Game Over! Monty Python and the Holy Grail

[Canucklehead]

יהוה

which is how God's name is generally spelled Biblically; all of those letters, in Ancient Hebrew (and to a degree modern Hebrew) are representative of vowel sounds (although they can also be consonants...in Hebrew dating back to the time the bible was written (when what we now define as vowels hadn't been invented yet), they were mainly used as vowels.

Oh geez, you don't know what a can of worms you've opened. Rob is a Biblical scholar.

In my own studies of Kaballah, I always understood the tetragrammaton to be composed solely of consonants, with the vowels intentionally left out to make the name unpronounceable. Ancient Hebrew didn't have any written vowels anyway, as the diacritics were only added later.

Rab is a Rabbi....so I think the worm can is open on both sides.

[Canucklehead]

Jinx w/LoRab. Lulz.

[LoRab]

Incidentally (ok, now I'm on a roll), all 3 letters (since the ה is repeated) are still used as representative of vowel sounds. If you're spelling out Modern Hebrew and not using vowels, and even sometimes attached to vowels when fully spelling out words, י is ee; ו is o or oo; and ה is ah.

/hebrewgeek

linki: @K-nuk <3

[a2thezebra]

I'll post in a couple of hours at my collegecaabl that-Fi has usable Wi-FiFi

[S~V~S]

I do that too, sometimes, Enrique. Especially if it is a big, complex quote I don't want to have to reformat for one snippet of text.

Lorab said~ My eye is on Made. For reasons stated. And if there is a lover situation going on, that doesn't negate one of those lovers being bad. I agree with folks that it likely wasn't a civ switch. There are too many reasons that Made could be bad, that to me outweigh the possibility of a potential civ role pairing that could possibly exist in a form that makes both of them civ in a game in which we have no clue what the roles are. #occam

That is also a good point about affiliation. After someone had said earlier that Lovers did not necessarily have to have BTS, I got to thinking about that. I remember one game, I don't recall which (I so wish the Piano & LP were not gone, it is frustrating not being able to look these things up) where the baddie would die if the civ were killed, so they had to protect that civ, although I am pretty sure I have seen the opposite as well. Also, Tyler & The Narrator were modified Lovers of a sort, Tyler needed TN alive to win, so they were paired in that sense. So yeah, BTS is not a requirement, but I don't recall a situation where it was same affiliation lovers where they did NOT have BTS.

[Bullzeye]

I'm in at least three minds about Made today. He has always seemed fairly bad to me, though I've always held off on going after him because of Misfits. On the other hand, Canuck's theory makes perfect sense. Especially when you add in that AP is a strange person to switch the lynch to. Or just to throw a spanner in the works, the crazy wildcard third option proposed by Llama also makes sense:

No one has pointed out that it is possible that Concorde was a lovers role AND that there was a lynch switch. Could just be a coincidence. Or synchronicity.

Furthermore, if this had happened, Made's teammates would be all over it trying to make him look good.

See, now this is the part that bothers me. Do like 4 or 5 civvies have BTS? Becasue it feels like several people are trying, ACTIVELY trying to keep Made from being lynched.

Maybe they're all French, and using the fact that we don't know the roles in their favor?

Why would you specifically say French here?

That's a LoRab post, sorry, I copy and paste into quote tabs.

If you put ="name" after the word quote in the first tag, it fills it in for you as if it were a proper quote. That's how I do it when I chop up people's posts to respond to individual bits.

That is also a good point about affiliation. After someone had said earlier that Lovers did not necessarily have to have BTS, I got to thinking about that. I remember one game, I don't recall which (I so wish the Piano & LP were not gone, it is frustrating not being able to look these things up) where the baddie would die if the civ were killed, so they had to protect that civ, although I am pretty sure I have seen the opposite as well. Also, Tyler & The Narrator were modified Lovers of a sort, Tyler needed TN alive to win, so they were paired in that sense. So yeah, BTS is not a requirement, but I don't recall a situation where it was same affiliation lovers where they did NOT have BTS.

