with 9 for now."
Check your math or correct a typo. I didn't bother to check where you're wrong, but I can promise you unless I am way off, you're wrong on one of the two ends
I see what you're saying. I think you're right. It's 4:25 AM.
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Sonny wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:16 am
I feel like you both agree yet are saying entirely different things.
Sean: PoE larger with more scum
JJJ: Misyeet options fewer with more scum
YW
The only reasonable vote right now is Owner. Are you up for it?
How exactly is this true? Is it because you tracked her to Jay and there was no kill? Did you consider she might be the doctor? Or the fruit is a vest?
Sonny wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:16 am
I feel like you both agree yet are saying entirely different things.
Sean: PoE larger with more scum
JJJ: Misyeet options fewer with more scum
YW
The only reasonable vote right now is Owner. Are you up for it?
How exactly is this true? Is it because you tracked her to Jay and there was no kill? Did you consider she might be the doctor? Or the fruit is a vest?
Or am I missing something?
Owner claimed fruit vender. You tell me. And I'm the drunk one....
Sonny wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:16 am
I feel like you both agree yet are saying entirely different things.
Sean: PoE larger with more scum
JJJ: Misyeet options fewer with more scum
YW
The only reasonable vote right now is Owner. Are you up for it?
How exactly is this true? Is it because you tracked her to Jay and there was no kill? Did you consider she might be the doctor? Or the fruit is a vest?
Or am I missing something?
Owner claimed fruit vender. You tell me. And I'm the drunk one....
What would you do if put into the situation she was and she was a strong pro town power role?
Sonny wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:16 am
I feel like you both agree yet are saying entirely different things.
Sean: PoE larger with more scum
JJJ: Misyeet options fewer with more scum
YW
The only reasonable vote right now is Owner. Are you up for it?
How exactly is this true? Is it because you tracked her to Jay and there was no kill? Did you consider she might be the doctor? Or the fruit is a vest?
Or am I missing something?
Owner claimed fruit vender. You tell me. And I'm the drunk one....
What would you do if put into the situation she was and she was a strong pro town power role?
Not claim fruit vendor.
Mac, I get it. Your'e town and all, but I am in god mode right now. Just trust me.
Sonny wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:16 am
I feel like you both agree yet are saying entirely different things.
Sean: PoE larger with more scum
JJJ: Misyeet options fewer with more scum
YW
The only reasonable vote right now is Owner. Are you up for it?
How exactly is this true? Is it because you tracked her to Jay and there was no kill? Did you consider she might be the doctor? Or the fruit is a vest?
Or am I missing something?
Sure, but fruit vendor is a verifiable role, if she gave something to someone else they can confirm it and stop her yeet.
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:24 am
I am not sure what to make of you seanzie.
Well, I'm drunk af right now, so you should believe every word I say, and vote Owner.
Can we still fight at some point if you are town?
Yeah, I like to fight. Sometimes about game related things.
While you're here, do you have a read on Kito?
I think it was pretty clear from my earlier spat with him that I am suspicious of his buddying. GTH? Probably town. But I am garbage at reading Kito. Would drink a beer with, but feel out before committing to a second date, ya'know?
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:24 am
I am not sure what to make of you seanzie.
Well, I'm drunk af right now, so you should believe every word I say, and vote Owner.
Can we still fight at some point if you are town?
Yeah, I like to fight. Sometimes about game related things.
While you're here, do you have a read on Kito?
I think it was pretty clear from my earlier spat with him that I am suspicious of his buddying. GTH? Probably town. But I am garbage at reading Kito. Would drink a beer with, but feel out before committing to a second date, ya'know?
What am I saying? I'd put out for Kito, but that doesn't mean he ain't scum!
Kito wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 11:10 pm
relies entirely on them being teamed though, if one of them flipped town I'd have no reason to scum read the other.
Wait what? Why not? If i flipped town you'd have no reason to scum read belzy just for that? What if belzy is actually scum pushing me?
What kind of logic is this?
