Mafia Misplay Mafia

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Speaking of cops I'm sitting on the side of the road with one right now lol

"You were speeding"

"Thought the speed limit was 45"

"It is right after Dakota station."

I was... literally... maybe 500 yards behind the limit increase lol

[Porscha]

santy's performance is better than mac's if we are talking abt that

Yea but he's back to pushing a misread on Esooa eod so idk.

well i guess we clash here because i dont particularly find esooa towny or their eod towny so i vibe with their read more

wait why? her eod was super towny or at least convincing af and she has hit a ton of her town notes

Talk to me about them?

u read it all recently i believe but shes just been playing a pretty consistent game poking at people and trying to find scum

i suppose it's just how you think esooa is scum like do you think she's just playing an amazing scum game or do you think she's like actually done something scummy? as i see it if she's scum she's emulating her recent town games perfectly and playing a super tight game where she finds a weak HK post to start picking apart and then tunnels at him for the rest of the day and makes eod extra convincing cuz it was obvious ender was gonna flip over HK

@Porscha this feels like the post your epic esooa/lily/santy team goes to die tbh

yeah i've mostly read their interactions as just teaming so this doesn't really put me off my suspicion. thanks for the point out tho

[Porscha]

like esooa and lily have been hard shielding each other for a good portion of the game at this point so lily defending esooa yet again doesn't hold much sway in convincing me of anything different

[Porscha]

honestly a good portion of why I am leaving lily and esooa in my poe is exactly because of how they have interacted with each other, which is strong TR's for a long time. I am more suspicious because I don't particularly trust lily. it's possible it is not w/w, solid chance it's v/w w/v, but I don't think it's v/v.

[Porscha]

honestly a good portion of why I am leaving lily and esooa in my poe is exactly because of how they have interacted with each other, which is strong TR's for a long time. I am more suspicious because I don't particularly trust lily. it's possible it is w/w, solid chance it's v/w w/v, but I don't think it's v/v.

ebwop

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Speaking of cops I'm sitting on the side of the road with one right now lol

"You were speeding"

"Thought the speed limit was 45"

"It is right after Dakota station."

I was... literally... maybe 500 yards behind the limit increase lol

He dropped my phone when I gave it to him Fit my insurance.

Anyways I go catch up now

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

honestly a good portion of why I am leaving lily and esooa in my poe is exactly because of how they have interacted with each other, which is strong TR's for a long time. I am more suspicious because I don't particularly trust lily. it's possible it is not w/w, solid chance it's v/w w/v, but I don't think it's v/v.

Out of the two of them I am much more wary of Lily than Esooa. I think it's possible Santy and Lily are teamed but that has a lot to do with their treatment of me, I saw which is ultimately probably stupid.

[Porscha]

honestly a good portion of why I am leaving lily and esooa in my poe is exactly because of how they have interacted with each other, which is strong TR's for a long time. I am more suspicious because I don't particularly trust lily. it's possible it is not w/w, solid chance it's v/w w/v, but I don't think it's v/v.

Out of the two of them I am much more wary of Lily than Esooa. I think it's possible Santy and Lily are teamed but that has a lot to do with their treatment of me, I saw which is ultimately probably stupid.

I agree that between esooa and lily that I am more wary of lily

[risiinq-]

im back!! will TRY to catchup on like everything i miss because my ego demands ok reads and ok reads take reading the whole game and i WILL have time today

*looks at the mere 300 i missed just leaving for a few hours*

ohno.

[Esooa]

risiinq posting before I go to sleep and I realize I've read nothing from her at all today I think so I ISO'd her

It's like fine honestly there's nothing I care that much about, her post where Sabi told her about some previous town game and Risiinq was saying she should read it in depth later seemed a little odd just cause I'm p sure Risiinq has played with me enough to at least contribute to that more

The rest of it is basically just I think their scope is maybe towny but idk, I know they did the bus stuff and decided to change up at least some things from last time I saw them wolf so I'd need to recheck that game how many different players they talked about, but regardless of how many it was their ISO this game seemed fine so yeah that's basically all I have on them

Oh, I guess OW died town reading them decently strongly so that counts for a bit

[Esooa]

btw @Achromatic I read a bit of your ISO, not all of course, but I saw you talk a lot about why HK is town from the NK which I agree with but then who do you think as a wolf makes that NK?