I think I remember a similar thing to what you're recalling here but I'm not sure what game it was. I know I had a similar setup in Supernatural where a civ couldn't die while one of the Angels lived (I think that angel had two lives as well, but superpowered BR burned them both out in one go). Two of my all time favourite games are on TP, and I played really well in both, so yeah I wish it wasn't gone as well. LP too though I sucked back then.

[juliets]

LC I'm still looking for the post that preceded mine regarding Made. I know someone said it because like I said, it was the first post that got me thinking about the whole concept. After I posted Dana posted below that she thinks it's possible Made, since he was good in Misfits and acted crazy, that he is doing the same here as cover. This is the essence of what I said about Made. The only thing I added was that this cover behavior draws attention to him as opposed to his baddie teammates. By the way, as Dana points out if this is his tactic it doesn't seem to be working at this point because there are people like me who didn't play misfits and think he's probably bad in this game or people who did play and see his behavior here for what it is - baddie behavior.

I'm still looking for the other quote but my god there are a lot of posts in this game. I'm doing the best that I can to find it.

Also, I just want to emphasize that I meant this as a possible theory and if I'm reading Dana right she is throwing it out there as just a possibility too. I don't know for sure that I will vote Made today - there is plenty of time and I want to see what develops today.

There's also the fact that this thread is basically a printing press, so I may have missed some important points while constantly catching up. I really didn't catch the suspicion on Juliets and Hedge. Maybe it went over my head but nothing really stood out to me. Enrique also seems different than his normal self but I believe that's just how he plays Mafia since this is the first game I've played with him. Made is acting crazy as usual, but I also feel like it could be a cover since he acted this insane in Misfits too and turned out to be good, so he might be purposely acting the same so that we'd compare it to that game and not suspect him as much. Or maybe not since if that's his plan it's not working at all because it's just bringing more suspicion onto him.

[Marmot]

See, now this is the part that bothers me. Do like 4 or 5 civvies have BTS? Becasue it feels like several people are trying, ACTIVELY trying to keep Made from being lynched.

Maybe they're all French, and using the fact that we don't know the roles in their favor?

Why would you specifically say French here?

The French were essentially the antagonists of the Holy Grail film. I'm being careful with my words, but I hope this explains it.

[Bullzeye]

See, now this is the part that bothers me. Do like 4 or 5 civvies have BTS? Becasue it feels like several people are trying, ACTIVELY trying to keep Made from being lynched.

Maybe they're all French, and using the fact that we don't know the roles in their favor?

Why would you specifically say French here?

The French were essentially the antagonists of the Holy Grail film. I'm being careful with my words, but I hope this explains it.

I know they're in the film and aren't friendly. I just think it's odd you seem to assume they're the/a baddie team (and mention them specifically) when the only known baddie role has no affiliation with them.

[Long Con]

Juliets, thanks for the quote there. Dana's theory lacks something that your theory has, and it's that part that pings me. Her idea is talking about Made on his own - that he's being crazy because he was crazy in Misfits and was a Civvie, so the "cover" is for himself - he can easily have a comparison drawn to his Civvie behaviour in Misfits.

Your theory that he was being crazy to distract attention away from his baddie teammates is what strikes me as suspicious, because it just doesn't make sense to me. His craziness just as effectively draws attention away from every other player in the game as well - unless his baddie teammates were ALREADY under scrutiny, then acting crazy to save them works. But I don't see that as the situation, and I don't think you do either.

So, in essence, your theory seems to me only to be an exercise in suspicion-mongering against Made, trying to get the idea out there that he does indeed have baddie teammates, trying to put into our minds that his playstyle is based on that.

[juliets]

LC see below. This was the thought that got me thinking about made trying to distract from other members on his team. I was wrong about one thing though, this was on the same day that I commented so it was close in time to my comment.

Hey, all.
Just catching up and posting thoughts as I go.