Gth townread rescinded.
Episode #573 of guillo doesn't actually read the posts he replies to
MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:00 am
@Sonny vote nutella
Lol, sure
[VOTE:
Nutella] aubergine
I actually have a meh read on them anyway, only note is the insta town read on Kito which must have been a joke but yall are dropping so many sincere townreads over air so who the hell knows anymore.
I didn't actually remember kito was the person whose first post I snap townread but they came back and were towny so
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 3:21 pm
@nutella there's a very good chance your dead. Legacy?
made sloonei lm are scum reads
strongest town reads?
Guillo, sonny, belzy, Dana, maybe alison and tangy but with reservations
nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 3:28 pm
Oh kito was p good too
Yawn. Nothing here to talk about of substance. The best I can do is this: nutella snap read Kito as town, then griped at Guillotine for reading Kito town, and then remembered Kito was the one she snap read town. She might have literally forgot about Kito which would be a decent look. Hard to take confidence in that with so little here.
Kito wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 11:10 pm
relies entirely on them being teamed though, if one of them flipped town I'd have no reason to scum read the other.
Wait what? Why not? If i flipped town you'd have no reason to scum read belzy just for that? What if belzy is actually scum pushing me?
What kind of logic is this?
Gth townread rescinded.
Episode #573 of guillo doesn't actually read the posts he replies to
It looks like you are the one who cant read, now i've been scum reading you and pushing you heck! Even deathtunneling you and you didnt react but now you have the time to instigate a fight between me and Kito? If i was a day vig i would shoot you right now.
Instigating?? Lol no one's doing that apart from me
nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 12:03 am
He said if one of you flips town he doesnt have particular reason to scumread the other because he was only talking about an associative read and otherwise had null reads on you
Thought that was pretty clear but you just seem to enjoy twisting things
Kito wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 11:04 pm
oh also potential scum distancing between belzy and guillo. you heard it here first lads
Why do you think that?
Cuz Belzy always distances from her scum buddies, like hardcore tunnelling and voting them from D1 distancing.
Guillo pulled an OMGUS vote out of his ass in response, and came up with reasons for it despite town reading her immediately before.
Then guillo stopped talking about it and they're still voting each other. Kinda like they went, ok cool, my job here is done, distancing secured, peace out. This relies entirely on them being teamed though, if one of them flipped town I'd have no reason to scum read the other
I read it again. Explain it to me like im a five years old (apparently i am)
It's an associative read like nutella said, yeah she could be scum pushing town!you but I have no reason to lean either way, except that I know scum!belzy behaviour and your response was pretty weak/manufactured. therefore if one of you is town you can't be distancing scum and i'm back to square zero
Shrug. Kito was mildly defensive of nutella in response to Guillotine's gripes. Kito kinda looks like the mafia in these exchanges TMIing nutella town.
If I reach hard enough it'd be decent for Kito. Reaching is required.
~~~
Conclusion
This doesn't do anything to make Kito look worse. It might make him look about 3.5% better. I would still feature him somewhere in the broader POE pool if not really in a priority position.
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MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:24 am
I am not sure what to make of you seanzie.
Well, I'm drunk af right now, so you should believe every word I say, and vote Owner.
Can we still fight at some point if you are town?
Yeah, I like to fight. Sometimes about game related things.
While you're here, do you have a read on Kito?
I think it was pretty clear from my earlier spat with him that I am suspicious of his buddying. GTH? Probably town. But I am garbage at reading Kito. Would drink a beer with, but feel out before committing to a second date, ya'know?
Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:22 am
Sure but the mafia team increasing by exactly one never causes the number of mischops to decrease by two+, so the function is strictly non-decreasing.
"5 mischops + 4 mafia = POE pool of 9. Make it 8 if you want to be even safer for a larger mafia team, or just in case of mechanical nonsense. I'll just roll with 9 for now."
Check your math or correct a typo. I didn't bother to check where you're wrong, but I can promise you unless I am way off, you're wrong on one of the two ends
I see what you're saying. I think you're right. It's 4:25 AM.