[Esooa]

honestly a good portion of why I am leaving lily and esooa in my poe is exactly because of how they have interacted with each other, which is strong TR's for a long time. I am more suspicious because I don't particularly trust lily. it's possible it is not w/w, solid chance it's v/w w/v, but I don't think it's v/v.

I really haven't seen anything from you explaining what you don't like from Lily other than "a few posts sound icky" which I mean, I don't agree, so like

[MacDougall]

im back!! will TRY to catchup on like everything i miss because my ego demands ok reads and ok reads take reading the whole game and i WILL have time today

*looks at the mere 300 i missed just leaving for a few hours*

ohno.

I had a big sook the end

[risiinq-]

why mac voting santy

i confused.

[MacDougall]

Why not? he's voting me and I'm 2nd top wagon. I don't have a green check on him and everyone seems to suspect him.

[Achromatic]

Let's play the "Can Mac and Santy be paired" game, with your host Achromatic.

Spoiler: show

I think stuff like having the secret read and the boats thingy I see more as your performative kind of playstyle (As in, I see some people sus you for things I dont see really as AI for you), and when I realtimed with you , catched up could vibe with your posts. Tho I skipped the long ones for sure lol

Can you vibe yourself off one of my stronger town reads perhaps?

Ehhh yeah, I should find a slot that I feel more sus about. But wolfhunting energy kinda low for me rn

Just sheep me on Mac then. Can't really hurt to see how he reacts to a wagon and you town read me so you believe it comes from good faith tbh.

Let's goo

By those metrics I am town reading Neon and Lily and they are in yout wagon wowee

I am town reading them too.

People make mistakes.

Any reason you are against Mac? Iirc he isn't in your town core.

I am not townreading them nah, probs want to evaluate and do a vote that feels good by this point.
Why do you sus mac?

Oh yeh I remembee reading that post and vibing with the expecting them to dig more of you tbh, which is probably the only thing I can see as valid.
The math/wagon thingy it was okay to me, like you say predatory vut its also good to maybe force some eraly reads in votes movement. And the interaction with sabi could be???? But its also a big stretch imo so weh

Oh yeh I remembee reading that post and vibing with the expecting them to dig more of you tbh, which is probably the only thing I can see as valid.
The math/wagon thingy it was okay to me, like you say predatory vut its also good to maybe force some eraly reads in votes movement. And the interaction with sabi could be???? But its also a big stretch imo so weh

Well day 1 I rarely expect to find a silver bullet.

It's also combined that I have 9 town reads and mac isn't one of them.

At some point you collect enough town reads and put pressure on someone not them imo.

Note at the time this was Santy's list of town friends:

Santygrass / Lilypetal / ender / Achro / Porscha / Neon / Sabi / Nanook

So half the game, but even so he passes on voting Mac early for kind of mystery reasons really.

I dont think mac lacked solving fot the amount of posts that he had in the game tbh. But maybe lacking the wolf hunting and absolute murdering energy that I see from Town Mac maybe

Lots of maybes.

Santy or Ender
Esooa
Achro

Currently where I'm at.

Watch them all be villa.

Also, hoping all goes well Sabi take your time! *Sends payers to cat*

This gives me pause.

i unironically think achro/mac is a difference check for no reason whatsoever and its making my head hurt

The only world I see Mac w is in is if achro is w.