1) I see Made has become the centre of Attention again. I am having a harder and harder time maintaining my earlier belief that he's just a whackadoodle civ. The main reason for this is because if I was on a baddie team with him, I'd be rejoicing because he's so successful at diverting the thread and keeping everyone's eyes just on him that it would allow his team a lot of freedom (and an easy distancing vote, if it came to that). Of course, the diversionary benefits still apply even if Made is a civ, so I'm back to square one. Basically, Made, if you are a civ, it might not be a bad idea to turn down the crazy and turn up the listening. There are an unknown number of baddies to find, and if you are a civ, you are currently distracting a lot of people from doing so.

[Marmot]

See, now this is the part that bothers me. Do like 4 or 5 civvies have BTS? Becasue it feels like several people are trying, ACTIVELY trying to keep Made from being lynched.

Maybe they're all French, and using the fact that we don't know the roles in their favor?

Why would you specifically say French here?

The French were essentially the antagonists of the Holy Grail film. I'm being careful with my words, but I hope this explains it.

I know they're in the film and aren't friendly. I just think it's odd you seem to assume they're the/a baddie team (and mention them specifically) when the only known baddie role has no affiliation with them.

There are 25 players in this game; the parity has to exist somewhere.

And no I'm not assuming that anyone who has BTSC is bad, I'm putting the idea up for discussion.

[Bullzeye]

LC see below. This was the thought that got me thinking about made trying to distract from other members on his team. I was wrong about one thing though, this was on the same day that I commented so it was close in time to my comment.

Hey, all.
Just catching up and posting thoughts as I go.

1) I see Made has become the centre of Attention again. I am having a harder and harder time maintaining my earlier belief that he's just a whackadoodle civ. The main reason for this is because if I was on a baddie team with him, I'd be rejoicing because he's so successful at diverting the thread and keeping everyone's eyes just on him that it would allow his team a lot of freedom (and an easy distancing vote, if it came to that). Of course, the diversionary benefits still apply even if Made is a civ, so I'm back to square one. Basically, Made, if you are a civ, it might not be a bad idea to turn down the crazy and turn up the listening. There are an unknown number of baddies to find, and if you are a civ, you are currently distracting a lot of people from doing so.

LC has a point though. Made acting crazy to distract people from his team only makes sense if his team were already in danger. The whole kerfuffle with him began before anybody else in the game came under any real scrutiny.

I know they're in the film and aren't friendly. I just think it's odd you seem to assume they're the/a baddie team (and mention them specifically) when the only known baddie role has no affiliation with them.

There are 25 players in this game; the parity has to exist somewhere.

And no I'm not assuming that anyone who has BTSC is bad, I'm putting the idea up for discussion.

It just felt strange to me that of all the possibilities you came up with one specific one for a group of people. Nobody else seems to have picked up on it so maybe I'm just crazy but it's something I felt funny about so I brought it up.

[juliets]

LC has a point though. Made acting crazy to distract people from his team only makes sense if his team were already in danger. The whole kerfuffle with him began before anybody else in the game came under any real scrutiny.

Yes Bullz and I think that's a good point. I'm only pointing out that the theory came up before I brought it up yet I was the only one that pinged LC. And note it was just a theory - I would expect any theory to be scrutinized but not me be looked at as bad because I brought up a thought that had been mentioned before.

[Long Con]

Not bad, Juliets, it does indeed seem as though Canuck brought up the idea first. I could say that it's baddieish of you to try and propogate such a notion, but I'm going to give you a break for now, and I will look elsewhere for my suspicions.

[Mister Rearranger]

I'm gonna have to vote soon, since I'll be driving out to Buffalo at 3 and don't wanna miss the lynch.

I don't love how Made immediately dropped his vote on me and took a vow of silence, but the discussion about why AP may have been lynched has given me pause in voting for him. I've never felt totally on board with lynching him in the first place.

[LoRab]

I know they're in the film and aren't friendly. I just think it's odd you seem to assume they're the/a baddie team (and mention them specifically) when the only known baddie role has no affiliation with them.

There are 25 players in this game; the parity has to exist somewhere.