That's the 4:25 AM tell for the fans.
It's okay. Last game I was wolf and I didn't check your math (you were right, but I made a faulty assumption), and I got the number of townclears wrong and got townread for it (it was nice), but I was just wrong (that didn't feel nice). Are you a wolf and wrong? Probz not, but you should vote Owner.
Sonny wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:16 am
I feel like you both agree yet are saying entirely different things.
Sean: PoE larger with more scum
JJJ: Misyeet options fewer with more scum
YW
The only reasonable vote right now is Owner. Are you up for it?
How exactly is this true? Is it because you tracked her to Jay and there was no kill? Did you consider she might be the doctor? Or the fruit is a vest?
Or am I missing something?
Owner claimed fruit vender. You tell me. And I'm the drunk one....
What would you do if put into the situation she was and she was a strong pro town power role?
Not claim fruit vendor.
Mac, I get it. Your'e town and all, but I am in god mode right now. Just trust me.
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:24 am
I am not sure what to make of you seanzie.
Well, I'm drunk af right now, so you should believe every word I say, and vote Owner.
Can we still fight at some point if you are town?
Yeah, I like to fight. Sometimes about game related things.
While you're here, do you have a read on Kito?
I think it was pretty clear from my earlier spat with him that I am suspicious of his buddying. GTH? Probably town. But I am garbage at reading Kito. Would drink a beer with, but feel out before committing to a second date, ya'know?
Cool, I'll get there than.
To be clear, just in case he asks *blushes* I'm not... not... townreading him, you know?
Sonny wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:28 am[VOTE:
Owner] aubergine
rly tho
If you're a flower vendor, why not say who you visited? Or at least say "no it wasn't Jay"?
She dodged Sean's question, even if it is a fake trap, it's a poor reaction.
Yeah I probs just gonna stop arguing with the drunk guy about the openwolf lol
When you've had as many publications as I have with breakthroughs based off the "golden zone of drunkenness", you stop arguing. Not all ideas are great, but if you sort through the golden ones, you find that all the good ones point to Owner.
Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:39 am
It's okay. Last game I was wolf and I didn't check your math (you were right, but I made a faulty assumption), and I got the number of townclears wrong and got townread for it (it was nice), but I was just wrong (that didn't feel nice). Are you a wolf and wrong? Probz not, but you should vote Owner.
I'm never a wolf, not currently a mafioso, and am often wrong.
Owner is well on her way to vote city, and I endorse that. I want bad bunny to feel my vote on her face when she next arrives.
Best Townie, Maffies 4, 8 and 9 Best Scum, Maffies 3 Best Moderator, Maffies 8 and 9 Most Valuable Player, Maffies 7 and 9 Best Roleplay, Maffies 4 and 6 Spirit Award, Maffies 9 Hall of Fame inductee, Maffies 4
Mafia Universe
Mafia Championship Finalist, 2015 and 2020 Best Town Player, 2020
Sonny wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:42 am
Btw, can a local tell me what Nutella's typical MO is with team interaction?
defense and awkward spew
Thanks. I never quite know what people mean by the word spew in this context but have never bothered to ask, can it be articulated? Like is it "over-focus"?
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Mafia Universe
Mafia Championship Finalist, 2015 and 2020 Best Town Player, 2020
Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:39 am
It's okay. Last game I was wolf and I didn't check your math (you were right, but I made a faulty assumption), and I got the number of townclears wrong and got townread for it (it was nice), but I was just wrong (that didn't feel nice). Are you a wolf and wrong? Probz not, but you should vote Owner.
I'm never a wolf, not currently a mafioso, and am often wrong.
Owner is well on her way to vote city, and I endorse that. I want bad bunny to feel my vote on her face when she next arrives.
Vote city US.... JJJ? As much as I like the image, I feel like your vote is better spent elsewhere if you're serious.
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 4:29 pm
Owner is still a prime suspect. I have no reason off-hand to change that view.