Just because I have seen achro do the same things as wolf before to a partner.

hmm yeah, i was considering a w/w possibility too but i dont think this immediately means a mac w achro v possibility doesnt exist

i kinda feel like there /is/ one wolf in there though.

it's hard to explain tho, ill see how it pans out

Ehh I could see them both as V imo
In order of likelihood prob a at this rn

V!Achro / W!Mac = V!Achro / V! Mac > W!Achro / V!Mac > W!Achro / W!Mac .

Very deep analysis

Notes W!Mac is equal to V!Mac equity here.

@Esooa could you convince me in to why is Mac scum?

Asks for help awhile later.

Towny people : Ris, sabi, porscha , lily
Towny but with less confidence: hk, achro, mac, outed wolf

Think this list feels good rn

Hm. What happened to having W!Mac being equally likely to V!Mac. When did that read change, I ctrl f'd for Mac and didn't see anything, oh bother let me actually read every post.

Could you scumcase Esooa for me Mac? Without bringing the votes thingy cuz thats boring

no

Then not much I can do /shrug.
OW last posts were fine too nyeh. Still need to find a sr that feels good, the lack of scumhunting is something Im aware of but like, dont feel like forcing it? If Im not scumreading anyone at the moment dont going to make my reads worse for the sake of it.

And if you lynch me because of the lack of sr oh well Skill Issue. Is mostly my stance in the game prob

In between that post he seemingly just accepts a straight 'no' from Mac and instead of pressing someone who he has as a tossup read, he bemoans that he can't help with the Esooa scum case and just drops it.

[VOTE: Esooa] aubergine

Nyeh

Feels a little more like a pocket of Mac than partnered.

Esooa discredited both the trs of ris and ow alltogether. And like, I can get why they couldnt agree with the read on OW, but ris townyness in that read was very good iml

it's not that deep, come up with something better

It makes me lean you as wolf atm, so /shrug.

Esooa discredited both the trs of ris and ow alltogether. And like, I can get why they couldnt agree with the read on OW, but ris townyness in that read was very good iml

I don't think someone expressing a difference of opinion is inherently wolfy though. Like; ow is just correct to discredit lol.

Ehh, sabi also expressed a different opinion on the ris read. But like, not recognizing that it shows a towny attention to detail and process from ris is what pings me idk

God this is such a bad reason to vote Esooa lol.

I guess the logical thread for Mac here is if Santy was pre-flipping Esooa then Mac would look better for pressuring Esooa and so he put him in lean v.

i have no current problem with visor tbh and i think choosing ender over hk is kinda logical anyways

I have seen nothing disagreeable from Visor and he's far and away my top town.

From someone who normally tunnels me D1 unless I push someone hard this is surprising.

You have pushed outside of consensus towards the same people i have which makes me think you are reading the game from a similar perspective. As the kids say "soul sex".

I think I disagree with this read but can see why Mac thinks this and its towny indicative from Mac to me

Feels more like a pocket than a partner

Mac not seeing sabi obvtowning is pinging me too. So I could prob see them as wolf tbfh.

But he reverses on this pretty fast:

I feel like trusting with my life now in Ris, Porscha, nook and Lily. Prob in that order.

I thought that maybe ow kill was one to maintain status quo in thread, but just glossing at player list wilgs was there and feels like far more juicier then Outed Wolf there to kill so eeeeeh Im still lost on why ow could die.

I see the mac case and like yeah, could be. But also it isnt like, too much level 0 as a take? Mac isn the only scum so there should be two other people who would agree with that and why???