And no I'm not assuming that anyone who has BTSC is bad, I'm putting the idea up for discussion.

It just felt strange to me that of all the possibilities you came up with one specific one for a group of people. Nobody else seems to have picked up on it so maybe I'm just crazy but it's something I felt funny about so I brought it up.

It's not just you. It pinged me, as well. Especially with her (his?) answers since you brought it up.

[Dana]

I'm gonna have to vote soon, since I'll be driving out to Buffalo at 3 and don't wanna miss the lynch.

I'm at school like an hour from Buffalo, yay!

[Long Con]

I'm gonna have to vote soon, since I'll be driving out to Buffalo at 3 and don't wanna miss the lynch.

Poll ends tomorrow.

[Made]

Welp, 20 hours are up, and i see we're still pretty much solely talking about me. Baller, didn't know I had you guys hooked THAT hard. Regardless...
Few things:
1. If there are players in this game that think i'm good, the best way to pursue my alivenessness is to question others and bring theories against them.
2. Read the pinging post against MM, as well as last (irl) night's arguments against Mongoose, I'll reread Mongoose and MM today and see where that leaves me.
3. It took me 2 hours to write my argument against MR. Does it seriously not resonate with anyone???

I still think we should listen to dennis and pursue quieter people. You could probably go to any of the 6 pages of post i've made this thread and find something interesting against me. What about those who weren't so talkative? MM and Mongoose are great starts, but we should continue with other quiet type people.

Gonna limit myself to less than 30 post before lynch in hope of facilitating new theories.

[Bullzeye]

Welp, 20 hours are up, and i see we're still pretty much solely talking about me. Baller, didn't know I had you guys hooked THAT hard. Regardless...
Few things:
1. If there are players in this game that think i'm good, the best way to pursue my alivenessness is to question others and bring theories against them.
2. Read the pinging post against MM, as well as last (irl) night's arguments against Mongoose, I'll reread Mongoose and MM today and see where that leaves me.
3. It took me 2 hours to write my argument against MR. Does it seriously not resonate with anyone???

I still think we should listen to dennis and pursue quieter people. You could probably go to any of the 6 pages of post i've made this thread and find something interesting against me. What about those who weren't so talkative? MM and Mongoose are great starts, but we should continue with other quiet type people.

Gonna limit myself to less than 30 post before lynch in hope of facilitating new theories.

Don't feel you have to limit yourself. You might notice things nobody else has and if you're a civ your input is valuable regardless of how any lynch goes - if you get lynched and revealed as civ we will know that your insights were true and valid. Hopefully that doesn't happen though. I would say your best bet right now is definitely to hunt for baddies as much as you can.

[S~V~S]

All the defending of made going on has really been whirling around in my head. I can't see a baddie team doing that, and it is not quite overt enough for civvie BTS (and too many people imo).

So, my theory is also about a role possibility. And the thing that kept popping into my head was DharmaHelper in the first recruitment game being a seemer role. He came up as a mystery civvie role; in that game, not all roles were revealed immediately. So a role no one ever heard of was a possibility. And it allowed the baddie team to claim a role that no one else had, so no one could dispute it. It also got his teammates tons of cred, as I recall it, although I could have that wrong.

That kind of thing would work really well in this game if there was a Seemer role. Knowing Roxy and the joy she takes in messing with the minds of her players, I could totally see her putting a seemer in a game with unknown roles. Wild speculation, or a possibility? If we lynch him, and he comes up civ, he could really BE civ, thats the drawback here, there is no way to prove it unless he flips bad, until games end. The other possibility is that there is only one baddie team (my thought is that if you are on a baddie team of 5 or 6, it is a safe bet that there is only one bad team; if a team of three, there is likely another) and Made is civ, and they are using him and his notoriety for cred. I am less likely to believe this one, though, since he has said a few BTS-ish things.

I just can't get his support group out of my mind.

[S~V~S]

I don't think I will be voting for Made today~ I think I am going to reread the people I think of as his supporters, and perhaps vote for one of them.