I don't really know what to make of her, I think the most suspect thing she's done is shade various people without really... seeming like solving or anything? I need to see how she's trying to contribute to that, you know. At least, that's what I think offhand.
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 4:19 pm
I'd like to blast into my token interactive analyses. That's going to be challenging with 900 players especially as I am getting quite busy outside this game. Who wants to volunteer to help old man Jay out with some names?
idk what exactly you mean by this but I currently have a 24x24 chart I'm filling out with teaming likelihood colours lmao
I have literally never seen a human do that who isn't me (that exact kind of colored matrix). Please carry on hawkwataine. Please carry on.
Same! Not this game as I'd have to re-write the macro and nested quotes would destroy me (and not by teams), but same.
It is fun that I earlier remarked that if Owner flips scum, Tangy would be a person to look at, and now JJJ and Tangy both want BB. Coincidence? probably. The golden zone only holds so much power, and I feel it fading, but still fun. Either way, super duper strong golden zone read before it is gone, Owner - correct vote.
Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:48 am
Vote city US.... JJJ? As much as I like the image, I feel like your vote is better spent elsewhere if you're serious.
It's a long day phase, drunkzie. There's plenty of time for all kinds of fun votes.
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Mafia Universe
Mafia Championship Finalist, 2015 and 2020 Best Town Player, 2020
Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 4:31 pm
Okay, end of Page 9. Guillo pointed out possible wolves in Nutella/Alison. Guillo also went from simply bear posting to regular posting in a way I kind of like (he wanted to do a gimmick, but then it feels like he just got excited as town and dropped the gimmick). Clearly Nutella was a hit, and I agree about Alison thus far. Mac also kind of pushed in that direction, and Nutella seems to be trying to butter Mac up afterwards (defended Mac at some point, and talked about how good Mac was in spiderverse, blah blah blah), so I am giving Mac a few town points here. Guillo probably also good, but seems to be getting less reactions from Nutella and others. I'd like to see Alison's flip to help sort these two.
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 4:19 pm
I'd like to blast into my token interactive analyses. That's going to be challenging with 900 players especially as I am getting quite busy outside this game. Who wants to volunteer to help old man Jay out with some names?
idk what exactly you mean by this but I currently have a 24x24 chart I'm filling out with teaming likelihood colours lmao
I have literally never seen a human do that who isn't me (that exact kind of colored matrix). Please carry on hawkwataine. Please carry on.
Same! Not this game as I'd have to re-write the macro and nested quotes would destroy me (and not by teams), but same.
I appreciate the fact that your issues with nested quotes are technical in nature. I am also not sure if I am trying to pocket you, or if you are trying to pocket me, based on this fact.
Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:48 am
Vote city US.... JJJ? As much as I like the image, I feel like your vote is better spent elsewhere if you're serious.
It's a long day phase, drunkzie. There's plenty of time for all kinds of fun votes.
Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 4:31 pm
Okay, end of Page 9. Guillo pointed out possible wolves in Nutella/Alison. Guillo also went from simply bear posting to regular posting in a way I kind of like (he wanted to do a gimmick, but then it feels like he just got excited as town and dropped the gimmick). Clearly Nutella was a hit, and I agree about Alison thus far. Mac also kind of pushed in that direction, and Nutella seems to be trying to butter Mac up afterwards (defended Mac at some point, and talked about how good Mac was in spiderverse, blah blah blah), so I am giving Mac a few town points here. Guillo probably also good, but seems to be getting less reactions from Nutella and others. I'd like to see Alison's flip to help sort these two.
What would Alison's flip mean for Guillo and Mac?
At this point? Jack (I didn't intend this, but realized afterwards that I think the bear is called jack? very funny;)) shit in my mind. I have a singular focus. I feel like I am the owner of a whole new idea.