Then later

Also I lost a quote from Achro talking about how ow was townreading Hk and we should follow that legacy or something and I hate it. But I hate more the fact that it is probably right so going to try to think of a V!hk world too wowee. Thats why Im kinda going with Esooa first weh

He is using my world building to build his own world

Town: Lily, nanook, riisinq,Porscha
Achro, Sabi, hollowkatt, MacDougall

Sussy: Esooa, Neon, Jack

Rn Im not going to look for a prev list. But Tbh I expect to be wrong in 1 tr for sure, but thinking in probs finding who after I got a wolf flipped. I am reassessing tho, cuz My read on Essooa EoD was kinda bad, but rereading there I cant get over just the contrast difference in how they read ris and neon ig.
And maybe the analysis is wrong and maybe mac is right and hk is a hit. Or Mac is a hit. Idk. Feeling comfy voting for neon rn

Gnn

Yeah so the thing I can't help but notice is this list doesn't match up with Santy's words very well. By all rights with how much he has praised me at various points up until this point I should be a tier up, he even uses my world building in his own world. Also he said that Mac doubting Sabi's obv towniness pinged him but then Sabi is in the second tier of town reads. Santy says they would reassess but they never really did.

Answer: Yes they can be, but if Santy is a wolf I wouldn't immediately turbo Mac based off of how Santy treated them. I would need to delve more into Santy's ISO and rip it apart. Lily being wolf with Santy would be some VERY BOLD partnering from them tbh, but I guess possible and not as bold as some other teams being thrown around today.

Also this iso kind of proves my thought that not signaling votes is super anti-town lol. It's fine moment to moment but since we don't have vote counts it is incredibly hard to follow vote movements in hindsight.

[VOTE: santygrass] aubergine

@Achromatic what was towny from lily's ISO you saw

I just liked her day around HK and the pettiness there tbh. It's nothing earth shattering I just thought "this is probably v" in its aimlessness.

btw @Achromatic I read a bit of your ISO, not all of course, but I saw you talk a lot about why HK is town from the NK which I agree with but then who do you think as a wolf makes that NK?

I feel like my scum leans/pursuits today should make this pretty obvious. If I didn't think, say, Santy or Mac could be involved in that kill I wouldn't have been pushing them. Anyway to be a bit more generic I think it is a wolf who is interested in the longterm viability of HK going over, not just today in theory. OW I think would have made a PROBLEM out of that starting today and it's better to have problems go away.

If Santy flips V I will find his sudden glaring at Lily to be of interest because it might just be right lol. He has shielded Lily a lot but when Lily hedges on him he's like "hold up" so that's noted.

If Santy/Mac doesn't have at least one wolf I think we are starting to be in a little bit of trouble, but hopefully we'd be able to re-evaluate correctly.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Also Mac, you understand that Im sussing you because your worldview of the game seems to waver ? Like some of th post you did also doesnt add up with how you put me in your W!hk cat in the same tier as JACK. And Esoos in Lean Wolf for that matter.

Its like, too big of a flaw for me to ignore

*sniff sniff*

Smells like lying-musk.

[risiinq-]

signaling that i just voted mac

[Jackofhearts2005]

Tbh it's kinda hard to continue to want to receive punishment for multiple irl days

[Sabiplz]

Gm I'm sick lol

[Jackofhearts2005]

Gm I'm sick lol

Not as sick as you'd be if I had linked to r/skavenslaves during all that talk about degradation kinks.

[santygrass]

Votecount asofrn

Santygrass (7) - Jack, hk, Sabi, Achro, Mac, Neon, Porscha
MacDougall (4) - Esooa,Drwilgs,riisinq-,Santygrass
Hollowkatt (2) - Nanook, Lilypetal

[risiinq-]

i was wondering why ahcro expressed intent to change to santy but did not. guess he was just late

[risiinq-]

ugh, will hang santy if we hang mac tmr

[Sabiplz]

Gm I'm sick lol

Not as sick as you'd be if I had linked to r/skavenslaves during all that talk about degradation kinks.

go on about this

[Jackofhearts2005]

Gm I'm sick lol

Not as sick as you'd be if I had linked to r/skavenslaves during all that talk about degradation kinks.

go on about this

[Achromatic]

What in the fuck.

[Sabiplz]

I.. Have many questions

[Achromatic]

Just don't type them one handed.