[Enrique]

To be honest, SVS, for your theory to be correct the baddies would have to be putting WAY too much into this while also being a little too powerful. They would've had to known AP's role with anticipation, switched the lynch to him, Made must have had a Seemer role, let's add in their kill, and saying there's 5-6 of them (all working to save Made every single day).

I find Bea's theory A LOT more likely than this. In fact, I'm pretty confident in it. I haven't watched the movie, but a Google search told me everything I needed to know to figure out what was happening. Do I need to bring up the secret in Concorde's role again? It just seems too obvious. If you don't buy it, that's fine, but unless things change drastically, I know I'm not voting for Made again.

linki: fair enough

[S~V~S]

This would have nothing to do with APs role; I am talking about a pattern of support the entire game. I think they definitely would like to capitalize on the possibilities of APs role. The BeaNuck theory is very possible. With manips it is also possible that Made was not the person lynched; he did not act like someone about to die.

But the seemer thing would work regardless of the AP lynch. You are overcomplicating this a bit, IMO.

[juliets]

I don't think I will be voting for Made today~ I think I am going to reread the people I think of as his supporters, and perhaps vote for one of them.

S~V~S, who do you think of as his supporters?

[Made]

I don't think I will be voting for Made today~ I think I am going to reread the people I think of as his supporters, and perhaps vote for one of them.

S~V~S, who do you think of as his supporters?

Interjection, permission to make this list myself?

[S~V~S]

I don't think I will be voting for Made today~ I think I am going to reread the people I think of as his supporters, and perhaps vote for one of them.

S~V~S, who do you think of as his supporters?

Interjection, permission to make this list myself?

Of course you can Do you think they may be glomming on to you for cred? I wonder if your list matches mine. I want to hear what you say first.

[Made]

Also just caught this

Made is civ, and they are using him and his notoriety for cred. I am less likely to believe this one, though, since he has said a few BTS-ish things.

I just can't get his support group out of my mind.

If you're referring to my "And Canuck will moderate " comment, I was just trying to bring her into the public eye along with everyone else on my list. I still don't understand her angle, nor what bea was getting at, but the idea of a seemer even existing makes me anxious. I also don't have BTSC so there's that.

As for my current theory, I think two mafia teams exist. both want the cred of saying they knew i was civvie all along, but both also want me dead/the center of attention.

The reason I say two is because it would explain the amount of people vouching for me. Both teams wanna cash in on my ass, but neither wants to be the one who lynched me.

linki- posting list after this!

[thellama73]

I don't think I will be voting for Made today~ I think I am going to reread the people I think of as his supporters, and perhaps vote for one of them.

S~V~S, who do you think of as his supporters?

Interjection, permission to make this list myself?

Of course you can Do you think they may be glomming on to you for cred? I wonder if your list matches mine. I want to hear what you say first.

Am I on the list?

[Mister Rearranger]

A: I though this was ending today.

B: Hmm.

[Made]

Organized by how much they wanted the booty
1. Canuck
2. Enrique (tho he's trying to separate himself from me might warrant him lower on the list)
3. Bea
4. Bullz
4. reywaS
5. BWT (Barely made the list, his lack of aggression towards me makes me think he think favorably of me, but could be me misinterpreting his caution of put me on the defensive.)

Night 2 is when most of my reinforcements arrived. Fucking fair weather friends...
I don't think i'm forgetting anyone, but iunno.

[S~V~S]

I don't think I will be voting for Made today~ I think I am going to reread the people I think of as his supporters, and perhaps vote for one of them.

S~V~S, who do you think of as his supporters?

Interjection, permission to make this list myself?

Of course you can Do you think they may be glomming on to you for cred? I wonder if your list matches mine. I want to hear what you say first.

Am I on the list?

i can't recall a list I have made recently that did not have Llama on it

In honesty, you are always on my list. I cannot ever understand how you think, and I think the feeling is mootual. The unknown is scary. So I always look for ways to cast you as Snidely Whiplash; that is my failing, not yours.