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 4:19 pm
I'd like to blast into my token interactive analyses. That's going to be challenging with 900 players especially as I am getting quite busy outside this game. Who wants to volunteer to help old man Jay out with some names?
idk what exactly you mean by this but I currently have a 24x24 chart I'm filling out with teaming likelihood colours lmao
I have literally never seen a human do that who isn't me (that exact kind of colored matrix). Please carry on hawkwataine. Please carry on.
Same! Not this game as I'd have to re-write the macro and nested quotes would destroy me (and not by teams), but same.
I appreciate the fact that your issues with nested quotes are technical in nature. I am also not sure if I am trying to pocket you, or if you are trying to pocket me, based on this fact.
Lol, it's always about the quality of the data not the appeal of the aesthetic
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Mafia Universe
Mafia Championship Finalist, 2015 and 2020 Best Town Player, 2020
Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 4:31 pm
Okay, end of Page 9. Guillo pointed out possible wolves in Nutella/Alison. Guillo also went from simply bear posting to regular posting in a way I kind of like (he wanted to do a gimmick, but then it feels like he just got excited as town and dropped the gimmick). Clearly Nutella was a hit, and I agree about Alison thus far. Mac also kind of pushed in that direction, and Nutella seems to be trying to butter Mac up afterwards (defended Mac at some point, and talked about how good Mac was in spiderverse, blah blah blah), so I am giving Mac a few town points here. Guillo probably also good, but seems to be getting less reactions from Nutella and others. I'd like to see Alison's flip to help sort these two.
What would Alison's flip mean for Guillo and Mac?
At this point? Jack (I didn't intend this, but realized afterwards that I think the bear is called jack? very funny;)) shit in my mind. I have a singular focus. I feel like I am the owner of a whole new idea.
I suspect this may be the point where I stop making sense of your posts. It's hella fun tho.
Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 4:31 pm
Okay, end of Page 9. Guillo pointed out possible wolves in Nutella/Alison. Guillo also went from simply bear posting to regular posting in a way I kind of like (he wanted to do a gimmick, but then it feels like he just got excited as town and dropped the gimmick). Clearly Nutella was a hit, and I agree about Alison thus far. Mac also kind of pushed in that direction, and Nutella seems to be trying to butter Mac up afterwards (defended Mac at some point, and talked about how good Mac was in spiderverse, blah blah blah), so I am giving Mac a few town points here. Guillo probably also good, but seems to be getting less reactions from Nutella and others. I'd like to see Alison's flip to help sort these two.
What would Alison's flip mean for Guillo and Mac?
At this point? Jack (I didn't intend this, but realized afterwards that I think the bear is called jack? very funny;)) shit in my mind. I have a singular focus. I feel like I am the owner of a whole new idea.
I suspect this may be the point where I stop making sense of your posts. It's hella fun tho.
Oh yes, this clears. My thoughts on page 9 are the end for you;)
Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 4:31 pm
Okay, end of Page 9. Guillo pointed out possible wolves in Nutella/Alison. Guillo also went from simply bear posting to regular posting in a way I kind of like (he wanted to do a gimmick, but then it feels like he just got excited as town and dropped the gimmick). Clearly Nutella was a hit, and I agree about Alison thus far. Mac also kind of pushed in that direction, and Nutella seems to be trying to butter Mac up afterwards (defended Mac at some point, and talked about how good Mac was in spiderverse, blah blah blah), so I am giving Mac a few town points here. Guillo probably also good, but seems to be getting less reactions from Nutella and others. I'd like to see Alison's flip to help sort these two.
What would Alison's flip mean for Guillo and Mac?
At this point? Jack (I didn't intend this, but realized afterwards that I think the bear is called jack? very funny;)) shit in my mind. I have a singular focus. I feel like I am the owner of a whole new idea.
I suspect this may be the point where I stop making sense of your posts. It's hella fun tho.
Was it a serious question, Sonny? Because to me it read like a question to divert my attention. If it it was a serious question, I will give it a bit more seriousness.
[-Mass Effect Mafia banner-]
She might have literally forgot about Kito which would be a decent look. Hard to take confidence in that with so little here.