[Sabiplz]

What

I

What

Fjdbdkls

[santygrass]

In that scenario if I was mafia with HK I would have started the day like:

Okay we just chop HK see you in 2 days.
Then after a while when I see Mac wagoned and HK not being wagoned I find a way to put my vote elsewhere pretty fast, I probably have a hair trigger for putting it back on him though.

Thinking emoji

decided to look at that other game just cause I felt like it and I feel like if someone else did this during EoD I would hate them but I love them cause I did it

Spoiler: show

This is based btw

Santy's Esooa read is, in fact, my biggest 'hrm" there so far. Because it is such a bad exposure issue for a wolf that it maybe starts to look like town.

I feel as if wolf Santy might just give up the Esooa angle there unless they are exactly partnered, but then someone is going to need to talk me through Esooa and why they think she is a wolf.

I need to look over Lily again though.

Think you are ignoring the fact That I voted Esooa in D1 before EoD ? And when I run through their EoD agreed but your point but also singnalized my trouble of how I felt they tr Neon much more easy while not feeling the same when ris had such townier moments? Idk is Neon a super polarized player and I dont know it?
And like, from my PoV with townreads I have and stuff, if hk is town, Esooa push there doesnt look so good, so its like, def could be maf in that scenario. Unless you think that D1 Mafia achieved two T/T wagons just letting town form them. Votecount being so close makes me think not/? .

I think tha if BOTH mac and hk are town, Esooa is kinda ehhhh almost impossible to be town? Same thing I think with if Esooa and Hk are town, then pew pew Mac . And hence why my PoE .

Tho tbh I dont really know how much is consistent worldbuilding that took me there to that conclussion and how much is gut feeling tha something is not right there/?

Like, my problem with HK being a wolf is it suggests very certain things that you DO imo need to at least theorize correctly that could be possible before I think it is right in my own head.

Like HK wolf with OW, his biggest defender, dying means there is some sort of plan here. It by definition must exist. OW was a 40 posting person with a few scum reads and a defense of HK. It means something. In HK wolf worlds it means a big something. Everyone is trying to push that to the side at times and like, it shouldn't be?

Scum HK's team needs an exact plan and so far I've seen scum lily with HK which is... really going for it in terms of assuming plays from the wolf team and Sabi who is all but socially cleared or people who voted HK day 1 which feels unlikely given how weak of a position ender had.

My mind is open, but also my mind still needs to be changed despite it being open. My suspicion of Santy is mostly sponge at this point and so far Santy hasn't done a lot of good with his rope despite the leeway he has ben given. Neither has Mac.

Town can have bad games and I am giving them every effort to make it up but their core, fundamental solving conclusions don't make any sense to me.

You think I had a rope leeway wowee. Think I've been lead wagon since start of day probs, me being townier and try to solve players my way is being scumread anyways, so yeh tha rope you talk about kinda bad I feel is like

[santygrass]

ugh, will hang santy if we hang mac tmr

Siganl boost this

[santygrass]

Also signal boosting jack not trying to solve me in the slightlest zzzzz. I dont care about the gimmicking, just note that their post were full in bad faith

[Sabiplz]

Thank you santy for getting back to talking about the game

[santygrass]

Also Mac, you understand that Im sussing you because your worldview of the game seems to waver ? Like some of th post you did also doesnt add up with how you put me in your W!hk cat in the same tier as JACK. And Esoos in Lean Wolf for that matter.

Its like, too big of a flaw for me to ignore

*sniff sniff*

Smells like lying-musk.

Like, what even is wrong in that post ¿?¿?¿?¿?

[santygrass]

Thank you santy for getting back to talking about the game

Better to ignore some posts... Yeah

[santygrass]

Also Mac, you understand that Im sussing you because your worldview of the game seems to waver ? Like some of th post you did also doesnt add up with how you put me in your W!hk cat in the same tier as JACK. And Esoos in Lean Wolf for that matter.

Its like, too big of a flaw for me to ignore

*sniff sniff*

Smells like lying-musk.

Like, what even is wrong in that post ¿?¿?¿?¿?