[thellama73]

i can't recall a list I have made recently that did not have Llama on it

In honesty, you are always on my list. I cannot ever understand how you think, and I think the feeling is mootual. The unknown is scary. So I always look for ways to cast you as Snidely Whiplash; that is my failing, not yours.

I find that very flattering. Thank you.

[nijuukyugou]

I hate to say it, but I am now very confused Perhaps I haven't been mafia'ing long enough to know all of the different types of roles people are discussing? Or I'm not good at reading theories that can't be fully explained? Gahhhhh!

I'll just say what I do "understand" or feel. I'm still wondering about the lynch and (what I believe is) the possibility of a lynch switch, and the results still make me suspicious of Made. I'm also still suspicious of these sudden supporters who were so gung-ho about voting him last time and were ready to vote him again, and now they're turning away? I feel like I'm missing something. I probably am missing something. My instinct is to go for what I see as the simplest route (i.e., assume a baddie lynch switch), unless I actually see a theory/speculation I can fully understand. (And I totally get that the rules don't allow people to get their thoughts out as clearly as they'd like, so I'm sure it's just as frustrating for y'all as it might be for me and others.)

(Side note: if my tone comes across as sarcastic, that is absolutely not what I'm going for - I am actually utterly confused by today's thread posts and theories, but I did want to contribute thoughts regardless in hopes that maybe some light could be shed )

Also I am enjoying the Hebrew/history lessons! I do love languages and Biblical/Torah fun

[thellama73]

I like your sarcastic tone, Blooper, for what that's worth.

[juliets]

Organized by how much they wanted the booty
1. Canuck
2. Enrique (tho he's trying to separate himself from me might warrant him lower on the list)
3. Bea
4. Bullz
4. reywaS
5. BWT (Barely made the list, his lack of aggression towards me makes me think he think favorably of me, but could be me misinterpreting his caution of put me on the defensive.)

Night 2 is when most of my reinforcements arrived. Fucking fair weather friends...
I don't think i'm forgetting anyone, but iunno.

Thanks made! Now I would also love to see SVS's list to see if there is a match.

[nijuukyugou]

I like your sarcastic tone, Blooper, for what that's worth.

Apparently my students do, too. I think they might think I'm joking

I think it might be the only way I can vent without getting in trouble...

[S~V~S]

I don't have BWT or Bullz on my list, but Mades list gives me a good starting point on my read. We agree in some points.

Juliets, I have seen you defending more than aggressing (is that even a word?). In general you are not a very aggressive player~ but who is on your list? If Made were off the poll, who would you consider voting for?

[Enrique]

Organized by how much they wanted the booty
1. Canuck
2. Enrique (tho he's trying to separate himself from me might warrant him lower on the list)
3. Bea
4. Bullz
4. reywaS
5. BWT (Barely made the list, his lack of aggression towards me makes me think he think favorably of me, but could be me misinterpreting his caution of put me on the defensive.)

Night 2 is when most of my reinforcements arrived. Fucking fair weather friends...
I don't think i'm forgetting anyone, but iunno.

Players are allowed to change their minds. In light of AP's lynch and the surrounding theories, I trust you.

@ Blooper - Look at AP's role, then look at that role in the context of the movie. Maybe you'll see what we're getting at.

[Made]

Organized by how much they wanted the booty
1. Canuck
2. Enrique (tho he's trying to separate himself from me might warrant him lower on the list)
3. Bea
4. Bullz
4. reywaS
5. BWT (Barely made the list, his lack of aggression towards me makes me think he think favorably of me, but could be me misinterpreting his caution of put me on the defensive.)

Night 2 is when most of my reinforcements arrived. Fucking fair weather friends...
I don't think i'm forgetting anyone, but iunno.

Players are allowed to change their minds. In light of AP's lynch and the surrounding theories, I trust you.

@ Blooper - Look at AP's role, then look at that role in the context of the movie. Maybe you'll see what we're getting at.

Also, I haven't seen the movie, which probably explains why this theory hasn't clicked for me yet.

[thellama73]

Doesn't the fact that Made professes not to understand the theory somewhat undermine the theory?

[Enrique]

Not really? It doesn't have to be a part of his role, just AP's. Like Canuck, I'm not suggesting they had BTSC.

[S~V~S]

I hate to say it, but I am now very confused Perhaps I haven't been mafia'ing long enough to know all of the different types of roles people are discussing? Or I'm not good at reading theories that can't be fully explained? Gahhhhh!

I'll just say what I do "understand" or feel. I'm still wondering about the lynch and (what I believe is) the possibility of a lynch switch, and the results still make me suspicious of Made. I'm also still suspicious of these sudden supporters who were so gung-ho about voting him last time and were ready to vote him again, and now they're turning away? I feel like I'm missing something. I probably am missing something. My instinct is to go for what I see as the simplest route (i.e., assume a baddie lynch switch), unless I actually see a theory/speculation I can fully understand. (And I totally get that the rules don't allow people to get their thoughts out as clearly as they'd like, so I'm sure it's just as frustrating for y'all as it might be for me and others.)

(Side note: if my tone comes across as sarcastic, that is absolutely not what I'm going for - I am actually utterly confused by today's thread posts and theories, but I did want to contribute thoughts regardless in hopes that maybe some light could be shed )

Also I am enjoying the Hebrew/history lessons! I do love languages and Biblical/Torah fun

The conjecture is that perhaps AP & Made were the Lovers~ Lovers roles have a connection. The commonest one is if one of them is targeted/lynched, the other dies, and in this game Concordes character would work pretty well for that.

I totally agree re simplest answer, aka Occams razor. I think a lynch switch is most likely, and AP coming up as he did was a giant coup fourre. But with no roles, it is mostly/all conjecture. The BeaNuk theory, my theory about Seemers (a baddie role that shows up as civ when killed), total conjecture.

You have to find the conjecture that works best for you

[nijuukyugou]

Thank you for clearing that up! That does help. I'm still inclined towards the simpler reasoning at this point, but the lover's role is certainly something to ponder.

[S~V~S]

Thank you for clearing that up! That does help. I'm still inclined towards the simpler reasoning at this point, but the lover's role is certainly something to ponder.

Yeah, sometimes those of us who have been playing for a long time can forget that the jargon and the terminology we use can be unfamiliar to newer players. The number of possible roles is staggering; and hosts are always thinking of new twists.

[LoRab]

I also thought of the possibility of a seemer role. I had the first seemer role, so it always goes through my mind. But I'm not seeing how it's the case here. I'm also confused. You're speculating that Made might be a seemer-type role and baddie teammates switched the lynch and are possibly setting up for what role they've chosen? And would that have just meant they got lucky with who they chose for the lynch?

[Made]

Before i forget, People keep saying "i'm a bit dense" Is that a reference to something, or just an expression I'd hadn't heard previous.

[juliets]

S~V~S, I am better able to do this backwards, i.e., tell you who I'm not suspecting at the moment:

canuck
dana
hedgeowl
long con
lorab
daisy
SVS
llama

so that leaves:
bea
boogs
bullz
metalmarsh
mr rearranger
mongoose
blooper
reywas

Of those, the ones that I would take a closer look at first are:
boogs
MM
mongoose
reywas

Boogs i have had a pingy feeling about but want to review his most recent posts. MM, made laid out a case on him and was surprised that he got no reaction from the rest of us. I need to re-read him and then re-read made's case because it did not make an impression on me. Mongoose because canuck had a strong feeling about her and I just haven't had time to re-read and think closely about her yet and reywas I was pinged by something early but I can't remember what so that calls for a re-read. If made were off the board these would be the people I looked at most closely unlesssomeone comes forward with something meaty about someone else.

[juliets]

Made, I don't think anyone has asked you this straight out: do you know what happened in the lynch that resulted in you being saved? This is a yes or no question as I'm sure it would break the rules for you to expound on it.