And it was one post from some pages ago, meaning that they had to search for it even.

[hollowkatt]

I think hk is significantly higher chance to flip red

Not in my worldview.

I don't think w!HK acts all deflated and meek like this. He wanted to die yesterday. This seems like a town player that knows he was anti town and wants to receive punishment.

I don't see a wolves motivation to this.

Tbh it's kinda hard to continue to want to receive punishment for multiple irl days

Lol

Tbh it's kinda hard to continue to want to receive punishment for multiple irl days

Unless HK has some weird degradation kink, I don't get why he would willingly do this as wolf.

Not saying degradation kinks are weird.

I am literally in real life dying of laughter so thank you this is a great way to wake up

[risiinq-]

just kidding id still rather prefer just not hanging santy yaknow

[Achromatic]

Well I've given you rope I don't know about anyone else.

[santygrass]

@Jackofhearts2005 show tha you are a Smart Skaven and can be the leader here.
What is your list of reads, who do you think is paired with me?

How would you view change if you had a copcheck of me being town?

[Achromatic]

Switching back to Mac to see what happens.

[risiinq-]

nothing happened, santy is still in the lead

[santygrass]

Well I've given you rope I don't know about anyone else.

What do you think? Just to sanity check me.

Cuz yeh, I think your approach was the more 'try to reason it' , since why I talk to you about stuff and views I think. But retracing this day, do you think I was in a 'leeway' position?
Like before going to sleep the cw was hk, which I said I didnt want to vote first from my PoE and was insisted to do it by another slot from my PoE (Mac). Idk

[Achromatic]

mac and santy are a case of two different approaches to scum hunting.

Santy has done a lot of things I have liked and a lot of things I have hated.

Mac is kind of a sea of nothing great for the entire game.

[Sabiplz]

Mac vs santy is fine but I prefer santy first then mac so I can see if my poe is correct or needs to be relooked at.

[risiinq-]

...i just realized eod is tmr

(technically tomorrow for me, but also just in 12 hours basically)

not good.

[santygrass]

Achro (or ris) if you have time can you look at Esooa posts regarding HK D1? Cuz idk if it cuz of phone but ISOing like takes me a while to find posts and maybe you do it faster wowee.
Like, to quote them and show to Mac. In my mind I know the wagonomics one, there was one more in the middle probs before EoD was near, and Esoos still kinda pushing hk in EoD , to know what Mac thinks there

[Achromatic]

Well I've given you rope I don't know about anyone else.

What do you think? Just to sanity check me.

Cuz yeh, I think your approach was the more 'try to reason it' , since why I talk to you about stuff and views I think. But retracing this day, do you think I was in a 'leeway' position?
Like before going to sleep the cw was hk, which I said I didnt want to vote first from my PoE and was insisted to do it by another slot from my PoE (Mac). Idk

I can't speak for others but I feel like you haven't laid out your cases very well tbh. Maybe you are just stuck in second gear and can't get it going when you need it or you don't want to but I think your wolf reasonings have been really weak over all. I am also trying to be a better team player and a lot of people think you're scum.

I would not be particularly surprised if you flipped town due to the good moments, but it is hard to see others being so kind for the entire game and I just... kind of needed more out of you today than what has been given to be able to feel better about trusting my day 1 town read on you tbh.

The fact OW died and you haven't really gone for HK while Mac did is a point in your favor, for example. It runs counter, if slightly, to wolf plotting in my head.

An answer I have to ask myself is 'do I trust santy enough to argue with several people I townread over it?' and my answer is no. I can feel good about voting Mac, but I can't really feel great going out on a limb for you tbh.

[santygrass]

Votecount asofrn

Santygrass (6) - Jack, hk, Sabi, Achro, Mac, Neon, Porscha
MacDougall (5) - Esooa,Drwilgs,riisinq-,Santygrass, Achro
Hollowkatt (2) - Nanook, Lilypetal